The Poppy

[Gnevin]

tomorrow, 11/11, is the actual date. It's 3 weeks this Thursday since i spotted the 1st one on TV. They will soon have them up on July 13th.

Yep... the Germans actually agreed to the Armistice much earlier that Nov 11 1918 but because of a pathetic decision by the allies to have a symmetircal time and date for the official end of the war (the 11th hour of the 11th month and all that ballix) countless soldiers on both sides continued to be killed right up to 11am ... how pathetic is that.

Bollox

"The Armistice was agreed at 5 AM on 11 November, to come into effect at 11 AM Paris time (that is 10 AM GMT), for which reason the occasion is sometimes referred to as "the eleventh (hour) of the eleventh (day) of the eleventh (month)". It was the result of a hurried and desperate process."

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Armistice_with_Germany_%28Compi%C3%A8gne%29

It was agreed four years too late in my opinion.
Standing up in the name of small nations my arse.

More like two cousins knocking lumps out of each other, then when one cousin is getting his ass kicked he calls in his best friend and they end up killing the other cousin.

The first world war will be seen in history books long after we depart as a senseless unnecessary war fought by two administrations who had little or no respect for their nations.

Don't most history books already hold this believe?

[rossie mad]

tomorrow, 11/11, is the actual date. It's 3 weeks this Thursday since i spotted the 1st one on TV. They will soon have them up on July 13th.

Yep... the Germans actually agreed to the Armistice much earlier that Nov 11 1918 but because of a pathetic decision by the allies to have a symmetircal time and date for the official end of the war (the 11th hour of the 11th month and all that ballix) countless soldiers on both sides continued to be killed right up to 11am ... how pathetic is that.

Bollox

"The Armistice was agreed at 5 AM on 11 November, to come into effect at 11 AM Paris time (that is 10 AM GMT), for which reason the occasion is sometimes referred to as "the eleventh (hour) of the eleventh (day) of the eleventh (month)". It was the result of a hurried and desperate process."

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Armistice_with_Germany_%28Compi%C3%A8gne%29

It was agreed four years too late in my opinion.
Standing up in the name of small nations my arse.

More like two cousins knocking lumps out of each other, then when one cousin is getting his ass kicked he calls in his best friend and they end up killing the other cousin.

The first world war will be seen in history books long after we depart as a senseless unnecessary war fought by two administrations who had little or no respect for their nations.

Don't most history books already hold this believe?

Do you mean belief?

I cant imagine the history books in britain and germany holding this belief.
If that is the case isnt this whole rememberance situation all a farce.

[Gnevin]

tomorrow, 11/11, is the actual date. It's 3 weeks this Thursday since i spotted the 1st one on TV. They will soon have them up on July 13th.

Yep... the Germans actually agreed to the Armistice much earlier that Nov 11 1918 but because of a pathetic decision by the allies to have a symmetircal time and date for the official end of the war (the 11th hour of the 11th month and all that ballix) countless soldiers on both sides continued to be killed right up to 11am ... how pathetic is that.

Bollox

"The Armistice was agreed at 5 AM on 11 November, to come into effect at 11 AM Paris time (that is 10 AM GMT), for which reason the occasion is sometimes referred to as "the eleventh (hour) of the eleventh (day) of the eleventh (month)". It was the result of a hurried and desperate process."

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Armistice_with_Germany_%28Compi%C3%A8gne%29

It was agreed four years too late in my opinion.
Standing up in the name of small nations my arse.

More like two cousins knocking lumps out of each other, then when one cousin is getting his ass kicked he calls in his best friend and they end up killing the other cousin.

The first world war will be seen in history books long after we depart as a senseless unnecessary war fought by two administrations who had little or no respect for their nations.

Don't most history books already hold this believe?

Do you mean belief?

I cant imagine the history books in britain and germany holding this belief.
If that is the case isnt this whole rememberance situation all a farce.

Fair enough I've not read many British or any German history books.  However most documentaries I've seen on Discovery and the History channel have been of this belief. Even Churchill was of the belief that WW1 was essentially the upper classes playing toy soldiers .

I don't see how it's a farce to remember those who fought and died for what they believed at the time where legitimate reasons

[red hander]

tomorrow, 11/11, is the actual date. It's 3 weeks this Thursday since i spotted the 1st one on TV. They will soon have them up on July 13th.

Yep... the Germans actually agreed to the Armistice much earlier that Nov 11 1918 but because of a pathetic decision by the allies to have a symmetircal time and date for the official end of the war (the 11th hour of the 11th month and all that ballix) countless soldiers on both sides continued to be killed right up to 11am ... how pathetic is that.

Bollox

"The Armistice was agreed at 5 AM on 11 November, to come into effect at 11 AM Paris time (that is 10 AM GMT), for which reason the occasion is sometimes referred to as "the eleventh (hour) of the eleventh (day) of the eleventh (month)". It was the result of a hurried and desperate process."

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Armistice_with_Germany_%28Compi%C3%A8gne%29

FYI, An estimated 13,000 soldiers died on the last day of the war, how many of them would have lived had the guns fallen silent at 5am?

