Poll

Would you back unity if a border poll was held tomorrow?

Yes (Northerner)
No (Northerner)
Yes (Southener)
No (Southener)

Author Topic: HOW WOULD YOU VOTE IN A BORDER POLL?  (Read 14198 times)

Applesisapples

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Re: HOW WOULD YOU VOTE IN A BORDER POLL?
« Reply #735 on: April 07, 2021, 10:56:39 AM »
https://www.ft.com/content/655c9fac-4661-4fb0-b461-b18c8d7b6689

A January survey by pollster LucidTalk found 47 per cent of respondents in Northern Ireland wanted the region to remain in the UK, with 42 per cent favouring it becoming part of a united Ireland — an outcome that shows the criteria for a referendum are currently not met. The more deeply researched Northern Ireland Life and Times surveys, conducted annually by Queen’s and Ulster universities since 1998, have consistently found support for unification at a little over 20 per cent.
Those polls are too simplistic, unity is much more complicated than that, not a certainty but at the moment none of those advocating a poll have provided the necessary research or answers to secure a yes.

yellowcard

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Re: HOW WOULD YOU VOTE IN A BORDER POLL?
« Reply #736 on: April 07, 2021, 11:04:03 AM »
If SF are in power when neoliberalism collapses there won't be a United Ireland for the following 20 years.
SF are all ideology and SFA policy. They don't understand the global economy and where it's at.
If Government and the economy depended solely on political parties then we'd all be in the shit. SF in Government will be a different animal, and perhaps not really that different to FF/FG. If they get a chance in Government I would bet that they will not do anything that is likely to make them unelectable. In the North they will struggle given the weak leadership of O'Neill, their only hope is that the SDLP are in worse shape.

I think that this is correct. I don't believe that SF will be anywhere near as radical as some would suggest if they actually get into government. The only way this could happen would be if there were to lead a government with left wing socialists and the numbers just won't be there for such an outcome. So that means a coalition with most likely FF and/or Labour and I think we would see a drastically watered down version of left wing policies. Who knows, there may even be some form of split if FF deteriorates even further and some will defect to FG and some to SF.

Reality will bite for SF though once they get into government since they will be dealing with real life economics for the first time. It will be interesting to see their next election manifesto since it would be the first time that they will potentially be held to account on their policies since prior to now they were never going to have to stand over them.   

Rossfan

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Re: HOW WOULD YOU VOTE IN A BORDER POLL?
« Reply #737 on: April 07, 2021, 11:13:52 AM »
You can put anything you like in an Election manifesto!
However unless you get an overall majority it remains a work of fiction.
PR will ensure ongoing Coalitions and if the recent opinion polls are reflected it will be a multi party Government with a Programme worked out in negotiations.
It will be
FG/FF/Greens and???
Or
SF/FF/Greens/SDP/Labour.  Good luck with getting the latter 2 on board unless they've reunited in the meantime.

Meanwhile the "conversation" on a UI and Referenda needs to continue.
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Angelo

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Re: HOW WOULD YOU VOTE IN A BORDER POLL?
« Reply #738 on: April 07, 2021, 11:16:15 AM »
If SF are in power when neoliberalism collapses there won't be a United Ireland for the following 20 years.
SF are all ideology and SFA policy. They don't understand the global economy and where it's at.
If Government and the economy depended solely on political parties then we'd all be in the shit. SF in Government will be a different animal, and perhaps not really that different to FF/FG. If they get a chance in Government I would bet that they will not do anything that is likely to make them unelectable. In the North they will struggle given the weak leadership of O'Neill, their only hope is that the SDLP are in worse shape.

I think that this is correct. I don't believe that SF will be anywhere near as radical as some would suggest if they actually get into government. The only way this could happen would be if there were to lead a government with left wing socialists and the numbers just won't be there for such an outcome. So that means a coalition with most likely FF and/or Labour and I think we would see a drastically watered down version of left wing policies. Who knows, there may even be some form of split if FF deteriorates even further and some will defect to FG and some to SF.

Reality will bite for SF though once they get into government since they will be dealing with real life economics for the first time. It will be interesting to see their next election manifesto since it would be the first time that they will potentially be held to account on their policies since prior to now they were never going to have to stand over them.

There's definitely truth to that.

However the plus point for them is the decades of corruption and incompetence from FFG means it's a case that they don't have to do an awful lot of positive things to change a lot.

