Cork play Tipp in two weeks, Munster Championship is just around the corner.
Should be a good game, hopefully Cork will go on to win, but Munster days out are nearly always days to remember.
Benny Dunne is the most recent casualty on the Tipp side, while Tom Kenny did in his hamstring with Grenagh today, not sure to a full extent of how bad the injury is but is now a massive doubt for the Tipp game. Which obviously will be a massive blow, bringing our injury list to Lorcan, Kenny and Cussen all out, which would mean Jerry, Niall Mac and Cadogan in. Cadogan and Niall Mac should be back for the game, but not 100% sure whether Jerry is up to playing in the mid these days, him and Naughton are pretty similar as well in one sense so we'll have to wait and see. That and having an all Newtown mid line up isn't exactly ideal either. ;)
Not the most ideal preperations but we'll have to adapt. Kenny's injury is a big blow though.
Is it not two weeks?
Is it not the 30th Reillers? I think this is a prime candidate for Tipp to be sent through the back door. They beat cork down in the park two years ago, but last year was no gimme, even with Cork's disrupted preparations. There's an assumption that Tipp will kick on from last year, but that's hard to do, and a big game like this so early in the year is far from ideal, for either team, but I think Cork have more to gain.
I reckon Cork might just have enough in the tank at home.
Tipp will win this very comfortably (by about 7/8 points). I expect this game will start to put the league, and how poor the standard was, into perspective.
Cork are a weak outfit at the moment. They haven't unearthed any real new talent as such, and the old stagers are starting to head backwards a little.
I'd also expect Tipp to have regressed from where they were last year, but they'll still be in the top 2/3 teams this year when the final shake-up comes about. They're still a handful of players short of a fully accomplished outfit in my view, but could still be well good enough for all-Ireland honours. Of course that all depends on whether Galway can put politics and internal bickering aside for a season, or whether Kilkenny are as fatigued as would appear. Tipp at their best should take Galway at their best. Not so Kilkenny, yet anyway.
But as regards the Tipp-Cork game - a comfortable win for Tipp by anything up to 10 points.
:D :D It is two weeks, next time I'll read the post before I put it down.
We almost beat them last year, argueably we should have. I think we've a few players all right that could surprise a lot of people. The injuries don't help though. Cussen's back training and Cadogan will hopefully make it.
It will be a hard one all right, but I think we can pull it out of the bag.
We hammered Galway in the Castlelyons challenge yesterday, 2-27 to 0-16, not exactly ground breaking when you look at the Galway team that played..
1. James Skehill
2. David Collins
3. Eugene McEntee
4. Pat Holland
5. Conor Dervan
6. John Lee
7. Adrian Cullinane
8. Niall Cahalan
9. Eoin Lynch
10. Aonghus Callanan
11. Kevin Hayes
12. Eanna Ryan
13. Richie Cummins
14. Joe Gantley
15. Finian Coone
16. John Grealish
17. Shane Kavanagh
18. Tony Og Regan
19. Niall Hayes
20. Niall Healy
21. Iarla Tannian
Our team was named as..
1. Donal Og Cusack - Cloyne
2. Shane O'Neill - Bishopstown
3. Eoin Dillon - Milford
4. Shane Murphy - Erin's Own
5. John Gardiner - Na Piarsaigh
6. Ronan Curran - St Finbarr's
7. Sean Og Ó hAilpín - Na Piarsaigh
8. Graham Callanan - Glen Rovers
9. William Egan - Kilbrin
10. Ben O'Connor - Newtownshandrum
11. Mark O'Sullivan - Dripsey
12. Cathal Naughton - Newtownshandrum
13. Kieran Murphy - Sarsfields (Captain)
14. Aisake Ó hAilpín - Na Piarsaigh
15. Patrick Horgan - Glen Rovers
16. Anthony Nash - Kanturk
17. Brian Murphy - Bride Rovers
18. Ray Ryan - Sarsfields
19. Lorcan McLouglin - Kanturk
20. Niall McCarthy - Carrigtwohill
21. Jerry O'Connor - Newtownshandrum
22. Paudie O'Sullivan - Cloyne
And made a boat load of changes at half time..
Nash
Shane Murphy
Dillion
B. Murphy
Ronan Curran
Ray Ryan
Shane O'Neill
Lorcan
Cathal Naugthan
Aisake
Jerry O Connor
Niall McCarthy
Fraggie Murphy
Paudie O Sullivan
Ben O Connor
Paudie scored a few when he came on, Ray Ryan played well, as did Shane Murphy. For everything that we have we still can't seem to get the long puck outs to work. Donal Og played it short in the first half, had no choice really with the wind, couldn't get near the young Dripsey lad Mark O Sullivan. It worked well from Cusack but the short game broke down in the team up the pitch. It's great when it works, but it hasn't worked in a long time, not really. And if DW makes the change which people are presuming he will, making a straight swap Jerry in for TK, we'll have a complete Newtown midfield and that could be a disaster.
I hope we play both Murphy's and push Shane O Neill up the pitch where he's more influential.
Certain hard calls have yet to be made and I'm wondering now whether he'll make them at all, I suppose only time will tell.
The selection against Tipp will be very interesting. I thought the league final showed that the way forward is not to take a step back.We started playing the way Walsh wants the team to play, direct, but when it got hard it went back to the same old, same old, pre 2006 style, which was grand when it won us games, but it's be countered and defended with ease since.
We have to resist the temptation to change course and go back to the tried and tested just for the sake of it. Especially when it gets hard.
On another note. Mr Barry Kelly is the ref for the day, which well isn't anyone's top choice, a point was made that whether Donal Og should start or not. Is he that far ahead of the rest of the other keepers to make up for the grudge match that will probably take place. Is he worth the headache?
Not saying I agree with that but it'll be interesting all right to see what happens.
I'd have thought the Aisake Ó hAilpín experiment was over but with Cussen possibly injured then Walsh has come this far with Aisake it looks like he's going to stick with him.
Aisake would needed to have been shown a huge bit of progress in handling of both hurl and ball since the NHL final to merit inclusion.
Apart from Ray Ryan is the many of the strike breakers on the current Cork panel?
I was impressed with Cussen. When was he injured and how long is he out?
Quote from: Lecale2 on May 18, 2010, 12:33:34 PM
I was impressed with Cussen. When was he injured and how long is he out?
He broke a bone in his hand, I think, in the Galway match, he was supposed to miss the Tipp game but he could make it.
Eoin Cadogan will be fit for the Tipp game. Played 30 mins against the intermediates Mon night and played well for that matter.
Very positive news.
I fancy Cork to spring a surprise in this one ( I would fancy them more if Tom Kenny was fit). Anyways too much face to be lost down leeside by the strikers if they do not pull up some trees this summer. First tree to fall will be tipp.
Tom Ryan in today's Irish Mail describing Cork's chances of AI success this year - over the top stuff as usual from Tom or just straight talking ?
"Dennis Walsh needed to show us in the league final that between the old and the new, he had knitted a team together who could do something this summer, but instead he revealed a team who have grown soft on defence and possesses all the meance of a muzzled poodle in attack."
For what my opinion is worth (sweet FA) I'm going for Cork too. The manner of defeat in last year's All Ireland would have taken the wind out of a hurricane. Cork are on the up and could catch Tipp on the way down. Either way, should be fun finding out
I think Tipp will beat them out the gate. Cork are not going anywhere this year. They were too long at the well with the same players.
<Sits back and awaits Reillers>
Tipp to win for me. Cork have too many issues within their team for me.
Sean Og creating his own siege mentality :
Seán Óg O Hailpín is determined to prove his critics wrong when Cork take on Tipperary in the Munster SHC on Sunday.
O hAilpín was substituted with 20 minutes left in the league final against Galway three weeks ago after being run ragged by Damien Hayes and commentators have since questioned whether the defender is up to the pace of the championship.
'A lot of people have me written off. They say I'm too old. My pace is gone. All of this stuff is being bandied around, O hAilpín said in the Irish Examiner.
'But if anyone knows my history, I've been written off since I was a kid, when I got "What the hell is this half-Fijian doing playing hurling?" I've been used to it for the last 20 years.
'Something like this is normal when you're Séan Óg O hAilpín.'
Despite this, he concedes that he is no longer a definite starter in Denis Walsh's side.
'Myself and the other 35 fellas won't know if we're on the team until Thursday night when Denis Walsh calls out the team so until then you just have to take it that your place is up for grabs'.'
'I can't say now that I'm definitely going to start Sunday. In years gone by I might have had myself down as a certainty on the team but after having a bad league final, I know I'm not a guarantee for next Sunday. It would be foolish for me to think I'm a certainty for the team, especially after being taken off against Galway.
He continued: 'Denis will pull out the piece of paper when we get on the pitch at 7pm next Thursday, and I just hope my name is on it. If it is, I'm going to have to repay that faith because I've no doubt that Denis is going to be under pressure if he plays me.
The defender knows that given Cork's poor recent record against Tipperary, Sunday's encounter will demand a big performance from the Rebels. But he is confident that the team have done their homework.
'Tipp might be favourites going into next week but we see it as a 50-50 ball game. What happens during the game determines whether it will go 60-40 or 70-30 one way or another, but before the ball is thrown-in it's the toss of a coin.
'Preparation has gone well. With a week to go, realistically all the work is done at this stage. The work for next Sunday started back in January. Preparation for the Tipperary game didn't start after defeat against Galway in the league final. It wasn't like we had to change things drastically. Yes, we had to tweak stuff but the groundwork and the solid foundations were put in with three solid months in January, February and March.
'The conditioning, the hurling, the power, the stamina, the analysis - that's all done.
'This week will be about keeping focused and being selfish. You have to be selfish - the most important thing this week is ourselves.'
Heading down to this. Can't wait. Unfortunately the backdoor has taken the edge of these games.
The Cork team to play Tipperary in Sunday's Munster Championship Quarter-Final at 4pm in Páirc Uí Chaoimh is as follows:
1. Donal Og Cusack (Cloyne)
2. Shane O'Neill (Bishopstown)
3. Eoin Cadogan (Douglas)
4. Brian Murphy (Bride Rovers)
5. John Gardiner (Na Piarsaigh)
6. Ronan Curran (St. Finbarr's)
7. Sean Og Ó hAilpín (Na Piarsaigh)
8. Tom Kenny (Grenagh)
9. Cathal Naughton (Newtownshandrum)
10. Ben O'Connor (Newtownshandrum)
11. Jerry O'Connor (Newtownshandrum)
12. Niall McCarthy (Carrigtwohill)
13. Kieran Murphy (Sarsfields) - Captain
14. Aisake Ó hAilpín (Na Piarsaigh)
15. Patrick Horgan (Glen Rovers)
16. Martin Coleman (Ballinhassig)
17. Shane Murphy (Erin's Own)
18. Eoin Dillon (Milford)
19. Conor O'Sullivan (Sarsfields)
20. Ray Ryan (Sarsfields)
21. Michael Walsh (Kildorrery)
22. Lorcan McLoughlin (Kanturk)
23. Michael Cussen (Sarsfields)
24. Paudie O'Sullivan (Cloyne)
25. Anthony Nash (Kanturk)
26. Mark O'Sullivan (Dripsey)
27. Tadgh Og Murphy (Sarsfields)
28. Graham Callanan (Glen Rovers)
29. Cian McCarthy (Sarsfields)
30. Luke O'Farrell (Midleton)
Eh..Looks a bit too much like the old guard, but it's pretty strong, happy with Jerry starting there though. It's the first time this season if memory serves me right, that the twins start together, and the play off eachother really well.
It's a pretty strong ream.
Would have been not too happy with Aisake starting on League form but he's played well in the challenge games, was the stand out performer in the last game, scored 3-03 or something like that, he's played well enough though, and not to mention he caused Tipp all kinds of bother before Walsh moved him in the league game.
Donal Og's starting, no big surprise there, I just hope his hold friend doesn't send him off, and hopfeully he'll give him no reason to have a go at him, wouldn't have the stomach to watch them play Tipp a man down.
If I'm honest would have much prefered Paudie Sull to start, but we'll see how it goes.
Looking at the team again I'm not fully sure that's what'll start. Thought they were delaying the announcement till Thurs to give everyone a chance to recover, last I heard TK was 50/50 at best. Still might expect a few changes to be made.
Happy with Naughton in the mid though. Love watching him cause all kinds of trouble, not a player who can match his speed, hopefully his brain will be up with the pace of his legs though.
Can't wait now. Will be there, Indy the backdoor does take the edge of the game a bit, but if there was no back door you'd be loosing teams like Tipp/Cork/Waterford extremley early on and you'd be left with a shite championship.
Irish Times today - one to bring back the memories
Matchless Tipp reclaim title
FROM THE ARCHIVE MONDAY, JULY 22nd, 1991: The 1989 Munster and All-Ireland winners Tipperary met defending champions Cork in the summer of 1991 in the provincial decider. After a enthralling draw in Cork, the sides resumed hostilities in Thurles. Here is Paddy
Downey' s report of a famous replay at Semple Stadium.
WORDS LIKE these which appear in cold print on Monday morning cannot capture the wild delirium which surged in great waves round Semple Stadium, Thurles, yesterday in the final minutes of the replayed Munster hurling final.
In those minutes the great game swayed on a razor's edge, but when referee Terence Murray blew the final whistle Cork, champions of 1990, were dethroned and the matchless men of Tipperary has regained the Munster title – their fourth victory in five years and third over Cork.
