Ard Mhacha v An Dún - Cluiche Ceannais Rionn 2 - Pairc an Chrócaigh 25/4/10

[mackers]

I would have Henderson in the corner instead of Mallon but aside from that that would be my team also. I think Henderson has been fairly harshly treated, he won the Laois match for us and was taken off twenty minutes in against Down despite doing nothing wrong.

Wouldn't agree. Mallon is more experienced and more consistent. I don't know how anyone could say Henderson has been harshly treated, he's had more game time than any of the other corner forward options this year. He has had more than his fair share of chances in the last two years, somewhere in the region of 13-15 starts by my reckoning, and has been consistently inconsistent. He puts in one good showing for every 4 or 5 starts, you just can't trust someone with that kind of return for Championship football.

Mallon has has a number of poor seasons and quite often has been anonymous in games. Perhaps that was the system we were playing. With a better looking HF line we don't need so much of Mallon's foraging back and that's why I'd rather see Henderson in the corner. He is a naturally more gifted finisher and it's that rather than Mallon's all round game that I think is needed.

That would be my line of thinking also, Henderson wouldn't be cut out for the aerial bombardment of our FF line that we had to endure for a few seasons. If we're going to create openings for our FF line with more fluid movement where ball winning isn't at a premium then Henderson's the man. AFS, if you're dropped at the earliest opportunity after every mediocre performance then it'll do nothing for your confidence. Henderson, more than most, has suffered from this type of treatment with the substitution in Newry being the ultimate example. He is very much a confidence player who would benefit from a run of games. Brian Mallon played well yesterday but has been a lot less prolific in front of goals than Henderson.

[mountainboii]

That would be my line of thinking also, Henderson wouldn't be cut out for the aerial bombardment of our FF line that we had to endure for a few seasons. If we're going to create openings for our FF line with more fluid movement where ball winning isn't at a premium then Henderson's the man. AFS, if you're dropped at the earliest opportunity after every mediocre performance then it'll do nothing for your confidence. Henderson, more than most, has suffered from this type of treatment with the substitution in Newry being the ultimate example. He is very much a confidence player who would benefit from a run of games. Brian Mallon played well yesterday but has been a lot less prolific in front of goals than Henderson.

But that's my point. Henderson started the first five league games this year. Even if the Down game is ignored, that's still four starts in a row, more than any of the other corner forwards options were afforded. He also started our first nine games last year. I really fail to see how anyone can say he hasn't been given a good run. Bottom line for me is that of his 8 league starts (ignoring Down) in the past 15 months, he's played well twice (Laois and Wexford) maybe three times at a push (Meath). That's not consistent enough. I definitely concede that Mallon hasn't been the most consistent either, but in the absence of an outstanding candidate I'd give his experience the nod.

Mallon has has a number of poor seasons and quite often has been anonymous in games. Perhaps that was the system we were playing. With a better looking HF line we don't need so much of Mallon's foraging back and that's why I'd rather see Henderson in the corner. He is a naturally more gifted finisher and it's that rather than Mallon's all round game that I think is needed.

I suppose I'd disagree with that a bit too. From what I've seen this year, we still rarely play with three full forwards at any one time. One inside forward at a time seems to drop out to create space for the other two. Because of this, I reckon it's crucial that the third FF has a good all round game and is able to come deep when necessary, especially as Clarke and McDonnell are likely to remain inside as much as possible. I think Mallon's all round game gives him the upper hand on Henderson in this regard.

[armaghniac]

I think Henderson might have a role if both Clarke and Stevie are playing, these can both win ball and draw backs creating room for a layoff to a player running into space. But Mallon advanced his case yesterday. I wasn't impressed with Feeney when he came on.

[mackers]

But Mallon has started many games for Armagh also but doesn't have the same scoring stats as Henderson would have. Of course you're right about Henderson's level of consistency but remember we are after a SCORING forward. It's not that Mallon isn't a valuable player to us, he works hard for the team but we set out at the start of the league with a solid defence, a poor midfield and an over-reliance on Clarke and McDonnell in the scoring stakes.
Thankfully our defence, with the exception of a couple of silly individual errors, are continuing to work well as a unit, our midfield problems have improved no end and the best SCORING option after Stevie and Clarke has been Henderson. Mallon has been consistent but he doesn't really scare defences.

[ardmhachaabu]

But Mallon has started many games for Armagh also but doesn't have the same scoring stats as Henderson would have. Of course you're right about Henderson's level of consistency but remember we are after a SCORING forward. It's not that Mallon isn't a valuable player to us, he works hard for the team but we set out at the start of the league with a solid defence, a poor midfield and an over-reliance on Clarke and McDonnell in the scoring stakes.
Thankfully our defence, with the exception of a couple of silly individual errors, are continuing to work well as a unit, our midfield problems have improved no end and the best SCORING option after Stevie and Clarke has been Henderson. Mallon has been consistent but he doesn't really scare defences.

