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Original post:

Quote
Boycott The International Rules Series

This year, and from now on, I for one will be boycotting the International Rules series totally. The Idea (or moment of clarity if you will) occurred to me while watching the minor All-Ireland finals this year.  We are completely playing into the hands of the Aussies and their poachers by supporting and promoting this series. Its crazy when you think about it.

The International Rules U-17 development panel is nothing but a team of potential young players to be stolen from our game. Pearse Hanley won the Ron Barassi medal as the best player of the 2006 U-17 International Rules for Ireland against Australia. Now, instead of shining for his county he is in Oz playing Aussie Rules for Brisbane Lions. Martin Clarke from Down, Armagh's Kevin Dyas, and Cork's Michael Shields have all taken up contracts as of late. I know that a lot of other counties have lost players too.

It seems to me the whole series was set up as a catchment net, where Ireland show off their best young talent to our Aussie counterparts. I cant think of any other legitimate reason for this hybrid game. What is the point of it?? So the Aussies can embarrass us again?? All we are doing is putting ideas in young lads heads, promoting Aussie Rules and letting the Aussies see the best we have to offer. We are being played as fools. The wool has being pulled over our eyes for long enough and its time that the whole thing was boycotted for good. It's a shite game anyway IMO.

Above was my original gripe but I think it was in vein as the development squads have now stopped.

But it seems Nicky Brennan agreed with me about showcasing our young talent.
http://www.news.com.au/heraldsun/story/0,21985,22617052-11088,00.html

Anyway im still not supporting it.
I dont want to see our senior players getting humiliated/hurt again after that debacle 16 months ago

Point of order, but

QuoteCork's Michael Shields have all taken up contracts as of late

is actually back in the country, and played for Cork against Kerry in the AISF.

Not disagreeing with the gist of your post though.

I've no intention of watching the bastardised game, but wouldn't call it a boycott.

I used to be all for it, giving our game an international aspect etc. but since we lost some of our finest talents I have turned full circle on it.

A small suggestion: Abandon the so-called International Rules series each Autumn and organise instead a Community Shield-type event for Croke Park on a single Sunday each October, with the All Ireland senior champions iin each code playing the corresponding national league Division 1 winners.

It would be a nice outing for youngsters and others who didn't get tickets to see their teams win the All Irelands and, if marketed properly, could be a sell-out.

AFAIK there is no longer under age games.

To be picked in the ireland squad it is most likely that you are at the top of the gaa game. By this stage you are gonna be too old for the aussies to have a keen interest in you.

Quote from: fred the red on September 29, 2008, 03:57:48 PM
AFAIK there is no longer under age games.

To be picked in the ireland squad it is most likely that you are at the top of the gaa game. By this stage you are gonna be too old for the aussies to have a keen interest in you.

Dessie Mone is at least 24

Quote from: ziggysego on September 29, 2008, 02:40:10 PM
I've no intention of watching the bastardised game, but wouldn't call it a boycott.

I bet you any money, you will have a wee sneaky look to see how the tyrone fellas got on and is everyone still in one piece

I enjoyed the first few series since it was restarted (quite possibly because we were winning!). I thought it gave our players an opportunity to represent their country, which they would not have otherwise.
But the approach taken by the Aussies in the past couple of series has completely changed my mind. I was at the last test in Croke Park and never witnessed such a poor 'sporting' spectacle. The Aussies just decided they were going to assault the physically weaker Irish side - there was no sport involved.
Even when played with good intentions, it's not a patch on Gaelic football anyway. I won't be attending it the next time it's in Ireland (if it survivies past this year's series).

Whatever about the senior series, there is NO merit to the U-17 series. It really is a scouting opportunity for the ALF and should be scrapped immediately. How the GAA haven't insisted on that before now is beyond me.
Edit: Just saw fred the red's comment re the under-age and hope that's true.

Quote from: thebandit on September 29, 2008, 03:59:44 PM

Quote from: fred the red on September 29, 2008, 03:57:48 PM
AFAIK there is no longer under age games.

To be picked in the ireland squad it is most likely that you are at the top of the gaa game. By this stage you are gonna be too old for the aussies to have a keen interest in you.

Dessie Mone is at least 24

And going nowhere. Like I said before, that recruitment camp in Mayo was just a PR stunt.

Quote from: Onion Bag on September 29, 2008, 04:00:43 PM

Quote from: ziggysego on September 29, 2008, 02:40:10 PM
I've no intention of watching the bastardised game, but wouldn't call it a boycott.

I bet you any money, you will have a wee sneaky look to see how the tyrone fellas got on and is everyone still in one piece

Well just to ensure the safety of our men ;)

out of interest how did tadgh kennelly get spotted by the swans?

i would say that the majority of us on here will be watching it if ireland have a chance of winning and the games are played in better spirit than the last time.

The series is the best thing that can happen. PR stunt or not Nixon has shown that they will easily come over and scout. He now has six clubs on his side. If communication breaks down between the GAA and the AFL it could turn into a poaching session.

Bollix - I think they see us as their amateur league at the moment. 

QuoteThe series is the best thing that can happen. PR stunt or not Nixon has shown that they will easily come over and scout. He now has six clubs on his side. If communication breaks down between the GAA and the AFL it could turn into a poaching session.

Not sure about that. It doesn't seem to me that they give a shite what the GAA/county boards/clubs want anyway. It's not like it stopped them making offers to Pearse Hanley, Kyle Coney, Sean Kavanagh, Marty Clarke or any of the others who have been offered contracts.
What will change if IR is scrapped?

(http://anacarlo.files.wordpress.com/2008/04/father-ted-careful-now.jpg)

Why boycott the series?
Do you seriously think if the series is boycotted the AFL are going to say they arent going to offer any more contracts to players??

Think we need to move into the real world & understand the AFL are going to offer contracts no matter what.

IMHO, the reason there are more offers nowadays is that the GAA has is so professional in its approach.
By developing the talented players earlier we are doing a lot of the groundwork for the Aussies & the Aussies realise they wont have to develop players as much as they had to in the past.
For eg, how many counties now have under 15 development squads?