Even neutral spectators in the huge attendance (official all-ticket figure 55,000, but there must have been 60,000 tightly packed into the stadium) were dazed by the throbbing tension and the astonishing manner in which Tipperary fought back from the brink of defeat.
It was more than astonishing, if the right word could be found to describe what had seemed impossible coming up to the end of the third quarter.
Seldom if ever before has any team in any game faced such a test of character. And it was character, sheer indomitable spirit – plus other factors which we shall come to presently – that won the title for them.
Tipperary looked dead and buried when trailing by nine points in the 14th minute of the second half. Like the tall ships, Cork were sailing away with the Munster crown in the humid heat of Semple Stadium.
But the defending champions struck something resembling the Rock of Cashel. In a bewildering spell of 13 minutes, Tipperary scored 2-5 – to which Cork replied with only one point from a magnificent 50-yard sideline puck by Cathal Casey – and the home team were in front with eight minutes of normal time to go.
Tipperary held that lead for only one minute, for Cork's midfield substitute Pat Buckley, who made a big impact when he entered the game 10 minutes before half-time, levelled the scores with a lovely point off the ground – and extra time was now looming.
Tipperary's thrust at this time from John Leahy, Joe Hayes and Aidan Ryan around midfield could not be stopped, however, and when the end came after six minutes of added time (a second half of 41 minutes) the challengers were in front by four points.
Most of that extension was caused by the deplorable invasion of the pitch, twice, by exuberant Tipperary supporters who were overflowing in their hundreds inside the perimeter wall on the Killinan end of the ground.
There was nothing rowdy about these incursions, however – young people were unable to contain their joy when Pat Fox and Aidan Ryan scored crucial goals.
The standard of the hurling was not consistently as high as in the drawn game at Páirc Uí Chaoimh on July 7th. But it was good enough at least to please the most discerning critics, and in the last quarter, and added time, it was excellent.
The Munster final this year must at last stop in their tracks the protagonists of the open draw.
Surely they cannot be allowed to kill this incomparable institution of Irish sport.
Cork will wonder how they let the game slip away when they seemed to have it totally in control – as they had at Páirc Uí Chaoimh. They were ahead at half-time by four points – 2-8 to 1-7 – and they shut their opponents out through most of the third quarter .
Between them, the full forwards – John Fitzgibbon, Ger Fitzgerald and Kevin Hennessy – scored four goals and three points. The champions also took over at midfield when Buckley came on to partner Teddy McCarthy. But they could not copperfasten their advantage.
The answer to the question posed is simple: this Tipperary team possess extraordinary character and many great hurlers.
Leahy was outstanding. His switch from the attack to midfield was a master stroke. Aidan Ryan and Hayes were splendid substitutes.
The contributions of the corner forwards Michael Cleary and Pat Fox were vital: they scored 1-7 and 1-5 respectively.
Declan Ryan played his part in different positions and Cormac Bonnar was unstoppable late in the game.
In defence, Bobby Ryan and Conal Bonnar were sound when the big effort was needed. Colm Bonnar was very effective in that sector too when he moved from midfield, and Ken Hogan could not be blamed for any of Cork's four goals. He made some fine saves.
Nicholas English was unable to line out because of injury, but on the day his absence was not a handicap. His replacement, Donie O'Connell, lined out at centre forward where he broke down several high balls, but not fruitfully, and Declan Ryan moved to the right wing while Cleary went into the left corner.
Cork selector and county board secretary Frank Murphy expressed his team's anger at the pitch invasion during the second half of the final and said that his board "will be taking the matter up with the Munster Council".
Murphy said that the Cork goalkeeper was struck twice by coins and was interfered with when pucking the ball out.
How They Lined Out
TIPPERARY: K Hogan; P Delaney, N Sheehy, M Ryan; J Madden, B Ryan, Conal Bonnar; D Carr (1-1), Colm Bonnar; D Ryan (0-2), D O'Connell, J Leahy (0-2); P Fox (1-5), Cormac Bonnar (0-1), M Cleary (1-7, 2fs). Subs: A Ryan (1-1) for O'Connell (half-time); J Hayes for Madden (40 mins).
CORK: G Cunningham; S O'Gorman, R Browne, D Walsh; C Casey (0-1, sideline), J Cashman (0-3, one 65, 1f), P Hartnett; B O'Sullivan, T McCarthy; T Mulcahy (0-1), M Foley, T O'Sullivan (0-6, 4f); G Fitzgerald (1-2), K Hennessy (1-0), J Fitzgibbon (2-1, goal from free). Subs: P Buckley (O-1) for B O'Sullivan (25 mins).
Referee: T Murray (Limerick).
Naughton is midfield or nothing I reckon. Hes not really tough enough to mix it anywhere else. He needs to be where theres ample space to run around in. He can do a decent job there so long as theres a grafter alongside him doing the donkey work. Midfield is one area where Cork can, and probably will, get the better of Tipp.
But it all smacks of the running game yet again, and is that really wise given the personnel, their age profile, etc?
From Cork's point of view I'd be a little worried about Cadogan's relative inexperience. I think the half-back line will hold up fine, given thats not an area Tipp are overly strong in themselves. The forward line don't exactly strike the fear of god though. I can't recall ever seeing JOC play at 11 before. As Relliers says, it could be a dummy lineup, but if its not, whatever strengths JOC does have (and he has plenty), being a target man ain't one of them.
I don't know how far Cussen is from full fitness, but even half-right I'd have given him the nod at 14 over Aisaike. I'd expect Maher at 3 for Tipp, meaning that regardless who Cork have at 14, Maher will eat them alive if they try and hurl him. Trying to outmuscle him with a giant like Cussen could be a different story though. Not that Maher can't mix it physically - he can - but against someone as big as Cussen, provided he'd be willing to use his size (in the league it didn't seem he used it to that great effect), it could pose problems.
Corks problem will be up front. The game will be a contest for the large part, but lack of free-scoring forwards will mean a small gap will eventually become big, Corks heads will drop, and Tipp will run out comfortable winners in the last 10 or so. I stand by my earlier prediction of Tipp to win this by >10 points.
Quote from: bottlethrower7 on May 27, 2010, 09:47:31 AM
Naughton is midfield or nothing I reckon. Hes not really tough enough to mix it anywhere else. He needs to be where theres ample space to run around in. He can do a decent job there so long as theres a grafter alongside him doing the donkey work. Midfield is one area where Cork can, and probably will, get the better of Tipp.
But it all smacks of the running game yet again, and is that really wise given the personnel, their age profile, etc?
From Cork's point of view I'd be a little worried about Cadogan's relative inexperience. I think the half-back line will hold up fine, given thats not an area Tipp are overly strong in themselves. The forward line don't exactly strike the fear of god though. I can't recall ever seeing JOC play at 11 before. As Relliers says, it could be a dummy lineup, but if its not, whatever strengths JOC does have (and he has plenty), being a target man ain't one of them.
I don't know how far Cussen is from full fitness, but even half-right I'd have given him the nod at 14 over Aisaike. I'd expect Maher at 3 for Tipp, meaning that regardless who Cork have at 14, Maher will eat them alive if they try and hurl him. Trying to outmuscle him with a giant like Cussen could be a different story though. Not that Maher can't mix it physically - he can - but against someone as big as Cussen, provided he'd be willing to use his size (in the league it didn't seem he used it to that great effect), it could pose problems.
Corks problem will be up front. The game will be a contest for the large part, but lack of free-scoring forwards will mean a small gap will eventually become big, Corks heads will drop, and Tipp will run out comfortable winners in the last 10 or so. I stand by my earlier prediction of Tipp to win this by >10 points.
Naughton's after toughening up a bit, he can and has mainly for Cork played out up front, but his best position is midfield. He's after getting a lot stronger and has improved a lot with Newtown this year, able to win his own ball as well, which he wasn't always able to do.
I don't know what we're going to do, Walsh has tried to really get the long game going but the team isn't fully sure how to play it, the "twin towers" of such, don't seem to be able to actually win the ball, so when things get tough they all end up going back to the oh so predictable short running game which hasn't worked really since 06.
At least it's not a full Newtown midfield because we'd have their game style going in about 30 seconds I'd say.
Cadogan is a very strong confident player and one thing about the young Cork players is that they don't lack confidence, it's never been a problem. He'll do just fine. He's the last person I'd be worried about.
The forward line is a bit worrying.
Fraggie hadn't the best League, and hopefully, we all presume anyway that Paudie Sull will be the first one on if he doesn't produce. That said, we tend to see the best of him when he comes on in the last 20 plus.
Jerry is good up at the HF line, and he's playing with Ben, first time this season I think, except maybe one game, when they've started together, they're able to work and create good scores off eachother which is great. He's played there before and I think it's the best position for him these days. But you're right he's not exactly a target man, worryingly the only one in the HF line who'd win you ugly ball is Niall McCarthy.
I'm not sure that's how we'll line out come the game itself. It's the line up for the programme, but I can't see it standing as the one after the throw in.
Aisake has been dire in the League, but he's done well since in challenge matches, he scored around 3-03 there a few days ago, (not saying much) but that score on any day is a good day.
But if you remember, when we played Tipp, we started Aisake at FF on Maher, and hear caused him all sorts of problems, and Walsh was quick to move him, he had seen what he needed and didn't want Tipp to see anymore.
That said if TK doesn't start, it'd probably mean Cussen at wing or centre forward rotating with AOH, and Jerry in the middle with Naughton.
It's not my first choice of a team, but it's got it's positives, and hopefully we'll pull it off, name for name we're not better than Tipp in this one, we'll just hope that we'll pull it off on the day. We should have last year, never mind the year before that, a 7 point lead like..should have been dead and burried.
But no if I had to pick the highlight of that team it'd be Naughton starting in the middle, last year he wasn't really with it, none of them were to be fair, but he's come on a hell of a lot this season with the club and while I used to think there was no one better to come off the bench with 20 mins to go, I mean he'd be a nightmare to have to mark at 50 mins of playing, hot tired, and he's thrown on. I'm not sure there's a player out there who can match him for his speed at the moment.
But he's after improving so much and it's good to see him starting.
I think we can pull this one out of the bag. No fear, down at home. Surely it's our turn ffs. Laws of averages and all.
The Tipp team
1. Brendan Cummins (Ballybacon-Grange)
2. Paddy Stapleton (Borris-Ileigh)
3. Padraic Maher (Thurles Sarsfields)
4. Paul Curran (Mullinahone)
5. Declan Fanning (Killenaule)
6. Conor O'Mahony (Newport)
7. Michael Cahill (Thurles Sarsfields)
8. Brendan Maher (Borris-Ileigh)
9. Shane McGrath (Ballinahinch)
10. Noel McGrath (Loughmore Castleiney)
11. Seamus Callanan (Drom & Inch)
12. John O'Brien (Toomevara)
13. Eoin Kelly (Mullinahone) Captain
14. Brian O'Meara (Kilruane MacDonaghs)
15. Lar Corbett (Thurles Sarsfields)
A few new faces in there since last year. Hard to comment on the likes of O'Meara and Cahill as I haven't seen either play. Maybe one of the Tipp lads can give us some insight from knowing them through the club scene.
It looks a patchy enough team really though, if one weren't to give the new lads the benefit of the doubt. As if Sheedy is spreading out the potential 'weak links' throughout the team.
I reckoned a while back that Tipp wouldn't be as good this year as they were last and, unless some of these new lads turn out to be overnight stars, I reckon thats gonna come to pass. They were a handful of players short of being a truly outstanding outfit last year, and it seems that handful has grown (though, as said, that assertion could be proved wrong in time).
Even the lads who have been Tipp's bigger players in the last while would have slight question marks over them. Eoin Kelly for example. Every yard of pace he loses is proving to be more limiting for him. Last year his main objectives seemed to be to win frees and take frees. Winning frees necessitates being able to get the ball in the first place. If Kelly has slowed up yet more since last year, he could be inneffective this time out. His hurling ability is unquestionable though, so I wouldn't be too quick to write him off.
The younger lads like Callinan and McGrath are going to have more questions asked of them this year too. Both those are the obvious focus of Tipp's half-forward line (John O'Brien is way too inconsistent to be relying on him), and that line is going to be crucial to how Tipp fare in the championship this year. If those guys can step up to the plate then the year could be long. If not, its going to kill their chances I reckon. And I wouldn't be so quick to call how I can see it going - I'd still question McGrath's temperment somewhat - a fabulous player, but one who still needs to come out of his shell a little more. Callinan is more along the Lar Corbett lines in that his hurling is far from polished, but hes such a danger with ball in hand. Again, as per Callinan and McGrath, Corbett will also need a big year if Tipp are to succeed this year.
From Cork's point of view, I'd be a little more confident that they can beat Tipp based on this team selection. There are obvious potential weaknesses to be targetted. If they turn out to be actual weaknesses, then who knows what fruit it might yield. A well-devised game-plan, one that will hit Tipp at their weak-spots, while also trying to neutralise their strengths (curbing Maher and O'Mahony's influence for one), is one way they could prevail.
But have they the players to do it? A problem thats persisted with Cork this last while is that I reckon they're still fully unsure themselves of how good they are.
I still reckon Tipp. Maybe I'd revise the margin down somewhat, having seen the Tipp team, but it looks like they too have a bit of a ways to go themselves before convincing that they're the proposition they were last year.
Quote from: Reillers on May 26, 2010, 12:37:29 PM
Donal Og's starting, no big surprise there, I just hope his hold friend doesn't send him off,
If Donal Óg behaves himself then there'll be no reason to.
Looking forward to this - first big game of the championship.
