Cork can be every bit as cynical as Donegal. Should be a cracker.
Going to be incredible game of hard football.
Cork go in as rightful favourites, they are pretty much a complete side with better footballers.
Just think the blanket defence 3.0 could eek this out for Donegal.
it'll be another tight and hard fought dog fight, hopefully.
my one concern is how easily cork put kildare to the sword. admittedly, kildare seemed out of sorts today... wide after wide. really hard to know what went wrong wih kildare's attack it misfired so badly, and they just didn't seem to attack with enough supporting numbers when they had the opportunities.
but there's no denying cork were impressive. ruthless even. we'll fancy it though.
and now for the gaaboard cliche.... whoever wins will be hard to stop!
Cork went to sleep for the second quarter, they will need to be on their game for the entire 70 minutes if they are to beat Donegal. It may not be one for the purists, but I am really looking forward to this one.
Cork have that physical element that will count against Donegal. Cork should make the final.
...and if my predictions are as accurate as this weekend's, Donegal will do it.
I thought Donegal were well worth their win today. They even threw in a mini-collapse at the end so they could win it twice, which probably made it all the sweeter. Kerry were a little bit unlucky in that their more senior players picked up untimely injuries when they did which disrupted their shape and rhythm but Donegal looked stronger when both teams had their full compliment.
Cork will probably not be able to beat Donegal the same way we beat Kildare. The running game up the middle will play into their hands. We need to be more clever and patient in delivering the ball to our better forwards to shoot for the posts. Sheehan is probably our best long-range shooter but was badly off-form today. Colm O'Neill and Kerrigan tried too many hail mary shots as well off their weaker foot today which is meat and drink to the Donegal system. Alan O'Connor hasn't replicated his league form in the Championship and will be lucky to hold off Pearse O'Neill.
Cork have conceded two goals in twelve games this year. If we can keep another clean sheet I would fancy our chances but there is still three weeks to prepare for what should be a fascinating game.
Cork'll take McHugh's head off before five minutes have sounded. That'll win it for them.
I picked Kerry to win today so there'll be nobody taking me too seriously here, but I think Cork will have the necessary street smarts to overcome an impressive Tír Chonaill side.
Quote from: Ard-Rí on August 05, 2012, 11:10:23 PM
I picked Kerry to win today so there'll be nobody taking me too seriously here, but I think Cork will have the necessary street smarts to overcome an impressive Tír Chonaill side.
Tír Chonaill it
isn't: Inis Eoghain (Inishowen) players
are included in the side! :P ;)
Corks style of play will play into Donegals hands. Lateral passing and breaking tackles, can see them getting frustrated as they did v Mayo last year.
Jim McGuinness has done an unbelievable job with Donegal. The system and work rate have been well documeted but he has turned the likes of Rory Kavanagh and Colm McFadden who were always good players on their day into players who will give an 8/10 performance every time. To beat Cork they will need Murphy to find a bit of form (still doesn't seem fully fit).
Quote from: Fear ón Srath Bán on August 05, 2012, 11:14:17 PM
Quote from: Ard-Rí on August 05, 2012, 11:10:23 PM
I picked Kerry to win today so there'll be nobody taking me too seriously here, but I think Cork will have the necessary street smarts to overcome an impressive Tír Chonaill side.
Tír Chonaill it isn't: Inis Eoghain (Inishowen) players are included in the side! :P ;)
Good catch. ;D
Cork, Mayo and Dublin must be hoping against Ireland getting a Gold in the Boxing.
G'wan John Joe, Michael and Paddy! Sicken the three of them!
The Irish News must not think much of Cork! They have Donegal in the Final ;D
I was at the Cork game yesterday and was not as impressed as many on here. The goals came from Kildare mistakes and Kildare just fell apart. Kildare have been exposed for what they really are, an average enough side who are fit and strong.
Cork have better players than Donegal, in fact Donegal have a few pretty average players but Donegal would be favourites in my eyes. They nose in front and stay there. They'll frustrate Cork like never before and wear them down.
In saying all that I'd dearly love to see Donegal get hammered as I detest the game they play but respect their endevour. Up Cork.
That was dreadful stuff in the second game yesterday, the future of gaelic football is bleak if a team like Donegal go on and win the All Ireland as others will inevitably copy it. Kerry are no strangers to playing "puke football" themselves, but that was unlike anything they'd faced before. Dublin are almost as bad ( they were the "saviours of gaelic football" last year when they only played 12 men behind the ball as opposed to Donegal's 14. I sincerely hope that neither of those teams win through in their semi-finals as if the showpiece game of gaelic football is contested between these two negative teams, it will turn people off football in their hundreds of thousands. For the sake of the game. lets' hope Mayo and Cork contest the final.
Quote from: ONeill on August 05, 2012, 10:50:24 PM
Cork'll take McHugh's head off before five minutes have sounded. That'll win it for them.
Can't believe no one has done this yet.
As a neutral in Croke Park yesterday I was disgusted at the levels of cynical fouling all over the pitch. Donegal are the biggest culprits and have mastered this as part of their gameplan.
Gaelic Football is the only game I know of that fouling will help your team. Fouling therefore is a positive tactic and one that teams are now being coached. In fairness Cork seemed to play the game fairly. My advice to them is to get cynical if they want to win.
The GAA really needs to address this. Bring in the sin bin, two fouls and you are in. Also the fouler should be made go behind the kicker for the free kick. The advantage should be with the man with the free kick. The present system means its almost a disadvantage to get a free kick.
http://www.donegaldemocrat.ie/news/local/donegal-club-championship-postponed-1-4136739
good to hear it.
Wondering if anybody can help me out with X2/x3 Premium Level tickets for this one. If you can, please message me back or PM me and if you's can't thanks all the same.
Quote from: cadence on August 08, 2012, 12:04:10 AM
http://www.donegaldemocrat.ie/news/local/donegal-club-championship-postponed-1-4136739
good to hear it.
Yes - it's all about 30 players and to hell with everyone else. Cop yourself on! This is an absolute scandal that shouldn't be allowed to happen. Obviously most Donegal people will disagree if it lands them Sam - much like their "style" of play, the end justifies the means - but it's just wrong that club football is treated so shabbily. We all know where this is going and most people don't give a shit becasue they aren't involved in clubs.
Quote from: magpie seanie on August 08, 2012, 04:38:46 PM
Quote from: cadence on August 08, 2012, 12:04:10 AM
http://www.donegaldemocrat.ie/news/local/donegal-club-championship-postponed-1-4136739
good to hear it.
Yes - it's all about 30 players and to hell with everyone else. Cop yourself on! This is an absolute scandal that shouldn't be allowed to happen. Obviously most Donegal people will disagree if it lands them Sam - much like their "style" of play, the end justifies the means - but it's just wrong that club football is treated so shabbily. We all know where this is going and most people don't give a shit becasue they aren't involved in clubs.
as far as i'm aware, the clubs are supportive. and it's hardly a scandal to most, altough i do recognise that this can be a very upsetting topic for some people.
Quote from: magpie seanie on August 08, 2012, 04:38:46 PM
Quote from: cadence on August 08, 2012, 12:04:10 AM
http://www.donegaldemocrat.ie/news/local/donegal-club-championship-postponed-1-4136739
good to hear it.
Yes - it's all about 30 players and to hell with everyone else. Cop yourself on! This is an absolute scandal that shouldn't be allowed to happen. Obviously most Donegal people will disagree if it lands them Sam - much like their "style" of play, the end justifies the means - but it's just wrong that club football is treated so shabbily. We all know where this is going and most people don't give a shit becasue they aren't involved in clubs.
I think what is scandalous is the fact that clubs are deprived of their best players for much of the season because they are tied up with the county team. What compounds the issue is that you have a brave few panelists who will get little to no playing time and are actually regressing riding the pines when they could be playing for their club side.
I agree 100% Seanie that the clubs get treated shabbily, the problem is that club football makes little to know money and the county teams are were the dosh is at, and that is why the clubs play second fiddle to the county teams.
This is a tough one to call. Donegal were so impressive against Kerry, but so were Cork against Kildare. Cork also hadn't played a competitive since playing Kerry in the Munster Semi-final. If anyone can get through the blanket defence, I think it's Cork because of their size. Whoever wins this will win the All-Ireland imo.
Leo McGloone had developed into a very good player with Donegal. He played most of the league at centre back, played there aswell with UUJ this year. He looks a very good player on the 40. Gallagher will be back to full fitness the next day do Donegal should be at full strength.
I think Cork would have won Sam last year if Goulding,Sheehan and O Neill were available.It will be a huge task for Donegal. Hope the can do it.
Would you get tickets around Croke Park on the day of this game? Our minors are on beforehand and I'm probably going to end up going after them.
Will be loads of tickets, the game won't get anywhere near 70,000 even. Both quarter finals double bills struggled to get 60,000, even with the dubs. I'd say the dub mayo game might be near a sell out alright, but this game could see donegal bring 40,000 with 5-10,000 from cork, plus a few other heads like me who will be going.
I'd expect a decent Cork crowd to travel for this one, over 15,000 or so. There was sizeable Cork crowds for the Semis in 2009 v Tyrone and in 2010 v Dublin and I could see a similar turnout for this one.
Like Kerry and Kilkenny Cork folk are spoilt and tend to be fussy in which games they decide to attend. Various factors come into play, one of which is the level of respect they'd have for the opposition. That sounds arrogant and it probably is but when people have to pick and choose the games they attend they will pick the ones with the higher profile. Donegal are correctly perceived as been a top contender so the game will attract a bigger than normal Cork crowd.
But overall I wouldn't see the attendance topping 50,000 so no issue with tickets.
Corks cynical fouling will play a major aspect to the game. They wont let donegal build from the back but instead stop their runs from the donegal full back line. If an attacker is pushed up on McHugh he might struggle to cope with that, but I feel it will be down to whether Cork will feel comfortable in pushing an attacker up on Mark McHugh rather than the convential idea of letting the 'loose half back' become a sweeper.
Quote from: cadence on August 08, 2012, 12:04:10 AM
http://www.donegaldemocrat.ie/news/local/donegal-club-championship-postponed-1-4136739
good to hear it.
What i find gas is that Donegal have asked the ulster council to delay the running of the ulster club championship so that they can have a team to participate in it . Simple solution if you want a team in the ulster club championship then run your own championship don't be postponing games for the whole of the summer.
Quote from: the Deel Rover on August 10, 2012, 12:01:53 PM
Quote from: cadence on August 08, 2012, 12:04:10 AM
http://www.donegaldemocrat.ie/news/local/donegal-club-championship-postponed-1-4136739
good to hear it.
What i find gas is that Donegal have asked the ulster council to delay the running of the ulster club championship so that they can have a team to participate in it . Simple solution if you want a team in the ulster club championship then run your own championship don't be postponing games for the whole of the summer.
meh.... ulster delay, fine, they don't, no biggie (as buffy used to say).
I find that an astonishing position to take. You're basically saying you're happy to sacrifice the opportunity of all senior club players in Donegal the chance of an Ulster and All Ireland medal for the chance of IC glory. Your opponents, who by the way, aren't an immensely successful football county themselves are carrying on with their club championships as they should. Counties should have to finish their club championships in due course as is their responsibility. My own county pulled a similar stroke not so long ago and gained nothing by it. We should either split county and club altogether or find a system whereby they can exist together but calling off club games like this is a disgrace. I can only presume Donegal folk agreeing with it have no involvement in club football.
In fairness, Donegal teams have a limited influence on the destination of the Ulster club championship.
True, but you could say that about many teams in all sports. The reality is that all club players should know when they are playing and should be allowed compete for their titles in reasonable time frame. I don't know how lads put up with it to be honest and I'm not sure many will for much longer.
Quote from: Zulu on August 10, 2012, 07:41:47 PM
I find that an astonishing position to take. You're basically saying you're happy to sacrifice the opportunity of all senior club players in Donegal the chance of an Ulster and All Ireland medal for the chance of IC glory. Your opponents, who by the way, aren't an immensely successful football county themselves are carrying on with their club championships as they should. Counties should have to finish their club championships in due course as is their responsibility. My own county pulled a similar stroke not so long ago and gained nothing by it. We should either split county and club altogether or find a system whereby they can exist together but calling off club games like this is a disgrace. I can only presume Donegal folk agreeing with it have no involvement in club football.
utilitarian rather than kantian ethics. i'm comforatable with it. wee bit of perspective. no human rights breaches here.
Excuse me but. returning to the topic,
I love Cark football, but on this occasion I feel they better beware as the Ulster champs are coming to get them
Clever post Smart one but check out the great Wiki's take on Kant
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kantian_ethics
Maybe both club and county resemble the duty thing
kant's duty is more straight up principles and values, e.g. one human life being precious enough to base an ethical decision/action upon. he'd see there being a duty to go to war to save one life for example. bit extreme, but if you extend the argument that's where you'd get. whereas utilitarianism is basing that choice on what would be of benefit to the majority. county wins out using utilitarian ethics, club is more important using kantian ethics. i'm sticking to utilitarianism on this one!
Will Kanty be fit?
if he is, he'll be making his case out on the field, as his duty demands. good fun this!
Quote from: rrhf on August 11, 2012, 01:40:07 PM
Will Kanty be fit?
Should be, and if he does he will probably be sacrificing his own attacking instincts to operate as a sweeper in front of McFadden. Pure utilitarianism at its best in the pursuit of the greater good.
Cork's deontological brand of attacking football should ultimately overcome Donegal's consequentialist approach.
Utilitarianism + Kanty + Deontological ethics > Utilitarianism on its own = Cork win.
bit of post-structuralism too in the donegal game would you not say eviemonkey? donegal win if so!
I was intrigued as to what some of those words meant. You learn something everyday but lets hope Anthony Davis doesn't try using some of those words
de·on·tol·o·gy (d n-t l -j ). n. Ethical theory concerned with duties and rights. [Greek deon, deont-, obligation, necessity (from neuter present participle of dein, ...
con·se·quen·tial·ism (k n s -kw n sh -l z m). n. The view that the value of an action derives solely from the value of its consequences.
Can't figure post-structuralism though.
took me over an hour to write out an explanation of post-structuralism and how it applies to donegal, then i lost the feckin' thing becasue i had stopped being logged in.
Quote from: cadence on August 11, 2012, 09:03:27 PM
took me over an hour to write out an explanation of post-structuralism and how it applies to donegal, then i lost the feckin' thing becasue i had stopped being logged in.
Systems failure, a sign of things to come on the 26th. ;)
I had to google post-structuralism and having digested it I still hadn't a clue how it applied to Donegal. That probably had a lot to do with me still not fully understanding post-structuralism even after the google search. Throw up the executive summary up there when you get another chance.
Early reports are the Cork players came through their club games ok so far, with a couple more to play tomorrow. Kant is happy regardless, Bentham and Canty are keeping their fingers crossed.
I am looking forward to this game. I am not so sure of the Donegal system as they nearly lost it the last day ,however they strike me as a very dedicated astute bunch who will know where they have to improve. Cork are good and are unique that they have no really outstanding player but rather a strong squad. My view is that Donegal will have to be more ambitious and get Murphy into the game more. I am hoping to get there in person and will be completely neutral and hope the best team win.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=T_gwxhb5-t4
nice wee tune!