I see you can read the same Wiki article I did , if incorrectly "Consequently there were 10,944 casualties of which 2,738 men died on the last day of the war" . 5am on November 11th is a lot different to too " much earlier that Nov 11 1918"

Actually, I didn't read that Wiki article, incorrectly or otherwise, but thanks for posting it.

According to Joseph Persico's '11th Month, 11th Day, 11th Hour: Armistice Day 1918': "Allied leaders found outrageous excuses to send 13,000 men to their deaths against a defeated enemy."

Think I'd prefer to take the word of a noted US historian rather than Wikipedia, but then again I could have quoted him incorrectly

[Gnevin]

tomorrow, 11/11, is the actual date. It's 3 weeks this Thursday since i spotted the 1st one on TV. They will soon have them up on July 13th.

Yep... the Germans actually agreed to the Armistice much earlier that Nov 11 1918 but because of a pathetic decision by the allies to have a symmetircal time and date for the official end of the war (the 11th hour of the 11th month and all that ballix) countless soldiers on both sides continued to be killed right up to 11am ... how pathetic is that.

Bollox

"The Armistice was agreed at 5 AM on 11 November, to come into effect at 11 AM Paris time (that is 10 AM GMT), for which reason the occasion is sometimes referred to as "the eleventh (hour) of the eleventh (day) of the eleventh (month)". It was the result of a hurried and desperate process."

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Armistice_with_Germany_%28Compi%C3%A8gne%29

FYI, An estimated 13,000 soldiers died on the last day of the war, how many of them would have lived had the guns fallen silent at 5am?

I see you can read the same Wiki article I did , if incorrectly "Consequently there were 10,944 casualties of which 2,738 men died on the last day of the war" . 5am on November 11th is a lot different to too " much earlier that Nov 11 1918"

Actually, I didn't read that Wiki article, incorrectly or otherwise, but thanks for posting it.

According to Joseph Persico's '11th Month, 11th Day, 11th Hour: Armistice Day 1918': "Allied leaders found outrageous excuses to send 13,000 men to their deaths against a defeated enemy."

Think I'd prefer to take the word of a noted US historian rather than Wikipedia, but then again I could have quoted him incorrectly

Consequently there were 10,944 casualties of which 2,738 men died on the last day of the war.[4]

4=Persico, Joseph E (2004). Eleventh month, eleventh day, eleventh hour. Random House. ISBN 9780099445395.

Strange as your quote also seems to be attributed to Persico.

[rossie mad]

I would have been a big fan of history in school and would have read my fair share of history books in relation to the era from 1800 up to the start of the cold war.

I wouldnt be an expert but from my recollection a lot of the books were justifying it in some way from both sides.
I think in recent years people are beginning to question its justification and are saying what was the point.

Farce may be a bit harsh of a word but my point is if people are beginning to question to justify the first world war then the whole emotional rollercoaster of remberance maybe should be watered down.
Remember yes but dont just remember for the sake of it.
I liked the idea what happened in dublin on sunday.Remembering those who fell in a prayer service with our president leading the prayers.
It was dignified and it remebered all the dead and prayer and reflection was the main thought.

Compared to the last three weeks which in my eyes seemed to be a celebration more than a rememberance.
Also i think it was particularly hijacked this year to justify iraq and afghanistan.

Why must we justify these campaigns by projecting the blood and suffering of those in the past?

[ross4life]

Michael Ballack wearing a poppy wats going on there then

[red hander]

tomorrow, 11/11, is the actual date. It's 3 weeks this Thursday since i spotted the 1st one on TV. They will soon have them up on July 13th.

Yep... the Germans actually agreed to the Armistice much earlier that Nov 11 1918 but because of a pathetic decision by the allies to have a symmetircal time and date for the official end of the war (the 11th hour of the 11th month and all that ballix) countless soldiers on both sides continued to be killed right up to 11am ... how pathetic is that.

Bollox

"The Armistice was agreed at 5 AM on 11 November, to come into effect at 11 AM Paris time (that is 10 AM GMT), for which reason the occasion is sometimes referred to as "the eleventh (hour) of the eleventh (day) of the eleventh (month)". It was the result of a hurried and desperate process."

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Armistice_with_Germany_%28Compi%C3%A8gne%29

FYI, An estimated 13,000 soldiers died on the last day of the war, how many of them would have lived had the guns fallen silent at 5am?

I see you can read the same Wiki article I did , if incorrectly "Consequently there were 10,944 casualties of which 2,738 men died on the last day of the war" . 5am on November 11th is a lot different to too " much earlier that Nov 11 1918"

Actually, I didn't read that Wiki article, incorrectly or otherwise, but thanks for posting it.

According to Joseph Persico's '11th Month, 11th Day, 11th Hour: Armistice Day 1918': "Allied leaders found outrageous excuses to send 13,000 men to their deaths against a defeated enemy."

