Despite team costs of €2m Dublin still manage to turn a surplus of €92k, while all around them neighbouring counties lie decimated by deficits.
And yet, like Oliver Twist, they think they should have some more.
I must be missing something. ???
Quote from: fearglasmor on December 13, 2011, 06:12:10 PM
Despite team costs of €2m Dublin still manage to turn a surplus of €92k, while all around them neighbouring counties lie decimated by deficits.
And yet, like Oliver Twist, they think they should have some more.
I must be missing something. ???
So good management of finances, vigorously pursuing sponsorship and putting firm plans in place to increase the playing numbers of the GAA (Which is one of our core principles) is now a flaw not a virture?
Good lord.
Hardly a flaw Heffo, but you don't need provincial status and a ball of extra money.
As your accounts shows.
Spread the wealth man, and give some to the impoverished wenches in Kildare!
PS Donegal spent €600k on preparing teams. Annual surplus on county activities was €100,000.
To be fair I think Dublin are dead right to pursue every penny they can. There are plenty of areas in Dublin GAA free zones and Dublin need as much as they can get to develop and promote the games there. The rest of us need to do the same as dublin and not expect them to spark up a fag and wait around for the rest of us to catch up.
You only have to look at Waterford or Mayo to see how not to do things.
Quote from: heffo on December 13, 2011, 07:15:02 PM
Quote from: fearglasmor on December 13, 2011, 06:12:10 PM
Despite team costs of €2m Dublin still manage to turn a surplus of €92k, while all around them neighbouring counties lie decimated by deficits.
And yet, like Oliver Twist, they think they should have some more.
I must be missing something. ???
So good management of finances, vigorously pursuing sponsorship and putting firm plans in place to increase the playing numbers of the GAA (Which is one of our core principles) is now a flaw not a virture?
Good lord.
I think its great that Dublin have managed their affairs so well and it would be great if other counties could do the same. I dont even see anything wrong with Dublin pushing the blue wave agenda. Its in their self interest. But I dont think giving Dublin special status is the right way to go when they have so much more resources on their doorstep than any other county. If Dublins objective is to have the GAA (the other 31 counties) support their efforts to maximise the playing pool in its population then they have to be prepared to consider a time when they field more than one intercounty team. Maybe they should be following their county council boundaries.
Another odd statement from Costelloe was the notion that any player transferring into a Dublin club would have to declare for Dublin. A truly warped notion on how to stop players transferring into Dublin clubs. Not happy with maximising their own playing pool Costelloe wants to steal other counties resources too.
When you see the huge pick & surplus turn over it's will be incredibly difficult for others to beat the Dubs in the years ahead.
Lads the issue of being able to play football and hurling in most places on the globe is one of the most fundamental and crucial aspects of the GAA as a social association and what Costello said runs contrary to that completely.
If the problem is certain clubs with a big bag of money going recruiting, then deal with that problem specifically - don't penalise all country footballers, many of whom are just playing football in Dublin because that's where they live and work. In many of these cases these young men are in debt or working for very small wages and while travelling home for county football training is fine because they get expenses, or because there are other players in Dublin travelling too, travelling home for club games and training is not realistic. They may have hopes of transferring back home in time, when they can move their work down there or get through difficult training periods, and either way all clubs should be open to anyone who wants to train and play with them.
I'd agree with the general view that Dublin should be either a county or a province in GAA terms and they shouldn't be allowed pick the best of both worlds. Of course they have a lot of work to do on development in certain areas, but I'd imagine the point that Fearglasmor was driving at was that already, they spend three times more than some other counties on preparing county teams. Perhaps that's money that they should be earmarking for developing the game in blackspots, particularly seeing as it should cost less to run Dublin than most other counties, on a month for month basis. After all, how many of the Dublin panel have to be re-imbursed for travelling a 150 mile round trip to training?
Rather than demanding more of the GAA generally, who have to be cognisant of the fact that a lot of counties don't have the same revenue generating potential as Dublin, I think Costello would do well to realise that while of course it's admirable that they should push on as a county and drive home their success, it's not a justification for more funds from central pots - if anything it's the opposite.
Everyone seems to have missed the point here.
1. Costello's transfer bye-law proposal - the ordinary 'culchie teacher' here won't be affected - if he's living in Dublin, working in Dublin and wants to put down roots then fine let him transfer, but he has to officially 'declare' for Dublin - no problem, he's Senior not IC standard so he transfers, plays away and thats the end of that.
2. Your Conor Mortimers, Colm Parkinson's, Begley's etc who suddenly find themselves living in a city centre penthouse with a 'job' provided by their new club - this is what he's addressing - if they have to declare for Dublin then the likelyhood is they won't transfer. Some previous players who've transferred to Dublin in the past ten years have been getting paid by their county on the side, they won't be paid by Dublin and it's unlikely they'd be selected anyway. Plenty of other players playing in Dublin over the last 15 years have openly made themselves available and weren't selected.
3. Funding - playing numbers at Juvenile level are way up again - their argument is that they should be funded appropriately as they're promoting the association.
Quote from: heffo on December 14, 2011, 09:02:55 AM
Everyone seems to have missed the point here.
1. Costello's transfer bye-law proposal - the ordinary 'culchie teacher' here won't be affected - if he's living in Dublin, working in Dublin and wants to put down roots then fine let him transfer, but he has to officially 'declare' for Dublin - no problem, he's Senior not IC standard so he transfers, plays away and thats the end of that.
2. Your Conor Mortimers, Colm Parkinson's, Begley's etc who suddenly find themselves living in a city centre penthouse with a 'job' provided by their new club - this is what he's addressing - if they have to declare for Dublin then the likelyhood is they won't transfer. Some previous players who've transferred to Dublin in the past ten years have been getting paid by their county on the side, they won't be paid by Dublin and it's unlikely they'd be selected anyway. Plenty of other players playing in Dublin over the last 15 years have openly made themselves available and weren't selected.
3. Funding - playing numbers at Juvenile level are way up again - their argument is that they should be funded appropriately as they're promoting the association.
(1) Aware of that. But what about the intercounty standard player who can't afford to go home for club and county games, since they mightn't get expenses from the club? What about a good standard player but with no car? They can get lifts from other county players, but for a club they're snookered? I know these are isolated cases, but no more isolated than the case of clubs that suddenly end up with millions in the bank and decide they're going to buy a championship.
(2) I agree that runs contrary to the spirit of the association - but that's always gone hand in hand with the absence of parish rule, and to be honest, who's to say that this wouldn't continue even if players had to declare for Dublin? You argue that players wouldn't transfer if that was the case - some mightn't, but many more still would. Would that make it better, or make it worse?