I'd expect SF to hit 50~ seats down south the next time. I expect FF to fall in line with them and probably the SD and Greens.

Forget about Labour, they are utterly finished.
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armaghniac

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Re: HOW WOULD YOU VOTE IN A BORDER POLL?
« Reply #739 on: April 07, 2021, 11:26:53 AM »
Parallel consent would never work, Unionism will never consent. But Mallon does raise the genuine concern that should 51 or 52% result in immediate unity then there could be major difficulties. In my view such a result should preface a period of negotiation and a process to get there peacefully and with maximum economic advantage. having said that there is a long way to go to get to that 50/51 mark.

While 51% might win the vote, there is a larger proportion of the population that recognise the validity of that vote, provided that there is a proper effort to bring everyone in the solution. There is a section of unionism who do not recognise democracy at all and these cannot be helped, but the bigger middle block can be brought on board to recognise the validity of the process even if not all of them would advocate unity at this precisely this point in time.
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Wildweasel74

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Re: HOW WOULD YOU VOTE IN A BORDER POLL?
« Reply #740 on: April 07, 2021, 11:41:23 AM »
Until someone brings to the table the processes that protects pensions, and not charging for doctor and hospital appointments( got alot as not well). The gap in pay differences north and south, the increased cost of food prices between both. Until the persons looking a border poll answer how these issues are to be resolved, before a poll, they are wasting their time. Nobody gona go down a route like the leaving the EU vote, as it was obvious nobody knew what they were voting for. A border poll vote blindly on the basis of just a United Ireland ain't gona cut the mustard anymore with people. Bring forward a proper basis and plan why it is better for united Ireland, instead of the usual bullshit about unity. A border poll in the morning wouldn't even be close, and in turn affect delay another vote to years down the line.

yellowcard

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Re: HOW WOULD YOU VOTE IN A BORDER POLL?
« Reply #741 on: April 07, 2021, 11:55:05 AM »
Until someone brings to the table the processes that protects pensions, and not charging for doctor and hospital appointments( got alot as not well). The gap in pay differences north and south, the increased cost of food prices between both. Until the persons looking a border poll answer how these issues are to be resolved, before a poll, they are wasting their time. Nobody gona go down a route like the leaving the EU vote, as it was obvious nobody knew what they were voting for. A border poll vote blindly on the basis of just a United Ireland ain't gona cut the mustard anymore with people. Bring forward a proper basis and plan why it is better for united Ireland, instead of the usual bullshit about unity. A border poll in the morning wouldn't even be close, and in turn affect delay another vote to years down the line.

Nobody is looking for a border poll in the morning and everybody wants engagement on the relevant issues that you raise. Point me to where any sane person wants a blind border poll tomorrow.

What is the 'usual bullshit about unity' that you are referring to? Did you even watch the Claire Byrne programme a few weeks back or read the recent discussions about beginning the conversation?

JPGJOHNNYG

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Re: HOW WOULD YOU VOTE IN A BORDER POLL?
« Reply #742 on: April 07, 2021, 12:13:44 PM »
https://www.ft.com/content/655c9fac-4661-4fb0-b461-b18c8d7b6689

A January survey by pollster LucidTalk found 47 per cent of respondents in Northern Ireland wanted the region to remain in the UK, with 42 per cent favouring it becoming part of a united Ireland — an outcome that shows the criteria for a referendum are currently not met. The more deeply researched Northern Ireland Life and Times surveys, conducted annually by Queen’s and Ulster universities since 1998, have consistently found support for unification at a little over 20 per cent.
Those polls are too simplistic, unity is much more complicated than that, not a certainty but at the moment none of those advocating a poll have provided the necessary research or answers to secure a yes.

Its not a million miles away either though
The life and times survey otherwise known as the unionist security blanket is seriously flawed. It usually has SF on about 9% of the vote it also carries out the poll face to face, not sure of anywhere on the planet where you going into a voting booth with someone looking at you.
The lucid talk polls have their flaws too but they are accurate. I even thought at the last election the Alliance surge prediction was pie in the sky stuff but it happened.
 I have said it before the SOS will drag their heels on the matter. Unionists will use the life and times survey as hard proof they will then claim nationalist only get 40% of the vote counting just SF and SDLP, they will claim green, alliance PBP and all others probably even openly nationalist independents as pro status quo. It will take the courts to sort out what the criteria for a referendum is and if it has been met.

