Messages

[problem is orangeman, we should've beaten Armagh too!!]

Sammymaguire said:

problem is orangeman, we should've beaten Armagh too!! 

How did you come to this conclusion? Fermanagh played Armagh twice and failed to beat them on either occasion. Armagh threw away an eight point lead in the first game and won the second by six points. They were thoroughly deserving winners. Armagh have only lost three times in the Ulster Championship in the last ten years. A lot of teams may claim that they should've  beaten them, but very few actually do. 

In reply to Corn:

My last message referred solely to Uladh's previous post - I quoted from his post. I wasn't referring to any of his other posts, I was referring to this one. My whole message referred to this post from Uladh.

You then tell me to go and read his other posts. But I wasn't talking about them, I was dealing solely with the comments he made in his last post. You then, after making no specific reference to the points I have made, order me for my homework to "Read the posts properly before going on a rant". Could you point out where I've gone "on a rant" and which points I have made that are inaccurate?     

[Quote from Crossfire: "Most knowledgeable football followers were aware this past couple of years that he was a good footballer and genuine county material".Correct.Stephen Kernan proved himself as an excellent footballer during Armagh's U21 success in 2004. It is no surprise that he is now shining in the senior jersey. For all players it takes a while to progress from U21 to senior.]

I said:

Quote from Crossfire: "Most knowledgeable football followers were aware this past couple of years that he was a good footballer and genuine county material".

Correct.

Stephen Kernan proved himself as an excellent footballer during Armagh's U21 success in 2004. It is no surprise that he is now shining in the senior jersey. For all players it takes a while to progress from U21 to senior.

Uladh replied to this by saying:

I have no problem with that. what i did have a problem was him geting the opportunity to fast track his progress before equally talented footballers and in front of players who were already at levels above him.

You say you have no problem with the claim that Stephen was an excellent footballer at U21 level and with the claim that he is now shining in the Armagh jersey. But you have a problem that he got "the opportunity to fast track his progress before equally talented footballers and in front of players who were already at levels above him".

So you claim that there are "equally talented footballers" who didn't get the opportunity Stephen received. Stephen Kernan has scored 1 goal and five points in the two championship matches played this season. He is our top scorer from play – this is a huge achievement seeing that our team also includes Ronan Clarke and Stephen McDonnell. He was named man – of – the – match in The Irish News for Sunday's performance and has been warmly praised by media pundits. He has also been warmly praised by his colleagues – for example Ronan Clarke has heaped praise on him during post – match interviews. He was instrumental in the 2004 U21 success and highly regarded by manager peter Rafferty.

Yet you say that there are a number of "equally talented footballers" who should have had their chance before him. If that is the case, then Armagh must have a number of other players out there who could also give man – of – the – match performances, score a goal and five over two championship games, receive universal praise among media pundits and be instrumental to our success. How come Peter McDonnell doesn't know about them? How come he doesn't play them? Why are these "equally talented footballers" being hidden away somewhere and not getting their chance?

The reality is if any footballer in Armagh is "equally talented" to Stephen Kernan then he's one hell of a footballer. Stephen Kernan oozes class and it is a joy to watch him in the orange jersey. A man of this ability deserved every chance he got to make progress and Armagh fans should be eternally grateful that he was given these chances. The people who gave Stephen his chances knew he was a player of great potential and he has proved them 100% correct.

Quote from Crossfire: "Most knowledgeable football followers were aware this past couple of years that he was a good footballer and genuine county material".

Correct.

Stephen Kernan proved himself as an excellent footballer during Armagh's U21 success in 2004. It is no surprise that he is now shining in the senior jersey. For all players it takes a while to progress from U21 to senior. Stephen is a wonderful footballer who is a pleasure to watch with his accurate score taking and selling dummies to opponents to create space for himself. He is the master of selling a dummy in crowded areas to send his opponent the wrong way. Like his father Joe before him he wears the orange jersey with distinction.

Quote from: Over the Bar on June 30, 2008, 01:35:07 PM

"Was it true that either John or Tony McEntee was dropped in that game over an insult shouted about Stephen Kernan in a Cross game?   Apparently Joe overheard it and dropped him.  Anyone know if this was a fact?"

Of course its NOT TRUE. Tony McEntee played the entire game against Fermanagh and John didn't play any county football in the 2004 season because he was recovering from surgery. John hadn't played in any of the Ulster Championship games in 2004 because he was just after his surgery. So, to suggest he was "dropped" is nonsense. To suggest Tony was "dropped" is even greater nonsense seeing that he played the whole game against Fermanagh.

[I don't think we have anything to fear]

Quote from Wanderer:

"I don't want to jinx anything but I don't think we have anything to fear, Fermanagh are better and Armagh are worse than prevous years".

Armagh have won six of the last nine Ulsters. They have played in six Ulster Finals since 1999 and won them all. Fermanagh, on the other hand, have never won Ulster and are appearing in their first Ulster Final since 1982. Yet, you dismiss Armagh by saying "I don't think we have anything to fear". I realise that its possible that Fermanagh can win this game, but I think you are  dismissing Armagh far too lightly.

