Down beatin limerick is a good result for us and I was expecting it. Now if we beat Longford by 3pts(no easy task) but possible and limerick and leitrim dont draw we stay up.
I spoke to a sligo selector the other day. I asked a few straight questions and wasnt impressed with the replys I got. I will review my post before posting and ask others aswell because I dont want to antagonise anyone.
Big week for Sligo, devasted if were back in Div 4 when only 10 people turn up to watch. Im not 100% sure but does that mean TM cup apply to this yr or next and if we lose to Mayo are we in it if relegated???
Quote from: SLIGONIAN on April 13, 2008, 07:06:36 PM
does that mean TM cup apply to this yr or next and if we lose to Mayo are we in it if relegated???
Yes.
;D ;D ;D ;D
New ( or return of old) scenario passed yesterday only applies from 2009.
And you have to beat Longford to ensure you stay out of the TM Cup. If our backs can contain Sligo's forwards that is.
From my conversation and questions put to a certain man of influence in the Sligo set up I am seriously worried about this Sunday and the summer. A massively different perspective from the majority of Sligofans on team selection. And judging by our performances the management are getting it wrong and contributing to our rapid demise but from this lads point of view its not them at fault. The players are too blame. Whereas in my opinion it is always equally both sides to blame in most cases and everyone should look at themselves.
My conversation will make interesting viewing. But Ive asked someone to read it first because I want to not offend anyone. You know in a province of 5 counties from underage to senior(sorry NY and London) but Leitrim have more connaght titles than us believe it or not. It all makes sense when you listen to guys involved with our county set up. We have the talent always but not the guidance. Anyone that disagrees with my logic or what Im saying. Tell me why have we 1 connaght title at any level since 1975 to show for our efforts?
I will think about this conundrum at length. I have no ill will agin any Sligo, Leitrim nor Limerick person but I am torn at our health and yours.
More anon.....................
SLIGONIAN Why bother putting it up at all. Sure we all have insights into the county set up and could spend hours writing up posts and debating inside stories. But sure what will that do. I have been reading your comments for some time now with out offering an opinion and the more I read the more I know you haven't a clue. In fact I don't why I am even entertaining you. Does us a favour and keep your inside scopes to yourself and don't be embarrassing yourself by posting them up on a chat page site....
As for Sunday I think it's a lost cause and that's not being negative you could say Longford are starting three points up always harder chasing a game like that especially away from home in the league. But still Sligo did it away to Wicklow last year if all injuries clear up and he finals picks his best 15 then you never know.
I have got some bad news, I spoke to a member of the sligo management team, I asked him a straight question, whats the story wtih phillips? A shrug of the shoulder and comment that went like this. "hes not training well and hasnt been allyear" I didnt want to antagonise the man so i didnt push it. But I did want to say why is the lad on still on panel if not giving his all at training.
This man said K ONeill has a good chance for next sunday, but I dont know how serious he was. I asked him about my clubmate Eoin who I feel isnt up to county senior yet, he said eoin was asked to a job last sunday and did it, which is a contradiction considering he got taken off at ht. I watched him put in a poor performance for my club again aswell.
I did say to him I was very frustrated with team selections and disagreed with alot but he was very careful in his words not to give much away. I also asked him what did he make of Jordan and he wasnt very convincing in his reply, "kinda its first yr and he has new ideas" but his body language wasnt enthustatic when he said it.
I said to him we have no chance against longford if he picks kivelhan, curran and mchugh as our HF line. He didnt say much but I could see he disagreed. Anyway my conclusion to it all is not all is well. he asked me do I go all the games, he then said you must be very frustrated and I said I was but I support my team when on the field and save my criticism for elsewhere.
We can just expect the same or worse TEAM SELECTIONS. Simple they cant see McNamara anywhere else but CHB and oneill has more chance than phillips. Also J Davey no chance of being pushed further forward and I did say that to him but he in disagreement. I said curran has more defensive qualites aswell.
Funny thing also he said our lads arent fit enough. I didnt say anything BUT isnt that the managements responsibilty???????????????.
I asked him how far away is EGAN TAYLOR and MCPARTLAND, he said mcpartland maybe as a sub but not start, the other 2 are long term and may not be back for a long time even CSFC which is worrying if true.
My last words were best of luck against longford, we can do it. His reply you know longford have it all to play for too. I said yes but Im focused on us and if we get the performance we wont have to worry about the opposition. I have to say I found this guy negative and he disappointed me. This should create some debate. Everything Ive siad is true.
QuoteI have got some bad news, I spoke to a member of the sligo management team, I asked him a straight question, whats the story wtih phillips? A shrug of the shoulder and comment that went like this. "hes not training well and hasnt been allyear" I didnt want to antagonise the man so i didnt push it. But I did want to say why is the lad on still on panel if not giving his all at training.
Without getting into the specifics Sligonian, that quote I've highlighted above could mean a few things, from your interpetation down to he's not going well in training, i.e. his form in training is poor so far. I wouldn't assume he's not putting the effort in.
Well I have alot of friends who I put the same words too and they all came too same conclusion as me but I respect your different perspective. But I suppose all weve been reading in the local papers the last few weeks doesnt help.ie quotes from our manager questioning players atitude, and players having to take long look at themselves.
If Longford play like they can, they'll win and stay up. If they play like they have been doing recently, then all will depend on which Sligo turns up on the day.
Sligo's backs are better than our backs - our forwards are better than Sligo's forwards. On a wet day, our middle third should do alright, and win enough possession to give good supply to Kavanagh, Barden (Snr) and McGee. On a dry day, I'd be afraid the Sligo middle third would run riot, and our full back line's a mess. Thankfully (and no disrespect intended) I'm not sure Sligo's FF line has the wherewithall to exploit that 'mess'.
Against my better judgement (and gut instinct gained by 35 years of watching Longford teams), I think Longford will scrape through and win by two points.