Was that the wee Donegal priest from Father Ted?
He sure knows his Irish geography!!
Quote from: cadence on August 11, 2012, 09:03:27 PM
took me over an hour to write out an explanation of post-structuralism and how it applies to donegal, then i lost the feckin' thing becasue i had stopped being logged in.
All you have to do is press the post button I thought??
IT'S FOOTBALL JIM, BUT NOT AS WE KNOW IT
D Maguire
'Michael, I don't know what to say. I don't know whether to laugh, or cry. I can understand the effectiveness of this defensive system. I can understand that they're not in the business of entertainment and I can understand that it's all about results and Donegal people won't give a tuppenny if they win an All-Ireland playing this sort of football. But heaven help us Michael if this is the way the game of Gaelic football is going to go because I've seen the apocalypse there in the last 38 minutes. Remember that tribe in Iraq, the Shi'ite tribe? Well, we've watched Shi'ite football for the last......"
(Pat Spillane, RTE, half time of the 2011 All-Ireland semi-final – Dublin v Donegal)
Probably the most common response reading that now is to downplay the level of seriousness you should hold Spillane's words in. Yet that common default reaction can be a lazy stance to take. How could you not have agreed with him? With 23 minutes on the clock in last year's All-Ireland Semi-Final, the scoreboard screamed at us: 'Dublin 0-1 Donegal 0-1.' At the same stage in the other semi-final there had been eight scores on the board in what was an uncharacteristically tight Mayo-Kerry first half. We know it takes two to tango and that Dublin also had defensively modified their 'startled earwigs' approach of previous campaigns but there was no getting away from the fact that this Donegal side elevated shut-out tactics to a new level, akin to the Italian Catenaccio system – the 'door-bolt'. It wasn't pretty. There's no shying away from that. I had witnessed it at first hand in Clones when Donegal defeated Tyrone in the Ulster semi a couple of months earlier. A Tyrone defender picked up the ball on his own end-line. Instead of pressurising Martin Swift, the Donegal attacker retreated, running backwards to his pre-ordaining training position, adhering rigidly to Jim McGuiness' script. Initially, it looked like a dishonourable retreat.
I agreed with Spillane that day although I'd never seen the Shi'ite's with a size 5. It did look like the sky was falling. Unlike McGuinness, I couldn't see what was needed to take Donegal closer to the ultimate endgame. I didn't possess that vision. I didn't want to recognise the beauty of controlled, defensive football. We still harked back to the 'gay abandon' of those great Kerry/Dublin battles of the 70s whether it really did happen or not. I didn't want to see our All-Ireland final besmirched with such extreme tactics and breathed a sigh of relief when the Dubs finally broke their resistance on the way to claiming their first Sam since 1995. I was wrong. It was a work in progress, not an assault on the All-Ireland title.
This brings us to Jim McGuinness. For years the jokes surrounded his eternal student persona, albeit a mighty footballer at Sigerson level with a level of success unmatched, captaining two different universities to the highest honours away from the books. Not many know that he was a squad member when Donegal took Sam home to the Hills for their first and only time, 20 years ago this year. He toiled for years in a Donegal side attempting to reclaim the glory of '92, without much success and crippled with injury. In 2005 he sounded a warning to all who doubted his aptitude to management when he guided his club, Naomh Conaill, to their first county title. Even given that success and his stewardship of the county U21 side that reached the All-Ireland final, there was still some element of doubt concerning his ability to manage the perennial bridesmaids, the party animals. Again, that was to the untrained eye and totally unfounded. McEniff, his manager back in 1992, claimed Jim was perfect for the job – he saw in McGuinness a deep thinker and someone who would do it his way. That was clearly evidenced with his reaction to Kevin Cassidy's failure to adhere to the fictional code of silence.
What is obvious to us all now is that last year was a work in progress. They almost won an All-Ireland before the plan had rolled out to its natural conclusion, like the explorer happening on the South Pole whilst looking for his lost snowshoe. McGuinness is now lauded for what, this time, looks like sound analysis. He's a clever manager, acutely aware of what it takes for the players he has under his wing to achieve their maximum potential whilst slowly introducing an element of expression. The 'nice football' Donegal of the noughties may have been everyone's second team but that wasn't enough for McGuinness. Jim steadied the ship defensively like nothing we'd seen before on a GAA field and built on that in 2012, echoing George Graham's mantra in the 80s of building your foundations from the back. In McBrearty, McFadden and Murphy they have some of the most sumptuous point-takers from distance in the game, a skill some feared was trickling out of the game. He asks questions of the opposition. In the provincial semi-final this year against Tyrone again, that was what he asked of his troops at half time. Tyrone were threatening to relieve them of their Ulster title. Look at Tyrone in the eye after 50 minutes and ask them how far they were prepared to go for that goal. Donegal over ran Tyrone at that precise moment in the game. In the final they didn't have to. Down attempted to physically better Donegal early on and forgot about the scoreboard. That's not going to succeed. The energy, strength and direct running of McHugh Jnr and Lacey couldn't be matched.
Cork have everything Donegal possess: strength, savage fitness, long-range point-scorers and a high-tempo running game when the flick needs to be switched. They also have been there and got the T-shirt. For the first time this championship season it's hard to predict the outcome of a Donegal game. I was confident they'd possess too much hunger and a superior level of fitness for Kerry. In fact I thought they'd win by more. Cork have a penchant for goals, something Donegal refuse to entertain. Although similar in style in many regards, it's the irresistible versus the immoveable. What happens if Donegal leak a goal or two early on and are left on the back-foot? It never happens. Well, almost never. In Killarney this year during the NFL, Kerry pummelled Donegal, scoring two goals by the 33rd minute mark. Donegal watched the kitchen burn but had no outlet to extinguish the flames in front of them. But, this isn't a cold night in March.
For me, that's the key to this contest. If Donegal have restricted Cork to less than 0-10 by the hour mark, McGuinness will have their number. Playing on Jim's terms, Counihan won't have the time to clear his charges' heads in time to eek out a solution as Donegal's late running game reaches its crescendo. Like the spider and the fly, they'll have the Rebels exactly where they want them, strangling in the middle of the delicately woven web. How foolish will last year's criticisms will appear. However, a goal or two for the normally early risers from the Rebel County and we'll see if Donegal have the wherewithal to abandon the game-plan until parity is restored. A fascinating contest awaits.
Quote from: cadence on August 15, 2012, 07:08:17 PM
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=T_gwxhb5-t4
nice wee tune!
I rather this version of the video with the babe in the background putting on suncream on her assets! :o
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gAjQrnImT_k&feature=related (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gAjQrnImT_k&feature=related)
@ o'neill... good post/article. a lot of people i spoke with last year about our style back then recognised that we were a work in progress, and graham's arsenal was cited often to draw comparison. as i recall, there was very little in the press about our tactics being a reflection of how far along in our development we were. there was, and still is, although it seems like it's slightly less, a lot of catastrophising going on about the negative impacts the donegal style is having on the game. and to me this is a ridiculous position to take. teams need to be allowed to grow and to figure out how to develop without having to fulfill unrealistic expectations on them to play like championship winners in the infancy of their journey to progress into something better. it's very improtant to recognise that it takes years to mature into something complex and artful. it does not happen over night. and that is a very fundamental flaw in the arguments of critics about donegal, or any other team going through a develop stage for that matter. perhaps this is why the critics are critics and not managers. they don't have, amongst the many skills a good manager must have at his disposal, that creative foresight to imagine what it could be like and the stages needed to achieve this . the people skills mcguinness must have to bring everyone along with him, bar kc of course, must be something else. we also sound like a team who want to be as good as we can be. there is no getting ahead of themselves. no cockiness. just keep the head down and graft, and on with the next challenge. loving it!
Quote from: From the Bunker on August 18, 2012, 11:36:41 AM
Quote from: cadence on August 15, 2012, 07:08:17 PM
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=T_gwxhb5-t4
nice wee tune!
I rather this version of the video with the babe in the background putting on suncream on her assets! :o
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gAjQrnImT_k&feature=related (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gAjQrnImT_k&feature=related)
yar
Quote from: From the Bunker on August 18, 2012, 11:36:41 AM
Quote from: cadence on August 15, 2012, 07:08:17 PM
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=T_gwxhb5-t4
nice wee tune!
I rather this version of the video with the babe in the background putting on suncream on her assets! :o
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gAjQrnImT_k&feature=related (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gAjQrnImT_k&feature=related)
Your profile says female are you into the same sex?
Mícheál Ó Muircheartaigh enjoying himself in Donegal Town right now with the winning Donegal Team from 1992. The Sam Maguire Cup is there too however Mícheál goes for Cork to win outright.
Going to toronto this week for a wedding,
would love to see the game on TV anyone know where one would get to see it. [ thank you]
Don't know about Toronto, but if you have your laptop, there's often a link up here on gameday:
http://www.wiziwig.tv/competition.php?part=sports&discipline=other
If you've internet, ustream will be broadcasting it here: http://www.ustream.tv/gaappv (http://www.ustream.tv/gaappv)
Not much talk about this game on here, for me it's a really fascinating game.
Hard to know which way it will go. Seems to be that most people think the best, or even only, way to play Donegal (when they're set up defensively) is to move the ball cleverly around their 45, shift their defence around, use the full width of Croke and then be economical in taking whatever space and scoring opportunities you can create.
Will be interesting to see if Cork can bulldoze holes through the Donegal screen and essentially wear them down, because I can't see Cork's inside forwards getting the space to show their talents, and their players out the field aren't nearly as creative as their Kerry counterparts who couldn't weave their way through the Donegal blanket.
The contrast in styles will also be interesting. Before the Kerry game alot of lazy pundits talked about the clash of styles but in my opinion Donegal and Kerry were set up very similarly. Cork, although I haven't seen alot of them this year, play a traditional line out as far as I'm aware so will be intriguing to see how this fares against the Donegal system.
Quote from: ONeill on August 18, 2012, 12:14:44 AM
IT'S FOOTBALL JIM, BUT NOT AS WE KNOW IT
D Maguire
'Michael, I don't know what to say. I don't know whether to laugh, or cry. I can understand the effectiveness of this defensive system. I can understand that they're not in the business of entertainment and I can understand that it's all about results and Donegal people won't give a tuppenny if they win an All-Ireland playing this sort of football. But heaven help us Michael if this is the way the game of Gaelic football is going to go because I've seen the apocalypse there in the last 38 minutes. Remember that tribe in Iraq, the Shi'ite tribe? Well, we've watched Shi'ite football for the last......"
(Pat Spillane, RTE, half time of the 2011 All-Ireland semi-final – Dublin v Donegal)
Probably the most common response reading that now is to downplay the level of seriousness you should hold Spillane's words in. Yet that common default reaction can be a lazy stance to take. How could you not have agreed with him? With 23 minutes on the clock in last year's All-Ireland Semi-Final, the scoreboard screamed at us: 'Dublin 0-1 Donegal 0-1.' At the same stage in the other semi-final there had been eight scores on the board in what was an uncharacteristically tight Mayo-Kerry first half. We know it takes two to tango and that Dublin also had defensively modified their 'startled earwigs' approach of previous campaigns but there was no getting away from the fact that this Donegal side elevated shut-out tactics to a new level, akin to the Italian Catenaccio system – the 'door-bolt'. It wasn't pretty. There's no shying away from that. I had witnessed it at first hand in Clones when Donegal defeated Tyrone in the Ulster semi a couple of months earlier. A Tyrone defender picked up the ball on his own end-line. Instead of pressurising Martin Swift, the Donegal attacker retreated, running backwards to his pre-ordaining training position, adhering rigidly to Jim McGuiness' script. Initially, it looked like a dishonourable retreat.
I agreed with Spillane that day although I'd never seen the Shi'ite's with a size 5. It did look like the sky was falling. Unlike McGuinness, I couldn't see what was needed to take Donegal closer to the ultimate endgame. I didn't possess that vision. I didn't want to recognise the beauty of controlled, defensive football. We still harked back to the 'gay abandon' of those great Kerry/Dublin battles of the 70s whether it really did happen or not. I didn't want to see our All-Ireland final besmirched with such extreme tactics and breathed a sigh of relief when the Dubs finally broke their resistance on the way to claiming their first Sam since 1995. I was wrong. It was a work in progress, not an assault on the All-Ireland title.
This brings us to Jim McGuinness. For years the jokes surrounded his eternal student persona, albeit a mighty footballer at Sigerson level with a level of success unmatched, captaining two different universities to the highest honours away from the books. Not many know that he was a squad member when Donegal took Sam home to the Hills for their first and only time, 20 years ago this year. He toiled for years in a Donegal side attempting to reclaim the glory of '92, without much success and crippled with injury. In 2005 he sounded a warning to all who doubted his aptitude to management when he guided his club, Naomh Conaill, to their first county title. Even given that success and his stewardship of the county U21 side that reached the All-Ireland final, there was still some element of doubt concerning his ability to manage the perennial bridesmaids, the party animals. Again, that was to the untrained eye and totally unfounded. McEniff, his manager back in 1992, claimed Jim was perfect for the job – he saw in McGuinness a deep thinker and someone who would do it his way. That was clearly evidenced with his reaction to Kevin Cassidy's failure to adhere to the fictional code of silence.
What is obvious to us all now is that last year was a work in progress. They almost won an All-Ireland before the plan had rolled out to its natural conclusion, like the explorer happening on the South Pole whilst looking for his lost snowshoe. McGuinness is now lauded for what, this time, looks like sound analysis. He's a clever manager, acutely aware of what it takes for the players he has under his wing to achieve their maximum potential whilst slowly introducing an element of expression. The 'nice football' Donegal of the noughties may have been everyone's second team but that wasn't enough for McGuinness. Jim steadied the ship defensively like nothing we'd seen before on a GAA field and built on that in 2012, echoing George Graham's mantra in the 80s of building your foundations from the back. In McBrearty, McFadden and Murphy they have some of the most sumptuous point-takers from distance in the game, a skill some feared was trickling out of the game. He asks questions of the opposition. In the provincial semi-final this year against Tyrone again, that was what he asked of his troops at half time. Tyrone were threatening to relieve them of their Ulster title. Look at Tyrone in the eye after 50 minutes and ask them how far they were prepared to go for that goal. Donegal over ran Tyrone at that precise moment in the game. In the final they didn't have to. Down attempted to physically better Donegal early on and forgot about the scoreboard. That's not going to succeed. The energy, strength and direct running of McHugh Jnr and Lacey couldn't be matched.
Cork have everything Donegal possess: strength, savage fitness, long-range point-scorers and a high-tempo running game when the flick needs to be switched. They also have been there and got the T-shirt. For the first time this championship season it's hard to predict the outcome of a Donegal game. I was confident they'd possess too much hunger and a superior level of fitness for Kerry. In fact I thought they'd win by more. Cork have a penchant for goals, something Donegal refuse to entertain. Although similar in style in many regards, it's the irresistible versus the immoveable. What happens if Donegal leak a goal or two early on and are left on the back-foot? It never happens. Well, almost never. In Killarney this year during the NFL, Kerry pummelled Donegal, scoring two goals by the 33rd minute mark. Donegal watched the kitchen burn but had no outlet to extinguish the flames in front of them. But, this isn't a cold night in March.
