Jerome Ousted?

[T Fearon]

Then contact the BBC's Audience Council. Surely also the BBC's coverage of Gaelic Games is dependent also upon contractual agreements with the Ulster Council.

Incidentally I agree that Jerome's contention that he was discriminated against, but he cited GAA coverage or alleged lack thereof by the BBC as "evidence".After week's of examining the evidence,the Tribunal (and Industrial Tribunals are not slow in my experience of finding in favour of complainants if they get a chance to do so at all, thus justifying their own existence) rejected his claims out of hand and described him as an unreliable witness.

[saffron sam2]

Then contact the BBC's Audience Council. Surely also the BBC's coverage of Gaelic Games is dependent also upon contractual agreements with the Ulster Council.

Incidentally I agree that Jerome's contention that he was discriminated against, but he cited GAA coverage or alleged lack thereof by the BBC as "evidence".After week's of examining the evidence,the Tribunal (and Industrial Tribunals are not slow in my experience of finding in favour of complainants if they get a chance to do so at all, thus justifying their own existence) rejected his claims out of hand and described him as an unreliable witness.

Not for the first time I am confused with your logic.

You say that you believe JQ was discriminated against, despite after weeks (no apostrophe) of examining the evidence (and Industrial Tribunals are not slow in your experience of finding in favour of complainants if they get a chance to do so at all, thus justifying their own existence), the Tribunal rejected his claims out of hand and described him as an unreliable witness.

You also say that you believe GAA coverage is fair, despite not being able to provide anything more concrete than an opinion and despite the fact that this issue was beyond the remit of the Tribunal.

[T Fearon]

SS2, sorry, that should have read "I agree that Jerome's contention was that he was discriminated against", I certainly don't agree that he was discriminated against. I also believe that the BBC and its legal representatives detailed its GAA coverage at length, in its defence at the Tribunal, and this had an obvious impact on the ultimate verdict. The only real winners as usual were the legal eagles laughing al the way to the bank. Jerome got diddly squat and the BBC's reputation is tarnished due to the fact that many (as this thread indicates) believe it was guilty of the allegations, regardless of the verdict

I have cited ad nasueam numerous examples to support my contention that gaa is fairly treated by the BBC, eg the number of live broadcasts on tv, the dedicated radio coverage on the majority of Sunday afternoons etc.

Its obvious that some here wouldn't be satisfied even if the BBC was broadcasting under 10 years of age league games live every week

[lynchbhoy]

SS2, sorry, that should have read "I agree that Jerome's contention was that he was discriminated against", I certainly don't agree that he was discriminated against. I also believe that the BBC and its legal representatives detailed its GAA coverage at length, in its defence at the Tribunal, and this had an obvious impact on the ultimate verdict. The only real winners as usual were the legal eagles laughing al the way to the bank. Jerome got diddly squat and the BBC's reputation is tarnished due to the fact that many (as this thread indicates) believe it was guilty of the allegations, regardless of the verdict

I have cited ad nasueam numerous examples to support my contention that gaa is fairly treated by the BBC, eg the number of live broadcasts on tv, the dedicated radio coverage on the majority of Sunday afternoons etc.

Its obvious that some here wouldn't be satisfied even if the BBC was broadcasting under 10 years of age league games live every week

nope- a bit of common sense to broadcast a few highlights of championship Football and Hurling games to bring the coverage up to scratch and nearer parity would be welcome.
You have no evidence as SS2 says. Only opinion.

maguire - common sense - I have said top level championship games and a selection of those each week.

ITG - as above, while I dont disagree with what you say, I just think that there could be more shown. Common sense and a bit more equality. I'd like to see highlights of a couple of Co Down or Armagh or Tryone or Donegal club championship games. I'd expect plenty of Gaelic games fans would! I dont watch only Liverpool, Philadelphia Eagles, San Antonio spurs, Philadelphia flyers, Celtic, Juventus, London Irish games only- I watch any games theyshow from those leagues and championships !

[T Fearon]

LB, it is you and SS2 who have no evidence, in contrast to my own repeated offering of the facts of numerous games broadcast live on tv, GAA taking over the airwaves on most Sunday afternoons and Saturday evenings frequently as well.

The BBC are not Sky Sports and have neither the manpower or resources to send camera crews to 6 or 7 club games each week, when senior soccer up here for example (regardless of its standard) gets a five minute montage each Saturday afternoon, and if it did allocate resources ludicrously in this way, it would mean there'd be less Championship coverage in the summer, as it would inevitably be a question of rejigging the existing budget

The vast majority of contributors are in agreement on this point by the way

[saffron sam2]

No further forward here Tony. No-one on here knows if the BBC spends a proportionate amount of time and money on covering Gaelic games, including you.

You can point to live championships (as the BBC did at the Tribunal), this doesn't paint a full picture.

Now can you give me BBC figures (figures that they refuse to release even under FOI Act) for
- the money spent televising each sport,
- the time spent televising each sport,
- the criteria used to decide the above.

Once we get these figures, it should prove or disprove your contention. Your opinion can't be passed off as fact.

By the way I haven't given a contention either way.

Has Connolly been in contact?

[T Fearon]

You know I'm not privy to that information and have no way of accessing it.

[saffron sam2]

I know, but until that information is made available we can only make assumptions.

There is no doubt that things are better, but I don't think that we should just be prepared to blindly settle for that.  It may be that the current status is as god as it gets; it may even be that the GAA is getting more than a fair share.

Has Connolly been in contact?

