10 Years Ago Today. Tyrone 0-12 Armagh 0-9.

[Mike Sheehy]

With the annoucement today of Tomas O Se's (35) retirement and the likelyhood of more to follow. Kerry have an enormous task over the next year or two to replace players of the calibre of Marc O Se (33), Galvin (33), O'Mahony(33), Brosnan (33) Declan O'Sullivan (30), Cooper (30) . I expect to see plenty of bluff and blunder from Mikey Shiity Sheehy as the decline continues.

Why don't you come up to one of our cultural days out and I'll play you a tune. Would 'Yesterday' by the Beatles be appropriate for you?

They said we'd never replace Jacko and Darragh O'Se came along
They said we'd never replace Mikey Sheehy and Maurice fitz came along
They said we'd never replace Maurice fitz and gooch came along.
Maybe James O'Donoghue will be the next gooch..who knows.

That's the difference between Tyrone and Kerry. We give these players the freedom to express themselves and that's why we have such a mixture of different types of players. You just produce robots that conform to a system. That is why you were a flash in the pan. Systems will always be combatted eventually..which is why you got wiped away in Killarney and its why Donegal got mullered by Mayo.

[under the bar]

Getting back to those weird Armagh jerseys with the strange dwarf/hobbit-like sleeves I know the fella who was commissioned by the county board to design them.  He's a Lurgan Sarsfields man and his brother played for Armagh back in the 90's.

Anyway he had recently qualified in design,  not clothing design, just design moreso associated with toys, and household stuff like you see in IKEA etc) but did a commendable job and the co board sorted him and he passed across the disks.  Anyway the software he used wasn't the same as O'Neills used so they had to covert the images and it didn't quite transpose as is should hence the sleeves like a pair of 3/4 length trousers!

Now ye all know, but the Sarsfields men probably knew this anyway, as he still has a good laugh about it!

[SkillfulBill]

With the annoucement today of Tomas O Se's (35) retirement and the likelyhood of more to follow. Kerry have an enormous task over the next year or two to replace players of the calibre of Marc O Se (33), Galvin (33), O'Mahony(33), Brosnan (33) Declan O'Sullivan (30), Cooper (30) . I expect to see plenty of bluff and blunder from Mikey Shiity Sheehy as the decline continues.

Why don't you come up to one of our cultural days out and I'll play you a tune. Would 'Yesterday' by the Beatles be appropriate for you?

They said we'd never replace Jacko and Darragh O'Se came along
They said we'd never replace Mikey Sheehy and Maurice fitz came along
They said we'd never replace Maurice fitz and gooch came along.
Maybe James O'Donoghue will be the next gooch..who knows.

That's the difference between Tyrone and Kerry. We give these players the freedom to express themselves and that's why we have such a mixture of different types of players. You just produce robots that conform to a system. That is why you were a flash in the pan. Systems will always be combatted eventually..which is why you got wiped away in Killarney and its why Donegal got mullered by Mayo.

Here is the problem for you, the last time Kerry had to replace All-Ireland winners on this scale was post 1986 and it took them 11 years to win another All-Ireland 1997 and that was in the pre-modern era .The issue for Kerry now is that it's not one or two great players need replacing its 6-8 over the next couple of years. Take into account the lack of underage success over a ten year period and the level to which counties prepare and develop their youth, the barren years could be extremely prolonged. History and tradition is no longer enough you have to have the material which Kerry don't have. 

[BennyCake]

Here is the problem for you, the last time Kerry had to replace All-Ireland winners on this scale was post 1986 and it took them 11 years to win another All-Ireland 1997 and that was in the pre-modern era .The issue for Kerry now is that it's not one or two great players need replacing its 6-8 over the next couple of years. Take into account the lack of underage success over a ten year period and the level to which counties prepare and develop their youth, the barren years could be extremely prolonged. History and tradition is no longer enough you have to have the material which Kerry don't have.

Underage success doesn't guarantee senior success. Donegal minors teams only won an Ulster in 06. They weren't even in any other final that I can remember, yet Donegal won Sam last year. Minor/U-21 successes can help, but it's not vital, as long as the good young players are coming through. Tyrone won AI minors in 08/10. It means nothing. It won't guarantee that Tyrone will win another senior title. You're talking like you just have to wait a couple of years, and Tyrone will have another AI, because of those minor teams.

You say Kerry have to replace 6-8 players over the next couple of years. That's true, but so do Tyrone. O'Neill, Cavanagh, Gormley, McMahon, McConnell are nearing retirement. Important players, experienced players. Cavanagh carried Tyrone to an AI semi. Tyrone will miss him more than Kerry will miss Tomas O'Se (as great a player as he was).

[SkillfulBill]

Here is the problem for you, the last time Kerry had to replace All-Ireland winners on this scale was post 1986 and it took them 11 years to win another All-Ireland 1997 and that was in the pre-modern era .The issue for Kerry now is that it's not one or two great players need replacing its 6-8 over the next couple of years. Take into account the lack of underage success over a ten year period and the level to which counties prepare and develop their youth, the barren years could be extremely prolonged. History and tradition is no longer enough you have to have the material which Kerry don't have.