Id agree regarding synopsis, Longford have better forward line, Id be worried about the defensive capabliites of our HB line but our full back has saved us in the past and may well do so next Sunday. Our forward line could be better if strongest team was selected. If we start with same HF line as louth game we may aswell not turn up. We are self destructing on the line and its starting to spread to the field. Id hope Gaughan starts did well 2nd half against louth and has pace. We need flannery to have another good day with frees and need brehony back to. Kelly scored 0-3 from play last day and is well able to excell and score. Hopefully we are fitter now and 2 week break has done us good.
Quote from: SLIGONIAN on April 14, 2008, 11:41:49 AM
I have got some bad news, I spoke to a member of the sligo management team, I asked him a straight question, whats the story wtih phillips? A shrug of the shoulder and comment that went like this. "hes not training well and hasnt been allyear" I didnt want to antagonise the man so i didnt push it. But I did want to say why is the lad on still on panel if not giving his all at training.
This man said K ONeill has a good chance for next sunday, but I dont know how serious he was.
hmm, I wont hold my breath that we'll see o'neill start on sunday. O'Neill played with Coolera & Phillips was asked not to play for harps. Thats sounds to me like they have plans to give phillips a run. Considering the performances todate, it's quite unbelievable that o'neill hasnt featured yet.
Quote from: SLIGONIAN on April 14, 2008, 11:41:49 AM
I asked him how far away is EGAN TAYLOR and MCPARTLAND, he said mcpartland maybe as a sub but not start, the other 2 are long term and may not be back for a long time even CSFC which is worrying if true.
How can taylor be such a long term injury? Hasnt he played for harps the last 2 games??
I'd expect a big performance on sunday. In fairness, we've been in these situations before and more often than not, we usually come up trumps. With the 3pt margin to make up, we're really up against it this time.
Maybe this selector will take my advice. ;). I wont hold my breath.
Well when he said that about oneill I honestly thought he was joking although I do think he is a good footballer but never played well or consistently to suggest hes a definite starter for county. Not that he doesnt have the potential but hes yet to show it. The thing that confuses me about peoples opinion on Oneill, all the guys on here seem to believe hes definite starter, but on hoganstand none of them rate him, actually I posted that oneill maybe should get a run, and a few lads said lets not lose the run of ourselves. As among older folk and outside the internet, Im talking friends, clubmates, family have similiar opinion to myself that oneill , what has he done for county in 6 yrs involved? He hasnt been a regular starter under 3 different managers? When I pushed this last time i challenged guys to justify why he should be starting and as usual when there was no evidence and couldnt handle it they went back to bashing me again? Where would yee play oneill? Who would you drop? Is he better than phillips? My last memory of oneill for Sligo was the Leitrim qualifier 2006 which we won in parc sean, he got a unbeliavle point that day with his left foot. I thank him for that. Has he played since? I can honestly say if he is playing well for coolera he deserves a shot but in my book he needs a fair few decent performance in a black jersey before I call him a definite starter.
Not sure we are on about the same taylor, Are you telling me Tony Taylor is back playing for harps after his long injury layoff???? I hope your right.
So do I expect a big one, we did it in wicklow and we can do it again.
Karol O'Neill has been very unlucky with injuries over the years and I suppose most people haven't seen him enough to realise how good he is. He is our best player in Coolera. He was superb again on Sunday for us - the best player on the pitch by a good way. I get to see a lot of him and I make no apologies for saying he should be in the team because it is a fact - he should be. Put no. 7 on his back and worry about the other positions. He can do a good job in the half forwards too if necessary but to get the best out of him he needs to be played in his natural position (one he has played in very little for Sligo).
If you remember he was dreadfully unlucky to be dropped last year when Tommy Breheny changed his tactics during the league. He was playing the 7th defender role (lining out at 15 and coming back sweeping) and did it to perfection - cutting out opposition attacks and setting up ours. He didn't get back in during the league and then suffered an ankle injury in a club game to rule him out of the Connacht campaign.
Anyway - we've a good few problems but we need to put them behind us and whatever team we put out has to do the business. The dryer the better from a Sligo point of view as mentioned earlier but regardless of the conditions we must win. I've no idea who they will pick but it will be more about attitude than the team they pick. If guys aren't doing it then off with them asap. Div 4 is a shite place to be and we must avoid it.
Sligonian, I didnt say O'Neill should be a definite starter but in my opinion he's a better hb than kivlehan, mcgovern & possibly davey. McGovernn has played well for sligo in the past but from what I've seen this year, he is severely lacking confidence and I would have liked to see O'Neill given a chance. Obviously, once given a chance he needs to prove he's good enough to hold onto the jersey.
Quote from: SLIGONIAN on April 14, 2008, 03:53:29 PM
Not sure we are on about the same taylor, Are you telling me Tony Taylor is back playing for harps after his long injury layoff???? I hope your right.
Yes. Tony Taylor. I was talking to a man this morning who tells me he played the last 2 games for harps. I was as shocked as you to hear it but he seemed 100% certain. I hope he's right.
Apparently Paul Taylor scored 1-5 for the Harps yesterday too.
Thats fair enough stevo-08, It kinda confirms me that this selector was just was probably not telling me or anyone full truth of what going on. So I take my conversation with him as pinch of salt.
Im at the stage now where I accept everyone involved is doing there best with Sligo, team selections,coaching,underage and while I may not agree I just have to accept it. So I go on Sunday hoping whatever team is selected does the business and I'll be happy regardless if i agree or disagree with team selection.
Regarding Oneill debate even before Id never question his ablilty, just the definite starter comment, he is obviously doing well for coolera and training well so of course he deserves a shot. Stevo I would disagree about Donovan and Davey not being as good, Donovan is corner back for starters and isnt in direct compeititon with oneill. Donovan hasnt been as good as last yr but is doing fine just needs a little more sharpness. Davey has been outstanding all yr, sligos best player in my opinion but i believe would be an awesome Half forward. I would then going by what seanie says give oneill his chance at no5. Kivelhan was Half forward the last day and had poor game, not sure hes good enough. Mcgovern has struggled this yr and is lacking confidence but in fairness to the lad he has been consistently good for us over the yrs and just needs good man to man management skills to get him going again.