For me, that's the key to this contest. If Donegal have restricted Cork to less than 0-10 by the hour mark, McGuinness will have their number. Playing on Jim's terms, Counihan won't have the time to clear his charges' heads in time to eek out a solution as Donegal's late running game reaches its crescendo. Like the spider and the fly, they'll have the Rebels exactly where they want them, strangling in the middle of the delicately woven web. How foolish will last year's criticisms will appear. However, a goal or two for the normally early risers from the Rebel County and we'll see if Donegal have the wherewithal to abandon the game-plan until parity is restored. A fascinating contest awaits.
Excellent Post O'Neill. Your explanation with regards the outcome of the game is exactly as I see it too....
My tuppence on this is simple.
Donegal are a fine team and as we know, are supremely organised and fit. But with Eoin Cadogan (the best man-marker in Ireland) taking care of Colm McFadden, they're going to need the rest of their team to chip in 14+ points to complete with Cork, who will easily hit that total if they move the ball at pace. Even the best of blankets can't move around quick enough to keep up with a ball moving at pace.
I'd take Cork to win by a few, and maybe as much as 6-7. This isn't meant as disrespect to Donegal; this is a pretty special Cork team, and if they play their own game, I don't think anyone can match them.
Also think Cork might edge them but wouldn't rule out another Donegal shut-out. It'll be interesting how Donegal cope if Cork get a start on them, though at 1-6 down to Tyrone last year they didn't panic.
Quote from: wildrover on August 21, 2012, 01:15:32 PM
Quote from: ONeill on August 18, 2012, 12:14:44 AM
IT'S FOOTBALL JIM, BUT NOT AS WE KNOW IT
D Maguire
'Michael, I don't know what to say. I don't know whether to laugh, or cry. I can understand the effectiveness of this defensive system. I can understand that they're not in the business of entertainment and I can understand that it's all about results and Donegal people won't give a tuppenny if they win an All-Ireland playing this sort of football. But heaven help us Michael if this is the way the game of Gaelic football is going to go because I've seen the apocalypse there in the last 38 minutes. Remember that tribe in Iraq, the Shi'ite tribe? Well, we've watched Shi'ite football for the last......"
(Pat Spillane, RTE, half time of the 2011 All-Ireland semi-final – Dublin v Donegal)
Probably the most common response reading that now is to downplay the level of seriousness you should hold Spillane's words in. Yet that common default reaction can be a lazy stance to take. How could you not have agreed with him? With 23 minutes on the clock in last year's All-Ireland Semi-Final, the scoreboard screamed at us: 'Dublin 0-1 Donegal 0-1.' At the same stage in the other semi-final there had been eight scores on the board in what was an uncharacteristically tight Mayo-Kerry first half. We know it takes two to tango and that Dublin also had defensively modified their 'startled earwigs' approach of previous campaigns but there was no getting away from the fact that this Donegal side elevated shut-out tactics to a new level, akin to the Italian Catenaccio system – the 'door-bolt'. It wasn't pretty. There's no shying away from that. I had witnessed it at first hand in Clones when Donegal defeated Tyrone in the Ulster semi a couple of months earlier. A Tyrone defender picked up the ball on his own end-line. Instead of pressurising Martin Swift, the Donegal attacker retreated, running backwards to his pre-ordaining training position, adhering rigidly to Jim McGuiness' script. Initially, it looked like a dishonourable retreat.
I agreed with Spillane that day although I'd never seen the Shi'ite's with a size 5. It did look like the sky was falling. Unlike McGuinness, I couldn't see what was needed to take Donegal closer to the ultimate endgame. I didn't possess that vision. I didn't want to recognise the beauty of controlled, defensive football. We still harked back to the 'gay abandon' of those great Kerry/Dublin battles of the 70s whether it really did happen or not. I didn't want to see our All-Ireland final besmirched with such extreme tactics and breathed a sigh of relief when the Dubs finally broke their resistance on the way to claiming their first Sam since 1995. I was wrong. It was a work in progress, not an assault on the All-Ireland title.
This brings us to Jim McGuinness. For years the jokes surrounded his eternal student persona, albeit a mighty footballer at Sigerson level with a level of success unmatched, captaining two different universities to the highest honours away from the books. Not many know that he was a squad member when Donegal took Sam home to the Hills for their first and only time, 20 years ago this year. He toiled for years in a Donegal side attempting to reclaim the glory of '92, without much success and crippled with injury. In 2005 he sounded a warning to all who doubted his aptitude to management when he guided his club, Naomh Conaill, to their first county title. Even given that success and his stewardship of the county U21 side that reached the All-Ireland final, there was still some element of doubt concerning his ability to manage the perennial bridesmaids, the party animals. Again, that was to the untrained eye and totally unfounded. McEniff, his manager back in 1992, claimed Jim was perfect for the job – he saw in McGuinness a deep thinker and someone who would do it his way. That was clearly evidenced with his reaction to Kevin Cassidy's failure to adhere to the fictional code of silence.
What is obvious to us all now is that last year was a work in progress. They almost won an All-Ireland before the plan had rolled out to its natural conclusion, like the explorer happening on the South Pole whilst looking for his lost snowshoe. McGuinness is now lauded for what, this time, looks like sound analysis. He's a clever manager, acutely aware of what it takes for the players he has under his wing to achieve their maximum potential whilst slowly introducing an element of expression. The 'nice football' Donegal of the noughties may have been everyone's second team but that wasn't enough for McGuinness. Jim steadied the ship defensively like nothing we'd seen before on a GAA field and built on that in 2012, echoing George Graham's mantra in the 80s of building your foundations from the back. In McBrearty, McFadden and Murphy they have some of the most sumptuous point-takers from distance in the game, a skill some feared was trickling out of the game. He asks questions of the opposition. In the provincial semi-final this year against Tyrone again, that was what he asked of his troops at half time. Tyrone were threatening to relieve them of their Ulster title. Look at Tyrone in the eye after 50 minutes and ask them how far they were prepared to go for that goal. Donegal over ran Tyrone at that precise moment in the game. In the final they didn't have to. Down attempted to physically better Donegal early on and forgot about the scoreboard. That's not going to succeed. The energy, strength and direct running of McHugh Jnr and Lacey couldn't be matched.
Cork have everything Donegal possess: strength, savage fitness, long-range point-scorers and a high-tempo running game when the flick needs to be switched. They also have been there and got the T-shirt. For the first time this championship season it's hard to predict the outcome of a Donegal game. I was confident they'd possess too much hunger and a superior level of fitness for Kerry. In fact I thought they'd win by more. Cork have a penchant for goals, something Donegal refuse to entertain. Although similar in style in many regards, it's the irresistible versus the immoveable. What happens if Donegal leak a goal or two early on and are left on the back-foot? It never happens. Well, almost never. In Killarney this year during the NFL, Kerry pummelled Donegal, scoring two goals by the 33rd minute mark. Donegal watched the kitchen burn but had no outlet to extinguish the flames in front of them. But, this isn't a cold night in March.
For me, that's the key to this contest. If Donegal have restricted Cork to less than 0-10 by the hour mark, McGuinness will have their number. Playing on Jim's terms, Counihan won't have the time to clear his charges' heads in time to eek out a solution as Donegal's late running game reaches its crescendo. Like the spider and the fly, they'll have the Rebels exactly where they want them, strangling in the middle of the delicately woven web. How foolish will last year's criticisms will appear. However, a goal or two for the normally early risers from the Rebel County and we'll see if Donegal have the wherewithal to abandon the game-plan until parity is restored. A fascinating contest awaits.
Excellent Post O'Neill. Your explanation with regards the outcome of the game is exactly as I see it too....
Its 'eke' ffs, not 'eek' (also for the benefit of collins on pg 1)
Quote from: goal 10 on August 20, 2012, 10:06:49 PM
Going to toronto this week for a wedding,
would love to see the game on TV anyone know where one would get to see it. [ thank you]
Don't have laptop or ustream, anyone know a pub showing the game in the toronto area. [ thank you again ]
Is mcguinness a gaeilgeoir
? Where in donegal is the naomh conaill club
?
It would be great to see a not Donegal vs mayo final
Quote from: seafoid on August 21, 2012, 07:15:06 PM
Is mcguinness a gaeilgeoir?
Níl a fhios agam.
Quote
Where in donegal is the naomh conaill club?
Glenties, south-west Donegal.
Not sure if Glenties is technically still in the Gaeltacht in terms of numbers of speakers or if McGuinness himself is a gaeilgeoir, but I do remember matches down there, with Big Jim playing, and the Glenties boys all encouraging each other the gather "na briseadh!" (sp?)
Quote from: J70 on August 21, 2012, 10:46:38 PM
Not sure if Glenties is technically still in the Gaeltacht in terms of numbers of speakers or if McGuinness himself is a gaeilgeoir, but I do remember matches down there, with Big Jim playing, and the Glenties boys all encouraging each other the gather "na briseadh!" (sp?)
Pretty sure the town of Glenties is in the galltacht but the parish/Naomh Conaill club serves the gaeltachtaí of Edeninfagh, Bellanamore, Fintown etc. It's a huge parish. Think Jim McGuinness is a townie !
Is Jim still involved with Glenties, I thought he had married a woman from around the Dunfanaghy area, St Michaels club? (McFaddens club)
Quote from: CitySlicker11 on August 22, 2012, 01:22:15 AM
Is Jim still involved with Glenties, I thought he had married a woman from around the Dunfanaghy area, St Michaels club? (McFaddens club)
You are correct city slicker jim is actually married to colm mcfaddens sister and dies not live in glenties anymore
yea he lives in Creeslough now same as Mcfadden, St Michael's in Dunfanaghy is in the the same parish as Creeslough
Gelnties i think, the club, is considered in the gaeltacht as parts of the part are in the gaeltacht. but jim himself was raised near the townwhich i dont think id in the gaeltacht. But as yous said he lives in creeslough now with his wife, colm's sister. Think he has plans to move back near glenties though, they built a house so i believe
Quote from: goal 10 on August 21, 2012, 06:59:13 PM
Quote from: goal 10 on August 20, 2012, 10:06:49 PM
Going to toronto this week for a wedding,
would love to see the game on TV anyone know where one would get to see it. [ thank you]
Don't have laptop or ustream, anyone know a pub showing the game in the toronto area. [ thank you again ]
Galway Arms on The Queensway will be showing it
Hi guys, I've put together a tactical preview of this one here for anyone interested http://action81.com/blog/?p=6151
Quote from: emmetryan on August 23, 2012, 01:44:32 PM
Hi guys, I've put together a tactical preview of this one here for anyone interested http://action81.com/blog/?p=6151
Good stuff - I thought a certain type of ref might clamp down on Donegal's tactic of forwards fouling the backs to slow down the play (a la Dublin/Kerry) but Coldrick reffed them this year in the Ulster semi and turned a blind eye to it.
Quote from: emmetryan on August 23, 2012, 01:44:32 PM
Hi guys, I've put together a tactical preview of this one here for anyone interested http://action81.com/blog/?p=6151
cheers emmet... lot of food for thought as usual. gonna be a beast of a game. canny wait.
Cork will name their team later with three positions up for grabs: Carey, whether he is fit to start or not?; and two forward spots, realistically two from Goold, Sheehan, Murphy and Goulding. Would be surprised/disappointed if Kelly doesn't start.
The Cork team that finished the Kildare game was better than the one that started but not sure such a policy would be wise against Donegal.
Quote from: eviemonkey on August 23, 2012, 06:37:47 PM
Cork will name their team later with three positions up for grabs: Carey, whether he is fit to start or not?; and two forward spots, realistically two from Goold, Sheehan, Murphy and Goulding. Would be surprised/disappointed if Kelly doesn't start.
The Cork team that finished the Kildare game was better than the one that started but not sure such a policy would be wise against Donegal.
He's not forward more of midfielder Goold or Goulding should be starting instead of him.
Quote from: Captain Obvious on August 23, 2012, 06:55:57 PM
He's not forward more of midfielder Goold or Goulding should be starting instead of him.
Agreed, he has offered very little in the full-forward line thus far to be honest. It is not that he has been wasteful but he is just not seeing enough of the ball. Ironically this is the one game where his inclusion actually makes some sense but I would still start Goulding. Goulding is too good of a player to hold in reserve in a game where every point will be crucial. Sheehan could be the one used as an impact sub.
Thought Big Nic was absolutely huge for Cork off the bench in 2010. His midfield dominance turned around multiple games that year.
I's go as far as to say Aidan Walsh would never have won the Young Player of the Year if Murphy didn't open up so much space and take attention off him in second halves. Seems a waste starting him at 14. If he has a full game in him there's little reason not to be starting him in the middle and if he doesn't then use him as in 2010.
The Cork Senior Football team to play Donegal in Sunday's All-Ireland Semi-Final at 3.30pm in Croke Park will line out as follows:
1. Alan Quirke
Valley Rovers
2. Ray Carey 3. Michael Shields 4. Eoin Cadogan
Clyda Rovers St. Finbarrs Douglas
5. Paudie Kissane 6. Graham Canty 7. Noel O Leary
Clyda Rovers Bantry Blues Cill na Martra
8. Alan O'Connor 9. Aidan Walsh
St. Colum's Kanturk
10. Fintan Goold 11. Patrick Kelly 12. Paul Kerrigan
Macroom Ballincollig Nemo Rangers
13. Colm O Neill 14. Donncha O'Connor 15. Nicholas Murphy
Ballyclough Ballydesmond Carrigaline
Quote from: harlechman on August 22, 2012, 11:58:14 PM
Quote from: goal 10 on August 21, 2012, 06:59:13 PM
Quote from: goal 10 on August 20, 2012, 10:06:49 PM
Going to toronto this week for a wedding,
would love to see the game on TV anyone know where one would get to see it. [ thank you]
Don't have laptop or ustream, anyone know a pub showing the game in the toronto area. [ thank you again ]
Galway Arms on The Queensway will be showing it
That's the place to watch it alright... Be warned though there's a right few Corkonians about and you'll have to listen to Mick Kinsella talking a load of nonsense throughout the game!
It doesn't make any sense to play Murphy as a conventional corner forward. He's not a scoring threat and the only sensible thing would be either a) third midfielder or b) full forward as a target man. I don't understand why they pick him there. He's a midfielder.
Quote from: ONeill on August 23, 2012, 02:27:02 PM
Quote from: emmetryan on August 23, 2012, 01:44:32 PM
Hi guys, I've put together a tactical preview of this one here for anyone interested http://action81.com/blog/?p=6151
Good stuff - I thought a certain type of ref might clamp down on Donegal's tactic of forwards fouling the backs to slow down the play (a la Dublin/Kerry) but Coldrick reffed them this year in the Ulster semi and turned a blind eye to it.
All depends what rules Coldrick chooses (whether consciously or otherwise) to forget this time out.
I think the logic behind starting Murphy at full-forward would be to vary the attacking build-up, mix the running game with short and longer deliveries. Then introduce Goulding early in the second half as the game opens up, well as open as it will get against Donegal.
