Seanie Johnston Switch and outside managers

[heffo]

Hope they remember which house their supposed to be living in... wasnt there a Wicklow import who gave an address  of a still unbuilt apartment number in a block in Bray??

The apt was built alright, Walsh just put the wrong address down on the form (easy mistake to make I suppose). Then he said he owned the apt. Then he said Ballymore properties (Wicklow sponsor at the time) owned it. Then he said he just lived there, resubmitted the transfer and he remembered the right address the second time around.

[Dougal]

if Val dropped seanie because of form then imo hes an idiot,as sean is better than most players in the county when hes not even on form.
if Val dropped seanie because he feels hes disruptive,then imo hes an idiot,why would you make someone whos disruptive team captain.
the whole cassidy thing was cleared up in no time because mcguinness came out with the reason he was dropped straight away.andrews is complaining about faceless posters (and people are calling seanie a whinger),if he came out with a reason for dropping the players he did and they were reasonable he might earn a bit of respect.

seanie would have training in kildare 3/4 times a week and a match at the weekend,if he wins the appeal there wouldnt be much difference in him living in cavan and driving to kildare most nites and living in kildare and driving to cavan every morning.shows how determined he is to play intercounty football.

[liihb]

I wouldn't be a major fan of Val Andrews, I don't think he's been particularly successful with any team he's been with apart from a star studded Tralee IT team, but at the end of the day if he's the manager, then he's the manager, and Johnson needs to knuckle down and buy into that or not play with Cavan until Andrews is gone. Ultimately the greatest strength of the GAA is that you play for where you are from, for the parish and for the Jersey (I realise that this can also be a huge weakness and a stick to beat the organization with too). However even Johnson gets this on some level, as he doesn't want to leave Cavan Gaels, where he is from......

[lynchbhoy]

As for Mauice fitz, Hes an irrelevance to this argument. Correct me if I'm wrong, but I dont think Maurice Fitz was ever put off the Kerry panel?? This isnt about team v individual. Val Andrews is perfectly entitled to do what he likes to advance Cavan football. As is Jim McGuinness. But so too should Seanie and Cassidy be allowed to do what they want to play the game they've devoted their lives to. Neither was dropped for tactical reasons, as m fitz was. Another thing, if M Fitz had been put off the panel entirely, I know I for one would have rather saw him play for someone else than not saw him play at all.

not exactly the same but certainly not irrelvant.
If the likes of one of the best players of his generation coul dbe left of the team , then a decent (and he isnt much more than decent as he is marked out of the game all too often I believe) player needs to use the same humility and keep the head down and work for his place like everyone else.
Just like Maurice Fitz did.

[Jinxy]

I wouldn't be a major fan of Val Andrews, I don't think he's been particularly successful with any team he's been with apart from a star studded Tralee IT team, but at the end of the day if he's the manager, then he's the manager, and Johnson needs to knuckle down and buy into that or not play with Cavan until Andrews is gone. Ultimately the greatest strength of the GAA is that you play for where you are from, for the parish and for the Jersey (I realise that this can also be a huge weakness and a stick to beat the organization with too). However even Johnson gets this on some level, as he doesn't want to leave Cavan Gaels, where he is from......

Cavan Gaels regularly win championships though.
If he played for a mid-ranking junior team I think he'd be gone like a hot snot.

[haranguerer]

As for Mauice fitz, Hes an irrelevance to this argument. Correct me if I'm wrong, but I dont think Maurice Fitz was ever put off the Kerry panel?? This isnt about team v individual. Val Andrews is perfectly entitled to do what he likes to advance Cavan football. As is Jim McGuinness. But so too should Seanie and Cassidy be allowed to do what they want to play the game they've devoted their lives to. Neither was dropped for tactical reasons, as m fitz was. Another thing, if M Fitz had been put off the panel entirely, I know I for one would have rather saw him play for someone else than not saw him play at all.

not exactly the same but certainly not irrelvant.
If the likes of one of the best players of his generation coul dbe left of the team , then a decent (and he isnt much more than decent as he is marked out of the game all too often I believe) player needs to use the same humility and keep the head down and work for his place like everyone else.
Just like Maurice Fitz did.

This isnt an issue about not getting picked for the panel/team because not considered good enough, or suitable for that team in a tactical sense. If that was the case, then certainly the door would be open, and hard work and good perfromances would pressurise the manager into looking at his selection again. This is a clash. Seanie and Cassidy have both been dropped, and it has nothing whatsoever to do with their performances or style of play. Both are fully entitled to believe that they will not be selected irregardless of their performance.

[Jinxy]

Remember when Cavan went down to play Cork in the qualifiers a couple of years ago and were more worried about organising a night out than actually putting up some resistance during the game?
They would be one of a small number of counties known for indiscipline and a lack of professionalism in terms of their committment levels.
Are all the managers to blame for that or is there just a hard core of players who want to do things their way?

