Áth Cliath vs Iarmhí

[heffo]

Then why are you telling me how he got the first belt u mentalist!

Cos between belts, knocks, noses, CCCC, DRA, late arrivals, early arrivals, due process, trial by media, full back problems, arrogant Dublin players and whatever else, I don't know whether I'm coming or going!

[AN other]

Pretty ungracious stuff there.

You lost by the same margin that we lost to the AI champions in last years semi, you cannot consider yourselves as good as Dublin as Dublin have proven themselves in Leinster.

WRT blood subs - there is no length of time specified so there was no rule breaking. I don't know what side of the ground you were sitting, but I was in the row directly behind the Dublin bench and his nose was pouring blood initially when it was stiched and it reopened completely with blood pouring out of it.

Do you want to point out ungraciousness or do you just want to make sweeping statements? Dublin won (obviously) and the best of luck to them, I was simply outlining what I thought were two pretty crucial factors that contributed to this. As you pointed out previously in this thread everybody is entitled to their opinion so get off your high horse.

I can consider Westmeath to be whatever I want to consider them to be. You previously scoffed at the suggestion that Westmeath could match Dublin with both teams at full strength following our win in the league final, something which was shown they could do yesterday, so I wouldn't be giving anything you have to say following the latest episode much weight.

If you read my post properly I said there was no rules broken. As I was sitting on the far side of the ground and haven't seen the first 20 minutes of the game in full on TV I'll just have to take what you're saying about the blood at face value but I would still remain a bit perplexed how somebody could continue in a game at all if they couldn't be fixed up within a time much shorter than half an hour (15 minutes playing time and about 15 minutes half time break). Deliberate tactic or not I still think it affected the game significantly in the last 20 minutes.

[heffo]

Pretty ungracious stuff there.

You lost by the same margin that we lost to the AI champions in last years semi, you cannot consider yourselves as good as Dublin as Dublin have proven themselves in Leinster.

WRT blood subs - there is no length of time specified so there was no rule breaking. I don't know what side of the ground you were sitting, but I was in the row directly behind the Dublin bench and his nose was pouring blood initially when it was stiched and it reopened completely with blood pouring out of it.

Do you want to point out ungraciousness or do you just want to make sweeping statements? Dublin won (obviously) and the best of luck to them, I was simply outlining what I thought were two pretty crucial factors that contributed to this. As you pointed out previously in this thread everybody is entitled to their opinion so get off your high horse.

I can consider Westmeath to be whatever I want to consider them to be. You previously scoffed at the suggestion that Westmeath could match Dublin with both teams at full strength following our win in the league final, something which was shown they could do yesterday, so I wouldn't be giving anything you have to say following the latest episode much weight.

If you read my post properly I said there was no rules broken. As I was sitting on the far side of the ground and haven't seen the first 20 minutes of the game in full on TV I'll just have to take what you're saying about the blood at face value but I would still remain a bit perplexed how somebody could continue in a game at all if they couldn't be fixed up within a time much shorter than half an hour (15 minutes playing time and about 15 minutes half time break). Deliberate tactic or not I still think it affected the game significantly in the last 20 minutes.

Take it easy there ANO, I'm not on any high horse - your post was ungracious - no congratulations for Dublin and claiming that Westmeath were just as good as Dublin - this isn't the case unfortunatly.

Of course you can consider Westmeath to be as good as the eventual AI winners, but I can still point out that you may be wrong.

You're perfectly entitled to point out that Dublin may have taken the piss with the blood sub, but I can say that Westmeath took the piss delaying kickouts to waste time until the last few minutes and set themselves up to play a tight game and hence the narrow margin - Dublin were poor and on the basis of that performance won't be going very far.

[Croí na hÉireann]

The one we left behind, bad decision making, poor handling and eight wides in the second half tells its own story. Interesting to see neutral comments on Dublin getting soft frees in the first half as I thought they got more controversial frees in the second half. Special mention to Keaney, for such a big built up fellow he goes to ground very easily or draws the frees or whatever ur having yourself. Still though I was proud of the Westmeath players and management that they didn't go ballistic at the ref at the final whistle and he was allowed to leave the field unaccompanied by gardai, which is a rare sight unfortunately these days. He's a young lad, hopefully he learns from this. Injury time in both halves was a joke. John Keane was very magnaminous in his post match interview, was looking at his and his defensive colleagues deficiencies rather than the second half shortcomings up front, and credit to him, a true sign to the togetherness of this squad.

The game hinged on three moments for me, the first was Morans shocking "tackle" on Bannon who had started promisingly. Kevin Reilly got a month for a similar "tackle" and I'd expect the same result here. Interesting the boys on the Sunday Game didn't sit on the fence on this one, I suppose it's different when it's not one of ur own  We replaced Bannon with Budda and unbelievably played him inside  He offers us absolutely nothing in there, no pace whatsoever. Second was Dessie's missed free, he'll be having nightmares about that one, and third was Sherlocks point, when the chips were down he stood up to be counted and credit to him.