The problem up until now for me is Murphy hasn't really been contributing enough in general play and his inclusion is dislodging Donncha O'Connor away from full-forward where he can be at his most effective.
Sheehan, Pearse O'Neill and Goulding is some firepower to bring off the bench but by not starting with your best team you do run the risk of having to claw back a deficit which will be easier said than done on Sunday.
Still wouldn't surprise me if there was one change announced before the throw-in.
Think Cork might just shade it but should be a fascinating contest
Is parking in Clonliffe College a thing of the past?
Quote from: Feckitt on August 24, 2012, 09:42:02 AM
Is parking in Clonliffe College a thing of the past?
Can still park in there entry at the entrance across from quinns bar and it cost €10 will be full of Donegal 1s on Sunday only downside is the wait to get out after the game
Thanks lad, years ago we used to go in from the main entrance on the clonliffe road near the top of Jones' Road. I'd say the queue to get in and out would be savage all right. Especially as it will only be Cork ones leaving early.
Lads remember the tall ships show is on as well so lots of roads around city closed off. Cork folks park at Red Cow Luas and Donegal lads park at M3 parkway and get the train to Drumcondra. Less hassle.
Of course that's only if you don't want to sup few ;)
Price on my tickets:
€40 or £38 :o
That's some exchange rate!
Quote from: Declan on August 24, 2012, 11:40:46 AM
Lads remember the tall ships show is on as well so lots of roads around city closed off. Cork folks park at Red Cow Luas and Donegal lads park at M3 parkway and get the train to Drumcondra. Less hassle.
Of course that's only if you don't want to sup few ;)
North Donegal lads won't be heading via the M3 Declan (not unless they want to add 30 miles to the journey)! ;)
(http://i849.photobucket.com/albums/ab56/declanrice/286.jpg)
Ticket purchased can't wait for this one, one of the hardest games to predict the outcome in years, that is what championship football is all about.
Forecast is for a cold and misty morning on the Anagaire/Áth na gCoire Bridge as the three buses from Naomh Muire move off.
Interview with Aaron Kernan here where he has some interesting things to say about the game amongst other things:
http://www.livegaelic.com/features/livegaelic-exclusive-interview-with-aaron-kernan/
(https://p.twimg.com/A1ElCGFCAAAKxMO.jpg)
Going to toronto this week for a wedding,
would love to see the game on TV anyone know where one would get to see it. [ thank yo
Don't have laptop or ustream, anyone know a pub showing the game in the toronto area. [ thank you again ]
[/quote] [/quote]
Galway Arms on The Queensway will be showing it
[/quote]
That's the place to watch it alright... Be warned though there's a right few Corkonians about and you'll have to listen to Mick Kinsella talking a load of nonsense throughout the game!
[/quote] Thank screanexile, The Galway Arms it is. will there be any donegal people there ? I don't want to be stuck with that cork shower. ;D
Quote from: drici on August 24, 2012, 06:38:08 PM
(https://p.twimg.com/A1ElCGFCAAAKxMO.jpg)
have received a nice mcguinness tee in the style of guinness. fucken legend.
Quote from: hardstation on August 25, 2012, 09:32:07 AM
Quote from: drici on August 24, 2012, 06:38:08 PM
(https://p.twimg.com/A1ElCGFCAAAKxMO.jpg)
Cracker!
would be a nice tee that.
+ this board needs it's own tee. i'd buy one. you can never have enough tees.
Just heard Martin mchugh say on highland radio that croke park expect 60000 tomorrow and the big majority are coming from Donegal up to 40000 expected from the county great numbers travelling
Quote from: donegal lad on August 25, 2012, 09:13:18 PM
Just heard Martin mchugh say on highland radio that croke park expect 60000 tomorrow and the big majority are coming from Donegal up to 40000 expected from the county great numbers travelling
Plenty of Donegal cars heading down the motorway this evening, but I can't see Cork bringing a big crowd.
Quote from: donegal lad on August 25, 2012, 09:13:18 PM
Just heard Martin mchugh say on highland radio that croke park expect 60000 tomorrow and the big majority are coming from Donegal up to 40000 expected from the county great numbers travelling
Has Donegal team been named. ?
Quote from: All of a Sludden on August 25, 2012, 09:21:38 PM
Quote from: donegal lad on August 25, 2012, 09:13:18 PM
Just heard Martin mchugh say on highland radio that croke park expect 60000 tomorrow and the big majority are coming from Donegal up to 40000 expected from the county great numbers travelling
Plenty of Donegal cars heading down the motorway this evening, but I can't see Cork bringing a big crowd.
Cork expected to bring around 10000 and they say the demand from neutrals is huge would say this can be put down to the high number of Donegal people living in other parts of Ireland as well.
Quote from: joemamas on August 25, 2012, 09:28:25 PM
Quote from: donegal lad on August 25, 2012, 09:13:18 PM
Just heard Martin mchugh say on highland radio that croke park expect 60000 tomorrow and the big majority are coming from Donegal up to 40000 expected from the county great numbers travelling
Has Donegal team been named. ?
No word on Donegal team yet
A lot of the Cork crowd would be waiting for the final. I'm not being cocky, but it's just the way we are.
I can't call this tomorrow. If anyone can get around, or through the Donegal defense, it's Cork. Our pace and power are on a level Donegal won't have experienced in championship since implementing the blanket defense. Aidan Walsh and Alan O'Connor will be absoloutley crucial, espeacially Walsh. We'll need his athleticism to break tackles and create space for other players. It won't be game for the likes of Paddy Kelly. I feel he needs space to operate and that will be in short supply. It looks like Noel O'Leary will be the one charged with following McHugh. No better man imo. If he can negate McHugh, Cork might win more of the breaks.
No surprises here but I'm tipping Cork, like always. Cork by 4.
I'm going for Cork by four.
Quote from: drici on August 24, 2012, 01:46:45 PM
(http://i849.photobucket.com/albums/ab56/declanrice/286.jpg)
Fair fucks to them, serious value. They must be healthy enough financially wise!!
Excellent idea and great gesture from the club concerned for their members in the times that are in it. Also well in with the ethos of the GAA.
Well done all concerned, best wishes for a safe and victorious trip!
Donegal Abu!
i think if donegal score a goal then they will win, because if they get a goal and are winning then id imagine they will shut up shop and make cork score from distance and when your playing donegal even when they are leading by 2 or 3 points its very hard for the other team to get back into it so cork will need to make sure donegal dont score a goal or get a good lead early on.
Quote from: CorkMan on August 25, 2012, 10:31:18 PM
A lot of the Cork crowd would be waiting for the final. I'm not being cocky, but it's just the way we are.
Would that be the case if you played Kerry in the semi final instead of Donegal?
just thinking, that armagh and donegal played in the 2003 semi final and remember it being a full house, 80000 anyway. Outside of dublin games, i cant remember any semi final even getting anywhere near that, they struggle for 60,000.
Armagh and donegal also played to a sell out croker in 2004 ulster final, though hill 16 was closed for building work, wat a day that was! these were bigger crowds than any armagh tyrone games of same era
donegal by 3 tomorrow, some feed of pints after it
Quote from: Orchardman on August 26, 2012, 01:24:12 AM
just thinking, that armagh and donegal played in the 2003 semi final and remember it being a full house, 80000 anyway. Outside of dublin games, i cant remember any semi final even getting anywhere near that, they struggle for 60,000.
Armagh and donegal also played to a sell out croker in 2004 ulster final, though hill 16 was closed for building work, wat a day that was! these were bigger crowds than any armagh tyrone games of same era
donegal by 3 tomorrow, some feed of pints after it
Mayo v Fermanagh 2004 had a huge crowd, I think it was reported 55,000 came up from Mayo alone, those be the days.
Quote from: Captain Obvious on August 26, 2012, 01:11:06 AM
Quote from: CorkMan on August 25, 2012, 10:31:18 PM
A lot of the Cork crowd would be waiting for the final. I'm not being cocky, but it's just the way we are.
Would that be the case if you played Kerry in the semi final instead of Donegal?
Probably not tbh.
Best of luck to Donegal today.
I'm looking forward to this game a lot, it should be a titanic clash.
Ulaidh go brea
Hoping Donegal can win today. Best of luck Tir Connaill
C'MON DONEGAL!!!!!! STUCK IN!!!!!
Can't believe it but I've got a pass out to my 2nd successive Donegal game. I even put on a green & yella top as thought my Everton wan might''t be appreciated and RTE might pick it up. I think Funegal will have something new up their sleave & Counihan will be too slow to work it out. Donegal by 4 with Cork having 2 sent off
Donegal by four.
Any links?
Cork by 3.
cork doing the usual silly stuff of soloing up the field from the half back line, if they bother to get the ball in to Kerrigan early, he destroy Donegal. Murphy playing in the right position for a change
Sheehan got no right foot??
Two evenly matched teams.
Donegal probably a better team but Cork by far has the better players, Cork half back line holding on to it too long, gallagher playing a stormer in the middle of the field, some great points scored
Great game so far. Cork looking slightly the better team to me. Better spread of quality players.
I think the name of the game is football not handball by the stats. Cork have a lot of possession but are clocking up the wides from difficult angles. Cork need a few changes i doubt, O`Neill needed at midfield, and achange is needed at no.6 Canty isnt the great player he was any more. Lacey on the other hand might be the best player on the field
Wonderful spectacle so far, probable game of the year contender. That said, Tipp-Kilkenny last week looked the same at half-time!
Here in Croke Park we have Mickey Joe Harte squawking at us. I want Langers to win now!
Donegal showing more willingness than this time last year to push forward, and Cork are often allowing them run quite a ways before closing in on them, A Donegal goal would seal it for them.
A long half time break?
Such a brilliant game. They can't keep this up for another 35, can they?
Why is Canty so highly rated?
was a great footballer in his time, but his legs have been long gone past 3 or 4 yrs
Cork haven't started second half at all and.it could be too late now
They r fecked in midfield, O'connor can hardly run.
cork brought O`Neill on but not at midfield, go figure? Donegal all over Cork there, oops there goes the crossbar, tough
Some game this is.
Does anyone have a clue as to what Eoin Cadogan was giving out about there?
Noel O`Leary?? Cork have a poor half back line when they are put on the back foot and actually have to defend
Cork look gone!
Cork look very like the Tipp hurlers. So long the bridesmaids and they could only win one all Ireland.
Donegal's fitness levels are phenomenal....
many a good team won only 1 all ireland, quite a few poor teams managed to squeeze 1 too
Quote from: bucko on August 26, 2012, 04:48:37 PM
Donegal's fitness levels are phenomenal....
Yeah, Cork just can't match them. Great to watch.
Quote from: Wildweasel74 on August 26, 2012, 04:49:49 PM
many a good team won only 1 all ireland, quite a few poor teams managed to squeeze 1 too
Cork should have won more.
Anyway if Mayo can beat the Dubs they must be in with a chance.
Right from the start cork were too ponderous instead of playing it in fast to a good full forward line, then they take off donncha - not counihan's greatest hour.
Some fitness levels displayed by DnG alright. Maybe only Dublin last year would be close to them in that respect.
Have to hand it to McGuinness, all those years in college paid off after all :)
Seem to get the jitters a wee bit when closing the game out though....
not bringing in O`Neill at midfield would be a bigger query fron the Cork point of view
Donegal's second ever AIF. They have a 100% record so far . Even better than Down now.
Cork looked like they ran out of ideas and energy. Fair play to Donegal, well deserved win.
Game of the year. Superb display by Donegal especially in that 2nd half huge turnaround from the 2009 game between the two, shows what a great manager can do for a team.
Cork must be sick of the sight of green and gold in Croke park.
Well done Donegal. Winners of a great game. Good luck in the final. :)
Quote from: seafoid on August 26, 2012, 04:57:46 PM
Quote from: Wildweasel74 on August 26, 2012, 04:49:49 PM
many a good team won only 1 all ireland, quite a few poor teams managed to squeeze 1 too
Cork should have won more.
Anyway if Mayo can beat the Dubs they must be in with a chance.
Cork were lucky to win the one they won. Other years they were beaten by better sides. Second year in a row Cork were beaten by a team that stood up to them and to be honest Cork are overrated.
Well done to Donegal they should be good enough to repeat 1992.
I'd say that was pretty impressive. Scoreline doesn't reflect how dominant we were.
Fair play to Donegal, I never saw it coming despite all the talk and build up. I was sure Cork would bring far more to the table but even so, who can stop Donegal now?
Thoroughly enjoyed the game, well done Donegal. Who can stop them now?
Donegal were superb. A great performance. Their intensity and fitness seem to be on a different level to almost everyone else. It's very hard to see Dublin or Mayo beating them to be honest.
Dublin might.
Mayo won't.
Sheer relentless intensity, allied with some sublime skill (despite some very eligible sides). Shoo-ins now, Brolly was right. ;)
Who got the first yellow card?
Never mind: Aidan Walsh
Had thought Cork would win it based on the fact that on paper they had more quality on the pitch. I didn't think they would get as badly beaten in midfield as they did, Neil Gallagher absolutely dominated around the middle, Alan O'Connor could've gone long before he did. Why Counihan didn't put O'Neill or Murphy in was baffling, even just to break the ball as Gallagher and Kavanagh were winning some amount of primary possession. The defensive frailty of the Cork backline when they are constantly put on the back foot was shown today, previously their midfielders ability to control around the middle normally gave their backs a level of protection that today was missing. Donegal will be bloody hard to beat in the final!
Did think Cork would win but not really surprised Donegal won handy at the finish. I think a team would need to be 5Pt's up on them at half time as the shift they seem to put in the 2nd half of games is impressive. Cork aren't really over rated, but Cantry is gone (Shields to no.6) kissane and O`Leary cant actually defend, Have some talented forwards but need 3 or 4 real leaders, they have none outside of canty and that's the reason he is still played. I think if one of the top managers was over them i think they would be hard to beat. When players are struggling you take them off not wait to the game has gone away from you. Ryan Bradley is one of donegals better footballers and he was took of very early, even though he done little wrong, but Walsh went on to have a great game. McGuiness has shown that's he the brightest young manager in the game. Donegal play a way better game that's last year, but he also knows his teams limitations and plays in away to bring the best out of his team. Cork teams have never really played tactics even when playing Kerry and try to depend on their players ability. the reality with football these days, is tactics, fitness, managerial ability, will wear/close down more talented opposition hence levelling the playing field. That's not to say Donegal don't have great players, they do, Lacey,McGee, Murphy, McFadden are class. But other county teams would have more players of this quality IE:Kerry and therefore tactics win games now not class. Hope Donegal win though, i was there 20yrs ago in croke park when they brought it home first time round.
Fair play to Donegal, well deserved winners! A great performance from them throughout the game,the fitness & intensity from the Donegal players seemed to be on a totally different level compared to Cork!As a Mayo supporter,if we beat dublin next week which I hope we do, it will very hard to see us beating such a quality Donegal side!
fairly happy with my 3 point win prediction, really that should have been a 10 point hammering. Very surprised at the amount of pundits tipping cork. Donegal weren't bein written off, they have gone past that stage now, but an awful lot of people couldnt see past cork winning, why? To me it was more a case of finding it hard to see donegal getting beaten, and cork dropped the heads early on today.
