The Blue Wave

[heffo]

Plus lads any player in full time education won't be eligible for an IC transfer anyway so they'll line out for their college and continue to play for their home club.

[AZOffaly]

That's fair enough heffo. And correct. But I'd say they are not the root of the problem anyway. The issue is obviously certain people joining clubs because they get inducements to do so. But I cannot see how forcing EVERYBODY who wishes to join a club up there to renounce their affiliation to their home counties is anything other than using a sledgehammer to crack a nut.

It will stop a few of these transfers, no doubt about it, but I'd say it's more likely to prevent at least as many young lads from the country getting a chance to play with their home counties.

[Lone Shark]

Everyone seems to have missed the point here.

1. Costello's transfer bye-law proposal - the ordinary 'culchie teacher' here won't be affected - if he's living in Dublin, working in Dublin and wants to put down roots then fine let him transfer, but he has to officially 'declare' for Dublin - no problem, he's Senior not IC standard so he transfers, plays away and thats the end of that.

2. Your Conor Mortimers, Colm Parkinson's, Begley's etc who suddenly find themselves living in a city centre penthouse with a 'job' provided by their new club - this is what he's addressing - if they have to declare for Dublin then the likelyhood is they won't transfer. Some previous players who've transferred to Dublin in the past ten years have been getting paid by their county on the side, they won't be paid by Dublin and it's unlikely they'd be selected anyway. Plenty of other players playing in Dublin over the last 15 years have openly made themselves available and weren't selected.

3. Funding - playing numbers at Juvenile level are way up again - their argument is that they should be funded appropriately as they're promoting the association.

(1) Aware of that. But what about the intercounty standard player who can't afford to go home for club and county games, since they mightn't get expenses from the club? What about a good standard player but with no car? They can get lifts from other county players, but for a club they're snookered? I know these are isolated cases, but no more isolated than the case of clubs that suddenly end up with millions in the bank and decide they're going to buy a championship.

(2) I agree that runs contrary to the spirit of the association - but that's always gone hand in hand with the absence of parish rule, and to be honest, who's to say that this wouldn't continue even if players had to declare for Dublin? You argue that players wouldn't transfer if that was the case - some mightn't, but many more still would. Would that make it better, or make it worse?

(3) It's great that underage numbers are up, but that's an issue for clubs. I can't see how an increase in under 12 players at Ballyboden or Raheny costs any more to the Dublin county board? Anyway, my point stands - in 2009 Offaly spent €435,000 on county teams, and €418,000 in 2010, and we have the same amount of county teams as Dublin. I don't have the 2011 number to hand but our overall balances were about the same so I presume it would be under half a million, and that's giving both codes equal preference. Dublin spent €2m on team costs, so if there are juveniles being neglected because Dublin choose to spend four times as much as other counties on their intercounty sides, then I would suggest that's your problem and the last thing that should be done is that there should be even more money thrown at the problem.

An excellent point and well put!! It basically sums up why Dublin should not be deisgnated a province as it will effectively render Dublin a proffessional team.

As has been said, if Dublin are willing to become their own 'provincial board' then let them create 2/3 County teams. Having said that it's taken them 15 years to win the AI with just one team so I can't see the DCB going for this particular notion!

We're not talking about provincial status. I know you're slow on the uptake generally.

I never mentioned the word provincial. I was merely nipping this thing in the bud about Dublin supposedly needing more funding. No team that spends €2m on teams needs more funding, if anything they need less.

And the reason for making it personal?

[Lone Shark]

These transfers are a cancer on our club scene up here. people are making a mountain out of a molehill on this. the only players this will effect are those leeching off the system. County players from leitrim, longford etc except in exceptionally rare cases would have no chance of making the dublin team in my view.

Lads like Donie Shine and Michael Murphy who are going to college in dublin wouldn't dream of giving up their inter county status with their respective counties. The only ones who would consider it are the leeches and freeloaders.