Quote from: Sean3 on May 26, 2010, 01:23:24 PM
Cork selector and county board secretary Frank Murphy expressed his team's anger at the pitch invasion during the second half of the final and said that his board "will be taking the matter up with the Munster Council".
Frank grafting away for Cork GAA - he doesn't get half the credit he deserves.
Quote from: bottlethrower7 on May 28, 2010, 09:58:50 AM
The Tipp team
1. Brendan Cummins (Ballybacon-Grange)
2. Paddy Stapleton (Borris-Ileigh)
3. Padraic Maher (Thurles Sarsfields)
4. Paul Curran (Mullinahone)
5. Declan Fanning (Killenaule)
6. Conor O'Mahony (Newport)
7. Michael Cahill (Thurles Sarsfields)
8. Brendan Maher (Borris-Ileigh)
9. Shane McGrath (Ballinahinch)
10. Noel McGrath (Loughmore Castleiney)
11. Seamus Callanan (Drom & Inch)
12. John O'Brien (Toomevara)
13. Eoin Kelly (Mullinahone) Captain
14. Brian O'Meara (Kilruane MacDonaghs)
15. Lar Corbett (Thurles Sarsfields)
A few new faces in there since last year. Hard to comment on the likes of O'Meara and Cahill as I haven't seen either play. Maybe one of the Tipp lads can give us some insight from knowing them through the club scene.
It looks a patchy enough team really though, if one weren't to give the new lads the benefit of the doubt. As if Sheedy is spreading out the potential 'weak links' throughout the team.
I reckoned a while back that Tipp wouldn't be as good this year as they were last and, unless some of these new lads turn out to be overnight stars, I reckon thats gonna come to pass. They were a handful of players short of being a truly outstanding outfit last year, and it seems that handful has grown (though, as said, that assertion could be proved wrong in time).
Even the lads who have been Tipp's bigger players in the last while would have slight question marks over them. Eoin Kelly for example. Every yard of pace he loses is proving to be more limiting for him. Last year his main objectives seemed to be to win frees and take frees. Winning frees necessitates being able to get the ball in the first place. If Kelly has slowed up yet more since last year, he could be inneffective this time out. His hurling ability is unquestionable though, so I wouldn't be too quick to write him off.
The younger lads like Callinan and McGrath are going to have more questions asked of them this year too. Both those are the obvious focus of Tipp's half-forward line (John O'Brien is way too inconsistent to be relying on him), and that line is going to be crucial to how Tipp fare in the championship this year. If those guys can step up to the plate then the year could be long. If not, its going to kill their chances I reckon. And I wouldn't be so quick to call how I can see it going - I'd still question McGrath's temperment somewhat - a fabulous player, but one who still needs to come out of his shell a little more. Callinan is more along the Lar Corbett lines in that his hurling is far from polished, but hes such a danger with ball in hand. Again, as per Callinan and McGrath, Corbett will also need a big year if Tipp are to succeed this year.
From Cork's point of view, I'd be a little more confident that they can beat Tipp based on this team selection. There are obvious potential weaknesses to be targetted. If they turn out to be actual weaknesses, then who knows what fruit it might yield. A well-devised game-plan, one that will hit Tipp at their weak-spots, while also trying to neutralise their strengths (curbing Maher and O'Mahony's influence for one), is one way they could prevail.
But have they the players to do it? A problem thats persisted with Cork this last while is that I reckon they're still fully unsure themselves of how good they are.
I still reckon Tipp. Maybe I'd revise the margin down somewhat, having seen the Tipp team, but it looks like they too have a bit of a ways to go themselves before convincing that they're the proposition they were last year.
I wouldn't agree with any of that. thats a better tipp side then last year. As people will see on Sunday.
Quote from: INDIANA on May 28, 2010, 01:06:32 PM
I wouldn't agree with any of that. thats a better tipp side then last year. As people will see on Sunday.
I'd imagine most Tipp folks would be happy enough with an average enough performance, once they see signs that suggest better to come. If Tipp show themselves to be better than last year in this sunday's game, I reckon they don't have a hope of winning the all-Ireland (peaking too soon, etc).
First round munster is typically a notch below the late summer knockout stuff. Once both sides see signs that they can improve enough to be in the shake-up come late summer, I'm sure both will be happy.
Quote from: bottlethrower7 on May 28, 2010, 01:19:20 PM
Quote from: INDIANA on May 28, 2010, 01:06:32 PM
I wouldn't agree with any of that. thats a better tipp side then last year. As people will see on Sunday.
I'd imagine most Tipp folks would be happy enough with an average enough performance, once they see signs that suggest better to come. If Tipp show themselves to be better than last year in this sunday's game, I reckon they don't have a hope of winning the all-Ireland (peaking too soon, etc).
First round munster is typically a notch below the late summer knockout stuff. Once both sides see signs that they can improve enough to be in the shake-up come late summer, I'm sure both will be happy.
Thats why Sheedy is bedding in players now. I think its potentially a far better team. But we will have to see how they perform on the day.
I genuinely can't wait now. Tipp v Cork. This is the Munster Champioship, and you've got fools, Leinster GAA type who want to break it all up. Them and their twisted priorities. Nothing much beats a day out in Munster. I'm looking forward to a good day out, I'd love to win it, and I think we could pull it off, but I think both coaches will be wanting to learn something from the game. The back door isn't the end of the world for either team. Looking at the Tipp team, I'm kinda worried about this O'Meara lad..nobody seems to know anything about him, a bit too quiet for my liking. I suppose we'll see on the weekend.
Either way, I can't wait. A real buzz about the place now.
Summer's finally here.
Quote from: heffo on May 28, 2010, 12:13:59 PM
Quote from: Reillers on May 26, 2010, 12:37:29 PM
Donal Og's starting, no big surprise there, I just hope his hold friend doesn't send him off,
If Donal Óg behaves himself then there'll be no reason to.
No, and its not unprecedented either. I recall Liam Dunne going off on one about Pat Horan in his book. The following year in the club championship Oulart played the Village in the club championship and the ref was none other than Mr.Horan. Dunne went over to him to shake hands in a 'no hard feelings' sort of way before the game. Donal Og might be advised to do likewise.
Quote from: bottlethrower7 on May 28, 2010, 02:25:23 PM
Quote from: heffo on May 28, 2010, 12:13:59 PM
Quote from: Reillers on May 26, 2010, 12:37:29 PM
Donal Og's starting, no big surprise there, I just hope his hold friend doesn't send him off,
If Donal Óg behaves himself then there'll be no reason to.
No, and its not unprecedented either. I recall Liam Dunne going off on one about Pat Horan in his book. The following year in the club championship Oulart played the Village in the club championship and the ref was none other than Mr.Horan. Dunne went over to him to shake hands in a 'no hard feelings' sort of way before the game. Donal Og might be advised to do likewise.
All right I know on the best of days we're paranoid as f**k, but really this ref has had it in for him for years.
He's never straight with him either. I mean the game against Galway where he sent DOC off. The first yellow wasn't neccesary, and when he gave him the second he was almost beside himself with delight, the grin on his face, I mean f**k it, at least try and hide the pleasure in it. Even the lads commentating on it said he had it in for him.
He's not consistant at all in what he wants, always contradicting himself from game to game.
He seriously has had it in for him and the team over the years. Hopefully he'll go unnoticed and just refs the game rightly. I don't have the stomach to watch us play a man down because Kelly saw the opportunity..again..to screw us over.
Quote from: Reillers on May 28, 2010, 02:45:45 PM
Quote from: bottlethrower7 on May 28, 2010, 02:25:23 PM
Quote from: heffo on May 28, 2010, 12:13:59 PM
Quote from: Reillers on May 26, 2010, 12:37:29 PM
Donal Og's starting, no big surprise there, I just hope his hold friend doesn't send him off,
If Donal Óg behaves himself then there'll be no reason to.
No, and its not unprecedented either. I recall Liam Dunne going off on one about Pat Horan in his book. The following year in the club championship Oulart played the Village in the club championship and the ref was none other than Mr.Horan. Dunne went over to him to shake hands in a 'no hard feelings' sort of way before the game. Donal Og might be advised to do likewise.
All right I know on the best of days we're paranoid as f**k, but really this ref has had it in for him for years.
He's never straight with him either. I mean the game against Galway where he sent DOC off. The first yellow wasn't neccesary, and when he gave him the second he was almost beside himself with delight, the grin on his face, I mean f**k it, at least try and hide the pleasure in it. Even the lads commentating on it said he had it in for him.
He's not consistant at all in what he wants, always contradicting himself from game to game.
He seriously has had it in for him and the team over the years. Hopefully he'll go unnoticed and just refs the game rightly. I don't have the stomach to watch us play a man down because Kelly saw the opportunity..again..to screw us over.
Behave yourself, donal O'g was way over the top that day and was well merited in getting the two yellows even though its not very often you see a keeper getting the line, he certainly deserved them both. The Rock was very lucky not to get at least a yellow for his indescretion on Joe Canning very early on it that game as well.
Donal O'G would be better served on concentrating on the game going on rather than f**king around swapping balls, coming outside the 6 yard area for puck outs, contesting every decision, taking quick puck outs and the likes as I'm sure its bound to rile any referee.
Cork tempting anyone at 7/4 ??? Seems big to me ?
Quote from: johnneycool on May 28, 2010, 02:56:05 PM
Quote from: Reillers on May 28, 2010, 02:45:45 PM
Quote from: bottlethrower7 on May 28, 2010, 02:25:23 PM
Quote from: heffo on May 28, 2010, 12:13:59 PM
Quote from: Reillers on May 26, 2010, 12:37:29 PM
Donal Og's starting, no big surprise there, I just hope his hold friend doesn't send him off,
If Donal Óg behaves himself then there'll be no reason to.
No, and its not unprecedented either. I recall Liam Dunne going off on one about Pat Horan in his book. The following year in the club championship Oulart played the Village in the club championship and the ref was none other than Mr.Horan. Dunne went over to him to shake hands in a 'no hard feelings' sort of way before the game. Donal Og might be advised to do likewise.
All right I know on the best of days we're paranoid as f**k, but really this ref has had it in for him for years.
He's never straight with him either. I mean the game against Galway where he sent DOC off. The first yellow wasn't neccesary, and when he gave him the second he was almost beside himself with delight, the grin on his face, I mean f**k it, at least try and hide the pleasure in it. Even the lads commentating on it said he had it in for him.
He's not consistant at all in what he wants, always contradicting himself from game to game.
He seriously has had it in for him and the team over the years. Hopefully he'll go unnoticed and just refs the game rightly. I don't have the stomach to watch us play a man down because Kelly saw the opportunity..again..to screw us over.
Behave yourself, donal O'g was way over the top that day and was well merited in getting the two yellows even though its not very often you see a keeper getting the line, he certainly deserved them both. The Rock was very lucky not to get at least a yellow for his indescretion on Joe Canning very early on it that game as well.
Donal O'G would be better served on concentrating on the game going on rather than f**king around swapping balls, coming outside the 6 yard area for puck outs, contesting every decision, taking quick puck outs and the likes as I'm sure its bound to rile any referee.
Tell me so what the first yellow was so deserving for? What did he do that was way over the top that deserved a yellow card, whatever about the 2nd yellow. What was so bad that deserved a yellow?
which one was the one where he'd swung the hurley round the Galway forwards neck? Was that the second one?
He was also out putting the butt of the hurl into lads before that, so you'd have hoped he'd have enough cop on the wise up but he didn't!
Fair play to you bt. If Tipp win pulling up, they'll have shot their load for the year. If they get over the line, they'll have yet to convince. You've all bases covered anyway. And sayin all this regardless of the whatever performance Cork add to the equation is quite a (few) statement(s).
I'd be disappointed if we don't win midfield, Brendan Maher has bolstered this area considerably. We know what Shane McGrath brings. Michael Cahill will be around for a long time, though may be more suited to corner back. Padraig Maher to the wing and Cahill to the corner may happen before a ball is thrown in. O'Meara is a wild card and you never know what way young lads will react in their first cauldron.
Cork in Cork is never simple, but if we get a performance approaching 90% out of Tipp I think we'll have too much for them.
Quote from: johnneycool on May 28, 2010, 03:36:31 PM
which one was the one where he'd swung the hurley round the Galway forwards neck? Was that the second one?
He was also out putting the butt of the hurl into lads before that, so you'd have hoped he'd have enough cop on the wise up but he didn't!
:-\ Ya because that was deserving, don't remember him butting the butt of the hurley into lads before hand, if I remember rightly he ran out a few Galway players got in his face, there was something that couldn't even be described as D4 handbags, but nothing serious, and he was the only one who got booked. I saw things 100 times worse in the game and people weren't booked for it.
Like they said on the day, he was targeted from early on for a number of reasons and Kelly was only looking for an excuse to send him off. He's learned from it though.
Quote from: ormondeboy3 on May 28, 2010, 04:02:05 PM
Fair play to you bt. If Tipp win pulling up, they'll have shot their load for the year. If they get over the line, they'll have yet to convince. You've all bases covered anyway. And sayin all this regardless of the whatever performance Cork add to the equation is quite a (few) statement(s).
got you out of hiding OB!! :)
I was talking more in terms of performance than result. But then I'm sure you knew that.
Righto,
I'm going for a big shock.
Cork now 9/4 and I'm going for Cork to win in their own patch.
an ill reared bunch there during that minutes silence.
Tipps a good thing, love that digging at the start of a game and the ref just hurls it in and says get on with it lads lol
Sticks and helmets flying all over the place.
