Osama Dead

[thebigfella]

Couldn't give a fcuk, IF it was Bin Lid, breathing IMO would have constituted a form of resistance.

The wests poster boy for terrorism is dead .... boo yaa

Christ get over yourself, the man made himself a poster boy for terrorism. He was a cnut full stop; happy to let other blow themselves up in Allah's name and the possibility of being rewarded with a few virgins, while lying up watching Arsenal bottle it in his nice comfy compound.

Did he now? There was me thinking it was the US administration who done that straight after Sept 11 (after spending 20 years funding him as a soldier against the soviets in Afghanistan). But I bow to your superior knowledge 

Standard protocol for debating on here, I bow to your superiour knolwedge but blah bblah blah I know better ........... 

Bin Laden took responsibility for Sept 11, whether or not he actually orcastrated it (just for the conspiracy therists  ). After that all other points are irrelevant, as by his own admission of guilt, he was responsible for one of the largest ever terrorist atrocities ever committed. Played out live across the world where by the majority of victims where civilians, including nationals from over 70 countries. He WANTED to be that poster boy 

The hypocrisy in your second point is pretty outragous. Has the west no leaders of armies who have much more blood on their hands through their illegal wars? Of course not.

It's only hypocrisy if you can quote where I have stated the western leaders have no blood on their hands? The topic is Bin Laden, that's what I am discussing, wtf are you discussing or assuming this hypocrisy from?

[thebigfella]

Couldn't give a fcuk, IF it was Bin Lid, breathing IMO would have constituted a form of resistance.

The wests poster boy for terrorism is dead .... boo yaa

Christ get over yourself, the man made himself a poster boy for terrorism. He was a cnut full stop; happy to let other blow themselves up in Allah's name and the possibility of being rewarded with a few virgins, while lying up watching Arsenal bottle it in his nice comfy compound.

Did he now? There was me thinking it was the US administration who done that straight after Sept 11 (after spending 20 years funding him as a soldier against the soviets in Afghanistan). But I bow to your superior knowledge 


The hypocrisy in your second point is pretty outragous. Has the west no leaders of armies who have much more blood on their hands through their illegal wars? Of course not.

http://m.guardian.co.uk/world/2011/may/03/osama-bin-laden-10-myths-cia-arsenal?cat=world&type=article


1. Osama bin Laden was 'created' by the CIA
He did not receive any direct funding or training from the US during the 1980s. Nor did his followers. The Afghan mujahideen, via Pakistan's ISI intelligence agency, received large amounts of both. Some bled to the Arabs fighting the Soviets but nothing significant.
2. He had a huge personal fortune
Bin Laden was forced to leave any cash he had when he in effect fled Saudi Arabia in 1991 for Pakistan and then Sudan. His family cut him off. Nor would the inheritance from his hugely wealthy father have been divided into equal parts anyway. What Bin Laden did have was contacts, which allowed him to raise money with ease.
3. He was responsible for 1993 bombing of World Trade Centre
Ramzi Yousef, who was the main perpetrator of the attack, was probably working for Khaled Sheikh Mohammed who was an independent operator at the time. Mohammed only started working with al-Qaida in 1996 and even then kept his distance from Bin Laden.
4. He got money from drug running
No evidence for this whatsoever despite repeated claims – such as in the post 9/11 British government dossier on al-Qaida.
5. He never exposed himself to any danger
He did not single-handedly seize a short-barrelled AK-47 from a dying Soviet general as he sometimes claimed but numerous witnesses report that he was in the thick of fighting in Jaji in 1987 and again at the battle of Jalalabad in 1989.
6. He spent a lot of time in caves
In the late 1990s, for propaganda purposes, Bin Laden invited select journalists to meet him in caves near Tora Bora in eastern Afghanistan. However he lived in a much more comfortable compound a short drive away, near the former Soviet collective farm of Hadda owned by a local warlord. By 1999 he had moved to a complex of houses near Kandahar. When he was killed, he was living in a relatively comfortable detached house in Abbottabad, Pakistan. In between, there is no evidence that he spent any time living in caves. The rest of al-Qaida's senior militants appear to have lived in the semi-fortified houses that are common in the tribal zones.
7.He was a tearaway teenager who partied in Beirut before becoming religious.
There is no evidence for this either. Bin Laden appears to have been an intense, shy and pious youth who married young and spent an inordinate amount of time studying scripture.
8. He was near to dying of a kidney disease.
There are some reports – not least in the Guantánamo files – of renal problems but certainly not serious enough to kill him. It is more likely he had back problems caused by his height (around 6ft 5in) and relatively sedentary lifestyle.
9. He hid in Kashmir, was the leader of Chechen groups, was responsible for violence in the Philippines and in Indonesia, organised the Madrid 2004 attack and had an extensive network in Paraguay, sub-Saharan Africa and South Africa.
All these claims, made by various governments or intelligence services over the last decade have proved totally without foundation.
10. Bin Laden was an Arsenal fan
Despite fans reportedly chanting "Osama, woah-woah, Osama, woah-waoh, he's hiding in Kabul, he loves the Arsenal", Bin Laden was not a faithful of the north London club.