I won't lie, I'm a little bit put out by the "ye're not from Dublin, so ye don't understand" bit - I did live and play in Dublin for years, albeit at Junior 7 and Junior 9 level respectively, so a long way from the big money transfer lads.


However, what I'm not getting is that this measure will actually cut out the genuine guys, and the leeches as you put it will be the ones unaffected. If I'm the type who will take money for playing and will leave my own club in the lurch, I'm hardly going to draw the line at leaving my county in the lurch either. On the other hand, if I'm a young footballer with little or no income and no means of transport, this very definitely impacts on me.

And that's hugely demeaning what you said about Longford and Leitrim - it's correct that some of them wouldn't make the Dublin team, however why should they then be forced to stop playing for Longford and Leitrim? All this rule does is stops them from playing county, or else deprives them of club football. Nobody wins.

If the problem is leeches with no loyalty following the money, then how in God's name is a rule like this supposed to help?

I note that in all this, nobody is attaching any blame where it really lies - the clubs that are offering the money. The general view there seems to be that doing anything about that is too hard, so we'll just legislate badly in a means to hopefully cut down the flow a little bit.

[INDIANA]

These transfers are a cancer on our club scene up here. people are making a mountain out of a molehill on this. the only players this will effect are those leeching off the system. County players from leitrim, longford etc except in exceptionally rare cases would have no chance of making the dublin team in my view.

Lads like Donie Shine and Michael Murphy who are going to college in dublin wouldn't dream of giving up their inter county status with their respective counties. The only ones who would consider it are the leeches and freeloaders.

I won't lie, I'm a little bit put out by the "ye're not from Dublin, so ye don't understand" bit - I did live and play in Dublin for years, albeit at Junior 7 and Junior 9 level respectively, so a long way from the big money transfer lads.


However, what I'm not getting is that this measure will actually cut out the genuine guys, and the leeches as you put it will be the ones unaffected. If I'm the type who will take money for playing and will leave my own club in the lurch, I'm hardly going to draw the line at leaving my county in the lurch either. On the other hand, if I'm a young footballer with little or no income and no means of transport, this very definitely impacts on me.

And that's hugely demeaning what you said about Longford and Leitrim - it's correct that some of them wouldn't make the Dublin team, however why should they then be forced to stop playing for Longford and Leitrim? All this rule does is stops them from playing county, or else deprives them of club football. Nobody wins.

If the problem is leeches with no loyalty following the money, then how in God's name is a rule like this supposed to help?

I note that in all this, nobody is attaching any blame where it really lies - the clubs that are offering the money. The general view there seems to be that doing anything about that is too hard, so we'll just legislate badly in a means to hopefully cut down the flow a little bit.

There is nothing demeaning about the reality. Most players from small counties wouldn't be good enough to play for Dublin. With all due respect I wouldn't be known  as one to champagne dublin as the leading football county in ireland. Quite the opposite.

Secondly the DCB have no powers to legislate the clubs when the GAA wont legislate on under the counter payments to county managers. At least we know in Dublin neither of our county managers are getting paid. Can your county say the same?

Thirdly in the abscence of any leadership from the GAA hierachy -Dublin has to look after itself and the best way to do this is to hit these players by ensuring they cannot play county football. Their profile goes down and they wont be half as attractive for these clubs who just love having big name inter county players on their books.

And lastly I was referring to screenexile not you on the previous posts.

[INDIANA]

I understand everything you've said there Indy, so why not just say that no club can play more than 2 non - Dubs? That way there's no point in clubs 'harvesting' from the culchies, and if you are a player looking for a club up there, you're more likely to go to a lesser club. If players want to declare for Dublin to become a 'Dub' then they'll do that under this proposal anyway.

I just can't understand why you would make players like me 20 years ago give up playing with my county to get club games where I work.

Because it could  contravene the GAA club transfer rule AZ. The only way we can solve this is through bye-law. Limiting the number of non-dubs on team could be deemed to be in contravention of the GAA rule book. The general opinion on this Costello proposed bye-law is that it wont.