[lynchbhoy]

LB, it is you and SS2 who have no evidence, in contrast to my own repeated offering of the facts of numerous games broadcast live on tv, GAA taking over the airwaves on most Sunday afternoons and Saturday evenings frequently as well.

The BBC are not Sky Sports and have neither the manpower or resources to send camera crews to 6 or 7 club games each week, when senior soccer up here for example (regardless of its standard) gets a five minute montage each Saturday afternoon, and if it did allocate resources ludicrously in this way, it would mean there'd be less Championship coverage in the summer, as it would inevitably be a question of rejigging the existing budget

The vast majority of contributors are in agreement on this point by the way

I dont know if that is true.
you say BBC dont have the resources to go to a few club games - but they can go to soccer games

also that the vast majority of people have the same view as you - great, if thats what you want !

I dont see any actual stats and facts/figures that you have produced..
maybe I am blind as well as everything else

[ziggysego]

I've sent the BBC an email.

[Maguire01]

The only way that Tony's contention can be proved or disproved is for the BBC to provide figures in relation to, for example:

- the money spent televising each sport.
- the time spent televising each sport.
- the criteria used to decide the above.

So far, despite a Freedom of Information request from Donagh, the BBC has been unwilling to do so. Why?

Maybe they did provide them to Donagh, but not to Ulick(?)

[Maguire01]

No further forward here Tony. No-one on here knows if the BBC spends a proportionate amount of time and money on covering Gaelic games, including you.

You can point to live championships (as the BBC did at the Tribunal), this doesn't paint a full picture.

Now can you give me BBC figures (figures that they refuse to release even under FOI Act) for
- the money spent televising each sport,
- the time spent televising each sport,
- the criteria used to decide the above.

Once we get these figures, it should prove or disprove your contention. Your opinion can't be passed off as fact.

By the way I haven't given a contention either way.

Has Connolly been in contact?

But surely if you're not satisfied with the coverage the onus is on you to demonstrate the disparity?

Anyway, essentially we know what coverage the GAA gets from the BBC. The argument is whether they should be showing more, such as club games. That's purely subjective - i'm not sure what value these stats will add.

[Maguire01]

LB, it is you and SS2 who have no evidence, in contrast to my own repeated offering of the facts of numerous games broadcast live on tv, GAA taking over the airwaves on most Sunday afternoons and Saturday evenings frequently as well.

The BBC are not Sky Sports and have neither the manpower or resources to send camera crews to 6 or 7 club games each week, when senior soccer up here for example (regardless of its standard) gets a five minute montage each Saturday afternoon, and if it did allocate resources ludicrously in this way, it would mean there'd be less Championship coverage in the summer, as it would inevitably be a question of rejigging the existing budget

The vast majority of contributors are in agreement on this point by the way

I dont know if that is true.
you say BBC dont have the resources to go to a few club games - but they can go to soccer games

also that the vast majority of people have the same view as you - great, if thats what you want !

I dont see any actual stats and facts/figures that you have produced..
maybe I am blind as well as everything else

So unless the BBC don't manage to spend their sports budget (which is an unlikely scenario), you're actually saying that the GAA coverage should be extended to club level at the expense of soccer coverage?

Also, has anyone been able to confirm whether the soccer clips on the news are actually recorded by BBC or just provided to them? I honestly can't see BBC sending out their outside broadcast setup for the sake of 20-30 seconds of coverage on Newsline. There's a lack of facts on all sides of this argument.

[T Fearon]

Stats are largely irrelevant. For example if the North of Ireland qualified for the finals of a major tournament then soccer coerage woukld increase, ditto if lots of Ulster teams reached the quarter and semi finals of the All Ireland etc. My contention is that in terms of coverage of the major competitions in all three codes, GAA,Soccer and Rugby Union fans are fairly catered for by the BBC. BBC gives about five minutes to local soccer on average at 5pm on tv each Saturday, the major club championship games get an airing usually on the Monday night news.

With a finite budget and airtime availability I cannot see that the BBC can do much moire than concentrate on the major competitions in all three codes, which any fair minded person would concede it does.

[imtommygunn]

ITG - as above, while I dont disagree with what you say, I just think that there could be more shown. Common sense and a bit more equality. I'd like to see highlights of a couple of Co Down or Armagh or Tryone or Donegal club championship games. I'd expect plenty of Gaelic games fans would! I dont watch only Liverpool, Philadelphia Eagles, San Antonio spurs, Philadelphia flyers, Celtic, Juventus, London Irish games only- I watch any games theyshow from those leagues and championships !

LB don't get me wrong - I would watch,almost, any GAA game that was on quite happily. I however feel I would be in the minority in doing that.It would also quickly lose it's appeal if all the crap of the day was on all the time. I really don't think it's realisitic having club championship games on. I would stand by my local argument. Local soccer is in my view district leagues at a lower level. It never sees the light of day on tv and that in my view is like for like.

I would also concur that the stats are irrelevant. SS2 / LB if you got stats and these stats said that the BBC spent as much, or more, on the GAA as they did on Irish league soccer would you concede your argument(s)? I very much doubt you would.

Subjectively I would love to see a lot more GAA games on the BBC. However if I think about it objectively I believe we are now seeing a fair amount of GAA coverage.

We should never settle but viewing figures will dictate that we won't have to. I struggle listening to Martin McHugh so don't always boost those viewing figures.

(P.S. If you get me stats and these stats tell me that Irish league soccer gets twice as much of a budget as the GAA then I will concede I am wrong however I believe that is an unlikely scenario. I also believe you are unlikely to get financial figures (or actual time figures) from the BBC. This does not make Tony's points null and void.  )