And the sliothar hasn't been thrown in yet !!! :D
The summer starts here. Tipp to win today and stop 5 in a row.
Sheedy should take Maher off now.
Aisake has him in knots.
Cork with the bit between their teeth.
Lar pulls one back.
Tipp evens lump on
What a goal for Cork !!!
Aisake takes a dive but it breaks to Horgan who is clinical with that chance.
Class stuff.
Aisake got raped there - no free !!!!
Maher taken off Aisake now.
Get up ye boy ye!!!
Cork full back line are doing well.
3 handpass fouls missed by Kelly
Cork the more intelligent team by a long shot. Brilliiant use of the ball at times
Tipp look clueless in terms of their delivery up into the forwards
Quote from: orangeman on May 30, 2010, 04:47:00 PM
Cork full back line are doing well.
In fairness they are doing very well. 2 between them, Tipp living off scraps for most of the first 35 minutes.
God that ref is woeful....calls handpasses as illegal when legal and misses illegal ones....
Quote from: DUBSFORSAM1 on May 30, 2010, 05:06:33 PM
God that ref is woeful....calls handpasses as illegal when legal and misses illegal ones....
He's only called one illegal.
Yes there appears to have been a couple of other illegal ones alright.
Tipp have beefed up the full forward line. Expect them to drive it in long this half.
Jesus bad tackle there. Could be a red here ?.
Yellow.
Cork playing well here.
6 up now.
25 left.
They're rolling back the years.
Hope for my sake they keep it up.
Cork are hurling Tipp off the field.
Cork's defence has been very impressive. The work rate all over the pitch is unreal.
What a miss by Aisake to finish the game.
Game over
Gees this is getting embarassing.
What age is Eoin Kelly? Pale shadow of former self. I think his injuries are catching up on him.
Reillers will be a happy man.
Disapointing result. Sean Og will be after a win bonus for that one. Hopefully Tipp can refocus and give the All Ireland a lash. I suppose it would be appropriate if Kilkenny were to beat the Cork strikers out the gates to win the historic 5-in-a-row. ABC (anyone but Cork)
Congrats to Cork who simply hurled Tipp off the pitch.
9/4 Cork was massive !!!!!!!!!!!
Cork were outstanding today - they were hungry.
Will they win Mc Carthy now ?
Not a fan of those Cork lads but have to hand it to them on that performance. Savage fire and passion. Fitness and teamwork was incredible. You'd have to take them seriously based on that but have they peaked or will they improve? Massive kick in the nuts for Tipp. This could end up being a great hurling championship.
Cork very impressive all over the field. Look like genuine contenders. Sean Og has a bit of hurling in him yet!
Good win for Cork but a poor match and Tipp were woeful. Will all the boys here who were writing off Cork after one or two poor performances after the 'strike' and telling us that this was proof they were wrong to take action now be back on to say otherwise?
Quote from: Zulu on May 30, 2010, 06:17:01 PM
Good win for Cork but a poor match and Tipp were woeful. Will all the boys here who were writing off Cork after one or two poor performances after the 'strike' and telling us that this was proof they were wrong to take action now be back on to say otherwise?
Away and catch yourself on.
Quote from: Zulu on May 30, 2010, 06:17:01 PM
Good win for Cork but a poor match and Tipp were woeful. Will all the boys here who were writing off Cork after one or two poor performances after the 'strike' and telling us that this was proof they were wrong to take action now be back on to say otherwise?
NO
Quote from: orangeman on May 30, 2010, 06:21:25 PM
Quote from: Zulu on May 30, 2010, 06:17:01 PM
Good win for Cork but a poor match and Tipp were woeful. Will all the boys here who were writing off Cork after one or two poor performances after the 'strike' and telling us that this was proof they were wrong to take action now be back on to say otherwise?
Away and catch yourself on.
Why? Lots of muppets came on here and claimed that some of Cork's performances post-strike showed that it was the players who were the problem. Donal Og was written off as were many others, yet I bet that none of you will be on here to accept yer comments were idiotic. As it happens I don't think that this performance today justifies anything but I didn't think that any poor performances since the strike proved anything either so I'm just interested in seeing if the Cork bashers will retracted some of their stupid comments in the months post-strike.
I don't want to take this off-topic but some of the comments by some posters when Cork put in a bad performance in the past two years deserve to be highlighted for teh bullshit they were.
As for Cork, they could well win a poor Munster championship now but they still aren't great.
Zulu - you've contradicted yourself several times there so as someone already said - catch yourself on.
Could you point out where I've contradicted myself? I've highlighted teh stupidity of some posters here and I don't think they'll be man enough to accept their stupidity, no contradiction there.
Jesus Boycey where do you get 4-5 realistic contenders? I think todays game will have provided Kilkenny with great comfort, Cork worked hard but an awful Tipp performance allied to a better than expected return from O'Halpin in FF doesn't mean Cork are realistic contenders for the AI.
Oh why ruin a good night? A smashing dayand a great roujnd of drinks afterwards. Summers here!!1! FUckin unreall!!!!!!
None of ye were exepecting that now was ye..
Quote from: Zulu on May 30, 2010, 06:37:37 PM
Quote from: orangeman on May 30, 2010, 06:21:25 PM
Quote from: Zulu on May 30, 2010, 06:17:01 PM
Good win for Cork but a poor match and Tipp were woeful. Will all the boys here who were writing off Cork after one or two poor performances after the 'strike' and telling us that this was proof they were wrong to take action now be back on to say otherwise?
Away and catch yourself on.
Why? Lots of muppets came on here and claimed that some of Cork's performances post-strike showed that it was the players who were the problem. Donal Og was written off as were many others, yet I bet that none of you will be on here to accept yer comments were idiotic. As it happens I don't think that this performance today justifies anything but I didn't think that any poor performances since the strike proved anything either so I'm just interested in seeing if the Cork bashers will retracted some of their stupid comments in the months post-strike.
I don't want to take this off-topic but some of the comments by some posters when Cork put in a bad performance in the past two years deserve to be highlighted for teh bullshit they were.
As for Cork, they could well win a poor Munster championship now but they still aren't great.
Was the all-ireland won today? Strange I thought it was a first round game. Will someone please put me in time machine so I can be transported to the first week of september. Was driving down Jones Road today- didn't see any Cork flags.
Quote from: Reillers on May 30, 2010, 07:47:22 PM
Oh why ruin a good night? A smashing dayand a great roujnd of drinks afterwards. Summers here!!1! FUckin unreall!!!!!!
None of ye were exepecting that now was ye..
[/b]
I was. I bet you'se at 9/4 !!
Well done Reillers - it was bound to have been a great day out in Pairc Ui Chaoimh. The atmosphere must have been class.
Quote from: orangeman on May 30, 2010, 08:01:37 PM
Quote from: Reillers on May 30, 2010, 07:47:22 PM
Oh why ruin a good night? A smashing dayand a great roujnd of drinks afterwards. Summers here!!1! FUckin unreall!!!!!!
None of ye were exepecting that now was ye..
[/b]
I was. I bet you'se at 9/4 !!
Well done Reillers - it was bound to have been a great day out in Pairc Ui Chaoimh. The atmosphere must have been class.
Aas did I. Haha. But nobdoy thought that we'd win by 10 like. Nice when it all works out. And people want to get rid oif the MUnster Championship. Everyone from 1 to the bench was fantastic. The fire today in their belies. I mean the atmostphere was somethin else sure it twas raining all right but id didn't dampen it one big. One of the best I@ve seen from the boys since the Galway game a few years ago..was at that too. A littl emore relexed near the final while today, but fuckin hell!!
God I love hurling!!!!
The 6 backs palyed a blidenr. ANd people worried about Cads and the inexperience of such.
Before hadn teh rumours almost killed us, word on the ground was Kenny and BOC were out before hand but thankfully it went feckin brilliantly for us. Great to hear all the positives about us!!
..For once..been looking for the flying pigs..as it was none so far. Massive day, great round before heading home. Brilliant Munster game!!
They're going to have a massive hard time reigning the hype in now.
The only thing that was shortened today was kilkennys odds of winning the all-ireland. Unbackbale after today.
A great day for the old guard, Sean Og had a great day, Donal Og pulled off a stunning save. Passing was crisp, all over the park. It looked like we'd a game plan and direction which had been missing in our last game or so.
Homework was done for the game though and we were on top in every position on the pitch. First to 50/50 ball and I'd say they were amazed by the amount of space we got.
Especially for AOH goal I mean Jerry probably couldn't believe his eyes. He was in acres of space and some. On Jerry O Connor, some saw him as quiet, but he gave Conor O Mahoney an awful time, dragged him all over the pitch, took him out of the game completely, untill Tipp took him off.
Just everyone from 1-15 and plus had a magnificent game.
Sheedy got it really wrong, the amount of high balls that rained down on the likes of Cadogan, unreal. They were slow to the ball in the midfield, and with the pace we have in there, it was only ever going to mean one thing.
A lot of potential in there a long with a great day from the "over the hill" players.
Aisake had a great day, as did Horgan, Naughton, and POS is really challenging and pushing for a spot. Hopefully now he'll fullfill the promise we all saw two or so seasons ago.
On another point, which no one has mentioned, the best tactic today was Walsh's decision to move Aisake off Maher in the league game.
Watched Ben/Donal Og and Denis Walsh's interview when I got home on RTE and Sunday game, you really can't beat the Cork bitterness.
Quote from: hardstation on May 30, 2010, 09:46:10 PM
Tipp were worse than brutal today. Not only were they beaten by a far better team but they had no balls at all. 1 Cork man winning a ball between 3 Tipp men on many occasions. No fight in them whatsoever. Their forward line in particular didn't want to know.
Can't wait to get them in Casement. ;)
BTW - Penalty my hole. Aisake was charging.
Really I know there have been changes in the rules, but I didn't realise the piggy back had been brought in to the game.
POS must be related to you Reillers for all the plugs you give him here. Must be a slower burner then the Olympic Flame.
Quote from: INDIANA on May 30, 2010, 11:02:54 PM
POS must be related to you Reillers for all the plugs you give him here. Must be a slower burner then the Olympic Flame.
Ah now, now, he's rarely mentioned and he's got buckets full of potential.
And do ya not feel like responding to Zulo at all? ;)
Quote from: Reillers on May 30, 2010, 11:04:42 PM
Quote from: INDIANA on May 30, 2010, 11:02:54 PM
POS must be related to you Reillers for all the plugs you give him here. Must be a slower burner then the Olympic Flame.
Ah now, now, he's rarely mentioned and he's got buckets full of potential.
And do ya not feel like responding to Zulo at all? ;)
Not much to respond to except if you wanted to back killkenny you needed to do it yesterday. Because you won't get a decent price on them in the morning.
Quote from: hardstation on May 30, 2010, 11:11:15 PM
Quote from: Reillers on May 30, 2010, 11:01:46 PM
Quote from: hardstation on May 30, 2010, 09:46:10 PM
Tipp were worse than brutal today. Not only were they beaten by a far better team but they had no balls at all. 1 Cork man winning a ball between 3 Tipp men on many occasions. No fight in them whatsoever. Their forward line in particular didn't want to know.
Can't wait to get them in Casement. ;)
BTW - Penalty my hole. Aisake was charging.
Really I know there have been changes in the rules, but I didn't realise the piggy back had been brought in to the game.
Where was the piggy back? Aisake got the ball and charged straight at the Tipp back, making no attempt to go around him. Charging in my book.
They were all over him, arms around his back, his head..etc if I remember rightly, either way we got a goal out of it.
First time in about three years I got sick drinking a pint and looking at a hurling match. When ya see a lad with a sprayed on fake tan taking on three Tipp men and beating them it is time to look for the slashook.
Quote from: Bud Wiser on May 31, 2010, 12:02:50 AM
First time in about three years I got sick drinking a pint and looking at a hurling match. When ya see a lad with a sprayed on fake tan taking on three Tipp men and beating them it is time to look for the slashook.
Fake tan? ::) ::) Grow up.
Fair play to the Cork men, they took their beating off Galway, went away and done their homework. Yesterday they crowded out the middle third with their half forward line almost into midfield and Gardiner sweeping up leaving no room whatsoever for the Tipp forwards who obviously don't like the tight confines.
Donal O'G stuck to what he is good at, shot stopping, organising his defence and his puck outs were sticking in the hands of his intended targets then it was a good day at the office.
Whoever has turned Aisake into a hurler over the last few weeks should be replacing Paudie Butler in Croke park as they've worked miracles ground hurling aside as Duignan pointed out. His awkward, gangly style had young Maher all over the place and certainly that unnerved the whole Tipp defence. I'd have though Fanning's more physical approach would have worked better on Aisiake but there you go. It's never good when your fullback and centre back who was replaced were all at sea and its time to go home when Niall McCarthy puts over two very good points.
Tipp were all at sea yesterday and have issues all over the place, but its hard to see them being as bad as they were yesterday and they'd be looking for a handy draw in the qualifiers to get back in the groove.
Cork looked to be serious contenders yesterday, but can those old legs and minds keep going to the well all summer. Will other teams learn from yesterday and counteract the hurling equivalent of the planket defence and swarm tackle?
They're in with a shout as Galway are stuttering, probably weighed down with a bit of expectation ot home, Tipp haven't shown the same fire to date, there's time yet, Kilkenny will hope to turn it on come championship time after a non eventful league campaign, Waterford, lord only knows!
Only time will tell.
Quote from: INDIANA on May 28, 2010, 01:06:32 PM
I wouldn't agree with any of that. thats a better tipp side then last year. As people will see on Sunday.