I like to think he was 

[thejuice]

I believe the USA should walk away from Afghanistan now, They can claim a victory of sorts, the TAPI pipeline seems to be going ahead under the new Afghan government.

The question is, do the soldiers get to go home or are they redeployed in Libya/Syria etc.

The Soviets pulled out of Afghanistan in 1989 claiming victory.  They handed over power to a communist government and the country was relatively stable. It all blew up 3 years later.  Afghanistan is like Somalia. It's a failed state . 

Last year the US spent $120bn fighting its war in Afghanistan and  Pakistan. The GNP of Afghanistan is $8bn. Do the maths.

I wasn't saying they were successful as far as Afghanistan as a "nation building project" is concerned, but they now can claim they were successful & walk away saving face.

And with the TAPI pipeline up and running the spoils of war go to America, which will help pay for the war. As long as it stays secure. 

[theskull1]

Couldn't give a fcuk, IF it was Bin Lid, breathing IMO would have constituted a form of resistance.

The wests poster boy for terrorism is dead .... boo yaa

Christ get over yourself, the man made himself a poster boy for terrorism. He was a cnut full stop; happy to let other blow themselves up in Allah's name and the possibility of being rewarded with a few virgins, while lying up watching Arsenal bottle it in his nice comfy compound.

Did he now? There was me thinking it was the US administration who done that straight after Sept 11 (after spending 20 years funding him as a soldier against the soviets in Afghanistan). But I bow to your superior knowledge 

Standard protocol for debating on here, I bow to your superiour knolwedge but blah bblah blah I know better ........... 

Bin Laden took responsibility for Sept 11, whether or not he actually orcastrated it (just for the conspiracy therists  ). After that all other points are irrelevant, as by his own admission of guilt, he was responsible for one of the largest ever terrorist atrocities ever committed. Played out live across the world where by the majority of victims where civilians, including nationals from over 70 countries. He WANTED to be that poster boy 

The hypocrisy in your second point is pretty outragous. Has the west no leaders of armies who have much more blood on their hands through their illegal wars? Of course not.

It's only hypocrisy if you can quote where I have stated the western leaders have no blood on their hands? The topic is Bin Laden, that's what I am discussing, wtf are you discussing or assuming this hypocrisy from?

The point is that he didn't "make himself a poster boy for terrorism" as you so confidently stated.... Nothing more than that.

My hypocrisy comment has a relevance when you're seething statement of hatred for one typre of mass murderer is not balanced by any acknowledgement that both al qaeda and the western powers have blood on their hands on a very very large scale. Actively stating a balanced perspective if you hold it lets everybody know more accurately your position on these difficult issues. You wouldn't want I'm sure to be characatured as that fella in the youtube video would you 

[johnneycool]

Live by the sword, die by the sword, so I'm ambivalent to Osama Bin Ladens murder/revenge killing.

Is the world a safer place?