Underage success doesn't guarantee senior success. Donegal minors teams only won an Ulster in 06. They weren't even in any other final that I can remember, yet Donegal won Sam last year. Minor/U-21 successes can help, but it's not vital, as long as the good young players are coming through. Tyrone won AI minors in 08/10. It means nothing. It won't guarantee that Tyrone will win another senior title. You're talking like you just have to wait a couple of years, and Tyrone will have another AI, because of those minor teams.

You say Kerry have to replace 6-8 players over the next couple of years. That's true, but so do Tyrone. O'Neill, Cavanagh, Gormley, McMahon, McConnell are nearing retirement. Important players, experienced players. Cavanagh carried Tyrone to an AI semi. Tyrone will miss him more than Kerry will miss Tomas O'Se (as great a player as he was).

Bennyi think your seeing what you want to see from my posts.  You keep on making out that I am arguing that Tyrones underage success guarantees senior success.  I am not of course it doesn't guarantee it but if you don't have the materials to start off with then the possibility of future success is extremely limited. Tyrone are in a much better position to capitalise on it's potential than Kerry simply because it  has proven potentials where Kerry don't.  Tyrone have managed to keep themselves competative while replacing a 3 times All-Ireland winning team do you think that has been done without converting it's potential?  Or perhaps it's by accident or luck. We have seen Armagh fall away in recent years and I would argue they had a greater opportunity at staying competative than Kerry currently do. In the past Kerry had the ability to bounce back relatively quickly but that was prior to modern methods such as development squads etc Kerry I am sure haven't stood still either but are not showing much in the way of results for their efforts. Do you think there is something special in the water down there which suddenly turns average to poor players at 21 to become all conquering heros at 22 or is it some sort of collective late footballing pubirty.

[muppet]

Well done ONeill, you stirred everyone up again.

I find that strangely addictive.

Its called the clap.

You will be glad to hear it is curable.

[BennyCake]

Bennyi think your seeing what you want to see from my posts.  You keep on making out that I am arguing that Tyrones underage success guarantees senior success.  I am not of course it doesn't guarantee it but if you don't have the materials to start off with then the possibility of future success is extremely limited. Tyrone are in a much better position to capitalise on it's potential than Kerry simply because it  has proven potentials where Kerry don't.  Tyrone have managed to keep themselves competative while replacing a 3 times All-Ireland winning team do you think that has been done without converting it's potential?  Or perhaps it's by accident or luck. We have seen Armagh fall away in recent years and I would argue they had a greater opportunity at staying competative than Kerry currently do. In the past Kerry had the ability to bounce back relatively quickly but that was prior to modern methods such as development squads etc Kerry I am sure haven't stood still either but are not showing much in the way of results for their efforts. Do you think there is something special in the water down there which suddenly turns average to poor players at 21 to become all conquering heros at 22 or is it some sort of collective late footballing pubirty.

I understand the reasons for dev squads. I don't know what Kerry are doing in that regard, but they are still producing talented players, if not great minor teams. James O'Donoghue did well this year, as did Donnacdh Walsh, and those few young lads in defence. Their names escape me now.

I honestly think these dev squads, while useful in ways, are removing the creative players from the game. Lads are being coached to death, tactics, blanket defences, keeping the ball, no risk strategy etc. I honestly think lads are being brought up with that mentality, where creativity isn't wanted. A player a la Maurice Fitzgerald that can produce amazing bits of skill. But the game isn't for the Maurice Fitzgerald's any more, as they at more of a liability in today's team, as the team from 1-15 are instructed to play a certain way. But had Mayo had a player with an ounce of creativity, they'd be AI champions.

Teams are really becoming robotic, non-imaginative drones, and the game is worse for it. How many players would've threaded that pass Cooper did v Dublin? Being able to think on your feet. Maybe that how Kerry are doing it with their squads. Dublin win the AI playing attacking football, so if a team have the right players, maybe they feel they can win that way too.

[rrhf]

In the modem game I don't think Derry would have won an all Ireland. Brolly wouldn't have got a ball

[nrico2006]

Bennyi think your seeing what you want to see from my posts.  You keep on making out that I am arguing that Tyrones underage success guarantees senior success.  I am not of course it doesn't guarantee it but if you don't have the materials to start off with then the possibility of future success is extremely limited. Tyrone are in a much better position to capitalise on it's potential than Kerry simply because it  has proven potentials where Kerry don't.  Tyrone have managed to keep themselves competative while replacing a 3 times All-Ireland winning team do you think that has been done without converting it's potential?  Or perhaps it's by accident or luck. We have seen Armagh fall away in recent years and I would argue they had a greater opportunity at staying competative than Kerry currently do. In the past Kerry had the ability to bounce back relatively quickly but that was prior to modern methods such as development squads etc Kerry I am sure haven't stood still either but are not showing much in the way of results for their efforts. Do you think there is something special in the water down there which suddenly turns average to poor players at 21 to become all conquering heros at 22 or is it some sort of collective late footballing pubirty.