Dublin or mayo will give them a hell of a game though
what a player gallagher is. although we had some great performances out there, if he didn't get motm for that whoever did would be embarassed to pick it up instead.
thought we rope-a-doped cork. played the long ball first half in attack, not committing too many players into energy sapping counterattacking runs and let cork run and run into us when they attacked. second half we unleashed the hounds and ran the legs off them. they were gone ten minutes to go and we should have won by a bigger score.
all the top teams use tactics. we never used to and that's why we weren't a top team despite having cracking players and won nothing. now we have the tactics and a good squad of players who all bring something valuable.
Quote from: Orchardman on August 26, 2012, 06:04:14 PM
fairly happy with my 3 point win prediction, really that should have been a 10 point hammering. Very surprised at the amount of pundits tipping cork. Donegal weren't bein written off, they have gone past that stage now, but an awful lot of people couldnt see past cork winning, why? To me it was more a case of finding it hard to see donegal getting beaten, and cork dropped the heads early on today.
Dublin or mayo will give them a hell of a game though
^ agree with this this. and that's not a dig at cork, who are still a fine side despite all their new found critics that hindsight seems to have created.
even when things were tight in the first half we were controlled and able to get our scores by committing a few more players when we needed to. it set us up for that second half performance when we were able to shut down their attack pretty much and got our own running game going.
the shot of counihan double face palming said it all really. the game was up. there wasn'y much he could do. fire more ball into the full forward line and it would more than likely be hoovered up by our lads, throw more players further forward in support of his full forward line and if we turn it over his defence is on the back foot chasing our counterattacks. and so he has to persist with his running game in the main. it was meat and drink to our boys.
Who was man of the match?
What a great game it is when played in the right spirit. No difficulty refereeing that and I don't remember one cheat, dive or injury-feigning in the whole game.
Might have been interesting had O'Neill's shot been a couple of inches lower and not rattled off the crossbar that time. Donegal's fitness levels are very impressive though. They were running just as hard in the 70th minute as they were in the 1st.
yeah i'd like to know who won motm too.... + i thought it was good display by the ref. both sides fouled, but there didn't seem to be that much of it going on and i didn't once think who is this boy reffing this game jesus wept etc.
Well done Donegal. Cringed a bit to hear the oléing at the end from the fans. Historically does not augur well for the AIF when this happens in the semis.
Fear a bit for Counihan as regardless of what he has won imvho he never really won over the Cork fans ( a fickle bunch).
Hats of to donegal, very well played............................................. pundits and neutrals silly to be so dismissive of a potential challege from mayo or dublin in the final
Spillane applauding donegal was sickening, hes a fickle man that lad
Quote from: Don Johnson on August 26, 2012, 05:36:04 PM
Who got the first yellow card?
Never mind: Aidan Walsh
It was McFadden
Terrific game of football. Congratulations to Donegal, a richly deserved win and I fancy them to win the final regardless of who their opponents are.
Absolutely delighted for Donegal. Great county and great people. I'll be rooting for them in the final regardless of who they play.
Mark McHugh must be the fittest footballer in the country.
Some engine.
Quote from: Jinxy on August 26, 2012, 07:50:55 PM
Mark McHugh must be the fittest footballer in the country.
Some engine.
You could pretty say that about the whole Donegal team, the pace they have on the counter is something else.
Quote from: Jinxy on August 26, 2012, 07:50:55 PM
Mark McHugh must be the fittest footballer in the country.
Some engine.
McCauley would give him a run ;)
Congrats Donegal
By the way, if anyone is coming this way (Yorkshire - Leeds, Sheffield, Hull, Bradford, etc) for work or studies in the coming months and are interested to get involved with a competitive and friendly football club with close ties also to other local Hurling and Ladies Football teams then please get in touch.
Gaelic Life article - http://freepdfhosting.com/d48e49e299.pdf
St Benedict's Harps website - http://stbenedictsharps.intheteam.com
How does drug testing work for county players, are they all tested for enhancers after the game?
Quote from: borderfox on August 26, 2012, 07:21:43 PM
Absolutely delighted for Donegal. Great county and great people. I'll be rooting for them in the final regardless of who they play.
the borderfox has been sniping away for donegal here for a while! fair play to you!
hilarious to hear that spillane has been complimentary. don't know what he's said, and could care less either.
make your transition!!!!!
who won motm?
Quote from: seanog on August 26, 2012, 08:03:38 PM
How does drug testing work for county players, are they all tested for enhancers after the game?
Players from each side are randomly selected for testing after the game.
1 thing i never understood, why is there drug testing in Gaelic football anyway? its an amateur sport, any recreational drug would show up, inhalers too apparently wouldn't pass, take the wrong cough medicine etc too would lead to a positive test. i understand it in the world of professional sports but the GAA has always stated we are the premier amateur sports organisation. If a player ever did test positive for some substance, does he get outed, is he banned? i remember the episode with Frankie Sheenan getting banned for taking an inhaler.He had asthma all his life, was he gaining an unfair advantage or just trying to play the sport he loved! Hell i played Gaelic football 20yrs puffing on inhalers just to give me breathe. I been on inhalers since i was 4, would i have to stop using them to play intercounty football. I still believe unlike most sports that there still is a high degree of honesty in Gaelic sports unlike the plague in track and field and cycling!
I've put together a tactical take on today's game for anyone interested http://action81.com/blog/?p=6154
Quote from: emmetryan on August 26, 2012, 09:22:11 PM
I've put together a tactical take on today's game for anyone interested http://action81.com/blog/?p=6154
always look forward to your stuff emmet and it's a great read yet again. thanks.
your blog is becoming a ritual btw.
There was a point in the first half - I think it was on 30 minutes - when you knew Cork's goose was cooked. Up until then I thought they'd met the Donegal blanket head on and were making gains with every other attack to keep the scoreboard ticking over. Like rugby league, they'd have a runner who'd break the outer rainbow and gain enough ground to generate a scoring opportunity. It was impressive strength and fitness on both sides and Cork showed no signs of early wilting.
Then, at that time around the 30, for the first time they simply hadn't the energy to sustain that effort and started to fanny about passing backwards hoping someone would put together some manner of lung-bursting run, but it wasn't there. The ball was turned over and that was that. You could almost see the collective nod/smirk from the O'Donnell men as if to say that's them broken. At half time Cork knew it was over. Well, I did.
After that Cork simply ran into trouble or just hit the ball straight up into the Dublin sky. We've seen that exasperation so many times now. Against Tyrone and Kerry it occurred around the 40-45 min mark. I was surprised how quickly Cork gave up the ghost but I suppose Donegal are primed to further improve on their system at this time of the year. Cork were shell-shocked - it was liked getting a slap across the lug every five seconds. Donegal never lulled at all. The more Cork tired, the harder Donegal hit and tackled to the point that Cork actually looked a smaller, weaker side.
It was magnificent to watch and quite frightening in terms of what a team will have to do to match that. Donegal has raised the physical bar to breaking point surely.
Mayo play a running game not unlike the one that troubled Donegal in the first half today and probably have the second tightest defence in the country right now. Those two teams are very well suited for a serious war of attrition in a final.
Likewise it'd be interesting to see how Dublin would respond to the new revision of Donegal football after last year's war games.
Donegal are favourites but I'm not willing to write anyone off, especially before next Sunday.
Great day in Croker today. Great win and performance by Donegal. Bring Sam back to the hills. Best of luck in the final.
Now, everybody... Jimmy's winning matches...
I think the difference between the 'pack of ravenous hounds' of Tyrone 03 v Kerry and this was that Donegal had 13 Doohers today. Then add on the physicality. Dara O'Se managed to relatively stay on his feet having been shoulder by 7 Tyrone players collectively. Gallagher would've sent him into the stands if he'd wanted to. Also, in the tackle they're all individually adept.
Phillip Jordan said today they're the fittest side he's ever seen on a field.
Some game and some team. Brick Molloy, Christy toye and Kevin Rafferty not even used.
Delighted for Donegal and Jim McGuinness, hope they take Sam now. On the other hand seriously worried about the way Gaelic football is headed if preparation and systems become more important than individual flair.
Ah Donegal don't lack flair, sure just look at Frank McGlynn's season
Quote from: emmetryan on August 26, 2012, 09:22:11 PM
I've put together a tactical take on today's game for anyone interested http://action81.com/blog/?p=6154
A very good analysis summed up in your report of today's game Emmett!!Your blog is a must read for all GAA fans!I'll make sure to tweet this report!
Quote from: yellowcard on August 26, 2012, 10:59:53 PM
Delighted for Donegal and Jim McGuinness, hope they take Sam now. On the other hand seriously worried about the way Gaelic football is headed if preparation and systems become more important than individual flair.
Individual flair was as much to do with a hopeless defender as a good forward. Gaelic football game today was better than 99 % of all tv games played in the 70s golden era. Twice as fast, precise and more scores from play, loved it
Quote from: Take Your Points on August 26, 2012, 10:30:42 PM
Conor Counihan was a very disappointed man when interviewed at the end. He has spent all his energy on that Cork team building their mental strength to overcome their reputation for being flaky and today they failed the test in the second half as panic gripped their every move. The realisation that they couldn't match Donegal in terms of energy further sapped their energy and concentration.
Yeah, he must have seriously fancied Cork to go all the way this year. Kerry out of the way. Players back from injury. This looked like the year with red and white ribbons on Sam. I'd say he'll pack it in. Hard to come back.
As for Donegal, I seriously thought ye would be out of the Championship today. How wrong was I? Ye are a serious outfit!
Quote from: MaigheoAbu on August 26, 2012, 11:08:43 PM
Quote from: emmetryan on August 26, 2012, 09:22:11 PM
I've put together a tactical take on today's game for anyone interested http://action81.com/blog/?p=6154
A very good analysis summed up in your report of today's game Emmett!!Your blog is a must read for all GAA fans!I'll make sure to tweet this report!
Quote from: yellowcard on August 26, 2012, 10:59:53 PM
Delighted for Donegal and Jim McGuinness, hope they take Sam now. On the other hand seriously worried about the way Gaelic football is headed if preparation and systems become more important than individual flair.
despite all the evidence to suggest otherwise too. ah now...
Quote from: cadence on August 26, 2012, 11:24:18 PM
Quote from: yellowcard on August 26, 2012, 10:59:53 PM
Delighted for Donegal and Jim McGuinness, hope they take Sam now. On the other hand seriously worried about the way Gaelic football is headed if preparation and systems become more important than individual flair.
despite all the evidence to suggest otherwise too. ah now...
What evidence?
thanks for making my point. do carry on!
Quote from: cadence on August 26, 2012, 11:30:38 PM
thanks for making my point. do carry on!
I'm confused now.
In terms of individual skill, is there a better defender than Karl Lacey out there? On the ball he's a brilliant exponent of all the skills needed. Did you see McGlynn's point? McFadden's points from distance from play and placed balls? Murphy? All fine, skilful players.
Quote from: yellowcard on August 26, 2012, 11:31:57 PM
Quote from: cadence on August 26, 2012, 11:30:38 PM
thanks for making my point. do carry on!
I'm confused now.
preparation and systems only get you so far. you need the footballing ability too. but you also need to work on both aspects, the one improves the other. with a smart strategy, you've good the framework to improve your players. players can't really blossom without the framework.
structure is all important. any art is a good example. work within a structure and it opens up the opportunity to be creative and effective at the same time. poetry, painting, music, they all use structure and sometimes the knowledge of the rules of what structure should look like to innovate new ways of being and sport is no different. structure actually fosters creativity, not stifle it.
Listen guys in the 70s a greatest ever Kerry golden years ever team mostly teachers and professionals scored 5 goals again a team who had 4 turf cutters 6 farmers, 1 balers assistant, and a bucket man whatever the hell that was. In otherwise Kerry walked over some gobshites over the years. Now the brainiest team wins, thats not a bad thing but there is still a few gobshites
Quote from: cadence on August 26, 2012, 11:43:02 PM
Quote from: yellowcard on August 26, 2012, 11:31:57 PM
Quote from: cadence on August 26, 2012, 11:30:38 PM
thanks for making my point. do carry on!
I'm confused now.
preparation and systems only get you so far. you need the footballing ability too. but you also need to work on both aspects, the one improves the other. with a smart strategy, you've good the framework to improve your players. players can't really blossom without the framework.
structure is all important. any art is a good example. work within a structure and it opens up the opportunity to be creative and effective at the same time. poetry, painting, music, they all use structure and sometimes the knowledge of the rules of what structure should look like to innovate new ways of being and sport is no different. structure actually fosters creativity, not stifle it.
Wouldn't disagree with any of that. If Donegal win the AI as I think they will now, it's without doubt the single biggest managerial achievement that I ever remember. I'm not saying Donegal don't have some very good players but I do think that they are far from being the most talented individuals in the country. I hope that's not seen as a criticism but it's just the way I see it.
Donegal's style of play now isn't much different to what Dublin used to win the All Ireland last year, other teams will have to try and copy it as it's the way GAA is going.
Quote from: Captain Obvious on August 26, 2012, 11:54:15 PM
Donegal's style of play now if isn't much different to what Dublin used to win the All Ireland last year, other teams will have to try and copy it as it's the way GAA is going.
Read Armagh02 - Tyrone05 - Dublin11 - Donegal12 in ascending order in terms of physical preparation.
i hope that made sense. system improves players, players improve the system, system improves players once again and the process just repeats itself. no great team, sportsman, artist, whatever, stays still... you just hope that when you have your purple patch you make hay and have a nice run. people/teams that do it well even manage to have a high standard in their transition periods. but you can't be successful without structure, or at the very least a knowledge of structure. imo like.
Quote from: Captain Obvious on August 26, 2012, 11:54:15 PM
Donegal's style of play now isn't much different to what Dublin used to win the All Ireland last year, other teams will have to try and copy it as it's the way GAA is going.
Quite a few differences between Donegal and Dublin. Unlike Dublin, Donegal can maintain a consistent shape and intensity throughout the whole 70 mins, but the 2nd half turbo charge. after taking the best that Cork could throw at them - on the chin, is a standout.
Great game to watch and as Hardy pointed out, delightfully free from the plague of cynicism.
I thought that was a brilliant game of football. Donegal deserved to win by a mile and I sincerely hope they go on to win the whole thing.
I'm not the biggest fan of ultra defensive football but Donegal have taken it to a level where they have a whole box of blankets in defence but they have tweeked it so that it doesnt distract from their attacking flair. I think their style now is near perfect in the modern game. They defend and attack in numbers, with pace and with no shortage of skill.
The level of organisation and fitness that McGunness has this team at enables them to play that way. For me they were fantastic to watch today and coming from a county with only one all-ireland too, I know how much it would mean to the to win it.
Karl Lacey is an unbelievably good footballer. MOTM for me.
Has to be said too though, the referee had a good game and definately played is part in the game being as free flowing as it was.
As good as donegal are now, they still would be beaten by 3 or 4 teams playing the standard style of Gaelic football, otherwise they play that road. they have about 5 exceptional footballers with the best defender in the county in the stands. The system covers the other players. Pick your best 15 in the country and Lacey and Murphy would probably be the only 2 on it.that said i hope they win the all ireland, Dublin going back to back while playing poorly all year would have half them saying they are great team which is not the case. They have 1 great footballer.