(3) It's great that underage numbers are up, but that's an issue for clubs. I can't see how an increase in under 12 players at Ballyboden or Raheny costs any more to the Dublin county board? Anyway, my point stands - in 2009 Offaly spent €435,000 on county teams, and €418,000 in 2010, and we have the same amount of county teams as Dublin. I don't have the 2011 number to hand but our overall balances were about the same so I presume it would be under half a million, and that's giving both codes equal preference. Dublin spent €2m on team costs, so if there are juveniles being neglected because Dublin choose to spend four times as much as other counties on their intercounty sides, then I would suggest that's your problem and the last thing that should be done is that there should be even more money thrown at the problem.
Quote from: heffo on December 14, 2011, 10:26:18 AM
Specifically how would they do that aside from bringing in a bye-law such as this?
Increase the burden of reporting on clubs' finances to make it even more difficult to get away with making cash payments.
Enforce a version of parish rule where clubs can only pick from designated areas.
Create a rule where if a club has X% of members from outside Dublin, then they can only have X% of players from outside Dublin on their senior team. That way you don't penalise clubs who have a lot of country members, but who have them at all levels and didn't recruit them.
There's a lot of ways to tackle a problem fairly if you put a little thought into it, rather than come in swinging with a sledgehammer.
Quote from: Lone Shark on December 14, 2011, 10:35:44 AM
Quote from: heffo on December 14, 2011, 10:26:18 AM
Specifically how would they do that aside from bringing in a bye-law such as this?
Increase the burden of reporting on clubs' finances to make it even more difficult to get away with making cash payments.
Enforce a version of parish rule where clubs can only pick from designated areas.
Create a rule where if a club has X% of members from outside Dublin, then they can only have X% of players from outside Dublin on their senior team. That way you don't penalise clubs who have a lot of country members, but who have them at all levels and didn't recruit them.
There's a lot of ways to tackle a problem fairly if you put a little thought into it, rather than come in swinging with a sledgehammer.
1. If Mick O'Dwyer can get a tax clearance cert, then how would they find the needle in the haystack? How would pay for this extra burden? It's hard enough to find club officers for a medium/big clubs?
2. There is a reason there is no parish rule in Dublin - it's unworkable - what about the 3 radius in Dublin 3 where you have 10/12 clubs picking from same schools and area?
3. That won't tackle the problem - some clubs have a link/connection with country clubs and have long had 'outsiders' playing for them who wouldn't be of a Senior county standard - they 'declare' for Dublin but wouldn't be within an asses roar of the team - so no issue there. Putting a quote of say 3 senior players doesn't stop you brining in 3 top-class IC players.
Quote from: Lone Shark on December 14, 2011, 10:27:14 AM
Quote from: heffo on December 14, 2011, 09:02:55 AM
Everyone seems to have missed the point here.
1. Costello's transfer bye-law proposal - the ordinary 'culchie teacher' here won't be affected - if he's living in Dublin, working in Dublin and wants to put down roots then fine let him transfer, but he has to officially 'declare' for Dublin - no problem, he's Senior not IC standard so he transfers, plays away and thats the end of that.
2. Your Conor Mortimers, Colm Parkinson's, Begley's etc who suddenly find themselves living in a city centre penthouse with a 'job' provided by their new club - this is what he's addressing - if they have to declare for Dublin then the likelyhood is they won't transfer. Some previous players who've transferred to Dublin in the past ten years have been getting paid by their county on the side, they won't be paid by Dublin and it's unlikely they'd be selected anyway. Plenty of other players playing in Dublin over the last 15 years have openly made themselves available and weren't selected.
3. Funding - playing numbers at Juvenile level are way up again - their argument is that they should be funded appropriately as they're promoting the association.
(1) Aware of that. But what about the intercounty standard player who can't afford to go home for club and county games, since they mightn't get expenses from the club? What about a good standard player but with no car? They can get lifts from other county players, but for a club they're snookered? I know these are isolated cases, but no more isolated than the case of clubs that suddenly end up with millions in the bank and decide they're going to buy a championship.
(2) I agree that runs contrary to the spirit of the association - but that's always gone hand in hand with the absence of parish rule, and to be honest, who's to say that this wouldn't continue even if players had to declare for Dublin? You argue that players wouldn't transfer if that was the case - some mightn't, but many more still would. Would that make it better, or make it worse?
(3) It's great that underage numbers are up, but that's an issue for clubs. I can't see how an increase in under 12 players at Ballyboden or Raheny costs any more to the Dublin county board? Anyway, my point stands - in 2009 Offaly spent €435,000 on county teams, and €418,000 in 2010, and we have the same amount of county teams as Dublin. I don't have the 2011 number to hand but our overall balances were about the same so I presume it would be under half a million, and that's giving both codes equal preference. Dublin spent €2m on team costs, so if there are juveniles being neglected because Dublin choose to spend four times as much as other counties on their intercounty sides, then I would suggest that's your problem and the last thing that should be done is that there should be even more money thrown at the problem.
An excellent point and well put!! It basically sums up why Dublin should not be deisgnated a province as it will effectively render Dublin a proffessional team.
As has been said, if Dublin are willing to become their own 'provincial board' then let them create 2/3 County teams. Having said that it's taken them 15 years to win the AI with just one team so I can't see the DCB going for this particular notion!
(1) Because if intercounty teams are paying managers, it's usually through benefactors putting them on the payroll. The problem here appears to be one club paying fortunes from their own bank account. That should be traceable. Anyway, it doesn't affect the core problem that if a club wants to buy players, forcing them to transfer to Dublin will simply end up with just that - a few less players transferring up, but a lot more Dublin based players giving up on their home county. Who does that help? And I say this from a county that has no hurlers in Dublin and two football panellists in Sylvesters, neither of whom would be likely to start a championship match.
(2) It doesn't have to be done by parish - just clearly define catchment areas. If 10/12 clubs have always picked from the same area, then allow that to continue. The point is that it will stop somebody living in Lucan from transferring to Kilmacud.
(3) What I'm suggesting there, and it was a top of the head thing so could probably be worked to suit, would take that into account. If your club membership includes 20% country, then your senior team could field up to 5 country players. If your club membership is 10% country, you can field 3 at senior level. That way you don't penalise clubs who have a lot of country members but do so because of links and connections, because they'll have plenty of country lads playing for their junior Z team as well. You only penalise the club that recruits senior standard lads only.
Playing membership I presume LS? And what defines 'from the country'? Moved to Dublin after you've started playing, or in school, or what? I like the idea, but as you said I think it would have to be worked through and be very black and white.
I can see clubs offering membership to auld lads in the pub to get their 'Culchie Quota' up. :D
It was a top of the head idea so the kinks would have to be worked out, but yeah, I'd imagine playing membership, and you could probably define it by "home club" as per the rules.
I know the rules would undoubtedly be twisted by some clubs, but it would be a step in the right direction anyway.
Quote from: Lone Shark on December 14, 2011, 11:28:40 AM
It was a top of the head idea so the kinks would have to be worked out, but yeah, I'd imagine playing membership, and you could probably define it by "home club" as per the rules.
