Kerry vs Down

[thewobbler]

RadioGaaGaa, it's a rather strange obsession with height that you have. Tyrone won 3 All Irelands during the noughties with nobody over 6' in either half back or half forward lines.

You sound like a man after Ross Carr's heart. Ross spent his first six months trying out every brute of a man in the county to see if there was football in them. An utterly daft experiment.

[RadioGAAGAA]

RadioGaaGaa, it's a rather strange obsession with height that you have.

Well... it does kinda spring from our evident weaknesses - where do you think was the main problem area last September?

Tyrone won 3 All Irelands during the noughties with nobody over 6' in either half back or half forward lines.

Singularly losing midfield in nearly every game - and therefore having to try and bypass midfield. Oh, and Tyrone didn't have to play against this Cork team; playing your own game is one thing, stopping the opposition playing their's is quite another.

[whitegoodman]

Have to agree with Radio on this one, we couldnt win a breaking ball around the middle against Cork last september and that remains our main weakness. 

And in fairness I dont think you could compare favourably some of downs half foward line with the all ireland winning tyrone teams.........mcginn/poland/mccumisky wouldnt have the same stature, strength or ball winning abilities as Dooher, McGuigan, McGinley or even Gerald Calvan.

IMO we will never beat the current cork team with a half foward line of Hughes, Poland and McGinn.  2 of the 3 max with Hughes obviously one of them.

Think Rooney and Garvey are big, strong and wirey enough to handle themselves as well as having the footballing ability but question marks remain over McKernan, lovely footballer but dont no whether he has the strength, knowhow or cut to play in such a key position as CHB

[thewobbler]

But winning a breaking-ball has got diddly squat to do with height. It's about timing and desire.

Cork didn't beat Down in the AI final because of height, but because of athleticism. It wasn't so much that they won every breaking-ball, but because they had runners at every angle when in possession. They ran both around us and over the top of us. They are a freakily athletic team - maybe only Dublin can even hope to take them on in that regard.

For Down to beat Cork, we would obviously have to improve dramatically in the breaking ball stakes, but more importantly we would have to play football, and make our possession count.

Like all teams, when their confidence is up, they'll put on a show. The best way to ruin that confidence is not by putting a series of big plodders around your half-back line, but to make them believe that if they make a mistake, they will get punished. That's when things start to get edgy.

[redandblackareback]

If we d have won last week I d say the interest in this game would have been much greater!! As we would have been going down there knowing a win takes you into the league final. Its an non runner now as Cork will roll Armagh over by maybe 10... Would personally like to see some of the fringe players tested, the likes of Mark Doran, Michael Magee etc.. throw 4 or 5 of them in and lets see what their made of, why not, otherwise whats the point in those lads being there if their not used> Sod it, heading down sat morning anyway for a few pints of stout hopefully in the sun!! 
Is there many making the journey?

[NP 76]

If we had of tried different kickouts against cork we would of had no need to worry about breaking ball . At the end of the day we lived of scraps around the middle all day and still were only beat by a point a big man is not going to break the ball to someone else when he has a better chance to catch it than anyone else . I for one cant think of anyone big to play at half forward hope im wrong who else is about . I would move Mc Kernan to wing half and swop Garvey to chb Mc Kernan good going forward but sometimes forgets to defend .Am heading down redandblack going to Hogan final first then on down the road should be good craic

[PAULD123]

To say we will never beat this current Cork side is just plain pessimistic for the sake of pessimism. We finished ONE point behind them in the biggest game in Ireland and in the last minute If Conor Maginn had just got his pass away we looked certain for an equaliser. That was on a day when it poured rain and allowed their slower defence to keep up with our normally faster forwards.

Along with Kerry, they are certainly the team to beat but it's not like we are struggling to beat London!!! We are well within a shot of Cork and with a tiny bit of luck would have a Sam Maguire sitting in the Mournes.

I know I am overly optimistic at times but there is no point talking the team down just for the sake of it.

[whitegoodman]

Paul I didnt say Down would never beat Cork, I said i didnt think they could beat them with the current half foward line in place.  Down were beat by a point last year but most Down fans would agree that Cork were more than a point the better team and still are.

The 2 brians or Paul Galvin arent necessarily tall players but they are strong and powerful which is essential for winning breaking ball.  A powerful player ( not to be mistaken with a tall player ) will win breakball all day long against a small player if both have the same level of desire as would be expected at the very top level.  That is my reasoning for not wanting poland and or mcginn in the same team

Wobbler makes the point about making use of our possession, but it takes an exceptional team such as the past Tyrone team to win games against the very best with 40% or less possession and Down as yet are not an exceptional team.

Dont get me wrong we have made massive strides and i would put us in the top 6 in the country and on a par with the likes of dublin and tyrone but still a little behind the 2 munster teams and massive credit must go to James and the rest of the management team for bringing us from being a laughing stock to one of the best teams about.

[whitegoodman]

If we d have won last week I d say the interest in this game would have been much greater!! As we would have been going down there knowing a win takes you into the league final. Its an non runner now as Cork will roll Armagh over by maybe 10... Would personally like to see some of the fringe players tested, the likes of Mark Doran, Michael Magee etc.. throw 4 or 5 of them in and lets see what their made of, why not, otherwise whats the point in those lads being there if their not used> Sod it, heading down sat morning anyway for a few pints of stout hopefully in the sun!! 
Is there many making the journey?

