Mayo v Galway - Connacht Final 13/07/08 14:00 McHale Park, Castlebar

[Galforever]

did it take away from your 1998 win?

There is a difference between wanting to avoid a certain team & beating whats in front of you.

In 98, I think many Galway people would have preferred to have played Kerry in the final, but Kildare beat them because they were better.

I know many of the Galway players of that era regret not beating Kerry (drawing & losing in 2000 and losing in 2002).

[OirthearMhaigheo]

did it take away from your 1998 win?

There is a difference between wanting to avoid a certain team & beating whats in front of you.

In 98, I think many Galway people would have preferred to have played Kerry in the final, but Kildare beat them because they were better.

I know many of the Galway players of that era regret not beating Kerry (drawing & losing in 2000 and losing in 2002).

I would agree and didn't mean it as a pop at that win, it is just a bit sweeter if you beat a traditionally big name, but if we were to win it without beating Kerry I would get over it quite easily! I think it is a bit defeatist to want to avoid a team anyway, I would just prefer to meet Kerry earlier than the final as they have a serious hex over us at the moment.

[moysider]

A couple of weeks ago I mentioned on here that this championship was not going to script and yesterday s events have blown it apart. Not just that Kerry lost but it was the manner in which they lost. They collapsed in a manner only a finished team does. But being Kerry they cant be written off but if that happened to any other team they would be considered finished. This will be a huge test for Pat O Shea because he has problems now in virtually every line of the team. Full-back, Midfield, Half-forward line, Full-forward line. I have my doubts whether O Shea is strong enough for the job. Galvin s blow-out was not a good sign for management. Could nt imagine that happening under an O Dwyer or O Connor.
Now he has to reconstruct the team and bed in likes if Tommy Walsh in @ a month. There were too many big slow men on the field yesterday and without Galvin and Declan O Sullivan two of their best players are gone. Ball winners, carriers, brilliant passers and both scored more than their fair share.
Scanlon too slow to play with Dara and Dara himself looks injured or gone. Brian Sheehan is no championship corner forward. Without good ball going in Gooch and Donaghy cant do the business. Kerry s goal yesterday would have been prevented if Kavanagh tackled anyway adequately.
Now Kerry might have been caught out by their peaking for September routine and Dara might be flying in a month but it looked more chronic than that. They also have the ingredients to rectify matters or at least improve things. Sheehan could be moved out. Tommy Griffin on a big man at full back. Tommy Walsh to midfield, If they had Galvin and Declan O Sullivan coming back you would nt fear for them but they have to be considered badly damaged now. Several teams will now fancy their chances of being around in September.

[Galforever]

Do not agree with that at all moysider. A team as good as Kerry does not suddenly become as bad as you are making them out to be. Kerry always had a weakness at full back since Mike McCarthy retired & they have tried numerous players alongside Darragh O'Sé in the past few years.

One interesting thing about yesterday was that both teams kicked high ball into theire full forward line. If Galway meet any of them, this tactic could play into Galways hands as its the type of game that Hanley would enjoy more than marking a Declan Maxwell.

[moysider]

I m not making them out to be bad but they were nt good yesterday and I m not sure it can be just put down to a bad day at the office. They appear to have real problems. Some of the players that made them so good are either retired - Moynihan, McCarty - injured - Declan O Sullivan - suspended - Galvin,  or off the boil -Dara O Shea.

[kevmy]

I agree with Moysider here.

Kerry for the last 3 or 4 years have been winning midfield by using D O'Sé to win primary ball and his partner + Galvin to win breaking ball. With Galvin gone and O'Sé losing form (although over the last few years he has peaked for Croker in the Autumn) this means midfield is in trouble. Once you lose in midfield all of your other problems are much more exposed. In Kerry's case this means their FB.
I've stated in the Cork v Kerry thread that all the teams which have won through the back door have made at least one radical change to their side since losing in the province and appearing in Croker. The qualifiers help them fine tune it usually with a handy draw to start them off. In 01 Galway put Mannion in centre back and got Wicklow away, in 05 Tyrone put Cormac McAnallen in FB after they got destroyed their by Down in the Ulster final and in 06 Kerry moved Donaghy away from being a hindrance in midfield to a phenomenon in FF and they also managed to get Longford in Fitz stadium in the qualifiers.