I could go to town on that comment. But I won't, for one reason. That Tipp team aren't as bad as they were made look there. What showed up in a big way was the total ineptitude of the Tipp sideline, firstly in how ill-prepared they were for this game and, secondly, how poor they were during the game. 2 very obvious examples are how long they waited to switch Maher off Aisaike and how long it took them to cotton onto the short puck-outs.
I reckon the game was won and lost in the first 30 mins. I wouldn't pay heed to how much Tipp lost by as the heads went down from about 15 mins into the second half. But that first 30 minutes was where Cork did most of the damage and by 'damage' I don't necessarily refer to what they chalked up score-wise. Moreso how they bolstered themselves in terms of confidence and mental strength, and likewise the damage they did to Tipp in these same areas.
And someone mentioned midfield last week (me maybe). That was such a crucial area and Tipp barely got a puck there. Aisaike had a huge impact for sure, but the reason he did was because of the acres of space midfield had to pick out their nice floated passes in.
Tipp's new players? What the hell was Sheedy at. That experiment with O'Meara backfired hugely. Cadogan ate him and that served to feed his confidence hugely.
Not to take from Cork at all but Tipp's management need to take a long, hard look at themselves and consider if they're up to the job. Its one thing being popular with the players and being a people person, but its a serious no-no to take on a team at this level with no hurling savvy at all. And maybe thats harsh, but thats what it looked like to me. Sheedy's short-fuse was clearly evident yesterday and one wonders if that inhibited whatever clarity of thought he might have had when needing to think of what they could do to curb Cork in those first 30 mins. And why Maher to wing-back and not center-back? Why not try and bring Corbett back to midfield and get him more involved in the game? Why not try and make more space for Callinan by getting midfield and wing-forwards to give him a bit of room.
And sadly for Tipp (again as I suggested might be the case last week), Eoin Kelly doesn't look up to this level anymore.
Patrick Horgan is a joy to watch. A seriously skilful operator.
Quote from: Bud Wiser on May 31, 2010, 12:02:50 AM
First time in about three years I got sick drinking a pint and looking at a hurling match. When ya see a lad with a sprayed on fake tan taking on three Tipp men and beating them it is time to look for the slashook.
What's that supposed to mean?
Quote from: bottlethrower7 on May 31, 2010, 09:27:51 AM
Quote from: INDIANA on May 28, 2010, 01:06:32 PM
I wouldn't agree with any of that. thats a better tipp side then last year. As people will see on Sunday.
I could go to town on that comment. But I won't, for one reason. That Tipp team aren't as bad as they were made look there. What showed up in a big way was the total ineptitude of the Tipp sideline, firstly in how ill-prepared they were for this game and, secondly, how poor they were during the game. 2 very obvious examples are how long they waited to switch Maher off Aisaike and how long it took them to cotton onto the short puck-outs.
I reckon the game was won and lost in the first 30 mins. I wouldn't pay heed to how much Tipp lost by as the heads went down from about 15 mins into the second half. But that first 30 minutes was where Cork did most of the damage and by 'damage' I don't necessarily refer to what they chalked up score-wise. Moreso how they bolstered themselves in terms of confidence and mental strength, and likewise the damage they did to Tipp in these same areas.
And someone mentioned midfield last week (me maybe). That was such a crucial area and Tipp barely got a puck there. Aisaike had a huge impact for sure, but the reason he did was because of the acres of space midfield had to pick out their nice floated passes in.
Tipp's new players? What the hell was Sheedy at. That experiment with O'Meara backfired hugely. Cadogan ate him and that served to feed his confidence hugely.
Not to take from Cork at all but Tipp's management need to take a long, hard look at themselves and consider if they're up to the job. Its one thing being popular with the players and being a people person, but its a serious no-no to take on a team at this level with no hurling savvy at all. And maybe thats harsh, but thats what it looked like to me. Sheedy's short-fuse was clearly evident yesterday and one wonders if that inhibited whatever clarity of thought he might have had when needing to think of what they could do to curb Cork in those first 30 mins. And why Maher to wing-back and not center-back? Why not try and bring Corbett back to midfield and get him more involved in the game? Why not try and make more space for Callinan by getting midfield and wing-forwards to give him a bit of room.
And sadly for Tipp (again as I suggested might be the case last week), Eoin Kelly doesn't look up to this level anymore.
Patrick Horgan is a joy to watch. A seriously skilful operator.
Why hold back? Tipp are not much better then they looked yesterday. I have no problem saying I got it badly wrong even if it doesn't stretch to praising Cork. Tipp were hammered by Dublin in the league. I was at the game. That game told more then it let on as did Tipp's meeting with Cork in the NHL. People think the NHL is a poor indicator- its actually a better indicator then people think.
Tipp struggled with AOS in the NHL and did nothing yesterday to counteract him in the air yesterday. That Tipp forward line bar Eoin kelly has no backbone when it comes to winning dirty ball. EK is a proven top class forward who can take punishment. You don't get rid of that. Lads like Callinan are Christmas decorations that only perform then the team plays well. Noel Mc Grath had an off day as did Corbett but I'd have no faith in the rest. But even still neither of them are ball winners.
Tipp are well ahead of the minnows like Offaly, Wexford and Dublin but well behind kilkenny and galway and now behind Cork as well. They will not win the all-ireland this year or next. They have massive problems. Honestly can't see anyone stopping kilkenny now. Probably some session in Langtons last night.
A real team would have regrouped at HT yesterday only 2 points down. Instead they completely imploded. Galway went down to 14 men and answered with a goal on Saturday evening. Thats the difference between a team going places and one going backwards.
Quote from: INDIANA on May 31, 2010, 10:06:24 AM
People think the NHL is a poor indicator- its actually a better indicator then people think.
I think for the early rounds of the championship, with the benefit of hindsight, thats a very true statement.
Something of a shock just how comprehensive this victory was - I don't think it flattered Cork in any way whatsoever. They completely snuffed out anything resembling a threat from Tipp, with many of their big names completely anonymous. Kelly and McGrath did nothing at all and while Corbett started brightly, he was shut down pretty quickly. Cadogan couldn't have asked for a better game to stamp his authority on the full back position - O'Meara didn't look up to it at all, either the pace or the skill of the game. The half back line was exceptional once again.
Aisake might not have the hurling in him of some others on the team, but in that sort of form he'll do damage to any team, especially with Gardiner dropping pinpoint balls on him all afternoon - Maher will have nightmares about him for weeks to come. What's shocking is that despite seeing the damage he could do in the league game, Sheedy didn't appear to have taken any specific corrective action.
Tipp are certainly not out of the AI race, they've far too many talented players to vanish altogether this season, but the fall from grace after last year's final is enormous.
As comprehensive a victory as it was, the penalty definitely shouldn't have been awarded - blatant charged. For the second goal - blatant dive by Aisake. Is there a dive rule in hurling??
PS - This just off the newsreel - Reillers expected to announce Cork as favourites for the AI, Cathal Naughton for HOTY, after four years of doing nothing since his 1-1 as a sub against Waterford.
Dunno where Sheedy goes after that. Problems in every line on the park. I mean one of their forwards goes through on goal gets bottled up, has 2 forwards on the 21 waiting to tap it over. Instead tries a a drop shot from 23 yards which doesn't go 2 yards and the ball is cleared. Nothing Sheedy can do about that.
Struck me yesterday the team is too young. Tipp have too many lads in key positions who are too inexperienced by the looks of it. EK can't be everywhere. He has enough to do be doing marking Cadogan who is a good hurler. But he got no support up there yesterday. Not sure they have the replacements either. Most people were basing their assessment on Tipp's first 15 replicating last years performances. Hammersley looked lively when he came on. Hennessy was a star minor but he didn't catch any puckouts when he came on. Gearoid Ryan is a good hurler but I couldn't honestly pick his best position. I don't envy Sheedy's task where people are expecting an all-ireland as their basis for a good season.
If Cork can keep that level of performance up they'll give anyone a game.
Except Kilkenny.
Quote from: INDIANA on May 31, 2010, 10:06:24 AM
Tipp struggled with AOS in the NHL and did nothing yesterday to counteract him in the air yesterday. That Tipp forward line bar Eoin kelly has no backbone when it comes to winning dirty ball. EK is a proven top class forward who can take punishment. You don't get rid of that. Lads like Callinan are Christmas decorations that only perform then the team plays well. Noel Mc Grath had an off day as did Corbett but I'd have no faith in the rest. But even still neither of them are ball winners.
Who is AOS (Aisake O Halipin ??? )
Think this showed up Tipps shortcomings on the sideline at this level. Yes when everyones on their game tipps hurling is great to watch and they can mix it with the best but the reality is that their game is too reliant on everybody being "on their game". They have zero game plan...they just hurl (like waterford). Ball after ball after ball in the first half was just drilled aimlessly out of defense into a tightly defended central forward area. Compare that to how cork kept looking to maintain possession and create space up front to exlpoit. No one in a Tipp jersey looked up and that told me they weren't told to. And whilst were talking about keeping possession, puck out after puckout went short and Cusask (as hateful as I find him) is the best in the business at disguising the length of his puckouts and finding players short. Tipp had nothing on their puckouts.....the cork wing half forwards, the midfield and the half back line made sure of that. It really was rabbits in the headlights for tipp yesterday. They had all winter to step up a level in terms of tactical awareness and they haven't. They'll rebound no doubt but I think they haven't got the game to beat the teams that "know" how to win (KK & Ck at this stage).
Think yesterday showed the benefits of keeping faith in a big awkward hurler. How many big men are lost to the game at an early age because their stickwork wasn't up to standard?
And all this praise heaped on Sean Og for his performance yesterday ??? Gardiner and Cusack had top drawer performances but I thought O Halpin was a 6/10 and no more up against a clueless tipp forward line. The Ck defensive unit I'd give 9/10 because they got it so right tactically
Quote from: INDIANA on May 31, 2010, 10:27:36 AM
Dunno where Sheedy goes after that. Problems in every line on the park. I mean one of their forwards goes through on goal gets bottled up, has 2 forwards on the 21 waiting to tap it over. Instead tries a a drop shot from 23 yards which doesn't go 2 yards and the ball is cleared. Nothing Sheedy can do about that.
Struck me yesterday the team is too young. Tipp have too many lads in key positions who are too inexperienced by the looks of it. EK can't be everywhere. He has enough to do be doing marking Cadogan who is a good hurler. But he got no support up there yesterday. Not sure they have the replacements either. Most people were basing their assessment on Tipp's first 15 replicating last years performances. Hammersley looked lively when he came on. Hennessy was a star minor but he didn't catch any puckouts when he came on. Gearoid Ryan is a good hurler but I couldn't honestly pick his best position. I don't envy Sheedy's task where people are expecting an all-ireland as their basis for a good season.
If Cork can keep that level of performance up they'll give anyone a game.
Except Kilkenny.
Will Paul Kelly be making it back any time soon as they'll need him?
I'd be loathe to start dancing on Tipp's grave just yet. A single game can seriously skew perspective, especially when a team either wins or loses by a lot. The truth is often somewhere far short of people's initial reaction though, in my opinion.
Just as Tipp probably aren't as good as they showed in september, I really believe they aren't as bad as they looked yesterday. But it is a serious blow and I'd doubt their ability to salvage anything from this year's championship. They're a beaten team now, and taking that frailty on into the qualifiers is something that will be hard to overcome. I expect they will feature later in the summer, but that doubt will linger.
They have no strength in depth either. They had a couple of starters that will need to do a lot to convince that they'll ever be anything other than passengers. Then springing lads that have little or no experience to replace them. But that facet of Tipp isn't new. Time and time again they resorted to springing Benny Dunne from the bench when he was gone past his best. How have they not managed to unearth any new talent, especially considering the relatively decent underage sides they've produced? Cork, in contrast, brought on Cussen and O'Sullivan who, while both inexperienced also, you'd feel would contribute positively when introduced.
Where do they go from here? They have to continue as they've been going. I don't see they've any choice other than to do that. Sheedy needs to go. Not now, but he does need to go. He has brought some cohesion and unity to Tipp as a panel, and that was needed after the disastrous reigns of babs and doyle. But now he needs to hand over to someone who can bring the best out of Tipp as a hurling force. Whether that person is a Tipp person or not, who can say, but these repeated troughs that Tipp have been hitting, are disastrous.
When is the last time Tipp have strung 2 good seasons together? Or let me rephrase, when is the last time Tipp could be said to have put in a good season, then build on that the following year? Even in Nicky's time he seemed to go from a few very low seasons to winning the all-Ireland almost all of a sudden. Last year for Tipp came out of the blue, relative to previous years. Now this?
Someone down there needs to take things by the scruff. There was an article in the sunday times yesterday about Cork not taking measures to ensure their future. I think that article would read better if it were about Tipp. In contrast to Cork, Tipp actually have the players coming through. They're just not coming that extra yard through to senior. For every Lar Corbett there seems to be 2 Willie Ryans or Pa Bourkes. Lads like that should have the work put into them to bring them through because, just as Tipp haven't become a bad team overnight, lads like those 2 don't become bad players overnight either.
I think we're all getting a little bit too far ahead of ourselves..like a country mile ahead of ourselves.
Cork were excellent and that can only do well for Cork and be a positive thing if we're able to keep the intensity and everything we saw yesterday, up. Tipp had a bad day out, and it was a really bad day out, but that's what it was, a bad day out where their weaknesses were really shown up. Every team has them, and they just didn't get going from the start, while Cork started and finished at 100 miles an hour.
