The Heineken Cup Thread

[Eastern_Pride]

We had Leinster in Wicklow last Wednesday, half of county Wicklow and every child in the town was there collecting autographs ,even the lions. The players were great and even had time for a kickabout with the lads after their training session and was a fantastic occasion but o'driscoll really showed his true personality. He arrived 30 minutes late, demanded free drink and left after 15 minutes after signing abut 10 peoples jerseys. It was really awful for all the kids who had come to see their hero and put a blotch on a great day.

Is this O'Drscoll's typical form?

Well he was asked to appear in blackrock college one day after a junior cup win, signed a piece of paper and told them to photocopy it

[muppet]

Fixtures out for next year.

http://mailer2.matchdaychat.com/lt/t_go.php?i=6157&e=MTUzOTEzOA==&l=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.ercrugby.com%2Feng%2F12_12877.php

Have you booked in for the final?

[Hoof Hearted]

nah was working out too expensive, and what with Derry being in AI Final next year, it would be too much !!

[muppet]

nah was working out too expensive, and what with Derry being in AI Final next year, it would be too much !!

Cool, you can have another weekend with the Mayo boys!

[Capt Pat]

Leinster have added a few players to help out their squad including Eoin reddan, Nathan Hines, Sean Beirne, Mike Ross and Strauss a 23 year old South African hooker. Hines should replace O'Kellly and move ahead of Toner in the second row battle. They have put together a pretty nice team again. Reddan will be a big improvement at scrum half. The other key thing is that they seeme to have managed their resources to a point where there will be a lot of Irish players on the team. Sean O'Brien will replace Elson, Sexton will replace Contepomi and Reddan will replace Whitaker. Hynes will probably get in ahead of Toner or O'Kelly and Van Der Linde will be in the front row if fit but Mike Ross might get ahead of Wright in the pecking order. With Cian Healy there is going to be big competition for a place in the front row.

[Eastern_Pride]

Leinster have added a few players to help out their squad including Eoin reddan, Nathan Hines, Sean Beirne, Mike Ross and Strauss a 23 year old South African hooker. Hines should replace O'Kellly and move ahead of Toner in the second row battle. They have put together a pretty nice team again. Reddan will be a big improvement at scrum half. The other key thing is that they seeme to have managed their resources to a point where there will be a lot of Irish players on the team. Sean O'Brien will replace Elson, Sexton will replace Contepomi and Reddan will replace Whitaker. Hynes will probably get in ahead of Toner or O'Kelly and Van Der Linde will be in the front row if fit but Mike Ross might get ahead of Wright in the pecking order. With Cian Healy there is going to be big competition for a place in the front row.

Looking at this it seems like a fairly tasty squad and I can see at least one piece of silverware going their way. This could be Sexton's year to really prove himself as European standard.

[Donnellys Hollow]

Plenty of competition in the front row it seems. I hope Cian Healy doesn't get squeezed out. He needs game time to keep up his development. I'm not convinced by Mike Ross but Ireland's options on the tight-head side beyond Hayes and Buckley are fairly non-existant so hopefully he'll come good.

I hope Seán O'Brien gets a good run of games now Elsom has gone home. He's looked a serious talent anytime I've seen him in action and I'd expect him to have broken into the national side before the World Cup.

[Gnevin]

Harlequins should discover on Monday if they have been ejected from next season's Heineken Cup as the fallout continues from the latest scandal to have rocked rugby.

And the club could be further damaged by the appeal of their winger Tom Williams, to be heard by the same independent committee, against the one-year ban he received for faking a blood injury.

Quins must appear before the hearing in Glasgow tomorrow after ERC disciplinary officer Roger O'Connor contested the level of sanction imposed for their role in the incident.

Williams was found to have faked a cut mouth during the closing stages of last April's Heineken Cup quarter-final defeat by Leinster.

The act enabled substituted fly-half Nick Evans, a drop-goal specialist, to return to the field with five minutes remaining and Quins trailing 6-5.

A late drop-goal attempt was engineered for Evans but the New Zealand fly-half was struggling with a knee injury and pulled it wide.

The ensuing disciplinary hearing banned Williams for 12 months and fined Quins £215,000, half of which was suspended.

O'Connor is appealing the decision to clear then Harlequins director of rugby Dean Richards, doctor Dr Wendy Chapman and physiotherapist Steph Brennan, and is believed to be seeking the club's expulsion from the Heineken Cup.

Richards resigned last weekend, an act that has been read as an acceptance of responsibility following the incident that has caused huge embarrassment to Quins and rugby in general.

The club's reputation could be further tarnished when Williams gives evidence to contest the ban that left him shouldering most of the blame.

It is inconceivable that Williams was not acting on directions from his team's management and reports have claimed he will say tomorrow that his mouth was deliberately cut moments after the match to cover up the scandal.

Such a confession would further implicate Quins, leaving the club to count the cost of an affair that has been dubbed 'Bloodgate'.
http://www.planetrugby.com/story/0,25883,3822_5494736,00.html

The fallout continues .

[Capt Pat]

Dean Richards has been banned for 3 years. More news to follow

[Dinny Breen]

Title changed.

Have absolute no sympathy for Richards, once a cheat always a cheat, integrity is very important and by cheating in the professional game you are cheating fellow professionals and denying them opportunity to make money in what is a very short career. Williams suspension reduction is right as he was just the patsy.

[Gnevin]

Title changed.

Have absolute no sympathy for Richards, once a cheat always a cheat, integrity is very important and by cheating in the professional game you are cheating fellow professionals and denying them opportunity to make money in what is a very short career. Williams suspension reduction is right as he was just the patsy.

Agreed what he did was to drag the whole game down.

[GaillimhIarthair]

Title changed.

