http://www.breakingnews.ie/ireland/clare-daly-after-breathalyser-i-had-a-hot-whiskey-for-cold-582939.html (http://www.breakingnews.ie/ireland/clare-daly-after-breathalyser-i-had-a-hot-whiskey-for-cold-582939.html)
United Left Alliance TD Clare Daly has admitted she was stopped by gardaí and breathalysed last night.
The North Dublin deputy said she had been visiting family on the south side of the city when she took a wrong turn and was stopped by gardaí.
She said she was breathalysed and was awaitingt the result of a sample to assess the level of alcohol in her system.
Ms Daly admitted to having a hot whiskey that evening for medicinal reasons, and said if she was over the limit it would be a very serious matter.
Gardaí are awaiting test results and no charges have been brought against Deputy Daly.
What has the wrong turn got to do with anything?
Quote from: J70 on January 29, 2013, 08:42:28 PM
What has the wrong turn got to do with anything?
I'd guess it was the reason they stopped her. Maybe an illegal turn rather than a wrong one?
Quote from: J70 on January 29, 2013, 08:42:28 PM
What has the wrong turn got to do with anything?
She went left.
QuoteWhat has the wrong turn got to do with anything?
It couldn't have been a U-turn, otherwise you'd have to arrest all politicians.
I can't stand Clare Daly but there's some funny business going on here.
Insofar as I know, when the guards stop you and you blow into the bag, they can charge you there and then. This story says they're waiting on the results. Now I don't know one way or the other but I would guess that she passed the breathalyser but the guards leaked the story anyway because they're not happy about Clare Daly shopping them for sorting people out over traffic offenses. So she won't be charged but the smell will linger.
It's a long road that has no turning. Normally I'd have an awful lot of sympathy if someone were set up in the completely hypothetical situation I've outlined above, which I don't posit for a minute is a true reflection of events, but merely one of numerous possible scenarios with varying levels of probability. But if Daly has been set up, it's hard to feel sorry for her.
Quote from: muppet on January 29, 2013, 08:34:59 PMGardaí are awaiting test results and no charges have been brought against Deputy Daly.
How long does it take for a Breathalyser result?
Quote from: IolarCoisCuain on January 29, 2013, 09:28:13 PM
I can't stand Clare Daly but there's some funny business going on here.
Insofar as I know, when the guards stop you and you blow into the bag, they can charge you there and then. This story says they're waiting on the results. Now I don't know one way or the other but I would guess that she passed the breathalyser but the guards leaked the story anyway because they're not happy about Clare Daly shopping them for sorting people out over traffic offenses. So she won't be charged but the smell will linger.
It's a long road that has no turning. Normally I'd have an awful lot of sympathy if someone were set up in the completely hypothetical situation I've outlined above, which I don't posit for a minute is a true reflection of events, but merely one of numerous possible scenarios with varying levels of probability. But if Daly has been set up, it's hard to feel sorry for her.
I thought you were brought back to the station for a further test? Papers said this morning she refused to be breathalysed
It seems decent breathalyers are another thing the north will have to bring to a united Ireland.
Quotethey're not happy about Clare Daly shopping them for sorting people out over traffic offenses.
Aye and she and the tax evader made a complete hames of that. From memory the initial list was over 800 people that were sorted and when the actual Facts came out the list was nigh on 60 or something. Shur the idiots relied on a guard who had previous for leaking miss-information which they knew already but chose to ignore it.
She would have been grand in Kerry
Quote from: Itchy on January 29, 2013, 09:31:17 PM
Quote from: IolarCoisCuain on January 29, 2013, 09:28:13 PM
I can't stand Clare Daly but there's some funny business going on here.
Insofar as I know, when the guards stop you and you blow into the bag, they can charge you there and then. This story says they're waiting on the results. Now I don't know one way or the other but I would guess that she passed the breathalyser but the guards leaked the story anyway because they're not happy about Clare Daly shopping them for sorting people out over traffic offenses. So she won't be charged but the smell will linger.
It's a long road that has no turning. Normally I'd have an awful lot of sympathy if someone were set up in the completely hypothetical situation I've outlined above, which I don't posit for a minute is a true reflection of events, but merely one of numerous possible scenarios with varying levels of probability. But if Daly has been set up, it's hard to feel sorry for her.
I thought you were brought back to the station for a further test? Papers said this morning she refused to be breathalysed
I didn't think you could refuse to be breathalysed. Like, if that was the case why would anyone do it? This is an odd one. I'd say there's quare hooring going on behind the scenes.
Quote from: IolarCoisCuain on January 29, 2013, 10:05:11 PM
Quote from: Itchy on January 29, 2013, 09:31:17 PM
Quote from: IolarCoisCuain on January 29, 2013, 09:28:13 PM
I can't stand Clare Daly but there's some funny business going on here.
Insofar as I know, when the guards stop you and you blow into the bag, they can charge you there and then. This story says they're waiting on the results. Now I don't know one way or the other but I would guess that she passed the breathalyser but the guards leaked the story anyway because they're not happy about Clare Daly shopping them for sorting people out over traffic offenses. So she won't be charged but the smell will linger.
It's a long road that has no turning. Normally I'd have an awful lot of sympathy if someone were set up in the completely hypothetical situation I've outlined above, which I don't posit for a minute is a true reflection of events, but merely one of numerous possible scenarios with varying levels of probability. But if Daly has been set up, it's hard to feel sorry for her.
I thought you were brought back to the station for a further test? Papers said this morning she refused to be breathalysed
I didn't think you could refuse to be breathalysed. Like, if that was the case why would anyone do it? This is an odd one. I'd say there's quare hooring going on behind the scenes.
You can for sure, then they take blood or urine which is less forgiving. Your best bet is to take the bag.
Quote from: give her dixie on January 29, 2013, 10:04:06 PM
She would have been grand in Kerry
Would probably have given her a top up.
this is a pity because claire was doing her best to expose the sliveens who were getting their mates in the guards to ruin genuine cases against crooked public figures who been caught breaking the law.
Quote from: lawnseed on January 29, 2013, 10:16:35 PM
this is a pity because claire was doing her best to expose the sliveens who were getting their mates in the guards to ruin genuine cases against crooked public figures who been caught breaking the law.
Can you show a source for this?
QuoteI didn't think you could refuse to be breathalysed.
She probably wasn't very drunk. Heading back to the station to give a sample would delay things a bit and might make just get you back under the limit or in a lower category.
Quote from: muppet on January 29, 2013, 10:18:53 PM
Quote from: lawnseed on January 29, 2013, 10:16:35 PM
this is a pity because claire was doing her best to expose the sliveens who were getting their mates in the guards to ruin genuine cases against crooked public figures who been caught breaking the law.
Can you show a source for this?
claire and boyd barret tried to raise it in the dail but were ruled out of order. they have stats and names of those involved
Quote from: lawnseed on January 29, 2013, 10:16:35 PM
crooked public figures
Mick Wallace anyone?? Her credibility evaporated when she took up with that clown.
Sounds like they must be waiting for results of a blood / urine test unless it is just something to blacken her.
Quote from: lawnseed on January 29, 2013, 10:27:35 PM
Quote from: muppet on January 29, 2013, 10:18:53 PM
Quote from: lawnseed on January 29, 2013, 10:16:35 PM
this is a pity because claire was doing her best to expose the sliveens who were getting their mates in the guards to ruin genuine cases against crooked public figures who been caught breaking the law.
Can you show a source for this?
claire and boyd barret tried to raise it in the dail but were ruled out of order. they have stats and names of those involved
So no is the answer.
Quote from: Itchy on January 29, 2013, 09:31:17 PM
Quote from: IolarCoisCuain on January 29, 2013, 09:28:13 PM
I can't stand Clare Daly but there's some funny business going on here.
Insofar as I know, when the guards stop you and you blow into the bag, they can charge you there and then. This story says they're waiting on the results. Now I don't know one way or the other but I would guess that she passed the breathalyser but the guards leaked the story anyway because they're not happy about Clare Daly shopping them for sorting people out over traffic offenses. So she won't be charged but the smell will linger.
It's a long road that has no turning. Normally I'd have an awful lot of sympathy if someone were set up in the completely hypothetical situation I've outlined above, which I don't posit for a minute is a true reflection of events, but merely one of numerous possible scenarios with varying levels of probability. But if Daly has been set up, it's hard to feel sorry for her.
I thought you were brought back to the station for a further test? Papers said this morning she refused to be breathalysed
I have watched enough police camera action to know you can refuse, but it obviously means you are just marked down as guilty, the thing is how pissed you actually are can then not be measured.
I would take a wild stab that the reason the wrong turn is an issue is she probably tried to avoid the police and turned and they subsequently nabbed her, asked where she was headed and she then would need to say woops, wrong turn, of course I have a vivid imagination.
Quote from: muppet on January 29, 2013, 10:59:42 PM
Quote from: lawnseed on January 29, 2013, 10:27:35 PM
Quote from: muppet on January 29, 2013, 10:18:53 PM
Quote from: lawnseed on January 29, 2013, 10:16:35 PM
this is a pity because claire was doing her best to expose the sliveens who were getting their mates in the guards to ruin genuine cases against crooked public figures who been caught breaking the law.
Can you show a source for this?
claire and boyd barret tried to raise it in the dail but were ruled out of order. they have stats and names of those involved
So no is the answer.
it was on the rte news. pretend i'm a fine gael td.. now do you believe me
Quote from: lawnseed on January 29, 2013, 11:06:26 PM
Quote from: muppet on January 29, 2013, 10:59:42 PM
Quote from: lawnseed on January 29, 2013, 10:27:35 PM
Quote from: muppet on January 29, 2013, 10:18:53 PM
Quote from: lawnseed on January 29, 2013, 10:16:35 PM
this is a pity because claire was doing her best to expose the sliveens who were getting their mates in the guards to ruin genuine cases against crooked public figures who been caught breaking the law.
Can you show a source for this?
claire and boyd barret tried to raise it in the dail but were ruled out of order. they have stats and names of those involved
So no is the answer.
it was on the rte news. pretend i'm a fine gael td.. now do you believe me
It is not a question of believing you, why don't you simply provide some evidence? Then we can make up our own minds and might even agree with you.
Quote from: muppet on January 29, 2013, 11:09:17 PM
Quote from: lawnseed on January 29, 2013, 11:06:26 PM
Quote from: muppet on January 29, 2013, 10:59:42 PM
Quote from: lawnseed on January 29, 2013, 10:27:35 PM
Quote from: muppet on January 29, 2013, 10:18:53 PM
Quote from: lawnseed on January 29, 2013, 10:16:35 PM
this is a pity because claire was doing her best to expose the sliveens who were getting their mates in the guards to ruin genuine cases against crooked public figures who been caught breaking the law.
Can you show a source for this?
claire and boyd barret tried to raise it in the dail but were ruled out of order. they have stats and names of those involved
So no is the answer.
it was on the rte news. pretend i'm a fine gael td.. now do you believe me
It is not a question of believing you, why don't you simply provide some evidence? Then we can make up our own minds and might even agree with you.
who is "we" you and your alias' if you cant find the time to watch the goings on in the dail when its on tv are you sure you shouldnt stick to the weather thread theres alot more wriggle room there
Quote from: lawnseed on January 29, 2013, 11:16:08 PM
Quote from: muppet on January 29, 2013, 11:09:17 PM
Quote from: lawnseed on January 29, 2013, 11:06:26 PM
Quote from: muppet on January 29, 2013, 10:59:42 PM
Quote from: lawnseed on January 29, 2013, 10:27:35 PM
Quote from: muppet on January 29, 2013, 10:18:53 PM
Quote from: lawnseed on January 29, 2013, 10:16:35 PM
this is a pity because claire was doing her best to expose the sliveens who were getting their mates in the guards to ruin genuine cases against crooked public figures who been caught breaking the law.
Can you show a source for this?
claire and boyd barret tried to raise it in the dail but were ruled out of order. they have stats and names of those involved
So no is the answer.
it was on the rte news. pretend i'm a fine gael td.. now do you believe me
It is not a question of believing you, why don't you simply provide some evidence? Then we can make up our own minds and might even agree with you.
who is "we" you and your alias' if you cant find the time to watch the goings on in the dail when its on tv are you sure you shouldnt stick to the weather thread theres alot more wriggle room there
You see, this gives the game away.
http://www.rte.ie/news/2013/0129/365174-clare-daly-gardai/ (http://www.rte.ie/news/2013/0129/365174-clare-daly-gardai/)
Independent TD Clare Daly has confirmed she was stopped by gardaí on suspicion of drink driving last night.
Deputy Daly told RTÉ news that she accepted full responsibility for her actions.
She said she was in an area of South Dublin that she was unfamiliar with and took an illegal turn.
The Deputy said that she was stopped by gardaí on foot of that and was breathalysed and then brought to Kilmainham Garda Station.
She said: "I had been with family and had been given a hot whiskey for a cold.
"If that brought me over the limit then that's obviously a very serious mistake on my part and one that I take full responsibility for," Ms Daly said.