Quote from: corn02 on September 29, 2008, 04:15:32 PM
The series is the best thing that can happen. PR stunt or not Nixon has shown that they will easily come over and scout. He now has six clubs on his side. If communication breaks down between the GAA and the AFL it could turn into a poaching session.

No I cant agree with that. I dont know how you can call it the best thing that can happen when its obvious that its simply a scouting fest for the Aussies.
At least if the series was banished they wouldnt find players as easy as us setting up development squads and simply telling them who our best young talent is, and which players are suited to THEIR game. When you think of it its outrageous.

Maybe spend the money on sending a few Senior Clubs/Counties on tour of the states and Oz for 2 weeks during the winter to let people abroad have the chance to see our top players in action, and give the opportunity to players to travel. No need for this "hybrid" game that lets Aussies feast on young players. The International Rules squad usually only picks the bigger, stronger players and has little to do with skill.

If we had our best clubs on tour, say Senior Club Finalists, as well as All Ireland Finalists and our All Stars, all on a tour it would give our most skilled players a proper reward that someone aiming for the International Rules panel would receive. It would also offer skilled players something to aim for and instead of wishing they were big and tall enough to play International Rules/Aussie Rules they might aim to play and bring their team to Croke Park on St Patrick's day or the third Sunday in September with the incentive of a tour to the States and maybe Oz for 2 weeks in November for their team. Its just a thought.

Quote from: full back on September 29, 2008, 04:33:05 PM
By developing the talented players earlier we are doing a lot of the groundwork for the Aussies & the Aussies realise they wont have to develop players as much as they had to in the past.
For eg, how many counties now have under 15 development squads?

It seems to me that the Aussies pick players based on size and physique as well as skill. Thats why I wont support a game that simply advertisers GAA players that are suited to their game. The whole thing isnt even about advertising our skills and our game.

Regarding your remark on youth development squads, I am totally against the idea also, but another story!  ;)


Edit:
I have a statistic that proves that only one player made it in Mayo from a Mayo U-16 Development Squad to the county U-21 panel a couple of years ago. That player still has not played Senior for Mayo (I think, but I need to research that one). Young lads getting a county jersey at 15-16 years old spoils them and they think they have made it. I have seen the same thing in the past with young players in my club getting a Senior club jersey at 17 and have not been seen since. But this is off topic! Rant over!

I was talking (drinking pints) with a former star of Coronation Street on Saturday night and this came up - he loves watching the games

Nonsense to talk about a boycott. If you don't want to watch it fair enough but don't try to make those of us who enjoy the game feel as though we are somehow harming the GAA.

I think its an enjoyable sport to watch and gives GAA players a chance to represent their countries as well as securing large attendance and further exposure for the GAA at an otherwise quiet time of the year on the intercounty scene. Of course we don't want to see players lost to the AFL but its not as though they'll forget where Ireland is if we cancel the series. The existence of the series does at least give us some leverage in discussions with the AFL itself.

Quote from: TacadoirArdMhacha on September 29, 2008, 04:58:40 PM
Nonsense to talk about a boycott. If you don't want to watch it fair enough but don't try to make those of us who enjoy the game feel as though we are somehow harming the GAA.

I think its an enjoyable sport to watch and gives GAA players a chance to represent their countries as well as securing large attendance and further exposure for the GAA at an otherwise quiet time of the year on the intercounty scene. Of course we don't want to see players lost to the AFL but its not as though they'll forget where Ireland is if we cancel the series. The existence of the series does at least give us some leverage in discussions with the AFL itself.

No body is under duress and im not asking anybody do anything. I changed the title of the thread so as to not to appear to be asking for anything.

Simply raising an argument and a question. Im maintaining that we are promoting their game more than its promoting ours.

I dont see any Aussie travellers, holidays makers, or Australian people here for a year or two by choice, picking up an O Neills.  ::)

Quote from: Gabriel_Hurl on September 29, 2008, 04:57:53 PM
I was talking (drinking pints) with a former star of Coronation Street on Saturday night and this came up - he loves watching the games

Who?

Quote from: TacadoirArdMhacha on September 29, 2008, 04:58:40 PM
Nonsense to talk about a boycott. If you don't want to watch it fair enough but don't try to make those of us who enjoy the game feel as though we are somehow harming the GAA.

I think its an enjoyable sport to watch and gives GAA players a chance to represent their countries as well as securing large attendance and further exposure for the GAA at an otherwise quiet time of the year on the intercounty scene. Of course we don't want to see players lost to the AFL but its not as though they'll forget where Ireland is if we cancel the series. The existence of the series does at least give us some leverage in discussions with the AFL itself.

But is it really though? I think it's actually quite boring now. It was good to watch when it was originally resurrected in the late 90's but now there seems to be a lot less kicking.

Quote from: AbbeySider on September 29, 2008, 04:44:17 PM

Quote from: corn02 on September 29, 2008, 04:15:32 PM
The series is the best thing that can happen. PR stunt or not Nixon has shown that they will easily come over and scout. He now has six clubs on his side. If communication breaks down between the GAA and the AFL it could turn into a poaching session.

No I cant agree with that. I dont know how you can call it the best thing that can happen when its obvious that its simply a scouting fest for the Aussies.
At least if the series was banished they wouldnt find players as easy as us setting up development squads and simply telling them who our best young talent is, and which players are suited to THEIR game. When you think of it its outrageous.

Maybe spend the money on sending a few Senior Clubs/Counties on tour of the states and Oz for 2 weeks during the winter to let people abroad have the chance to see our top players in action, and give the opportunity to players to travel. No need for this "hybrid" game that lets Aussies feast on young players. The International Rules squad usually only picks the bigger, stronger players and has little to do with skill.

If we had our best clubs on tour, say Senior Club Finalists, as well as All Ireland Finalists and our All Stars, all on a tour it would give our most skilled players a proper reward that someone aiming for the International Rules panel would receive. It would also offer skilled players something to aim for and instead of wishing they were big and tall enough to play International Rules/Aussie Rules they might aim to play and bring their team to Croke Park on St Patrick's day or the third Sunday in September with the incentive of a tour to the States and maybe Oz for 2 weeks in November for their team. Its just a thought.