I know the rules would undoubtedly be twisted by some clubs, but it would be a step in the right direction anyway.
All of this sounds like an administrative nightmare for Dublin and it's clubs. The solution proposed would work for Dublin and ultimately it's county team as it will stop/reduce the number of mercenaries playing key positions for the top clubs.
Why, when a solution proposed (which ultimately would have to be approved by central council) works for us, would we look for an alternative solution?
Quote from: heffo on December 14, 2011, 11:34:18 AM
Quote from: Lone Shark on December 14, 2011, 11:28:40 AM
It was a top of the head idea so the kinks would have to be worked out, but yeah, I'd imagine playing membership, and you could probably define it by "home club" as per the rules.
I know the rules would undoubtedly be twisted by some clubs, but it would be a step in the right direction anyway.
Why, when a solution proposed (which ultimately would have to be approved by central council) works for us, would we look for an alternative solution?
Because there's more to the GAA than just looking after your own interests, particularly when it comes to the culture of being able to move club and slot into a new community when you have to live away from home.
Quote from: Lone Shark on December 14, 2011, 11:44:15 AM
Quote from: heffo on December 14, 2011, 11:34:18 AM
Quote from: Lone Shark on December 14, 2011, 11:28:40 AM
It was a top of the head idea so the kinks would have to be worked out, but yeah, I'd imagine playing membership, and you could probably define it by "home club" as per the rules.
I know the rules would undoubtedly be twisted by some clubs, but it would be a step in the right direction anyway.
Why, when a solution proposed (which ultimately would have to be approved by central council) works for us, would we look for an alternative solution?
Because there's more to the GAA than just looking after your own interests, particularly when it comes to the culture of being able to move club and slot into a new community when you have to live away from home.
Who is looking out for Dublin's interests though?
Any county can bring a motion to Congress to change rule 6.2 this making any bye-law change in Dublin redundant.
What about the players' interests? This proposal is effectively saying that if you happen to be a decent enough county player, you'd better be able to afford to drive home to your club for training and club matches, or else you can't work in Dublin and play club football. Of course if you declare for us, you can play for whoever you like.
Quote from: AZOffaly on December 14, 2011, 11:55:21 AM
What about the players' interests? This proposal is effectively saying that if you happen to be a decent enough county player, you'd better be able to afford to drive home to your club for training and club matches, or else you can't work in Dublin and play club football. Of course if you declare for us, you can play for whoever you like.
How many players would you think are affected using the example above?
How many of those would have come in the first place if they hadn't certain carrots dangled in front of them?
Would the interests/needs of the players affected outweigh the interests/needs of the club's who developed them and were then left high and dry?
What about the reduction of the standard of the 'home' counties SFC? E.g five Laois IC footballers were playing in Dublin's SFC last year.
What about the fact that when Pat Gilroy goes to watch a championship match at the latter stages a good number of the players playing aren't available to him and are keeping good players who could develop into IC standard players, out of the team?
Quote from: heffo on December 14, 2011, 12:02:56 PM
Quote from: AZOffaly on December 14, 2011, 11:55:21 AM
What about the players' interests? This proposal is effectively saying that if you happen to be a decent enough county player, you'd better be able to afford to drive home to your club for training and club matches, or else you can't work in Dublin and play club football. Of course if you declare for us, you can play for whoever you like.
How many players would you think are affected using the example above?
How many of those would have come in the first place if they hadn't certain carrots dangled in front of them?
Would the interests/needs of the players affected outweigh the interests/needs of the club's who developed them and were then left high and dry?
What about the reduction of the standard of the 'home' counties SFC? E.g five Laois IC footballers were playing in Dublin's SFC last year.
What about the fact that when Pat Gilroy goes to watch a championship match at the latter stages a good number of the players playing aren't available to him and are keeping good players who could develop into IC standard players, out of the team?
Happened me. I went to Kerry working as a young fella. I had no car. Wanted to play club football, but was on an Offaly panel when I left. On my inter county transfer I said that I wanted to declare for Offaly, but change my club to the club in Kerry.
That meant I was able to see out the Under 21 and Senior Championship with Offaly (a quick process) while playing with the club down there. I got train tickets to Tullamore for County training and matches paid by the County Board. My club wouldn;t have been able for that.
Should I have declared for Kerry, and never got a sniff of a county game (nor actually want to play for them), or should I have just given up club football for the year?
How many players would you think are affected using the example above?
Some - but that's not the point. The point is to do what's right, and not to punish players unfairly for the transgressions of a few rich clubs.
How many of those would have come in the first place if they hadn't certain carrots dangled in front of them?
We'll never know - but yet you're opposing every possible suggestion in terms of removing the carrots, instead coming at it from another angle, saying that it's okay to come up to Dublin, as long as you refuse to play for your home county. If Costello said he wanted to ban transfers into Dublin clubs, he'd be just as wrong, but at least then you'd know it wasn't about recruiting players for Dublin.
Would the interests/needs of the players affected outweigh the interests/needs of the club's who developed them and were then left high and dry?
Of course that's a problem, but how is their home club any better off if the player declares for Dublin as opposed to their home county? If they can't afford to travel home, then they can't afford to travel home. Every rural club in Ireland is well used to losing players - that's just how it goes, and always will.
What about the reduction of the standard of the 'home' counties SFC? E.g five Laois IC footballers were playing in Dublin's SFC last year.
Again, that's a problem, but not one that's addressed by this measure. If a player is transferring for the money, they will do so anyway, they obviously need the money really badly or wouldn't be doing it, or else they've no loyalty - either way their home club and home championship is going to lose out one way or another. All this measure does is ensure that players taking the money from Dublin clubs stop playing for their county and in some cases, become available to Pat Gilroy for selection.
What about the fact that when Pat Gilroy goes to watch a championship match at the latter stages a good number of the players playing aren't available to him and are keeping good players who could develop into IC standard players, out of the team?
I'd say Pat Gilroy is quite happy to know that his players are operating at a high standard. There are over thirty senior teams in Dublin - that's plenty of players to pick from, and I find it hard to believe that if you're close enough to county standard, then you have to be able to get into your club team. Even Parnells last year would have had 8/9 native Dubs in their starting lineup. You can't tell me that there are a dozen players in the club capable of playing intercounty, or even developing that way?
Even if we take this move at face value and say that it is about protecting the Dublin SFC and not about recruiting lads to play for Dublin, it's still completely the wrong way to go about doing this. The players transferring for all the wrong reasons would do so anyway, and only the players transferring for the right reasons would be impacted.
I think that's it in a nutshell
Quote
Even if we take this move at face value and say that it is about protecting the Dublin SFC and not about recruiting lads to play for Dublin, it's still completely the wrong way to go about doing this. The players transferring for all the wrong reasons would do so anyway, and only the players transferring for the right reasons would be impacted.
