Brian McGuigan and Phillip Jordan announce their retirement

[rrhf]

The red card was unavoidable, and I know genuine Armagh supporters who blame Marsden for losing his cool but yet still accept that with 2 Marsdens on the field they still wouldnt have won that game.  You cant hit someone in any sport bar boxing or ice hockey.  If you lose your composure you lose the game.  Over the years some armagh guys dont accept that the man lifted the fist.  Marsdens a great guy but he lost his cool and whacked a player no excuse, and it looked damn sore. Im saying that with a heavy heart because I know some people I like who live in Armagh and I hate to say it in 1995 Tyrone people felt that if Charlie had went off the field at that time rather than a few minutes later Tyrone would have won.  Its self delusionary, we are all guilty of it but I hate to see players still getting stick for something that happened on the field of play between 2 consenting adults.  None of ye could have laced Jordans boots so suck it up lads and get on with it.  Self Sympathy is entrapment.  Liberate yourselves from it - go out, get behind Paddy O Rourke, build a new team and give us a game in next years Ulster - the good Armagh fans I used to know could always have accepted defeat no sourness, and moved on.  Has there been crossbreeding with Derry here?     Case closed. 

[Orchardman]

wise up rrhf, i for one have gave jordan plenty of praise, and i wouldn't use any words like tr**p etc on this site for him. We can't keep going on about that incident in 2003, and who knows if we would have won if he had of stayed on, i dont think we would, as i said before we were crap that day. BUT stop saying that marsden lifted his fist and decked jordan FFS, it was nothing of the sort, have you never been on a football pitch or even a bit of small dust up yourself?

[Fear ón Srath Bán]

Nothing much more to be said, two of the very best, whom we were blessed to have. Their clubs have been much happier places over the last few days no doubt.

Unfair about Ciarán Gourley -- only for him Down would almost definitely have beaten us in the Ulster in 2003, and things most definitely would have been different... gave fantastic service too over the years.

Not only that FoSB, our Derry friend may remember the quarter final in Ulster that year when the inbreds were twenty minutes from knocking Tyrone out. Gourley and McMenamin were introduced and the rest is history.

True, another example of his massive contribution to our fortunes being somewhat underrated.

[Mike Sheehy]

effective players. Should I say more ? I hate to be rude....

[rrhf]

Glad to see Gourley getting proper recognition here, a totally committed player who was outstanding on the field in 2003 was injured in 2005 and in 2008 had a tremendous season getting us to the all ireland final. Was one of the bravest players ever to pull on a Tyrone jersey and suffered many injuries as a result.  He saved Tyrone in 2003 V Down and whilst it didnt work out was the man initially handed the full back role after Cormac - and that showed the faith that we had in the man .   Was Gourley the first of the 1997 team to make it into Tyrone seniors? Played in the championship in 1999 which to put it in context was Adrian Cushs last season.  I believe O Neill/ Mc Anallan  also played that year and Mc Guigan may have been a sub.  That meant it took nearly 5 seasons for the young lads to achieve greatness.  During this time they received constant football and had many good days and bad days.  Its important we give the young lads who have at 21 next to no football under their belt due to the successful careers of their predecessors as much gametime as possible now.  Rebuilding years have been lost, its frustrating that they had not more game time before now. But if its 3 years till we win an all ireland Ill gladly accept that. But we must be patient and now  through these unselfish retirements the glass ceiling is being removed. We await an exciting new dawn in Tyrone football.     

[rrhf]

By the way Orchardman I have raised my fist on the football field - just three times, whilst looking up at Dooher and Canavan in the hogan stand. 

[imtommygunn]

Jordan cannot ever be a great after his stunt in 2003.

Feigning injury and hurt to get D Marsden sent off will only ever send out the message he was a cheat and perjursit (By action) and an insult of all that is good in our sport.  Yes it may have won him an AI medal but to do so by such mal-practice of all that is good in Gaa was and is a heresy to all proper supporters of the game.

He may be remembered for a few all Ireland medals but in the minds of many he will be remembered for being a cheat and as yellow as a duck's foot

What a load of balls !!!

Video of the incident (replay about 25 seconds in)...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gnATCSQxNwM

Back on topic, Brian Philly and now Ciaran owe Tyrone nothing. Thanks for the memories lads.

Not from either county so not bothered about your tit for tat but the bold Francie got a forearm round the side of the head which almost knocked him out so I don't understand what you're trying to illustrate with this video link!

[Orchardman]

By the way Orchardman I have raised my fist on the football field - just three times, whilst looking up at Dooher and Canavan in the hogan stand.