Nonsense, how many players who played in the series went and played AFL then? By keeping relations good, the GAA have the option of perhaps imposing regulations on the players going, even perhaps gain compensation for the clubs. If there is a total break off, it is an open field. That is why it is a good thing to have the series.

Quote from: Gabriel_Hurl on September 29, 2008, 04:57:53 PM
I was talking (drinking pints) with a former star of Coronation Street on Saturday night and this came up - he loves watching the games

How's Keith getting on?

Quote from: Onion Bag on September 29, 2008, 05:11:05 PM

Quote from: Gabriel_Hurl on September 29, 2008, 04:57:53 PM
I was talking (drinking pints) with a former star of Coronation Street on Saturday night and this came up - he loves watching the games

Who?

Charlie stubbs? :D

Quote from: Gabriel_Hurl on September 29, 2008, 04:57:53 PM
I was talking (drinking pints) with a former star of Coronation Street on Saturday night and this came up - he loves watching the games

Tyrone Dobbs...........

Who is Keith?

He used to work with Tyrone as a matter of fact

Quote from: Gabriel_Hurl on September 29, 2008, 05:46:38 PM
Who is Keith?

Duffy.

Can't imagine Mike Baldwin taking too much of an interest in the series, or Fred now that you mention it!

the international rules series is great for the gaa, and if a few lads get to live in oz as pro for a few years its a small price to pay. it certainly helps keep the premiership out of my house for a few more weeks every year its on

Yes lets stop the International Rules and the Australians will stop holding clinics, stop watching Hogan Cup, Minor games etc....why not enter the real world and accept there is no way of stopping Irish players going to Australia to play Aussie Rules.

Quote from: DUBSFORSAM1 on September 29, 2008, 06:50:55 PM
Yes lets stop the International Rules and the Australians will stop holding clinics, stop watching Hogan Cup, Minor games etc....why not enter the real world and accept there is no way of stopping Irish players going to Australia to play Aussie Rules.

Ah sure if everyone done that there be nothing for the whingers to complain about  ::)

Quote from: DUBSFORSAM1 on September 29, 2008, 06:50:55 PM
Yes lets stop the International Rules and the Australians will stop holding clinics, stop watching Hogan Cup, Minor games etc....why not enter the real world and accept there is no way of stopping Irish players going to Australia to play Aussie Rules.

Well said DFS. Them lads will want Rule 21 and 27 restored yet to keep the GAA in purecloudcuckoo land.

A point of order to the lad who said Pearse Hanley is now in Australia instead of playing for his County - please note Pearse Hanley CAN'T PLAY FOR HIS COUNTY unless he moved to another part of co Roscommon and transferred to that club.

 ;D Ballaghadreen. The South Ossetia of Connacht.

Without taking issue with the fact that our own organisation will probably slip down the road of professionalism shortly, I'd think it'd be an incredible decision for our players to be blinded by the spotlights of an Aussie rules contract. What's the average lifespan of a gaa player there at the highest level? It appears to be about 4 years and then major mobility problems. Don't think we've too much to worry about if this is correct, still believe that we've kept en-tack county before pocket mindset

there could be few greater joys than to represent your country, and the games do provide entertainment.  wouldnt agree that they advertise our best players and the aussies have scouts throughout the country anyway so theyre going to see them anyway. while we cant begrude players for wanting to go overseas, action must be taken to encourage them to stay

I won't be watching it because it's crap.

I play senior football, I travel to every Derry game, I take an underage team in the club, I would go out on a Wednesday night to watch the under-16s training and I wouldn't waste my time watching the disaster that is the International Rules.  Just look at the tackle on Benny Coulter a couple of years ago.  It's alright for the Aussies who can sit in the house and undergo months of rehab and get paid for it, but there's a big difference between amateur and professional.  As advanced as our games have become, the players are not as physical as their Australian counterparts and inevitably get bullied, resulting in the last few hammerings we've taken in the series.

If they were serious about the game being a showcase for both sets of players skills, I'd take the tackle out of it.  Let's see how good the Aussies are when they can't mill an oncoming player. 

There are also a few things the Irish could do better - 1. avoid the tackle, as one journalist in the tribune yesterday said the aussies train to avoid the tackle whilst gaelic players are encouraged to take a player on - no chance of a point like Doohers being scored against the Aussies - he'd a been dragged to the floor by the first player he went near.  2. Learn to move back from the mark position.  All the Aussies retreat 15-20 yards before releasing the ball, as the defending player stands at the mark position - the Irish tendency is to try and steel a few yards because the defending team are forced to retreat.

Quote from: DUBSFORSAM1 on September 29, 2008, 06:50:55 PM
why not enter the real world and accept there is no way of stopping Irish players going to Australia to play Aussie Rules.

I am in the real world. Its obvious that we cant stop players going to Australia, but we are playing straight into their hands by having U-17 development squads and showing them our best talent that would suit their game.
Its not promoting our game as much as its promoting theirs over here. They are laughing at us.

The new rules that allow for suspension of Aussie players from the AFL competition should help improve their discipline - previously they could do what they wanted in the International series without any fear of repercussions on their 'day job'

What has really changed for the Australian team in recent years is the type of players we selected for the International Rules series. In early yearrrrrrrrrrrr just take our All Australian team but that didnt work  as obviously Aussie Rules Football and International Rules Football are different games. These days we tend to take smaller and faster players as they are more suited to the IR series.

Quote from: AFS on September 30, 2008, 03:16:47 AM
As a couple of people have already pointed out - the U17 competition is gone. Granted it was a bit ridiculous but its gone so this is no longer an issue. Anyway, I'd bet good money that any of the Aussie scouts worth their salt over here would know of most of the outstanding U17 talent in the country these days, without needing to see who is named on an international squad.

Your right, I think my gripe about development squads the was in vein.
But it seems Nicky Brennan agreed with me about showcasing our young talent. Thanks Nickey!


http://www.news.com.au/heraldsun/story/0,21985,22617052-11088,00.html

Curtains for under-17 International Rules series

IF THE senior International Rules series is not dead in the water, the under-17 version certainly is.
Gaelic Athletic Association president Nickey Brennan is determined to keep the prized junior series in the deep-freeze.