To be fair mackers, if I was a defender, I would be more scared of Mallon than Henderson.  No harm to the man, I just don't think he wins enough of his own ball and is too dependent on others in the team to give him ball, granted he can do damage but, is that enough?
Mallon is a more intelligent player in that he can see opportunities, he looks for the man running into space etc whereas Henderson hasn't proven himself in that department just yet

[Benny Barnaveld]

It is a bit of a change with Clarke at CHF.
But he has played there for club and county on a few occassions & done ok.
Armagh have not had Clarke for most of the league and have not been playing the same high balls into the FF ine and have had success with this tactic. They could always swap him if it was not working out.
Surely a man with his skill and power, and ability to take a score could do well there.

[bennydorano]

Brian Mallon is a natural CHF and with signs of him returning to form he should get a run there, however AK is going to be there barring an injury by the looks of it.  I really dont buy into AK as a CHF at all, I always get the feeling that it's a case of the emperor's new clothes with him, especially in some media circles, however he's not terrible, but I think there's better.

I suppose Armagh have something to prove, but it really is a totally pointless game, an NFL Div 1 title has some kudos, but Div 2 has zip.

[ardmhachaabu]

Brian Mallon is a natural CHF and with signs of him returning to form he should get a run there, however AK is going to be there barring an injury by the looks of it.  I really dont buy into AK as a CHF at all, I always get the feeling that it's a case of the emperor's new clothes with him, especially in some media circles, however he's not terrible, but I think there's better.

I suppose Armagh have something to prove, but it really is a totally pointless game, an NFL Div 1 title has some kudos, but Div 2 has zip.

I agree a Division 2 title means nothing, I think it means something to the squad though in terms of what happened in the last game.  Down shouldn't have won so easily last outing and I daresay it won't be so easy for them this time

[dodgy umpire]

This thread has been very Armagh dominated so far. From a Down point of view this should prove to be our toughest test yet. Armagh have undoubtedly found their form and after thrashing Donegal they should not lack confidence,  the open spaces of Croker will truely test our full back line.  The Armagh WHF left unmarked by Colgan (who will presumably sweep) will have plenty of room to run at our defence but I look forward to seeing MC thread passes through to our FF line who should flourish on this wide pitch. I expect Down to win the midfield contest and should King (who is playing great football) run out of steam, we have big Dan back in our arsenal! My 15 would be
     McVeigh
Rafferty McArdle McCartan
McKernan Colgan Garvey
  Rodgers  King
Maginn M Clarke Hughes
Lavery J Clarke B Coulter

should Paul Mc C be fit i would have him on instead of Lavery, and I would like to see Gordon and Doyler get run outs

[Benny Barnaveld]

Brian Mallon is a natural CHF and with signs of him returning to form he should get a run there, however AK is going to be there barring an injury by the looks of it.  I really dont buy into AK as a CHF at all, I always get the feeling that it's a case of the emperor's new clothes with him, especially in some media circles, however he's not terrible, but I think there's better.

I suppose Armagh have something to prove, but it really is a totally pointless game, an NFL Div 1 title has some kudos, but Div 2 has zip.

Brian Mallon may be a natural CHF, but he does lack the physicallity of some of our recent former great CHF like McEntee & Marsden.

[John o connor]

Agree with your selection dodgy, think mc com shades it but Laverty deserves a chance. Should be tight one but fancy us to turn them over again hopefully getting stronger grip at midfield from the off !! Dont think they did us any favours tankin Donegal at the weekend either.

[hobit hunter]

Yes the league Div 1 & 2 finals are being played as double headers in Croke Park on Sunday 25th

Pencilled in for Croker but I fear with the Dubs not making the Div 1 final and that contest now being west dominated we could find ourselves in Casement.  If it's Croker then expect a big Armagh turn out and I reckon a squeak of a win.

[mountainboii]

Yes the league Div 1 & 2 finals are being played as double headers in Croke Park on Sunday 25th

Pencilled in for Croker but I fear with the Dubs not making the Div 1 final and that contest now being west dominated we could find ourselves in Casement.  If it's Croker then expect a big Armagh turn out and I reckon a squeak of a win.

Croke Park was confirmed earlier today.

[hobit hunter]

Great news!  Hadn't seen it

[illdecide]

This thread has been very Armagh dominated so far. From a Down point of view this should prove to be our toughest test yet. Armagh have undoubtedly found their form and after thrashing Donegal they should not lack confidence,  the open spaces of Croker will truely test our full back line.  The Armagh WHF left unmarked by Colgan (who will presumably sweep) will have plenty of room to run at our defence but I look forward to seeing MC thread passes through to our FF line who should flourish on this wide pitch. I expect Down to win the midfield contest and should King (who is playing great football) run out of steam, we have big Dan back in our arsenal! My 15 would be
     McVeigh
Rafferty McArdle McCartan
McKernan Colgan Garvey
  Rodgers  King
Maginn M Clarke Hughes
Lavery J Clarke B Coulter

should Paul Mc C be fit i would have him on instead of Lavery, and I would like to see Gordon and Doyler get run outs

Why do people keep going on about the "wide open spaces of Croke Park" the pitch is 145m x 90m the same as 85% of all intercounty pitches so why do people think it's bigger/wider than the rest of the pitches, Dodgy umpire not getting at you either as the commentators in the TV studio have said the same thing