Tipp will unfortunately be back in the qualifers and out the other side, you don't become a bad side over night. I think it was just a bit of a nasty AI hangover, and this should really motivate them now. They're a bit like Cork in that way.
Have to agree to an extent with bottlethrower and reillers. Good win for Cork and bad day for Tipp. But although the margin of the win was unexpected, considering Tipp have only won once in Cork since 1923 I think, even during years when Tipp were winning quite a bit more, I don't think yesterday's result should have been a total surprise. What was surprising was Tipp's lack of penetration and from about twenty minutes in looked like a team heavy on their legs. While I wouldn't rate Sean óg's performance highly, only towards the end he seemed to show, there's no doubting the Cork backs had a day of it.
Still think Cork are lacking in the forwards though. Aisake was a handful yesterday but fluffs more than he makes use of. And even though he scored two points Niall McCarthy is in the same mould. I'd be very surprised if there's not a better forward on the bench. If Ben OConnor was to get injured this Cork team would have a big hole to fill.
Anyway the questions are does this mean Cork are back and can Tipp recover. In spite of Zulu trying to tease us no one ever said they'd gone away, just that they weren't the force they used to be, although yesterday's performance wasn't to be dismissed. Those long and direct balls did pay dividends. What must Ger be thinking.
Can't see Tipp becoming a bad team overnight and whatever was wrong with them yesterday expect them to be thereabouts at the end of the championship.
One question I would ask about this resurgence; Was the 'fair play' money used to good effect for panel development and was that the secret of yesterday's performance? And should other counties now be putting more emphasis on that award?
While I've no admiration for a lot of those players for their vindictivness during their strike it makes for a more interesting championship and the more teams challanging for it the better.
Quote from: bottlethrower7 on May 31, 2010, 11:09:40 AM
I'd be loathe to start dancing on Tipp's grave just yet. A single game can seriously skew perspective, especially when a team either wins or loses by a lot. The truth is often somewhere far short of people's initial reaction though, in my opinion.
Just as Tipp probably aren't as good as they showed in september, I really believe they aren't as bad as they looked yesterday. But it is a serious blow and I'd doubt their ability to salvage anything from this year's championship. They're a beaten team now, and taking that frailty on into the qualifiers is something that will be hard to overcome. I expect they will feature later in the summer, but that doubt will linger.
They have no strength in depth either. They had a couple of starters that will need to do a lot to convince that they'll ever be anything other than passengers. Then springing lads that have little or no experience to replace them. But that facet of Tipp isn't new. Time and time again they resorted to springing Benny Dunne from the bench when he was gone past his best. How have they not managed to unearth any new talent, especially considering the relatively decent underage sides they've produced? Cork, in contrast, brought on Cussen and O'Sullivan who, while both inexperienced also, you'd feel would contribute positively when introduced.
Where do they go from here? They have to continue as they've been going. I don't see they've any choice other than to do that. Sheedy needs to go. Not now, but he does need to go. He has brought some cohesion and unity to Tipp as a panel, and that was needed after the disastrous reigns of babs and doyle. But now he needs to hand over to someone who can bring the best out of Tipp as a hurling force. Whether that person is a Tipp person or not, who can say, but these repeated troughs that Tipp have been hitting, are disastrous.
When is the last time Tipp have strung 2 good seasons together? Or let me rephrase, when is the last time Tipp could be said to have put in a good season, then build on that the following year? Even in Nicky's time he seemed to go from a few very low seasons to winning the all-Ireland almost all of a sudden. Last year for Tipp came out of the blue, relative to previous years. Now this?
Someone down there needs to take things by the scruff. There was an article in the sunday times yesterday about Cork not taking measures to ensure their future. I think that article would read better if it were about Tipp. In contrast to Cork, Tipp actually have the players coming through. They're just not coming that extra yard through to senior. For every Lar Corbett there seems to be 2 Willie Ryans or Pa Bourkes. Lads like that should have the work put into them to bring them through because, just as Tipp haven't become a bad team overnight, lads like those 2 don't become bad players overnight either.
A lot of Tipps best underage players hit the booze too hard unfortunately. Sheedy can't exactly put minders on them.You also forget that Cork have more GAA clubs then anyone else. Cork have done very well at junior and intermediate all-ireland level. People worry about them in the senior club championship and their dreadful record in it. The strength of Cork hurling is in the country clubs outside the city now and the club scene reflects that.
When Cork had to field a self-inflicted 3rd string last year they stayed with most teams in Div 1. Limericks 3rd string were beaten by 30 points by Dublin . The sheer arrogance which I despise about Cork hurling and their fans is actually well founded in the belief that you will always find hurlers in Cork. You will because of the amount of clubs they have.
Mighn't be any harm anyway. Might put a spanner in the works of Munster rugby whose fans I have a pain in my arse listening to.
Tipp have the same problems they have had most of the last couple of years in that they don't have a good half forward line who can win 50-50 balls or even 40-60 balls....They need to get a few big guys who can hurl into the team.
Quote from: INDIANA on May 31, 2010, 01:23:00 PM
Quote from: bottlethrower7 on May 31, 2010, 11:09:40 AM
I'd be loathe to start dancing on Tipp's grave just yet. A single game can seriously skew perspective, especially when a team either wins or loses by a lot. The truth is often somewhere far short of people's initial reaction though, in my opinion.
Just as Tipp probably aren't as good as they showed in september, I really believe they aren't as bad as they looked yesterday. But it is a serious blow and I'd doubt their ability to salvage anything from this year's championship. They're a beaten team now, and taking that frailty on into the qualifiers is something that will be hard to overcome. I expect they will feature later in the summer, but that doubt will linger.
They have no strength in depth either. They had a couple of starters that will need to do a lot to convince that they'll ever be anything other than passengers. Then springing lads that have little or no experience to replace them. But that facet of Tipp isn't new. Time and time again they resorted to springing Benny Dunne from the bench when he was gone past his best. How have they not managed to unearth any new talent, especially considering the relatively decent underage sides they've produced? Cork, in contrast, brought on Cussen and O'Sullivan who, while both inexperienced also, you'd feel would contribute positively when introduced.
Where do they go from here? They have to continue as they've been going. I don't see they've any choice other than to do that. Sheedy needs to go. Not now, but he does need to go. He has brought some cohesion and unity to Tipp as a panel, and that was needed after the disastrous reigns of babs and doyle. But now he needs to hand over to someone who can bring the best out of Tipp as a hurling force. Whether that person is a Tipp person or not, who can say, but these repeated troughs that Tipp have been hitting, are disastrous.
When is the last time Tipp have strung 2 good seasons together? Or let me rephrase, when is the last time Tipp could be said to have put in a good season, then build on that the following year? Even in Nicky's time he seemed to go from a few very low seasons to winning the all-Ireland almost all of a sudden. Last year for Tipp came out of the blue, relative to previous years. Now this?
Someone down there needs to take things by the scruff. There was an article in the sunday times yesterday about Cork not taking measures to ensure their future. I think that article would read better if it were about Tipp. In contrast to Cork, Tipp actually have the players coming through. They're just not coming that extra yard through to senior. For every Lar Corbett there seems to be 2 Willie Ryans or Pa Bourkes. Lads like that should have the work put into them to bring them through because, just as Tipp haven't become a bad team overnight, lads like those 2 don't become bad players overnight either.
A lot of Tipps best underage players hit the booze too hard unfortunately. Sheedy can't exactly put minders on them.You also forget that Cork have more GAA clubs then anyone else. Cork have done very well at junior and intermediate all-ireland level. People worry about them in the senior club championship and their dreadful record in it. The strength of Cork hurling is in the country clubs outside the city now and the club scene reflects that.
When Cork had to field a self-inflicted 3rd string last year they stayed with most teams in Div 1. Limericks 3rd string were beaten by 30 points by Dublin . The sheer arrogance which I despise about Cork hurling and their fans is actually well founded in the belief that you will always find hurlers in Cork. You will because of the amount of clubs they have.
Mighn't be any harm anyway. Might put a spanner in the works of Munster rugby whose fans I have a pain in my arse listening to.
In as much as I'd agree with you that Cork have a huge number of clubs surely Tipp aren't exactly picking from a small pool of players themselves and must have the second largest number of hurling clubs to pick from.
Quote from: INDIANA on May 30, 2010, 07:55:19 PM
Quote from: Zulu on May 30, 2010, 06:37:37 PM
Quote from: orangeman on May 30, 2010, 06:21:25 PM
Quote from: Zulu on May 30, 2010, 06:17:01 PM
Good win for Cork but a poor match and Tipp were woeful. Will all the boys here who were writing off Cork after one or two poor performances after the 'strike' and telling us that this was proof they were wrong to take action now be back on to say otherwise?
Away and catch yourself on.
Why? Lots of muppets came on here and claimed that some of Cork's performances post-strike showed that it was the players who were the problem. Donal Og was written off as were many others, yet I bet that none of you will be on here to accept yer comments were idiotic. As it happens I don't think that this performance today justifies anything but I didn't think that any poor performances since the strike proved anything either so I'm just interested in seeing if the Cork bashers will retracted some of their stupid comments in the months post-strike.
I don't want to take this off-topic but some of the comments by some posters when Cork put in a bad performance in the past two years deserve to be highlighted for teh bullshit they were.
As for Cork, they could well win a poor Munster championship now but they still aren't great.
Was the all-ireland won today? Strange I thought it was a first round game. Will someone please put me in time machine so I can be transported to the first week of september. Was driving down Jones Road today- didn't see any Cork flags.
Rubbish, a number of lads around here tried to equate a league loss as proof of Cork's demise and that it showed the strike was a failure as the Cork lads previous performances in the championship had nothing to do with McCARTHY AND ALL TO DO WITH THE PLAYERS THEMSELVES. We now know this to be rubbish but anyone who knew their sport always thought this to be the case. I notice none of of those soothsayers have acknowleged their stupidity but instead ignore their previous comments and continue on their merry way.
In saying that I think anyone who thinks this is the re-emergence of Cork needs their head examined. Tipp were awful and Cork were a one trick pony and once AOS is taken care of, which isn't difficult, they'll struggle.
Quote from: Zulu on May 31, 2010, 05:03:28 PM
Rubbish, a number of lads around here tried to equate a league loss as proof of Cork's demise and that it showed the strike was a failure as the Cork lads previous performances in the championship had nothing to do with McCARTHY AND ALL TO DO WITH THE PLAYERS THEMSELVES. We now know this to be rubbish but anyone who knew their sport always thought this to be the case. I notice none of of those soothsayers have acknowleged their stupidity but instead ignore their previous comments and continue on their merry way.
In saying that I think anyone who thinks this is the re-emergence of Cork needs their head examined. Tipp were awful and Cork were a one trick pony and once AOS is taken care of, which isn't difficult, they'll struggle.
Why don't you name names Zulu just so that people don't feel you're pointing the finger at them.
There's a contradictory nature to that post btw
I agree with the latter part of it though. Tipp asked Cork no questions yesterday, so we'll have to see how they react come the time those questions are asked before proper judgement can be made regarding corks revival over the medium term
I haven't named anyone as those who jumped the gun should know themselves and I don't want to turn this into a 'strike' topic again. However, I did feel it needed to be highlighted as there was a lot of complete BS posted here after the Cork strike by posters who were simply trying to point score when the issue should have been left go. The fact that none of them have come on to accept the stupidity of thier comments just highlights the fact that they were trying to use any Cork failure as a stick to beat the players with rather than a fair analysis of the situation.
Where is the contradiction in my posts, I've asked already but I haven't got an answer?
QuoteI agree with the latter part of that post though. Tipp asked Cork no questions yesterday. So we'll have to see how they react before a proper judgement can be made regarding corks revival over the medium term
I thought Cork were poor in many ways yesterday and while they might win Munster, as their is only a decent Waterford standing in their way, I doubt they have enough for Galway and they definitely don't have enough for Kilkenny.
Quote from: Zulu on May 31, 2010, 05:03:28 PM
Quote from: INDIANA on May 30, 2010, 07:55:19 PM
Quote from: Zulu on May 30, 2010, 06:37:37 PM
Quote from: orangeman on May 30, 2010, 06:21:25 PM
Quote from: Zulu on May 30, 2010, 06:17:01 PM
Good win for Cork but a poor match and Tipp were woeful. Will all the boys here who were writing off Cork after one or two poor performances after the 'strike' and telling us that this was proof they were wrong to take action now be back on to say otherwise?
Away and catch yourself on.
Why? Lots of muppets came on here and claimed that some of Cork's performances post-strike showed that it was the players who were the problem. Donal Og was written off as were many others, yet I bet that none of you will be on here to accept yer comments were idiotic. As it happens I don't think that this performance today justifies anything but I didn't think that any poor performances since the strike proved anything either so I'm just interested in seeing if the Cork bashers will retracted some of their stupid comments in the months post-strike.
I don't want to take this off-topic but some of the comments by some posters when Cork put in a bad performance in the past two years deserve to be highlighted for teh bullshit they were.
As for Cork, they could well win a poor Munster championship now but they still aren't great.
Was the all-ireland won today? Strange I thought it was a first round game. Will someone please put me in time machine so I can be transported to the first week of september. Was driving down Jones Road today- didn't see any Cork flags.