[How do you know? For a start, he seems to have little understanding of modern concepts of attacking and no understanding of how modern defensive systems operate".]

In reply to Uladh's reply to my post: Uladh said: "How do you know? For a start, he seems to have little understanding of modern concepts of attacking and no understanding of how modern defensive systems operate".

I know because I listen to him on TV and have also read what he writes. His TV comments and newspaper articles show that he has a very clear understanding of the tactics in gaelic football. He is very astute in his assessment of games.

To say that "he seems to have little understanding of modern concepts of attacking and no understanding of how modern defensive systems operate", is not true at all. In fact the exact opposite is true. I can't see how you could conclude this from listening to him on TV or reading what he writes.

For example, when speaking about Armagh on Sunday, he made the very simple and correct observation that its in their best interests to give Clarke and McDonnell as easy a ball as possible. This is pure common sense. Steven McDonnell scored four points from play on Sunday - three of them were when he got an easy ball played to him. On two occasions in the first half, Ronan Clarke got a ball where he was cornered by two or more players. In both cases, Ronan's shots were blocked. The passes he got were good passes, but he was still in a position where he had no space and it was very difficult to score. McHugh, talking about one of these situations that Clarke found himself in, observed that it was difficult for Clarke to score in this situation.

When Tyrone won their All - Irelands they created loads of space for their finisher, who may have been Canavan or O'Neill. Regularly Tyrone fisted over simple points. Kerry create space and simple chances for Cooper to finish. When Armagh do this, McDonnell, Clarke and McConville also finish off the move with ease. For example Martin O'Rourke soloed through twice on Sunday and fisted a pass to McDonnell who scored easily on both occasions.

Martin McHugh is not saying that Armagh shouldn't play the long diagonal ball. He's saying they should take the right option ie., sometimes long diagonal ball is the right option, but sometimes the running game is the right option. His advice is simple, straightforward and common sense.

Martin McHugh knows gaelic football inside out. He is a superb tactition, very passionate about the game and knows the strengths and weaknesses of individual players. His record as a manager and player speaks for itself.

If he was managing a good set of players in any county, success would be virtually guaranteed. He has a very common sense approach and great enthusiasm for the game. But most of all he knows how to successfully plan tactics for individual games and to make astute switches at the right times. He would be a success as a manager wherever he goes as long as the players had sufficient talent.

Martin McHugh's comments about Armagh yesterday were spot on. I've been watching this Armagh team since 1999 and he made very valid comments.

Armagh continually put difficult ball into Clarke and McDonnell who then have to fight for it and try and score from difficult situations. Plus they have to put so much effort into winning the ball and fighting off three or four men, it saps their energy. McHugh was making the excellent point that they should be trying to give Clarke and McDonnell easier ball to make it easier for them. This has been obvious for many years. If Armagh ran more at teams and opened up defences and laid off handy passes to McDonnell and Clarke in space, they would get more handy scores and handy frees. instead they play balls out to the corner flag to McDonnell, who then has to try to work a score.  

McHugh was simply saying Armagh should play the running game more and give handy passes to McDonnell and Clarke. He also correctly pointed out that by dropping Martin O'Rourke back, it allowed Cavan to play an extra man as a sweeper at the back to double team McDonnell.

If armagh played the running game more, as McHugh correctly suggested, they would draw defenders out to meet the runner and the ball could then be hand passed to Clarke or McDonnell in space. Also Paddy McKeever and Martin O'Rourke could get forward and get more scores and frees.

McHugh's points about Armagh yesterday were 100% correct and, if they were taken on board, Armagh would be hard to stop.  Martin McHugh is a great analyst.    

Orangeman said: "Did anybody read the suggestion in the papers yesterday about the proposed new format for the football championship ? It proposed giving the provincial winners another chance if they're beat in the quarter final - Like this year, the four provincial winners would play each other - the winners go straight into the semi finals and the losers would get another game against the qualifier winners to progress to the semis ? What do you think ?"

This is an excellent idea. It would be much fairer for two reasons: Firstly the provincial winners would get another chance and secondly only two teams would come through from the qualifier side of the draw.

The way it is at present, with four teams coming through from the qualifiers, there is too much advantage for teams who are in the qualifier side. With this system as suggested, the advantage would swing back to the provincial winners and would make winning your province more desirable. By allowing four teams through from the qualifier side, things are made too easy at present for teams in the back door.

No team should have to play on consecutive weeks. This idea of playing one match in each province per week is the root of the whole problem. In Ulster, for example, they should play at least two games in the championship each Sunday and the whole provincial championships would be run off much quicker. This would free up more time to avoid the pile - up in fixtures which comes later in the summer.   

The Provincial championships should be run off much quicker, so that there's a lot more free Sundays so that no team ends up playing on consecutive weeks.
 

The eras of the two Brians and Joe have been by far the most successful in Armagh's history. We hadn't played in the championship in Croke Park since 1982 until the Brians brought us there in 1999. We've practically lived there since.

Armagh people should be forever grateful to Brian McAlinden, Brian Canavan and Joe Kernan for the outstanding service they have given to the County, both as players and management.