I understand the reasons for dev squads. I don't know what Kerry are doing in that regard, but they are still producing talented players, if not great minor teams. James O'Donoghue did well this year, as did Donnacdh Walsh, and those few young lads in defence. Their names escape me now.

I honestly think these dev squads, while useful in ways, are removing the creative players from the game. Lads are being coached to death, tactics, blanket defences, keeping the ball, no risk strategy etc. I honestly think lads are being brought up with that mentality, where creativity isn't wanted. A player a la Maurice Fitzgerald that can produce amazing bits of skill. But the game isn't for the Maurice Fitzgerald's any more, as they at more of a liability in today's team, as the team from 1-15 are instructed to play a certain way. But had Mayo had a player with an ounce of creativity, they'd be AI champions.

Teams are really becoming robotic, non-imaginative drones, and the game is worse for it. How many players would've threaded that pass Cooper did v Dublin? Being able to think on your feet. Maybe that how Kerry are doing it with their squads. Dublin win the AI playing attacking football, so if a team have the right players, maybe they feel they can win that way too.

Donnacha Walsh is near 30.  Kerry are going to face another few years in the wilderness.  The like of Tipperary will get a win over them in Munster at some stage in the next 5 years too.  Not enough talent coming through as the point has been made. 

[Estimator]

In the modem game I don't think Derry would have won an all Ireland. Brolly wouldn't have got a ball

v Down - Brolly didn't score
v Monaghan - Brolly scored 3pts
v Donegal - Brolly didn't score
v Dublin - Brolly scored 1pt
v Cork - Brolly scored 1pt

Brolly was only a small cog in the scoring charts that year.  He only started two games.  Our half back line were probably more potent than the full forward line from play.

[sensethetone]

In the modem game I don't think Derry would have won an all Ireland. Brolly wouldn't have got a ball

v Down - Brolly didn't score
v Monaghan - Brolly scored 3pts
v Donegal - Brolly didn't score
v Dublin - Brolly scored 1pt
v Cork - Brolly scored 1pt

Brolly was only a small cog in the scoring charts that year.  He only started two games.  Our half back line were probably more potent than the full forward line from play.

derry did hane e gormley, s downey, d barton tohill etc some spread of scores ok. read in irish new s that brolly didnt start blowing kisses until after the 93 AI. imo he can't have had many chances to kiss to the crowd-he was handy but did he really score freely in every game in the championship when you think that derry went out after 1 game in 94, two games 95, 2 games 96, 3 games 97, 4 games 98, 2 games 99, 3 games 00 was he even about by 01?

[muppet]

In the modem game I don't think Derry would have won an all Ireland. Brolly wouldn't have got a ball

v Down - Brolly didn't score
v Monaghan - Brolly scored 3pts
v Donegal - Brolly didn't score
v Dublin - Brolly scored 1pt
v Cork - Brolly scored 1pt

Brolly was only a small cog in the scoring charts that year.  He only started two games.  Our half back line were probably more potent than the full forward line from play.

derry did hane e gormley, s downey, d barton tohill etc some spread of scores ok. read in irish new s that brolly didnt start blowing kisses until after the 93 AI. imo he can't have had many chances to kiss to the crowd-he was handy but did he really score freely in every game in the championship when you think that derry went out after 1 game in 94, two games 95, 2 games 96, 3 games 97, 4 games 98, 2 games 99, 3 games 00 was he even about by 01?

Brolly 01 is my main memory of him.

[Bensars]

In the modem game I don't think Derry would have won an all Ireland. Brolly wouldn't have got a ball

v Down - Brolly didn't score
v Monaghan - Brolly scored 3pts
v Donegal - Brolly didn't score
v Dublin - Brolly scored 1pt
v Cork - Brolly scored 1pt

Brolly was only a small cog in the scoring charts that year.  He only started two games.  Our half back line were probably more potent than the full forward line from play.

derry did hane e gormley, s downey, d barton tohill etc some spread of scores ok. read in irish new s that brolly didnt start blowing kisses until after the 93 AI. imo he can't have had many chances to kiss to the crowd-he was handy but did he really score freely in every game in the championship when you think that derry went out after 1 game in 94, two games 95, 2 games 96, 3 games 97, 4 games 98, 2 games 99, 3 games 00 was he even about by 01?

The old adage, dont believe everything you read.

He was at it long before 93. Remember vividly him doing it in Ryan Cup game around 90'

[Fear ón Srath Bán]

Awwwww, where has Sheehy gone with all of his habitual venomous mouthing on this thread? I was SO enjoying that! Awwwww, just not fair 

[lenny]

Awwwww, where has Sheehy gone with all of his habitual venomous mouthing on this thread? I was SO enjoying that! Awwwww, just not fair 

Will tyrone be looking for a new corner back next year?