Rubbish, a number of lads around here tried to equate a league loss as proof of Cork's demise and that it showed the strike was a failure as the Cork lads previous performances in the championship had nothing to do with McCARTHY AND ALL TO DO WITH THE PLAYERS THEMSELVES. We now know this to be rubbish but anyone who knew their sport always thought this to be the case. I notice none of of those soothsayers have acknowleged their stupidity but instead ignore their previous comments and continue on their merry way.
In saying that I think anyone who thinks this is the re-emergence of Cork needs their head examined. Tipp were awful and Cork were a one trick pony and once AOS is taken care of, which isn't difficult, they'll struggle.
Who exactly Zulu? You want to personalise things -don't sit on the fence. Either put up or shut up.
Quote from: Zulu on May 31, 2010, 05:24:52 PM
Where is the contradiction in my posts, I've asked already but I haven't got an answer?
Well on one hand as a result of corks performance yesterday you want certain posters to acknowledge their stupidity for suggesting that the cork team (particularly the strikers) just weren't up to it anymore. You then state that you weren't that impressed with cork. Is that not contradictory?
Honestly think Tipp gambed on "peaking" later on in the Championship and got it wrong...... very wrong. They imo looked like a team in the midst of heavy physical training or less likely overtrained.Stll think they will be there or there abouts if they regroup well and " circle the wagons "and sharpen up in training. The younger lads will learn that September 2009 is long gone and 2010 success will have to be earnt and not handed to them.
Have a hunch that Waterford will do well this summer.
Can someone tell me when Tipp actually look to be playing with a gameplan because I can't see it. When they're on form they'll test any team because they have great hurlers in their panel but KK and CK play with a strategy and you can see it. On an off day a proper strategy can still get you over the line. Tipp had an off day and looked clueless
Quote from: INDIANA on May 31, 2010, 05:26:04 PM
Quote from: Zulu on May 31, 2010, 05:03:28 PM
Quote from: INDIANA on May 30, 2010, 07:55:19 PM
Quote from: Zulu on May 30, 2010, 06:37:37 PM
Quote from: orangeman on May 30, 2010, 06:21:25 PM
Quote from: Zulu on May 30, 2010, 06:17:01 PM
Good win for Cork but a poor match and Tipp were woeful. Will all the boys here who were writing off Cork after one or two poor performances after the 'strike' and telling us that this was proof they were wrong to take action now be back on to say otherwise?
Away and catch yourself on.
Why? Lots of muppets came on here and claimed that some of Cork's performances post-strike showed that it was the players who were the problem. Donal Og was written off as were many others, yet I bet that none of you will be on here to accept yer comments were idiotic. As it happens I don't think that this performance today justifies anything but I didn't think that any poor performances since the strike proved anything either so I'm just interested in seeing if the Cork bashers will retracted some of their stupid comments in the months post-strike.
I don't want to take this off-topic but some of the comments by some posters when Cork put in a bad performance in the past two years deserve to be highlighted for teh bullshit they were.
As for Cork, they could well win a poor Munster championship now but they still aren't great.
Was the all-ireland won today? Strange I thought it was a first round game. Will someone please put me in time machine so I can be transported to the first week of september. Was driving down Jones Road today- didn't see any Cork flags.
Rubbish, a number of lads around here tried to equate a league loss as proof of Cork's demise and that it showed the strike was a failure as the Cork lads previous performances in the championship had nothing to do with McCARTHY AND ALL TO DO WITH THE PLAYERS THEMSELVES. We now know this to be rubbish but anyone who knew their sport always thought this to be the case. I notice none of of those soothsayers have acknowleged their stupidity but instead ignore their previous comments and continue on their merry way.
In saying that I think anyone who thinks this is the re-emergence of Cork needs their head examined. Tipp were awful and Cork were a one trick pony and once AOS is taken care of, which isn't difficult, they'll struggle.
Who exactly Zulu? You want to personalise things -don't sit on the fence. Either put up or shut up.
I can't recall every poster who made those comments and I'm not about to trawlel through all the posts but dowling certainly put the boot in and few more backed him up.
Quote from: theskull1 on May 31, 2010, 05:31:41 PM
Quote from: Zulu on May 31, 2010, 05:24:52 PM
Where is the contradiction in my posts, I've asked already but I haven't got an answer?
Well on one hand as a result of corks performance yesterday you want certain posters to acknowledge their stupidity for suggesting that the cork team (particularly the strikers) just weren't up to it anymore. You then state that you weren't that impressed with cork. Is that not contradictory?
Not so skull1, I was pointing out the stupidity of any sensible person using a league result to justify or support any position. Likewise yesterdays result must be viewed with caution, Cork are decent but the result doesn't prove they are anything more than that and the performance wasn't great. The point I'm making is that some lads tried to use Cork results as proof that the players were wrong, anyone with any sense knew that wasn't the case. However, if those lads use the same logic they should now acknowledge that yesterdays result was proof they were right, is that not true?
Quote from: Zulu on May 31, 2010, 05:51:47 PM
Quote from: theskull1 on May 31, 2010, 05:31:41 PM
Quote from: Zulu on May 31, 2010, 05:24:52 PM
Where is the contradiction in my posts, I've asked already but I haven't got an answer?
Well on one hand as a result of corks performance yesterday you want certain posters to acknowledge their stupidity for suggesting that the cork team (particularly the strikers) just weren't up to it anymore. You then state that you weren't that impressed with cork. Is that not contradictory?
Not so skull1, I was pointing out the stupidity of any sensible person using a league result to justify or support any position. Likewise yesterdays result must be viewed with caution, Cork are decent but the result doesn't prove they are anything more than that and the performance wasn't great. The point I'm making is that some lads tried to use Cork results as proof that the players were wrong, anyone with any sense knew that wasn't the case. However, if those lads use the same logic they should now acknowledge that yesterdays result was proof they were right, is that not true?
Think you're becoming paranoid Zulu. People made a fairly logical conclusion that Cork were finished as a force after the league final.
I used the poor performances by Tipp against Dublin and Cork in the NHL as evidence of a deeper malaise in the Tipp camp at present. But I suppose that makes me stupid as well because Cork underperformed in the NHL final.
It was ironic yesterday watching a Cork team using a direct hurling style when one of the noted problems of the strike was the use of such tactics. More then a little irony in that as well.
Nice attempt at twisting logic there Indiana. In fairness you weren't one of the lads who threw the cheap shots and I agreed with your, and others, overall assessment of Cork going forward. What I objected to was those who tried to connect a league loss with the strike and the point I'm making is to those who used that logic must now accept the Cork players were right to get rid of Gerald if results justify actions? Cork have managed something they couldn't under Gerald so they must have been right (if we use the same logic of those who put the boot in after league defeats, no?)
Quote from: Zulu on May 31, 2010, 05:51:47 PM
Not so skull1, I was pointing out the stupidity of any sensible person using a league result to justify or support any position. Likewise yesterdays result must be viewed with caution, Cork are decent but the result doesn't prove they are anything more than that and the performance wasn't great. The point I'm making is that some lads tried to use Cork results as proof that the players were wrong, anyone with any sense knew that wasn't the case. However, if those lads use the same logic they should now acknowledge that yesterdays result was proof they were right, is that not true?
Tipps inability to offer cork any real fight yesterday means that a proper assessment of just how good cork were is difficult at this stage. They put in an equally spirited performance against galway 2 years ago under Ger Mac but overall they haven't looked like AI winners for a few years now. I don't think its fair to suggest that people were basing their opinions on cork solely on the league final (a game in which they performed like tipp did yesterday). Still think you're contradicting yourself a bit with this argument
Quote from: Zulu on May 31, 2010, 06:04:33 PM
Nice attempt at twisting logic there Indiana. In fairness you weren't one of the lads who threw the cheap shots and I agreed with your, and others, overall assessment of Cork going forward. What I objected to was those who tried to connect a league loss with the strike and the point I'm making is to those who used that logic must now accept the Cork players were right to get rid of Gerald if results justify actions? Cork have managed something they couldn't under Gerald so they must have been right (if we use the same logic of those who put the boot in after league defeats, no?)
Denis Walsh is a good manager. No-one would say otherwise. But the cork hurlers can thank the likes of John Fenton for picking him. I could never agree with the tactics used to get rid of Gerald for the simple reason that it spiralled beyond sport. Which it shouldn't in an amateur scenario. That whole scenario went to a place it never should have gone. So personally while I'm a big admirer of the Cork football team I could never bring myself to like the ringleaders of the strike in terms of the Cork hurlers. A good Gaa man was disgraced and abused to the extent that he won't be involved again. thats sad in my view.
On the game itself. Cork on that display could beat everyone except Kilkenny. I really think Kilkenny are home and hosed. If the 2007 Cork model couldn't beat kilkenny. The 2010 model comprising of largely the same players definitely won't. Its the same reason why tyrone aren't capable of winning the all-ireland this season at football. Tipp were absolutely woeful yesterday. In the NHl against an average side like Dublin you could detect the softness that set in over the winter. But I assumed Cork had regressed miles back. What was shown was that experience still counts and that Tipp underage players look like following the habits of previous crews. Tipp are not doing well at u21 level and that may indicate a deeper malaise within the transition from minor to u21.
In fairness Cork used 37 players in the league but largely came back to the old dogs. the fact that Walsh can get that level of performance shows him to be a good manager.
QuoteDenis Walsh is a good manager. No-one would say otherwise. But the cork hurlers can thank the likes of John Fenton for picking him. I could never agree with the tactics used to get rid of Gerald for the simple reason that it spiralled beyond sport. Which it shouldn't in an amateur scenario. That whole scenario went to a place it never should have gone. So personally while I'm a big admirer of the Cork football team I could never bring myself to like the ringleaders of the strike in terms of the Cork hurlers. A good Gaa man was disgraced and abused to the extent that he won't be involved again. thats sad in my view.
You're missing the point I'm making. When the strike was happening we all argued our points but once it was over most of us left it at that. However, some lads tried to use some poor league results or the fact that Cork didn't progress in last years championship beyond what they did under Gerald as proof that the players were the problem and not the management. If that logic holds true they must surely retract their statements and accept the players were right and that Gerald was the problem as they have now achieved something Gerald never managed.
On the game, I thought Cork worked extremely hard and were brilliant in may ways but they don't look like a team that can score heavily and I think their backs are not what they used to be and they won't beat Kilkenny.
Zulu I'm flattered, out of all the names you could have chosen from you picked mine!
I don't go much by the league but here's what I wrote on April 5,
"While there's no doubting the calibre of some of the Cork players over the last number of years I would contend that Ger saw the need to revamp things but was prevented from doing so. Ironically all the strike achieved was to delay the changes and progress that would come about."
good man Babs. That lad just can't help himself, can he!
Quote from: bottlethrower7 on June 01, 2010, 09:41:02 AM
good man Babs. That lad just can't help himself, can he!
He's an absolute disgrace that man. he really is. Those comments he made in the INDo today are beyond the pale in my view.
Babs out of order again but some home truths in there as well !!
Babs points finger at Tipp 'failures'
Tuesday June 01 2010
IN AN angry outburst, former manager Michael 'Babs' Keating has written off Tipperary's All-Ireland prospects in the wake of Sunday's crushing Munster SHC defeat to Cork.
Keating insisted that last year's beaten All-Ireland finalists will not fancy the Qualifier route after falling to a 10-point defeat at Páirc Uí Chaoimh.
Keating, who failed to capture any silverware during his second spell in charge from 2005-07, launched another blistering attack on the current players, many of whom he managed prior to Liam Sheedy's appointment.
Sheedy masterminded successive Munster successes in 2008 and 2009, and Tipp also ran Kilkenny desperately close in last year's All-Ireland final, but Keating remains unconvinced and claimed that some players have "failed" Tipperary.
Relish
Speaking to TV3, Keating said: "If Tipp are to come through, they could have to meet Waterford, Galway and Kilkenny along the way. I don't think the players that have failed Tipperary over the last number of years will relish meeting them all.
"Having to face a couple of them will make life very tough for Tipperary."
Keating also launched a fresh defence of his tempestuous second term in charge, which saw him at odds with leading players like Brendan Cummins and Eoin Kelly.
"Decisions that myself, Tom Barry and John Leahy made managing the team four and five years ago, we made in the best interests of the people paying money and wearing the blue and gold going in the gate," he said.
During the 2007 campaign, Keating dropped both Cummins and Kelly and he reflected: "We made unpopular decisions but made those decisions in their (supporters') best interests.
"If Liam and his selectors sat down with us at that stage for a couple of hours, they need not necessarily have taken our ideas on board but he (Sheedy) could have taken a few short-cuts along the way and he would be in a better position today than he is."
Keating also took a veiled swipe at Sheedy when he spoke about Cork boss Denis Walsh's planning for Sunday's win, saying: "Denis Walsh has a history of winning All-Irelands -- he has that advantage over Liam Sheedy."
Keating once again stressed that Tipperary's half-forward division and midfield is not up to scratch and claimed that the personnel he worked with who are still playing for the Premier County did not heed the advice he had given them.
He said: "The half-forward line and midfield are not strong enough to match what's going to emerge -- that was proven in last year's All-Ireland.
"All the mistakes being made, we would have hammered those home night in, night out. Take the goal chance that Lar Corbett missed -- we missed three of those in last year's All-Ireland. Those guys did not take on board the advice that they were given.
"If (Pat) Fox or (Nicky) English got the opportunity that Lar Corbett got, it would have been a definite green flag. If Fox or English got the opportunity of three goals in last year's All-Ireland, they would be goals.
"They wouldn't be making heroes out of PJ Ryan or Donal Óg (Cusack).