seafoid

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Re: HOW WOULD YOU VOTE IN A BORDER POLL?
« Reply #743 on: April 07, 2021, 01:21:01 PM »
If SF are in power when neoliberalism collapses there won't be a United Ireland for the following 20 years.
SF are all ideology and SFA policy. They don't understand the global economy and where it's at.
If Government and the economy depended solely on political parties then we'd all be in the shit. SF in Government will be a different animal, and perhaps not really that different to FF/FG. If they get a chance in Government I would bet that they will not do anything that is likely to make them unelectable. In the North they will struggle given the weak leadership of O'Neill, their only hope is that the SDLP are in worse shape.

I think that this is correct. I don't believe that SF will be anywhere near as radical as some would suggest if they actually get into government. The only way this could happen would be if there were to lead a government with left wing socialists and the numbers just won't be there for such an outcome. So that means a coalition with most likely FF and/or Labour and I think we would see a drastically watered down version of left wing policies. Who knows, there may even be some form of split if FF deteriorates even further and some will defect to FG and some to SF.

Reality will bite for SF though once they get into government since they will be dealing with real life economics for the first time. It will be interesting to see their next election manifesto since it would be the first time that they will potentially be held to account on their policies since prior to now they were never going to have to stand over them.

There's definitely truth to that.

However the plus point for them is the decades of corruption and incompetence from FFG means it's a case that they don't have to do an awful lot of positive things to change a lot.

I'd expect SF to hit 50~ seats down south the next time. I expect FF to fall in line with them and probably the SD and Greens.

Forget about Labour, they are utterly finished.
Why is the standard of living in the 26 counties higher than that in the North?

Terms like "Free State" and assuming economic backwardness in the South are signs of 1950s Unionism.
Lookit

Angelo

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Re: HOW WOULD YOU VOTE IN A BORDER POLL?
« Reply #744 on: April 07, 2021, 01:30:38 PM »
If SF are in power when neoliberalism collapses there won't be a United Ireland for the following 20 years.
SF are all ideology and SFA policy. They don't understand the global economy and where it's at.
If Government and the economy depended solely on political parties then we'd all be in the shit. SF in Government will be a different animal, and perhaps not really that different to FF/FG. If they get a chance in Government I would bet that they will not do anything that is likely to make them unelectable. In the North they will struggle given the weak leadership of O'Neill, their only hope is that the SDLP are in worse shape.

I think that this is correct. I don't believe that SF will be anywhere near as radical as some would suggest if they actually get into government. The only way this could happen would be if there were to lead a government with left wing socialists and the numbers just won't be there for such an outcome. So that means a coalition with most likely FF and/or Labour and I think we would see a drastically watered down version of left wing policies. Who knows, there may even be some form of split if FF deteriorates even further and some will defect to FG and some to SF.

Reality will bite for SF though once they get into government since they will be dealing with real life economics for the first time. It will be interesting to see their next election manifesto since it would be the first time that they will potentially be held to account on their policies since prior to now they were never going to have to stand over them.

There's definitely truth to that.

However the plus point for them is the decades of corruption and incompetence from FFG means it's a case that they don't have to do an awful lot of positive things to change a lot.

I'd expect SF to hit 50~ seats down south the next time. I expect FF to fall in line with them and probably the SD and Greens.

Forget about Labour, they are utterly finished.
Why is the standard of living in the 26 counties higher than that in the North?

Terms like "Free State" and assuming economic backwardness in the South are signs of 1950s Unionism.

Is it?

Why don't you ask the younger generation of under 40s why they are voting in their droves for SF.

I think you'll find it's very much an anti-FFG vote due to the crisis they have created in terms of home ownership, cost of living, an out of control rental market that effect the average worker hugely in that generation as vutlure funds, landlord and MNCs cream the riches.

The predominant outlook of dinosaurs like you, Rossfan and Louther is all over now. You can bitch and moan about the change that's coming down the line but you can't stop it now.

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Louther

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Re: HOW WOULD YOU VOTE IN A BORDER POLL?
« Reply #745 on: April 07, 2021, 02:01:51 PM »
If SF are in power when neoliberalism collapses there won't be a United Ireland for the following 20 years.
SF are all ideology and SFA policy. They don't understand the global economy and where it's at.
If Government and the economy depended solely on political parties then we'd all be in the shit. SF in Government will be a different animal, and perhaps not really that different to FF/FG. If they get a chance in Government I would bet that they will not do anything that is likely to make them unelectable. In the North they will struggle given the weak leadership of O'Neill, their only hope is that the SDLP are in worse shape.