I think Dublin are trying to solve the wrong problem here, or at least solve it in the wrong way. If the real issue is that too many clubs are fielding non-Dubs, then put a cap on it. Simples.
This proposal looks like 'If the Clubs are going to play them, then we want them for Dublin'.
I know what you are saying about the home clubs and the home counties, but as LS says, they are going to be affected anyway. If I can't get home for matches or training, then it matters little who I am playing for. I'm not playing for my home club or in my home championship. To make me declare for Dublin or stop playing club altogether is not a solution, it's just compounding the matter by making it even worse for the player affected.
Quote from: screenexile on December 14, 2011, 10:56:32 AM
Quote from: Lone Shark on December 14, 2011, 10:27:14 AM
Quote from: heffo on December 14, 2011, 09:02:55 AM
Everyone seems to have missed the point here.
1. Costello's transfer bye-law proposal - the ordinary 'culchie teacher' here won't be affected - if he's living in Dublin, working in Dublin and wants to put down roots then fine let him transfer, but he has to officially 'declare' for Dublin - no problem, he's Senior not IC standard so he transfers, plays away and thats the end of that.
2. Your Conor Mortimers, Colm Parkinson's, Begley's etc who suddenly find themselves living in a city centre penthouse with a 'job' provided by their new club - this is what he's addressing - if they have to declare for Dublin then the likelyhood is they won't transfer. Some previous players who've transferred to Dublin in the past ten years have been getting paid by their county on the side, they won't be paid by Dublin and it's unlikely they'd be selected anyway. Plenty of other players playing in Dublin over the last 15 years have openly made themselves available and weren't selected.
3. Funding - playing numbers at Juvenile level are way up again - their argument is that they should be funded appropriately as they're promoting the association.
(1) Aware of that. But what about the intercounty standard player who can't afford to go home for club and county games, since they mightn't get expenses from the club? What about a good standard player but with no car? They can get lifts from other county players, but for a club they're snookered? I know these are isolated cases, but no more isolated than the case of clubs that suddenly end up with millions in the bank and decide they're going to buy a championship.
(2) I agree that runs contrary to the spirit of the association - but that's always gone hand in hand with the absence of parish rule, and to be honest, who's to say that this wouldn't continue even if players had to declare for Dublin? You argue that players wouldn't transfer if that was the case - some mightn't, but many more still would. Would that make it better, or make it worse?
(3) It's great that underage numbers are up, but that's an issue for clubs. I can't see how an increase in under 12 players at Ballyboden or Raheny costs any more to the Dublin county board? Anyway, my point stands - in 2009 Offaly spent €435,000 on county teams, and €418,000 in 2010, and we have the same amount of county teams as Dublin. I don't have the 2011 number to hand but our overall balances were about the same so I presume it would be under half a million, and that's giving both codes equal preference. Dublin spent €2m on team costs, so if there are juveniles being neglected because Dublin choose to spend four times as much as other counties on their intercounty sides, then I would suggest that's your problem and the last thing that should be done is that there should be even more money thrown at the problem.
An excellent point and well put!! It basically sums up why Dublin should not be deisgnated a province as it will effectively render Dublin a proffessional team.
As has been said, if Dublin are willing to become their own 'provincial board' then let them create 2/3 County teams. Having said that it's taken them 15 years to win the AI with just one team so I can't see the DCB going for this particular notion!
We're not talking about provincial status. I know you're slow on the uptake generally.
Quote from: AZOffaly on December 14, 2011, 12:25:56 PM
I think that's it in a nutshell
Quote
Even if we take this move at face value and say that it is about protecting the Dublin SFC and not about recruiting lads to play for Dublin, it's still completely the wrong way to go about doing this. The players transferring for all the wrong reasons would do so anyway, and only the players transferring for the right reasons would be impacted.
I think Dublin are trying to solve the wrong problem here, or at least solve it in the wrong way. If the real issue is that too many clubs are fielding non-Dubs, then put a cap on it. Simples.
This proposal looks like 'If the Clubs are going to play them, then we want them for Dublin'.
I know what you are saying about the home clubs and the home counties, but as LS says, they are going to be affected anyway. If I can't get home for matches or training, then it matters little who I am playing for. I'm not playing for my home club or in my home championship. To make me declare for Dublin or stop playing club altogether is not a solution, it's just compounding the matter by making it even worse for the player affected.
Its pointless trying to explain to posters here what goes on in Dublin club football because we cant post the half of it. This is a Dublin based problem and we will be solving it looking at our own interests. Nobody likes Dublin anyway so I'm quite happy for Dublin to look after its own interests instead of trying to solve everybody's else's.
The ordinary country player wont be affected. I think if myself and Heffo put that in neon lights at the op of the thread with Scarlett Johnasson naked- some of the posters here still wouldnt get the point.
How many country players coming to dublin would be good enough for the current Al-Ireland Champions? About 2%. You're talking about 20 players this will affect- 99% of this 20 are getting paid, apartments, cars etc. So some people here want us not to bring in a rule to satisfy a bunch of free-loaders. There sole reason for coming to dublin is for compensation. And people want us to feel sorry for them :D
My advice would be- have a day off. This is a local Dublin problem. And it will be solved locally. Our senior club game is destroyed by these type of transfers. And we're going to put an end to it.
I understand everything you've said there Indy, so why not just say that no club can play more than 2 non - Dubs? That way there's no point in clubs 'harvesting' from the culchies, and if you are a player looking for a club up there, you're more likely to go to a lesser club. If players want to declare for Dublin to become a 'Dub' then they'll do that under this proposal anyway.
I just can't understand why you would make players like me 20 years ago give up playing with my county to get club games where I work.
Quote from: AZOffaly on December 14, 2011, 04:22:46 PM
I understand everything you've said there Indy, so why not just say that no club can play more than 2 non - Dubs?
That would then prevent the majority of players who are genuine and just want to play the game where they're living from doing so - it would affect the average player far more than the mercenaries who the proposed bye-law is aimed at.
Not at all, because those guys can declare for Dublin, just as you are suggesting. In my proposal, at least I could play with Offaly and find a club that had a free culchie slot.
Quote from: AZOffaly on December 14, 2011, 04:22:46 PM
I understand everything you've said there Indy, so why not just say that no club can play more than 2 non - Dubs? That way there's no point in clubs 'harvesting' from the culchies, and if you are a player looking for a club up there, you're more likely to go to a lesser club. If players want to declare for Dublin to become a 'Dub' then they'll do that under this proposal anyway.
I just can't understand why you would make players like me 20 years ago give up playing with my county to get club games where I work.
Because it could contravene the GAA club transfer rule AZ. The only way we can solve this is through bye-law. Limiting the number of non-dubs on team could be deemed to be in contravention of the GAA rule book. The general opinion on this Costello proposed bye-law is that it wont.