Probably not, but its likely there'll be a concerted effort from the Jihadists to prove that Bin Ladens doctrine lives on so we in the west and anyone in a major city would need to be on their guard.


I always wonder what creates these people like Bin Laden and their what seems to be irrational hatred of all things western.

Is it our different or more modern outlook on religious beliefs and democracy?

Is it the Wests sins in these regions from the colonial past and even present?

Is it the fact that we arm certain dictators to the hilt, yet castigate and murder others when they cease to be useful?

Is it our arrogance in taking the moral high ground and not seeing how our actions impact on others?

Is it our support of the concentration camp that is Gaza and the west bank?

Are these people terrorists or freedom fighters?

We've made a rod for our own back in the middle east and muslim world which will only result in more deaths on both sides, collateral damage.

There's no winners in this.

[theskull1]

+1

Its hard to triumphant when you ask questions like these.

[Tony Baloney]

f**k him. They should have cut his head off and put it on a spike as the same boy would have done to any of us.

Some of you boys need to stop crying about Blair etc. Yis aren't in school anymore - it's big boys rules out there.

[Hardy]

f**k him. They should have cut his head off and put it on a spike as the same boy would have done to any of us.

Some of you boys need to stop crying about Blair etc. Yis aren't in school anymore - it's big boys rules out there.

Is this the policy that used to be called "shoot to kill" in some quarters?

[johnneycool]

f**k him. They should have cut his head off and put it on a spike as the same boy would have done to any of us.

Very modern, sounds very like something Cromwell would have been at.

[Tony Baloney]

f**k him. They should have cut his head off and put it on a spike as the same boy would have done to any of us.

Some of you boys need to stop crying about Blair etc. Yis aren't in school anymore - it's big boys rules out there.

Is this the policy that used to be called "shoot to kill" in some quarters?

. Why else would you shoot?

If some cnut wants to blow up a building full of civilians in New York, Belfast or Timbuktu he should be prepared for what's coming his way.

[Tony Baloney]

f**k him. They should have cut his head off and put it on a spike as the same boy would have done to any of us.

Very modern, sounds very like something Cromwell would have been at.

Or a 21st Century jihadi.

[thebigfella]

Couldn't give a fcuk, IF it was Bin Lid, breathing IMO would have constituted a form of resistance.

The wests poster boy for terrorism is dead .... boo yaa

Christ get over yourself, the man made himself a poster boy for terrorism. He was a cnut full stop; happy to let other blow themselves up in Allah's name and the possibility of being rewarded with a few virgins, while lying up watching Arsenal bottle it in his nice comfy compound.

Did he now? There was me thinking it was the US administration who done that straight after Sept 11 (after spending 20 years funding him as a soldier against the soviets in Afghanistan). But I bow to your superior knowledge 

Standard protocol for debating on here, I bow to your superiour knolwedge but blah bblah blah I know better ........... 

Bin Laden took responsibility for Sept 11, whether or not he actually orcastrated it (just for the conspiracy therists  ). After that all other points are irrelevant, as by his own admission of guilt, he was responsible for one of the largest ever terrorist atrocities ever committed. Played out live across the world where by the majority of victims where civilians, including nationals from over 70 countries. He WANTED to be that poster boy 

The hypocrisy in your second point is pretty outragous. Has the west no leaders of armies who have much more blood on their hands through their illegal wars? Of course not.

It's only hypocrisy if you can quote where I have stated the western leaders have no blood on their hands? The topic is Bin Laden, that's what I am discussing, wtf are you discussing or assuming this hypocrisy from?

The point is that he didn't "make himself a poster boy for terrorism" as you so confidently stated.... Nothing more than that.

My hypocrisy comment has a relevance when you're seething statement of hatred for one typre of mass murderer is not balanced by any acknowledgement that both al qaeda and the western powers have blood on their hands on a very very large scale. Actively stating a balanced perspective if you hold it lets everybody know more accurately your position on these difficult issues. You wouldn't want I'm sure to be characatured as that fella in the youtube video would you 

Actually it has no relevance, you were trying to be a smart ass and I caught you out and your still trying to justify your assumptions and liberal nonsense

I don't have to justify my "seething hatred", as you put it, by balancing it out with whataboutary.  It's not a difficult issue at all, he was a cnut and deserved it. I couldn't give a fcuk about that you tube video or what western leaders have done (in relation to this topic). IF the yanks did execute him, fair fcuks.