If every player was fit flying and on form, whats our best starting 15 team?
So it comes down to this. We have pulled out of tight spots before, but few quite like this. Must beat Longford by three if Leitrim or Limerick lose, and win by seven if they somehow manage to share the points. Should get the music from "The Great Escape" on in the car for the journey up! Very hard to know how it could go, would have wrote off Longford after the Louth game, but they seem to be more optimistic after beating Limerick. It's in their hands if nothing else.
O'Neill surely deserves a run but we've been here before. Hard to know with the recent introductions how they will line out, but surely Sligonian you don't expect managers/selectors to be telling you everything that goes on, cards, chest etc. Take it from someone who knows. But regardless of who goes out there they will need our full support in the task. Surprised to see that Taylor is back (if indeed correct, not many reports in the papers these days, papers should get their act together really), though it is a year or so since he got the injury.
Quote from: SLIGONIAN on April 14, 2008, 05:06:26 PM
Stevo I would disagree about Donovan and Davey not being as good, Donovan is corner back for starters and isnt in direct compeititon with oneill. Donovan hasnt been as good as last yr but is doing fine just needs a little more sharpness.
Just a clarification. I did mean McGovern in my post above, now edited. Apologies - although I doubt im the first man to mix the 2 harps lads up. And totally agree, Donovan is doing just fine. Davey is always worth his place on the team and will always give his all. But I think we have a very light hb line with the likes of donovan, kivlehan, davey, mcnamara. ONeill would add a bit of strength and, assuming maguire plays at full back, I would have liked to see a hb line of davey/phillips/o'neill or davey/neachtain/o'neill given a chance.
Quote from: Owenmoresider on April 14, 2008, 10:09:28 PM
Surprised to see that Taylor is back (if indeed correct, not many reports in the papers these days, papers should get their act together really), though it is a year or so since he got the injury.
OMS, my "source" on taylor could be completely wrong but he seemed 100%. Is there anyway we can verify this - match reports, etc. As you say, i'd expect something in the papers about it.
Quote from: SLIGONIAN on April 14, 2008, 11:41:49 AM
I asked him how far away is EGAN TAYLOR and MCPARTLAND, he said mcpartland maybe as a sub but not start, the other 2 are long term and may not be back for a long time even CSFC which is worrying if true.
Your selector friend is telling you porkie pies Sligonian. Both Egan and T Taylor played in the recent Tourlestrane Harps match. Egan playing full match and would have played Sunday if he was in the Country and Taylor appearing at half time. Another county panelist i was speaking to reckons Egan will be in contention to play this Sunday. Great boost for the county team to have 2 of our best lads returning just before chmpionship
Quote from: SLIGONIAN on April 14, 2008, 05:13:02 PM
If every player was fit flying and on form, whats our best starting 15 team?
Our best 15 in my opiniuon is
Greene
Harrison
McGuire
Donovan
McGovern
Egan
Davey
Quinn
Henry
Curran
O'Hara
S Davey
Kelly
Sweeney
McPartland
Hope i haven't forgotten anyone. May be a bit early for Coen, Gaughan etc
Mano, I think you'd have to make room for a "fit, flying and on form" Brehony.
Quote from: stevo-08 on April 15, 2008, 09:40:17 AM
Mano, I think you'd have to make room for a "fit, flying and on form" Brehony.
Bloody hell how did i omit Brehony and McNamara too.
Brehony in for Sean Davey, McNamara in for Sweeney with Brehony in corner and McN moving out
Garry Gaughan told not to play club last weekend... all the soundings are he could start sunday either half back or half forward.
It would be a gamble but it is likely. Egan will not start he's not ready yet and hasn't played enough football.
I wouldn't play Sweeney in a game like this on sunday he's not a team player and has proved nothing this year in the league to say he starts.
Karol O'Neill good play put huge step up from club football to a game of this size on sunday... were do you play him he's hasn't the pace for the back line and is he a natural scoring forward?
Phillips should be cb no question playing great football at the moment and this side needs an edge to it a couple of fighters ohara can't do it all by himself.
OMS no I didnt expect him to give away much, but I accept now that he was telling me porkies. In fairness to me would of killed him to tell me the truth about our injured players??????? Although Im delighted he is wrong and that both are back playing.
Gaughan should start, great ball carrier and pace and there is cutting in him too. He is way ahead of mchugh who started against louth.
Playing either ONEILL or PHILLIPS is a huge risk at this stage. My point is these lads didnt even get a run in the FBD or any league game. They should of got game time before this. We all know there strengths, for me as a forward watching the supply into the forwards during our league it has been atrocious. Oneill and phillips are outstaanding passers of the ball and are physical men who would of course strenghten our HB line and it does need strengthening and most importantly are excellent suppliers of quality ball. Whatever they lack in pace others have pace in our backline so there would be a good blend. If either start on Sunday I wish them well but if they play bad its not really there fault as it will be down to lack of county games and thats management team fault.
Sweeney has had enough chances to prove himself starting and hasnt delivered.
My best Sligo Starting 15 for CSFC.
Greene
Harrison
McGuire
Donovan
Curran/gaughan/oneill
Phiilips
McGovern
Egan
Quinn
S Davey
McNamara
Kelly
Brehony
O Hara
McPartland
Now some(everyone) will argue about my positions for Curran & kelly. Everyone knows Brian curran has more defensive qualities than attacking and is a vital break winner so he deserves a place maybe, why not try him HB line. He is more a HB than HF. That moves J Davey up then who has more strengths attacking than curran. I can honestly back in 2002 if anyone said J Davey class HB i would of disagreed and I know everyone would. So I expect the same with my selection of curran. It is a toss of coin for me for that position with gaughan/oneill/curran.