"I am a little bit surprised that Garda authorities released this information without any charges being brought or any confirmation of me being over the limit," Ms Daly added.
In relation to her recent criticism of authorities quashing penalty points, Ms Daly said the point she was making was that people who violate road safety regulations should be treated in a transparent way and exposed to the full rigours of the law.
"That is something that should absolutely happen in my case if I'm found guilty of any offence the same as it would for every other citizen," Ms Daly added.
As far as I understand it, the breathalyser is not a definitive test, just an indicator. If you show up positive on the bag you have to go to the station to get a proper, quantitatively measurable blood or urine test. Daly was on the 9:00 news and said she was taken to the station and tested and is awaiting the result. She also stated she was surprised this story has reached the public domain, as, until she tests positive, she's not guilty of anything. She has a point and the guards involved in politically motivated leaking should be dealt with.
It's still a story though - bound to happen when you're in the public eye.
QuoteIf you show up positive on the bag you have to go to the station to get a proper, quantitatively measurable blood or urine test.
Do they not also have evidential calibrated breathalsyers in the station? The ones in the car are a guideline only
Could she not get a HealeyRae dispensation,or do they only apply in Kerry?
Quote from: IolarCoisCuain on January 29, 2013, 10:05:11 PM
Quote from: Itchy on January 29, 2013, 09:31:17 PM
Quote from: IolarCoisCuain on January 29, 2013, 09:28:13 PM
I can't stand Clare Daly but there's some funny business going on here.
Insofar as I know, when the guards stop you and you blow into the bag, they can charge you there and then. This story says they're waiting on the results. Now I don't know one way or the other but I would guess that she passed the breathalyser but the guards leaked the story anyway because they're not happy about Clare Daly shopping them for sorting people out over traffic offenses. So she won't be charged but the smell will linger.
It's a long road that has no turning. Normally I'd have an awful lot of sympathy if someone were set up in the completely hypothetical situation I've outlined above, which I don't posit for a minute is a true reflection of events, but merely one of numerous possible scenarios with varying levels of probability. But if Daly has been set up, it's hard to feel sorry for her.
I thought you were brought back to the station for a further test? Papers said this morning she refused to be breathalysed
I didn't think you could refuse to be breathalysed. Like, if that was the case why would anyone do it? This is an odd one. I'd say there's quare hooring going on behind the scenes.
Is providing no sample be it breath or blood, not seen as a failed test and therefore an admission of guilt?
As far as I know she suffered from pleurisy (had to kick her smoking habit) so she probably hadn't the lungs for the bag.
I was bagged with sweat pouring out of me just after 5 a side one night and it took me 3 attempts to register the yoke.
Quote from: NAG1 on January 30, 2013, 08:02:43 AM
Quote from: IolarCoisCuain on January 29, 2013, 10:05:11 PM
Quote from: Itchy on January 29, 2013, 09:31:17 PM
Quote from: IolarCoisCuain on January 29, 2013, 09:28:13 PM
I can't stand Clare Daly but there's some funny business going on here.
Insofar as I know, when the guards stop you and you blow into the bag, they can charge you there and then. This story says they're waiting on the results. Now I don't know one way or the other but I would guess that she passed the breathalyser but the guards leaked the story anyway because they're not happy about Clare Daly shopping them for sorting people out over traffic offenses. So she won't be charged but the smell will linger.
It's a long road that has no turning. Normally I'd have an awful lot of sympathy if someone were set up in the completely hypothetical situation I've outlined above, which I don't posit for a minute is a true reflection of events, but merely one of numerous possible scenarios with varying levels of probability. But if Daly has been set up, it's hard to feel sorry for her.
I thought you were brought back to the station for a further test? Papers said this morning she refused to be breathalysed
I didn't think you could refuse to be breathalysed. Like, if that was the case why would anyone do it? This is an odd one. I'd say there's quare hooring going on behind the scenes.
Is providing no sample be it breath or blood, not seen as a failed test and therefore an admission of guilt?
Don't think so. Breathalyser gives the indication of alcohol in the system . Afaik blood/ urine test is the proof . Failure to give blood/urine sample is an offence.
I cannot believe a single hot whiskey would throw you over the limit - unless it was an industrial one.
She is a dreadful auld witch and hooking up with Mick Wallace has done her no favours.
From her web page
http://www.claredaly.ie/
On Monday evening after meetings in the Dáil, I attended a meeting in Swords and left at 9.30pm for another meeting requested by a family of longstanding political acquaintances in the Southside of the city near the Canal. I arrived after 10pm and spent almost two hours discussing political issues which I had raised in the Dáil. Before I left I was offered a hot whiskey for a cold. I had no food since lunchtime and did not realise the implications of taking this house measure of hot whiskey.
I left at midnight and not being familiar with the area found myself on the road to Ballyfermot at Kilmainham and took a right turn onto the South Circular Road trying to get back onto the Northside – unfortunately there is no right turn at this junction. A passing Garda patrol car saw the turn and pulled me over and this was brought to my attention by Gardai in a car who stopped me. I was breathalysed but this was not satisfactory and was brought to the Kilmainham Garda Station where a urine sample was taken.
I accept full responsibility for what is a serious lack of judgement and while I find it surprising that the Gardaí in Kilmainham released this information to tabloid journalists before 11am, I believe that the Gardaí implementing road safety have a job to do and I support them.
Should the test result on the sample provided prove to be above the statutory limit, I will accept the consequences and resolve that this will not happen again.
QuoteI cannot believe a single hot whiskey would throw you over the limit - unless it was an industrial one.
They should give special driving permits for people with colds alright. Very unlucky as hot port is the norm on the southside and one of those is lighter than a whiskey and wouldn't throw you over.
Pity her mates didn't make her an aul sambo either!
Let he who has not sat behind the wheel after one drink cast the first (or twenty-fifth) stone!
I didn't notice stones being thrown at Clare here,
mostly about what did she do to get pulled over while driving and what kind of a measure did she have ;D
If she is over the limit, I suspect the line 'did you have more than the house measure'? will get more usage.
why is she suprised it is n the public domain?
she tried to whistleblow on the 'special' type of guards some politicians are 'friends' with, she was goin to be hung 1st chance thy got.
stil a bit of an 'oul hag
Quote from: Billys Boots on January 30, 2013, 10:41:35 AM
Let he who has not sat behind the wheel after one drink cast the first (or twenty-fifth) stone!
The problem here is that it is Clare Daly who started the campaign insisting that all road traffic offences be prosecuted. Of course she had a point, but herself, Ming & Mick blew it out of all proportion (see Ming on VB last night claiming the Gárda Síochána is a corrupt force). I notice her press release doesn't demand her prosecution for the illegal turn which she has admitted to.
Quote from: Billys Boots on January 30, 2013, 10:41:35 AM
Let he who has not sat behind the wheel after one drink cast the first (or twenty-fifth) stone!
Thanks, you've given me licence to cast as many stones as I want! :P
Quote from: Main Street on January 30, 2013, 11:30:34 AM
I didn't notice stones being thrown at Clare here,
mostly about what did she do to get pulled over while driving and what kind of a measure did she have ;D
If she is over the limit, I suspect the line 'did you have more than the house measure'? will get more usage.
"Shorry Shir, I couldn't posshibly be over the limit. I've only had two Clare Dalys. Hic!"
That's still less than a half HealyRae.
Quote from: Farrandeelin on January 30, 2013, 04:09:07 PM
Quote from: Billys Boots on January 30, 2013, 10:41:35 AM
Let he who has not sat behind the wheel after one drink cast the first (or twenty-fifth) stone!
Thanks, you've given me licence to cast as many stones as I want! :P
Fire away! ;)
Quote from: Main Street on January 30, 2013, 04:22:42 PM
That's still less than a half HealyRae.
And nothing close to a McDaid.
Quote from: muppet on January 30, 2013, 04:06:58 PM
Quote from: Billys Boots on January 30, 2013, 10:41:35 AM
Let he who has not sat behind the wheel after one drink cast the first (or twenty-fifth) stone!
The problem here is that it is Clare Daly who started the campaign insisting that all road traffic offences be prosecuted. Of course she had a point, but herself, Ming & Mick blew it out of all proportion (see Ming on VB last night claiming the Gárda Síochána is a corrupt force). I notice her press release doesn't demand her prosecution for the illegal turn which she has admitted to.
what? ??? the problem with clare is that she highlighted the corruption in the legal system where guards removed penalty points from people licences who were friends or family members or people that they considered important or influencial. this practice completely undermines confidence in the forces of law and order and makes a mockery of the points system which is supposeed to promote road safety. clare used dail previledge to name a judge who had availed of this sick practice the establishment dont like it when you shine a light on them.
Quote from: lawnseed on January 30, 2013, 09:39:30 PM
Quote from: muppet on January 30, 2013, 04:06:58 PM
Quote from: Billys Boots on January 30, 2013, 10:41:35 AM
Let he who has not sat behind the wheel after one drink cast the first (or twenty-fifth) stone!
The problem here is that it is Clare Daly who started the campaign insisting that all road traffic offences be prosecuted. Of course she had a point, but herself, Ming & Mick blew it out of all proportion (see Ming on VB last night claiming the Gárda Síochána is a corrupt force). I notice her press release doesn't demand her prosecution for the illegal turn which she has admitted to.
what? ??? the problem with clare is that she highlighted the corruption in the legal system where guards removed penalty points from people licences who were friends or family members or people that they considered important or influencial. this practice completely undermines confidence in the forces of law and order and makes a mockery of the points system which is supposeed to promote road safety. clare used dail previledge to name a judge who had availed of this sick practice the establishment dont like it when you shine a light on them.
Are you sure you are Irish?
Quote from: muppet on January 30, 2013, 09:42:50 PM
Quote from: lawnseed on January 30, 2013, 09:39:30 PM
Quote from: muppet on January 30, 2013, 04:06:58 PM
Quote from: Billys Boots on January 30, 2013, 10:41:35 AM
Let he who has not sat behind the wheel after one drink cast the first (or twenty-fifth) stone!
The problem here is that it is Clare Daly who started the campaign insisting that all road traffic offences be prosecuted. Of course she had a point, but herself, Ming & Mick blew it out of all proportion (see Ming on VB last night claiming the Gárda Síochána is a corrupt force). I notice her press release doesn't demand her prosecution for the illegal turn which she has admitted to.
what? ??? the problem with clare is that she highlighted the corruption in the legal system where guards removed penalty points from people licences who were friends or family members or people that they considered important or influencial. this practice completely undermines confidence in the forces of law and order and makes a mockery of the points system which is supposeed to promote road safety. clare used dail previledge to name a judge who had availed of this sick practice the establishment dont like it when you shine a light on them.
Are you sure you are Irish?
your question puzzles me and reminds me of documents found on german wwII pilots where they are given instruction on what to expect should they be shot down over ireland. they are told the the irish women are basically good but the men are the lowest scum on the planet and not to be trusted. sometimes i'm very proud of where i'm from but then you hear about this type of shite and throw in a wee bit of clerical abuse, wee bit of cronyism, wee bit of fraud, wee bit of horsemeat.. and on and on and youve a recipe for the skitter
Quote from: lawnseed on January 30, 2013, 10:10:31 PM
Quote from: muppet on January 30, 2013, 09:42:50 PM
Quote from: lawnseed on January 30, 2013, 09:39:30 PM
Quote from: muppet on January 30, 2013, 04:06:58 PM
Quote from: Billys Boots on January 30, 2013, 10:41:35 AM
Let he who has not sat behind the wheel after one drink cast the first (or twenty-fifth) stone!
The problem here is that it is Clare Daly who started the campaign insisting that all road traffic offences be prosecuted. Of course she had a point, but herself, Ming & Mick blew it out of all proportion (see Ming on VB last night claiming the Gárda Síochána is a corrupt force). I notice her press release doesn't demand her prosecution for the illegal turn which she has admitted to.
what? ??? the problem with clare is that she highlighted the corruption in the legal system where guards removed penalty points from people licences who were friends or family members or people that they considered important or influencial. this practice completely undermines confidence in the forces of law and order and makes a mockery of the points system which is supposeed to promote road safety. clare used dail previledge to name a judge who had availed of this sick practice the establishment dont like it when you shine a light on them.
Are you sure you are Irish?
your question puzzles me and reminds me of documents found on german wwII pilots where they are given instruction on what to expect should they be shot down over ireland. they are told the the irish women are basically good but the men are the lowest scum on the planet and not to be trusted. sometimes i'm very proud of where i'm from but then you hear about this type of shite and throw in a wee bit of clerical abuse, wee bit of cronyism, wee bit of fraud, wee bit of horsemeat.. and on and on and youve a recipe for the skitter
This is an interesting subject. I knew a son of one of those men.
Here is a discussion on it: http://forum.axishistory.com/viewtopic.php?f=12&t=11437 (http://forum.axishistory.com/viewtopic.php?f=12&t=11437)
Even if your 'documents' existed (no source from you - as usual), which I seriously doubt, the Germans of WW2 were hardly the most objective in the assessment of their fellow Europeans, were they?
