Down V Armagh - Newry 26th Feb

[5 Sams]

I'll spin this combined teams thing another way.

The only Armagh players who would significantly improve the Down team are Donaghy and McKeever.

This isn't to say I don't rate the rest of Armagh's players - Stevie McD is one of the best players I've seen, Mallon and Toner are quality, Jamie Clarke looks a great prospect - but more to do with the fact that Down wouldn't become more freescoring with the addition of any Armagh forwards. Maybe a point or two here or there, that's all... i.e. no significant improvement.

In return, any three of M Clarke, Poland, Hughes, Coulter and Maginn would dramatically improve Armagh's half-forward line, Rogers is the best midfielder out of all on show, and McKernan would add a welcome dash of class to their team.

And the only players who would significantly improve Armagh are Coulter & Clarke - and to a lesser extent Hughes.

The other half forwards you name - including McKernan who would not be entertained as a defender in armagh - are no better / not as good as what we have.

We could actually ship you a load of defenders from beyond our panel who would start for down. McKernan and Gordan are laughably bad defenders and McCartan & Rooney are very average - all four protected by the system.

Can I ask what you base that opinion on? I wonder would Kieran Donaghy or Declan O'Sullivan agree with you.

[5 Sams]

anyone know of any bars in derry city to catch the match on sat night.

I don't think you'll have any trouble finding a bar in the city centre showing the game....but if you want a deadly pint of stout to go along with it head to Tinney's just off the Strand Road

[naka]

is it just me or does any one else think down could give armagh a real pasting on saturday night, having seen armagh to date i cant for the life of me work out the tactical contrbution of the  managers on the sideline
our only hope for the championship is to get the two clarkes motoring, find a  playmaker for centre half forward a mobile partner for toner and a corner back to assist mallon and donaghy otherwise we could get stuffed then as well

[Ethan Tremblay]

oh ye of little faith!!  A can assume that por knows what he's playing at on the sideline and that all the preperation are for the sole purpose of when down travel to armagh in may (giving grugan experiance now).  I agree that toner needs a solid midfield partner to shift the responsibilty in the fielding department (possibly the younger duffy from the ogs)  Armagh are the underdogs for this match, a tag which they have carried on numerous occasions and would suit them down to the ground!  Armagh aint done yet!

[PAULD123]

On a dry hard pitch where our forwards could use their speed AND IF we were playing to the standard of last summer, then giving Armagh's current form, you would expect Armagh to be torn apart. But it isn't summer, the pitch doesn't suit our game and like Armagh, we are nowhere near on form.

This will be a game of two teams struggling for form. I expect to see many mistakes, many poor decisions in the passing, Quite a few slips (mostly from Down players), and the in bursts, sporadic wonderful glimpses of brilliance. I expect this from both teams because both teams have quality forwards who have talent regardless of form but due to lack of form will not be able to do it for a full 70 minutes.

[armaghniac]

Down are probably not playing as well as Dublin at this stage, and Armagh gave Dublin a good game, so I reckon we are in there rightly.

[TacadoirArdMhacha]

anyone know of any bars in derry city to catch the match on sat night.

I don't think you'll have any trouble finding a bar in the city centre showing the game....but if you want a deadly pint of stout to go along with it head to Tinney's just off the Strand Road

The Gweedore / Peadar's is another decent option.

[ardchieftain]

it's sad but the point about our management is spot on. Unfortunately.
We do have a squad every bit as talented as Down's though. It will be a tight match and might come down to who wants it more. If it comes down to simple desire in the last 5 minutes i'd like to think we'll snatch it.

[whitegoodman]

Duffle i agreed with the combined team you made apart from a few things.

If u have the comfort of having Donaghy at Full Back Dan Gordon would get in ahead of Toner at midfield.

Dyas is completley unproven at senior level.  He has potential but sure that is it.  Id have Kernan, McKernan or Rooney in there.

Ur point on Gordon and McKernan being laughably bad defenders is laughable.  Did u see Gordon on Kieran Donaghy or against Kildare or last wk for that matter.  Alright he struggled in the all ireland final but he wasnt the first and wont be the last to do so against that cork full forward line.

U also say McKernan wouldnt be considered as a defender for Armagh.  Is he not the same type of defender as Aaron Kernan.  R u trying to tell me he is a much better defender than him.  They are both lovely footballers who are limited at defending.  I would have Declan Rooney ahead of both of them and ur assumption that he is average shows how little u no about Down football.

[DuffleKing]

Of course all things are relative and none of the players mentioned are bad players, but rather relatively poor defenders by county standards.

Gordon wouldn't get a game for down at midfield so i doubt he'd get in a combined team.

Kernan is not good enough defensively to be a top quality defender but he can do enough to get by. McKernan is way behind even that level defensively - but i happen to think he's more effective and dynamic than ak going forward. Rooney wasn't even in the down team at the start of the championship last year and he's very average. you boys really need to see past your lucky draws and tainted victories from last year.

Gordon is filling a hole at full back for down in the absence of alternatives - nothing more. we prefer our full backs to be able to tackle and stay with a forward when he turns.

I know more about down football than you obviously think.

