Derry Club Football & Hurling original

[lenny]

What was the exact story with subs?

Anybody know who came on and off etc.?

Toner on for Cassidy
McGurk on for CD
Downey on for Loughlin

Extra time CD and Loughlin back on, but can't remember right now who came on the 2nd half of ET.

* McGurk had two stints , 3 mins in regular time and 2 mins in et totally 5 mins.

* Downey got 9 mins

* Kearney got 2 mins in et (scored a point)

* Toner got 29 mins

4 subs in total (45 mins between them) scoring 1 point

Monaghan who finished stronger made 7 substitutions totaling 217 mins scoring 5 points

Think Toner got a point as did Kearney. We needed to use the bench more, some of our main players were out on their feet. Kearney should definitely have had more game time.

[marty34]

Not a good look for subs and bench with lads, who were cleared wrecked, coming back on again.

If you were an unused sub, I'd say you wouldn't be too happy. Actually you'd want to step away from that and play some club football.

[Wildweasel74]

They are playing some club fball seen Reegan, Mulholland, T Rodgers playing the day in a league game.

[marty34]

They are playing some club fball seen Reegan, Mulholland, T Rodgers playing the day in a league game.

No's 16 - 25. Did they all play today for clubs?

And players who were wrecked coming on again and you sitting fresh on bench.

Not, as I said, a good look.

[Ryan O]

They are playing some club fball seen Reegan, Mulholland, T Rodgers playing the day in a league game.

No's 16 - 25. Did they all play today for clubs?

And players who were wrecked coming on again and you sitting fresh on bench.

Not, as I said, a good look.

Rogers wasn't even togged out against Monaghan. Not on the squad

[HonDerry]

A reflection on yesterday  and the sub situation
When you look at the game back, the contrast in how both teams used their bench is hard to ignore. Monaghan went early and went hard:
HT change
Then 45, 50, 55 mins
They effectively restarted their team before the game got away from them
Derry:
First real changes at 60 mins, Then 66 mins, Nothing again until extra-time

Monaghan used subs to change the game. We used subs when the game had already changed on us. And the impact was obvious:
McCaul gave them a focal point immediately
McCarron comes in and swings the whole momentum
The bigger question is why. It's easy to say "we should have made changes earlier"... but the real issue is do we trust the bench? And that doesn't start in May, it starts in the league.

Teams like Donegal and Tyrone, Blood 4–5 U20 or U21s, and take short-term hits to build long-term depth.  We stick tight to a core group and don't expose younger players to enough high-level minutes. So when the championship comes and the game is in the melting pot the management is slow to change because the trust isn't fully there
This isn't new, it's been here since Gallagher. When the starting 15 are going well, it's not an issue.
But when momentum swings, as it always does at this level you need players coming in who can change the game.

The results yesterday wasn't just about player mistakes or game management. It was about squad development. Monaghan had players ready to come in and impact the game. We didn't have that same level of trust or readiness.
And until we solve that, we'll always be vulnerable when Plan A starts to fail.
 
People on here saying x or y should be on. On our subs who actually got a good amount of time during the league. The other issue being the ground is a lot harder now than during the league so the likes of Kearney, Young, Murray who bring serious pace and movement are better suited to the game now than earlier in the year.

 from Irish News report....
the Armagh manager admitted that keeping everyone in his squad happy wasn't his priority.
"I don't (keep them happy)," he said.
"I keep them very unhappy, that's mainly my job because if I was keeping them happy, then they wouldn't work.

Is it just me or have the last few managers been too focussed on keeping starting the core starting 15 happy

[Wildweasel74]

That Lad McCaul just over U20 age i think.

