At end of last year Liam Griffin made ten wishes for the GAA this year, one of them being that the disgraceful antics of the Waterford hurling team at the start of the All-Ireland would not be repeated. He was referring to the tactics of "getting to know" your opponent before the game and it seems this is anintegral part of Davy Fitzs preperations and that video posted on You Tube has gone to his head. The strike on Eddie Brennan yesterday was an absolute disgrace and has no part whatsoever in hurling and don't let anyone tell me that drawing across a players head deliberately with a hurl has a part in the game - not even in Laois.
Why did Brennan get sent off? Can't figure it out. I think Fitzgerald is a good coach but he's too demented in his approach to be top quality in my view. Believe me Waterford will pay for that yesterday later on in the year if they play the Cats. There is no county better at lowering the blades then kilkenny. And they do it on the ball which means they never get caught.
From the telly, there was no way Brennan should have got the line. He actually thought he was getting a yellow himself and had to double take.
I wasn't there, but I can only assume Brennan struck Prendergast earlier on. If not, it was ridiculous decision.
Bad blow by Prendergast though, no excuses.
Ah I suppose we should not dwell on it. But: I am delighted to see the progress that the Dub's are making in the hurling and I would hate to see young up and coming hurlers being blackguarded before they even get onto the field. Fitz would want to tone it down a bit, that's all I am saying. My interpretation of his after match interview was that they won because of the tough tackling they displayed and that others who wanted to get into the team would have to show the same tougness. If that be his motto then he would want to be consistent at it when they meet a more physical side than they are.
Quote from: AZOffaly on March 02, 2009, 11:25:16 AM
From the telly, there was no way Brennan should have got the line. He actually thought he was getting a yellow himself and had to double take.
I wasn't there, but I can only assume Brennan struck Prendergast earlier on. If not, it was ridiculous decision.
Bad blow by Prendergast though, no excuses.
you assume wrong. The telly captured pretty much the whole incident. Brennan was badly wronged. The belt followed that shoulder charge of Brennan's on Prendergast. It was slightly awkward and a little off shoulder-to-shoulder, but far from deserving an assault such as the one meted out by Prendergast. The ref needs to admit his wrongdoing also. If not I'd imagine this will be strongly appealed.
I read a piece a few months ago about Waterfords preparation for the All Ireland Final and one Waterford player was having trouble sleeping because of what Davy Fitz wanted to do before the ball was thrown in, i.e. attempting to take the head off his man. It obviously does not sit well with some of them.
Was at the AI final and Fitzy was roaring at his players all the way through the warm up which is fair enough - but contrast that to Cody who just stood and watched the warm up.
Then as they went to take their places, Tommy Walsh was obviously a target - his man just came over and belted him even before the throw in.
The rest as they say is history.
Prendergast will be looking at 3 months for this I'd say.
It looked that the ref sent both off on the advice of the umpire. KK will appeal Eddie's sending off, I'd say.
Wrong approach when playing a kilkenny team trained by Cody. Lowering the blades never cut any ice with kilkenny and believe me come championship time it won't . To beat kilkenny you have to out-hurl them. Fitzgerald is too obssessed with hurling in my view.
Quote from: Minder on March 02, 2009, 11:38:14 AM
I read a piece a few months ago about Waterfords preparation for the All Ireland Final and one Waterford player was having trouble sleeping because of what Davy Fitz wanted to do before the ball was thrown in, i.e. attempting to take the head off his man. It obviously does not sit well with some of them.
Davy Fitz wasn't managing Waterford in the days of Shane Aherne and Noel Crowley, so as demented as Davy Fitz is the Waterford lads don't normally need any coaxing in giving their neighbours a bit of a whaling from time to time.
Quote from: orangeman on March 02, 2009, 11:44:21 AM
Was at the AI final and Fitzy was roaring at his players all the way through the warm up which is fair enough - but contrast that to Cody who just stood and watched the warm up.
Then as they went to take their places, Tommy Walsh was obviously a target - his man just came over and belted him even before the throw in.
The rest as they say is history.
Prendergast will be looking at 3 months for this I'd say.
It looked that the ref sent both off on the advice of the umpire. KK will appeal Eddie's sending off, I'd say.
If there was one fella you dont wanta to do it too its him hed eat ya for breakfast, He played a stormer in the final after the slap too.
This will spur the cats on and be something for them to feed on for the rest of the year. God help waterford if they mean up again.
I cant see the cats resort to out and out dirt, they have no need and i dont think cody would allow it.
Quote from: youngfella on March 02, 2009, 01:05:18 PM
Quote from: orangeman on March 02, 2009, 11:44:21 AM
Was at the AI final and Fitzy was roaring at his players all the way through the warm up which is fair enough - but contrast that to Cody who just stood and watched the warm up.
Then as they went to take their places, Tommy Walsh was obviously a target - his man just came over and belted him even before the throw in.
The rest as they say is history.
Prendergast will be looking at 3 months for this I'd say.
It looked that the ref sent both off on the advice of the umpire. KK will appeal Eddie's sending off, I'd say.
If there was one fella you dont wanta to do it too its him hed eat ya for breakfast, He played a stormer in the final after the slap too.
This will spur the cats on and be something for them to feed on for the rest of the year. God help waterford if they mean up again.
I cant see the cats resort to out and out dirt, they have no need and i dont think cody would allow it.
Kilkenny do play a physical brand of hurling which does spill over into the 'beyond the rules' and Cody has had his dark days too especially when he prowled thurles like a bear the day Galway got their comeuppance for beating the cats in the previous years semi-final. He intimidated the referee something awful that day. Some kilkenny players overstepped the mark that day too with Hickey clothesling an incoming Galway forward early on in the game.
