Rory MacIlroy - Member of the order of the British Empire.

[All of a Sludden]

If more free staters didn't have TVs in ther bedrooms growing up, the country wouldn't be full of west brits who think whatever RTÉ tells them to think. "Ohh 'The Queen' is visiting....I'd better support that because RTÉ says that if we do, we become mature!!"

Maybe you should ask your Queen not to visit Ireland again. 

[Nally Stand]

If more free staters didn't have TVs in ther bedrooms growing up, the country wouldn't be full of west brits who think whatever RTÉ tells them to think. "Ohh 'The Queen' is visiting....I'd better support that because RTÉ says that if we do, we become mature!!"

Maybe you should ask your Queen not to visit Ireland again. 

Ich frage mich, ob Sie Ihren Kopf von Staat, Christian Wulff, wird in diesem Jahr besuchen.

[Myles Na G.]

I agree. MacIlroy didn't sell this soul in this occassion, that happened some time ago.

In the world that Rory inhabits, this award is no sell out it is considered to be a highlight of his career. 

In our "shared future" it is a test for others to accept that this s a reality for Rory and no attempt to insult others.  The acceptance of diversity is the first test for us all and acceptance of the equality of existence of diverse views, ideas and beliefs is the second test.  Pass both and we are on our way to a shared future.

Problem is 90% at least don't want a shared future. McIlroy like Mr Armstrong has employed an Uncle Tom approach to get on in his chosen career, why I don't know, but the Business World is full of such people although most of them are of a generation where it was the only way to get on. To my mind this shared future only seems to mean accepting a British Dimension. Therefore when something as outrageous as an Irish Christmas Greeting is placed on Belfast City Hall we see really what a shared future is all about. Until there really is parity of aspiration/nationality/esteem etc people like McIlroy will always be seen as sellouts. The thing is he is a talent and he could have genuinely made a difference to mutual acceptance by being a little less obvious.

What a complete load of bollix. What you mean is that neither man is a lackey of the republican movement and has chosen to make their own decisions rather than swallow the deluded guff pumped out by the boys who are going to end partition and set Ireland free. (One of these days, that is. Just as soon as business up at Stormont allows  ).

Sorry Myles I don't know which part of this Island you reside in, but the point I was making had nothing to do with partition, but parity of esteem. And I do believe that anyone acting in the way McIlroy has, wrapping the loyalist flag around him whilst people from his tradition have their native tongue described as gobbledygook do those of us seeking such  parity a disservice. It would appear that parity only works one way. I have no difficulty with him accepting the gong, nor Martin O'Neill, nor McCoy...personal choice. I just don't think at 22 he has done enough to merit such recognition and this was a politically expedient choice by Cameron. It aslso devalues it. By the by there is a former recipient of one of these up on charges of defrauding the school he ran. Makes you wonder who vets these?

It's not a 'loyalist' flag anymore than the Irish tricolour is a 'republican' flag. One is the flag of the 6 county state, the other is the flag of the 26 county state. Both flags have been adopted and trailed through the dirt by paramilitary groups, I agree, but that doesn't make the emblems exclusive to them. The fact that McIlroy feels comfortable waving the NI flag shouldn't be held against him. On the contrary, I think it shows he's mature enough not to allow himself to be backed into a sectarian cul de sac in which the only emblems deemed to be acceptable are those of ones own tribe.

[Rossfan]

The 6 Cos has no official flag (nor is it a State ) nowadays so that flag has no official standing.

[fitzroyalty]

True. It's time that piece of shit was confined to the bin.
As for:

The fact that McIlroy feels comfortable waving the NI flag shouldn't be held against him. On the contrary, I think it shows he's mature enough not to allow himself to be backed into a sectarian cul de sac in which the only emblems deemed to be acceptable are those of ones own tribe.

I think it's more to do with the fact he doesn't know any different/couldn't care less.

[trileacman]

True. It's time that piece of shit was confined to the bin.
As for:

The fact that McIlroy feels comfortable waving the NI flag shouldn't be held against him. On the contrary, I think it shows he's mature enough not to allow himself to be backed into a sectarian cul de sac in which the only emblems deemed to be acceptable are those of ones own tribe.

I think it's more to do with the fact he doesn't know any different/couldn't care less.

Exactly.
Got a letter in the door saying he was up for an award.
Thinks to himself "Good enough".

[Myles Na G.]

The 6 Cos has no official flag (nor is it a State ) nowadays so that flag has no official standing.

'Flower of Scotland' isn't the official anthem of Scotland, but it does the job quite well because of its popularity with a majority of the people there.

State / country / territory / region / etc / etc...
Call it what you want, makes no difference to my point.
(btw, is the republic still a 'state', or does it count as a region of Germany these days?)

[Applesisapples]

I just don't think at 22 he has done enough to merit such recognition and this was a politically expedient choice by Cameron.

Are you having a laugh? He's achieved more at 22 than most people will in their whole lives! He's number 2 in the world in his sport. He has already won a Major, breaking several records in doing so.

Absolute ba**s. He is well paid for hitting a round white ball around a field. He hasn't saved a life and there are numerous examples of his immature and arrogant attitude. Yes he undoubtedly talented at golf but his financial rewards far exceed any contribution he may make to society. I'm not in favour of civic awards of this nature but if we have to have them then they should be based on something with more substance than the sporting exploits of a 22 year old. In addition the British system is politically controlled and motivated by expediency.

[Applesisapples]

Problem is 90% at least don't want a shared future.