[imtommygunn]

Some people have talked about Johnston maybe not being great. Johnston is a cracking forward. The reason he can be marked out of games is because he is Cavan's only forward and a defensive system is often adopted to do so. What chance, for example, does he have ploughin a lone furrow against Donegal? In my view he'd be as good as someone like Bernard Brogan if he got more spotlight.

Andrews doesn't seem to have had great success with Cavan. I don't understand why he's there to be honest.

In saying all that though the laws can't be changed for him.

[heffo]

Andrews doesn't seem to have had great success with Cavan. I don't understand why he's there to be honest.

You could say the same thing about every Cavan manager though since '97 couldn't you.

When Andrews goes, who's going to replace him? What will he do differently?

[imtommygunn]

Well there is that heffo. One post says about the crap managers that Johnston has worked under. I'm not 100% but I think that pretty much reads every manager he ever worked under!

Is this not Andrews second tenure in Cavan though with the first being a disaster or am I mistaken on that? If so why reemploy him?

Not sure what they can do differently but they were in the AI u21 final recently and while they haven't won much at minor there have been several years where they've only been narrowly beaten by eventual all ireland champions. Surely that's bound to bring through some talent?

I find it hard to believe that all their attitudes are so bad they can't progress. Donegal before McGuinness were on the road to nowhere too. There are some handy enough footballers in Cavan.

[mylestheslasher]

Andrews first spell was not a disaster. We were in a league div 1 final and an ulster final.  Cavan won ulster u21 and minor last yr. The young players are there, is the manager good enough - I don't know.

[heffo]

Well there is that heffo. One post says about the crap managers that Johnston has worked under. I'm not 100% but I think that pretty much reads every manager he ever worked under!

Is this not Andrews second tenure in Cavan though with the first being a disaster or am I mistaken on that? If so why reemploy him?

Not sure what they can do differently but they were in the AI u21 final recently and while they haven't won much at minor there have been several years where they've only been narrowly beaten by eventual all ireland champions. Surely that's bound to bring through some talent?

I find it hard to believe that all their attitudes are so bad they can't progress. Donegal before McGuinness were on the road to nowhere too. There are some handy enough footballers in Cavan.

So when Andrews goes either this year or next and the next fella comes in, what does he do differently?

Clearly Andrews is setting his stall out on basing his team around the U21s from last year and some of the minors who've had a decent run. All things being equal clearly Johnson would be a huge part of that. For whatever reason, Andrews decided that Johnson's talent and experience either isn't worth it and any negatives he may bring outweight his talent or he wants to give him a kick up the hole.

Just as a case in point, Bernard Brogan was on course for an All Star and POTY in 2009 until Tom O'Sullivan got a hold of him and he didn't get a sniff in that game. Gilroy wasn't happy with his workrate and so didn't use him at all in the O'Byrne cup in 2010 and left him on the bench for the first four league games. He went on to be POTY in 2010.

Or a different example, Dessie Farrell was dropped abruptly off the Dublin panel by Tommy Lyons  - the two had never seen eye to eye and Lyons felt Farrell was a negative presence in the panel. Farrell bitched privately about it but put his head down and was back playing championship later that year.

[mylestheslasher]

Andrews first spell was not a disaster. We were in a league div 1 final and an ulster final.  Cavan won ulster u21 and minor last yr. The young players are there, is the manager good enough - I don't know.

agree but he had 10 of McHughs panel from 97 in that team.
My only problem with Andrews is ive never yet seen him doing anything constructive in a game when things are going wrong and ive watched him closely.
Then listen to him doing an interview and you wonder were you watching the same game as him. plus the fact he hasnt proved himself anywhere at inter county level either at senior or more recently at minor level.
Thats my main problem with him

I wouldn't argue with you on a lot of that Richie but due to the state we are in no manager with a proven track record would touch us with a barge pole. Hence we get Andrews. While he is there he has to be given a chance.

[Westside]

In the 2010 League with Johnston absent we scored more than in the previous and subsequent campaigns with him present.

He was obviously dropped for a reason. A reason Andrews is under no obligation to release to the public. As was said elsewhere, his contract is with the County Board not the Cavan Public.

Johnston is coming out of this looking bad, 4 players were dropped and Johnston is the only one throwing a strop. Doubts remain about his residency in Kildare. He's either reacting badly to this or showing his true colours. Time will tell.

Andrews never does anything constructive? Did he not introduce a debutante last night who scored 5 points along with other players to overturn a 5 point margin?

[anglocelt39]

Johnston had played under crap managers like Keogan, Carr and here he was again playing under another crap one



Ah yes Ritchie, consistency from one Forum to the other, sure it's always the management, eh. not to mention your outher hobby horse, the County Board.