Long Kesh Park takes another step forward

[full back]

I'd imagine they'll do some sort of 'guaranteed seat' ticket, which will cover all events including concerts etc. As long as you don't mind travelling to Belfast

Is the Maze classed as Belfast? I thought it would be too far out to be classed as there

[SammyG]

Is the Maze classed as Belfast? I thought it would be too far out to be classed as there

The Maze is definitely not classed as Belfast but if a stadium is ever buillt it will be in Belfast

[saffron sam2]

Do you think it will be possible to buy a season ticket that will allow access to all games in all three sports?  

I would like one of them.  (tickets that is, not sports)

I'd imagine they'll do some sort of 'guaranteed seat' ticket, which will cover all events including concerts etc. As long as you don't mind travelling to Belfast
[/quote]

Travelling to Belfast will be quite easy for me, given that I am there already. 

I have always been against the proposal at the Maze, but I am actually warming to it a bit now.  Certainly beats the hell out of travelling to Clones and watching soccer and rugby in a modern stadium is quite appealing.

[Main Street]

Ryanair logic could be applied re the location name

[stiffler]

Maze stadium 'best option': study 

How the Maze site could look
Northern Ireland's national stadium should be built on the site of the former Maze Prison, according to a leaked consultants report.
The Press Association says it has seen a copy of the report by consultants from PricewaterhouseCoopers.

It is currently being reviewed by Finance Minister Peter Robinson, before being passed to Executive colleagues.

PA says it recommends the government go ahead with plans for the all-seater venue at the Maze site.

The Gaelic Athletic Association, Irish Football Association and Ulster Rugby have all confirmed they would play games at the venue.

The site is just outside Lisburn in County Antrim.

The consultants said the venue had the potential to generate significant revenue and claimed that the overall cost to the taxpayer after the first four years of operation would be £37m.

This was based on the 38,500-seat stadium hosting 23 major sporting and music events in a year and attracting just under 500,000 paying spectators.

Other options examined included a hypothetical stadium in north Belfast and the refurbishment of the three sporting bodies' existing venues. The report said there would be many benefits to a venue at Belfast's north foreshore, but ruled it out on cost grounds.

"Hypothetically such an option would generate high visitor spending benefits because it is located closer to the city centre, but these are outweighed by the capital and infrastructure costs and the higher value of this site," the report is quoted as saying.

The Maze site is opposed by some unionists due to plans to build a conflict transformation centre alongside the stadium and by many NI football fans who want any new stadium to be in Belfast.

[snatter]

37 million is nothing to the UK exchequer.

Remember this is coming out of ringfenced UK plc funds, not NI plc funds allocated to/controlled by the assembly.

Moving on....

This stadium is a no-brainer for the GAA and should be supported by all those with the GAA's interests at heart.
I wonder if the Shinners have the wit to decouple the stadium issue from the conflict centre.
If the conflict centre issue can be parked, then its more likely that the stadium will get built.

Once its built, the NI fans will come.
At that point, or a year or so after, the Shinners can push for something to be done with the H blocks.
I'd say its unlikely that NI fans would then boycott the Maze after happily using it.
Remember that the H blocks are listed, so nothing can happen to them in the meantime.

I imagine there'd be goodwill from Ulster GAA fans if the Shinners worked with the GAA's interests for a change and not against it (eg Casement rally).

[his holiness nb]

The Maze is definitely not classed as Belfast

I dunno Sammy, if theres concerts there that may change.

I cant remember who it was at a Slane concert in the past few years saying "hello Dublin" !!!

The Royals were not best pleased 

[Hardy]

Dubs are entitled to their dreams too.

[his holiness nb]

Dubs are entitled to their dreams too.

Check out the club section Hardy, draw done for the championships. Looking for predictions from the "locals" 

[Hardy]

Unfortunately, Holiness I see very little Meath club football these days, being on active duty behind enemy lines. So I wouldn't be the best judge.

[Donagh]

Time the IFA was told to feck off. The Brits should throw them the two or three million they'd be entitled to commensurate with their attendance figures and let them slip off and renovate their cess pit of a bigot bowl and let the rest of us move on. FFS all they would need to do would be host four concerts a year instead of three to make up the shortfall.

[Evil Genius]

37 million is nothing to the UK exchequer.

Remember this is coming out of ringfenced UK plc funds, not NI plc funds allocated to/controlled by the assembly.

£37m might be "nothing" to the UK Exchequer, but even if this figure is correct, it doesn't tell half the story. From UTV's leaked copy of the Report, the following figures also emerge:
http://u.tv/newsroom/indepth.asp?id=87616&pt=n

"It is estimated that the stadium would cost £126 million to build and would need an additional £114 million investment to improve the transport infrastructure around the isolated site."