As concerns about losing Irish talent to the AFL mount, Brennan has declared: "That series is dead in the water, you can take that as a given.

"Maybe we were our own worst enemies by putting our best players in the shop window by having that series."

The under-17 series was last held in Australia in last year, and the Australians toured Ireland in 2005.

Although it is an invaluable experience for Australia's AIS academy members, the Irish are angry that AFL clubs saw it as a recruiting opportunity.

Brennan made his comments about the under-17 series as he prepared to meet AFL chief executive Andrew Demetriou on the future of the senior International Rules concept.

Flanked by GAA player welfare manager Paraic Duffy, Brennan met with Demetriou in Paris. Both parties reviewed the controversial incidents at Croke Park almost a year ago that forced the suspension of the senior International Rules series.

Brennan warned the meeting would be no quick-fix and that was the case. The meeting was described as "frank and cordial", but it was not enough to revive the series.

It was agreed that further discussions were needed before the issue of a resumption of the International Rules series could be considered.

Both sides emphasised their commitment to maintaining their long-standing relationship. A further meeting will take place in the new year.

***********************************

Well that seems to be closure on the development squads.
Anyway im still boycotting it.

I dont want to see our senior players getting humiliated again after that debacle 16 months ago.

Quote from: thebandit on September 29, 2008, 03:59:44 PM

Quote from: fred the red on September 29, 2008, 03:57:48 PM
AFAIK there is no longer under age games.

To be picked in the ireland squad it is most likely that you are at the top of the gaa game. By this stage you are gonna be too old for the aussies to have a keen interest in you.

Dessie Mone is at least 24

Dana will play Aussie Rules before Dessie Mone ever will

That's what happens if you have an Uncle in DCU and as a scout for the AFL ... it's all just propoganda and bullsh*t

The International Rules is just some end of season fun to give the two teams a run out and an international dimension. There will be no players poached from the International Rules group and as for the whole hype and worry about it ... COP ON

There are more Gaelic footballers lost to ... Soccer, Drink, Drugs, Rugby etc than will ever play Aussie Rules and to those who are bitter about a few lads making a few pound in Oz playing a game, look at the economy here - could you balme them?

In fact if anything the fear of Aussie Rules may do more good than harm by getting the GAA to buck up and take better care of their players - but to me there is no exodus to sorry about.

i love gaelic football and i like aussie rules so I have no problem with the international rules series at senior level. people werent complaining about it when we were winning.

i can't believe,  we're getting involved again in this crap ....

promote our own game!  ..... we had two brilliant all-ireland finals this year, watched by close on 100,000 fans
in croker/longford, and millions around the world ... via satlite tv and internet.
yet here we are again .... pussy footin to them f****n  aussie thugs ... make no mistake thats what they are!!!

do we want to expose our classy gaelic footballers,.... with all their craft and skill, to this non event, so that all the johny come latelys ....................................................
come out of the woodwork to see a good ould punch up ...just like they stayed in the pub on all-ireland final day.

Quote from: kickingmule on September 30, 2008, 11:45:36 AM
i can't believe,  we're getting involved again in this crap ....

promote our own game!  ..... we had two brilliant all-ireland finals this year, watched by close on 100,000 fans
in croker/longford, and millions around the world ... via satlite tv and internet.
yet here we are again .... pussy footin to them f****n  aussie thugs ... make no mistake thats what they are!!!

do we want to expose our classy gaelic footballers,.... with all their craft and skill, to this non event, so that all the johny come latelys ....................................................
come out of the woodwork to see a good ould punch up ...just like they stayed in the pub on all-ireland final day.

Id agree with the jist of that.
I dont want to see our best footballers embarrassed and humiliated like they were 16 months ago.
And we were humiliated. It was terrible what went on.

If we want to have pride in our game we shouldnt let our players get tarnished and physically abused by those Aussie Nationalist thugs.
Its not a stage to showcase our skills. Its a stage for the Aussies to beat up and bully.

A good GAA player can have all the skills of the game but gets spoiled, broken and concussed by a thug that doenst care for the ball and wants to take out the man. There is something wrong if you call that a sporting spectacle. many of the bset players in the country wont play International Rules anymore and they are dead right.

If we want to showcase our skills abroad why not have a tour for the GAA All-Ireland finalists. 4 teams on tour of the US or Australia for a couple of weeks during the winter. Marketed and televised properly like a series (like playoffs) it would be huge.

well Abbeysider, I think your being a bit harsh, calling them thugs and "nationalist thugs  ??? " but yeah a tour of Gaelic football and hurling would be better.

By the way how does the hurling vs Shinty play out, It doesnt grab the headlines like its big-ball cousin but is it successful otherwise? Are the games good, I havent got to see them.

Quote from: thejuice on September 30, 2008, 03:50:08 PM
well Abbeysider, I think your being a bit harsh, calling them thugs and "nationalist thugs  ??? " but yeah a tour of Gaelic football and hurling would be better.

I suppose the use of the word "nationalist" is metaphoric of the type of emotion and psychology they bring to it.
Its like they use the series as a war or battle on a field, one nation against another. The last outing didnt really resemble a skilled sport.
The targeting of Ciaran McDonald in 2005 before the ball was thrown in was total thuggery.

This series should be kicked into touch, i for one will give it no support

Fake,
mongrel,
overhyped,
dangerous,
Amateurs v Professionals,
Cherry Picking,
2 Confused referees,
Thugs,
Boring,
Hammerings (both physical and Scoreboard),
No protection of players by referee,
Fools (amateurs who would put their livlihood or earnings at risk to a dangerous tackle).
Bi-national (as it only has 2 counties who play the hybrid game),
Holidays for the boys (administrators),
embarrassing (the lack of sportmanship and respect the last series had)
I mean how Brennan was humiliated last year, handing over the Cup which is named after a Tyrone Legend to thugs......it was one the embarassing moments of GAA ( beat the 12 apostiles of '83!)

wont be watching it quite simply a steaming pile of shite.