I think that this is correct. I don't believe that SF will be anywhere near as radical as some would suggest if they actually get into government. The only way this could happen would be if there were to lead a government with left wing socialists and the numbers just won't be there for such an outcome. So that means a coalition with most likely FF and/or Labour and I think we would see a drastically watered down version of left wing policies. Who knows, there may even be some form of split if FF deteriorates even further and some will defect to FG and some to SF.

Reality will bite for SF though once they get into government since they will be dealing with real life economics for the first time. It will be interesting to see their next election manifesto since it would be the first time that they will potentially be held to account on their policies since prior to now they were never going to have to stand over them.

There's definitely truth to that.

However the plus point for them is the decades of corruption and incompetence from FFG means it's a case that they don't have to do an awful lot of positive things to change a lot.

I'd expect SF to hit 50~ seats down south the next time. I expect FF to fall in line with them and probably the SD and Greens.

Forget about Labour, they are utterly finished.
Why is the standard of living in the 26 counties higher than that in the North?

Terms like "Free State" and assuming economic backwardness in the South are signs of 1950s Unionism.

Is it?

Why don't you ask the younger generation of under 40s why they are voting in their droves for SF.

I think you'll find it's very much an anti-FFG vote due to the crisis they have created in terms of home ownership, cost of living, an out of control rental market that effect the average worker hugely in that generation as vutlure funds, landlord and MNCs cream the riches.

The predominant outlook of dinosaurs like you, Rossfan and Louther is all over now. You can bitch and moan about the change that's coming down the line but you can't stop it now.

Mr Gript himself here, waiting for the right wing to steam to power....or is it the left you for?

You’ve no clue what people thinking or living down here, you stuck in the occupied 6, self pity mindset that will hold you and you mirror images on the unionist side back and keep you in the troubles for decades. No stones on you to actually make a change, just want what suits you and forget everyone else. And you talk of dinosaurs....a bluffer of the highest level. And proven to peddle lies when it suits him.

Angelo

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Re: HOW WOULD YOU VOTE IN A BORDER POLL?
« Reply #746 on: April 07, 2021, 02:09:28 PM »
If SF are in power when neoliberalism collapses there won't be a United Ireland for the following 20 years.
SF are all ideology and SFA policy. They don't understand the global economy and where it's at.
If Government and the economy depended solely on political parties then we'd all be in the shit. SF in Government will be a different animal, and perhaps not really that different to FF/FG. If they get a chance in Government I would bet that they will not do anything that is likely to make them unelectable. In the North they will struggle given the weak leadership of O'Neill, their only hope is that the SDLP are in worse shape.

I think that this is correct. I don't believe that SF will be anywhere near as radical as some would suggest if they actually get into government. The only way this could happen would be if there were to lead a government with left wing socialists and the numbers just won't be there for such an outcome. So that means a coalition with most likely FF and/or Labour and I think we would see a drastically watered down version of left wing policies. Who knows, there may even be some form of split if FF deteriorates even further and some will defect to FG and some to SF.

Reality will bite for SF though once they get into government since they will be dealing with real life economics for the first time. It will be interesting to see their next election manifesto since it would be the first time that they will potentially be held to account on their policies since prior to now they were never going to have to stand over them.

There's definitely truth to that.

However the plus point for them is the decades of corruption and incompetence from FFG means it's a case that they don't have to do an awful lot of positive things to change a lot.

I'd expect SF to hit 50~ seats down south the next time. I expect FF to fall in line with them and probably the SD and Greens.

Forget about Labour, they are utterly finished.
Why is the standard of living in the 26 counties higher than that in the North?

Terms like "Free State" and assuming economic backwardness in the South are signs of 1950s Unionism.

Is it?

Why don't you ask the younger generation of under 40s why they are voting in their droves for SF.

I think you'll find it's very much an anti-FFG vote due to the crisis they have created in terms of home ownership, cost of living, an out of control rental market that effect the average worker hugely in that generation as vutlure funds, landlord and MNCs cream the riches.

The predominant outlook of dinosaurs like you, Rossfan and Louther is all over now. You can bitch and moan about the change that's coming down the line but you can't stop it now.

