Meeting of Grassroots to Discuss our Strategy re GPA

[full back]

Taken from the Cambridge Dictionary:

Definition
elite
group noun [C]
the richest, most powerful, best educated or most highly trained group in a society:
the country's educated elite
a member of the elite
DISAPPROVING A powerful and corrupt elite has bled this country dry.

Few interesting words in that definition......

[FTJC]

Because I love football. Very simple. I would love to give more time to my career, but I love this to much.
Exactly, and its better to love football than playstation, but both are past times. Diffrence is you'll not get a grant for your playstation

I wont respond to that shite....did somebody mention the word respect

[Because I love football. Very simple. I would love to give more time to my career, but I love this to much.

[t

Good, I'm sure that's the same for 99.9% of intercounty players - so would 2k per year make you love it more? 

No it wont, i never said that I was for the grant, but with all the other people getting paid for their contribution to the gaa, whats wrong with a government grant

Has anyone in the GPA ever asked the GAA to do something about the high profile managers and the ridiculously arduous and long winded training methods being employed these days?

The problem is in the last few years inter county training has spawned a mini industry in the fitrness world and i feel the GPA are trying to push the association down a route where we pay players instead of stepping back and saying hold on a second there's no need for guys to be doing organised 4-nights-a-week training 8 months before they kick a ball in the championship.

[RadioGAAGAA]

Has anyone in the GPA ever asked the GAA to do something about the high profile managers and the ridiculously arduous and long winded training methods being employed these days?

The problem is in the last few years inter county training has spawned a mini industry in the fitrness world and i feel the GPA are trying to push the association down a route where we pay players instead of stepping back and saying hold on a second there's no need for guys to be doing organised 4-nights-a-week training 8 months before they kick a ball in the championship.

Exactly.

As I see it that is the real problem, and some pittance "grants" (in the real world these payments are token gestures - although highly symbolic and controversial) are not going to change that.

[pintsofguinness]

Its clear from reading here that not to many of you play county football in todays world. I do, and for anyone to even remotely sugget that the average club footballer puts in the same amount of time and dedecation simply does not have the vaguest clue. If you want to play county football you have no choice, it is either all or nothing. And I am from a county where we have no success. the GAA should rename its self as the HAA, the Hypocritical Athletic Assoc.

Jesus, here's another one that has a gun put to his head.

Shouldn't the GAA be doing something about all these players that are forced to play?

Because I love football. Very simple. I would love to give more time to my career, but I love this to much.

And there we have it!  Why, in the name of f**k!, should you be paid for something you love?
You put a lot of time into the gaa but it's so you can do something you love and you're crying and whinging looking a few euro for it, have you every thought about the people who put just as much time into the GAA as you  so they can do the most boring and mundane, but vitally important tasks?  You tell me why you should be paid over them. 

I wont respond to that shite....did somebody mention the word respect

Respect for what?

dmarsden

Seriously lads, an we still be serious about putting playstation, hill walking and chess clubs on a par with being a county footballer? is it possible that there are people within our own organisation who regard meeting the commiment requirements to last on a county panel as a hobby?

What is it then?


Rois

Imagine you were someone who went to a county referees committee meeting every week.  You were responsible for organising referee assessments in the county for as many matches as humanly possible.  You spent your time circulating letters to referees, phoning them up, rearranging for last minute hitches.  Then you have to assess a referee (maybe two) every weekend yourself.  During the summer you cover matches for the Ulster Council and Croke Park (intercounty obviously).  You write reports, collate reports from other assessors and organise referee training.  You have to go to Dublin a couple of times a year (from Tyrone) to get an update on recent refereeing and assessment issues.
Now, that's the intercounty effort.  As a clubperson you attend the weekly committee meeting.  You meet outside these meetings with the other members of the club development committee to organise the lottery application and plan the new training pitch.  You contact the surveyors,  architects, meet with the bank to discuss your financing.  You spend half an hour collecting the club lotto envelopes each week.

Why would you do this?  Because you choose to.  You don't expect payment for it, because it makes you feel good to do it, you're part of a club, part of a county.

In what way is that a less valuable contribution to the GAA than the intercounty player?

That's probably one of the best posts I've ever read on this board and without doubt the best in this discussion.
I look forward to the responses. 


btw I'm disappointed that only one of the pro grant posters had the balls to answer the question I posed.

[ONeill]

Imagine you were someone who went to a county referees committee meeting every week.  You were responsible for organising referee assessments in the county for as many matches as humanly possible.  You spent your time circulating letters to referees, phoning them up, rearranging for last minute hitches.  Then you have to assess a referee (maybe two) every weekend yourself.  During the summer you cover matches for the Ulster Council and Croke Park (intercounty obviously).  You write reports, collate reports from other assessors and organise referee training.  You have to go to Dublin a couple of times a year (from Tyrone) to get an update on recent refereeing and assessment issues.
Now, that's the intercounty effort.  As a clubperson you attend the weekly committee meeting.  You meet outside these meetings with the other members of the club development committee to organise the lottery application and plan the new training pitch.  You contact the surveyors,  architects, meet with the bank to discuss your financing.  You spend half an hour collecting the club lotto envelopes each week.

Why would you do this?  Because you choose to.  You don't expect payment for it, because it makes you feel good to do it, you're part of a club, part of a county.

In what way is that a less valuable contribution to the GAA than the intercounty player?

That is the argument of someone who doesn't understand what the govn grant is for. There are people in soccer, rugby etc in this country who do that at lower-level/school who also don't get paid but do it for he love of it. And that's great. That's pure volunteer material. And that's what makes all games tick.