Abbeysider can you put a poll on this?, seems to be quite an even split for those in favour and those who arent.

WELL PUT BUNKER!!!
TIME TO RID OURSELVES OF THIS AUSSIE DISEASE! :(

I'm not going to watch, because it's a shit 'sport' and doesn't promote our games. That and the fact I fear a great injury to one of our players at some stage in the future.

As for it putting our best players in the shopping window.... well that door has been opened and stopping the IR Series won't close it now.

Quote from: fred the red on September 30, 2008, 11:04:50 PM
Abbeysider can you put a poll on this?, seems to be quite an even split for those in favour and those who arent.

That was a good call fred,
I posed the question to see if people were in favour or not.
I didnt think it balanced to ask were people boycotting it altogether.

Im open to suggestions to edit the poll as people see fit to get a fair result.
From talking to ordinary GAA people I believe that a lot more people would like to see the series put to a stop.
However I can understand Irish people abroad and especially in Oz wanting to keep the games or sport...? ( for use of a better term  ::) ) ...alive.

Quote from: ziggysego on September 30, 2008, 11:26:38 PM
I'm not going to watch, because it's a shit 'sport' and doesn't promote our games. That and the fact I fear a great injury to one of our players at some stage in the future.

As for it putting our best players in the shopping window.... well that door has been opened and stopping the IR Series won't close it now.

With all due respect Ziggy et al is the loss of 10-20 players (mainly minors) somehow ruins your competition the talent pool must be skinny.

Of all the current batch of Irish lads in Australia right now one is a superstar (Kennelly), one is handy (Clarke) and the rest are fringe players or yet to make it. Most will make their way back home in the next 1-2 years a lot wiser for the experience.

Quote from: AbbeySider on October 01, 2008, 12:18:55 AM
However I can understand Irish people abroad and especially in Oz wanting to keep the games or sport...? ( for use of a better term  ::) ) ...alive.

This is probably one of the reasons I am going to watch the International rules this year. It's the first time in about 3/4 years I will get to see the GAA lads close up.

These lads have had a long tough season and getting away for 2 or 3 weeks for an end of season trip together is well deserved before the winter training starts up again.

People here don't seem to be aware that this year we are going to see a cleaner encounter due to the suspensions running over to next season.

It would be nice to beat the Aussies on their own turf. Pride is at stake here and bragging rights in work the following week!!

Quote from: thejuice on September 30, 2008, 03:50:08 PM

By the way how does the hurling vs Shinty play out, It doesnt grab the headlines like its big-ball cousin but is it successful otherwise? Are the games good, I havent got to see them.

Ive been to a number of those internationals, always an enjoyable day out and though its not perfect with the mixed rules the games are invariably played in very good spirit. Sadly there is no financial draw in the shinty/hurling match and it hasnt really been taken seriously by the GAA in recent years, as shown by the fact they have only been picking their players from counties in the Christy Ring and Nicky Rackard Cup. The Scots seem to have twigged onto that this year because the squad announced this week doesnt feature lads from the top shinty clubs.

Ive always felt it was a shame the shinty/hurling is seen as such a poor relation in comparison to the GAA/AFL because its a genuine cultural and sporting link between two ancient amateur sports. Unfortunatey as I said earlier its not a cash cow.

Anyway gives me an another excuse to post some shinty on the board here  ;D http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=w3Lvqx-7NuA&feature=related

Quote from: Lamh Dhearg Alba on October 01, 2008, 12:26:19 PM
.... as shown by the fact they have only been picking their players from counties in the Christy Ring and Nicky Rackard Cup. The Scots seem to have twigged onto that this year because the squad announced this week doesnt feature lads from the top shinty clubs.

Id be more inclined to give people playing the Christy Ring and Nicky Rackard Cups a chance at this.

There can be a slight element of elitism in the GAA with these kind of opportunity's.
Its always the players from the top teams that get the sponsorship deals and the advertising campaign contracts.
I wouldnt begrudge any player from a smaller county getting an opportunity to travel or be involved in something.

Its great that they got the chance to do it instead of the big teams. I have a feeling that its not a reflection on taking the game seriously or not, but more about the GAA wanted to spread the opportunity's to weaker counties that might never get a chance to do something like that. Maybe the Scots took the same approach.

Correct me if I'm wrong but I think the GAA took to fielding teams from the lower divisions for a couple of reasons, firstly its a way of recognising these players, they don't get the glory of All Ireland Sundays so this is a way of honouring them. The hurlers were in the main hammering the Scots lads which was doing the series no good at all.

Quote from: AbbeySider on October 01, 2008, 12:57:11 PM

Quote from: Lamh Dhearg Alba on October 01, 2008, 12:26:19 PM
.... as shown by the fact they have only been picking their players from counties in the Christy Ring and Nicky Rackard Cup. The Scots seem to have twigged onto that this year because the squad announced this week doesnt feature lads from the top shinty clubs.

Id be more inclined to give people playing the Christy Ring and Nicky Rackard Cups a chance at this.

There can be a slight element of elitism in the GAA with these kind of opportunity's.
Its always the players from the top teams that get the sponsorship deals and the advertising campaign contracts.
I wouldnt begrudge any player from a smaller county getting an opportunity to travel or be involved in something.

Its great that they got the chance to do it instead of the big teams. I have a feeling that its not a reflection on taking the game seriously or not, but more about the GAA wanted to spread the opportunity's to weaker counties that might never get a chance to do something like that. Maybe the Scots took the same approach.

I take your point AbbeySider and I dont begrudge these lads their chance. However I dont see any suggestion that Ireland should pick from Division 4 counties for the GAA/AFL game so as to give lads from less recognised counties a big day out.  Similarly if the Aussies were to field a team picked from secondary competition clubs to play Ireland Ive no doubt that people in Ireland would be none too impressed.

As for scalder's point thats not altogether true either. IIRC there was only one hammering in the series and this was when bizarrely the GAA/AFL points scoring system was used for the shinty/hurling match. In the main the matches over the past couple of decades have been well fought.

Anyone have a full squad listing of the last u17 team that toured?? Charlie Vernon etc??