Quote from: muppet on January 30, 2013, 10:23:58 PM
Quote from: lawnseed on January 30, 2013, 10:10:31 PM
Quote from: muppet on January 30, 2013, 09:42:50 PM
Quote from: lawnseed on January 30, 2013, 09:39:30 PM
Quote from: muppet on January 30, 2013, 04:06:58 PM
Quote from: Billys Boots on January 30, 2013, 10:41:35 AM
Let he who has not sat behind the wheel after one drink cast the first (or twenty-fifth) stone!
The problem here is that it is Clare Daly who started the campaign insisting that all road traffic offences be prosecuted. Of course she had a point, but herself, Ming & Mick blew it out of all proportion (see Ming on VB last night claiming the Gárda Síochána is a corrupt force). I notice her press release doesn't demand her prosecution for the illegal turn which she has admitted to.
what? ??? the problem with clare is that she highlighted the corruption in the legal system where guards removed penalty points from people licences who were friends or family members or people that they considered important or influencial. this practice completely undermines confidence in the forces of law and order and makes a mockery of the points system which is supposeed to promote road safety. clare used dail previledge to name a judge who had availed of this sick practice the establishment dont like it when you shine a light on them.
Are you sure you are Irish?
your question puzzles me and reminds me of documents found on german wwII pilots where they are given instruction on what to expect should they be shot down over ireland. they are told the the irish women are basically good but the men are the lowest scum on the planet and not to be trusted. sometimes i'm very proud of where i'm from but then you hear about this type of shite and throw in a wee bit of clerical abuse, wee bit of cronyism, wee bit of fraud, wee bit of horsemeat.. and on and on and youve a recipe for the skitter
This is an interesting subject. I knew a son of one of those men.
Here is a discussion on it: http://forum.axishistory.com/viewtopic.php?f=12&t=11437 (http://forum.axishistory.com/viewtopic.php?f=12&t=11437)
Even if your 'documents' existed (no source from you - as usual), which I seriously doubt, the Germans of WW2 were hardly the most objective in the assessment of their fellow Europeans, were they?
oh i dont know.. maybe the germans are still working with those documents.. when you look at what they have been dealing with fine gael.. fianna fail..
Quote from: lawnseed on January 30, 2013, 10:10:31 PM
Quote from: muppet on January 30, 2013, 09:42:50 PM
Quote from: lawnseed on January 30, 2013, 09:39:30 PM
Quote from: muppet on January 30, 2013, 04:06:58 PM
Quote from: Billys Boots on January 30, 2013, 10:41:35 AM
Let he who has not sat behind the wheel after one drink cast the first (or twenty-fifth) stone!
The problem here is that it is Clare Daly who started the campaign insisting that all road traffic offences be prosecuted. Of course she had a point, but herself, Ming & Mick blew it out of all proportion (see Ming on VB last night claiming the Gárda Síochána is a corrupt force). I notice her press release doesn't demand her prosecution for the illegal turn which she has admitted to.
what? ??? the problem with clare is that she highlighted the corruption in the legal system where guards removed penalty points from people licences who were friends or family members or people that they considered important or influencial. this practice completely undermines confidence in the forces of law and order and makes a mockery of the points system which is supposeed to promote road safety. clare used dail previledge to name a judge who had availed of this sick practice the establishment dont like it when you shine a light on them.
Are you sure you are Irish?
your question puzzles me and reminds me of documents found on german wwII pilots where they are given instruction on what to expect should they be shot down over ireland. they are told the the irish women are basically good but the men are the lowest scum on the planet and not to be trusted. sometimes i'm very proud of where i'm from but then you hear about this type of shite and throw in a wee bit of clerical abuse, wee bit of cronyism, wee bit of fraud, wee bit of horsemeat.. and on and on and youve a recipe for the skitter
And if there's any crowd we should take notice of, it's the Nazis....
You're not proud of being Irish. Maybe you're proud of being Northern Irish, I don't know. But you spend your time here constantly telling anyone who'll read your posts how much you detest everything about the Republic of Ireland.
Quote from: Tubberman on January 30, 2013, 10:44:38 PM
Quote from: lawnseed on January 30, 2013, 10:10:31 PM
Quote from: muppet on January 30, 2013, 09:42:50 PM
Quote from: lawnseed on January 30, 2013, 09:39:30 PM
Quote from: muppet on January 30, 2013, 04:06:58 PM
Quote from: Billys Boots on January 30, 2013, 10:41:35 AM
Let he who has not sat behind the wheel after one drink cast the first (or twenty-fifth) stone!
The problem here is that it is Clare Daly who started the campaign insisting that all road traffic offences be prosecuted. Of course she had a point, but herself, Ming & Mick blew it out of all proportion (see Ming on VB last night claiming the Gárda Síochána is a corrupt force). I notice her press release doesn't demand her prosecution for the illegal turn which she has admitted to.
what? ??? the problem with clare is that she highlighted the corruption in the legal system where guards removed penalty points from people licences who were friends or family members or people that they considered important or influencial. this practice completely undermines confidence in the forces of law and order and makes a mockery of the points system which is supposeed to promote road safety. clare used dail previledge to name a judge who had availed of this sick practice the establishment dont like it when you shine a light on them.
Are you sure you are Irish?
your question puzzles me and reminds me of documents found on german wwII pilots where they are given instruction on what to expect should they be shot down over ireland. they are told the the irish women are basically good but the men are the lowest scum on the planet and not to be trusted. sometimes i'm very proud of where i'm from but then you hear about this type of shite and throw in a wee bit of clerical abuse, wee bit of cronyism, wee bit of fraud, wee bit of horsemeat.. and on and on and youve a recipe for the skitter
And if there's any crowd we should take notice of, it's the Nazis....
You're not proud of being Irish. Maybe you're proud of being Northern Irish, I don't know. But you spend your time here constantly telling anyone who'll read your posts how much you detest everything about the Republic of Ireland.
maybe you've been asleep for a wee while but the last time i checked the traitors guys like you elected have completely destroyed the country you live in. just incase you just come out of a coma the very people who plunged our country into 3 generations of poverty are gaining in the polls -- weekly! and on the off chance you haven't notice the guys that you voted for have made such a mess of the country that people north of the border whos birthright it is to be irish and be part of a united ireland DONT WANT IT! arent you the least bit ashamed that your countrymen would rather be governed by the british queen than an irish government?
In fairness to Lawnseed, he has a chip on his shoulder that is visible from space.
Quote from: muppet on January 30, 2013, 11:02:22 PM
In fairness to Lawnseed, he has a chip on his shoulder that is visible from space.
spacemen can see that ireland has serious problems running their own country
Quote from: lawnseed on January 30, 2013, 10:59:13 PM
Quote from: Tubberman on January 30, 2013, 10:44:38 PM
Quote from: lawnseed on January 30, 2013, 10:10:31 PM
Quote from: muppet on January 30, 2013, 09:42:50 PM
Quote from: lawnseed on January 30, 2013, 09:39:30 PM
Quote from: muppet on January 30, 2013, 04:06:58 PM
Quote from: Billys Boots on January 30, 2013, 10:41:35 AM
Let he who has not sat behind the wheel after one drink cast the first (or twenty-fifth) stone!
The problem here is that it is Clare Daly who started the campaign insisting that all road traffic offences be prosecuted. Of course she had a point, but herself, Ming & Mick blew it out of all proportion (see Ming on VB last night claiming the Gárda Síochána is a corrupt force). I notice her press release doesn't demand her prosecution for the illegal turn which she has admitted to.
what? ??? the problem with clare is that she highlighted the corruption in the legal system where guards removed penalty points from people licences who were friends or family members or people that they considered important or influencial. this practice completely undermines confidence in the forces of law and order and makes a mockery of the points system which is supposeed to promote road safety. clare used dail previledge to name a judge who had availed of this sick practice the establishment dont like it when you shine a light on them.
Are you sure you are Irish?
your question puzzles me and reminds me of documents found on german wwII pilots where they are given instruction on what to expect should they be shot down over ireland. they are told the the irish women are basically good but the men are the lowest scum on the planet and not to be trusted. sometimes i'm very proud of where i'm from but then you hear about this type of shite and throw in a wee bit of clerical abuse, wee bit of cronyism, wee bit of fraud, wee bit of horsemeat.. and on and on and youve a recipe for the skitter
And if there's any crowd we should take notice of, it's the Nazis....
You're not proud of being Irish. Maybe you're proud of being Northern Irish, I don't know. But you spend your time here constantly telling anyone who'll read your posts how much you detest everything about the Republic of Ireland.
maybe you've been asleep for a wee while but the last time i checked the traitors guys like you elected have completely destroyed the country you live in. just incase you just come out of a coma the very people who plunged our country into 3 generations of poverty are gaining in the polls -- weekly! and on the off chance you haven't notice the guys that you voted for have made such a mess of the country that people north of the border whos birthright it is to be irish and be part of a united ireland DONT WANT IT! arent you the least bit ashamed that your countrymen would rather be governed by the british queen than an irish government?
If that's to anyone's shame, it's yours, not mine.
To use your sensationalist language, you and your fellow Northern Irishmen would be the traitors for opting of the public-service fuelled economy and handouts by staying in Britain, rather than being in control of your own country and having the responsibility of governance.
Your people, and SF, your party, have never had the responsibility of running a country. You just mouth off (or shoot and bomb off) from the side. Backward, dysfunctional and immature.
Quote from: Tubberman on January 30, 2013, 11:08:55 PM
Quote from: lawnseed on January 30, 2013, 10:59:13 PM
Quote from: Tubberman on January 30, 2013, 10:44:38 PM
Quote from: lawnseed on January 30, 2013, 10:10:31 PM
Quote from: muppet on January 30, 2013, 09:42:50 PM
Quote from: lawnseed on January 30, 2013, 09:39:30 PM
Quote from: muppet on January 30, 2013, 04:06:58 PM
Quote from: Billys Boots on January 30, 2013, 10:41:35 AM
Let he who has not sat behind the wheel after one drink cast the first (or twenty-fifth) stone!
The problem here is that it is Clare Daly who started the campaign insisting that all road traffic offences be prosecuted. Of course she had a point, but herself, Ming & Mick blew it out of all proportion (see Ming on VB last night claiming the Gárda Síochána is a corrupt force). I notice her press release doesn't demand her prosecution for the illegal turn which she has admitted to.
what? ??? the problem with clare is that she highlighted the corruption in the legal system where guards removed penalty points from people licences who were friends or family members or people that they considered important or influencial. this practice completely undermines confidence in the forces of law and order and makes a mockery of the points system which is supposeed to promote road safety. clare used dail previledge to name a judge who had availed of this sick practice the establishment dont like it when you shine a light on them.
Are you sure you are Irish?
your question puzzles me and reminds me of documents found on german wwII pilots where they are given instruction on what to expect should they be shot down over ireland. they are told the the irish women are basically good but the men are the lowest scum on the planet and not to be trusted. sometimes i'm very proud of where i'm from but then you hear about this type of shite and throw in a wee bit of clerical abuse, wee bit of cronyism, wee bit of fraud, wee bit of horsemeat.. and on and on and youve a recipe for the skitter
And if there's any crowd we should take notice of, it's the Nazis....
You're not proud of being Irish. Maybe you're proud of being Northern Irish, I don't know. But you spend your time here constantly telling anyone who'll read your posts how much you detest everything about the Republic of Ireland.
maybe you've been asleep for a wee while but the last time i checked the traitors guys like you elected have completely destroyed the country you live in. just incase you just come out of a coma the very people who plunged our country into 3 generations of poverty are gaining in the polls -- weekly! and on the off chance you haven't notice the guys that you voted for have made such a mess of the country that people north of the border whos birthright it is to be irish and be part of a united ireland DONT WANT IT! arent you the least bit ashamed that your countrymen would rather be governed by the british queen than an irish government?
If that's to anyone's shame, it's yours, not mine.
To use your sensationalist language, you and your fellow Northern Irishmen would be the traitors for opting of the public-service fuelled economy and handouts by staying in Britain, rather than being in control of your own country and having the responsibility of governance.
Your people, and SF, your party, have never had the responsibility of running a country. You just mouth off (or shoot and bomb off) from the side. Backward, dysfunctional and immature.
i'm thinking when we take over we should introduce internment for guys like you in the interests of health and safety. its for your own good. free healthcare and grub you'll be happy and free from the realisation that ireland has been run by crooks for nearly a hundred years and you voted them in.
btw did you vote for fianna gael or fine fail it hardly matters they are the same but you should come clean
If she turned the wrong way, surely the guards should just have asked "did you not see the arrows?" And if after that "house measure" she replied truth be told she didn't even see the Indians, then as in similar instances in the past, let her go.
To be honest I don't see the alleged "hypocrisy" of Claire Daly's postion about traffic offenses being quashed and getting stopped for being over the limit. Surely it would only be hypocrisy if she thought she should get off?