OK, so maybe ur phily jordan then, fair play.
I'm not someone who get's invoved in slabbering matches. I have stated on this and some other thread (think it was about big joe's book) that:
1. I don't think armagh would have won that day regardless
2: that jordan didn't do much wrong after that and that he turned into a fine footballer.

But i still cannot fathom how any sane person can't say what really happened in that incident was farce, running up to a man's face at full pelt and then falling to the ground in a heap, joke.

[tyroneStatto]

my take on the marsden/jordan incident was that jordan ran towards him and marsden raised his fists. correct me if i'm wrong but it later transpired that marsden's red card was only rescinded due to an issue with the referees report and not cause he didnt do anything untoward. dunno what armagh have a problem with as they should have been stuffed that day - tyrone missed about 4 clear goal chances.

also will say that both mcguigan and jordan are legends. however talk that they will never be replaced is nonsense as i'm sure that the same was said in 1984 when king frank was forced to quit. just 5 years later peter canavan was playing nfl for tyrone and the rest is history. nobody knows what the future holds....

[ONeill]

my take on the marsden/jordan incident was that jordan ran towards him and marsden raised his fists. correct me if i'm wrong but it later transpired that marsden's red card was only rescinded due to an issue with the referees report and not cause he didnt do anything untoward. dunno what armagh have a problem with as they should have been stuffed that day - tyrone missed about 4 clear goal chances.

also will say that both mcguigan and jordan are legends. however talk that they will never be replaced is nonsense as i'm sure that the same was said in 1984 when king frank was forced to quit. just 5 years later peter canavan was playing nfl for tyrone and the rest is history. nobody knows what the future holds....

The same wasn't said in 1985 because Tyrone had won nothing. Jordan is a multiple AI winner. I'd be surprised if I see another set of Tyrone players who win 3 AIs in 6 years.

[Tony Baloney]

my take on the marsden/jordan incident was that jordan ran towards him and marsden raised his fists. correct me if i'm wrong but it later transpired that marsden's red card was only rescinded due to an issue with the referees report and not cause he didnt do anything untoward. dunno what armagh have a problem with as they should have been stuffed that day - tyrone missed about 4 clear goal chances.

also will say that both mcguigan and jordan are legends. however talk that they will never be replaced is nonsense as i'm sure that the same was said in 1984 when king frank was forced to quit. just 5 years later peter canavan was playing nfl for tyrone and the rest is history. nobody knows what the future holds....

The same wasn't said in 1985 because Tyrone had won nothing. Jordan is a multiple AI winner. I'd be surprised if I see another set of Tyrone players who win 3 AIs in 6 years.

Fingers crossed.

[BennyCake]

The thing about the Jordan incident was that he ran towards Marsden at speed, with intent to rough him up, shoulder him or otherwise. Marsden was occupied with other Tyrone players and seen Jordan coming towards him late, and put up his hands to defend himself. Like a reflex action. There was no malice or intent in Marsden's actions. There was with Jordan's.

Tyrone may have won anyway. But Marsden was hard done by. Marsden wasn't a dirty player. Tough, yes. Dirty, no.

[fitzroyalty]

1. I have yet to see anywhere on this thread, anyone insinuate that Armagh would have won the 03 AI had Marsden not been sent off, so stop peddling that shite.

2. Jordan ran at Marsden like a man possessed. Marsden raised his hands, as anyone would in self-defence. He was NOT the aggressor, Jordan was. Jordan hits deck like he's been shot, and simulates injury for a while, rolling about in 'agony'. That is all FACT.

To do so in an AI final to get a player sent off, I stand by my original comment. The actions of a c*nt.

[stew]

1. I have yet to see anywhere on this thread, anyone insinuate that Armagh would have won the 03 AI had Marsden not been sent off, so stop peddling that shite.

2. Jordan ran at Marsden like a man possessed. Marsden raised his hands, as anyone would in self-defence. He was NOT the aggressor, Jordan was. Jordan hits deck like he's been shot, and simulates injury for a while, rolling about in 'agony'. That is all FACT.

To do so in an AI final to get a player sent off, I stand by my original comment. The actions of a c*nt.

+1

[pintsofguinness]

1. I have yet to see anywhere on this thread, anyone insinuate that Armagh would have won the 03 AI had Marsden not been sent off, so stop peddling that shite.

2. Jordan ran at Marsden like a man possessed. Marsden raised his hands, as anyone would in self-defence. He was NOT the aggressor, Jordan was. Jordan hits deck like he's been shot, and simulates injury for a while, rolling about in 'agony'. That is all FACT.

To do so in an AI final to get a player sent off, I stand by my original comment. The actions of a c*nt.

Spot on.