Video in Good Shepherd Chapel - Niamh Horan

[haveaharp]

RC leaders the world over facilitated/covered up these atrocities, yet Tony is disgusted at some daft idiots frolicking on an alter yet he fawns over one of those leaders who played a very important part in role in the cover up here locally. His sheepish idolatry to Brady regardless of the evidence and his refusal to accept he is in any way guilty to the point he's too morally corrupted to lead those of faith is typical of the devout it would seem.   

THIS IS "THE WHY" I RESPONDED INITIALLY IN THE WAY I DID TO THIS THREAD.

Forget about Tony, but it is untrue to make such a sweeping statement as you have, it implies that all the church hierarchy were complicit. It is the case that many misguided fools covered up abuse. The church is a body made up of human beings who all make mistakes some as in this case with devastating consequences not least for the childern involved. But don't generalise.

Was Brady a misguided fool when he witnessed the 2 lads being silenced ? Not he was not. The church hierarchy were complicit because every last one of them knew what was happening. How could they not ?

[Hardy]

A few bad apples, eh? Never heard that one before.

[armaghniac]

Its like a Jewish man pissing on German flag and hard line Nazi complaining bitterly about the act.
Yes we can all agree its insulting and wrong....but you know and I know its hard to just finish the sentence there in light of the person doing the complaining.

It isn't. This is not some victim of child abuse making a statement in some way. This is music video made by someone who has not suffered and who is doing it to make money.

Child abuse took place in a variety of places, is a music artist entitled to shoot a video in the Garden of Remembrance because the government did not act on child abuse?

[theskull1]

You know what armaghniac youre right. Thanks for completely missing the point because of this error. I'll make a correction to my analogy

I am attacking TFs opinions on this subject in context of his tolerance nay whole hearted support for his church leader who was a major player in the child abuse cover up in this part of the world.

Are you telling me you can't understand and sympathise with people like me taking such a position when we see the likes of Sean Brady as someone who should be behind bars as opposed to alter rails?

Its like a musician pissing on German flag in a music video (with an interest in making money) and a hard line Nazi complaining bitterly about the act.
Yes we can all agree its insulting and wrong....but you know and I know its hard to just finish the sentence there in light of the person doing the complaining.

[Ulick]

Three of my children were baptised in the Good Shepherd and although we don't attend Mass there I'm fairly friendly with Fr Fullerton and Fr McKenna. Contrary to what was reported in the media and what the director of this video have said, neither priest gave permission for any kind of filming to happen inside the chapel. The literally went in and set-up without seeking or gaining permission from anyone connected to the church. It's obvious this whole thing was a carefully planned publicity stunt on behalf of the director and musician - sure why not when Rihanna can do it so successfully it's only natural to expect others to take it further. Meanwhile Fr Fullerton and Fr McKenna who are both very elderly are extremely distressed by it all and are talking about the Chapel and/or the altar having to be reconsecrated.

[muppet]

Having read this again, it occurred to me that Tony never put up a link to the story nor indeed anything regarding the story.

Any chance of something to go on other than Tony's word?

http://www.belfasttelegraph.co.uk/news/local-national/northern-ireland/fury-at-pop-video-sex-on-the-altar-in-belfast-catholic-church-30375220.html

Pangurban - the word "Narrow" in Meath can mean a lot of things, especially the genetic diversity!!

Good man thanks.

[J OGorman]

i think the main point, which has been missed is...the song is complete and utter pants

[muppet]

i think the main point, which has been missed is...the song is complete and utter pants

So this is what happened:

* Band films sexy scene in Church apparently without permission as blatantly obvious publicity stunt;
* Church protests and the scenes removed from the final video;
* Someone is outraged anyway;
* Someone else decides to ask Niamh Horan what she thinks;
* She says the most sensational thing that enters her head;
* Tony is appalled and outraged and cannot understand why the world hasn't stopped turning;

Tony, do you work for this band?

[laoislad]

Meh.. I done far worse in the Protestant graveyard in Durrow after the local disco.

[J OGorman]

Meh.. I done far worse in the Protestant graveyard in Durrow after the local disco.

with a guy lying on top of you?

[omaghjoe]

HS! That's way worse than I imagined. Who do they think they are?

Apart from anything else, Is this not this a crime? Why are the police not involved

[Ulick]

HS! That's way worse than I imagined. Who do they think they are?

Apart from anything else, Is this not this a crime? Why are the police not involved

The way I understand it the priests have been played for fools:
-The director apparently told them that because the building was open to the public she assumed they could film in it.
-She apologizes and says here I tell you what you can view the video we'll take out whatever you want.
-The priests view the video are horrified and insist all shots of their chapel are removed.   
-For the official version the director duly removes all footage of the Good Shepard.
-The 'unofficial' version is released on the web with the offending scenes still present.
-Director says very sorry everyone, dunno how that could have happened, look we gave the priests final editorial control an all, we tried our best.
-Media does their part and provide loads of publicity for the story and a shit song with equally crummy video are headline news.
-Two elderly priests left dazed and confused wondering wtf happened. 

I don't see there is a criminal offense that can be proven. Even if there was the ignorance plea would most likely get her a slap on the wrist at most as anything more and the director is suddenly the western Pussy Riot and priests are evil incarnate.

[armaghniac]

The Altar is not a public part of a church. A courthouse might be a public building, but film riding on the bench and that wouldn't be acceptable.
Has Blasphemy been repealed?

[The Iceman]

Skull I don't think it's a fair analogy to draw between the Nazis and the church. But I see what you're doing.

The reality is for 2000 years the people who make up the RC Church have messed up - like every organisation in the world - but in spite of this - it survives, it continues on. There are good people in the church still. Good priests too. Sean Brady isn't one of them in your book and mine - but he hasn't long left and there is no love lost between him and the man in line.

When it comes to forgiveness, we are all called to forgive. But that doesn't mean things are reconciled. The Church in Ireland especially needs to reconcile with the people of Ireland. Until that happens I don't think the Church has any real hope there. I also don't know what would be enough for some people. I don't know what act or continuing act of reconciliation would be enough.

With this all in mind, I'm glad you agree that what happened in Good Shepherd was distasteful but it isn't fair to brush it off either. I hadn't likened you as a candidate for the Nolan Show but you and the Tony fella would make for a great episode

[muppet]

Skull I don't think it's a fair analogy to draw between the Nazis and the church. But I see what you're doing.

The reality is for 2000 years the people who make up the RC Church have messed up - like every organisation in the world - but in spite of this - it survives, it continues on. There are good people in the church still. Good priests too. Sean Brady isn't one of them in your book and mine - but he hasn't long left and there is no love lost between him and the man in line.

When it comes to forgiveness, we are all called to forgive. But that doesn't mean things are reconciled. The Church in Ireland especially needs to reconcile with the people of Ireland. Until that happens I don't think the Church has any real hope there. I also don't know what would be enough for some people. I don't know what act or continuing act of reconciliation would be enough.

With this all in mind, I'm glad you agree that what happened in Good Shepherd was distasteful but it isn't fair to brush it off either. I hadn't likened you as a candidate for the Nolan Show but you and the Tony fella would make for a great episode

This is all fair and reasonable Iceman.

The one pony (edit - point! - bloody predictive text) I would make is that the Church calls us all to forgive. But it also calls for us to be remorseful when we have done wrong. This is where the Church is, I believe, falling down. It continues to be evasive and make legal technical arguments to avoid being responsible. In my opinion that is not good enough from the Catholic Church that educated me.