A fair chance she could pass the urine test which will be fun if it happens.
Do normal guards on the beat carry around Breathalyzers? Did she take the wrong turn to avoid a checkpoint? Im pretty sure she would have had to go to the station for the 'proper' test which should have given plenty of time for a single measure to be under the limit ( unless it was a huge house measure!!!)
I understand that she drove the worng way up a one-way street and 'met' a patrol.
Quote from: Billys Boots on January 31, 2013, 03:06:36 PM
I understand that she drove the worng way up a one-way street and 'met' a patrol.
Er, do you think they were lying in wait for her to come up a one-way street?
Quote from: Billys Boots on January 31, 2013, 03:06:36 PM
I understand that she drove the worng way up a one-way street and 'met' a patrol.
She was not very clear so with her statement.
I left at midnight and not being familiar with the area found myself on the road to Ballyfermot at Kilmainham and took a right turn onto the South Circular Road trying to get back onto the Northside – unfortunately there is no right turn at this junction.
I assumed it was at the junction of Old Kilmainham road and emmet road. There is no turn right there on to the south circular road.
Quote from: ludermor on January 31, 2013, 02:49:38 PM
Do normal guards on the beat carry around Breathalyzers? Did she take the wrong turn to avoid a checkpoint? Im pretty sure she would have had to go to the station for the 'proper' test which should have given plenty of time for a single measure to be under the limit ( unless it was a huge house measure!!!)
This might read as an anti-woman rant and you might be right.
I don't think the omens are good for Clare.
She did feel it necessary to provide us with extra information, that she was ill, that she hadn't eaten in a long time, that she drank it just before she departed and she was given the 'house measure' indicating a good measure, an act of generosity from a grateful and caring host.
Therein lies a hat full of excuses (reducers), all prepared should she be found to be over the limit. Although I have never had to take a breathalyser, I would imagine that she would have benefitted from drinking as much water as she could until she was tested at the station and perhaps she should have asked for a blood sample to be taken to gain time. Maybe that's just myth.
Personally I don't think she had any malicious intent with getting her excuses in early, but rather that's just a natural woman's/wife's instinct to never ever take responsibility for ones actions ;D
Furthermore, she makes a mistake while driving,
try and ask a woman, well what did you do? did you not see the sign? and the answer will sound like the whole universe conspired to make her take that wrong turn.
Lastly, the Gardai probably leaked out the info, not nice but that's just the way it is, she was perceived as criticising the Gardai in the Dail and the Gardai take this kind of thing personal.
Quote from: gerrykeegan on January 31, 2013, 03:48:01 PM
Quote from: Billys Boots on January 31, 2013, 03:06:36 PM
I understand that she drove the worng way up a one-way street and 'met' a patrol.
She was not very clear so with her statement.
I left at midnight and not being familiar with the area found myself on the road to Ballyfermot at Kilmainham and took a right turn onto the South Circular Road trying to get back onto the Northside – unfortunately there is no right turn at this junction.
I assumed it was at the junction of Old Kilmainham road and emmet road. There is no turn right there on to the south circular road.
You're right - the only 'no right turn' I know of around there is when you're on the SCR and want to go right out towards Ballyfermot/N4
Quote from: Main Street on January 31, 2013, 04:16:06 PM
Quote from: ludermor on January 31, 2013, 02:49:38 PM
Do normal guards on the beat carry around Breathalyzers? Did she take the wrong turn to avoid a checkpoint? Im pretty sure she would have had to go to the station for the 'proper' test which should have given plenty of time for a single measure to be under the limit ( unless it was a huge house measure!!!)
This might read as an anti-woman rant and you might be right.
I don't think the omens are good for Clare.
She did feel it necessary to provide us with extra information, that she was ill, that she hadn't eaten in a long time, that she drank it just before she departed and she was given the 'house measure' indicating a good measure, an act of generosity from a grateful and caring host.
Therein lies a hat full of excuses (reducers), all prepared should she be found to be over the limit. Although I have never had to take a breathalyser, I would imagine that she would have benefitted from drinking as much water as she could until she was tested at the station and perhaps she should have asked for a blood sample to be taken to gain time. Maybe that's just myth.
Personally I don't think she had any malicious intent with getting her excuses in early, but rather that's just a natural woman's/wife's instinct to never ever take responsibility for ones actions ;D
Furthermore, she makes a mistake while driving,
try and ask a woman, well what did you do? did you not see the sign? and the answer will sound like the whole universe conspired to make her take that wrong turn.
Lastly, the Gardai probably leaked out the info, not nice but that's just the way it is, she was perceived as criticising the Gardai in the Dail and the Gardai take this kind of thing personal.
+1
It is amazing how some people can read between the lines and others need it tattooed onto their eyelids.
Quote from: heffo on January 31, 2013, 04:17:13 PM
Quote from: gerrykeegan on January 31, 2013, 03:48:01 PM
Quote from: Billys Boots on January 31, 2013, 03:06:36 PM
I understand that she drove the worng way up a one-way street and 'met' a patrol.
She was not very clear so with her statement.
I left at midnight and not being familiar with the area found myself on the road to Ballyfermot at Kilmainham and took a right turn onto the South Circular Road trying to get back onto the Northside – unfortunately there is no right turn at this junction.
I assumed it was at the junction of Old Kilmainham road and emmet road. There is no turn right there on to the south circular road.
You're right - the only 'no right turn' I know of around there is when you're on the SCR and want to go right out towards Ballyfermot/N4
I'm only saying what I heard from a fairly reliable source - I didn't mean anything sinister by it at all deiseach.
Quote from: Billys Boots on February 01, 2013, 10:33:46 AM
I'm only saying what I heard from a fairly reliable source - I didn't mean anything sinister by it at all deiseach.
Okay, but I'm still not getting it. You say she "'met' a patrol". This strikes me as implying that the patrol was lying in wait for her. If they were, then they must have been psychic. Or perhap they assumed a woman driver was bound to take a wrong turn ;)
Quote from: Main Street on January 31, 2013, 04:16:06 PM
Quote from: ludermor on January 31, 2013, 02:49:38 PM
Do normal guards on the beat carry around Breathalyzers? Did she take the wrong turn to avoid a checkpoint? Im pretty sure she would have had to go to the station for the 'proper' test which should have given plenty of time for a single measure to be under the limit ( unless it was a huge house measure!!!)
This might read as an anti-woman rant and you might be right.
I don't think the omens are good for Clare.
She did feel it necessary to provide us with extra information, that she was ill, that she hadn't eaten in a long time, that she drank it just before she departed and she was given the 'house measure' indicating a good measure, an act of generosity from a grateful and caring host.
Therein lies a hat full of excuses (reducers), all prepared should she be found to be over the limit. Although I have never had to take a breathalyser, I would imagine that she would have benefitted from drinking as much water as she could until she was tested at the station and perhaps she should have asked for a blood sample to be taken to gain time. Maybe that's just myth.
Personally I don't think she had any malicious intent with getting her excuses in early, but rather that's just a natural woman's/wife's instinct to never ever take responsibility for ones actions ;D
Furthermore, she makes a mistake while driving,
try and ask a woman, well what did you do? did you not see the sign? and the answer will sound like the whole universe conspired to make her take that wrong turn.
Lastly, the Gardai probably leaked out the info, not nice but that's just the way it is, she was perceived as criticising the Gardai in the Dail and the Gardai take this kind of thing personal.
Not eating in a long time may speed up the process of becoming "drunk" but surely it wouldn't have any bearing on the level of alcohol in your system. So I don't see the reason for mentioning it at all. Not eating before drinking may be the difference between waking up with a sore head or waking up in the garden with a sore head, but it couldn't be the differnce between being fit to drive and being over the limit.
Quote from: Main Street on January 31, 2013, 04:16:06 PM
Quote from: ludermor on January 31, 2013, 02:49:38 PM
Do normal guards on the beat carry around Breathalyzers? Did she take the wrong turn to avoid a checkpoint? Im pretty sure she would have had to go to the station for the 'proper' test which should have given plenty of time for a single measure to be under the limit ( unless it was a huge house measure!!!)
This might read as an anti-woman rant and you might be right.
I don't think the omens are good for Clare.
She did feel it necessary to provide us with extra information, that she was ill, that she hadn't eaten in a long time, that she drank it just before she departed and she was given the 'house measure' indicating a good measure, an act of generosity from a grateful and caring host.
Therein lies a hat full of excuses (reducers), all prepared should she be found to be over the limit. Although I have never had to take a breathalyser, I would imagine that she would have benefitted from drinking as much water as she could until she was tested at the station and perhaps she should have asked for a blood sample to be taken to gain time. Maybe that's just myth.
Personally I don't think she had any malicious intent with getting her excuses in early, but rather that's just a natural woman's/wife's instinct to never ever take responsibility for ones actions ;D
Furthermore, she makes a mistake while driving,
try and ask a woman, well what did you do? did you not see the sign? and the answer will sound like the whole universe conspired to make her take that wrong turn.
Lastly, the Gardai probably leaked out the info, not nice but that's just the way it is, she was perceived as criticising the Gardai in the Dail and the Gardai take this kind of thing personal.
She wouldn't have been allowed take anything by mouth from when she was tested on the roadside. You cannot "opt" for the blood test but if you make a reasnonable attempt at the "big breathalyser" in the station and can't register a result then it's a urine or blood sample that is taken. Not sure about the urine sample but for the blood sample a doctor is needed and that can result in delays which needless to say the person accused would be delighted about.
Quote from: deiseach on February 01, 2013, 11:09:41 AM
Quote from: Billys Boots on February 01, 2013, 10:33:46 AM
I'm only saying what I heard from a fairly reliable source - I didn't mean anything sinister by it at all deiseach.
Okay, but I'm still not getting it. You say she "'met' a patrol". This strikes me as implying that the patrol was lying in wait for her. If they were, then they must have been psychic. Or perhap they assumed a woman driver was bound to take a wrong turn ;)
I shouldn't have put any emphasis on the word met - I only meant it in the sense that she happened upon them as opposed to having expected them to be there.
Fierce interest in this case, while other recent news goes hardly mentioned.
Might be best to wait till the full story comes out and see what the actual outcome is, idle spectulation and hearsay otherwise.
Quote from: Larry Duff on February 01, 2013, 11:47:53 AM
Not eating in a long time may speed up the process of becoming "drunk" but surely it wouldn't have any bearing on the level of alcohol in your system. So I don't see the reason for mentioning it at all. Not eating before drinking may be the difference between waking up with a sore head or waking up in the garden with a sore head, but it couldn't be the differnce between being fit to drive and being over the limit.
Larry, for sure you can mull over her account, but why do you think Clare needs to have a rational reason in order to state something which she deems worthy to be mentioned in her account?
I forecast some stormy times ahead for you in relationship matters :)
Quote from: magpie seanie on February 01, 2013, 12:11:36 PM
Quote from: Main Street on January 31, 2013, 04:16:06 PM
Quote from: ludermor on January 31, 2013, 02:49:38 PM
Do normal guards on the beat carry around Breathalyzers? Did she take the wrong turn to avoid a checkpoint? Im pretty sure she would have had to go to the station for the 'proper' test which should have given plenty of time for a single measure to be under the limit ( unless it was a huge house measure!!!)
This might read as an anti-woman rant and you might be right.
I don't think the omens are good for Clare.
She did feel it necessary to provide us with extra information, that she was ill, that she hadn't eaten in a long time, that she drank it just before she departed and she was given the 'house measure' indicating a good measure, an act of generosity from a grateful and caring host.
Therein lies a hat full of excuses (reducers), all prepared should she be found to be over the limit. Although I have never had to take a breathalyser, I would imagine that she would have benefitted from drinking as much water as she could until she was tested at the station and perhaps she should have asked for a blood sample to be taken to gain time. Maybe that's just myth.
Personally I don't think she had any malicious intent with getting her excuses in early, but rather that's just a natural woman's/wife's instinct to never ever take responsibility for ones actions ;D
Furthermore, she makes a mistake while driving,
try and ask a woman, well what did you do? did you not see the sign? and the answer will sound like the whole universe conspired to make her take that wrong turn.
Lastly, the Gardai probably leaked out the info, not nice but that's just the way it is, she was perceived as criticising the Gardai in the Dail and the Gardai take this kind of thing personal.
She wouldn't have been allowed take anything by mouth from when she was tested on the roadside. You cannot "opt" for the blood test but if you make a reasnonable attempt at the "big breathalyser" in the station and can't register a result then it's a urine or blood sample that is taken. Not sure about the urine sample but for the blood sample a doctor is needed and that can result in delays which needless to say the person accused would be delighted about.
If the case does go to a court process, she can take the oath and truly say 'Your honour, it was only resting in my bloodstream'.
No drink driving case to be heard as she was under the limit.
Quote from: Bingo on February 08, 2013, 12:53:07 PM
No drink driving case to be heard as she was under the limit.
Thought that might happen.
Quote from: magpie seanie on February 08, 2013, 12:55:22 PM
Quote from: Bingo on February 08, 2013, 12:53:07 PM
No drink driving case to be heard as she was under the limit.