Added to this they had some of the top 5 managers of modern times (O'Mahoney, Harte and O'Connor). I don't think Kerry have a readymade solution for either midfield or FB and I don't think O'Shea is in the same league as the above mentioned fellas.

Now I'm not saying that Kerry won't be dangerous or are out of the reckoning especially when you take into account the relatively average opposition but I don't think this is the same as 06. If D O Sé regains form and if O'Sullivan is not exposed again (and there aren't that many Cussen/Donaghy types around) then they could come again. However I think they may well struggle around midfield. If they struggle around midfield then Donaghy and Gooch are much quieter than any sort of man marking will ever make them

[Croí na hÉireann]

I've stated in the Cork v Kerry thread that all the teams which have won through the back door have made at least one radical change to their side since losing in the province and appearing in Croker. The qualifiers help them fine tune it usually with a handy draw to start them off. In 01 Galway put Mannion in centre back and got Wicklow away, in 05 Tyrone put Cormac McAnallen in FB after they got destroyed their by Down in the Ulster final and in 06 Kerry moved Donaghy away from being a hindrance in midfield to a phenomenon in FF and they also managed to get Longford in Fitz stadium in the qualifiers.

You're mixing 05 up with 03, if the Tyronies see that they'll have u for breakfast 

[Farrandeelin]

Do not agree with that at all moysider. A team as good as Kerry does not suddenly become as bad as you are making them out to be. Kerry always had a weakness at full back since Mike McCarthy retired & they have tried numerous players alongside Darragh O'Sé in the past few years.

One interesting thing about yesterday was that both teams kicked high ball into theire full forward line. If Galway meet any of them, this tactic could play into Galways hands as its the type of game that Hanley would enjoy more than marking a Declan Maxwell.

Maybe Kerry don't become a bad team overnight, but Derry beat them in the league final and now Cork beat them in yesterday's Munster final and both had to come back from big deficits. So I would half agree with moysider on this one. However, they will certainly be out to atone for it and if they get a fullback they might.

[rosnarun]

anyone buy tickets from ticketmaster . did ye get them.  i ordered mine last week still no sign

[moysider]

I suppose there ll be no Mayo teams named before Thursday night earliest. There did nt seem to be - and I looked - any official release of the minor team last week until day of  throw - in. But I might have missed something. Is it just me or is this disappointing. I m sure most of us would nail the selections pretty much anyway but delayed selections are dampening down interest and debate among the fans coming up to a game. When Johnno was in Galway I think he used to name his teams early in the week so players would not be fretting about whether they were starting or not. That thinking seems to have changed. Then they wonder about falling attendances. Public interest is not being stimulated at all. There is no Buzz. Most debate in Mayo has been about somebody who is not playing rather than those that are.

[RedandGreenSniper]

I suppose there ll be no Mayo teams named before Thursday night earliest. There did nt seem to be - and I looked - any official release of the minor team last week until day of  throw - in. But I might have missed something. Is it just me or is this disappointing. I m sure most of us would nail the selections pretty much anyway but delayed selections are dampening down interest and debate among the fans coming up to a game. When Johnno was in Galway I think he used to name his teams early in the week so players would not be fretting about whether they were starting or not. That thinking seems to have changed. Then they wonder about falling attendances. Public interest is not being stimulated at all. There is no Buzz. Most debate in Mayo has been about somebody who is not playing rather than those that are.