So basically in what is likely to be the last competitive game before playing armagh u want to start experimenting with fringe players for the sake of it, give them a game because they havnt had one all year.  These fringe players obviously havnt been showing enough in training and shouldnt be given a start for the sake of it especially considering they have no change of getting a game against armagh. 

IMO we should be putting out as close to the championship team as is possible in what will be the ultimate test played at championship pace.  What better preparation can you get?!! McKenna cup or trial matches is the time for fringe players to be given game time, not a month before the championship.

[PAULD123]

I agree with WhiteGM on this. We can't start playing a half reserve team just to make those players feel good. There has to be a reason for changing any given player.

But more importantly this isn't a bounce game. We have a (slim) chance of a league final. Just suppose Armagh pulled of a shocker and then we lost cause we played reserves.

No, we must go out with our best team, try to win and uphold our part of the plan. Also we must beat a top 5 side at some stage if we are to move on and progress. As WhitGM says we're top six but we have only beat one of those teams above us and that was a depleted Kerry team. Unless we start beating these teams we will never be anything other than the best of the rest

[Mid Down Gael]

The Kerry team to play Down on Sunday at 2.30pm in Fitzgerald Stadium is as follows:
1. Brendan  Kealy, (Kilcummin)
2. Shane Enright (Tarbert) 3 Marc Ó Sé (An Ghaeltacht) . 4 Tom O'Sullivan (Rathmore)
5 Tomas Ó Sé,  (An Ghaeltacht )6 Killian Young (Renard)  7. Aidan O'Mahony(Rathmore)
8 Eoin Brosnan (Dr. Crokes), 9 Anthony Maher (Duagh)
10. Donnchadh Walsh (Cromane), 11. Darran O'Sullivan (Glenbeigh/Glencar) 12. Paul Galvin (Finuge)
13. Colm Cooper (Dr. Crokes)14 Kieran Donaghy(Austin Stacks) 15. Declan O'Sullivan (Piarsaigh Na Dromada)
Subs:

Tomás Mac a t'Saoir (An Ghaeltacht)  Seamus Scanlon (Currow) Kieran O'Leary  (Dr. Crokes)
Bryan Sheehan (St. Mary's)  20 Padraig Reidy (Scartaglin)   Brian McGuire  (Listowel Emmetts)  Daniel Bohan(Austin Stacks) ,
Adrian O'Connell (St Michaels Foilmore)  Niall O'Mahony (Spa)

[PAULD123]

Is anyone coming to kerry? We got here this evening. Just a word of warning there is a huge diversion before mallow that takes you into Fermoy, You will need to allow at least half an hour extra to get here.

[5 Sams]

The Kerry team to play Down on Sunday at 2.30pm in Fitzgerald Stadium is as follows:
1. Brendan  Kealy, (Kilcummin)
2. Shane Enright (Tarbert) 3 Marc Ó Sé (An Ghaeltacht) . 4 Tom O'Sullivan (Rathmore)
5 Tomas Ó Sé,  (An Ghaeltacht )6 Killian Young (Renard)  7. Aidan O'Mahony(Rathmore)
8 Eoin Brosnan (Dr. Crokes), 9 Anthony Maher (Duagh)
10. Donnchadh Walsh (Cromane), 11. Darran O'Sullivan (Glenbeigh/Glencar) 12. Paul Galvin (Finuge)
13. Colm Cooper (Dr. Crokes)14 Kieran Donaghy(Austin Stacks) 15. Declan O'Sullivan (Piarsaigh Na Dromada)
Subs:

Tomás Mac a t'Saoir (An Ghaeltacht)  Seamus Scanlon (Currow) Kieran O'Leary  (Dr. Crokes)
Bryan Sheehan (St. Mary's)  20 Padraig Reidy (Scartaglin)   Brian McGuire  (Listowel Emmetts)  Daniel Bohan(Austin Stacks) ,
Adrian O'Connell (St Michaels Foilmore)  Niall O'Mahony (Spa)

In fairness I would fancy our full forward line against that Kerry full back line...I know Marc is a top 3 corner back of the last 5-6 years but he will have his hands full with Benny and the other two...Tom with miles on the clock and Shane a greenhorn..... Marty and Paul will give them them their fill.

I think our midfield will be better than Kerry's.....fullstop. Brosnan is out of position and Maher hasnt made a name for himself yet...he's no Moran or Quirke or even Tommy G or Scanlan....


As for the Kerry forward line.....welll that just scares the shite of of me

[Mid Down Gael]

Down Team

1 Declan Alder
2 Gerard McCartan
3 Dan Gordon
4 Brendan McArdle
5 Conor Garvey
6 Kevin McKernan
7 Declan Rooney
8 James Colgan
9 Kalum King
10 Daniel Hughes
11 Mark Poland
12 Conor Maginn
13 Paul McComiskey
14 Brendan Coulter
15 Martin Clarke

[whitegoodman]

If McCartan and McArdle come through tomorrow unscathed it will be very hard to drop either for the championship.

Good to see colgen getting a chance at midfield as well althought it may be due to an injury to fitzpatrick