Where do you pull that figure from?

To my mind this shared future only seems to mean accepting a British Demention. Therefore when something as outrageous as an Irish Christmas Greeting is placed on Belfast City Hall we see really what a shared future is all about.

I wouldn't be looking to many of our politicians as an example when it comes to promoting a shared future. Many of them survive by playing the 'green vs orange' game. That doesn't mean everyone else has to follow them.

Until there really is parity of aspiration/nationality/esteem etc people like McIlroy will always be seen as sellouts.

Only by people who have a problem with someone who doesn't follow a narrow definition of what someone from a Catholic/Protestant background should do.

Don't know where to start here. But in brief as someone who has grown up through the worst of the troubles and before, am I to be greatful for the crumbs from the Unionist/British table? I am not talking about ending partition or uniting Ireland, I am asking for my Nationality, Culture and ethnicity to be given equal status in the state in which I live. The so called national team can't even adopt a neutral flag and anthem. McIlroy as a succesful person from a similar background has simply pulled the ladder up behind him and accepted that I and others are still slightly less than equal citizens.

[stephenite]

I just don't think at 22 he has done enough to merit such recognition and this was a politically expedient choice by Cameron.

Are you having a laugh? He's achieved more at 22 than most people will in their whole lives! He's number 2 in the world in his sport. He has already won a Major, breaking several records in doing so.

Absolute ba**s. He is well paid for hitting a round white ball around a field. He hasn't saved a life and there are numerous examples of his immature and arrogant attitude. Yes he undoubtedly talented at golf but his financial rewards far exceed any contribution he may make to society. I'm not in favour of civic awards of this nature but if we have to have them then they should be based on something with more substance than the sporting exploits of a 22 year old. In addition the British system is politically controlled and motivated by expediency.

What examples of his immature and arrogant attitude?

[Tubberman]

To be getting worked up about a 22 year old lad getting a fairly meaningless award from the Queen is pretty sad.
Surely there are other more important issues that could be focussed on?

[Hardy]

Christ this stuff is depressing. Mediaeval prejudices and blind superstitions from the dark ages being presented as debating points in the second decade of the 21st century. When will it end? Will the great-grandchildren of the unbending dogmatists here still be applying sixteenth-century labels to each other on the gaaboard of 2112?

Probably.

[Nally Stand]

Christ this stuff is depressing. Mediaeval prejudices and blind superstitions from the dark ages being presented as debating points in the second decade of the 21st century. When will it end? Will the great-grandchildren of the unbending dogmatists here still be applying sixteenth-century labels to each other on the gaaboard of 2112?

Probably.

Which countries will ye have handed Irish sovereignty to between now and then I wonder.

[Applesisapples]

To be getting worked up about a 22 year old lad getting a fairly meaningless award from the Queen is pretty sad.
Surely there are other more important issues that could be focussed on?

Christ sakes its good fun having the debate if your bored you don't have to participate.

[Applesisapples]

I agree. MacIlroy didn't sell this soul in this occassion, that happened some time ago.

In the world that Rory inhabits, this award is no sell out it is considered to be a highlight of his career. 

In our "shared future" it is a test for others to accept that this s a reality for Rory and no attempt to insult others.  The acceptance of diversity is the first test for us all and acceptance of the equality of existence of diverse views, ideas and beliefs is the second test.  Pass both and we are on our way to a shared future.

Problem is 90% at least don't want a shared future. McIlroy like Mr Armstrong has employed an Uncle Tom approach to get on in his chosen career, why I don't know, but the Business World is full of such people although most of them are of a generation where it was the only way to get on. To my mind this shared future only seems to mean accepting a British Dimension. Therefore when something as outrageous as an Irish Christmas Greeting is placed on Belfast City Hall we see really what a shared future is all about. Until there really is parity of aspiration/nationality/esteem etc people like McIlroy will always be seen as sellouts. The thing is he is a talent and he could have genuinely made a difference to mutual acceptance by being a little less obvious.

What a complete load of bollix. What you mean is that neither man is a lackey of the republican movement and has chosen to make their own decisions rather than swallow the deluded guff pumped out by the boys who are going to end partition and set Ireland free. (One of these days, that is. Just as soon as business up at Stormont allows  ).

Sorry Myles I don't know which part of this Island you reside in, but the point I was making had nothing to do with partition, but parity of esteem. And I do believe that anyone acting in the way McIlroy has, wrapping the loyalist flag around him whilst people from his tradition have their native tongue described as gobbledygook do those of us seeking such  parity a disservice. It would appear that parity only works one way. I have no difficulty with him accepting the gong, nor Martin O'Neill, nor McCoy...personal choice. I just don't think at 22 he has done enough to merit such recognition and this was a politically expedient choice by Cameron. It aslso devalues it. By the by there is a former recipient of one of these up on charges of defrauding the school he ran. Makes you wonder who vets these?

It's not a 'loyalist' flag anymore than the Irish tricolour is a 'republican' flag. One is the flag of the 6 county state, the other is the flag of the 26 county state. Both flags have been adopted and trailed through the dirt by paramilitary groups, I agree, but that doesn't make the emblems exclusive to them. The fact that McIlroy feels comfortable waving the NI flag shouldn't be held against him. On the contrary, I think it shows he's mature enough not to allow himself to be backed into a sectarian cul de sac in which the only emblems deemed to be acceptable are those of ones own tribe.

Showing your ignorance there Myles it is actually the flag of the old Unionist dominated Stormont and has no official status.