Think I'd prefer to take the word of a noted US historian rather than Wikipedia, but then again I could have quoted him incorrectly

Consequently there were 10,944 casualties of which 2,738 men died on the last day of the war.[4]

4=Persico, Joseph E (2004). Eleventh month, eleventh day, eleventh hour. Random House. ISBN 9780099445395.

Strange as your quote also seems to be attributed to Persico.

So, he's a schizophrenic ... what about German casualties, or don't they count? 

[Gnevin]

tomorrow, 11/11, is the actual date. It's 3 weeks this Thursday since i spotted the 1st one on TV. They will soon have them up on July 13th.

Yep... the Germans actually agreed to the Armistice much earlier that Nov 11 1918 but because of a pathetic decision by the allies to have a symmetircal time and date for the official end of the war (the 11th hour of the 11th month and all that ballix) countless soldiers on both sides continued to be killed right up to 11am ... how pathetic is that.

Bollox

"The Armistice was agreed at 5 AM on 11 November, to come into effect at 11 AM Paris time (that is 10 AM GMT), for which reason the occasion is sometimes referred to as "the eleventh (hour) of the eleventh (day) of the eleventh (month)". It was the result of a hurried and desperate process."

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Armistice_with_Germany_%28Compi%C3%A8gne%29

FYI, An estimated 13,000 soldiers died on the last day of the war, how many of them would have lived had the guns fallen silent at 5am?

I see you can read the same Wiki article I did , if incorrectly "Consequently there were 10,944 casualties of which 2,738 men died on the last day of the war" . 5am on November 11th is a lot different to too " much earlier that Nov 11 1918"

Actually, I didn't read that Wiki article, incorrectly or otherwise, but thanks for posting it.

According to Joseph Persico's '11th Month, 11th Day, 11th Hour: Armistice Day 1918': "Allied leaders found outrageous excuses to send 13,000 men to their deaths against a defeated enemy."

Think I'd prefer to take the word of a noted US historian rather than Wikipedia, but then again I could have quoted him incorrectly

Consequently there were 10,944 casualties of which 2,738 men died on the last day of the war.[4]

4=Persico, Joseph E (2004). Eleventh month, eleventh day, eleventh hour. Random House. ISBN 9780099445395.

Strange as your quote also seems to be attributed to Persico.

So, he's a schizophrenic ... what about German casualties, or don't they count?

I think the quote you gave is a misquote which confuses deaths and casualties

http://www.amazon.com/Eleventh-Month-Day-Hour-Armistice/dp/0375760458/ref=ntt_at_ep_dpi_3

Seems to support the 2,738 German and British deaths

[randomtask]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YW24N1G0WIk&feature=topvideos

what does yous make of that. not giving any opinion on the matter just think would be interesting to discuss

[Aerlik]

 

Folks, ffs stop citing Wikipedia as your reference.  It is widely accepted in the academic world as an unreliable source of information.  By all means read it, then...look for the references cited on the subject and click on those links to try to confirm with more substantial PROOF.

The very fact that any Joe Soap can go in and edit an article says it all.

If any of you are at university and are presenting an article from Wikipedia as a reference, I would fail you immediately no matter how good your work.

Rememberance Day today in Oz.  They are sticking to the original script, ie, commemorating all the dead of both world wars, but it always takes a dumbfcuk presenter to muck things up; one clown commented that they were also remembering the soldiers who are (and I paraphrase) fighting for our (sic) freedom (sic).  FFS, Aus is a free country - it has been sucked into a war through the lies of its former PM and his war criminal cohort, shrub.

[Cúig huaire]

Homes under the hammer was only on for half an hour this morning, I am writing to the BBC to complain, who do they think they are, disrupting my mornings viewing because the Queen is going to mass.
In saying that I got to see Jeremy Kyle on TV3.

[Gnevin]

Folks, ffs stop citing Wikipedia as your reference.  It is widely accepted in the academic world as an unreliable source of information.  By all means read it, then...look for the references cited on the subject and click on those links to try to confirm with more substantial PROOF.

The very fact that any Joe Soap can go in and edit an article says it all.

Incorrect, you just have to be a little more careful the edit your reading hasn't been vandalized and make sure anything you quote is referenced .

http://news.cnet.com/Study-Wikipedia-as-accurate-as-Britannica/2100-1038_3-5997332.html

[delboy]

Folks, ffs stop citing Wikipedia as your reference.  It is widely accepted in the academic world as an unreliable source of information.  By all means read it, then...look for the references cited on the subject and click on those links to try to confirm with more substantial PROOF.

The very fact that any Joe Soap can go in and edit an article says it all.

Incorrect, you just have to be a little more careful the edit your reading hasn't been vandalized and make sure anything you quote is referenced .

http://news.cnet.com/Study-Wikipedia-as-accurate-as-Britannica/2100-1038_3-5997332.html

+1, it used to be laughable at the start but its come on leaps and bounds in the last few years, and a lot of the info placed on it is actually coming from academics.
The only real problem i would have with wiki, is that it automatically narrows the field to whats on the entry, whilst its nearly always correct, it leaves out so much background detail that can only be got by doing some proper research.

[Declan]

Anyone participate in the minutes silence this morning at 11am?