These transfers are a cancer on our club scene up here. people are making a mountain out of a molehill on this. the only players this will effect are those leeching off the system. County players from leitrim, longford etc except in exceptionally rare cases would have no chance of making the dublin team in my view.
Lads like Donie Shine and Michael Murphy who are going to college in dublin wouldn't dream of giving up their inter county status with their respective counties. The only ones who would consider it are the leeches and freeloaders.
Quote from: INDIANA on December 14, 2011, 04:32:00 PM
Quote from: AZOffaly on December 14, 2011, 04:22:46 PM
I understand everything you've said there Indy, so why not just say that no club can play more than 2 non - Dubs? That way there's no point in clubs 'harvesting' from the culchies, and if you are a player looking for a club up there, you're more likely to go to a lesser club. If players want to declare for Dublin to become a 'Dub' then they'll do that under this proposal anyway.
I just can't understand why you would make players like me 20 years ago give up playing with my county to get club games where I work.
Because it could contravene the GAA club transfer rule AZ. The only way we can solve this is through bye-law. Limiting the number of non-dubs on team could be deemed to be in contravention of the GAA rule book. The general opinion on this Costello proposed bye-law is that it wont.
These transfers are a cancer on our club scene up here. people are making a mountain out of a molehill on this. the only players this will effect are those leeching off the system. County players from leitrim, longford etc except in exceptionally rare cases would have no chance of making the dublin team in my view.
Lads like Donie Shine and Michael Murphy who are going to college in dublin wouldn't dream of giving up their inter county status with their respective counties. The only ones who would consider it are the leeches and freeloaders.
Can you look at my example and tell me am I a freeloader or a leecher? :D I think there are potentially a few lads who might be able to make smaller county panels (Wexford, Carlow, Wicklow, Louth, Westmeath etc etc) that wouldn't even be on your radar in terms of the big name, big money guys. These fellas might be genuinely looking to play club ball near where they live and work, but while they are good enough for Offaly, they wouldn't be within an asses roar of the Dublin team. This proposal is essentially barring them from playing county football, unless they somehow try to maintain with their home clubs, which might not be possible for a lot of them, especially younger lads.
Plus lads any player in full time education won't be eligible for an IC transfer anyway so they'll line out for their college and continue to play for their home club.
That's fair enough heffo. And correct. But I'd say they are not the root of the problem anyway. The issue is obviously certain people joining clubs because they get inducements to do so. But I cannot see how forcing EVERYBODY who wishes to join a club up there to renounce their affiliation to their home counties is anything other than using a sledgehammer to crack a nut.
It will stop a few of these transfers, no doubt about it, but I'd say it's more likely to prevent at least as many young lads from the country getting a chance to play with their home counties.
Quote from: INDIANA on December 14, 2011, 04:09:59 PM
Quote from: screenexile on December 14, 2011, 10:56:32 AM
Quote from: Lone Shark on December 14, 2011, 10:27:14 AM
Quote from: heffo on December 14, 2011, 09:02:55 AM
Everyone seems to have missed the point here.
1. Costello's transfer bye-law proposal - the ordinary 'culchie teacher' here won't be affected - if he's living in Dublin, working in Dublin and wants to put down roots then fine let him transfer, but he has to officially 'declare' for Dublin - no problem, he's Senior not IC standard so he transfers, plays away and thats the end of that.
2. Your Conor Mortimers, Colm Parkinson's, Begley's etc who suddenly find themselves living in a city centre penthouse with a 'job' provided by their new club - this is what he's addressing - if they have to declare for Dublin then the likelyhood is they won't transfer. Some previous players who've transferred to Dublin in the past ten years have been getting paid by their county on the side, they won't be paid by Dublin and it's unlikely they'd be selected anyway. Plenty of other players playing in Dublin over the last 15 years have openly made themselves available and weren't selected.
3. Funding - playing numbers at Juvenile level are way up again - their argument is that they should be funded appropriately as they're promoting the association.
(1) Aware of that. But what about the intercounty standard player who can't afford to go home for club and county games, since they mightn't get expenses from the club? What about a good standard player but with no car? They can get lifts from other county players, but for a club they're snookered? I know these are isolated cases, but no more isolated than the case of clubs that suddenly end up with millions in the bank and decide they're going to buy a championship.
(2) I agree that runs contrary to the spirit of the association - but that's always gone hand in hand with the absence of parish rule, and to be honest, who's to say that this wouldn't continue even if players had to declare for Dublin? You argue that players wouldn't transfer if that was the case - some mightn't, but many more still would. Would that make it better, or make it worse?
(3) It's great that underage numbers are up, but that's an issue for clubs. I can't see how an increase in under 12 players at Ballyboden or Raheny costs any more to the Dublin county board? Anyway, my point stands - in 2009 Offaly spent €435,000 on county teams, and €418,000 in 2010, and we have the same amount of county teams as Dublin. I don't have the 2011 number to hand but our overall balances were about the same so I presume it would be under half a million, and that's giving both codes equal preference. Dublin spent €2m on team costs, so if there are juveniles being neglected because Dublin choose to spend four times as much as other counties on their intercounty sides, then I would suggest that's your problem and the last thing that should be done is that there should be even more money thrown at the problem.
An excellent point and well put!! It basically sums up why Dublin should not be deisgnated a province as it will effectively render Dublin a proffessional team.
As has been said, if Dublin are willing to become their own 'provincial board' then let them create 2/3 County teams. Having said that it's taken them 15 years to win the AI with just one team so I can't see the DCB going for this particular notion!
We're not talking about provincial status. I know you're slow on the uptake generally.
I never mentioned the word provincial. I was merely nipping this thing in the bud about Dublin supposedly needing more funding. No team that spends €2m on teams needs more funding, if anything they need less.
And the reason for making it personal?
Quote from: INDIANA on December 14, 2011, 04:32:00 PM
These transfers are a cancer on our club scene up here. people are making a mountain out of a molehill on this. the only players this will effect are those leeching off the system. County players from leitrim, longford etc except in exceptionally rare cases would have no chance of making the dublin team in my view.
Lads like Donie Shine and Michael Murphy who are going to college in dublin wouldn't dream of giving up their inter county status with their respective counties. The only ones who would consider it are the leeches and freeloaders.
I won't lie, I'm a little bit put out by the "ye're not from Dublin, so ye don't understand" bit - I did live and play in Dublin for years, albeit at Junior 7 and Junior 9 level respectively, so a long way from the big money transfer lads.
However, what I'm not getting is that this measure will actually cut out the genuine guys, and the leeches as you put it will be the ones unaffected. If I'm the type who will take money for playing and will leave my own club in the lurch, I'm hardly going to draw the line at leaving my county in the lurch either. On the other hand, if I'm a young footballer with little or no income and no means of transport, this very definitely impacts on me.
