AISF Aug 23rd Tyrone v Cork

[AZOffaly]

Maybe it's terminology. You are attempting (Zulu) to but a very definitive, scientific, meaning to peaking. Maybe peaking is the wrong word, maybe it's momentum, improvement etc. All I know is that Kerry playing Limerick in the first round of the championship is not the same level of fitness, aggression, or sharpness (in thought or deed) as will be the case if they played Dublin in August, for example.

Peaking implies that you cannot go any further, as you say, so peaking is a slight misnomer.

[tbrick18]

Tyrone are still going to be a good team, but It's hard to see them winning another AI soon. Their leaders were all taken off yesterday, Dooher, McGinley, Gormley and we've probably seen the best of them. I think probably the only possible retirements will be Dooher and McGinley but even at that I think that it will be impossible to replace them in the short term. Ulster will be wide open next year....but Cork could well be the new dynasty in footballing terms.

Cork were brilliant yesterday, Tyrone were terrible.  Beat by 5 points was it?  Hardly a mauling.  I can't understand how people come out and fire names off randomly regarding retirements etc.  Sure Colm Cooper should have retired before the Dublin game too should he have not?  I think Dooher will call it quits and Collie Holmes, but the majority of the rest will stay.  Enda McGinley is a brilliant athlete and footballer, and has only came back from a bad injury and as a result doesn't have his best game - hardly a call for retirement expecially considering his age and previous.  Tyrone would have been a different animal yesterday if McGinley and Sean Cavanagh had been 100%, but they weren;t and Tyrone were beaten by the better team on the day.  I don't see how Cork will start a footballing dynasty either, their key players are getting on a bit and its not like they have dominated underage football.  I hope Mickey Harte stays on but he needs to freshen things up personnel wise.  The only comment anyone would have against Harte is that he appears to be too reluctant to bring new players through instead of relying on players he has had faith in for years.  There is lots of talent within the county and there has been multiple All Ireland Minor, Hogan Cup, Vocational Schools winning sides that have produced top class players.

I think you misunderstood a bit about the retirements. I was trying to highlight that there wont be retirements and that possilbly the only players to retire would be Dooher and McGinley. I'm not saying they should or have to, just that IMO these are the only players who might possiby retire. So dont get your knickers in a twist!

As for Cork with nothing coming through....they have been in 4 of the last 6 all irelan U21 finals. They must have something coming through.

[timmykelleher]

As for Cork with nothing coming through....they have been in 4 of the last 6 all irelan U21 finals. They must have something coming through.

Agreed.
Given that we won the Junior All-Ireland against Roscommon this weekend and CIT won the Sigerson with 13 Cork men playing we should be able to field a team again next year 

[longrunsthefox]

Is a fair bit of influence on the Cork supporters listening to different groups of them singing songs... "now you better believe us we're goin to win the cup." ... heard a fellow at half time giving out about the sending off saying, 'there was no guarantee he would have got through to score anyway."  wat the f**!...    was like Dublin supporters booing last year when the other team didn't kick the ball out of play when they had a man injured.

[DuffleKing]

eh, the tyrone fans were booing too while gormley was down yesterday and play went on...

[longrunsthefox]

we like our soccer too 

[lynchbhoy]

I'm not picking holes JM and I wasn't highlighting a typo (apologise if that's how it came across) but I am trying to show that peaking is a myth and one of the ways I'm doing this is by asking people to define peaking. You can't achieve something unless you what it is and you, like everyone else, are unable to define what you mean by peaking. I mean how can a coach get 15 players and whatever subs are used to produce their best on a given day? I train teams to reach certain standards but sometimes they never reach it, i never set out to reach a 'peak' because I can't define it and I will never reach it.

don know about definitions but getting 15 men to play as well together as they possibly can for a number of games in  row is difficult.
Cohesion and contnuity will be at a maximum after a couple of outings but then soon after this the invariable injuries and individuals loss of form can hit the starting or best 15.

my example would be Kerry.
Their starting (prob not best) 15 lined out v Cork and looked unfit.
While playing fairly rubbish against sligo and longford, they didnt have what most would deem as their best 15 out. Since then they have put stronger starting sides out and their form is improving and maybe peaked v Dublin?
That is what meath are hoping anyhow !

[tyronefan]

Well done Cork, they were clearly the better side yesterday and were a pleasure to watch. Played great football and hopefully can go on now to win the final.

If they play against Kerry/Meath the way they played against us they will have no problem.

Good luck in the final

[longrunsthefox]

the predictable goading from kerry 'supporters' apart, I aren't that annoyed about yesterday's defeat. This team has taken us on a fantastic journey and gave us days we only dreamt of before 2003. Also is a good Cork team and hope they win the final.   

[talktothehand]

good luck to cork. thoroughly deserved that win yesterday. some of our big names didn't turn up. good luck in the final the rebels!

[EC Unique]

Fair play to Cork and their supporters. I wish them all the best in the Final and they are well capable of beating Kerry. Their hunger and speed is what won for them yesterday. They need to work on their shooting with the amount of easy scores missed yesterday.