Its a sad day to see Joe depart. He brought us such joy in 2002 and it was such a great achievement to get us back to the final in 2003 despite so many injuries. It was also a tremendous achievement to keep this team at the top table for so long. How many supporters would have expected in 2002 that this team would still be challenging strongly for the All - Ireland in 2006? How many would have thought we'd be back in the final in 2003 and then win three Ulster titles in a row, including the first from the preliminary round in sixty years? From 2002 - 2006, Armagh only lost one Ulster championship match under Joe. This occurred at a time when Ulster was never more competitive.

Well done to the two Brians for starting it all off and for bringing such wonderful success and well done Joe for putting the icing on the cake and for keeping us at the top for so long. The three of you have given us so many great days out and have made Armagh a football county to be respected the length and breadth of Ireland.   

Re Armamike's comment "It's always been a bit of a sore point with me that the 2 Brians never really got the recognition they deserved for putting together the blueprint of the team that went on to success at all-ireland level".

Absolutely spot on. The 2 Brians deserve huge praise. They built the team, instilled discipline and laid excellent foundations. Your comment that if Clarke had been around in 2000, then that may have been all that was needed, is also spot on.

In 2000, Armagh were one point ahead in the All Ireland semi final with time up and Kerry were awarded a free. Maurice Fitzgerald put it over.

In 2002, Armagh were one point ahead in The All Ireland semi final with time up and Dublin were awarded a free. Ray Cosgrove missed.

If Maurice Fitz had missed and Cosgrove scored, who knows? Brian Canavan and Brian McAlinden deserve nothing only praise. Without them, we may never have had so many great days out in Croke Park. 

It is difficult to understand the criticism of Stephen Kernan. He scored two excellent points yesterday. For the first point, he created loads of space for himself by sidestepping the Derry defender. The problem for Armagh was that they couldn't get enough space to shoot, so any player like Stephen who can create space like this is certainly worth his place on the team. The second point was also a great effort from distance.

Armagh only scored nine points in total and Stephen scored two of the best of them, so what's the problem? He is only a new member of the championship team, so what do people expect from him ? Do they expect him to score five or six points? This year Armagh have needed scoring forwards, but when a fellah like Stephen comes along and scores a few great points, some supporters slag him off. He plays in the half forward line so two points in a game is a very good return from a half forward.

Supporters are meant to get behind the team and management. If everyone roared Stephen on and encouraged him and built up his confidence, I'm certain that he would score even more. Remember he comes from very good stock, his father was a superb forward and Aaron is also excellent. Stephen was brilliant during the Under 21 All Ireland and Peter Rafferty had great faith in him.

And anyway, he's obviously made of stern stuff because despite the criticism he has received he proved his doubters wrong with two great scores yesterday. Fair play to you Stephen.   

It is difficult to understand the criticism of Stephen Kernan. He scored two excellent points yesterday. For the first point, he created loads of space for himself by sidestepping the Derry defender. The problem for Armagh was that they couldn't get enough space to shoot, so any player like Stephen who can create space like this is certainly worth his place on the team. The second point was also a great effort from distance.

Armagh only scored nine points in total and Stephen scored two of the best of them, so what's the problem? He is only a new member of the championship team, so what do people expect from him ? Do they expect him to score five or six points? This year Armagh have needed scoring forwards, but when a fellah like Stephen comes along and scores a few great points, some supporters slag him off. He plays in the half forward line so two points in a game is a very good return from a half forward.

Supporters are meant to get behind the team and management. If everyone roared Stephen on and encouraged him and built up his confidence, I'm certain that he would score even more. Remember he comes from very good stock, his father was a superb forward and Aaron is also excellent. Stephen was brilliant during the Under 21 All Ireland and Peter Rafferty had great faith in him.

And anyway, he's obviously made of stern stuff because he's stood up against any of the criticism which he has received and proved his doubters wrong with two great scores yesterday. Fair play to you Stephen.   

It is difficult to understand the criticism of Stephen Kernan. He scored two excellent points yesterday. For the first point, he created loads of space for himself by sidestepping the Derry defender. The problem for Armagh was that they couldn't get enough space to shoot, so any player like Stephen who can create space like this is certainly worth his place on the team. The second point was also a great effort from distance.

Armagh only scored nine points in total and Stephen scored two of the best of them, so what's the problem? He is only a new member of the championship team, so what do people expect from him ? Do they expect him to score five or six points? This year Armagh have needed scoring forwards, but when a fellah like Stephen comes along and scores a few great points, some supporters slag him off. He plays in the half forward line so two points in a game is a very good return from a half forward.

Supporters are meant to get behind the team and management. If everyone roared Stephen on and encouraged him and built up his confidence, I'm certain that he would score even more. Remember he comes from very good stock, his father was a superb forward and Aaron is also excellent. Stephen was brilliant during the Under 21 All Ireland and Peter Rafferty had great faith in him.

And anyway, he's obviously made of stern stuff because he's stood up against any of the abuse which he has received and proved his doubters wrong with two great scores yesterday. Fair play to you Stephen.