And that's hugely demeaning what you said about Longford and Leitrim - it's correct that some of them wouldn't make the Dublin team, however why should they then be forced to stop playing for Longford and Leitrim? All this rule does is stops them from playing county, or else deprives them of club football. Nobody wins.
If the problem is leeches with no loyalty following the money, then how in God's name is a rule like this supposed to help?
I note that in all this, nobody is attaching any blame where it really lies - the clubs that are offering the money. The general view there seems to be that doing anything about that is too hard, so we'll just legislate badly in a means to hopefully cut down the flow a little bit.
Quote from: Lone Shark on December 14, 2011, 05:19:20 PM
Quote from: INDIANA on December 14, 2011, 04:32:00 PM
These transfers are a cancer on our club scene up here. people are making a mountain out of a molehill on this. the only players this will effect are those leeching off the system. County players from leitrim, longford etc except in exceptionally rare cases would have no chance of making the dublin team in my view.
Lads like Donie Shine and Michael Murphy who are going to college in dublin wouldn't dream of giving up their inter county status with their respective counties. The only ones who would consider it are the leeches and freeloaders.
I won't lie, I'm a little bit put out by the "ye're not from Dublin, so ye don't understand" bit - I did live and play in Dublin for years, albeit at Junior 7 and Junior 9 level respectively, so a long way from the big money transfer lads.
However, what I'm not getting is that this measure will actually cut out the genuine guys, and the leeches as you put it will be the ones unaffected. If I'm the type who will take money for playing and will leave my own club in the lurch, I'm hardly going to draw the line at leaving my county in the lurch either. On the other hand, if I'm a young footballer with little or no income and no means of transport, this very definitely impacts on me.
And that's hugely demeaning what you said about Longford and Leitrim - it's correct that some of them wouldn't make the Dublin team, however why should they then be forced to stop playing for Longford and Leitrim? All this rule does is stops them from playing county, or else deprives them of club football. Nobody wins.
If the problem is leeches with no loyalty following the money, then how in God's name is a rule like this supposed to help?
I note that in all this, nobody is attaching any blame where it really lies - the clubs that are offering the money. The general view there seems to be that doing anything about that is too hard, so we'll just legislate badly in a means to hopefully cut down the flow a little bit.
There is nothing demeaning about the reality. Most players from small counties wouldn't be good enough to play for Dublin. With all due respect I wouldn't be known as one to champagne dublin as the leading football county in ireland. Quite the opposite.
Secondly the DCB have no powers to legislate the clubs when the GAA wont legislate on under the counter payments to county managers. At least we know in Dublin neither of our county managers are getting paid. Can your county say the same?
Thirdly in the abscence of any leadership from the GAA hierachy -Dublin has to look after itself and the best way to do this is to hit these players by ensuring they cannot play county football. Their profile goes down and they wont be half as attractive for these clubs who just love having big name inter county players on their books.
And lastly I was referring to screenexile not you on the previous posts.
Quote from: AZOffaly on December 14, 2011, 04:36:02 PM
Quote from: INDIANA on December 14, 2011, 04:32:00 PM
Quote from: AZOffaly on December 14, 2011, 04:22:46 PM
I understand everything you've said there Indy, so why not just say that no club can play more than 2 non - Dubs? That way there's no point in clubs 'harvesting' from the culchies, and if you are a player looking for a club up there, you're more likely to go to a lesser club. If players want to declare for Dublin to become a 'Dub' then they'll do that under this proposal anyway.
I just can't understand why you would make players like me 20 years ago give up playing with my county to get club games where I work.
Because it could contravene the GAA club transfer rule AZ. The only way we can solve this is through bye-law. Limiting the number of non-dubs on team could be deemed to be in contravention of the GAA rule book. The general opinion on this Costello proposed bye-law is that it wont.
These transfers are a cancer on our club scene up here. people are making a mountain out of a molehill on this. the only players this will effect are those leeching off the system. County players from leitrim, longford etc except in exceptionally rare cases would have no chance of making the dublin team in my view.
Lads like Donie Shine and Michael Murphy who are going to college in dublin wouldn't dream of giving up their inter county status with their respective counties. The only ones who would consider it are the leeches and freeloaders.
Can you look at my example and tell me am I a freeloader or a leecher? :D I think there are potentially a few lads who might be able to make smaller county panels (Wexford, Carlow, Wicklow, Louth, Westmeath etc etc) that wouldn't even be on your radar in terms of the big name, big money guys. These fellas might be genuinely looking to play club ball near where they live and work, but while they are good enough for Offaly, they wouldn't be within an asses roar of the Dublin team. This proposal is essentially barring them from playing county football, unless they somehow try to maintain with their home clubs, which might not be possible for a lot of them, especially younger lads.
You're talking about 10 players max AZ. We cant not legislate just to look after 10 non-Dubs.
There is no solution to this that will appease everyone.
The majority of country players will be un-affected by this and the majority in most things holds sway.
The only alternative is a draft system whereby the weakest senior club in the locality gets first call on the player. Most country players I've spoken to would baulk at this. Even though to me it seems the fairest solution. They cite freedom of movement and all this other bullshit. This is not soccer and the Bosman ruling.
Quote from: INDIANA on December 14, 2011, 05:33:15 PM
Quote from: Lone Shark on December 14, 2011, 05:19:20 PM
Quote from: INDIANA on December 14, 2011, 04:32:00 PM
These transfers are a cancer on our club scene up here. people are making a mountain out of a molehill on this. the only players this will effect are those leeching off the system. County players from leitrim, longford etc except in exceptionally rare cases would have no chance of making the dublin team in my view.
Lads like Donie Shine and Michael Murphy who are going to college in dublin wouldn't dream of giving up their inter county status with their respective counties. The only ones who would consider it are the leeches and freeloaders.
I won't lie, I'm a little bit put out by the "ye're not from Dublin, so ye don't understand" bit - I did live and play in Dublin for years, albeit at Junior 7 and Junior 9 level respectively, so a long way from the big money transfer lads.
However, what I'm not getting is that this measure will actually cut out the genuine guys, and the leeches as you put it will be the ones unaffected. If I'm the type who will take money for playing and will leave my own club in the lurch, I'm hardly going to draw the line at leaving my county in the lurch either. On the other hand, if I'm a young footballer with little or no income and no means of transport, this very definitely impacts on me.
And that's hugely demeaning what you said about Longford and Leitrim - it's correct that some of them wouldn't make the Dublin team, however why should they then be forced to stop playing for Longford and Leitrim? All this rule does is stops them from playing county, or else deprives them of club football. Nobody wins.
If the problem is leeches with no loyalty following the money, then how in God's name is a rule like this supposed to help?
I note that in all this, nobody is attaching any blame where it really lies - the clubs that are offering the money. The general view there seems to be that doing anything about that is too hard, so we'll just legislate badly in a means to hopefully cut down the flow a little bit.