These transfers are a cancer on our club scene up here. people are making a mountain out of a molehill on this. the only players this will effect are those leeching off the system. County players from leitrim, longford etc except in exceptionally rare cases would have no chance of making the dublin team in my view.

Lads like Donie Shine and Michael Murphy who are going to college in dublin wouldn't dream of giving up their inter county status with their respective counties. The only ones who would consider it are the leeches and freeloaders.

Can you look at my example and tell me am I a freeloader or a leecher? I think there are potentially a few lads who might be able to make smaller county panels (Wexford, Carlow, Wicklow, Louth, Westmeath etc etc) that wouldn't even be on your radar in terms of the big name, big money guys. These fellas might be genuinely looking to play club ball near where they live and work, but while they are good enough for Offaly, they wouldn't be within an asses roar of the Dublin team. This proposal is essentially barring them from playing county football, unless they somehow try to maintain with their home clubs, which might not be possible for a lot of them, especially younger lads.

You're talking about 10 players max AZ. We cant not legislate just to look after 10 non-Dubs.

There is no solution to this that will appease everyone.

The majority of country players will be un-affected by this and the majority in most things holds sway.

The only alternative is a draft system whereby the weakest senior club in the locality gets first call on the player. Most country players I've spoken to would baulk at this. Even though to me it seems the fairest solution. They cite freedom of movement and all this other bullshit. This is not soccer and the Bosman ruling.

[screenexile]

These transfers are a cancer on our club scene up here. people are making a mountain out of a molehill on this. the only players this will effect are those leeching off the system. County players from leitrim, longford etc except in exceptionally rare cases would have no chance of making the dublin team in my view.

Lads like Donie Shine and Michael Murphy who are going to college in dublin wouldn't dream of giving up their inter county status with their respective counties. The only ones who would consider it are the leeches and freeloaders.

I won't lie, I'm a little bit put out by the "ye're not from Dublin, so ye don't understand" bit - I did live and play in Dublin for years, albeit at Junior 7 and Junior 9 level respectively, so a long way from the big money transfer lads.


However, what I'm not getting is that this measure will actually cut out the genuine guys, and the leeches as you put it will be the ones unaffected. If I'm the type who will take money for playing and will leave my own club in the lurch, I'm hardly going to draw the line at leaving my county in the lurch either. On the other hand, if I'm a young footballer with little or no income and no means of transport, this very definitely impacts on me.

And that's hugely demeaning what you said about Longford and Leitrim - it's correct that some of them wouldn't make the Dublin team, however why should they then be forced to stop playing for Longford and Leitrim? All this rule does is stops them from playing county, or else deprives them of club football. Nobody wins.

If the problem is leeches with no loyalty following the money, then how in God's name is a rule like this supposed to help?

I note that in all this, nobody is attaching any blame where it really lies - the clubs that are offering the money. The general view there seems to be that doing anything about that is too hard, so we'll just legislate badly in a means to hopefully cut down the flow a little bit.

There is nothing demeaning about the reality. Most players from small counties wouldn't be good enough to play for Dublin. With all due respect I wouldn't be known  as one to champagne dublin as the leading football county in ireland. Quite the opposite.

Secondly the DCB have no powers to legislate the clubs when the GAA wont legislate on under the counter payments to county managers. At least we know in Dublin neither of our county managers are getting paid. Can your county say the same?

Thirdly in the abscence of any leadership from the GAA hierachy -Dublin has to look after itself and the best way to do this is to hit these players by ensuring they cannot play county football. Their profile goes down and they wont be half as attractive for these clubs who just love having big name inter county players on their books.

And lastly I was referring to screenexile not you on the previous posts.

Lol good man Indiana so much for ignoring me in future . . . the OP refers to 'the blue wave' and about Dublin looking for more money. The point of LS's that I highlighted and agreed with was the fact that Dublin are looking for more money. Dublin's plan for getting more money?? Provincial status! But don't let the facts get in the way of giving me a slagging.