Thought that might happen.
Wasn't a proper house measure then?!
Quote from: magpie seanie on February 08, 2013, 12:55:22 PM
Quote from: Bingo on February 08, 2013, 12:53:07 PM
No drink driving case to be heard as she was under the limit.
Thought that might happen.
Maybe a senior Garda 'lost' the evidence somewhere!!
Result of Test 33% below limit!
On Monday night 28th January, after meetings in the Dail, I attended a meeting in Swords and left at 9.30pm for another meeting requested by a family on the Southside of the city near the Canal. I arrived after 10pm and spent almost two hours discussing issues which I had raised in the Dail. Before I left I was offered a hot whiskey for a cold.
I left at midnight and not being familiar with the area found myself on the road to Ballyfermot at Kilmainham and took a right turn onto the South Circular Road trying to get back onto the North side – unfortunately there is No Right Turn at this junction and this was brought to my attention by Gardai in a car who stopped me.
I was breathalysed but the equipment didn't register a reading. I was arrested and handcuffed on the side of the road. I objected to being handcuffed and stated that I would willingly go to the Garda station. I was told by the arresting Garda that this was 'procedure'.
I was brought in a patrol car to the Kilmainham Garda Station – within 300 metres distance. At one point I was placed in a cell on my own. A doctor was called and I provided a urine sample. When I was released a female Garda told me to 'come back when you are sober'.
I believe that the Gardai implementing road safety have a job to do and I support them. However, I object strongly to the arrest, handcuffing and release of information re the arrest on suspicion of drink driving to the tabloid press early on Tuesday. My legal advice is that none of this is 'procedure'.
I believe that this was a deliberate attempt to discredit a left-wing TD who has raised issues of malpractice within the Garda Siochana. This information could only have come from within the Gardai.
The Garda Ombudsman is investigating this matter, as a criminal investigation under Section 98 of the Garda Soichana Act 2005. This is a very serious issue. Every citizen is entitled to their good name and to have their privacy respected.
Garda whistle blowers who have quite correctly approached the designated Confidential Recipient and elected TDs, as they are lawfully entitled to do, have been threatened that they will be fully investigated in accordance with the Garda Siochana (Discipline) Regulations 2007 for speaking to a third party.
I now expect that the same enthusiasm will be taken in relation to those who have sought to damage me.
I have received the official result of the test on the urine sample provided and the result is 45 milligrammes per 100 millilitres of urine, which is 33% below the allowable limit – 67 milligrammes
If she was smart she should consider herself fortunate to be below the limit and move on. Her conspiracy theory looks flimsy as she admitted making an illegal turn and thus attracting the attention of the Gárdaí. She also admitted having a drink thus making a breathalyser reasonable. I'm not sure about the arrest and certainly the handcuffing looks excessive but like I say, if she ended the dramatics and accusations and she would come out of it far better.
Quote from: muppet on February 08, 2013, 04:07:37 PM
If she was smart she should consider herself fortunate to be below the limit and move on. Her conspiracy theory looks flimsy as she admitted making an illegal turn and thus attracting the attention of the Gárdaí. She also admitted having a drink thus making a breathalyser reasonable. I'm not sure about the arrest and certainly the handcuffing looks excessive but like I say, if she ended the dramatics and accusations and she would come out of it far better.
I'd say you're probably right muppet, though if you've been following the Andrew Mitchell "Plebgate" case in England, anything is possible!
Interesting double standards re the "naming" of the ex Cork politician arrested on suspicion of conspiracy to murder
Quote from: Declan on March 01, 2013, 10:02:51 AM
Interesting double standards re the "naming" of the ex Cork politician arrested on suspicion of conspiracy to murder
Interesting but not surprising. :(
So who is it, anyway?
I'd have thought you'd know Hardy ;)
Quote from: Declan on March 01, 2013, 10:02:51 AM
Interesting double standards re the "naming" of the ex Cork politician arrested on suspicion of conspiracy to murder
Double standards alright, but you'd have thought a suspicion of conspiracy a garda, a revenue official and an accountant would be a whole lot more serious than a drink driving offense!
I see there is some libellous vandalism going on on Noel O'Flynn's wiki page.
Quote from: Premier Emperor on March 01, 2013, 10:54:22 AM
In a completely unrelated incident, I see there is some libellous vandalism going on on Noel O'Flynn's wiki page.
There, fixed that for ye. ;)
Quote from: Premier Emperor on March 01, 2013, 10:54:22 AM
I see there is some libellous vandalism going on on Noel O'Flynn's wiki page.
Thats the first name I thought of
Quote from: johnneycool on March 01, 2013, 10:52:45 AM
Quote from: Declan on March 01, 2013, 10:02:51 AM
Interesting double standards re the "naming" of the ex Cork politician arrested on suspicion of conspiracy to murder
Double standards alright, but you'd have thought a suspicion of conspiracy a garda, a revenue official and an accountant would be a whole lot more serious than a drink driving offense!
That is probably exactly why there has been no names.
Any links?
http://www.irishcentral.com/news/Former-politician-from-well-known-family-arrested-on-conspiracy-to-murder-charge-194169271.html (http://www.irishcentral.com/news/Former-politician-from-well-known-family-arrested-on-conspiracy-to-murder-charge-194169271.html)
Quote from: Declan on March 01, 2013, 01:54:17 PM
http://www.irishcentral.com/news/Former-politician-from-well-known-family-arrested-on-conspiracy-to-murder-charge-194169271.html (http://www.irishcentral.com/news/Former-politician-from-well-known-family-arrested-on-conspiracy-to-murder-charge-194169271.html)
Thanks Declan, doesn't seem to be on any of the Irish outlets. Serious charges all right.
Serious alright - http://www.irishexaminer.com/ireland/icrime/judge-wants-psych-report-on-ex-ff-councillor-219396.html (http://www.irishexaminer.com/ireland/icrime/judge-wants-psych-report-on-ex-ff-councillor-219396.html)
This had disappeared from the RTÉ news by 12:00, if not earlier, having been a top four item at 8:00. Not a peep about it since, that I heard. Why would that be?
http://www.independent.ie/irish-news/courts/former-city-councillor-gary-oflynn-charged-with-soliciting-garda-murder-29107632.html (http://www.independent.ie/irish-news/courts/former-city-councillor-gary-oflynn-charged-with-soliciting-garda-murder-29107632.html)
Not much chat about another Cork County Councillor in the news. Drunk driving, running from the Gardaí and hiding in the bushes ::)
http://www.eveningecho.ie/2013/03/02/cork-councillor-in-court-on-drink-driving-charge/ (http://www.eveningecho.ie/2013/03/02/cork-councillor-in-court-on-drink-driving-charge/)
Quote from: Nally Stand on March 12, 2013, 11:53:25 AM
Not much chat about another Cork County Councillor in the news. Drunk driving, running from the Gardaí and hiding in the bushes ::)
http://www.eveningecho.ie/2013/03/02/cork-councillor-in-court-on-drink-driving-charge/ (http://www.eveningecho.ie/2013/03/02/cork-councillor-in-court-on-drink-driving-charge/)
Big reader of the Evening Echo are you?
Wouldn't be that popular around my area, so hadn't seen that.
Quote from: Tubberman on March 12, 2013, 12:16:37 PM
Quote from: Nally Stand on March 12, 2013, 11:53:25 AM
Not much chat about another Cork County Councillor in the news. Drunk driving, running from the Gardaí and hiding in the bushes ::)
http://www.eveningecho.ie/2013/03/02/cork-councillor-in-court-on-drink-driving-charge/ (http://www.eveningecho.ie/2013/03/02/cork-councillor-in-court-on-drink-driving-charge/)
Big reader of the Evening Echo are you?
Wouldn't be that popular around my area, so hadn't seen that.
I suppose RTÉ/The Irish Times/The Indo aren't commonplace in Mayo either?
http://www.rte.ie/news/2012/0911/337135-fine-gael-councillor/ (http://www.rte.ie/news/2012/0911/337135-fine-gael-councillor/)
https://www.irishtimes.com/news/drink-driving-charge-councillor-fled-checkpoint-1.1316649 (https://www.irishtimes.com/news/drink-driving-charge-councillor-fled-checkpoint-1.1316649)
http://www.independent.ie/irish-news/leading-fine-gael-councillor-quits-chair-after-drink-driving-arrest-26896697.html (http://www.independent.ie/irish-news/leading-fine-gael-councillor-quits-chair-after-drink-driving-arrest-26896697.html)
Quote from: Nally Stand on March 12, 2013, 11:53:25 AM
Not much chat about another Cork County Councillor in the news. Drunk driving, running from the Gardaí and hiding in the bushes ::)
http://www.eveningecho.ie/2013/03/02/cork-councillor-in-court-on-drink-driving-charge/ (http://www.eveningecho.ie/2013/03/02/cork-councillor-in-court-on-drink-driving-charge/)
If he had have been in Kerry they would have hired a limo to pick the fecker up
Quote from: stew on March 12, 2013, 02:22:05 PM
Quote from: Nally Stand on March 12, 2013, 11:53:25 AM
Not much chat about another Cork County Councillor in the news. Drunk driving, running from the Gardaí and hiding in the bushes ::)
http://www.eveningecho.ie/2013/03/02/cork-councillor-in-court-on-drink-driving-charge/ (http://www.eveningecho.ie/2013/03/02/cork-councillor-in-court-on-drink-driving-charge/)
If he had have been in Kerry they would have hired a limo to pick the fecker up and handed him the keys to it
Quote from: Nally Stand on March 12, 2013, 01:25:04 PM
Quote from: Tubberman on March 12, 2013, 12:16:37 PM
Quote from: Nally Stand on March 12, 2013, 11:53:25 AM
Not much chat about another Cork County Councillor in the news. Drunk driving, running from the Gardaí and hiding in the bushes ::)
http://www.eveningecho.ie/2013/03/02/cork-councillor-in-court-on-drink-driving-charge/ (http://www.eveningecho.ie/2013/03/02/cork-councillor-in-court-on-drink-driving-charge/)
Big reader of the Evening Echo are you?
Wouldn't be that popular around my area, so hadn't seen that.
I suppose RTÉ/The Irish Times/The Indo aren't commonplace in Mayo either?
http://www.rte.ie/news/2012/0911/337135-fine-gael-councillor/ (http://www.rte.ie/news/2012/0911/337135-fine-gael-councillor/)
https://www.irishtimes.com/news/drink-driving-charge-councillor-fled-checkpoint-1.1316649 (https://www.irishtimes.com/news/drink-driving-charge-councillor-fled-checkpoint-1.1316649)
http://www.independent.ie/irish-news/leading-fine-gael-councillor-quits-chair-after-drink-driving-arrest-26896697.html (http://www.independent.ie/irish-news/leading-fine-gael-councillor-quits-chair-after-drink-driving-arrest-26896697.html)
If he is guilty of that he is a disgrace. I doubt if anyone would defend him here.
However he isn't a TD and he wasn't part of a group, despite a warning in the Dáil, alleging Gárda corruption.
did ming raise the penalty points thing today in the dail
Quote from: lawnseed on March 12, 2013, 08:46:47 PM
did ming raise the penalty points thing today in the dail
(https://encrypted-tbn0.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcR1VkurUamgBnOrIqF1ZBZSENCh5wxYTDyIMLx92dAKh1fMMZbj9rWbk9A)
What you talkin' 'bout Lawnseed?
Quote from: lawnseed on March 12, 2013, 08:46:47 PM
did ming raise the penalty points thing today in the dail
Yep, sure did, but withheld names on legal advice.
Quote from: Fear ón Srath Bán on March 12, 2013, 09:20:37 PM
Quote from: lawnseed on March 12, 2013, 08:46:47 PM
did ming raise the penalty points thing today in the dail
Yep, sure did, but withheld names on legal advice.
with the sliveen mentality it wont even raise an eyebrow.. compare that to the justice in gb where taken someone elses points get you jail even when your a MP
Looks like the culture is infectious. It would be interesting to see just who has had points cancelled. Is any party / TD clean here?
Quote from: Maguire01 on March 12, 2013, 10:24:26 PM
Looks like the culture is infectious. It would be interesting to see just who has had points cancelled. Is any party / TD clean here?
well your crowd are clean this time.. as they circle the plughole north of the border
Quote from: lawnseed on March 12, 2013, 10:29:22 PM
Quote from: Maguire01 on March 12, 2013, 10:24:26 PM
Looks like the culture is infectious. It would be interesting to see just who has had points cancelled. Is any party / TD clean here?
well your crowd are clean this time.. as they circle the plughole north of the border
Unlike you, I don't have 'a crowd'.