Mr Gript himself here, waiting for the right wing to steam to power....or is it the left you for?

You’ve no clue what people thinking or living down here, you stuck in the occupied 6, self pity mindset that will hold you and you mirror images on the unionist side back and keep you in the troubles for decades. No stones on you to actually make a change, just want what suits you and forget everyone else. And you talk of dinosaurs....a bluffer of the highest level. And proven to peddle lies when it suits him.

You're projecting a false allegation here again. You have no basis for it but I think slinging mud defines your limitations.

I've never read an article on Gript, I've never mentioned them on here before you did, I've never posted a link to any articles of there's. You on the other hand have openly admitted to knowing what is reported by them and what isn't. You're the poster who introduced them to the debate. It seems the only poster who reads Gript on here is you.

I can see by the fact that you are now resigned to flinging mud at me with these incessant and baseless allegations is an indicator of the embarrassment and shame you must feel after outing yourself as a subscriber to Gript, a far right editorial.
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Louther

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Re: HOW WOULD YOU VOTE IN A BORDER POLL?
« Reply #747 on: April 07, 2021, 02:14:17 PM »
If SF are in power when neoliberalism collapses there won't be a United Ireland for the following 20 years.
SF are all ideology and SFA policy. They don't understand the global economy and where it's at.
If Government and the economy depended solely on political parties then we'd all be in the shit. SF in Government will be a different animal, and perhaps not really that different to FF/FG. If they get a chance in Government I would bet that they will not do anything that is likely to make them unelectable. In the North they will struggle given the weak leadership of O'Neill, their only hope is that the SDLP are in worse shape.

I think that this is correct. I don't believe that SF will be anywhere near as radical as some would suggest if they actually get into government. The only way this could happen would be if there were to lead a government with left wing socialists and the numbers just won't be there for such an outcome. So that means a coalition with most likely FF and/or Labour and I think we would see a drastically watered down version of left wing policies. Who knows, there may even be some form of split if FF deteriorates even further and some will defect to FG and some to SF.

Reality will bite for SF though once they get into government since they will be dealing with real life economics for the first time. It will be interesting to see their next election manifesto since it would be the first time that they will potentially be held to account on their policies since prior to now they were never going to have to stand over them.

There's definitely truth to that.

However the plus point for them is the decades of corruption and incompetence from FFG means it's a case that they don't have to do an awful lot of positive things to change a lot.

I'd expect SF to hit 50~ seats down south the next time. I expect FF to fall in line with them and probably the SD and Greens.

Forget about Labour, they are utterly finished.
Why is the standard of living in the 26 counties higher than that in the North?

Terms like "Free State" and assuming economic backwardness in the South are signs of 1950s Unionism.

Is it?

Why don't you ask the younger generation of under 40s why they are voting in their droves for SF.

I think you'll find it's very much an anti-FFG vote due to the crisis they have created in terms of home ownership, cost of living, an out of control rental market that effect the average worker hugely in that generation as vutlure funds, landlord and MNCs cream the riches.

The predominant outlook of dinosaurs like you, Rossfan and Louther is all over now. You can bitch and moan about the change that's coming down the line but you can't stop it now.

Mr Gript himself here, waiting for the right wing to steam to power....or is it the left you for?

You’ve no clue what people thinking or living down here, you stuck in the occupied 6, self pity mindset that will hold you and you mirror images on the unionist side back and keep you in the troubles for decades. No stones on you to actually make a change, just want what suits you and forget everyone else. And you talk of dinosaurs....a bluffer of the highest level. And proven to peddle lies when it suits him.

You're projecting a false allegation here again. You have no basis for it but I think slinging mud defines your limitations.

I've never read an article on Gript, I've never mentioned them on here before you did, I've never posted a link to any articles of there's. You on the other hand have openly admitted to knowing what is reported by them and what isn't. You're the poster who introduced them to the debate. It seems the only poster who reads Gript on here is you.

I can see by the fact that you are now resigned to flinging mud at me with these incessant and baseless allegations is an indicator of the embarrassment and shame you must feel after outing yourself as a subscriber to Gript, a far right editorial.

That all you can do? Deny and deflect.

You’ve been caught out on this board more times it’s funny at this stage. You get shown up and then disappear from view for a few days when a few hard questions put to you that expose your lies.