On the trash talking, well it's disappointing to see that again really, I'm sure it will come back to bite like it did last year. I don't buy this "Dublin were very poor", well apart from McConnell that is (the man is never a full back), Dublin weren't allowed play. When Alan Brogran managed to slip JK he did damage and the reason he didn't do an awful lot of it is down to the marking job, was great to see JK back to his best. Said last week that we had to hold the two Brogans and Jayo and we did, which makes the loss even harder to take. I didn't see any of them being substituted so when Connolly came on for Bernard he was basically the difference in the Dublin attack. Anytime he got clean ball he did damage. Dublin will win the Leinster Final handy enough, they have the better forwards and midfield than Wexford and probably an equal enough defence. Need to sort out the full back position.

Glennon was sensational early on, turned McConnell inside out. Regarding bringing him out in the second half, well we wanted to/needed to get him into the game more, he destroyed Cork when moved out there in the league game this year. However no point bringing him out when u don't have 2 inside forwards inside, and Budda and Willo are certainly not inside forwards. Dessie was excellent as well, however another good performance in Croker is gonna be overshadowed by a missed free. Thought we were gonna see it out when Casey was put on him for the second half...

Willo and Budda were poor and didn't really offer anything, should've been subbed earlier and kept away from the full forward line. Smyth was his usual hard working self but distribution was below par, Doran Harte must have ran JK close for motm, unbelievable engine on him, can play ball but loves to keep it simple, a managers dream...

Overall I think we lost the crucial midfield battle. O'Donoghue battled and broke ball all day and played an absolutely sensational ball in to Natchie for the goal as well as other excellent passes. Duffy struggled really, didn't catch much, handling was poor, delivery was worse and his day was probably summed up with the wide towards the end. We really missed Flans experience in the middle, gutted for him that we didn't delivery him the chance for a Leinster medal. Hopefully he gets back to fitness in the next couple of weeks...

JK as already stated was back to his brilliant 04 form, anytime Brogan looked like popping out of his pocket he stuffed him back in there. The rest of the backs were their usual solid selves without really coming to the fore. Anyways well done to the Dublin team, they hung in there, battled it out and won a tight battle, something they're not often credited with. The jeerers and the day outers make it hard to warm to the Dublin support and enlightening encounters with the Jacks are decreasing by the year. Respectable crown in the stand though so maybe they are confined mostly to the Hill, pity u can't lock them in there after the match...

So where do we go from here? Traditionally it has always been a battle for Westmeath to get themselves right mentally for the qualifiers but we've got a kind draw and should try to make the most of it. Bannon is out with a broken collar bone from that "tackle" so I'd start David Glennon inside with the brother and see if he can cut the mustard at this level and make an impact over 70 minutes. I'd look to use Flan sparingly again, Duffy deserves another shot in the middle and would like to see how Flan gets on inside for the last 15 minutes. If this team pulls together, get the heads down, get over Tipp and give whoever we draw next a right rattle then it can go far. Leinster is gone, we should now aim for an All-Ireland semi-final, it's certainly not beyond us!!!

WE'RE NOT FINISHED YET!!!

[Hound]

That's rich about Keaney, considering Glennon's antics.

I don't know how any honest Westmeath man could say Dublin got more soft frees than Westmeath. Its simply untrue. And the stats of 31-18 for frees in Westmeath's favour back that up.

I personally thought Dolan wasted a sea of ball in the second half. He got to every ball before Casey, but usually Casey forced him out wide and he mostly gave it away or went backwards. 

[Jinxy]

In fairness Croí, Dublin missed 2/3 relatively handy free's and had a fair few wides themselves.

[Croí na hÉireann]

That's rich about Keaney, considering Glennon's antics.

I don't know how any honest Westmeath man could say Dublin got more soft frees than Westmeath. Its simply untrue. And the stats of 31-18 for frees in Westmeath's favour back that up.

Haven't seen the replay of the Glennon incident but from accounts on here he was reacting to trash talk from Moran (who shouldn't even have been on the field). Haven't had time to watch a full replay yet but carbon copies of incidents that were awarded as frees to Dublin were not awarded down the other end. The one baffling decision that Westmeath did get (Henry & Glennon watching ball drift over endline) was preceded by a blatant foul. Haven't seen them stats but those defenders are well versed in the tackle and know how to execute it, maybe we need to be more cynical.

In fairness Croí, Dublin missed 2/3 relatively handy free's and had a fair few wides themselves.

They sure did but I still think it's one we left behind, never pushed on after our great start and should have been ahead at half time. Didn't have the end product that our start to the second half deserved.