Quote from: Maguire01 on March 12, 2013, 10:31:19 PM
Quote from: lawnseed on March 12, 2013, 10:29:22 PM
Quote from: Maguire01 on March 12, 2013, 10:24:26 PM
Looks like the culture is infectious. It would be interesting to see just who has had points cancelled. Is any party / TD clean here?
well your crowd are clean this time.. as they circle the plughole north of the border
Unlike you, I don't have 'a crowd'.
you sure dont ;D
where are yez heading for you next agm? some old peoples home around dungannon
Quote from: lawnseed on March 12, 2013, 10:36:25 PM
Quote from: Maguire01 on March 12, 2013, 10:31:19 PM
Quote from: lawnseed on March 12, 2013, 10:29:22 PM
Quote from: Maguire01 on March 12, 2013, 10:24:26 PM
Looks like the culture is infectious. It would be interesting to see just who has had points cancelled. Is any party / TD clean here?
well your crowd are clean this time.. as they circle the plughole north of the border
Unlike you, I don't have 'a crowd'.
you sure dont ;D
where are yez heading for you next agm? some old peoples home around dungannon
Unlike you, while my point of view will be more closely aligned to some parties than others, I've no loyalty to any. For today's proceedings at Stormont for example, I couldn't be much further from some of the SDLP contributions.
But you keep yourself young with your juvenile comments.
Quote from: Maguire01 on March 12, 2013, 10:41:23 PM
Quote from: lawnseed on March 12, 2013, 10:36:25 PM
Quote from: Maguire01 on March 12, 2013, 10:31:19 PM
Quote from: lawnseed on March 12, 2013, 10:29:22 PM
Quote from: Maguire01 on March 12, 2013, 10:24:26 PM
Looks like the culture is infectious. It would be interesting to see just who has had points cancelled. Is any party / TD clean here?
well your crowd are clean this time.. as they circle the plughole north of the border
Unlike you, I don't have 'a crowd'.
you sure dont ;D
where are yez heading for you next agm? some old peoples home around dungannon
Unlike you, while my point of view will be more closely aligned to some parties than others, I've no loyalty to any. For today's proceedings at Stormont for example, I couldn't be much further from some of the SDLP contributions.
But you keep yourself young with your juvenile comments.
thats right thats the thing we agree on religion and me being young ;)
Ming been handed his arse by Vinny Browne tonight, great stuff!! Ming, Step away from the shovel and stop digging!!!!!!
The f**king sheer arrogance of this p***k is mind blowing, i hope the Roscommon councillor involved, hangs this bollicks out to dry!!
Up the Ming. Roscommon councillors or officials are a shower of edjits unlike any other I've encountered and Ming rightly drove them soft by reducing their expenses and exposing their stupid and useless practices when he was a member of the chamber, I wouldn't believe anything one of them says about Ming as all but a few have major, major axes to grind.
Anyone that does, more's the fool you.
This is classic mid-term blather that only people not willing to consider the candidate to begin with will remember come election time.
I tend to believe a Garda would very much solicit well-known people like Ming claims given their continued poor behaviour with other famous people but Ming's mistake wasn't even letting it happen, it was not getting out in front of this story when Daly was pushing this last year. The whole thing is incredibly ironic to me because Ming has taken the train to Dublin for a few months now, most times I'm in Castlerea early I'll see him walking to the station with his gear in hand.
For anyone that wants a little perspective without someone like Vincent Browne making stroke faces and interrupting every five seconds: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=B3dGPnEdcoM (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=B3dGPnEdcoM)
Just listening to his tax evading go been man mate Mick Wallace defending him on Radio 1. You folk down South really get the politicians you deserve
Quote from: Dougal Maguire on March 13, 2013, 07:24:17 AM
Just listening to his tax evading go been man mate Mick Wallace defending him on Radio 1. You folk down South really get the politicians you deserve
Excuse me, but everyone (including you righteous nordies) gets the politicians they deserve.
Quote from: Syferus on March 13, 2013, 03:28:14 AM
Up the Ming. Roscommon councillors or officials are a shower of edjits unlike any other I've encountered and Ming rightly drove them soft by reducing their expenses and exposing their stupid and useless practices when he was a member of the chamber, I wouldn't believe anything one of them says about Ming as all but a few have major, major axes to grind.
Anyone that does, more's the fool you.
This is classic mid-term blather that only people not willing to consider the candidate to begin with will remember come election time.
I tend to believe a Garda would very much solicit well-known people like Ming claims given their continued poor behaviour with other famous people but Ming's mistake wasn't even letting it happen, it was not getting out in front of this story when Daly was pushing this last year. The whole thing is incredibly ironic to me because Ming has taken the train to Dublin for a few months now, most times I'm in Castlerea early I'll see him walking to the station with his gear in hand.
For anyone that wants a little perspective without someone like Vincent Browne making stroke faces and interrupting every five seconds: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=B3dGPnEdcoM (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=B3dGPnEdcoM)
I'm struggling to see the difference between you and those in North Tipp supporting Lowry, or South Kerry supporting Healy Rae.
Just watched both the Dail clip and VB appearance. Interesting that you think the pre-prepared, rehearsed and unchallenged version provides the perspective. Have to agree with An Gaeilgoir - VB ripped him a new one.
Elaine Byrne @ElaineByrne
Help me. RTE all over @lukeming €160 fine & 4 penalty pts. NOTHING yet on @michael_lowry apparent non-disclosure of £250,000.
Now there's a surprise
Ming the meek makes his point
Miriam Lord
A new political cohort has emerged in Leinster House – The Technicality Group.
These are the deputies who may have transgressed (think Mick Wallace and his tax affairs) but manage to escape censure on a technicality. Group members are distinguished by their brass necks and fantastic ability to turn a blind eye.
Hypocrisy and victimhood also come with the territory.
At the moment, The Technicality Group has three leading lights – Wallace, Clare Daly and Luke Ming Flanagan.
Its members were to the fore last night when the Spent Convictions Bill came up for discussion.
By the time Ming finished speaking, listeners could have been forgiven for thinking they had wandered into a debate on the Compromised Convictions Bill.
Although, in fairness, it was a case of being in the wrong place at the wrong time for Flanagan. He just happened to receive his penalty points when there was somebody in a position of influence around to have them wiped from the record.
In another unfortunate twist, he just happens to be in Leinster House this week. If he were in the Vatican instead, Ming would surely be a front runner in the race to the papacy.
Thanks to his wonderfully self-serving performance last evening, the holier than thou Roscommon deputy presented a most immaculate set of credentials to the House. (At least according to himself.)
Others may enter into the distinctly dodgy practice of actively seeking to have motoring penalty points quashed while others may find themselves sucked into a world of corruption by domineering Garda sergeants and sinister senior county council officials, but Ming the Infallible can do no wrong.
He may be part of a crusade against certain members of An Garda Síochána for sorting out people's points problems, among other things, but when he turns out to be the beneficiary of such carry-on – not once, but twice – Flanagan has no problem standing up in Dáil Éireann and bleating about the incidents as if they represent an injustice perpetrated against his own pristine character.
What was he to do?
The first time, Deputy Flanagan was forced by a sergeant to write to the station and request that his offence be wiped because he was entitled to do so under an antiquated rule which states that TDs cannot be snared by the police on their way to or from Leinster House.
This was after the officer heard that Ming had been done for using his mobile phone while driving.
What did this custodian of the law do but "insist" that Flanagan put pen to paper to avoid the fine?
Listening to Ming in the Dáil yesterday evening, you'd believe that policeman all but frog-marched him to the biro and Belvedere Bond.
Ming the meek – just ask all those people who have protested with him down through the years – always does what the local constabulary tell him to do.
But "that's not all" he told the Dáil, anxious to show how innocent people can be drawn into this murky world where "corruption is like rust", starting out unseen but soon corrupting everything it touches.
But not Ming, of course.
On this second occasion, in December 2011, six months or so after he endured the first atrocity, Deputy Flanagan was stopped again for talking on his mobile phone while driving.
This time, he mentioned it at a county council meeting and soon afterwards, a senior official got in touch to say he had sorted out the matter for him.
As you can imagine, Ming was outraged. On the spot. On both spots.
As outraged as any ordinary crusader for the little man trying to combat "systemic abuse" by shadowy establishment forces would be.
As outraged as only Ming can be, and frequently is.
And he did nothing. Said nothing.
Until the whole penalty points thing blew up and the Technicality Group ran with it.
And until the newspapers got wind of the penalty points that were turfed under the carpet for him.
Well, of course, it was the Garda's fault for leaking the information. That's "illegal" he told the Dáil, stung that such a thing could have been done to him.
And he would have said something (if not at the actual time, which some might consider the right moment to act) sooner, only he was keeping his powder dry so he could use his story to ambush the Minister for Justice.
No such thing as points getting quashed? At which point he would astonish Alan Shatter with his news.
"Whatever about the case whereby the points were removed on the grounds of travelling to the Dáil," he told the House, there was no case for the council official doing him a turn.
He's been terribly hard done by.
Ming is now hoping he will be allowed to pay the fine which "should have been imposed on me as punishment in the first place".
He believes 15 other parliamentarians were let off penalty points.
They should make amends too, he sulked.
(The TDs and Senators we met last night were moaning about their points and how nobody ever told them how to have them scrapped.)
Wallace, Flanagan and Daly spoke one after another, then left the chamber together.
Another mortifying night for the Technical Group. But, by the look of the Independent trio, a triumph for the Technicalities.
http://www.irishtimes.com/news/politics/oireachtas/ming-the-meek-makes-his-point-1.1324104?page=1
Quote from: Miriam Lord on March 13, 2013, 10:29:20 AM
Listening to Ming in the Dáil yesterday evening, you'd believe that policeman all but frog-marched him to the biro and Belvedere Bond.
Ming the meek – just ask all those people who have protested with him down through the years – always does what the local constabulary tell him to do.
Brilliant.
Quote from: Maguire01 on March 13, 2013, 09:31:21 AM
Quote from: Syferus on March 13, 2013, 03:28:14 AM
Up the Ming. Roscommon councillors or officials are a shower of edjits unlike any other I've encountered and Ming rightly drove them soft by reducing their expenses and exposing their stupid and useless practices when he was a member of the chamber, I wouldn't believe anything one of them says about Ming as all but a few have major, major axes to grind.
Anyone that does, more's the fool you.
This is classic mid-term blather that only people not willing to consider the candidate to begin with will remember come election time.
I tend to believe a Garda would very much solicit well-known people like Ming claims given their continued poor behaviour with other famous people but Ming's mistake wasn't even letting it happen, it was not getting out in front of this story when Daly was pushing this last year. The whole thing is incredibly ironic to me because Ming has taken the train to Dublin for a few months now, most times I'm in Castlerea early I'll see him walking to the station with his gear in hand.
For anyone that wants a little perspective without someone like Vincent Browne making stroke faces and interrupting every five seconds: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=B3dGPnEdcoM (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=B3dGPnEdcoM)
I'm struggling to see the difference between you and those in North Tipp supporting Lowry, or South Kerry supporting Healy Rae.
Just watched both the Dail clip and VB appearance. Interesting that you think the pre-prepared, rehearsed and unchallenged version provides the perspective. Have to agree with An Gaeilgoir - VB ripped him a new one.
The clue is in the post directly below your's, they've very different political animals.
One set has a history of embezzlement, the other has a history of fighting for, and pushing through, changes that crub politicians' abilities to abuse the system at local and national level. The people who tried to compare him to have tried to get rich off their position; Ming lives in relative poverty and always has. This isn't Mick Wallace, this is someone of honestly small means who has done as close to an honest job in the Dail as any I have ever seen.
Ming has always campaigned for better laws and practices for everyone even since 1997, not just parish pump issues. He's always been a big issue guy, not some inward-facing career politician. This is not a man enthralled with money or developers, if you knew Ming as long as people here have you'd know he gets himself into holes by being too honest with people, not by being a gombeen and trying to tell everyone what they want to hear. Just about the only thing Ming shares with Haely-Rae or Pacman Lowry is the same side of the Dail chamber.
He made a balls up letting them wipe his points to begin with but it's nothing short of ridiculous that you'd compare him to those sort of fools because of this incident.
And on Vincent Browne - it's grand entertainment to watch him make bizarre half-awake sounds and faces every few seconds if you're in the position of not having anything better to watch at 11 PM at night but as something of real worth it's negligible, Browne is as big a blow-hard as any of the politicians he features. Browne doing the same old routine he's been doing for decades isn't 'ripping him a new one' in anyone's langauge.
Quote from: Maguire01 on March 13, 2013, 10:29:20 AM
Ming the meek makes his point
Miriam Lord
A new political cohort has emerged in Leinster House – The Technicality Group.
These are the deputies who may have transgressed (think Mick Wallace and his tax affairs) but manage to escape censure on a technicality. Group members are distinguished by their brass necks and fantastic ability to turn a blind eye.
Hypocrisy and victimhood also come with the territory.
At the moment, The Technicality Group has three leading lights – Wallace, Clare Daly and Luke Ming Flanagan.
http://www.irishtimes.com/news/politics/oireachtas/ming-the-meek-makes-his-point-1.1324104?page=1
Why is Clare Daly in this group? Was her "technicality" not that she was under the limit or is there something else out there?