You don’t have to subscribe to Gript and well you know. There is plenty, far too much, sharing of their stuff on twitter to know what they said and thankfully plenty of people who call them out for what they report.


Angelo

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Re: HOW WOULD YOU VOTE IN A BORDER POLL?
« Reply #748 on: April 07, 2021, 02:42:22 PM »


This is where you entered the thread below. No contribution to the point in hand, just some rehashed baseless mud slinging that has nothing in relevance to the discussion

If SF are in power when neoliberalism collapses there won't be a United Ireland for the following 20 years.
SF are all ideology and SFA policy. They don't understand the global economy and where it's at.
If Government and the economy depended solely on political parties then we'd all be in the shit. SF in Government will be a different animal, and perhaps not really that different to FF/FG. If they get a chance in Government I would bet that they will not do anything that is likely to make them unelectable. In the North they will struggle given the weak leadership of O'Neill, their only hope is that the SDLP are in worse shape.

I think that this is correct. I don't believe that SF will be anywhere near as radical as some would suggest if they actually get into government. The only way this could happen would be if there were to lead a government with left wing socialists and the numbers just won't be there for such an outcome. So that means a coalition with most likely FF and/or Labour and I think we would see a drastically watered down version of left wing policies. Who knows, there may even be some form of split if FF deteriorates even further and some will defect to FG and some to SF.

Reality will bite for SF though once they get into government since they will be dealing with real life economics for the first time. It will be interesting to see their next election manifesto since it would be the first time that they will potentially be held to account on their policies since prior to now they were never going to have to stand over them.

There's definitely truth to that.

However the plus point for them is the decades of corruption and incompetence from FFG means it's a case that they don't have to do an awful lot of positive things to change a lot.

I'd expect SF to hit 50~ seats down south the next time. I expect FF to fall in line with them and probably the SD and Greens.

Forget about Labour, they are utterly finished.
Why is the standard of living in the 26 counties higher than that in the North?

Terms like "Free State" and assuming economic backwardness in the South are signs of 1950s Unionism.

Is it?

Why don't you ask the younger generation of under 40s why they are voting in their droves for SF.

I think you'll find it's very much an anti-FFG vote due to the crisis they have created in terms of home ownership, cost of living, an out of control rental market that effect the average worker hugely in that generation as vutlure funds, landlord and MNCs cream the riches.

The predominant outlook of dinosaurs like you, Rossfan and Louther is all over now. You can bitch and moan about the change that's coming down the line but you can't stop it now.

Mr Gript himself here, waiting for the right wing to steam to power....or is it the left you for?

You’ve no clue what people thinking or living down here, you stuck in the occupied 6, self pity mindset that will hold you and you mirror images on the unionist side back and keep you in the troubles for decades. No stones on you to actually make a change, just want what suits you and forget everyone else. And you talk of dinosaurs....a bluffer of the highest level. And proven to peddle lies when it suits him.

It's spam. It's what you do. Spam up the board with inane, baseless trolling and the moderator should be taking action against your type of posting.
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grounded

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Re: HOW WOULD YOU VOTE IN A BORDER POLL?
« Reply #749 on: April 07, 2021, 03:18:12 PM »
Until someone brings to the table the processes that protects pensions, and not charging for doctor and hospital appointments( got alot as not well). The gap in pay differences north and south, the increased cost of food prices between both. Until the persons looking a border poll answer how these issues are to be resolved, before a poll, they are wasting their time. Nobody gona go down a route like the leaving the EU vote, as it was obvious nobody knew what they were voting for. A border poll vote blindly on the basis of just a United Ireland ain't gona cut the mustard anymore with people. Bring forward a proper basis and plan why it is better for united Ireland, instead of the usual bullshit about unity. A border poll in the morning wouldn't even be close, and in turn affect delay another vote to years down the line.

Yep needs to be a proper discussion before any border poll. I dont think anybody argues with that.
             Funny your post brought back some memories from an open talk that Chris McGimpsey was giving to the Unionist party in Trinity College in the 90's.( Coincidentally Sinn Fein were banned from having any organisation in Trinity at that time).
          He included all those arguments re: Health, Finance, education and demographics. At the time he was quite adamant that there would never be a nationalist majority and thus no possibility of a UI. The south couldn't afford it etc.
       Strangely one other strand of his argument was that closer integration within the EU would do away with a lot of the aspirations Nationalists had for a UI.