[Mourne Rover]

Duffleking, comment is free but the facts are sacred. You claim that you know about Down football but you say that Declan Rooney could not make our side at the start of the championship. Even though he missed the entire league campaign through injury, he was actually brought straight back into our defence for our opening USC match, away to Donegal last May, and kept his place for all eight of our championship fixtures last summer, all the way through to the AI final. As a half-back, he scored two points from play on his seasonal debut in a tight game aganst Galway last Sunday. You may think that he is `very average' but those of us who have seen him regularly would hold a different opinion.   

[PAULD123]

Down team For Armagh, Same exactly as for Galway:

1. Brendan McVeigh (An Ríocht)
2. Gerald McCartan (Boireann)
3. Dan Gordon (Loch an Oileáin)
4. Luke Howard   (Áth Bhriain)
5. Aidan Branagan (Cill Chua)
6. Kevin McKernan (Boireann)
7. Declan Rooney (Boireann)
8. Peter Fitzpatrick (Baile Mhairtín)
9. Kalum King (Áth Bhriain)
10. Daniel Hughes (Sabhaill)
11. Mark Poland (Cloch Fhada)
12. Conor Maginn (Áth Bhriain)
13. Conor Laverty (Cill Chua)
14. Brendan Coulter (Droichead Mhaigh Éo)
15. Martin Clarke (An Ríocht)

16. Cathal Murdock (Boireann)
17. Conor Garvey (Droichead Mhaigh Éo)
18. Liam Doyle (Liatroim)
19. Paul McPolin (Cluain Daimh)
20. Ronan Murtagh (Baile Cholmáin)
21. John Clarke (An Ríocht)
22. James Colgan (An Ríocht)
23. Ronan Sexton (Droichead Mhaigh Éo)
24. Aidan Carr (Cluain Dáimh)
25. Mark Doran (Cloch Fhada)
26. Paul McComiskey (Dún Droma)

[mackers]

I'd be happy enough that five out of Armagh's six defenders will be able to do a job on their counterpart. A Mallon suits the fast nippy forwards so he can go on Conor Laverty and should do a good job, Donaghy has the pace and strength to deal with a "half fit" Coulter, Finn Mo will follow Clarke out the field which will suit Armagh, he fouls a lot so the further away from our goals he is the better and he did an excellent job on him in Croker, in addition he can attack fairly well.
I'd be confident enough of the Dyas and McKeever match ups but the one that would concern me is Hughes vs. Duffy. Danny Hughes is a great player and if he's given room to run at a defence will cause all sorts of problems. Paul Duffy is exactly the same, very effective going forward but his main job on Saturday evening should be to keep Hughes quiet and I'd have concerns that he will be able to do it.

[whitegoodman]

Happy enough with that team apart from Id liked to have seen McCumisky or Murtagh instead of Lavery.  Mallon didnt give him a kick of it when he came on in the league final and suits him down to the ground.  Would  have thought the other 2 would have given Mallon more trouble.

Good forward bench options if we are in a bit of trouble.

Interesting to see who will pick up stevie, likely gordon will go to swift, Gerrard McCartan has the height and speed but stevie would be far to cute for a guy in his infancy of county football so likely to be Luke Howard who himself is only coming back from a long term serious injury.  I smell trouble if we dont double mark the killeavy c**t!!!

[orchard 8195]

I can't see how anyone thinks Armagh has better players - Hello 4 All Stars? and another 3 All star nominations, and McKernan was clearly robbed of one. Who are all these Armagh players that are better than Dan Gordon, Benny Coulter, Marty Clarke, Danny Hughes, Brendan McVeigh, Kevin McKernan, Conor Garvey, Decky Rooney?

Dan Gordan has been playing full back, Not in same league as brendy donaghy in this position, Benny Coulter, Hughes and Clarke (Who i think is a bit overated) yes would def get onto most teams in the country, McVeigh is of similar ability to Hearty, Kevin McKernan is excellant going forward and would make it onto our half backline Although his defensive capabilities are suspect when playing from 5-7 (Remember he was dropped for a period for down last year mainly because of this) Garvey and Rooney are not better than what we have at our disposal in the backline.
Just my opinion and this hasnt been tainted by a major Down dislikening like many in my county have as i reserve this for our red hand neighbours!!!

Dont disagree with you on Donaghy, a class act, if we had him last year we would have won the all ireland no doubt about it. Think your way of the mark with the Clarke overrated statement if you watch closely everything goes through him, everything down do welll he s involved. Hearty for me is a pudding no offence and last year was mc veighs best year in a Down shirt. As regards Garvey, he is an excellant man marking and proved this last year on route to the final. Saturday will be tough for Armagh but right now I personally believe we have one of the best forward lines in Ireland, a big statement but statistics dont lie, 3 of the 6 all stars last year.

I saw Martin Clarke many times at underage level and have to say he was the best underage player i have seen, However i feel his time at aussie rules has put him back as a player rather than forward. At underage he was all about blistering pace, taking players on and carrying the ball, this was as well as having a fantastic left peg. Now he is a different player, instead prefaring to play the "Quarter back" role at number 11. I think this is for two reasons 1. He has bulked up to much in oz and hasnt the same pace as he previously had, 2. in oz rules he was not able to carry the ball because of the tackle. I just think his time there has taken the edge and (good) rawness from his game. While still a great player i just feel the media over emphasise his role in every game he plays because of who he is. IMO opinion he would come behind coulter, hughes Rodgers and possibly dan Gordan at midfield as your best player.
Also while Hearty has had some v dodgy moments in the past (As all Goalkeepers do) last year he had a fine season.