Quote from: Our Nail Loney on October 01, 2008, 04:39:10 PM
Anyone have a full squad listing of the last u17 team that toured?? Charlie Vernon etc??

What year was that? 2005 ?

Im nearly sure this is the 2004 U17 squad with Charlie Vernon.
Im saying its the 2005 squad because Gareth Bradshaw from Moycullen is on it and he is around 21 I think.


1.  Padraig Kearney, Kildare           
2.  Dean Barrett, Meath               
3.  Gareth Bradshaw, Galway           
4.  David Culloty, Kerry               
5.  Darragh Egan, Tipperary           
6.  Brian Faherty, Galway             
7.  Ian Fleming, Laois                 
8.  Fintan Goold, Cork                 
9.  Seamus Graham, Derry               
10. Andrew Hanley, Mayo               
11. Shane Hogan, Galway               
12. Conor Hughes, Kildare             
13. Paul Kerrigan, Cork               
14. Mark Lynch, Derry                 
15. Shane McCarthy, Cork               
16. Sean Paul Henry, Derry             
17. John McCormack, Armagh             
18. Brian Moran, Kerry       
19. Jonathon O'Brien, Dublin           
20. Padraic O'Reilly, Cavan           
21. Jonathon O'Sullivan, Kerry         
22. Stephen Prendergast, Waterford     
23. Luke Quinn, Kerry                 
24. Kevin Reilly, Meath
25. Charlie Vernon,  Armagh

was 2006 not the last time it toured??? or was it late November/December 2005, i cant be too sure

  know because our clubman Ray Cullivan captained the team down under.

Mark Lynch  was captain one year, not sure which.

Have been boycotting it myself for years. A really ugly game imo which somehow manages to incorporate the worst elements of both codes.Won't even watch it on TV.
Lived in Oz myself for some years and I can safely say that the Victoria public does not give a monkeys about these games.

I have to admit I love the games. The players seem to love the game as well and aren't they the most important part of the process?? They know the risks and they want to and volunteer to play year in year out so let them play....

As for this rubbish about the Aussie being thugs they have yes gone overboard in some tackles etc and matches but the same happens in GAA so lets not kid ourselves....and the targetting of players etc also happens in GAA...while they tend to think the mouthing off, jersey pulling, kicking the ball on the gound, sly digs, diving etc are really cowardly acts which we think makes up tough guys they prefer to go in hard and fast with fists etc if there is trouble...

For me the most embarrassing thing is that guys with 4 weeks training can come in and kick points better than Irish guys who have had 20 years training...

Was at the last U-17 tour in Adelaide, it was in April 2006 - can't remember the full list of players - Pierce Hanley from Mayo won the player of the tournament, Shane O'Rourke from Meath played also

dsfm- the best players in the gaa won't even go for trials now, gooch,dooher etc because of fear of injury. now boylan has set physical requirements of not being less than 6ft etc, which i can understand comepletely.
the point being it doesn't involve our best players anymore, and the physical dimensions required now ensure that it will descend into a bastardised form of rugby league. that and the stinking attitude of the aussies, they'll let the irish win one series maybe, then knock the shite out of them next time, reagrdless of whether that means people get injured.
no dis-respect but people aren't going to tune into a series for too long, when it doesn't involve our best players. my idea is that any game that doesn't conform to allowing our best players to compete isn't a game worth promoting or playing. I actually watch aussie rules every weekend, love the sport strangely but asking our guys to compete against some of the best athletes in the world ina game where the aussies hvae such a size and power advantage is inherently dangerous , that and the stinking attitide of many of the aussie players , makes it something i wouldn't watch if it was on in my back garden.

Indiana - Saying that the physical requirements affect the decision of players to play happens in GAA also whereby small light players don't get picked for county teams as they don't have the physique to cope etc....Guys like Cavanagh/Canty etc are all involved so that is quality players going....If the Irish players skills were better they would negate the power disadvantage and a lot of the Aussie players aren't that big anymore either...

my point is DSFm they have the physical requirements to play GAA but they don't to play this game. in my view it then ceases to have any relevance to gaelic football so bother promoting it? is it because some membes of the gaa hierachy want a 2 week sabbatical in Australia or something? why anyone wants to watch a bunch of louts trying to injure the best of irish talent is beyond me i'm afraid.

Quote from: stephenite on October 02, 2008, 05:25:31 AM
Was at the last U-17 tour in Adelaide, it was in April 2006 - can't remember the full list of players - Pierce Hanley from Mayo won the player of the tournament,

Point of order - Hanley is not FROM Mayo. He just played for them at Minor and U21 because his club is affiliated to the Mayo Co Board.( the shower of traitorous ************s)

Quote from: Rossfan on October 02, 2008, 09:50:42 PM

Quote from: stephenite on October 02, 2008, 05:25:31 AM
Was at the last U-17 tour in Adelaide, it was in April 2006 - can't remember the full list of players - Pierce Hanley from Mayo won the player of the tournament,

Point of order - Hanley is not FROM Mayo. He just played for them at Minor and U21 because his club is affiliated to the Mayo Co Board.( the shower of traitorous ************s)

He is from Mayo - he says so himself, are you denying him this right? Would you say that a Northern Nationalist has no right to say they're from Ireland?

Point of order - he also played for his native county at Senior level not just underage. ;D :D ;D :D ;D

[quote author=Rossfan link=topic=9556.msg388006#msg388006 date=1222980642
Point of order - Hanley is not FROM Mayo. He just played for them at Minor and U21 because his club is affiliated to the Mayo Co Board.( the shower of traitorous ************s)
[/quote]

Ouch, that's very harsh on the misfortunate disenfranchised Rossies there, Rossfan

The Ballagh club website is well out of date - just like the official policy of facing exclusively over towards Mayo - but ye'll enjoy picking well known names out of the Interesting Facts page, methinks.

http://www.ballaghaderreengaa.com/facts.htm

I see those eagle eyed, progressive google folk are on the ball though with an advert for Roscommon GAA Gear on the the mainpage  ;)

Seriously though, the club and the two county boards should come to a gentleman's agreement and let the players decide which county they wish to declare for themselves without fear or favour. This craic of Mayo not letting Ballagh lads declare for Ros because they might lose a good player is all a bit dated at this stage.