Quote from: Syferus on March 13, 2013, 10:57:23 AM
Quote from: Maguire01 on March 13, 2013, 09:31:21 AM
Quote from: Syferus on March 13, 2013, 03:28:14 AM
Up the Ming. Roscommon councillors or officials are a shower of edjits unlike any other I've encountered and Ming rightly drove them soft by reducing their expenses and exposing their stupid and useless practices when he was a member of the chamber, I wouldn't believe anything one of them says about Ming as all but a few have major, major axes to grind.
Anyone that does, more's the fool you.
This is classic mid-term blather that only people not willing to consider the candidate to begin with will remember come election time.
I tend to believe a Garda would very much solicit well-known people like Ming claims given their continued poor behaviour with other famous people but Ming's mistake wasn't even letting it happen, it was not getting out in front of this story when Daly was pushing this last year. The whole thing is incredibly ironic to me because Ming has taken the train to Dublin for a few months now, most times I'm in Castlerea early I'll see him walking to the station with his gear in hand.
For anyone that wants a little perspective without someone like Vincent Browne making stroke faces and interrupting every five seconds: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=B3dGPnEdcoM (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=B3dGPnEdcoM)
I'm struggling to see the difference between you and those in North Tipp supporting Lowry, or South Kerry supporting Healy Rae.
Just watched both the Dail clip and VB appearance. Interesting that you think the pre-prepared, rehearsed and unchallenged version provides the perspective. Have to agree with An Gaeilgoir - VB ripped him a new one.
The clue is in the post directly below your's, they've very different political animals.
One set has a history of embezzlement, the other has a history of fighting for, and pushing through, changes that crub politicians' abilities to abuse the system at local and national level. The people who tried to compare him to have tried to get rich off their position; Ming lives in relative poverty and always has. This isn't Mick Wallace, this is someone of honestly small means who has done as close to an honest job in the Dail as any I have ever seen.
Ming has always campaigned for better laws and practices for everyone even since 1997, not just parish pump issues. He's always been a big issue guy, not some inward-facing career politician. This is not a man enthralled with money or developers, if you knew Ming as long as people here have you'd know he gets himself into holes by being too honest with people, not by being a gombeen and trying to tell everyone what they want to hear. Just about the only thing Ming shares with Haely-Rae or Pacman Lowry is the same side of the Dail chamber.
He made a balls up letting them wipe his points to begin with but it's nothing short of ridiculous that you'd compare him to those sort of fools because of this incident.
And on Vincent Browne - it's grand entertainment to watch him make bizarre half-awake sounds and faces every few seconds if you're in the position of not having anything better to watch at 11 PM at night but as something of real worth it's negligible, Browne is as big a blow-hard as any of the politicians he features. Browne doing the same old routine he's been doing for decades isn't 'ripping him a new one' in anyone's langauge.
I have to agree with Syferus here. Ming is actually one of the good guys but he mucked up totally in this case. He will make full amends for his mistake I'm sure and not just by paying the fines and taking the points. You cannot compare him to the likes of Lowry or Healy-Rae or even Wallace.
Miriam Lord's article is not surprising. She has made a career out of the establishment so any chance to put the boot in on the anti-establishment crowd is gravy! As Syferus said VB is pure entertainment - I wouldn't take it too seriously. VB is so good at what he does he could easily argue black is white and make you agree by the end of the show.
Quote from: LeoMc on March 13, 2013, 11:26:38 AM
Quote from: Maguire01 on March 13, 2013, 10:29:20 AM
Ming the meek makes his point
Miriam Lord
A new political cohort has emerged in Leinster House – The Technicality Group.
These are the deputies who may have transgressed (think Mick Wallace and his tax affairs) but manage to escape censure on a technicality. Group members are distinguished by their brass necks and fantastic ability to turn a blind eye.
Hypocrisy and victimhood also come with the territory.
At the moment, The Technicality Group has three leading lights – Wallace, Clare Daly and Luke Ming Flanagan.
http://www.irishtimes.com/news/politics/oireachtas/ming-the-meek-makes-his-point-1.1324104?page=1
Why is Clare Daly in this group? Was her "technicality" not that she was under the limit or is there something else out there?
Yes - a terrible "technicality" that sickened a lot of establishment types.
Quote from: magpie seanie on March 13, 2013, 11:29:29 AM
I have to agree with Syferus here. Ming is actually one of the good guys but he mucked up totally in this case. He will make full amends for his mistake I'm sure and not just by paying the fines and taking the points. You cannot compare him to the likes of Lowry or Healy-Rae or even Wallace.
Miriam Lord's article is not surprising. She has made a career out of the establishment so any chance to put the boot in on the anti-establishment crowd is gravy! As Syferus said VB is pure entertainment - I wouldn't take it too seriously. VB is so good at what he does he could easily argue black is white and make you agree by the end of the show.
I don't think Ming is anywhere near as bad as Lowry or Healy-Rae but he has made a complete fool of himself here and making 'full amends' for it doesn't make it any less foolish. Miriam Lord, who doesn't spare the rod for establishment types, might as well have given up on her career as a sketch writer had she not taken the piss out of him.
Quote from: Syferus on March 13, 2013, 10:57:23 AM
Quote from: Maguire01 on March 13, 2013, 09:31:21 AM
Quote from: Syferus on March 13, 2013, 03:28:14 AM
Up the Ming. Roscommon councillors or officials are a shower of edjits unlike any other I've encountered and Ming rightly drove them soft by reducing their expenses and exposing their stupid and useless practices when he was a member of the chamber, I wouldn't believe anything one of them says about Ming as all but a few have major, major axes to grind.
Anyone that does, more's the fool you.
This is classic mid-term blather that only people not willing to consider the candidate to begin with will remember come election time.
I tend to believe a Garda would very much solicit well-known people like Ming claims given their continued poor behaviour with other famous people but Ming's mistake wasn't even letting it happen, it was not getting out in front of this story when Daly was pushing this last year. The whole thing is incredibly ironic to me because Ming has taken the train to Dublin for a few months now, most times I'm in Castlerea early I'll see him walking to the station with his gear in hand.
For anyone that wants a little perspective without someone like Vincent Browne making stroke faces and interrupting every five seconds: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=B3dGPnEdcoM (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=B3dGPnEdcoM)
I'm struggling to see the difference between you and those in North Tipp supporting Lowry, or South Kerry supporting Healy Rae.
Just watched both the Dail clip and VB appearance. Interesting that you think the pre-prepared, rehearsed and unchallenged version provides the perspective. Have to agree with An Gaeilgoir - VB ripped him a new one.
The clue is in the post directly below your's, they've very different political animals.
One set has a history of embezzlement, the other has a history of fighting for, and pushing through, changes that crub politicians' abilities to abuse the system at local and national level. The people who tried to compare him to have tried to get rich off their position; Ming lives in relative poverty and always has. This isn't Mick Wallace, this is someone of honestly small means who has done as close to an honest job in the Dail as any I have ever seen.
Ming has always campaigned for better laws and practices for everyone even since 1997, not just parish pump issues. He's always been a big issue guy, not some inward-facing career politician. This is not a man enthralled with money or developers, if you knew Ming as long as people here have you'd know he gets himself into holes by being too honest with people, not by being a gombeen and trying to tell everyone what they want to hear. Just about the only thing Ming shares with Haely-Rae or Pacman Lowry is the same side of the Dail chamber.
He made a balls up letting them wipe his points to begin with but it's nothing short of ridiculous that you'd compare him to those sort of fools because of this incident.
And on Vincent Browne - it's grand entertainment to watch him make bizarre half-awake sounds and faces every few seconds if you're in the position of not having anything better to watch at 11 PM at night but as something of real worth it's negligible, Browne is as big a blow-hard as any of the politicians he features. Browne doing the same old routine he's been doing for decades isn't 'ripping him a new one' in anyone's langauge.
Ming's biggest problem is that when you climb up on a high horse, you have to be squeaky clean. What he has done here is corrupt. It's low level stuff, but none the less corrupt.
And i'm not intending to compare him to Lowry or Healy Rae, rather that his local supporters don't seem to be able to call a spade 'a spade' - saying that "he made a balls up letting them wipe his points to begin with" isn't quite hitting the nail on the head. He didn't just 'let them wipe his points' - he wrote to them to have his points wiped. He was complicit, was he not?
The thing is, I appreciate the role he has played, being a thorn in the side of the establishment. And dismiss VB all you want, but I watched the show and it was quite clear how uncomfortable Ming was when challenged. This has seriously damaged his integrity and credibility.
Quote from: magpie seanie on March 13, 2013, 11:29:29 AM
Miriam Lord's article is not surprising. She has made a career out of the establishment so any chance to put the boot in on the anti-establishment crowd is gravy!
Does she not regularly stick the boot into the establishment?
And instead of playing 'the man', what are the inaccuracies with the article?
Quote from: Maguire01 on March 13, 2013, 12:13:04 PM
And instead of playing 'the man', what are the inaccuracies with the article?
Including Clare Daly in the 'Technicality Group' is a bit cheeky. Miriam Lord will no doubt claim artistic licence, but you can be sure it reinforces the view of some people that Daly was guilty of something.
Quote from: deiseach on March 13, 2013, 12:18:41 PM
Quote from: Maguire01 on March 13, 2013, 12:13:04 PM
And instead of playing 'the man', what are the inaccuracies with the article?
Including Clare Daly in the 'Technicality Group' is a bit cheeky. Miriam Lord will no doubt claim artistic licence, but you can be sure it reinforces the view of some people that Daly was guilty of something.
Yes, you could definitely argue that. But in terms of the content on Ming...
Miriam is a fantastic writer and I enjoy her pieces but that was definitely playing the man and not the ball in relation to Clare Daly.
The bigger picture in all of Ming's mistakes is the fact that in Ireland it's still who you know not, what you know when it comes to getting things done/sorted.
As an aside, I wonder how Chris Huhne and Vicky Pryce would have fared had they promised to make full amends for their behaviour - switch the points from her licence to his and all's well. I'm pretty sure Ming didn't break the law, but the idea that you can make everything okay by reversing what you did previously would have interesting social ramifications.
No doubt what he did was wrong and hypocritical. However, the kicking he got on the VB show was hardly a case of the punishment matching the crime. In the context of 400,000 plus unemployed, mortgage arrears, church scandals, bank debt tied into sovereign debt, etc. Not really a big news story, hows about the media and VB go after the former fiancial regulator and his co-horts. Leave the former pot smoking, turf cutting gasun alone, one of the better TD's out there imo. Even if he did score a horrible own-goal on this one. Politics in Ireland is far to parochial to the determinant of getting something useful done at a national level.
Quote from: deiseach on March 13, 2013, 12:37:04 PM
As an aside, I wonder how Chris Huhne and Vicky Pryce would have fared had they promised to make full amends for their behaviour - switch the points from her licence to his and all's well. I'm pretty sure Ming didn't break the law, but the idea that you can make everything okay by reversing what you did previously would have interesting social ramifications.
I think you misunderstood what I said on this. Paying the fines and taking the points on his licence won't be the end of making amends for this blunder for Ming. At least he had the balls to go on VB unlike the guys who have don't countless times more damage to the country. He is actively, albeit belatedly, standing up against the nod, nod, wink, wink culture that is all encompassing and a cancer on our society for generations.
Our socio-political system is broken and totally unfit for purpose. There is zero fairness in our society and worse still - not even the veil of pretence to be seen. Effectively one party government since partition/independence hasd continually wrecked our country and rather than fight against it people try to fit into it and demonise the likes of Ming. It makes no sense.
Quote from: deiseach on March 13, 2013, 11:50:03 AM
Quote from: magpie seanie on March 13, 2013, 11:29:29 AM
I have to agree with Syferus here. Ming is actually one of the good guys but he mucked up totally in this case. He will make full amends for his mistake I'm sure and not just by paying the fines and taking the points. You cannot compare him to the likes of Lowry or Healy-Rae or even Wallace.
Miriam Lord's article is not surprising. She has made a career out of the establishment so any chance to put the boot in on the anti-establishment crowd is gravy! As Syferus said VB is pure entertainment - I wouldn't take it too seriously. VB is so good at what he does he could easily argue black is white and make you agree by the end of the show.
I don't think Ming is anywhere near as bad as Lowry or Healy-Rae but he has made a complete fool of himself here and making 'full amends' for it doesn't make it any less foolish. Miriam Lord, who doesn't spare the rod for establishment types, might as well have given up on her career as a sketch writer had she not taken the piss out of him.
Lowry and Healy-Rae all started as unknowns once.
I see greatness in Ming. Give him time, he has the ability to go all the way.
Quote from: deiseach on March 13, 2013, 12:37:04 PM
As an aside, I wonder how Chris Huhne and Vicky Pryce would have fared had they promised to make full amends for their behaviour - switch the points from her licence to his and all's well. I'm pretty sure Ming didn't break the law, but the idea that you can make everything okay by reversing what you did previously would have interesting social ramifications.
Especially if it only applies if/when you're caught.