Have absolute no sympathy for Richards, once a cheat always a cheat, integrity is very important and by cheating in the professional game you are cheating fellow professionals and denying them opportunity to make money in what is a very short career. Williams suspension reduction is right as he was just the patsy.

Spot on Dinny.  An absolute disgrace what he did had what has gone on at Harlequins in trying to cover this up subsequently.  I cannot fathom how they are still in the Heineken Cup this season!  Apparently this is not the first time that Richards has been behind such a pathetic stunt.  His coaching career at the highest level is in tatters and his reputation within the game is forever tarnished.  A stupid stupid man.

[Declan]

Misconduct Appeal Hearing Decisions
17 August 2009, 6:29 pm

An independent Appeal Committee convened in Glasgow on Monday, 17 August, to hear the appeals lodged against decisions of the independent Disciplinary Committee regarding the Heineken Cup quarter-final match between Harlequins and Leinster at the Twickenham Stoop on 12 April, 2009.
The original independent Disciplinary Committee, which convened over three days (2, 3 and 20 July), found that the Club (Harlequins) and Mr Tom Williams were guilty of Misconduct under the Heineken Cup Disciplinary Rules by fabricating a wound or blood injury in order to allow Nick Evans (No 10), who had earlier been substituted, to return to the field of play during the match.

The original Committee imposed a fine of 250,000 Euro on Harlequins, of which 50 percent was suspended for two years, and the Committee suspended Mr Williams from playing rugby for a period of 12 months up to and including 19 July, 2010.
The Committee found that the Misconduct Complaints against club officials Dean Richards (Director of Rugby), Dr Wendy Chapman (Doctor) and Steph Brennan (Physiotherapist) had not been proven.

Mr Williams lodged an appeal against the sanction imposed on him and ERC Disciplinary Officer Roger O'Connor appealed the level of sanction imposed on the Club (Harlequins) and the decision of the Committee to dismiss Misconduct Complaints against the three Club officials.
Appeal Decisions
After almost 14 hours of hearings the independent Appeal Committee, chaired by Rod McKenzie (Scotland) and also comprising Professor Lorne D Crerar (Scotland) and Mark McParland (Ireland), issued the following decisions.

Tom Williams: Following the introduction of new evidence by Mr Williams where he admitted his guilt in the Misconduct and where he explained the part played by Mr Richards and Mr Brennan in fabricating the wound or blood injury, as well as disclosing full details of the steps taken by those involved to cover up what had happened in the period following the match, the Committee upheld the appeal and reduced the sanction to a suspension of four (4) months up-to and including 19 November 2009.

Dean Richards: Following the introduction of the new evidence by Mr Williams and an admission of guilt by Dean Richards, the Committee allowed the ERC appeal and found that Mr Richards was guilty of Misconduct in that he organised the fabrication of a wound or blood injury. Mr Richards acknowledged that he had orchestrated the subsequent cover up of the incident.

The Committee imposed a suspension of three (3) years on Mr Richards from participating in any capacity in ERC tournaments and will be requesting that other tournaments and Governing Bodies give effect to this suspension in their tournaments.

Steph Brennan: Following the introduction of the new evidence by Mr Williams and an admission of guilt by Steph Brennan, the Committee allowed the appeal and found that Mr Brennan was guilty of Misconduct in that he participated in the fabrication of a wound or blood injury. Mr Brennan acknowledged that he had been actively involved in the subsequent cover up of the incident.

The Committee imposed a suspension of two (2) years on Mr Brennan from participating in any capacity in ERC tournaments and will be requesting that other tournaments and Governing Bodies give effect to this suspension in their tournaments.

During the course of the hearing it was disclosed that there had been four previous occasions in non ERC tournaments in which Mr Richards and Mr Brennan had fabricated a wound or blood injury. Details of these incidents will be passed on to the relevant tournaments organiser.

The Club (Harlequins): The Committee found that the club were vicariously liable for the actions of its employees and that the level of Misconduct by its employees was of a greater magnitude than had been established in the original hearing based on the new evidence from Mr Williams and upheld the ERC appeal and increased the fine imposed on the Club to 300,000 Euro, which it must pay in full by 1 December 2009.

Dr Wendy Chapman: The Appeal Committee dismissed the ERCs Disciplinary Officer's appeal on grounds that the Appeal Committee lacked jurisdiction under the Disciplinary Rules in this particular case.

Notes
Independent Appeal Committee:
a) Following the decision(s) of an independent Disciplinary Committee all parties (the Club, player(s), individuals and ERC) have the right to appeal the decision(s) of the Committee.

b) The independent Appeal Committee is chosen by the Chairman of the independent Disciplinary Panel Professor Lorne Crerar.

c) None of the members of the independent Disciplinary Committee who issued the decisions being challenged in the appeal(s) may sit on the independent Appeal Committee.

d) The full written decision(s) for the original independent Disciplinary Hearing and the Appeal Hearing will be made available on ercrugby.com/disciplinenews at a later date when the full written decision(s) of the Appeal hearing have been completed and issued to all parties.


Shower of cheating bastards - 4 previous times and the doc got off on a technicality. Would love to see them thrown out. what would have happened if Evans had gotten that drop goal???   

[Main Street]

The  ERC have made a recovery of sorts after literally being forced to pursue this case by the outcry after the original farcical disciplinary procedure.
Nothing sweeter than seeing cynical cheats get their comeuppance in public.

Have Harlequins escaped being thrown out of the HC?

[GaillimhIarthair]

The  ERC have made a recovery of sorts after literally being forced to pursue this case by the outcry after the original farcical disciplinary procedure.
Nothing sweeter than seeing cynical cheats get their comeuppance in public.

Have Harlequins escaped being thrown out of the HC?

It looks like it at the moment