Philips will be rusty as he hasnt had much game time but needs to get a chance. Brehony is scoring forward and deserves a place some where in the forward. He might just do well there on the wing although I do have reservations about his pace and ball winning. If it wasnt working I would switch Kelly out to HF line. Toss of a coin that positional choice. Kelly got scores last sun so maybe CF would suit but has the pace to excell in HF line with his pace and vision. He mightin be the strongest but he has the pace to break tackles and he hasnt scored enough consistently for me to be a corner forward.
Lastly sweeney, coen, gaughan, kivelhan, beirne, Oneill, mctiernan Flannery all to come on if any player is underperforming.
For the longford game: Flannery is a cert to start, was awesome from frees with right foot which we do need,Gaughan is likely as well with a good 2nd half performance the last day. McNamara will start HB as will J Davey id say.
id leave curran half forward for longford game, no point making too many positional switches together. flannery take frees, dont trust davey with them. kelly should start wing forward, ive seem him play there at club and schools level, he finds it easier to score on the run comming from deep. only thing is we would miss him in the corner cause he always gets out infront of his man. gaughan might b better as a second half sub, wins alot of frees when he runs with the ball. dont think sweeney deserves to start, id even have mctiernan before him. suppose it depends if johnny mc is fit to start whether either of those lads start. mcpartland is a great man to get a few scores. dont know where they will play brehony but it shouldt be full forward cause the full back will bully him off the ball.
if we win by 4 points then we stay up even if limerick and leitrim draw because of the hammering down inflicted on limerick makes there score difference closer to us. i think anyway. that would be alot easier than sweating on the other game to go our way. i reckon limerick will beat leitrim anyway. they are fairly poor away from carrick
Just to clarify as stated that is my CSFC team not longford game selection, I agree not the best idea to make too many changes for longford. Flannery wil start after his good showing the last day but Im not convinced by him. He lacks pace and i think he would struggle in CSFC. Brehony is corner forward.
Just to point out all long range frees should be taken by Johnny Davey got a few corkers against louth. Let flannery and brehony take the ones closer to the goal.
The scoring difference below. Right lets say Leitrim and limerick do DRAW. We would need to beat longford by 9pts to avoid relegation. Best case scenario is either one beat each other leaving us with a 3pt victory to get.
Played Won Drawn Lost For Against Pts Diff Pts.
Fermanagh 6 5 1 0 89 74 15 11
Wexford 6 4 2 0 85 68 17 10
Down 6 4 0 2 97 88 9 8
Louth 6 3 0 3 1 81 -80 6
Longford 6 2 0 4 85 98 -13 4
Leitrim 6 2 0 4 70 89 -19 4
Limerick 6 1 1 4 82 91 -9 3
Sligo 6 1 0 5 70 87 -17 2
right u are sligonian. dont know where i was getting the score difference from. well at least from limericks point of view a draw is not enough for them if we were to lose to longford. so they be all out for win. id hav to agree with ya on flannery. tried before and didnt do alot, doesnt do alot from play. still its not like many of our forwards are setting the world alight with massive scoring displays. jordan will prob have kevin beirne in his team somewhere on sunday, hope its not midfield. heard he did ok against louth at FF. wasnt at da game though, livin abroad.
Quote from: burgh on April 17, 2008, 12:22:59 PM
right u are sligonian. dont know where i was getting the score difference from. well at least from limericks point of view a draw is not enough for them if we were to lose to longford. so they be all out for win. id hav to agree with ya on flannery. tried before and didnt do alot, doesnt do alot from play. still its not like many of our forwards are setting the world alight with massive scoring displays. jordan will prob have kevin beirne in his team somewhere on sunday, hope its not midfield. heard he did ok against louth at FF. wasnt at da game though, livin abroad.
Beirne didnt play against Louth, The team was Greene,harrison,mcguire,donovan,j davey,mcnamara,mcgovern,ohara,quinn,e mchugh,curran,kivelhan,flannery,sweeney,kelly. Subs that came on gaughan,gilmartin,coen and sean davey. Fair play to ya showing an interest even though your abroad, ocean fm online if u wanna listen to match. I'll be listening to my radio on my mobile for updates on leitirm limerick game aswell while at longford. You make a good point limerick will be all out for the win so we can be fairly sure theres no conspirary theories. I think limerick might be shooting themselves in the foot aswell, leitrim love tight pitches and fixing the game for kilmallock not parc na ngael could cost limerick.
Beirne didnt play against Louth, The team was Greene,harrison,mcguire,donovan,j davey,mcnamara,mcgovern,ohara,quinn,e mchugh,curran,kivelhan,flannery,sweeney,kelly. Subs that came on gaughan,gilmartin,coen and sean davey. Fair play to ya showing an interest even though your abroad, ocean fm online if u wanna listen to match. I'll be listening to my radio on my mobile for updates on leitirm limerick game aswell while at longford. You make a good point limerick will be all out for the win so we can be fairly sure theres no conspirary theories. I think limerick might be shooting themselves in the foot aswell, leitrim love tight pitches and fixing the game for kilmallock not parc na ngael could cost limerick.
[/quote]
did he play FF against fermanagh?? prob wont get a game dis week so. dont think mchugh wil get start either. not bad player but not ready i dont think for senior.
Quote from: burgh on April 17, 2008, 09:33:37 PM
Beirne didnt play against Louth, The team was Greene,harrison,mcguire,donovan,j davey,mcnamara,mcgovern,ohara,quinn,e mchugh,curran,kivelhan,flannery,sweeney,kelly. Subs that came on gaughan,gilmartin,coen and sean davey. Fair play to ya showing an interest even though your abroad, ocean fm online if u wanna listen to match. I'll be listening to my radio on my mobile for updates on leitirm limerick game aswell while at longford. You make a good point limerick will be all out for the win so we can be fairly sure theres no conspirary theories. I think limerick might be shooting themselves in the foot aswell, leitrim love tight pitches and fixing the game for kilmallock not parc na ngael could cost limerick.
did he play FF against fermanagh?? prob wont get a game dis week so. dont think mchugh wil get start either. not bad player but not ready i dont think for senior.