[toby47]

A reflection on yesterday  and the sub situation
When you look at the game back, the contrast in how both teams used their bench is hard to ignore. Monaghan went early and went hard:
HT change
Then 45, 50, 55 mins
They effectively restarted their team before the game got away from them
Derry:
First real changes at 60 mins, Then 66 mins, Nothing again until extra-time

Monaghan used subs to change the game. We used subs when the game had already changed on us. And the impact was obvious:
McCaul gave them a focal point immediately
McCarron comes in and swings the whole momentum
The bigger question is why. It's easy to say "we should have made changes earlier"... but the real issue is do we trust the bench? And that doesn't start in May, it starts in the league.

Teams like Donegal and Tyrone, Blood 4–5 U20 or U21s, and take short-term hits to build long-term depth.  We stick tight to a core group and don't expose younger players to enough high-level minutes. So when the championship comes and the game is in the melting pot the management is slow to change because the trust isn't fully there
This isn't new, it's been here since Gallagher. When the starting 15 are going well, it's not an issue.
But when momentum swings, as it always does at this level you need players coming in who can change the game.

The results yesterday wasn't just about player mistakes or game management. It was about squad development. Monaghan had players ready to come in and impact the game. We didn't have that same level of trust or readiness.
And until we solve that, we'll always be vulnerable when Plan A starts to fail.
 
People on here saying x or y should be on. On our subs who actually got a good amount of time during the league. The other issue being the ground is a lot harder now than during the league so the likes of Kearney, Young, Murray who bring serious pace and movement are better suited to the game now than earlier in the year.

 from Irish News report....
the Armagh manager admitted that keeping everyone in his squad happy wasn't his priority.
"I don't (keep them happy)," he said.
"I keep them very unhappy, that's mainly my job because if I was keeping them happy, then they wouldn't work.

Is it just me or have the last few managers been too focussed on keeping starting the core starting 15 happy

That could be the difference in having an internal & external manager.

A manager from the county he's managing (McGeeney) would be thinking of the counties long term a bit more, an external manager knows he's probably got 1-3 years to get it right so has to get the most out of his core players.

That's not me saying I think we should have an internal set up, or any slight on Meenagh by the way.

[marty34]

A lad raised a point with me last night in regarding the two semi-finals and the two different defeats for Derry and Down - he asked who's camp would you rather be in when you wake up this morning?

[ranch]

A lad raised a point with me last night in regarding the two semi-finals and the two different defeats for Derry and Down - he asked who's camp would you rather be in when you wake up this morning?

Derry for various reasons.

1) they're still in the AI. They can get another crack at Monaghan this summer to rectify it, Down can't.

2) they know they should have won the game both in normal time and ET. They lost to a team who got a bit of momentum and with the 2 point rule that can be huge. Down on the other hand were embarrassed.

3) their better players have shown in the past the levels they can reach, Down are nowhere near that level and have a fair way to go to get close.

[toby47]

No ulster this year, I don't expect us to challenge for the All Ireland either. Were not in the worst place but definitely short of Armagh, Donegal, Kerry etc.

Next year we are in Divison 2 again, just looking at the age profile of the team from Saturday evening, you have to think a right few of the team are in their 'prime years'

Gareth McKinless(32)
Brendan Rogers (32)
Niall Loughlin (30/31)
Niall Toner (30/31)
Conor Doherty (28)
Conor Glass (28)
Shane McGuigan (28)
Shea Downey (28)
Conor McCluskey (27)

What is the realistic ceiling in the next few years for this group?

Is there anyone in u20's or below that you think will be 'fast tracked' into the team like a Shane McGuigan, Glass etc?

[ck]

Glass and McGuigan are closer to 30 than 28, if not 30 already

[jb77]

They're closer to 28 considering they are both exactly 28

[GTP]

I'd say changing manager each of the last 3 seasons has limited the turnover of players. Harte kept basically the same squad as RG. Tally had little chance to find new players, although in fairness a few did get game time. And the current set up has brought in a few who then left. A county team has a minimum 10 matches in a year it isn't a lot to be giving lads game time to see if they are up to it or judging then on.
The other issue is how do club players break through when the league doesn't matter and they might get 2 championship games a year.

[CookieMonster]

Who would everybody like to get in the draw? Is it at 1oclock?