Well the way some of the Rossies portray the situation here, you'd think the Ballagh players were desperate to play for Ros and were forced against their will to wear the Green and Red.
Andy Moran was behind me at the minor replay in Longford and was roaring Mayo on the whole game. Never stopped the whole game through and was asking a young lad beside him "Do you think we'll win it? Ha? I don't know either!"  :D

Didn't sound like a man being forced against his will to me  ;)

Quote from: spectator on October 02, 2008, 11:15:59 PM
Seriously though, the club and the two county boards should come to a gentleman's agreement and let the players decide which county they wish to declare for themselves without fear or favour. This craic of Mayo not letting Ballagh lads declare for Ros because they might lose a good player is all a bit dated at this stage.

I love this - if the shoe was on the other foot you'd be all for a gentleman's agreement alright  :D
Dated my arse, how is wanting to ensure you have the best players at your disposal dated?  ;)

Would Joe Diver not be a man to try for this International Rules craic? He's a beast of a man, decent fielder, kicks some great long-range points. Admittingly also kisks some great long-range shots into the corner flag.

and a born winner too..

As regards the game itself as a spectacle, I'm not dead set against it.

But the humiliation of Aussies outperforming us with the round ball, coupled with the embarrassment of effectively having to ask them to please 'ease off' before we're willing to go out and play with them again, it's just cringeworthy. (I'm talking about watering down their legitimate physicality there by the way, aside from the scattergun thuggery beloved by that headbanger Kevin Sheedy who is single-handedly responsible for killing this thing off).

We're just not able to take them on in a proper contest like we could back in the days of Bomber Liston and so on, our game has lost its physical edge now and what's more, we're totally abject at kicking the ball accurately because all we do in gaelic football is handpass ourselves into oblivion.

If we can't truly compete, skills or physicality-wise, then why bother?????

For those reasons, I'm no longer an advocate of the IR series like I was back in the day but that said, I'll almost certainly take a look out of curiousity.

Quote from: Tubberman on October 02, 2008, 11:34:29 PM
Well the way some of the Rossies portray the situation here, you'd think the Ballagh players were desperate to play for Ros and were forced against their will to wear the Green and Red.

That's a mis-interpretation imo, the issue is that Ballagh lads don't have the choice to play for Ros. They must play for Mayo if they wish to play ic.

If Andy Moran had the choice, he'd have played for Ros as a promising youngster. He hadn't though and so had to play for Mayo. Good Luck to him, but the rulebook made him follow his ic ambitions with Mayo. Doubt he'd change back to Ros currently, as he has a way better better chance of winning a celtic cross with Mayo, undoubtedly he wouldn't want to desert his team mates at this stage of their quest for Sam either, and realisically Ros in their present poor state cannot match that sort of ambition. Nothing unusual in his comments really, considering he's an established player for Mayo.

Quote from: stephenite on October 03, 2008, 03:20:32 AM
Dated my arse, how is wanting to ensure you have the best players at your disposal dated?  ;)

Dated in the sense that some Ballagh young lads won't put up with it in this day and age and are turning to soccer instead.
[Decoded, that's Ballagh-speak for 'given the strong Mayo orientation of the GAA club, some lads are steering clear and playing soccer instead.']

Quote from: stephenite on October 03, 2008, 03:20:32 AM
I love this - if the shoe was on the other foot you'd be all for a gentleman's agreement alright  :D

That's the most painless solution imho. Ballagh GAA is losing young lads to soccer, which is a shame. The club should be at the heart of the community, facilitating everyone. Why not give the few Rossies the choice to play for Ros if they wish? Would it be so hard to do that? I suppose, just like the Aussies in the IR Series, for the Mayo folks it's results that matter and to hell with sportsmanship, doing the right thing and facilitating young Ballagh Rossie lads sporting dreams.

Tis bad karma i tell ya stephenite, ye'll never win Sam until ye do the right thing and give the young Ballagh lads a free choice ;)

Quote from: stephenite on October 03, 2008, 03:20:32 AM

Quote from: spectator on October 02, 2008, 11:15:59 PM
Seriously though, the club and the two county boards should come to a gentleman's agreement and let the players decide which county they wish to declare for themselves without fear or favour. This craic of Mayo not letting Ballagh lads declare for Ros because they might lose a good player is all a bit dated at this stage.

I love this - if the shoe was on the other foot you'd be all for a gentleman's agreement alright  :D
Dated my arse, how is wanting to ensure you have the best players at your disposal dated?  ;)

Is there somewhere I can read the full story on the situation with Ballaghdeeren? What I've picked up is that its in Roscommon geographically but considered a part of Mayo? Is that just for GAA purposes or also administratively and what's the background? If its too complicated to explain, apologies!

I think Ballagh was regarded as Co Mayo till the Brits set up County Councils in 1898. Ballagh became part of Roscommon then officially -something to do with the local bigwigs the Dillon family using their influence in Westminster as  there would be higher rates in Mayo.
Ballagh has since been part of Roscommon as the townsfolk walk on Ros Co Council footpaths, drive RN cars on Ros Co Council streets, drink water from Ros Co Council watermains, flush their toilets into Ros County Council sewers, take part in the Roscommon Community games, play soccer in the Roscommon and district League and their lassies club is(was? do they still exist) affiliated to the Ros Co Board.
They also vote in the Roscommon South Leitrim Constituency and their handball club which like the GAA club is affiliated to the rhubarbs recently got grants from Ros County Council despite a number of patriotic Councillors objecting to giving money to a crowd of traitors.
Back about 10 or 15 years ago a group of patriotic GAA people in Ballagh tried to set up a club( St John's) which would affiliate to Ros Co Board,thereby giving choice to youngsters in the Co Ros town, but the Mayo Co Board with assistance from Galway and bloody Laythrum stymied it.
Still the Ballarossies fight on and as others used to say "Tiocfaidh ár lá" and I look forward to the day when a Ballagh lad leads Ros to the Sam and we parade it through the streets of the West Ros town.