100% spot on MS

There should be regulations set in stone regarding the picking of teams. I don't think leaving your selection til late brings much advantage as the opposition will have a good idea anyway. The priority should be promotion of our games, something that a lot of people don't think is too important. But attendances are falling. However if teams were to be released, lets say, by the latest Tuesday night, then it would heighten the sense of anticipation and interest would snowball imo.
I know there are cases where this isn't always feasible - replays etc. But if someone is doubtful with injury, pick him on the team with the caveat 'subject to a fitness test'.
But no doubt some managers would use loopholes like this to name a dummy team. The mindset has to change

[RedandGreenSniper]

Whats the point of winning an all-ireland if you dont beat the best teams on the way to doing so. That is the purpose of winning it, not getting a handy run along the way!

Okay maybe I have a fear of Kerry. I think its forgiveable all things considered. I agree, it would be the best way to win the All-Ireland - to beat the best teams along the way. But when you've been waiting as long as we have you'll tend not to be fussy.
Anyway such talk is premature at this stage so back to Sunday.
Presuming the match-ups go as expected and P Joyce is picked up by Heaney and M Meehan by K Higgins, where will Kieran Conroy play and how much of a problem will it be, IF Mayo win, that their new full-back will be going into an All-Ireland quarter-final without having played a championship game there?
Whats the Galway team looking like lads? Naturally ye'll have P Joyce, N Joyce, M Meehan and M Clancy in attack. Who'll be the two to join them? Will the Breatchnach (sp)experiment continue (from a Mayo viewpoint I hope so) and will Sammon stick with Paul Conroy? Or will Damien Dunleavy come in at wing-forward and, the real danger from a Mayo viewpoint, pacey players like Bane and/or Armstrong be given their chance?

[moysider]

The Galway team will be much solider than the Leitrim match. I expect Fitzgerald and Blake to start at 2 and 6 respectively with Coyne on the bench unless Meehan injured.. As I ve said before our full forward line as constructed is pre-cooked for Galway full back line and Blake brings a lot of physicality to 6. Looks like Sammon will stick with Breathnach. Like Forde he obviously has not the same belief in Nicky Joyce or Seán Armstrong as popular opinion.
As regards Mayo full back. I expect Galway will start Conroy to support midfield and as an outlet for their own kick-outs and there is where our Conroy should be deployed. I cant see us havin a settled full back line and there is no sense in it.
Our most important match-up is who picks up Matthew Clancy. Much more important than Meehan ,Joyces, or Armstrongs even though Galway lads seem to have little time for him. I would prefer to see these match- ups

  Boyle v Breathnach/ Armstrong/ N Joyce - worried about  Br's height but apart from that I d expect him to come out on top all three.

  Higgins v  Meehan -  Been there before. On the day.

  Heaney v Joyce - We ve seen it before, make your own mind up.

Conroy V Conroy. Our lad was brought in as a full back but looks like he can play around the middle comfortably and could be there for years. Could be the joker in the pack. Fine footballer. So is the Galway Conroy so I think we need height in hb line to counter Galway s use of Dunleavy or Conroy as ball winning options. Naturally Mayo management will have these angles sorted, I m sure, as it happened in the league match in Castlebar a few month s ago. Yawn! Its too predictable.

Cuniffe v Nicky Joyce. Who knows? I would expect advantage Mayo if Cuniffe can attack behind a winning midfield  but there are still question marks about Cuniffe s defence when backs are to the wall.

Nallen V Clancy. I would thrust Nallen to do this job more than I would anybody else.

If we can quieten Clancy we can win it although on the other end of the pitch we have it all to do. I d be hoping our advantage  our pace [ I think we have more pace about us] will decide it but I think Galway have the better assurance and composure. Not at all sure how it will turn out. Usually in tight games Galway win.

[IolarCoisCuain]

The Galway team will be much solider than the Leitrim match.

The Galway team will be much more solid Moysider. We might be getting nervous as the big day looms but that's no reason to abandon correct grammar. Tsk tsk tsk. 

[Barney]

Any word on Howley lads? Its all very quiet - if fit I would expect him to replace Colm Boyle.

Other than that Dillon will come in for Gardiner and I'd say he'll leave it at that.