[/quote]
I think he was selected FF but played HF he actually wasnt bad in the first half but faded in 2nd half but obviously wasnt the only one.
You can sing that about Eoin Mchugh, hasnt even done it for our club yet never mind county. The lad has been very lucky so to speak getting selected with Sligo all the way through so far. Thats not to say he wont do it in future, id love nothing more than a st molaise gael excelling with the county. It would boost the club and youngsters in the area. There arent many GAA gaels in our area. Gavin Gilsenan is our best hope in my opinion and then Johnny kelly. Not sure wilson or mchugh will do it at county level but lets see.
I expect and would pick myself the Connaught Championship winning back line. Whatever the debates about No. 6 , there is no alternatives for this match. Ohara and quinn will be midfield. Again cant see any alternatives. Sligonian is right that we wont win with the same half forward line as the last match. Davey and Brehony should give us more options in the half forward line if fit to start. With the constant chopping and changing over the season with cawley , Mc tiernan and flannery all getting some game time its impossible to know the forawrd line that will be picked. I would pick Curran , Brehony , Henry , Kelly , Beirne , Mc Tiernan with Gaughan, Coen , Davey , Sweeney and Flannery as options. Its a small half forward line hence playing Henry but its still a big ask for O Hara to play midfield at this stage. Strangely no one here is discussing what may be the closest selction debate of them all - Goalie. Combining Greenes mistakes against Limerick and Louth vrs Farrells highly impressive U21 campaign this is much closer competition than you would think. Still Greenes Experience will probably sway the decision but it will be a close run thing.
Recent attempts at teams for Championship i think we should leave until after Sunday and see how injuries are shaping up.
We normally play well at this time of the year and under pressure so a 3 point win is achievable. Would worry about the draw in Limerick as there wont be much in that match either and we wont beat Longford by 8 points anyhow.
Come on Longford, ye shower of f*ckin wasters, don't take me over to ye!!! ::)
sligo gone down. disaster
Anyone there for the match? Am I right in thinking a late goal won it?
Well - won it is all relative. Sligo had to win by 3 or so points and it was level at 12 pts each with 5 to go. Longford were down to 14 midway thro 2nd half as Declan 'C' got two yellas.
Kavanagh got a goal at the death alright but Sligo's funeral was underway at that stage.
Leitrim banished to the Cooper wastelands as well so not a great day for football west of the Shannon (then I spose the Rossies did stop the rot somewhat)
A sad day after so many years out of Div 4. Overall we got what we deserved for a lacklustre league campaign. We could have ulled it off today but didn't score enough in our dominant second half spell. Moving Beirne out to midfield was a disastrous switch that we paid for. Yong Gilmartin was being beaten in the air but was doing ok besides. To be fair they had got a lot of switches right before that but they were obvious ones.
Well done to Longford. Kavanagh is some player. What we'd do for one like him.
So must beat London and Mayo to avoid the Murphy Cup.
Absoultely Gutted, just back from the game.
Sligo team that started Greene, Harrison, Mcguire, donovan,J davey,Mcnamara, Naughton, Ohara, Gilmartin, Kivelhan, brehony, curran, Kelly, Beirne, Flannery.
We raced into a 4-1 lead against the breeze playnig good football but hampered by some players on the sligo who had to be carried.Then longford came into it. Level at HT 7-7. Longford started the brighter in 2nd half got 2 scores then Sligo woke up ON THE LINE. But some shocking decisions. 1, they took off mcnamara who Ive been saying isnt a CHB for 2 yrs now and Im sick of saying it. Man is useless without the ball. But instead of pushing him up to the forwards and taking off kivelhan and beirne they leave them on and take mcnamara off altogether. Phillips came on and he is too loose and probably not match fit so its hard to judge him today. Gaughan came on then for kivelhan A WAY TOO LATE but of course made a huge difference, Sligo started to play and scores 5 in row to lead 12-10 and longford in trouble then another great move involving the impressive curran put gaughan 1 on 1 with GK only to hit the crossbar. That would of put us 5pts up with 12 mins left. Then longford woke up seeing that happen was a boost to them and then 13-13 then they got man sent off for what I dont know. But as usual with our circus on the line the extra man made no difference. Longford got goal and were comfortable at the end.
Now Brian kavangh was outstanding and put in MOTM display and I was diappointed by donovan though sometimes he was roasted but in fairness kavangh was nearly unstoppable.
O Hara for me was awesome and seemed to be back to near his best. Maizy runs etc... Curran too did very well and mark brehony. Harrison did well first half but faded and naughton in fairness did well on the ball. Flannery was ok firat half but lacks pace and non existant 2nd half. J davey fought hard but Berry probably won that battle.
This game was lost by our management set up. End of Story. When I heard the team announced I could of choked. We started with at least 2 or 3 paasengers, Kivlehan was atrocious, not even close to county standard, what he is doing in the HF line, Kevin Beirne another disaster. The selection of gilmartin too is shocking, the poor lad even got sick on the field at one stage, How is any man who hasnt played all yr expected to be up to pace thrown into this one. I presuming Quinn is injured and sweeney too.
Dont tell me we dont have anyone else, why was gaughan not started? He did well in louth.
We have no chance aginst MAYO with current management set up. The cant seem to see obvious things which highlight there lack of football knowledge. Now we are relegated and mangement are 99% to blame.
On the way out my Dad had to console one of the players mothers who was distraught. We didnt know her but she had to talk to someone she said. Sligo football isnt just a game is it some of our lives. The management aren't GIVING US A CHANCE. If we picked the right team we'd have half a chance. Then itd be up to the players.
If we had right team out in our dominant spells we would of scored MORE and that is why the should take the blame.
Back to travelling to Antrim,waterford,KILKENNY,LONDON,carlow, etc.. cant wait. :'( :'( :'(. honestly feel like crying writing this.