Quote from: yellowcard on August 26, 2012, 11:52:18 PM
Quote from: cadence on August 26, 2012, 11:43:02 PM
Quote from: yellowcard on August 26, 2012, 11:31:57 PM
Quote from: cadence on August 26, 2012, 11:30:38 PM
thanks for making my point. do carry on!
I'm confused now.
preparation and systems only get you so far. you need the footballing ability too. but you also need to work on both aspects, the one improves the other. with a smart strategy, you've good the framework to improve your players. players can't really blossom without the framework.
structure is all important. any art is a good example. work within a structure and it opens up the opportunity to be creative and effective at the same time. poetry, painting, music, they all use structure and sometimes the knowledge of the rules of what structure should look like to innovate new ways of being and sport is no different. structure actually fosters creativity, not stifle it.
Wouldn't disagree with any of that. If Donegal win the AI as I think they will now, it's without doubt the single biggest managerial achievement that I ever remember. I'm not saying Donegal don't have some very good players but I do think that they are far from being the most talented individuals in the country. I hope that's not seen as a criticism but it's just the way I see it.
you're not seeing how much our players have improved by playing within a framework and tweeking that framework gradually as they become more adept at what they do. take mark mchugh, he has had the talent ever since he broke into the team. but last year he used to run into traffic, get surrounded, and lose the ball. he doesn't do that at all now. he's smarter and his reading of the game has developed hugely. and that is a good example of how the framework helps players to develop their games and how this improved aspect of individual player's games can be implemented into your overall strategy. it is much too simplistic to view tactics and preparation as being separate from ability and creativity, and vice versa. the one feeds and nourishes the other.
Are some saying there was no cynicism? It was dripping from the game but Coldrick turned a blind eye to it.
From 'clumsy' tackling in non-scoring areas, to going down holding the face after supposed third man tackles to time-wasting late on - Coldrick ignored the whole show. I think it was well over a minute before the final Donegal free was hit from the time it was awarded. Coldrick still blew her up on time.
Quote from: rrhf on August 26, 2012, 11:51:35 PM
Listen guys in the 70s a greatest ever Kerry golden years ever team mostly teachers and professionals scored 5 goals again a team who had 4 turf cutters 6 farmers, 1 balers assistant, and a bucket man whatever the hell that was. In otherwise Kerry walked over some gobshites over the years. Now the brainiest team wins, thats not a bad thing but there is still a few gobshites
Give us an example of one of these gobshite teams ?
Also, well done to Donegal but they are now overwhelming favourites to win the AI. Ulster teams always need the crutch of being underdog and they usually crumble under the pressure of raised expectation (e.g Armagh anytime after 02, Tyrone 04,06,09 and this years 10 point hammering, Down in 2010) so it will be interesting to see how they deal with this new situation.
Quote from: Hardy on August 26, 2012, 06:24:08 PM
What a great game it is when played in the right spirit. No difficulty refereeing that and I don't remember one cheat, dive or injury-feigning in the whole game.
Did colm o rourke accuse Donegal of play acting at half time in relation to the late arrival for the second half. Even the begrudging counties can't agree on what's going on here.
72:08 the free was awarded.
73:10 the free was hit.
Ref blew her up 73:23
That's accepted cynicism.
Still waiting on examples of those gobshite teams rrhf.....I cant remember who we beat by 5 goals that had turf cutters on the team!...were you referring to Monaghan ?? I think that was in 1979 if I recall correctly ?
Quote from: ONeill on August 27, 2012, 12:15:34 AM
Are some saying there was no cynicism? It was dripping from the game but Coldrick turned a blind eye to it.
From 'clumsy' tackling in non-scoring areas, to going down holding the face after supposed third man tackles to time-wasting late on - Coldrick ignored the whole show. I think it was well over a minute before the final Donegal free was hit from the time it was awarded. Coldrick still blew her up on time.
agree with you i def thought it wasn't free from cynicism. but there was also not a ridiculous level of liberty-taking going on. made for a great game.
(http://i849.photobucket.com/albums/ab56/declanrice/289.jpg)
Just amazed at that game today. I honestly thought if we were to win, we'd scrape through after having been put to the pin of our collar by Cork. Did not forsee us basically doing to them what we did to Derry and Down and even Kerry with that second half explosion. That we won by two points was a travesty - we were easily worth a seven or eight point win and hopefully that goal at the end was a serious lesson learned. We missed a succession of easy chances as well in the second half, chances that went over the bar against Down and Derry, otherwise the scoreline might have reflected our dominance. If we'd taken three or four of those easy points and avoided the stupid goal at the end, I think that that second half would rival the 92 final performance as possibly the best performance from any Donegal team ever. Just a joy to watch! Hard to pick a standout performer given there were so many (Gallagher, Kavanagh especially), but with his couple of points and overall excellence I'd have to give it to Lacey. Going to be a fun month!! ;D
Quote from: tbrick18 on August 27, 2012, 12:11:59 AM
I thought that was a brilliant game of football. Donegal deserved to win by a mile and I sincerely hope they go on to win the whole thing.
I'm not the biggest fan of ultra defensive football but Donegal have taken it to a level where they have a whole box of blankets in defence but they have tweeked it so that it doesnt distract from their attacking flair. I think their style now is near perfect in the modern game. They defend and attack in numbers, with pace and with no shortage of skill.
The level of organisation and fitness that McGunness has this team at enables them to play that way. For me they were fantastic to watch today and coming from a county with only one all-ireland too, I know how much it would mean to the to win it.
Karl Lacey is an unbelievably good footballer. MOTM for me.
Has to be said too though, the referee had a good game and definately played is part in the game being as free flowing as it was.
Whilst I agree that Karl Lacey is a fine footballer, Ciaran Sheehan gave him a roasting yesterday
Quote from: DuffleKing on August 27, 2012, 02:23:53 AM
Quote from: tbrick18 on August 27, 2012, 12:11:59 AM
I thought that was a brilliant game of football. Donegal deserved to win by a mile and I sincerely hope they go on to win the whole thing.
I'm not the biggest fan of ultra defensive football but Donegal have taken it to a level where they have a whole box of blankets in defence but they have tweeked it so that it doesnt distract from their attacking flair. I think their style now is near perfect in the modern game. They defend and attack in numbers, with pace and with no shortage of skill.
The level of organisation and fitness that McGunness has this team at enables them to play that way. For me they were fantastic to watch today and coming from a county with only one all-ireland too, I know how much it would mean to the to win it.
Karl Lacey is an unbelievably good footballer. MOTM for me.
Has to be said too though, the referee had a good game and definately played is part in the game being as free flowing as it was.
Whilst I agree that Karl Lacey is a fine footballer, Ciaran Sheehan gave him a roasting yesterday
With his mighty total of zero points? Sheehan was anonymous for large stretches and Lacey, a defender, was a more potent attacking threat than he was.
Quote from: J70 on August 27, 2012, 02:19:35 AM
and avoided the stupid goal at the end
Only happens occasionally in a life time - almost regrettable but will never ever happen again. The scaifte agus an fhoireann together are not a mix for winning. An fhoireann do the damage and celebrating with the scaifte afterwards would have eased all anxiety but it was good craic until the cúl and made it more Donegal-ish to win on a tight margin anyway.
er seyfrus, sheehan got 3 from play my friend
Excellent game and Donegal were very impressive. Must be roaring favourites for the final now but we'll see how next Sunday's game goes first.
Well done Donegal, excellent performance. Absolutely nothing wrong with that style of football, a million miles away from what they did v the Dubs this time last year.
Some display of fielding by the midfielders. Would never have expected Cork to be obliterated in that area of the field. This kept them on the front foot for much of the second half, which made them look fitter.
As mentioned by the Donegal lads, a little bit of panic set in during the last 5 minutes, when they missed 2 or 3 easy points and the bizarre goal conceded (where did all the defenders go??!!). But that's allowed in an All Ireland semi, and to be honest, in a semi you're probably better winning by 2 points with a couple of things to work on, than putting in the perfect performance and winning by 8.
I honestly can't see Donegal losing, have felt that since the Ulster Final that they will go the whole way as they look so strong, solid and hard to play against. Have never seen a side as hard to beat in a long time. What do the other teams do next then? While I don't think Donegal will dominate I do think that they, along with Dublin, have raised the bar in terms of training with the twice a day sessions etc. Dublin and Donegal would not be the panels with the best players (you just have to look at where Dublin were in 2009 and Donegal in 2010), but they arguably have the best coach(s) working with them the past few years and it shows. I remember Joe Brolly spouting months ago about how Tyrone could never win back to back All Irelands due to the high number of injuries the players received due to the way they trained and played, will the same be the case with Donegal? I would imagine it would be inevitable that the players will pick up muscle injuries or more serious ones over time given the training they are doing, and it would be a big ask to sustain this level for 2 or 3 seasons in a row. In saying that, I think Mayo will actually get to the final.
Quote from: Hound on August 27, 2012, 08:36:24 AM
Well done Donegal, excellent performance. Absolutely nothing wrong with that style of football, a million miles away from what they did v the Dubs this time last year.
Some display of fielding by the midfielders. Would never have expected Cork to be obliterated in that area of the field. This kept them on the front foot for much of the second half, which made them look fitter.
As mentioned by the Donegal lads, a little bit of panic set in during the last 5 minutes, when they missed 2 or 3 easy points and the bizarre goal conceded (where did all the defenders go??!!). But that's allowed in an All Ireland semi, and to be honest, in a semi you're probably better winning by 2 points with a couple of things to work on, than putting in the perfect performance and winning by 8.
They didn't finish very well against Kerry either
Which hotel will the Donegal team be staying for the final?
Is it just me or has anyone else noticed the following:
Donegal beat Kerry comfortably enough = quotes from here and elsewhere such as, bad day at the office for the Kingdom, they caught Kerry on the way down, Kerry were finished anyhow
Donegal beat Cork (the same Cork who beat the same Kerry earlier this year) comfortably enough = quotes such as, Donegal favs now for AI, Donegal outstanding etc etc.
Its a typical Irish reaction similar in a way to the reaction we have to the economy.
The answer is somewhere inbetween - I wouldn't say that Donegal are the best thing since sliced bread. Credit where credit is due they were excellent yesterday. In saying that Cork were very poor. I counted 5 intercept passes that led to scores for Donegal (in fact Donegal missed 3 more sitters from intercepts).
As ever a balanced view from the media and elsewhere will never be given (apart from probably Martin McHugh on the SG last night).
Quote from: ONeill on August 27, 2012, 12:15:34 AM
Are some saying there was no cynicism? It was dripping from the game but Coldrick turned a blind eye to it.
From 'clumsy' tackling in non-scoring areas, to going down holding the face after supposed third man tackles to time-wasting late on - Coldrick ignored the whole show. I think it was well over a minute before the final Donegal free was hit from the time it was awarded. Coldrick still blew her up on time.
100% correct. Coldrick was either extremely naive or shockingly incompetent.
Quote from: Syferus on August 27, 2012, 02:29:57 AM
With his mighty total of zero points? Sheehan was anonymous for large stretches and Lacey, a defender, was a more potent attacking threat than he was.
One of the least informed posts I've seen on here.
Sheehan scored 0-3 from, was unlucky with some narrow wides and hit a beautiful inch-perfect 50 yard pass to set up the goal.
My respect for Donegal has been reinstalled after yesterday's game. I feared the worst going there but I must say it was one of the most enjoyable game I've been at in recent times as a neutral.
Well done Donegal - it will be a fascinating final - regardless of whether it's the Dubs or Mayo.
Quote from: blanketattack on August 27, 2012, 09:27:53 AM
Quote from: Syferus on August 27, 2012, 02:29:57 AM
With his mighty total of zero points? Sheehan was anonymous for large stretches and Lacey, a defender, was a more potent attacking threat than he was.
One of the least informed posts I've seen on here.
Sheehan scored 0-3 from, was unlucky with some narrow wides and hit a beautiful inch-perfect 50 yard pass to set up the goal.
He would have been man of the match had Cork won. Surely he is getting him mixed up with another Cork player?
Thought Sheehan finally should his true potential
On reflection, I don't even think yesterday was about fitness levels. I still reckon Cork would out-gym Donegal man-for-man.
Instead it was like a brawl between the a gym monkey and a trained boxer. They gym monkey, despite being bigger, stronger and quicker (and a pretty good scrapper) was lulled into using all his energy in the early rounds, and the boxer used his nous and skill to pick him off for fun as tiredness set in.
Nothing influences club football trends like senior county football success. If Jimmy McGuinness has signalled a new dawn whereby players (even those the biggest egos) listen to their managers, and play as part of a bigger picture instead of as the only picture, it could be exciting times for Gaelic football. In truth, Kerry have been doing this for years, and Crossmaglen have taken it to unbelievable levels in the club game - but it's when one of the "wee boys" does it, that everyone else starts to take notice.
In regards to the Cork goal. I was in the upper Hogan directly in line with it and there was a blatant push in the back for O'Neil to get the few yards space while the ball was in the air.
Does anyone have an insight to the training Donegal have been doing as their level of fitness is seriously unreal?
Donegal deserved the win. Truely awesome performance.
Was disapponted in Cork. They looked shell-shocked and where were their scoring forwards?
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gAjQrnImT_k
Jimmys winning matches ;D
Quote from: manballandall on August 27, 2012, 10:17:46 AM
Does anyone have an insight to the training Donegal have been doing as their level of fitness is seriously unreal?
Only heard bits and pieces but apparently they run from the top 21 to the bottom 21 and back. 2 groups so you get a rest while the other group run and you're expected to be in and around the 30 second mark for it.
It stands to reason as you can see Mark McHugh pick up the ball in his own 21 and charge up to the far one numerous times during a game, then he charges straight back to his own 21 again. Maybe not as much as 12 times a game but if he can do 12 in training he can easily do 8/9/10 in a match!
Quote from: screenexile on August 27, 2012, 10:32:09 AM
Quote from: manballandall on August 27, 2012, 10:17:46 AM
Does anyone have an insight to the training Donegal have been doing as their level of fitness is seriously unreal?
Only heard bits and pieces but apparently they run from the top 21 to the bottom 21 and back. 2 groups so you get a rest while the other group run and you're expected to be in and around the 30 second mark for it.
It stands to reason as you can see Mark McHugh pick up the ball in his own 21 and charge up to the far one numerous times during a game, then he charges straight back to his own 21 again. Maybe not as much as 12 times a game but if he can do 12 in training he can easily do 8/9/10 in a match!
And according to Pat Spillane, at least one of them was ordered to eat 8 meals a day to put on weight!
Well done to Donegal. You have a county team to be proud of.
This team now is the polar opposite of previous Donegal sides (i wouldn't call them teams) up until 2 years ago. Hard to get the head around the transformation. McGuiness and Gallagher etc deserve great credit, as do the players for buying in to the new regime. It's probably the greatest turnaround with the same bunch of players since Heffernan took over the Dubs in the early 70s.
Quote from: screenexile on August 27, 2012, 10:32:09 AM
Quote from: manballandall on August 27, 2012, 10:17:46 AM
Does anyone have an insight to the training Donegal have been doing as their level of fitness is seriously unreal?