However, the grant scheme is nothing to do with valuing one group within the GAA ahead of the other. The GAA aren't making this decision. The govn have decided that because other amateur elite athletes are subsidised simply due to their excellence at a given sport. The top GAA athletes are also eligible for this.

Besides, if you do the admin described above for the love of it, why would your ethos change just because the govn have decided to subsidise top players? That shouldn't change things...unless the volunteer element was fickle in the first place. Don't forget, many of these players will continue to take underage sides or help out in the same manner as before.

[pintsofguinness]

There are people in soccer, rugby etc in this country who do that at lower-level/school who also don't get paid but do it for he love of it. And that's great. That's pure volunteer material. And that's what makes all games tick.

Oh goodie, lets be like rugby and soccer 

[ONeill]

Erm, we are in terms of volunteering at a certain level.

I can see now why no one answered whatever question it was....

[pintsofguinness]

The question was should the issue go to the membership as rules 42 and 21 did - maybe you'd like to answer it or I suspect it doesn't apply to you as you'd hardly know where your club was.

[ONeill]

Nope, it doesn't apply to me as I don't know where my club is.

Now, run along.

[pintsofguinness]

Now, run along.

Gladly, the argument "I'm more intelligent than you all and none of you understand" was funny at first but it's boring now.

[ONeill]

I wholeheartedly agree. (Stick to your signature O'Neill!)

[pintsofguinness]

A small rump of malcontents'

'I'm not sure what the opposition is based on' says GPA chief Dessie Farrell

By Donnchadh Boyle
Thursday December 06 2007

"A small rump of malcontents"-- that's how GPA chief Dessie Farrell described the meeting that took place last night in Toome, Co Antrim.

The meeting was organised by a group of GAA people who fear irreparable damage to the association if the proposed grants scheme for players agreed by the Government, the GPA, the GAA and the Irish Sports Council goes ahead.

Speaking ahead of Saturday's Central Council meeting, which is expected to see the agreement rubber-stamped by the GAA, Farrell played down the opposition to the scheme, which has gathered a head of steam since the GPA's announcement just over a week ago.

Opposed

"I know that there has been a contingent up north who have been opposed to the scheme but I don't know how broad that opinion is," the GPA's chief executive said. "By and large we have had huge cross the board support for this, but obviously change can be difficult for some people."

Much of the opposition to the grants has come from administrators and Farrell agrees that there is something of a 'generation gap' between officers and their county squads but believes that this is changing.

"That has been prevalent in the history of the GPA, but I feel that mindsets have changed and perhaps that difference isn't as obvious as it once was. In a sense there has been a changing of the guard and I think that has helped move things on."

Resistance has been at its strongest in Ulster where the Tyrone and Derry county board chairmen Pat Darcy and Seamus McCloy have already indicated that their units will not be assisting in the distribution of the grants.


"I'm not sure what that (Ulster opposition) is based on. Perhaps it is an extension of the opposition that there was to changes in Rule 42 and Rule 21. What's important is that the players are still revered and respected in their own locality and this scheme in no way damages the amateur ethos," Farrell continued.


"To be honest I can't understand how any GAA person would be willing to stand over a situation where their own players are being discriminated against -- other athletes from other codes are eligible for grants and they are still considered amateur."

The former Dublin footballer confirmed that payers from both Tyrone and Derry had been in contact expressing concern at their chairman's stance.

"The players (from those counties) must be asking themselves why. It must be very disappointing for them. Why would anyone begrudge their own players a grant?

Last night's meeting in Antrim was chaired by All-Ireland winning Armagh footballer Barry O'Hagan, and Farrell confirmed that his organisation was not invited to attend.

"No, we're not invited nor will we have a representative present. The GAA has a huge membership all around the country and I wonder what constitutes a ground swell? But I'd ask the question -- how many people going to that meeting are from clubs who pay their managers? People choose to ignore certain issues. Other amateur codes get aided and there is no issue so there is a certain degree of hypocrisy involved," he remarked.

Validity

Farrell also hit out at Mayo County Board Secretary Sean Feeney who questioned the validity of the GPA's vote for strike action. In his report for his county convention, Feeney stated the grants scheme was 'more or less pay for play' while he also questioned the voting system undertaken by the GPA when it balloted its members on the possibility of strike action.

"To be honest I don't even think that warrants comment," Farrell retorted. "Our vote was scrutinised by independent auditors as well as several journalists. Mr Feeney's comments were spurious and disingenuous."

If, as is expected, Central Council direct county boards to distribute the funds to their players, Tyrone and Derry will find themselves at odds with Croke Park which could lead to further disruption. In that case, Farrell insisted the GPA would have no issue in distributing the grants to players.

"We would be happy to step in. There is no logistical reason why we couldn't."

Central Council needs only 51pc of the vote to pass the scheme on Saturday and Farrell doesn't foresee any problems.

"I don't see any reason why the scheme won't be passed," he concluded.

- Donnchadh Boyle

http://www.independent.ie/sport/gaelic-football/a-small-rump-of-malcontents-1239007.html

[Bogball XV]

Dessie does the GPA yet another favour, he's great he is, so tactful.  Regarding the pay for play issue, I think it's been accepted by the GAA/GPA that players will be liable for tax on this money, that would make it income, hmm.......

[ONeill]

There's definitely much to be discussed on both sides.

[rrhf]

Yes because we must remember, there will always be those who are there to take and there will always be those who are there to give.