Put it this way Sligonian and other Sligo people, if Sligo had won today, maybe ye might have taken yere foot off the pedal against Mayo, now ye simply have to win and put us in the qualifiers for ye to stay out of the Tommy Murphy Cup.
Quote from: Farrandeelin on April 20, 2008, 07:17:04 PM
Put it this way Sligonian and other Sligo people, if Sligo had won today, maybe ye might have taken yere foot off the pedal against Mayo, now ye simply have to win and put us in the qualifiers for ye to stay out of the Tommy Murphy Cup.
With our management team we havent a hope. Of course leading up to the wicklow game last yr i had it in my head that if we lost we would have to beat ros and imagine the hunger to stay out of the TM cup and this yr it happens but Mayo are way ahead of ros and its in castlebar. Our own clowns cant even get CHB right never mind our HF line. Its a mess.
Theyve had the whole FBD and NFL and now were are worse than ever. What must our good players like J DAVEY, CURRAN, OHARA, MCGUIRE etc be thinking when they see beirne or kivelhan losing the ball or giving it away every 5 seconds with GAUGHAN on the line and COEN. Them lads are sick of carrying dead weight around. Im sick of watching it. Give our PLAYERS a chance. Please just pick the right team and get rid of these passenger, no team can play with 3 or 4 especially at county...
Sligonian - I haven't seen any game so in some senses I can't comment... but I know the way the system works and I know a lot of the players and backroom people involved and am still in touch with some to get a reasonable read on the situation... so I will
On the whole, people should not be hugely surprised about what has happened over the past two months. I'd go further and say that we should not be surprised at what has happened over the past fifteen months.
What happened last summer was the unfinished business of '02 / '03 when a particularly good (by Sligo standards) bunch of players came good together but didn't close the deal despite having it in their hands to do so. 2004 saw us eat our own in the infamous J Kerins / TM Cup row, a split that endured into '05 and was added to by Corrigan's failed reign. In that time we fell out with each other, lost players and lost focus. It took Tom Breheny a year to pull everybody together, a process that cemented about this time last year. The rest as they say is history and with the feeling back, a squad, if not quite the team, built around the nucleus of '02/'03 delivered.
It was a squad though lacking hugely in scoring ability as the two big score getters of the previous era were gone as front liners - Paul Taylor and Dessie - and had not been replaced While it still had to be won, and we did, the quality of performance in that championship and particularly of forward performance against both Rosc and Galway was limited.The lack of penetration and movement was almost unbelievable at inter county level and was cruelly exposed in Croke Park by a Cork team that really didn't have to be good to win. That may seem harsh but it is true and has carried into this season, except that now, unlike a year ago, there is no unfinished business; there is no cause. The hunger has been quenched and no matter how you dress it up, lads that spent much of their playing days in Div 1 or a variation of same, were always going to be suspect in a competitive Div 3 having spent the winter eating out on a Connaught championship.
The 'rookie' manager probably didn't help - there certainly is unlikely to be that incredible bond that the players spoke about during last summer (even before they won) - but it is hard to avoid the conclusion that Breheny knew exactly what was coming and got out while he could - he was right.
I don't know if Jordan is the man for the job - I'd be very suspicious of a manager that has a go at his player's through the media after only five competitive matches - but time will tell. However I think the comments here about some of the players are a little uncalled for - it's an amateur game yet and they are I'm sure doing the best that they can and are proud. I'm equally sure that they are hurting more tonight than any of us and they have to get back up on the bike in a few days time and start building for the summer.
It's worth noting too that even heroes have to start somewhere and not always as instant hits - for example when Paul Durcan first appeared in a county shirt in the early 90s it was a good many years before the public at large appreciated and / or acknowledged his merits (I know because I was on the panel at the time) so back off the kids that are learning and if ye can't have something positive to say about them, say nothing
In respect of this summer, I would encourage the management to be bold - give youth it's chance. Unless Mayo lose it completely, we won't beat them There is certainly no point IMO in trying to keep a team (that has done its thing and is moving on) together in a vain attempt to win that game when there are players of the same or better ability on the sideline that will only start to improve further by playing. Pick the best team available on raw talent and if there are two players of equal ability competing for a spot, give it to the younger guy that needs the chance.
We should beat London which can be the blooding of a few, we are unlikely to beat Mayo but the experience will bring on a few and then we should aim to win the TM Cup - three 'lose or your out' games including one in Croke Park would do a lot for a new young panel and would set them up a lot better for trying to get out of Div 4 next year than to stick with the older guys and thus leave that new team trying to get experience and gel for the first time when that League campaign starts next year.
Time for leadership now. Let's hope it is there and if the management don't have the courage to do the right thing, then let's not hang around waiting for them to figure it out. If we have a management failure, let's make it is what the business gurus call 'a fast failure' - hope you are watching Murph!
I am well aware of the status of some of the people on this board within sligo GAA.
You mention the system and you know how it works. That to me is one of the problems. Why in province of 5 counties from underage to senior have we 1 connaght title to show for our GREAT efforts being made? Can someone explain that?
In my posts I do say negative stuff. IS IT NOT TRUE what Ive said about kivelhan, mchugh and beirne? Can someone say to me thats a lie??????????? Its time for straight talking not positive BS. In case anyone doesnt notice tomorrow I said plenty of positive stuff about certain players. Im not blaming the players because its not Mcnamara fault he selected CHB its NOT kivelhan, beirnes, gilmartins fault they were selected.
PADDY in all fairnes I live in the NOW you live in the past. Going on about 02 is futile now. That team is gone. As you havent seen us this yr it impossible for you to see what I see.
We could still PICK better teams couldnt we??????? Im being proved right on alot of negatives because there true. Some people cant handle the truth. THATS WHAT IM TALKING ABOUT. Stupid mistakes being made. He had the whole FBD AND NFL to get young up coming players into the squad.
Can anyone understand why GAUGHAN didnt start? Can anyone understand MCNAMARA at CHB? Would anyone start kivelhan and beirne going on past performances? Its not there fault there best is not good enough? Why was coen not given a run? He showed up better than kelly for u21s. Thats 4or 5 mistakes alone today by management team.