"This is where the team is lacking. Until we get a grasp of that and what centre-field and half-forward play is about and add in what is typical Tipperary hurling, a good bit of steel, I don't think we're going to come back winning again."
- Jackie Cahill
Irish Independent
Quote from: INDIANA on May 31, 2010, 06:16:42 PM
Quote from: Zulu on May 31, 2010, 06:04:33 PM
Nice attempt at twisting logic there Indiana. In fairness you weren't one of the lads who threw the cheap shots and I agreed with your, and others, overall assessment of Cork going forward. What I objected to was those who tried to connect a league loss with the strike and the point I'm making is to those who used that logic must now accept the Cork players were right to get rid of Gerald if results justify actions? Cork have managed something they couldn't under Gerald so they must have been right (if we use the same logic of those who put the boot in after league defeats, no?)
Denis Walsh is a good manager. No-one would say otherwise. But the cork hurlers can thank the likes of John Fenton for picking him. I could never agree with the tactics used to get rid of Gerald for the simple reason that it spiralled beyond sport. Which it shouldn't in an amateur scenario. That whole scenario went to a place it never should have gone. So personally while I'm a big admirer of the Cork football team I could never bring myself to like the ringleaders of the strike in terms of the Cork hurlers. A good Gaa man was disgraced and abused to the extent that he won't be involved again. thats sad in my view.
On the game itself. Cork on that display could beat everyone except Kilkenny. I really think Kilkenny are home and hosed. If the 2007 Cork model couldn't beat kilkenny. The 2010 model comprising of largely the same players definitely won't. Its the same reason why tyrone aren't capable of winning the all-ireland this season at football. Tipp were absolutely woeful yesterday. In the NHl against an average side like Dublin you could detect the softness that set in over the winter. But I assumed Cork had regressed miles back. What was shown was that experience still counts and that Tipp underage players look like following the habits of previous crews. Tipp are not doing well at u21 level and that may indicate a deeper malaise within the transition from minor to u21.
In fairness Cork used 37 players in the league but largely came back to the old dogs. the fact that Walsh can get that level of performance shows him to be a good manager.
First off, Zulu is right in a way, I mean a lot of people, proabably (and I'll stand corrected if I'm wrong) you as well, gave the players and awful hard doing especially when they were, to put it lightly, humiliated and destroyed, ripped apart by Kilkenny under Walsh's first game.
Everyone had a go, and no doubt, ye all enjoyed it, and if that was the side you were on I wouln't blame ye for it. A lot had a go about how Gerald wasn't the problem, the players were, they were passed it and couldn't except that their failures had nothing to do with Gerald, and that game highlighted it, but I don't blame ye for thinking that, and it's hard to say oh well now ye've to come on and take it back because a lot has changed in a year. We'd no fight then, everyone was exhausted and drained while players like Gardiner had aged 5 years.
I am not getting back into the issues of the strike and I probably wont bring it up after this post, I've no desire to debate them, but maybe one day you'll see the other side and the necessity of the strike will come to light, Gerald was a victim of the CCB's games. But BOTH sides were abused, BOTH sides experienced months of criticism that they never should have had to deal with, especially as amateurs. And I hope no one ever is put in that position again. It was horrible experience for BOTH sides. But all of it was down to the games the CCB played. And I know that things were said and done from BOTH sides that they regret now.
At the end of the day, they were thrown into a pit and the CCB presumed that Gerald would come out of it, he didn't. And that was that. It was a scrap for their lives and we all know what happened.
And now, because of it, the clubs have their voice, and most incredibily and importantly, out of the horrible mess of the strike, the clubs forum was born. Now things are questioned more and things are a little bit more democratic and see through. While all along the CCB now know that the clubs have power and if they have to will stand against them again. And that is only good for the game in Cork. No question about that.
But without the strike that happened, things wouldn't have been done the way they were, and have never picked someone like Walsh. Instead another person they could hold unde their tumb.
You're right though we've Jimmy Barry-Murphy, John Fenton and Denis Coughlan, to thank for what's happened this season just as much as the rest of the players and Walsh and the clubs forum, without their hard work we'd never have appointed Denis Walsh, who has brought calm and unity back into a squad that really needed something to lift the cloud.
I mean it was highlighted there in the game, Gardiner had aged about 5 years in the strike, no exageration, and Donal Og spoke about it in his book, that Gardiner was under all kinds of stress and taking it really hard. They all were. But I wont pretend that I was happy about seeing Gerald been thrown around by the CCB and things were said on both sides that I genuinely think both sides regret, and it's sad what happened, but both sides were at fault.
No one came out of the strike well, neither sides did, in your mind it was black and white, the hurlers won and a good GAA man lost, but nobody came out of it well. Not even close.
I hope now though, maybe a bit naive but anyway, that we can now fully move on from it. It's been a horrible long road to this point. And no one ever again wants to see the amateur game dragged through the mud like it was.
I don't expect you and any of your lot to change your view on it now, and I certainly wont change my view on things. But we're allowed to adapt and move with the time and hopefully soon there will be enough time and space for us to fully move on from what happened.
There was no winner..hurling lost and that's the truth of it.
You, and everyone else for that matter, has your views, I've mine, and they'll probably never change and I've no desire to try and change them now.
I just gotta wonder how long will it take for Cork hurling just to be about hurling.
Is it wrong of me to think that we were past it all ready. I suppose.
Quote from: orangeman on June 01, 2010, 12:29:28 PM
Babs out of order again but some home truths in there as well !!
Babs points finger at Tipp 'failures'
Tuesday June 01 2010
IN AN angry outburst, former manager Michael 'Babs' Keating has written off Tipperary's All-Ireland prospects
I love reading Babs interviews. He has no tact but is very entertaining.
Quote from: Reillers on June 01, 2010, 01:34:35 PM
I just gotta wonder how long will it take for Cork hurling just to be about hurling.
Is it wrong of me to think that we were past it all ready. I suppose.
What with media profiles, book deals and endorsement opertunities, you'd better ask the players Reillers
As good as some of them still are on the pitch I have zero respect for many on that panel and will be happy to see those humiliated in the same way they tried to humiliate Ger Mac. Whether that will happen this year is not in my hands. Gut feeling ....I still think they will fall short this year but I may very well be wrong. Truth is Sundays game was not enough to judge whether cork are back at the right level again due to Tipp being so bad.
Babs is a bitter mouth piece, how can he come out and stab guys in the back that he used to train and manage. No decency about the man whatsoever.
Thought the match was great intesity wise, Cork definitely got that part right. I dont think their hurling was particularly good. They closed Tipp down all over and didnt give them a second. Also was good to see the adapting to the new tatic of Ohalpin on the edge of the square def gave them an added dimension.
Be interesting to see them next time out if they can rise to that level again, plus people will have caught on to the direct route tactic.
I think it might be the catalyst fot Tipp in a strange way, throw off the caution and just really go for it!
Quote from: NAG1 on June 01, 2010, 02:37:10 PM
Babs is a bitter mouth piece, how can he come out and stab guys in the back that he used to train and manage. No decency about the man whatsoever.
Thought the match was great intesity wise, Cork definitely got that part right. I dont think their hurling was particularly good. They closed Tipp down all over and didnt give them a second. Also was good to see the adapting to the new tatic of Ohalpin on the edge of the square def gave them an added dimension.
Be interesting to see them next time out if they can rise to that level again, plus people will have caught on to the direct route tactic.
I think it might be the catalyst fot Tipp in a strange way, throw off the caution and just really go for it!
He's certainly well balanced with chips on both shoulders is our Babs. His wee dig about Sheedy not having won an AI as a player is a bit petty all the same.
Nice of him to offer to sit down with Sheedy and the Co board to help out, the arrogance of the man knows no bounds.
No wonder Sean McGuinness was going to box the ears of him way years ago.
or maybe Babs is a psychological genius. Sure didn't comments he made once inspire Offaly to win an all-Ireland?
I wonder if he'll get a mention when Tipp win the all-Ireland, having used Babs' comments as their motivation to do so?
Quote from: bottlethrower7 on June 02, 2010, 08:44:23 AM
or maybe Babs is a psychological genius. Sure didn't comments he made once inspire Offaly to win an all-Ireland?
I wonder if he'll get a mention when Tipp win the all-Ireland, having used Babs' comments as their motivation to do so?
True but the idea that Sheedy should have sat down with the Great One prior to the job is ludricrous. The idea that sheedy isn't up to it because he didn't win an all-ireland as a player again is ridiculous. Bitter bitter man.
Quote from: INDIANA on June 02, 2010, 09:22:39 AM
Quote from: bottlethrower7 on June 02, 2010, 08:44:23 AM
or maybe Babs is a psychological genius. Sure didn't comments he made once inspire Offaly to win an all-Ireland?
I wonder if he'll get a mention when Tipp win the all-Ireland, having used Babs' comments as their motivation to do so?
True but the idea that Sheedy should have sat down with the Great One prior to the job is ludricrous. The idea that sheedy isn't up to it because he didn't win an all-ireland as a player again is ridiculous. Bitter bitter man.
Babs is a great man at helping teams win All-Irelands. Sure didn't he help the donkeys of Cork win the derby back in 1990?
And the Sheep in a Heap in 1998.
Tipp star says former mentor Keating should 'think twice' before criticism
Tipperary midfielder Shane McGrath hit back at stinging criticism from within the county last night by insisting that one defeat won't floor their championship challenge.
McGrath admitted comments from former manager Michael 'Babs' Keating and former secretary Tommy Barrett were "not helpful" to the team's recovery.
Keating had accused the Tipperary hurlers of failing the county and predicted that they would not have the capacity to work their way through the qualifiers. It's not the first time Babs has criticised players he worked with without success between 2005 and 2007.
critics
McGrath has urged critics such as Keating to "think twice" about what they say in the future.
"Babs is a pundit. If people say these things, maybe they should think twice about saying them, but they don't and they say these things so they'll sell papers or they'll be listened to. I'd always thank Babs for giving me my chance in inter-county hurling, but that's in the past now," said McGrath.
"Some of the finest hurlers in the country are on our team. You don't become a bad team overnight. I don't really take what these people say to heart. If you did, you would just give up hurling in the morning.
"It's probably not helpful," admitted McGrath, who said he understood that Babs and Barrett knew an era when Tipperary were all-conquering.
"They just want to see Tipp hurling at the top and that's fair enough. No one went out to play a bad match on Sunday; we all went out to do our best. The great positive I take from that is the same thing happened to Kerry last year and look where they ended up."
Tipperary's heaviest defeat to Cork in the Munster Championship since 1942 sparked criticism and prompted a meeting of the players and management last night. So far, manager Liam Sheedy has kept his counsel on criticism from Keating and others.
Tipperary will now take a week off training before resuming their preparations for qualifiers they haven't always been favourably disposed to.
Barrett has also hit out at Sunday's referee on local radio, suggesting he hasn't been a fan of Barry Kelly in the past.
"I didn't like the referee, first of all, I never liked him. When Cork are playing Tipp, it's always a massive game, a strong game, a hard game," said Barrett.
"You must have a good, strong referee. He pulled Paul Curran for handpassing the ball (in the first half); he let Cork go four times before that."
- Colm Keys
Irish Independent
Babs really doesn't know when to stop does he..
And Shane McGrath saying he didn't like the ref and never did..not the smartest thing he could have said, no matter how much he dislikes him.
Quote from: Reillers on June 02, 2010, 12:35:08 PM
Babs really doesn't know when to stop does he..
And Shane McGrath saying he didn't like the ref and never did..not the smartest thing he could have said, no matter how much he dislikes him.
Shane Mc Grath didn't say that. He's bit cuter than that hopefully.
Read it again. ;)
looks like Tommy Barrett was the man critising the referee.
QuoteBarrett has also hit out at Sunday's referee on local radio, suggesting he hasn't been a fan of Barry Kelly in the past.
Or if it was Donal Og you meant, then I'd agree with you, although Kelly didn't do anything wrong to Ogie on Sunday in fairness.
Quote from: orangeman on June 02, 2010, 01:49:55 PM
Quote from: Reillers on June 02, 2010, 12:35:08 PM
Babs really doesn't know when to stop does he..
And Shane McGrath saying he didn't like the ref and never did..not the smartest thing he could have said, no matter how much he dislikes him.
Shane Mc Grath didn't say that. He's bit cuter than that hopefully.
Read it again. ;)
Haha..so he didin't.
Just proves what I often said to you Reillers. You don't read things properly before you jump in feet first.
You're getting on in previous posts bringing up the strike as if that's what was needed for Cork to beat Tipp as if it hadn't happened before or that Cork hadn't great victories before. Catch yourself on.
Most of us said Tipp would be Kilkenny's main rivals last year and Cork had slipped down the pecking order and we were right.
And if you believe Sunday's victory justifies the vile treament meted out to Ger McCarthy by the strikers and the the contempt they held the whole GAA in then thats a sad reflection on you.
Quote from: dowling on June 02, 2010, 06:56:15 PM
Just proves what I often said to you Reillers. You don't read things properly before you jump in feet first.
You're getting on in previous posts bringing up the strike as if that's what was needed for Cork to beat Tipp as if it hadn't happened before or that Cork hadn't great victories before. Catch yourself on.
Most of us said Tipp would be Kilkenny's main rivals last year and Cork had slipped down the pecking order and we were right.
And if you believe Sunday's victory justifies the vile treament meted out to Ger McCarthy by the strikers and the the contempt they held the whole GAA in then thats a sad reflection on you.
..Ya..and I don't read posts..really like. ::) ::)
Well I'm glad you agree with one thing I said!