There is nothing demeaning about the reality. Most players from small counties wouldn't be good enough to play for Dublin. With all due respect I wouldn't be known as one to champagne dublin as the leading football county in ireland. Quite the opposite.
Secondly the DCB have no powers to legislate the clubs when the GAA wont legislate on under the counter payments to county managers. At least we know in Dublin neither of our county managers are getting paid. Can your county say the same?
Thirdly in the abscence of any leadership from the GAA hierachy -Dublin has to look after itself and the best way to do this is to hit these players by ensuring they cannot play county football. Their profile goes down and they wont be half as attractive for these clubs who just love having big name inter county players on their books.
And lastly I was referring to screenexile not you on the previous posts.
Lol good man Indiana so much for ignoring me in future . . . the OP refers to 'the blue wave' and about Dublin looking for more money. The point of LS's that I highlighted and agreed with was the fact that Dublin are looking for more money. Dublin's plan for getting more money?? Provincial status! But don't let the facts get in the way of giving me a slagging.
Other than that I agree with the sentiments here. Ordinary lads shouldn't be getting punished for playing a bit of ball for their own County whilst living in Dublin. I played in Dublin but never declared for them (not that I would have got a look in for either). The year before I came McNulty was employed by the Club as a coaching officer yet never played a game other than Championship (4 in total I think). I know there are countless other examples but it's just ridiculous imo and needs stamped out. There has to be a way to spread outside players among all clubs fairly rather than the current system.
I miss when Kerry used to win All-Irelands and wanted to break away with England and the All-Blacks.
Quote from: screenexile on December 14, 2011, 06:58:56 PM
Quote from: INDIANA on December 14, 2011, 05:33:15 PM
Quote from: Lone Shark on December 14, 2011, 05:19:20 PM
Quote from: INDIANA on December 14, 2011, 04:32:00 PM
These transfers are a cancer on our club scene up here. people are making a mountain out of a molehill on this. the only players this will effect are those leeching off the system. County players from leitrim, longford etc except in exceptionally rare cases would have no chance of making the dublin team in my view.
Lads like Donie Shine and Michael Murphy who are going to college in dublin wouldn't dream of giving up their inter county status with their respective counties. The only ones who would consider it are the leeches and freeloaders.
I won't lie, I'm a little bit put out by the "ye're not from Dublin, so ye don't understand" bit - I did live and play in Dublin for years, albeit at Junior 7 and Junior 9 level respectively, so a long way from the big money transfer lads.
However, what I'm not getting is that this measure will actually cut out the genuine guys, and the leeches as you put it will be the ones unaffected. If I'm the type who will take money for playing and will leave my own club in the lurch, I'm hardly going to draw the line at leaving my county in the lurch either. On the other hand, if I'm a young footballer with little or no income and no means of transport, this very definitely impacts on me.
And that's hugely demeaning what you said about Longford and Leitrim - it's correct that some of them wouldn't make the Dublin team, however why should they then be forced to stop playing for Longford and Leitrim? All this rule does is stops them from playing county, or else deprives them of club football. Nobody wins.
If the problem is leeches with no loyalty following the money, then how in God's name is a rule like this supposed to help?
I note that in all this, nobody is attaching any blame where it really lies - the clubs that are offering the money. The general view there seems to be that doing anything about that is too hard, so we'll just legislate badly in a means to hopefully cut down the flow a little bit.
There is nothing demeaning about the reality. Most players from small counties wouldn't be good enough to play for Dublin. With all due respect I wouldn't be known as one to champagne dublin as the leading football county in ireland. Quite the opposite.
Secondly the DCB have no powers to legislate the clubs when the GAA wont legislate on under the counter payments to county managers. At least we know in Dublin neither of our county managers are getting paid. Can your county say the same?
Thirdly in the abscence of any leadership from the GAA hierachy -Dublin has to look after itself and the best way to do this is to hit these players by ensuring they cannot play county football. Their profile goes down and they wont be half as attractive for these clubs who just love having big name inter county players on their books.
And lastly I was referring to screenexile not you on the previous posts.
Lol good man Indiana so much for ignoring me in future . . . the OP refers to 'the blue wave' and about Dublin looking for more money. The point of LS's that I highlighted and agreed with was the fact that Dublin are looking for more money. Dublin's plan for getting more money?? Provincial status! But don't let the facts get in the way of giving me a slagging.
Other than that I agree with the sentiments here. Ordinary lads shouldn't be getting punished for playing a bit of ball for their own County whilst living in Dublin. I played in Dublin but never declared for them (not that I would have got a look in for either). The year before I came McNulty was employed by the Club as a coaching officer yet never played a game other than Championship (4 in total I think). I know there are countless other examples but it's just ridiculous imo and needs stamped out. There has to be a way to spread outside players among all clubs fairly rather than the current system.
There isnt a better way because the rule-book would have to change. Unless the rule-book is going to accomodate Dublin being the capital city- which it appears its not. On that basis we have to look after ourselves. And be under no illusions this will be sorted out one way or another.
Ah come on now. I'm sure that this all sounds great in your head - particularly in the current dub phase - but in reality nothing can or will be done
Quote from: DuffleKing on December 15, 2011, 07:31:03 AM
In reality nothing can or will be done
Not true.
Dublin can bring in a bye-law.
All the moaning Chairmen of clubs from Laois etc who keep complaining that 'Dublin have to do something about this' can bring a motion to congress.
I'd be surprised if the Dublin CB would be allowed to dictate what county any player is elligible for. In any case it sounds to me like a statement designed to draw attention to a problem rather than be a real solution.
I'm not up to speed on Dublin GAA these days but when I was playing in the 80's/90's I played against lads like Kevin Kilmurray (Offaly), Benny Gaughran (Louth) with Civil Service, Brian Talty (Galway) with Parnells and i'm sure more i cant remember now ( Garda would have been full of country lads) who lived and worked in Dublin and it would be rediculous to think that these or their modern day equivalents would have to either declare for Dublin, play club football in their home county or give up football altogether under such a rule.
Quote from: fearglasmor on December 15, 2011, 01:55:52 PM
I'd be surprised if the Dublin CB would be allowed to dictate what county any player is elligible for. In any case it sounds to me like a statement designed to draw attention to a problem rather than be a real solution.
I'm not up to speed on Dublin GAA these days but when I was playing in the 80's/90's I played against lads like Kevin Kilmurray (Offaly), Benny Gaughran (Louth) with Civil Service, Brian Talty (Galway) with Parnells and i'm sure more i cant remember now ( Garda would have been full of country lads) who lived and worked in Dublin and it would be rediculous to think that these or their modern day equivalents would have to either declare for Dublin, play club football in their home county or give up football altogether under such a rule.
Civil Service are now Div 6, Garda are Div 5 and well the less said about Parnells the better, so there aren't too many IC players playing for the former two.