[AN other]

Take it easy there ANO, I'm not on any high horse - your post was ungracious - no congratulations for Dublin and claiming that Westmeath were just as good as Dublin - this isn't the case unfortunatly.

By that logic you didn't offer any commiserations to Westmeath so you're posts have been pretty undignified...I also don't see how making a claim that Westmeath were as good as Dublin amounts to ungraciousness. Caffrey more or less said the same when saying Westmeath were unlucky not to get the draw. Dublin won on the day (and loads of congratulations, fair play and the best of luck to them  ) but it could easily have been Westmeath.

Of course you can consider Westmeath to be as good as the eventual AI winners, but I can still point out that you may be wrong.

You can, but I never said Westmeath were as good as any all-ireland winners, I said that they are presently as good as Dublin, the present being this year, to date, league and championship. A point between them in the league (without mentioning finals and trips to Cork) and nothing between the two sides on Sunday. Dublin perhaps have more talent and potential individually and have a bit more capacity to improve but the two teams are evenly matched so far this year.

You're perfectly entitled to point out that Dublin may have taken the piss with the blood sub, but I can say that Westmeath took the piss delaying kickouts to waste time until the last few minutes and set themselves up to play a tight game and hence the narrow margin - Dublin were poor and on the basis of that performance won't be going very far.

What are you trying to argue by stating the obvious set up of Westmeath? I don't recall Connaughton delaying kickouts, nor do I recall the ref taking issue with this at all.
I don't think Dublin were poor, apart from McConnell getting the run around from Glennon and a couple of missed frees. This was the hardest game Dublin have got in leinster since Westmeath beat them in 2004 (edit: One meath game aside perhaps) and they simply weren't let play with the fluidity that people might expect and hope for. If I were a follower of the Dubs I'd be pretty satisfied that others got the scores on the board when the chief attackers were curtailed. Biased as I may be I doubt Brogan and co. in the forwards will have a tougher game all year.

[INDIANA]

looks like Moran got 4 weeks. upgraded to a red card, that should keep O Neill and the mob happy.

[joemamas]

If indeed this is true, not sorry for him for the aforementioned mouthing off. Having said that advantage Dublin, Caffrey will not lose any sleep over losing a mediocre footballer. Far less controversial than dropping him.

[Hound]

Haven't seen the replay of the Glennon incident but from accounts on here he was reacting to trash talk from Moran (who shouldn't even have been on the field). Haven't had time to watch a full replay yet but carbon copies of incidents that were awarded as frees to Dublin were not awarded down the other end. The one baffling decision that Westmeath did get (Henry & Glennon watching ball drift over endline) was preceded by a blatant foul. Haven't seen them stats but those defenders are well versed in the tackle and know how to execute it, maybe we need to be more cynical.

Thats absolute bull about frees awarded to Dublin that werent awarded down the other end! Dolan and Glennon went down at the slightest touch, though at least Glennon didnt lie around feigning injury on a number of occassions like Dessie. Interesting that Dessie accounted for 6 of Westmeath's 12 wides.

The Moran "mouthing off incident" was absolutely nothing. Saw it again last night. Glennon was awarded a free, and started mouthing at Henry. Moran then came in and started mouthing and Glennon, and Glennon gave him lip back. There were a couple of incidents of bad sportsmanship by both teams, but there was nothing in that one.

Saw a replay of the Moran incident. It was unfortunate really. Pure freak that an injury resulted. There was no hint of an elbow, but it was a decent hit with the shoulder and Bannon was in process of losing his footing so was coming in very low. There was no malice or intent to injure, so I think a red card would have been very harsh, but given the injury and the pressure put on by the media, the ref was bound to crumble and change it to a red, as he has done.

[INDIANA]

It appears that the Sunday Game is now also a special discplinary committee, there was heavy contact made but i don't think the intent was there. once it was revisited the ref , there was only one outcome. Neat sidestep by Spillane on the galvin incident while he almost ensured an upgrade of the ban on this incident. the programme is descending into a shambles.

[Hardy]

I agree about Moran's hit. Another accident - Bannon fell into the tackle. But the Brennan regime has its statistics, never mind the injustice done to lads and their reputations. The annual report will trumpet a new dawn for discipline, citing increased suspensions etc., while ignoring the true ills assailing the game and allowing the cheating, diving and injury feigning to flourish unchecked.

Our game is going to hell and the Mary Poppins tendency has won.

[bennydorano]

I reckon that is the most dangerous type of tackle in the game but it's hard to gauge anyone's intent, but I thought Moran knew exactly what he was doing.

[heffo]

I don't think there was any intent there, but if the CCCC are going to review all cases like this from now on (A La Kevin Reilly) then Dublin can't really have any complaints.