What I AM SAYING HAS nothing to do with system, nothing to do last yr. We could easily make a better shape of it right NOW. But it is already too late.
You talk about Tommy Brehony getting out and yes it looks as so it was right but that man made plenty of obvious mistakes too. Just got lucky last yr with connaght football being so poor simple as that. I believe if we had decent manager who didnt make so many mistakes we get alot MORE from our current panel thats all.
Pick our best team and give the players a chance. Its time for honest reflection and its time to be men. Say what has to be said and do what has to be done.
How can ther hunger be gone PADDY? Did Noel not say THIS IS NOT THE END IT IS BEGINNING..................are we fans to not to have any expectations at all. Are we not to demand the management team put out our best TEAM.
Quote from: SLIGONIAN on April 21, 2008, 12:33:25 AM
I am well aware of the status of some of the people on this board within sligo GAA.
You mention the system and you know how it works. That to me is one of the problems. Why in province of 5 counties from underage to senior have we 1 connaght title to show for our GREAT efforts being made? Can someone explain that?
In my posts I do say negative stuff. IS IT NOT TRUE what Ive said about kivelhan, mchugh and beirne? Can someone say to me thats a lie??????????? Its time for straight talking not positive BS. In case anyone doesnt notice tomorrow I said plenty of positive stuff about certain players. Im not blaming the players because its not Mcnamara fault he selected CHB its NOT kivelhan, beirnes, gilmartins fault they were selected.
PADDY in all fairnes I live in the NOW you live in the past. Going on about 02 is futile now. That team is gone. As you havent seen us this yr it impossible for you to see what I see.
We could still PICK better teams couldnt we??????? Im being proved right on alot of negatives because there true. Some people cant handle the truth. THATS WHAT IM TALKING ABOUT. Stupid mistakes being made. He had the whole FBD AND NFL to get young up coming players into the squad.
Can anyone understand why GAUGHAN didnt start? Can anyone understand MCNAMARA at CHB? Would anyone start kivelhan and beirne going on past performances? Its not there fault there best is not good enough? Why was coen not given a run? He showed up better than kelly for u21s. Thats 4or 5 mistakes alone today by management team.
What I AM SAYING HAS nothing to do with system, nothing to do last yr. We could easily make a better shape of it right NOW. But it is already too late.
You talk about Tommy Brehony getting out and yes it looks as so it was right but that man made plenty of obvious mistakes too. Just got lucky last yr with connaght football being so poor simple as that. I believe if we had decent manager who didnt make so many mistakes we get alot MORE from our current panel thats all.
Pick our best team and give the players a chance. Its time for honest reflection and its time to be men. Say what has to be said and do what has to be done.
How can ther hunger be gone PADDY? Did Noel not say THIS IS NOT THE END IT IS BEGINNING..................are we fans to not to have any expectations at all. Are we not to demand the management team put out our best TEAM.
The best team is always going to be something thats open to debate. Yesterday I m convinced that Our u21 management got things wrong selection - wise that cost us a valuable semi final -or partly did anyway. Thing is Sligo got relegated over a whole league campaign. Now like Maughan in Ros, another Mayo man will take the rap [ and Peter Forde likewise in Galway] Surely this slump started V Cork last year in championship. Why did Brehony resign a team that just won a Connnacht Championship first time since 7? Would he have resigned if he believed they would boot on from that or did he believe that that was going to be as good as it gets? Unless the incoming manager repeated last years Connacht win he was always going to be in trouble. Plus all these league divisions are tough if you end up in them. At least in division 1 teams can generate a bit more momentum - and games are usually pacey - to express themselves. 3 and 4 are bear pits.
Sligonian - clearly you have a very considered and indepth knowledge of Sligo football and of life in general given the speed and focus of your response. If you weren't so keen to have all the answers and to talk down anybody who repeats the question, you might find that we agree on more than we disagree on.
For Sligo football to progress, those charged with its direction (who were elected by people like you and I through the clubs of which we are members so there is a place to question their stewardship every year if one wishes) have to get to the root cause of our shortcomings which are very little to do with who picked who or who was picked in any game that was played this year and have a lot to do with structures and leadership in clubs, schools and colleges. I'm sure our more mature and better informed posters will add further to the advice in that regard given that they also contribute week in week out where it matters - in clubs and on the field, and like our players, take pride in putting their name to it.
My core point is that we should not be surprised by what has happened in the past two months and my post is nothing about living in the past and all about trying to explain that some of the criticisms of recent events on this board are really only addressing the symptoms, not the problems.
If you can't see that - then at least stay out of the way of the people that can.
Paddy - excellent posts as usual. I read your first one there last evening but didn't have time to reply. I agree with your analysis. I think now is a time for cool heads and regrouping. The league is over and even though it was sad to get demoted to Div 4 we must now regroup and move forward for the championship. Try to focus on the positive and work on the negatives. The young players coming through are a positive. Jordan, to his credit and maybe to his cost, largely left those players to the U-21 management until their Connacht tilt was over. A correct decision if you are exercising long term thinking in my view. Along with some of these emerging players we have one or two proven injured lads to come back in. We should do enough to get over London and hopefully give Mayo a real rattle when we'll go in as total underdogs. When the hard ground returns we'll be a different team. O'Hara's performance yesterday, Naughton's continuing improvement, Phillips return, Gaughans energy, Kelly's tidiness and workrate - in defeat these were encouraging signs. Lets not get too emotional about this setback.
I have to say I admire yer optimism and emotional restraint in the face of such disappointment.
Can I just say Im not writing off any of the players, just basing my opinion on past recent performance that maybe some shouldnt of started yday.
I read an article on LIAM OG GORMLEY in the champion a few weeks. Very indepth interview. I was impressed at the structures hes putting in place and the effort going into underage. More of enphasis on development rather than winning up to ages of 14. I trained my local national school for a year when I was in college and I could see thats were the key to our future success lies. The players carried that development into the club.