Quote from: heffo on December 15, 2011, 03:45:59 PM
Quote from: fearglasmor on December 15, 2011, 01:55:52 PM
I'd be surprised if the Dublin CB would be allowed to dictate what county any player is elligible for. In any case it sounds to me like a statement designed to draw attention to a problem rather than be a real solution.
I'm not up to speed on Dublin GAA these days but when I was playing in the 80's/90's I played against lads like Kevin Kilmurray (Offaly), Benny Gaughran (Louth) with Civil Service, Brian Talty (Galway) with Parnells and i'm sure more i cant remember now ( Garda would have been full of country lads) who lived and worked in Dublin and it would be rediculous to think that these or their modern day equivalents would have to either declare for Dublin, play club football in their home county or give up football altogether under such a rule.
Civil Service are now Div 6, Garda are Div 5 and well the less said about Parnells the better, so there aren't too many IC players playing for the former two.
As I said, I am not up with the current scene, but I was trying to see how the principle of the proposed rule would apply to todays equivalents of my time. Much as AZ tried to do earlier.
And what about the idea that DCB would be able to implement a bye law that controls inter county declarations ? Do you really think that is realistic ?
Quote from: fearglasmor on December 15, 2011, 04:53:46 PM
Quote from: heffo on December 15, 2011, 03:45:59 PM
Quote from: fearglasmor on December 15, 2011, 01:55:52 PM
I'd be surprised if the Dublin CB would be allowed to dictate what county any player is elligible for. In any case it sounds to me like a statement designed to draw attention to a problem rather than be a real solution.
I'm not up to speed on Dublin GAA these days but when I was playing in the 80's/90's I played against lads like Kevin Kilmurray (Offaly), Benny Gaughran (Louth) with Civil Service, Brian Talty (Galway) with Parnells and i'm sure more i cant remember now ( Garda would have been full of country lads) who lived and worked in Dublin and it would be rediculous to think that these or their modern day equivalents would have to either declare for Dublin, play club football in their home county or give up football altogether under such a rule.
Civil Service are now Div 6, Garda are Div 5 and well the less said about Parnells the better, so there aren't too many IC players playing for the former two.
As I said, I am not up with the current scene, but I was trying to see how the principle of the proposed rule would apply to todays equivalents of my time. Much as AZ tried to do earlier.
And what about the idea that DCB would be able to implement a bye law that controls inter county declarations ? Do you really think that is realistic ?
Comparing the two situations or eras is like chalk and cheese though.
I believe that this is just a kite to try and force central council to bring a rule change to 6.2 and in no way does Costello or Gilroy want any of these players to actually line out for Dublin.
Quote from: fearglasmor on December 15, 2011, 04:53:46 PM
Quote from: heffo on December 15, 2011, 03:45:59 PM
Quote from: fearglasmor on December 15, 2011, 01:55:52 PM
I'd be surprised if the Dublin CB would be allowed to dictate what county any player is elligible for. In any case it sounds to me like a statement designed to draw attention to a problem rather than be a real solution.
I'm not up to speed on Dublin GAA these days but when I was playing in the 80's/90's I played against lads like Kevin Kilmurray (Offaly), Benny Gaughran (Louth) with Civil Service, Brian Talty (Galway) with Parnells and i'm sure more i cant remember now ( Garda would have been full of country lads) who lived and worked in Dublin and it would be rediculous to think that these or their modern day equivalents would have to either declare for Dublin, play club football in their home county or give up football altogether under such a rule.
Civil Service are now Div 6, Garda are Div 5 and well the less said about Parnells the better, so there aren't too many IC players playing for the former two.
As I said, I am not up with the current scene, but I was trying to see how the principle of the proposed rule would apply to todays equivalents of my time. Much as AZ tried to do earlier.
And what about the idea that DCB would be able to implement a bye law that controls inter county declarations ? Do you really think that is realistic ?
None of these players would be selected by Dublin even if good enough. This is being looked at to specifically penalise the clubs and players who are milking the system
Quote from: INDIANA on December 16, 2011, 09:42:54 AM
Quote from: fearglasmor on December 15, 2011, 04:53:46 PM
Quote from: heffo on December 15, 2011, 03:45:59 PM
Quote from: fearglasmor on December 15, 2011, 01:55:52 PM
I'd be surprised if the Dublin CB would be allowed to dictate what county any player is elligible for. In any case it sounds to me like a statement designed to draw attention to a problem rather than be a real solution.
I'm not up to speed on Dublin GAA these days but when I was playing in the 80's/90's I played against lads like Kevin Kilmurray (Offaly), Benny Gaughran (Louth) with Civil Service, Brian Talty (Galway) with Parnells and i'm sure more i cant remember now ( Garda would have been full of country lads) who lived and worked in Dublin and it would be rediculous to think that these or their modern day equivalents would have to either declare for Dublin, play club football in their home county or give up football altogether under such a rule.
Civil Service are now Div 6, Garda are Div 5 and well the less said about Parnells the better, so there aren't too many IC players playing for the former two.
As I said, I am not up with the current scene, but I was trying to see how the principle of the proposed rule would apply to todays equivalents of my time. Much as AZ tried to do earlier.
And what about the idea that DCB would be able to implement a bye law that controls inter county declarations ? Do you really think that is realistic ?
None of these players would be selected by Dublin even if good enough. This is being looked at to specifically penalise the clubs and players who are milking the system
Indy, I think you're making my point for me. I don't think that Dublin are doing this to swell their own ranks with new players, I understand and agree with you and heffo that they are trying to protect the integrity and value of their own club championships, for both honest clubs and for the Dublin team itself, by cutting down on the 'imports', that are just there for inducements.
However, the bit in bold is my point. I'm sure there are people playing club ball in Dublin from other counties who are not high profile, are not milking the system and would never be picked by Dublin. These players may well be already part of county panels down the country at various levels, or may have aspirations of making their own county panel. Kevin Kilmurray won All Irelands with Offaly remember :)
This bye law, if brought in, would give those sort of players Hobson's Choice. Declare for Dublin, knowing you will never be picked, or esle forget about playing club ball up here.
This is the GAA silly season. The writers haver very little to go on at this time of year...the winter ban....breaking the winter ban....should there be a winter ban?......the end of the winter ban......its summer down under etc.
The gap is usually filled by any of the attention grabbing/seeking CB AGM speakers. These kites offer something for everyone, they give the hacks copy, they wind up the frustrated and they entertain the bored. So everyone is happy.
They should ban all talk of the Winter Ban.
A Winter ban ban.
'Off the Winter Ban' for December
Don't mention the winter ban in December and raise money for your club. 30 people in a squad not talking once about the winter ban, raising £100 each in sponsorship, ergo 3k for your club.
Nice gesture by the Dublin County Board to send the Chairman of the 'Blue Wave' down to Kildare as an auditor.