As for you other point on the poster boy, give it up, he wanted and gladly accepted it. Fcuk sake you cannot orchestrate what he did and not expect to be held up as one of the most evil men in the world. IMO as soon as those planes crashing into the Twin Towers and the subsequent collapse was broadcast live across the world, the western governments had very little to do in order to make him their poster boy  He'd managed that all himself.

[johnneycool]

f**k him. They should have cut his head off and put it on a spike as the same boy would have done to any of us.

Very modern, sounds very like something Cromwell would have been at.

Or a 21st Century jihadi.

So you're admitting to having the same outlook and methods as Bin laden and those you pour scorn on?

[Tony Baloney]

Couldn't give a fcuk, IF it was Bin Lid, breathing IMO would have constituted a form of resistance.

The wests poster boy for terrorism is dead .... boo yaa

Christ get over yourself, the man made himself a poster boy for terrorism. He was a cnut full stop; happy to let other blow themselves up in Allah's name and the possibility of being rewarded with a few virgins, while lying up watching Arsenal bottle it in his nice comfy compound.

Did he now? There was me thinking it was the US administration who done that straight after Sept 11 (after spending 20 years funding him as a soldier against the soviets in Afghanistan). But I bow to your superior knowledge 

Standard protocol for debating on here, I bow to your superiour knolwedge but blah bblah blah I know better ........... 

Bin Laden took responsibility for Sept 11, whether or not he actually orcastrated it (just for the conspiracy therists  ). After that all other points are irrelevant, as by his own admission of guilt, he was responsible for one of the largest ever terrorist atrocities ever committed. Played out live across the world where by the majority of victims where civilians, including nationals from over 70 countries. He WANTED to be that poster boy 

The hypocrisy in your second point is pretty outragous. Has the west no leaders of armies who have much more blood on their hands through their illegal wars? Of course not.

It's only hypocrisy if you can quote where I have stated the western leaders have no blood on their hands? The topic is Bin Laden, that's what I am discussing, wtf are you discussing or assuming this hypocrisy from?

The point is that he didn't "make himself a poster boy for terrorism" as you so confidently stated.... Nothing more than that.

My hypocrisy comment has a relevance when you're seething statement of hatred for one typre of mass murderer is not balanced by any acknowledgement that both al qaeda and the western powers have blood on their hands on a very very large scale. Actively stating a balanced perspective if you hold it lets everybody know more accurately your position on these difficult issues. You wouldn't want I'm sure to be characatured as that fella in the youtube video would you 

Actually it has no relevance, you were trying to be a smart ass and I caught you out and your still trying to justify your assumptions and liberal nonsense

I don't have to justify my "seething hatred", as you put it, by balancing it out with whataboutary.  It's not a difficult issue at all, he was a cnut and deserved it. I couldn't give a fcuk about that you tube video or what western leaders have done (in relation to this topic). IF the yanks did execute him, fair fcuks.

As for you other point on the poster boy, give it up, he wanted and gladly accepted it. Fcuk sake you cannot orchestrate what he did and not expect to be held up as one of the most evil men in the world. IMO as soon as those planes crashing into the Twin Towers and the subsequent collapse was broadcast live across the world, the western governments had very little to do in order to make him their poster boy  He'd managed that all himself.

Hear/here hear/here.

[Tony Baloney]

f**k him. They should have cut his head off and put it on a spike as the same boy would have done to any of us.

Very modern, sounds very like something Cromwell would have been at.

Or a 21st Century jihadi.

So you're admitting to having the same outlook and methods as Bin laden and those you pour scorn on?

Put your reading glasses on. I didn't pour scorn on any outlook or methods. I would pour scorn on anyone yapping about the manner of his passing, live by the sword, die by the sword.

Don't feel you need to reply.