Unfortunetly my club is full of internal politics and I know alot of our supporters, players are quite disillusioned at the minute. The system is a huge problem and as everyone knows our club is huge area. The guidance isnt there at the top and it is hard for our players to motivate themselves when they see what goes on.
Just on the Sligo manager, isnt it a 3 man panel who select him???
Anyway I have to say Im not sure I blame Jordan. Im not even sure hes calling the shots. I know alot of people who feel the same.
For me though there just is no excuse for some of the mistakes being made. Can I ask paddy, what is the root cause of our shortcomings in your opinion or from what you hear?
Sligonian, why do you use CAPS LOCK intermittently? It's very annoying :D
Quote from: AZOffaly on April 21, 2008, 11:28:06 AM
Sligonian, why do you use CAPS LOCK intermittently? It's very annoying :D
Not sure why, I guess its an unconcious habit. If it is that annoying I'll stop for YOU AZ. ;)
GoOd MaN.
Have to agree with most of the points made above, in reality we've looked like relegation material for a while, and it's no surprise that we have gone that way. Very disappointing though when we were in the position needed to survive, if only Gaughan had got the goal or point. Kavanagh was excellent though, Donovan handled him early on but found it difficult as the game wore on, and it's not often Johnny Davey gets beat in a chase but he had a tough time with Padraig Berry, who did well for LD. Changes made were neccessary and should probably remain that way long-term, but bringing Davey on for Gilmartin was madness, his first contribution was to get booked for a silly foul. The notion that he still has something to offer should be banished now. Flannery looked ok early on but faded out akltogether. Bringing Byrne out the field didn't do us any good either, wasn't at the races at all.
Good to see phillips get a run at last, showed more cut than McNamara had shown, I suspect if MMcN went in for that ball in the first half with more vigour, rather than hestitating then he wouldn'r have got hurt (though it was a bit of a lunge from LD's FF). Phillips left his mark on the LD sub anyway. O'Hara did well enough (and din't rrise to the LD chb's bait too) but for one or two dodgy passes. Gilmartin showed potential, was Quinn injured I assume? Curran was much beter in 2nd half, poor in 1st, Breheny still the most reliable scoring option, coming into better form now it must be said. Kivlehan isn't a great option for HB and neither for HF either.
Well done to Longford, SS, BB, Laueleye and co on avoiding the depths of D4 and Tommy Cooper. Ye probably didn't expect that after the Louth game. Still would expect Westmeath to win in the Leinster tie though.
One consolation - the Leitrim crowd can't gloat too much at our demise.
I just remembered seanie that youve posted a few times you have suspicions on why we do poor in the league. Can you tell my why you think we dont perform well in the league?
Paddy in your post you say the sligo players hunger maybe gone after last yr. That reinforces Jordans criiticisms in the local press questioning the players atitude. If a players hunger is gone why commit again. I mean no ones forcing the players to commit. You talk of unfinished business being completed an all.
In 2002 I knew and we all knew Forde cost us the final with leaving mcguire, durkin mcgarty etc on the bench. That was thrown away by team selection. Sorry for going on about your post but I read 4 times now to try a see your points. I agree with some but dont buy into others. If you can answer my queries above and here Id really appreciate, I respect others perspective and it may change my perceptions, opinions.
QuoteStill would expect Westmeath to win in the Leinster tie though.
You won't find too many arguments with us on that score. ::)
Quote from: Owenmoresider on April 21, 2008, 11:54:07 AMWell done to Longford, SS, BB, Laueleye and co on avoiding the depths of D4 and Tommy Cooper. Ye probably didn't expect that after the Louth game.
No, to put it mildly. I think we're just relieved not to be out in the wilderness for the summer.
QuoteStill would expect Westmeath to win in the Leinster tie though.
You'll not get any disagreement on that proposition from this quarter.
The underlying issues that were there at the time of the Louth match are still there.
From a footballing perspective I dont think I seen as many balls picked up from the ground and passes given away. Longford defence is very loose and although we'd love to have kavanagh. Yer relying too much on him. He is in the same class as cooper, forde, freeman, bradley. In the first half yer supply into kavanagh was killing him. Having to run 30 yrds and out towards the sideline is no good. Need to improve on that but as game wore on it improved.
QuoteLongford defence is very loose
There are a good few of that back six that wouldn't be there, but for injuries, delinquency and disinterest.
Yesterday was:
D Sheridan
P McDonnell, A O'Connor, C Conefrey
Declan C Reilly, E Wiliams, P Kelly
All going to plan, I imagine that Sunday week will be:
D Sheridan
D Brady, D Masterson, C Conefrey
S Mulligan, N Farrell, Declan C Reilly
Sligonian - seeing this on the fly - will reply when I get a chance but on one point. Restarint / optimism is built on the basis of being here before. I was in a Sligo dressing room in Ballyragget Co. Kilkenny and Lemybrien Co. Waterford... and some of those that were alongside me on those days later played in the '97 Connaught Final and subsequently in Div 1... and are not that long gone off the panel. There is always hope.
Quote from: paddypastit on April 21, 2008, 07:44:05 PM
Sligonian - seeing this on the fly - will reply when I get a chance but on one point. Restarint / optimism is built on the basis of being here before. I was in a Sligo dressing room in Ballyragget Co. Kilkenny and Lemybrien Co. Waterford... and some of those that were alongside me on those days later played in the '97 Connaught Final and subsequently in Div 1... and are not that long gone off the panel. There is always hope.
I have a few questions put to ya alright, look forward to the replies, Ive been there before too supporting sligo in Div4 with about 10 others. Took us ages to get out of it. I know im still young but those were painful memories. In one game against kilkenny in kent park we won 1-14 to 1-10 i remember there are lots more. There is hope as always in the dark times and its I suppose what keeps me going supporting sligo all these yrs. And it could be worse at least ive seen us win connaght last yr. I try to live in the present moment not the past so I want that feeling again though. Not easy to accept the way the league went.