Other than that I agree with the sentiments here. Ordinary lads shouldn't be getting punished for playing a bit of ball for their own County whilst living in Dublin. I played in Dublin but never declared for them (not that I would have got a look in for either). The year before I came McNulty was employed by the Club as a coaching officer yet never played a game other than Championship (4 in total I think). I know there are countless other examples but it's just ridiculous imo and needs stamped out. There has to be a way to spread outside players among all clubs fairly rather than the current system.

[muppet]

I miss when Kerry used to win All-Irelands and wanted to break away with England and the All-Blacks.

[INDIANA]

These transfers are a cancer on our club scene up here. people are making a mountain out of a molehill on this. the only players this will effect are those leeching off the system. County players from leitrim, longford etc except in exceptionally rare cases would have no chance of making the dublin team in my view.

Lads like Donie Shine and Michael Murphy who are going to college in dublin wouldn't dream of giving up their inter county status with their respective counties. The only ones who would consider it are the leeches and freeloaders.

I won't lie, I'm a little bit put out by the "ye're not from Dublin, so ye don't understand" bit - I did live and play in Dublin for years, albeit at Junior 7 and Junior 9 level respectively, so a long way from the big money transfer lads.


However, what I'm not getting is that this measure will actually cut out the genuine guys, and the leeches as you put it will be the ones unaffected. If I'm the type who will take money for playing and will leave my own club in the lurch, I'm hardly going to draw the line at leaving my county in the lurch either. On the other hand, if I'm a young footballer with little or no income and no means of transport, this very definitely impacts on me.

And that's hugely demeaning what you said about Longford and Leitrim - it's correct that some of them wouldn't make the Dublin team, however why should they then be forced to stop playing for Longford and Leitrim? All this rule does is stops them from playing county, or else deprives them of club football. Nobody wins.

If the problem is leeches with no loyalty following the money, then how in God's name is a rule like this supposed to help?

I note that in all this, nobody is attaching any blame where it really lies - the clubs that are offering the money. The general view there seems to be that doing anything about that is too hard, so we'll just legislate badly in a means to hopefully cut down the flow a little bit.

There is nothing demeaning about the reality. Most players from small counties wouldn't be good enough to play for Dublin. With all due respect I wouldn't be known  as one to champagne dublin as the leading football county in ireland. Quite the opposite.

Secondly the DCB have no powers to legislate the clubs when the GAA wont legislate on under the counter payments to county managers. At least we know in Dublin neither of our county managers are getting paid. Can your county say the same?

Thirdly in the abscence of any leadership from the GAA hierachy -Dublin has to look after itself and the best way to do this is to hit these players by ensuring they cannot play county football. Their profile goes down and they wont be half as attractive for these clubs who just love having big name inter county players on their books.

And lastly I was referring to screenexile not you on the previous posts.

Lol good man Indiana so much for ignoring me in future . . . the OP refers to 'the blue wave' and about Dublin looking for more money. The point of LS's that I highlighted and agreed with was the fact that Dublin are looking for more money. Dublin's plan for getting more money?? Provincial status! But don't let the facts get in the way of giving me a slagging.

Other than that I agree with the sentiments here. Ordinary lads shouldn't be getting punished for playing a bit of ball for their own County whilst living in Dublin. I played in Dublin but never declared for them (not that I would have got a look in for either). The year before I came McNulty was employed by the Club as a coaching officer yet never played a game other than Championship (4 in total I think). I know there are countless other examples but it's just ridiculous imo and needs stamped out. There has to be a way to spread outside players among all clubs fairly rather than the current system.

There isnt a better way because the rule-book would have to change. Unless the rule-book is going to accomodate Dublin being the capital city- which it appears its not. On that basis we have to look after ourselves. And be under no illusions this will be sorted out one way or another.

[DuffleKing]

Ah come on now. I'm sure that this all sounds great in your head - particularly in the current dub phase - but in reality nothing can or will be done

[heffo]

In reality nothing can or will be done

Not true.