Quote from: TacadoirArdMhacha on October 03, 2008, 08:29:26 PM
Is there somewhere I can read the full story on the situation with Ballaghdeeren? What I've picked up is that its in Roscommon geographically but considered a part of Mayo? Is that just for GAA purposes or also administratively and what's the background? If its too complicated to explain, apologies!

Yeah, it's complicated but here goes anyway;

Ballagh GAA club was formed in 1885. It was one of the very early Mayo GAA clubs. Geographically, the town was in County Mayo back then.

In 1898, The Local Goverment Act moved the county boundary, which i understand a plebiscite in Ballagh endorsed. Ballagh then came within County Roscommon for all intents and purposes, with the Mayo border receeding four or five miles westwards. The club continued playing in Mayo, as some of the locals back then were understandably miffed at being moved out of Mayo and it helped maintain a link with Mayo.

In the intervening 110 odd years, the town has come to be seen as one of Roscommon's principle market towns. Administratively and geographically, the town and parish are in County Roscommon. The GAA club continues to play in Mayo, as that's where it historically played. Many club members remain very loyal and die-hard Mayo followers, although now living in Roscommon. They genuinely identify with Mayo and the football helps them to do so.

The Ballagh club playing in Mayo is acceptable under GAA rules, as a tiny part of an out parish of Ballagh still crosses the border into County Mayo. Club players of inter-county standard must play for Mayo under GAA  rules. Ballagh is unusual geographically, from a GAA perspective. While all of the town and surrounding half parishes are principally in Roscommon, small extremities of its area touch into Mayo and Sligo. From a 'Parish Rule' perspective, keeping Ballagh in Mayo for GAA purposes saves the GAA a whole lot of trouble with the parish rule, although in civil law it's legally untenable to tell Ballagh Rossies they can't play with their native Ros if they wish to play inter-county football. GAA law holds in Ballagh though for now, as a legal challenge has never been advanced.

From a GAA perspective, a few unsavourary incidents have drawn attention in past years, as referred to by Rossfan.

Over time, Ballagh Rossies had gotten weary of watching their best players being forced to play for Mayo. Tis terrible to see one of your own beating you in a Connacht Final, for example. For youngsters, they have no choice but to play for Mayo and can't really leave home to join another club, even if they wanted to. Why should they have to anyway? 

In the early nineties, an attempt was made to form an under-age club, St Johns,  which would be affiliated to Roscommon. The local existing club and Mayo County Board objected and brought this for adjudication to The Connacht Council. There, Mayo, Galway and Leitrim objected to St Johns being formed & so Ballagh Rossies were told to take a running jump.There are some interesting side stories relating to this, but i won't go into them here. Basically, Ballagh Rossies were told they could play with the existing club in County Mayo and play inter county football with Mayo, or not at all. Although they were living in Roscommon, in their wisdom officialdom in Mayo, Galway and Leitrim denied them the right to play club football in, or for their own county.

Another controversial incident occurred when the Ballagh Rossies set up a ladies club. Under the rules of ladies football, which are different to mens, a Ballagh team should play in Roscommon. A local GAA official stopped the Ballagh ladies from using a local playing field when they went to train there. This was the final straw for a lot of Rossies, and even to this day, they basically have little to do with the GAA club as they see it as being biased against them because they're Rossies. Terrible situation really, as the club should be at the heart of the community, instead of dividing people.

One or two of the current Mayo footballers from Ballagh grew up supporting Roscommon, but because of the GAA rules must play for Mayo. This is what we debate about with the Mayo lads on here from time to time. The parish rule could be blown out of the water by Ballagh Rossies, if they chose to advance a legal challenge. They could also form a new GAA club affiliated to Ros, although this would cause much turmoil again. The easiest solution though would be for the club and two county boards to agree to facilitate letting lads play for Ros if they wished. There'd be no need for any aggravation and everyone should be happy then.

The annoying thing, is that such an agreement would barely lose Mayo any players. At the moment, most club players would declare for Mayo anyway.

Meanwhile, some of the young lads disenchanted with the current set-up are turning to a burgeoning soccer club in the town. When I'm back there, they tell me they have no time for the GAA club's traditional hardline Mayo stance, which doesn't acknowledge their Ros affiliations. A little gesture like the GAA club letting them declare for Ros would go a long way to changing all that. It would also bring back a lot of the older disenfranchised GAA Rossies in the town to the club, imo. That smacks of win win for everyone to me anyway.

Sooner or later, the bad taste in Ballagh around the GAA question will have to be addressed & righted, for the good of the vast majority of decent GAA folks there as well as everyone else in the area. Hopefully that day isn't too far off.

Thanks for that spectator, glad we've only a simple county border to contend with, even though it (now) covers six of them!  Ballaghdereen abú! ;)

Quote from: Fear ón Srath Bán on October 03, 2008, 10:55:28 PM
!  Ballaghdereen abú! ;)

The town - not the effin GAA club - till they see sense and abandon this clinging on to their former colonial power. ;)

Quote from: Rossfan on October 04, 2008, 04:29:32 PM

Quote from: Fear ón Srath Bán on October 03, 2008, 10:55:28 PM
!  Ballaghdereen abú! ;)

The town - not the effin GAA club - till they see sense and abandon this clinging on to their former colonial power. ;)

Mayo?

Ricky Nixon spotted at a recent Mayo minor club match in Ballaghhadereen

(http://1.bp.blogspot.com/_7n3V7bnR9eI/SLB5ohwUx2I/AAAAAAAACGY/IUq9rn3c7VY/S240/bandanakanga)

QuoteInternational Rules game in Ashbourne
06 October 2008

This Saturday night, 11th October sees another milestone for Donaghmore Ashbourne as the club hosts an International Rules game for the first time.

The game will involve Donaghmore Ashbourne (together with a number of Guest Players from the Meath Senior Team) who will play the Australian Amateur Under 23 AFL team in an International Rules Challenge.

This AFL team is currently touring Ireland and will also play Bishopstown GAA Club Cork, National University of Ireland, Galway and Dublin City University as part of their tour.

The game throws in at 7.00pm.

Admission is €5 at the gate.