As for Tyrone, I am very disappointed to be out of the Championship as I think we did nor perform to the best of our ability. Players were making very basic errors not typical of this team. Simple kick passes going wrong and good scoring chances not being taken. Tactically I think the extra man could have been used better. The loss of Sean can not be overstated. It was massive and I think if fit he would have made a huge difference.

Enough said about Bannon already. He did not influence the result but certainly influenced the quality of the game.

Armagh fans that cheered and flagged every Cork score should be ashamed of themselves. Any Tyrone supporters near me yesterday were totally behind Armagh minors but I will certainly be supporting the Down lads from here on.

[Estimator]

Fair play to Cork and their supporters. I wish them all the best in the Final and they are well capable of beating Kerry. Their hunger and speed is what won for them yesterday. They need to work on their shooting with the amount of easy scores missed yesterday.

As for Tyrone, I am very disappointed to be out of the Championship as I think we did nor perform to the best of our ability. Players were making very basic errors not typical of this team. Simple kick passes going wrong and good scoring chances not being taken. Tactically I think the extra man could have been used better. The loss of Sean can not be overstated. It was massive and I think if fit he would have made a huge difference.

Enough said about Bannon already. He did not influence the result but certainly influenced the quality of the game.

Armagh fans that cheered and flagged every Cork score should be ashamed of themselves. Any Tyrone supporters near me yesterday were totally behind Armagh minors but I will certainly be supporting the Down lads from here on.

Why?

[EC Unique]

Fair play to Cork and their supporters. I wish them all the best in the Final and they are well capable of beating Kerry. Their hunger and speed is what won for them yesterday. They need to work on their shooting with the amount of easy scores missed yesterday.

As for Tyrone, I am very disappointed to be out of the Championship as I think we did nor perform to the best of our ability. Players were making very basic errors not typical of this team. Simple kick passes going wrong and good scoring chances not being taken. Tactically I think the extra man could have been used better. The loss of Sean can not be overstated. It was massive and I think if fit he would have made a huge difference.

Enough said about Bannon already. He did not influence the result but certainly influenced the quality of the game.

Armagh fans that cheered and flagged every Cork score should be ashamed of themselves. Any Tyrone supporters near me yesterday were totally behind Armagh minors but I will certainly be supporting the Down lads from here on.

Why?

Would have thought the traditional Gael would support the team from the same province?

[Estimator]

Fair play to Cork and their supporters. I wish them all the best in the Final and they are well capable of beating Kerry. Their hunger and speed is what won for them yesterday. They need to work on their shooting with the amount of easy scores missed yesterday.

As for Tyrone, I am very disappointed to be out of the Championship as I think we did nor perform to the best of our ability. Players were making very basic errors not typical of this team. Simple kick passes going wrong and good scoring chances not being taken. Tactically I think the extra man could have been used better. The loss of Sean can not be overstated. It was massive and I think if fit he would have made a huge difference.

Enough said about Bannon already. He did not influence the result but certainly influenced the quality of the game.

Armagh fans that cheered and flagged every Cork score should be ashamed of themselves. Any Tyrone supporters near me yesterday were totally behind Armagh minors but I will certainly be supporting the Down lads from here on.

Why?

Would have thought the traditional Gael would support the team from the same province?

In my experience this rarely happens.  I'm sure the Cork fans weren't supporting Kerry in the minors.

[Zulu]

I did define it.

With respect JM you didn't.

Your job as a coach is to make sure they can perform in the top 10% - 15% of their current potential.

How do you know what their potential is and how as a coach do you get 30 players of varying potentials to peak together?

To increase the '10' you have to overload which means they would be in periods where they are not near their 'peak' but they are improving it.

That is peaking to me.

That's training, not peaking.

All I know is that Kerry playing Limerick in the first round of the championship is not the same level of fitness, aggression, or sharpness (in thought or deed) as will be the case if they played Dublin in August, for example.

Again that's just the training process, for example if I'm running a marathon in September and I start training in January I won't be as fit in April as I will be in September but I can't guarantee that I wouldn't have run a better tim if I ran the race in August rather than September. In other words I can prepare myself to run a good race in or around September but I can't do anything to ensure that I will run my absolute best on the day of the race.

don know about definitions but getting 15 men to play as well together as they possibly can for a number of games in  row is difficult.
Cohesion and contnuity will be at a maximum after a couple of outings but then soon after this the invariable injuries and individuals loss of form can hit the starting or best 15.

my example would be Kerry.
Their starting (prob not best) 15 lined out v Cork and looked unfit.
While playing fairly rubbish against sligo and longford, they didnt have what most would deem as their best 15 out. Since then they have put stronger starting sides out and their form is improving and maybe peaked v Dublin?
That is what meath are hoping anyhow !

Kerry might not reach the standard of the Dublin game again this year but it isn't because of their training program that they 'peaked' that day. All I'm saying is as a coach you can't get 30 individuals to 'peak' on a given day, so it isn't a goal you should set yourself.