Only heard bits and pieces but apparently they run from the top 21 to the bottom 21 and back. 2 groups so you get a rest while the other group run and you're expected to be in and around the 30 second mark for it.
It stands to reason as you can see Mark McHugh pick up the ball in his own 21 and charge up to the far one numerous times during a game, then he charges straight back to his own 21 again. Maybe not as much as 12 times a game but if he can do 12 in training he can easily do 8/9/10 in a match!
I'd have thought that the 200m up and down was a pretty standard drill, even at club football.
There's undoubtedly a high level of fitness in Donegal football, but to me it's more how they use their fitness. It's hard to recall a lung bursting run from Lacey, McHugh or McGlynn where the end product isn't at least a shooting opportunity, and they don't swarm forward in big numbers. These two things are related too; the runs tend to be into open space rather than crowds of drifting players. So much common sense.
Quote from: blanketattack on August 27, 2012, 09:27:53 AM
Quote from: Syferus on August 27, 2012, 02:29:57 AM
With his mighty total of zero points? Sheehan was anonymous for large stretches and Lacey, a defender, was a more potent attacking threat than he was.
One of the least informed posts I've seen on here.
Sheehan scored 0-3 from, was unlucky with some narrow wides and hit a beautiful inch-perfect 50 yard pass to set up the goal.
Had a quick look at RTE's stay sheet and he wasn't listed in the scorers at all. Regardless it's ridiculous to say he skinned Lacey, particularly for most of the second half Sheehan was anonymous and that was the key period in the game.
Great result for Donegal and thoroughly deserved. Having beaten Kerry and Cork must make them favourites.
I always felt a bit sorry for Donegal during the recent Armagh/Tyrone domination of Ulster. It is their time to dominate now.
Quote from: highorlow on August 27, 2012, 09:22:58 AM
Is it just me or has anyone else noticed the following:
Donegal beat Kerry comfortably enough = quotes from here and elsewhere such as, bad day at the office for the Kingdom, they caught Kerry on the way down, Kerry were finished anyhow
Donegal beat Cork (the same Cork who beat the same Kerry earlier this year) comfortably enough = quotes such as, Donegal favs now for AI, Donegal outstanding etc etc.
Its a typical Irish reaction similar in a way to the reaction we have to the economy.
The answer is somewhere inbetween - I wouldn't say that Donegal are the best thing since sliced bread. Credit where credit is due they were excellent yesterday. In saying that Cork were very poor. I counted 5 intercept passes that led to scores for Donegal (in fact Donegal missed 3 more sitters from intercepts).
As ever a balanced view from the media and elsewhere will never be given (apart from probably Martin McHugh on the SG last night).
I see no contradiction between questioning whether Donegal were the real deal after the Kerry game and thinking they might well be after the Cork game. Kerry had been beaten by Cork, so it was reasonable to say that Cork would present a sterner challenge than Kerry. Yet Donegal took them pretty handily and have little to fear from Dublin, who don't look any better than the team that an inferior Donegal ran very close last year, and Mayo who are, well, Mayo
Syferus, Your logic doesn't stand up - you've been caught out so stop digging. If you watched the game you would have seen Sheehan's performance - which was excellent- and you would have been entitled to say ( as you did) that he was anonymous, even though you missed his three points, one of which was the score of the game, where Mickey Harte on BBC picked up that he had chased a lost cause for the team, kept the ball in play, started the move and fired over a fantastic point to finish it. You would have been entitled to your opinion, even though you'd probably be the only person in Ireland with that opinion.
Now if you were depending on the RTE stay sheet- which you quote in your defence - you would not have been entitled to your opinion on Sheehan's performance because you were depending on a statistical summary rather than your analysis. Cake and eat it etc.
Lacey is a hell of a player but his attacking tendencies will obviously make him vulnerable in defending. Probably was the best defender on show yesterday but Ciaran Sheehan is one hell of a footballer- the best in Cork IMO.
Cork are a talented group of athletes, some good footballers with a good manager.
Donegal are a talented group of footballers, all good athletes with an excellent manager and assistant manager.They also have belief and hunger- a rare combination- and will be hard to beat.
Quote from: Syferus on August 27, 2012, 10:58:32 AM
Quote from: blanketattack on August 27, 2012, 09:27:53 AM
Quote from: Syferus on August 27, 2012, 02:29:57 AM
With his mighty total of zero points? Sheehan was anonymous for large stretches and Lacey, a defender, was a more potent attacking threat than he was.
One of the least informed posts I've seen on here.
Sheehan scored 0-3 from, was unlucky with some narrow wides and hit a beautiful inch-perfect 50 yard pass to set up the goal.
Had a quick look at RTE's stay sheet and he wasn't listed in the scorers at all. Regardless it's ridiculous to say he skinned Lacey, particularly for most of the second half Sheehan was anonymous and that was the key period in the game.
Wow. You didn't see the game, did you?
Quote from: Dubh driocht on August 27, 2012, 11:44:30 AM
Syferus, Your logic doesn't stand up -
Syferus and logic in the one sentence :o :o :o
Now there's an oxymoron if there ever was one ;D ;D
That lad is a standing joke among Ros circles due to some of the stuff he comes out with.
Some show by Donegal yesterday but Cork's old limitations of ponderous sideways passing came back to haunt them.
Also wasn't Counihan's finest hour - 2 big midfielders in the forwards but no one getting enough ball to kick it into them.
Donegal will give the Final a hell of a crack ... but they've only won a Semi final yet ;)
Keeping the players safe from the hype over the next month in that isolated County could be McGuinness's biggest task now
QuoteKeeping the players safe from the hype over the next month in that isolated County could be McGuinness's biggest task now
I think tickets for the final should only be allowed to those who paid the household charge.
Quote from: highorlow on August 27, 2012, 01:56:29 PM
QuoteKeeping the players safe from the hype over the next month in that isolated County could be McGuinness's biggest task now
I think tickets for the final should only be allowed to those who paid the household charge.
You're not Jimmy Dennihan are you?
Quote from: deiseach on August 27, 2012, 11:30:46 AM
I see no contradiction between questioning whether Donegal were the real deal after the Kerry game and thinking they might well be after the Cork game. Kerry had been beaten by Cork, so it was reasonable to say that Cork would present a sterner challenge than Kerry. Yet Donegal took them pretty handily and have little to fear from Dublin, who don't look any better than the team that an inferior Donegal ran very close last year, and Mayo who are, well, Mayo
;D Indeed just the attitude Mayo or Dublin need to take them in the final
Dublin and Mayo wont be so naive as to try and bring the game to Donegal................lets see what happens when the shoe is on the other foot
Quote from: squire_in_navy_slacks on August 27, 2012, 04:06:11 PM
;D Indeed just the attitude Mayo or Dublin need to take them in the final
Meh. If Dublin or Mayo need any extra motivation to win the All-Ireland, they shouldn't be playing
Quote from: DuffleKing on August 27, 2012, 11:58:18 AM
Quote from: Syferus on August 27, 2012, 10:58:32 AM
Quote from: blanketattack on August 27, 2012, 09:27:53 AM
Quote from: Syferus on August 27, 2012, 02:29:57 AM
With his mighty total of zero points? Sheehan was anonymous for large stretches and Lacey, a defender, was a more potent attacking threat than he was.
One of the least informed posts I've seen on here.
Sheehan scored 0-3 from, was unlucky with some narrow wides and hit a beautiful inch-perfect 50 yard pass to set up the goal.
Had a quick look at RTE's stay sheet and he wasn't listed in the scorers at all. Regardless it's ridiculous to say he skinned Lacey, particularly for most of the second half Sheehan was anonymous and that was the key period in the game.
Wow. You didn't see the game, did you?
Clearly didn't. Sheehan,O'Neill was Corks best forwards yesterday Goulding,O'Connor poor or well marked.
The elongated journey home via planes, trains and automobiles is never easy after you have lost a Championship match but it can be slightly more tolerable when you accept you have been beaten by a better team, and yesterday we were. So congrats first and foremost to Donegal who were outstanding on the day. They won all the battles that had to be won on the pitch and tactically were always a step or two ahead of Cork. Theyhave one huge hurdle to overcome yet but on yesterday's evidence it will take a serious effort to stop them now.
Even before a ball was kicked Cork were on the back foot, re-arranging three lines on the team to adjust to the opposition which was lunacy given the team would only have had two weeks together to prepare for any change in formation. Lining up with five defenders is fine when you have the ball but if you lose possession round the middle those defenders will be swamped by the waves of Donegal players on the counter-attack. The more Cork lost their defensive shape by pushing forward trying to create over-laps to reduce the deficit the more it played into Donegal's hands. We may have lost in any event but Cork's best chance of a win was to stick to what we had been doing all year.
Yesterday game will most likely mark the end of the Counihan era and the feeling in Cork was this year's success or otherwise would define his legacy. The verdict will not be hugely favourable now. A new man will most likely come in but not sure what kind of approach Cork will take in the future. The game has changed considerably since 2009-2010 and Cork will tactically need to adapt accordingly.
Better team definitly won. They cleaned us out all over the pitch. Donegal supported was absoloutley unreal. The ground shook when the final whistle went. I hope ye win it now.
Both teams are to be complemented on a great game. Donegal are now one step closer and will be heavily tipped to win sam. I hope that Donegal can go on and win it but would not rule out Dublin or Mayo. Jim McGuinness and co will now have a great month grtting ready.
Quote from: ONeill on August 27, 2012, 12:23:39 AM
72:08 the free was awarded.
73:10 the free was hit.
Ref blew her up 73:23
That's accepted cynicism.
Ah the time keeping refs pay no attention to it an thereby condone the behavour. I only watched the game on tv as I have posted thought it was a fine match.
Quote from: manballandall on August 27, 2012, 10:17:46 AM
Does anyone have an insight to the training Donegal have been doing as their level of fitness is seriously unreal?
It seems to be shrouded in secrecy. Brolly wrote a good article about it last week. Worth reading if someone can post her up.
I think it was Bogue's book that mentioned the overpowering stench of vomit at training sessions.
Cassidy exposed a tiny bit about it and got the chop supposedly. Starting to doubt if both were linked. Anyone thinking that McGuinness didn't see Cassidy as part of the scheme anyway?
I thought Sheehan was Cork's best forward but he still put 3/4 wides which would have made the game much tighter if they'd went over - O'Connor in particular was anonymous.
Very strange to see Cork beaten at MF, you'd have expected them to break even anyway.
Donegal missed some soft points and you'd wonder if Cork had gotten on top, how Donegal would have reacted - that's one thing we've yet to see from them, whether they can come back from being a few points down.
Quote from: ONeill on August 27, 2012, 10:52:10 PM
Quote from: manballandall on August 27, 2012, 10:17:46 AM
Does anyone have an insight to the training Donegal have been doing as their level of fitness is seriously unreal?
It seems to be shrouded in secrecy. Brolly wrote a good article about it last week. Worth reading if someone can post her up.
I think it was Bogue's book that mentioned the overpowering stench of vomit at training sessions.
Cassidy exposed a tiny bit about it and got the chop supposedly. Starting to doubt if both were linked. Anyone thinking that McGuinness didn't see Cassidy as part of the scheme anyway?
Cassidy would still be a great asset as a player. But he broke the pirate' s code.
A GAA book is a book too many most of the time but ridiculous for a player that still had stuff to do to spill the beans because some guy was writing a book and doing interviews. Utter shite call by Cassidy. I ve not read Cass's stuff ( couldn t be arsed) - all you need to know about Donegal is watch them play, preferably as often as possible. Savage player Cassidy but McGuinness was dead right cutting him off. McGuiness was punishing stupidity and ego - traits that are not detectable in the present Donegal side. They re also the most disciplined/honest team I ve ever seen at this.... well ever.
If you haven't read what Cassidy said, how do you know he deserved to be jettisoned?
Quote from: DuffleKing on August 27, 2012, 11:58:18 AM
Quote from: Syferus on August 27, 2012, 10:58:32 AM
Quote from: blanketattack on August 27, 2012, 09:27:53 AM
Quote from: Syferus on August 27, 2012, 02:29:57 AM
With his mighty total of zero points? Sheehan was anonymous for large stretches and Lacey, a defender, was a more potent attacking threat than he was.
One of the least informed posts I've seen on here.
Sheehan scored 0-3 from, was unlucky with some narrow wides and hit a beautiful inch-perfect 50 yard pass to set up the goal.
Had a quick look at RTE's stay sheet and he wasn't listed in the scorers at all. Regardless it's ridiculous to say he skinned Lacey, particularly for most of the second half Sheehan was anonymous and that was the key period in the game.
Wow. You didn't see the game, did you?
I did and Sheehan, like most of the Cork team, was largely MIA for half the game. I highly doubt you could list off yesterday's scorers and their points totals without a look at a stat line.
It's just the usual forum maxim of ratcheting up the verbosity of statements, 'he gave him a roasting', as predictable as it is annoying. So many want so deserately to make the
definitive opinion on players and teams that they forget it's only ever going to be an opinion.
jeez Syferus that hole is getting deeper and deeper :)
Quote from: maigheo on August 28, 2012, 01:43:26 AM
jeez Syferus that hole is getting deeper and deeper :)
Meaning?
Quote from: Syferus on August 28, 2012, 01:50:58 AM
Quote from: maigheo on August 28, 2012, 01:43:26 AM
jeez Syferus that hole is getting deeper and deeper :)
Meaning?
Put your shovel away, climb back out of that dark hole and go to bed.
Quote from: moysider on August 27, 2012, 11:57:22 PM
Quote from: ONeill on August 27, 2012, 10:52:10 PM
Quote from: manballandall on August 27, 2012, 10:17:46 AM
Does anyone have an insight to the training Donegal have been doing as their level of fitness is seriously unreal?
It seems to be shrouded in secrecy. Brolly wrote a good article about it last week. Worth reading if someone can post her up.
I think it was Bogue's book that mentioned the overpowering stench of vomit at training sessions.
Cassidy exposed a tiny bit about it and got the chop supposedly. Starting to doubt if both were linked. Anyone thinking that McGuinness didn't see Cassidy as part of the scheme anyway?
Cassidy would still be a great asset as a player. But he broke the pirate' s code.
A GAA book is a book too many most of the time but ridiculous for a player that still had stuff to do to spill the beans because some guy was writing a book and doing interviews. Utter shite call by Cassidy. I ve not read Cass's stuff ( couldn t be arsed) - all you need to know about Donegal is watch them play, preferably as often as possible. Savage player Cassidy but McGuinness was dead right cutting him off. McGuiness was punishing stupidity and ego - traits that are not detectable in the present Donegal side. They re also the most disciplined/honest team I ve ever seen at this.... well ever.
that's a big claim, but one thing i know, i love this donegal team. the joy they give to us supporters is unlike any other donegal side... including the late 80s-early 90s side. maybe that has something to do with the brickbats that have been thrown at them, you become protective because they have been very gracious in how they've responded and handled it all. but jibes are jibes after all. uncalled for and over the line.
it's good to have something to define yourself with i suppose. and it's something else to have a team that will go through hell and highwater for the county. as an immigrant, you just can't beat your county doing it the way donegal are doing it... the sense of belonging somewhere is amped up just that little bit more. fuckenlovethisdonegalteam!