Quote from: magpie seanie on March 13, 2013, 02:25:44 PM
I think you misunderstood what I said on this. Paying the fines and taking the points on his licence won't be the end of making amends for this blunder for Ming. At least he had the balls to go on VB unlike the guys who have don't countless times more damage to the country. He is actively, albeit belatedly, standing up against the nod, nod, wink, wink culture that is all encompassing and a cancer on our society for generations.
What further punishment will there be for Ming for his 'blunder'? I presume there will be no legal sanction against him, so the only thing I can see is being ridiculed by satirists for a hilarious case of foot-in-mouth, yet you seem to find this to be a display of establishment hackery.
If I was in Mings camp I would insist that he now shaves the beard and sideburns and get a haircut.
That would deflect attention from this act of treason.
Quote from: highorlow on March 13, 2013, 03:08:46 PM
If I was in Mings camp I would insist that he now shaves the beard and sideburns and get a haircut.
That would deflect attention from this act of treason.
He should fall on his (Wilkinson) Sword. :D
His career has gone to pot. He tried to set up a smokescreen and made a hash of it but he doesn't seem to give a shit.
Quote from: Hardy on March 13, 2013, 03:43:13 PM
His career has gone to pot. He tried to set up a smokescreen and made a hash of it but he doesn't seem to give a shit.
The Dope.
He needs to cut and run to a different turf, silly sod.
Quote from: Maguire01 on March 13, 2013, 12:10:10 PM
[Ming's biggest problem is that when you climb up on a high horse, you have to be squeaky clean. What he has done here is corrupt. It's low level stuff, but none the less corrupt.
. This has seriously damaged his integrity and credibility.
Agree 100%.
I won't be delivering any leaflets for him next time around or voting for him either.
So it looks like I'll now be scrawling "NO THANKS" across the ballot paper :-\ :(
RTÉ News @rtenews 6m
TDs Mick Wallace and Clare Daly have entered Shannon Airport in order to inspect a US military aircraft
RTÉ News @rtenews 5m
Two people have been arrested after getting through a fence and entering Shannon Airport. They are being detained at Shannon Garda Station
Expand
I wonder how this one is going to play out!
QuoteRTÉ News @rtenews 6m
TDs Mick Wallace and Clare Daly have entered Shannon Airport in order to inspect a US military aircraft
RTÉ News @rtenews 5m
Two people have been arrested after getting through a fence and entering Shannon Airport. They are being detained at Shannon Garda Station
Expand
I wonder how this one is going to play out!
Was there drink involved?
Quote from: gerrykeegan on July 22, 2014, 01:30:17 PM
RTÉ News @rtenews 6m
TDs Mick Wallace and Clare Daly have entered Shannon Airport in order to inspect a US military aircraft
RTÉ News @rtenews 5m
Two people have been arrested after getting through a fence and entering Shannon Airport. They are being detained at Shannon Garda Station
Expand
I wonder how this one is going to play out!
Released without charge !
Quote from: highorlow on July 22, 2014, 03:27:00 PM
QuoteRTÉ News @rtenews 6m
TDs Mick Wallace and Clare Daly have entered Shannon Airport in order to inspect a US military aircraft
RTÉ News @rtenews 5m
Two people have been arrested after getting through a fence and entering Shannon Airport. They are being detained at Shannon Garda Station
Expand
I wonder how this one is going to play out!
Was there drink involved?
(http://cdn3.independent.ie/migration_catalog/article25337230.ece/8c6ac/ALTERNATES/w620/Mick-Wallace-1)
Quote from: orangeman on July 22, 2014, 03:36:49 PM
Quote from: gerrykeegan on July 22, 2014, 01:30:17 PM
RTÉ News @rtenews 6m
TDs Mick Wallace and Clare Daly have entered Shannon Airport in order to inspect a US military aircraft
RTÉ News @rtenews 5m
Two people have been arrested after getting through a fence and entering Shannon Airport. They are being detained at Shannon Garda Station
Expand
I wonder how this one is going to play out!
Released without charge !
Apparently a file is being sent to the dpp.
While I wouldn't have any time for either and Wallace in particular I think is a sc**bag. I'd say they're actually correct on this. It seems fairly likely the US have used irish airports for rendition and transport of weapons but we pretend that they don't because we can't afford to piss them off. It'd be better off to just come clean on it and quit sticking our heads in the sand.
Quote from: macdanger2 on July 22, 2014, 09:13:33 PM
Quote from: orangeman on July 22, 2014, 03:36:49 PM
Quote from: gerrykeegan on July 22, 2014, 01:30:17 PM
RTÉ News @rtenews 6m
TDs Mick Wallace and Clare Daly have entered Shannon Airport in order to inspect a US military aircraft
RTÉ News @rtenews 5m
Two people have been arrested after getting through a fence and entering Shannon Airport. They are being detained at Shannon Garda Station
Expand
I wonder how this one is going to play out!
Released without charge !
Apparently a file is being sent to the dpp.
While I wouldn't have any time for either and Wallace in particular I think is a sc**bag. I'd say they're actually correct on this. It seems fairly likely the US have used irish airports for rendition and transport of weapons but we pretend that they don't because we can't afford to piss them off. It'd be better off to just come clean on it and quit sticking our heads in the sand.
They broke the law on suspicion that someone else might be breaking the law. As a matter of interest, what is the law for US military aircraft at Shannon and what grounds did they feel entitled them to conduct an inspection?
QuoteAs a matter of interest, what is the law for US military aircraft at Shannon and what grounds did they feel entitled them to conduct an inspection?
Good point.
The Dail passed a motion in '03 to allow military planes to land in Shannon. I think the pair seem to think that if weapons are on board we are breaching neutrality and our constitution.
I don't know anything about international aviation law.
It's a publicity and electioneering stunt by the two idiots.
Quotewhat grounds did they feel entitled them to conduct an inspection
They have admitted they were breaking the law and this was the only way they could inspect them. Shatter told them to show him the evidence so they are blaming him.
We do allow navy warcraft on our seas, whats the difference?
Quote from: Mayo4Sam on July 23, 2014, 09:48:05 AM
We do allow navy warcraft on our seas, whats the difference?
em, there aint 1000s of Irish people within striking distance of the boats?
Well there are, anything of them that anchour at an Irish port are within range of any number of people
They are idiots, and this is totally a self-serving publicity stunt for the 2 of them but they does raise the issue of rendition flights into the public limelight at a time when the whole question of the US and it's role as the world's 'policeman' is being called into question. The whole notion of irish neutrality is false and Christy wasn't too far wrong!!!
http://waterfordwhispersnews.com/2014/07/23/wallace-and-dalys-parents-forbid-them-from-seeing-each-other-again/
QuoteTHE parents of Mick Wallace and Claire Daly have today banned the pair from seeing each other ever again, following their arrest at Shannon Airport yesterday afternoon.
The TD's, who claim they were inspecting US military aircraft as part of a protest against Shannon Airport being used as a Military Hub, were released without charge a short time later, and were picked up at Shannon Garda Station by their highly apologetic Mams and Dads.
"I just don't know what I'm going to with him" said Michaela Wallace, in an emotional press conference with her friends during a coffee morning in Wexford earlier.
"It's that Daly girl, leading him astray. And that Ming lad, the cannabis fella. My boy used to have such a god job at the buildings, then he fell in with that lot. Next thing, I'm getting calls from him, 'Mam will you come pick me up at the Garda Station... well I tell you, I was MORTIFIED!!".
"I told him Mick, I said Mick, can you not just do your job in the Dail without this carry on? Try and be like the other TDs and just don't get involved... but of course, he knows everything so he does".
Mrs. Wallace went on to state that her son had been grounded for the rest of the year, and is forbidden from contacting Claire Daly until the Dail is back in session. A similar ban has also been put on Ms. Daly, by her irate father.
"That lad with the fuckin' head on him, coming round here corrupting our Claire" said Cillian Daly, who isn't angry at his daughter, just disappointed. "She has it all in her head now about protests and Military planes and inspecting them for weapons on the runway of an airport... This Wallace f**ker thinks he's Hans Blix and he's roped my wee girl in with him".
"She's up there in her room now sulking that I won't let her see him anymore. Shouting on about how she hates me, and how I just don't understand her and how they're just making a stand against the US military is using Shannon Airport as a military base. It's hard to listen to, but I just don't want her to throw away her whole future over some fuckin' hippy".
Quote from: brokencrossbar1 on July 23, 2014, 10:18:59 AM
They are idiots, and this is totally a self-serving publicity stunt for the 2 of them but they does raise the issue of rendition flights into the public limelight at a time when the whole question of the US and it's role as the world's 'policeman' is being called into question. The whole notion of irish neutrality is false and Christy wasn't too far wrong!!!
It is important to note that Irish neutrality was never about neutrality. It was about being 'neutral' against Britain and being able to avoid helping them whenever it suited us.
Quote from: muppet on July 23, 2014, 03:29:48 PM
Quote from: brokencrossbar1 on July 23, 2014, 10:18:59 AM
They are idiots, and this is totally a self-serving publicity stunt for the 2 of them but they does raise the issue of rendition flights into the public limelight at a time when the whole question of the US and it's role as the world's 'policeman' is being called into question. The whole notion of irish neutrality is false and Christy wasn't too far wrong!!!
It is important to note that Irish neutrality was never about neutrality. It was about being 'neutral' against Britain and being able to avoid helping them whenever it suited us.
In other words, national policies on neutrality, like strategic alliances and postures of belligerence, are decided on the basis of national interest. People seem to think neutrality as a policy is some kind of expression of either a pious pacifism or cowardice. Very few people seem to know that, in addition to the countries that stayed neutral throughout WWII, the USA, Netherlands, Belgium, Luxembourg, Norway, Denmark and others were neutral until attacked.
Quote from: Hardy on July 23, 2014, 03:59:25 PM
Quote from: muppet on July 23, 2014, 03:29:48 PM
Quote from: brokencrossbar1 on July 23, 2014, 10:18:59 AM
They are idiots, and this is totally a self-serving publicity stunt for the 2 of them but they does raise the issue of rendition flights into the public limelight at a time when the whole question of the US and it's role as the world's 'policeman' is being called into question. The whole notion of irish neutrality is false and Christy wasn't too far wrong!!!
It is important to note that Irish neutrality was never about neutrality. It was about being 'neutral' against Britain and being able to avoid helping them whenever it suited us.
In other words, national policies on neutrality, like strategic alliances and postures of belligerence, are decided on the basis of national interest. People seem to think neutrality as a policy is some kind of expression of either a pious pacifism or cowardice. Very few people seem to know that, in addition to the countries that stayed neutral throughout WWII, the USA, Netherlands, Belgium, Luxembourg, Norway, Denmark and others were neutral until attacked.
Agreed. To a point.
If we say Ireland is neutral, and we do, what does that mean? You say it isn't an ideological position, which is fair enough, but then what is it? USA stayed eyed neutral in both World Wars until they had to enter, but they don't set themselves up as being 'neutral'. The same applies to The Netherlands, Belgium, Luxembourg, Norway and Denmark who are members of NATO. We are different, whatever that means.
To my mind our neutrality was to appease (the understandable) anti-British sentiments 80/90 years ago (Black & Tans anyone?), but it has since become an odd quirk of our independence.
We're not the only ones who have been neutral by long-term policy - see Switzerland, Sweden, Austria, etc. I don't believe anybody thinks Switzerland's neutrality, for instance, is any kind of ideological, never mind moral stance. And all of these nations maintain a strongly armed neutrality. They just don't join military alliances as a matter of policy because it works for them. For now, anyway.
While a misty-eyed view that our neutrality is rooted in a moral objection to military action may prevail among the romantically inclined, I suggest the dept. of Foreign Affairs simply calculates that it's the best position for our national interest. We haven't much to offer any potential ally, other than the use of our territory, airports and ports, so they're not exactly lining up to sign us up. On the other hand, a neutral stance may occasionally offer opportunities that would not be available to countries with certain alliances.
It also saves us spending cash we don't have on weapons we generally don't want to use.
I understood that our neutrality comes from Dev wanting to differentiate the Irish Free State from the UK.
Taken from wiki:
Quote
While most neutral states do not allow any foreign military within their territory, Ireland has a long history of allowing military aircraft of various nations to refuel at Shannon Airport. Under the Air Navigation (Foreign Military Aircraft) Order, 1952,[4] the Minister for Foreign Affairs, exceptionally, could grant permission to foreign military aircraft to overfly or land in the State. Confirmation was required that the aircraft in question be unarmed, carry no arms, ammunition or explosives and that the flights in question would not form part of military exercises or operations.
After the September 11 attacks, these conditions were "waived in respect of aircraft operating in pursuit of the implementation of the United Nations Security Council Resolution 1368".
http://waterfordwhispersnews.com/2014/07/23/wallace-and-dalys-parents-forbid-them-from-seeing-each-other-again/ (http://waterfordwhispersnews.com/2014/07/23/wallace-and-dalys-parents-forbid-them-from-seeing-each-other-again/)