Dublin can bring in a bye-law.

All the moaning Chairmen of clubs from Laois etc who keep complaining that 'Dublin have to do something about this'  can bring a motion to congress.

[fearglasmor]

I'd be surprised if the Dublin CB would be allowed to dictate what county any player is elligible for. In any case it sounds to me like a statement designed to draw attention to a problem rather than be a real solution.

I'm not up to speed on Dublin GAA these days but when I was playing in the 80's/90's I played against lads like Kevin Kilmurray (Offaly), Benny Gaughran (Louth) with Civil Service, Brian Talty (Galway) with Parnells and i'm sure more i cant remember now ( Garda would have been full of country lads) who lived and worked in Dublin and it would be rediculous to think that these or their modern day equivalents would have to either declare for Dublin, play club football in their home county or give up football altogether under such a rule.

[heffo]

I'd be surprised if the Dublin CB would be allowed to dictate what county any player is elligible for. In any case it sounds to me like a statement designed to draw attention to a problem rather than be a real solution.

I'm not up to speed on Dublin GAA these days but when I was playing in the 80's/90's I played against lads like Kevin Kilmurray (Offaly), Benny Gaughran (Louth) with Civil Service, Brian Talty (Galway) with Parnells and i'm sure more i cant remember now ( Garda would have been full of country lads) who lived and worked in Dublin and it would be rediculous to think that these or their modern day equivalents would have to either declare for Dublin, play club football in their home county or give up football altogether under such a rule.

Civil Service are now Div 6, Garda are Div 5 and well the less said about Parnells the better, so there aren't too many IC players playing for the former two.

[fearglasmor]

I'd be surprised if the Dublin CB would be allowed to dictate what county any player is elligible for. In any case it sounds to me like a statement designed to draw attention to a problem rather than be a real solution.

I'm not up to speed on Dublin GAA these days but when I was playing in the 80's/90's I played against lads like Kevin Kilmurray (Offaly), Benny Gaughran (Louth) with Civil Service, Brian Talty (Galway) with Parnells and i'm sure more i cant remember now ( Garda would have been full of country lads) who lived and worked in Dublin and it would be rediculous to think that these or their modern day equivalents would have to either declare for Dublin, play club football in their home county or give up football altogether under such a rule.

Civil Service are now Div 6, Garda are Div 5 and well the less said about Parnells the better, so there aren't too many IC players playing for the former two.

As I said, I am not up with the current scene, but I was trying to see how the principle of the proposed rule would apply to todays equivalents of my time. Much as AZ tried to do earlier.
And what about the idea that DCB would be able to implement a bye law that controls inter county declarations ? Do you really think that is realistic ?

[heffo]

I'd be surprised if the Dublin CB would be allowed to dictate what county any player is elligible for. In any case it sounds to me like a statement designed to draw attention to a problem rather than be a real solution.

I'm not up to speed on Dublin GAA these days but when I was playing in the 80's/90's I played against lads like Kevin Kilmurray (Offaly), Benny Gaughran (Louth) with Civil Service, Brian Talty (Galway) with Parnells and i'm sure more i cant remember now ( Garda would have been full of country lads) who lived and worked in Dublin and it would be rediculous to think that these or their modern day equivalents would have to either declare for Dublin, play club football in their home county or give up football altogether under such a rule.

Civil Service are now Div 6, Garda are Div 5 and well the less said about Parnells the better, so there aren't too many IC players playing for the former two.

As I said, I am not up with the current scene, but I was trying to see how the principle of the proposed rule would apply to todays equivalents of my time. Much as AZ tried to do earlier.
And what about the idea that DCB would be able to implement a bye law that controls inter county declarations ? Do you really think that is realistic ?

Comparing the two situations or eras is like chalk and cheese though.

I believe that this is just a kite to try and force central council to bring a rule change to 6.2 and in no way does Costello or Gilroy want any of these players to actually line out for Dublin.