Just checking lads, but all this talk of a Donegal 'System' is it not simply the Tyrone blanket defence re-worked with more physicality and less attacking?
Quote from: ONeill on August 27, 2012, 10:52:10 PM
Starting to doubt if both were linked. Anyone thinking that McGuinness didn't see Cassidy as part of the scheme anyway?
Yep. Book was nothing to do with it. Only an excuse to act.
Quote from: sheamy on August 28, 2012, 11:14:53 AM
Quote from: ONeill on August 27, 2012, 10:52:10 PM
Starting to doubt if both were linked. Anyone thinking that McGuinness didn't see Cassidy as part of the scheme anyway?
Yep. Book was nothing to do with it. Only an excuse to act.
An excuse for who? There's a lot of people who feel that Cass was going to walk anyway.
Quote from: moysider on August 27, 2012, 11:57:22 PM
Quote from: ONeill on August 27, 2012, 10:52:10 PM
Quote from: manballandall on August 27, 2012, 10:17:46 AM
Does anyone have an insight to the training Donegal have been doing as their level of fitness is seriously unreal?
It seems to be shrouded in secrecy. Brolly wrote a good article about it last week. Worth reading if someone can post her up.
I think it was Bogue's book that mentioned the overpowering stench of vomit at training sessions.
Cassidy exposed a tiny bit about it and got the chop supposedly. Starting to doubt if both were linked. Anyone thinking that McGuinness didn't see Cassidy as part of the scheme anyway?
They re also the most honest team I ve ever seen at this.... well ever.
Lets not carried away now.
Not so long ago Rory Gallagher was 20 yards onto the pitch giving the 'elbow' sign harrassing the ref when there was a fair clash trying to get a Dublin player sent off
Then we had this
(http://www.sportsfile.com/winshare/w540/Library/SF759/552858.jpg)
Our friend Rory there too.
I think he means 'honest' in terms of the hard graft they put in, as in honest effort.
Quote from: AZOffaly on August 28, 2012, 02:04:25 PM
I think he means 'honest' in terms of the hard graft they put in, as in honest effort.
No harm in clearing things up though
Great game Sun but was disappointed in Cork, felt they focussed too much on Donegal rather than their own strengths by moving O'Leary back and trying Paddy Kelly on McHugh. To compound matters they didn't shoot enough from distance when the shot was on despite starting Sheehan and Goulding, which would suggest that was in their game plan. They never got Donnacha O'Connor on the ball at all. Some players repeatedly took the ball into the tackle which is a major no no against Donegal and this ate away at the morale of the rest of the team. They were a beaten docket halfway through the second half.
You have to hand it to Donegal and McGuinness though, probably the most organised team to play the game. Viewing is limited on the box but after Anthony Thompson clipped the ball over the bar after the goal chance broke down he didn't take back up the field like a march hare. Instead he looked to fill in at corner forward safe in the knowledge that his position was manned and he was able to take a brief breather. Can't see them being beat in the final.
Quote from: Croí na hÉireann on August 28, 2012, 02:58:42 PM
Great game Sun but was disappointed in Cork, felt they focussed too much on Donegal rather than their own strengths by moving O'Leary back and trying Paddy Kelly on McHugh. To compound matters they didn't shoot enough from distance when the shot was on despite starting Sheehan and Goulding, which would suggest that was in their game plan. They never got Donnacha O'Connor on the ball at all. Some players repeatedly took the ball into the tackle which is a major no no against Donegal and this ate away at the morale of the rest of the team. They were a beaten docket halfway through the second half.
You have to hand it to Donegal and McGuinness though, probably the most organised team to play the game. Viewing is limited on the box but after Anthony Thompson clipped the ball over the bar after the goal chance broke down he didn't take back up the field like a march hare. Instead he looked to fill in at corner forward safe in the knowledge that his position was manned and he was able to take a brief breather. Can't see them being beat in the final.
McGlynn's goal in the Ulster final was similar. He had broken forward and took up a corner forward position to deny a short kick-out.
Quote from: RMDrive on August 28, 2012, 11:44:50 AM
Quote from: sheamy on August 28, 2012, 11:14:53 AM
Quote from: ONeill on August 27, 2012, 10:52:10 PM
Starting to doubt if both were linked. Anyone thinking that McGuinness didn't see Cassidy as part of the scheme anyway?
Yep. Book was nothing to do with it. Only an excuse to act.
An excuse for who? There's a lot of people who feel that Cass was going to walk anyway.
that being the case it was a master-stroke from McGuinness, sending out a message to the rest of the squad and adding to the mythology.
Quote from: LeoMc on August 28, 2012, 04:22:34 PM
Quote from: RMDrive on August 28, 2012, 11:44:50 AM
Quote from: sheamy on August 28, 2012, 11:14:53 AM
Quote from: ONeill on August 27, 2012, 10:52:10 PM
Starting to doubt if both were linked. Anyone thinking that McGuinness didn't see Cassidy as part of the scheme anyway?
Yep. Book was nothing to do with it. Only an excuse to act.
An excuse for who? There's a lot of people who feel that Cass was going to walk anyway.
that being the case it was a master-stroke from McGuinness, sending out a message to the rest of the squad and adding to the mythology.
I don't believe that it was as calculated as you make out. I reckon that these things rarely are. What I'd be sure of is that Cass had a pretty good idea what would happen when he revealed his involvement in the book. So he probably went into it knowing that it could mean the end of his involvement with the team. Couple that with the idea that he was going to pack it in anyway and you might have an explanation. I'm only guessing though.
One thing I am absolutely sure of is that Cass is held in the highest possible regard in the county, and rightly so. Even on the bad days he did his best to represent Donegal in a positive way. A nice lad and a fine footballer - one of the best we have ever produced. His reputation was capped off by the point last year against Kildare - that alone will mean he will never be forgotten. I think he could have a good career in the media ahead of him also. He seems to be very comfortable in the work he does with TG4.
Congrats Donegal and I even bought a green and yellow top to support ye on Sunday which is more than I can see for my brother & sister in law from Donegal.
Just curious, but who would Donegal say has been there toughest match so far?
I've noticed they tend to play a waiting game til half time and then pull away from most teams and then before you know it you can't get back into it.
My wife doesn't know if she wants Dublin in the final now or not as she was supporting her cousin last year.
Tyrone gave Donegal their toughest match in the championship so far.
I thought Donegal were very comfortable and well on control in the second half against Tyrone, except for injury time. First half was even with maybe Tyrone shading it. Looking back though, it was probably our toughest game.
Some serious shite being spouted on here in regards to Jimmy McGuinness. Listening or reading Joe Brolly, you would think that he had just split the f**king atom!! System this, system that, a load of dung. Essentially a very hard working/ fit , physical and hungry team, doing what they need to win a title. Bottom line, they could have lost to Tyrone ( a team very much in transition), and note David Coldrick gave Tyrone f**k all that day. What can only be described as a "jammy " goal against Kerry, got them over the line there. The only convincing victories they have achieved this year, were against Derry and Down ( both poor teams).
Donegal are a good team, and have an excellent chance of winning Sam, but some people ( analysts) included are going over the top!
Do Tyrone or Armagh fans ever not whinge about refs? ;D
You'd think Tyrone were still a big power the way some lads go on here. ::)
(and yes lads I know Ros were rubbish this year ... but at least we still have a sponsor)
I used to love listening to the boys on Highland radio(Donegal) giving out about the referee EVERY match. If ye read most posts from Tyrone fans back in early summer we thought Donegal would go further than us.
The difference being that Highland are commenting in real time, with all the emotion and frustration and lack of retrospection and consideration that is inevitably involved. Even so, they acknowledge when the ref screws over the opposition.
http://www.spailpin.blogspot.ie/
Quote from: J70 on August 29, 2012, 07:03:37 PM
Do Tyrone or Armagh fans ever not whinge about refs? ;D
OK, a little bit of praise: your lot haven't lost a game that Coldrick refereed this year; that's fantastic, unbelievable altogether. :P
Quote from: cadhlancian on August 29, 2012, 06:29:18 PM
Some serious shite being spouted on here in regards to Jimmy McGuinness. Listening or reading Joe Brolly, you would think that he had just split the f**king atom!! System this, system that, a load of dung. Essentially a very hard working/ fit , physical and hungry team, doing what they need to win a title. Bottom line, they could have lost to Tyrone ( a team very much in transition), and note David Coldrick gave Tyrone f**k all that day. What can only be described as a "jammy " goal against Kerry, got them over the line there. The only convincing victories they have achieved this year, were against Derry and Down ( both poor teams).
Donegal are a good team, and have an excellent chance of winning Sam, but some people ( analysts) included are going over the top!
You're just adding to the shite with that post so. Kerry goal was a square ball. Kerry were well beat as were cork. The scoreline might not say it but both very convincing wins.
The systems Donegal play are a big advance on anything seen in Gaelic football and the preparation those guys must do is savage. Maybe it's not rocket science - train teams so that they are so supremely fit defenders can overlap and attack at will and still get back but how meticulously Donegal are prepared is impressive.
I think what has brought most analysts into superlatives is not that Donegal are doing something exceptional, but that a group of erstwhile journeymen or under-perfoming players have been coerced and convinced to fulfil their talents, through an underlying emphasis on the collective.
Anyone who has ever managed a football team (and I'm speaking as a retired reserve team manager) can only take heart from watching Donegal's improvement.
The improvement is impressive, no doubt about that. As somebody said, it is mostly getting players to totally believe in themselves and the training has no doubt been taken to another level. This is not a "system" ! I would imagine that with the amount of training being touted on here, it would be nearly impossible for teams to dominate on a streak of say 4 to 5 years? You would have to think that 2 years tops would be all that any player would be able to tolerate ( both mentally and physically) from such brutal training regimes?
I happened to watch a bit of this match again and noticed at about 71 mins Kerrigan firstly grabbed the Donegal No. 18 around the neck/shoulder to drag him down. Not content with that he then pushed his head forward as if in some act of revenge or to hurt him. I just that if that was in a match in the league the CCCC would be intervening afterwards. Do they be on holidays every July and August. I've No grudge with Kerrigan but thought it could have been a nasty injury
Quote from: Fuzzman on September 10, 2012, 08:21:42 PM
I happened to watch a bit of this match again and noticed at about 71 mins Kerrigan firstly grabbed the Donegal No. 18 around the neck/shoulder to drag him down. Not content with that he then pushed his head forward as if in some act of revenge or to hurt him. I just that if that was in a match in the league the CCCC would be intervening afterwards. Do they be on holidays every July and August. I've No grudge with Kerrigan but thought it could have been a nasty injury
Rule 7.3 (r) subsection (iv) clause 7 states that video evidence will be use to punish player indiscretions up to, but not including the All Ireland semi finals, from which time video evidence shall only be used to exonerate players.
Also known as the Diarmud Connolly provision: yerra we wouldnt want a man to miss the All Ireland final.
Me and the lads around me also noticed how often Cork were collecting possession inside the small semi circle outside the box.
I thought the rule was that for kickouts after a score you had to be outside that circle to receive the ball. Is that wrong?
Quote from: JHume on September 11, 2012, 09:23:19 AM
Quote from: Fuzzman on September 10, 2012, 08:21:42 PM
I happened to watch a bit of this match again and noticed at about 71 mins Kerrigan firstly grabbed the Donegal No. 18 around the neck/shoulder to drag him down. Not content with that he then pushed his head forward as if in some act of revenge or to hurt him. I just that if that was in a match in the league the CCCC would be intervening afterwards. Do they be on holidays every July and August. I've No grudge with Kerrigan but thought it could have been a nasty injury
Also known as the Diarmud Connolly provision: yerra we wouldnt want a man to miss the All Ireland final.
AKA if you're going to reward play acting and feigning injury be sure you correctly send the person off.
Quote from: heffo on September 12, 2012, 03:26:23 PM
Quote from: JHume on September 11, 2012, 09:23:19 AM
Quote from: Fuzzman on September 10, 2012, 08:21:42 PM
I happened to watch a bit of this match again and noticed at about 71 mins Kerrigan firstly grabbed the Donegal No. 18 around the neck/shoulder to drag him down. Not content with that he then pushed his head forward as if in some act of revenge or to hurt him. I just that if that was in a match in the league the CCCC would be intervening afterwards. Do they be on holidays every July and August. I've No grudge with Kerrigan but thought it could have been a nasty injury
Also known as the Diarmud Connolly provision: yerra we wouldnt want a man to miss the All Ireland final.
AKA if you're going to reward play acting and feigning injury be sure you correctly send the person off.
To be fair, Dublin have a long history of seeking to overturn suspensions?
Remember Tommy 'Tom' Carr in 1993?
Quote from: Fuzzman on September 12, 2012, 03:20:49 PM
Me and the lads around me also noticed how often Cork were collecting possession inside the small semi circle outside the box.
I thought the rule was that for kickouts after a score you had to be outside that circle to receive the ball. Is that wrong?
I don't think so. I think the sole purpose of that box is the exclusion zone for penalties. I think if you are 13 metres away from the kickout, you are good to go. Mind you, if they are inside a semi circle that starts on the 20, for a kickout in the middle of the 13, they'd be getting close enough to that distance if they were much inside the radius of the semi circle.
Quote from: AZOffaly on September 13, 2012, 01:02:04 PM
Quote from: Fuzzman on September 12, 2012, 03:20:49 PM
Me and the lads around me also noticed how often Cork were collecting possession inside the small semi circle outside the box.
I thought the rule was that for kickouts after a score you had to be outside that circle to receive the ball. Is that wrong?
I don't think so. I think the sole purpose of that box is the exclusion zone for penalties. I think if you are 13 metres away from the kickout, you are good to go. Mind you, if they are inside a semi circle that starts on the 20, for a kickout in the middle of the 13, they'd be getting close enough to that distance if they were much inside the radius of the semi circle.
As long as you are outside it when the ball is kicked, there's nothing to stop you running in and collecting it nearer the keeper!
Quote from: AZOffaly on September 13, 2012, 01:02:04 PM
Quote from: Fuzzman on September 12, 2012, 03:20:49 PM
Me and the lads around me also noticed how often Cork were collecting possession inside the small semi circle outside the box.
I thought the rule was that for kickouts after a score you had to be outside that circle to receive the ball. Is that wrong?
I don't think so. I think the sole purpose of that box is the exclusion zone for penalties. I think if you are 13 metres away from the kickout, you are good to go. Mind you, if they are inside a semi circle that starts on the 20, for a kickout in the middle of the 13, they'd be getting close enough to that distance if they were much inside the radius of the semi circle.
I've often wondered about that exclusion zone thing.
The semi circle is 13m in radius, but the centre point it radiates from is the middle of the 20m line - ie the location of the penalty spot in hurley.
Given that the football penalty spot (or line) is 11m out, shouldn't there be a different exclusion zone, centred on that spot, for football? Or are officials worried that groundsmen wouldn't be able to draw two semi circles?
At a rough calcuation, the football penalty exclusion zone keeps players 22m from the penalty spot, whereas the rule only calls for players to be 13m away.
Hurlers on the other hand are just 13m away.