As I understand it, private developers will provide the construction cost (£126m), in return for developpment rights on the site (industrial, retail, housing etc) which they must judge to be worth more than £126m (otherwise no profit in it for them). This raises a number of questions straightaway.
1. How on earth can it cost so much to build a medium sized stadium, when the site is (effectively) for free? The Liberty Stadium in Swansea, built on land donated by the Council, is half the size of the Maze proposal, but a fifth the cost! ( http://dspace.dial.pipex.com/town/park/yfh45/swansea.htm )
2. If the cost should overrun (invariably the case), who will bear the overrun? I can guarantee it won't be the developers, in that they will extract some sort of concession to guard against the possibility! Interestingly, Lisburn District Council, so sure that this Stadium will be a winner, nonetheless have passed a motion which refuses to see them accept any financial responsibility for, or contribution to, the Stadium!
3. The Government will be subsidising the transport infrastructure to the tune of £114m - for a stadium which they (optimistically) claim will be used no more than 23 days a year. It's not as if the roads and transport budget for NI is overflowing, these days, so I refuse to accept that that money could not better be spent elsewhere. Why not just let the developers pay for the transport links, in return for the development rights for industry, retail, housing etc. That would leave £37m to be distributed fairly between the three codes in NI, to spend as they see best, with the proviso that such expenditure be made in such a way as best provides for genuine cross-community access and participation etc. This would be much more effective than merely building a stadium on the basis of some pie-in-the-sky "Shared Space" concept; it would be democratic; it would put a firm limit on expenditure.



"It was working on the basis that the Maze venue would host 23 major sporting and music events in a year and attract just under 500,000 paying spectators. The stadium would accommodate six or seven Northern Ireland football matches, five or six gaelic matches and three Ulster rugby games each year."

Once again, the figures simply do not add up. Taking the upper figures - 7 IFA, 6 GAA and 3 UR - this still only adds up to 16 events p.a. Where are the other 7 sporting and music events going to come from? I know of no other stadium sports which would attract significant crowds and as for "music", this is baloney. The Stadium is far too big for the majority of events, for which the Odyssey, the Point etc are ideally suited. Yet it is too small for the really big stadium attractions (U2, Springsteen, Eagles, Stones etc), which will either go to Lansdowne or Croke, or for outdoor venues/festivals like Slane. And there aren't that many such acts, anyhow, and when/if they include Ireland on their Itinerary, it is only ever likely to be one location (i.e. for a market of 6 million people). And they don't all tour every year. And with no roof, the stadium is at risk from the weather half the year, anyhow! Above all, whilst the Government has been happy to trumpet the "commitment" of the three codes, one must assume that not one single major Promoter has expressed an interest in the Maze, otherwise we'd have heard all about them by now.

And, of course, the upper figures are highly suspect. The only soccer events which could be expected to draw a decent crowd are internationals and maybe the Irish Cup Final. NI never has six home internationals in a year, so how do they arrive at a figure of 6 or 7? (Bear in mind, also, that the IFA has plans to develop the Blanchflower Stadium project in Belfast to around 10k capacity, which means it would be the obvious home for U-21 internationals and other Cup Finals etc.)
As for Ulster rugby, the only matches which would even half-fill a 35k seater/42k all capacity stadium are Ireland internationals and Heineken Cup games. For internationals, once Lansdowne is built, the IRFU will have a heavy incentive to play all internationals there, but even if they decide to move a couple of minor games to the Provinces, the Maze will be competing with the new Munster stadium which is being built, so perhaps one international every other year, at most. And as for Ulster's Heineken games, when Ulster can't presently fill the 13k capacity Ravenhill for all of these games, what hope is there for a huge stadium away from their heartland and spiritual home? And that's assuming they continue to qualify for the Heineken - presently in doubt, I'm sorry to say.
Which leaves the GAA. Can someone tell me whether Ulster GAA has 5 or 6 games in its calendar each year which are too big for the likes of Casement, and which will not also be required to be staged in Clones?



In the end, regardless of how it is accounted for on whose balance sheet, we are going to be lumbered with a stadium which will cost the country £240 million. As far as I am concerned, that is bonkers economics by any standards. And that would be the case even if it were filled for all of those 23 events which they claim it will host every year.  

[snatter]

Time the IFA was told to feck off. The Brits should throw them the two or three million they'd be entitled to commensurate with their attendance figures and let them slip off and renovate their cess pit of a bigot bowl and let the rest of us move on. FFS all they would need to do would be host four concerts a year instead of three to make up the shortfall.

Donagh,

No thoughts on my previous post re the shinners linking their support of the stadium to the conflict centre?
It would be nice for them to act in the GAA's best interests on this one.

Surely if the stadium is in the GAA's best interests, then the shinners should do the intelligent thing and let it proceed, whilst parking the conflict centre for a year or two.

[Chrisowc]

Time the IFA was told to feck off. The Brits should throw them the two or three million they'd be entitled to commensurate with their attendance figures and let them slip off and renovate their cess pit of a bigot bowl and let the rest of us move on. FFS all they would need to do would be host four concerts a year instead of three to make up the shortfall.

Windbagging alert!!

[An Fear Rua]

harder to catch Mackerel