Kilkenny are no angels and they have good hurlers but they also have men well capable of doing a job when the need arises but all good teams need those types from time to time.
Quote from: johnneycool on March 02, 2009, 12:24:51 PM
Quote from: Minder on March 02, 2009, 11:38:14 AM
I read a piece a few months ago about Waterfords preparation for the All Ireland Final and one Waterford player was having trouble sleeping because of what Davy Fitz wanted to do before the ball was thrown in, i.e. attempting to take the head off his man. It obviously does not sit well with some of them.
Davy Fitz wasn't managing Waterford in the days of Shane Aherne and Noel Crowley, so as demented as Davy Fitz is the Waterford lads don't normally need any coaxing in giving their neighbours a bit of a whaling from time to time.
I was thinking the same myself. I think Davy would bring out the inner Bla-ness in them :D There were some Waterford teams down the years that drove up the price of ash on their own.
Quote from: johnneycool on March 02, 2009, 02:01:35 PM
..Cody has had his dark days too especially when he prowled thurles like a bear the day Galway got their comeuppance for beating the cats in the previous years semi-final. He intimidated the referee something awful that day.
'Days'?
name another.
was him and Daly not shouldering each other along the line in CP a few years back?
Not saying its a bad thing, just keeping a bit of prespective in the debate.
Quote from: johnneycool on March 02, 2009, 03:54:01 PM
was him and Daly not shouldering each other along the line in CP a few years back?
Not saying its a bad thing, just keeping a bit of prespective in the debate.
him and the Rock maybe. But that was a nothing incident. The Rock was acting the maggot and Cody wasn't gonna let him have his way. Don't recall anything with him and Daly.
Generally though Cody is as composed as they come. The only time hes ever shown emotion during games in my recollection were the incident you mentioned, and the time he collapsed in a heap when Mick Jacob scored that goal in the last minute of the 2004 leinster semi-final. Otherwise hes fairly poker-faced, and does it very well.
Ya can watch the game in full on tg4 website, just watched it, fast paced game for march time.
That was wile dirty stroke Prendergast played on eddie, no call for it. The ref really looked after waterford, very one sided in that respect. Eoin kelly also had a swing at tommy walsh with the stick and missed, should be looked into.
I dont like watching dorty teams and its thats the only idea davy has for beating kilkenny, he should reconsider management, before someone gets badly hurt.
Kilkenny are no angels but most of the dirt seems to have left there game in the last few years and they have got there just deserves cleaning up all round them.
Quote from: youngfella on March 02, 2009, 06:12:10 PM
Ya can watch the game in full on tg4 website, just watched it, fast paced game for march time.
That was wile dirty stroke Prendergast played on eddie, no call for it. The ref really looked after waterford, very one sided in that respect. Eoin kelly also had a swing at tommy walsh with the stick and missed, should be looked into.
I dont like watching dorty teams and its thats the only idea davy has for beating kilkenny, he should reconsider management, before someone gets badly hurt.
Kilkenny are no angels but most of the dirt seems to have left there game in the last few years and they have got there just deserves cleaning up all round them.
Waterford would have needed that referee last September ! He has been kind to them.That was my comment on Sunday watching the match live on TG4. Can antone tell me what Brennan has been reported for ? It's still not clear.
Quote from: orangeman on March 03, 2009, 01:13:46 PM
That was my comment on Sunday watching the match live on TG4. Can antone tell me what Brennan has been reported for ? It's still not clear.
Kilkenny are waiting on the report. No one knows yet.
Kilkenny attacker Eddie Brennan has requested a personal hearing after the Central Competitions Control Committee proposed a four-week ban following his sending off in the Allianz NHL Division One clash with Waterford last Sunday.
The Irish Times' website is reporting that Waterford have yet to receive a referee's report on the incident which also saw Declan Prendergast sent off after he struck out at Brennan.
The report suggests, however, that the Déise defender could be facing an eight-week suspension after striking Brennan with his hurl at Walsh Park.
Brennan heard of the CCCC's recommendation today and his case is expected to be heard by the Central Hearings Committee (CHC) this week. The minimum ban for a red card is four weeks.
The Graigue-Ballycallan clubman will miss league encounters with Tipperary and Clare if his appeal is not successful.
Quote from: orangeman on March 03, 2009, 06:07:57 PM
Kilkenny attacker Eddie Brennan has requested a personal hearing after the Central Competitions Control Committee proposed a four-week ban following his sending off in the Allianz NHL Division One clash with Waterford last Sunday.
The Irish Times' website is reporting that Waterford have yet to receive a referee's report on the incident which also saw Declan Prendergast sent off after he struck out at Brennan.
The report suggests, however, that the Déise defender could be facing an eight-week suspension after striking Brennan with his hurl at Walsh Park.
Brennan heard of the CCCC's recommendation today and his case is expected to be heard by the Central Hearings Committee (CHC) this week. The minimum ban for a red card is four weeks.
The Graigue-Ballycallan clubman will miss league encounters with Tipperary and Clare if his appeal is not successful.
Kilkenny are playing Galway in a back-match this sunday. They need to get it sorted by then as they're really thing on the ground panel-wise at the moment.
Prendergast should have gotten 6 months. Hopefully common sense prevails and Brennan will be exonerated.
That ref is some tool though. Hopefully he'll never be given another game again.
Quote from: bottlethrower7 on March 04, 2009, 10:06:53 AM
Quote from: orangeman on March 03, 2009, 06:07:57 PM
Kilkenny attacker Eddie Brennan has requested a personal hearing after the Central Competitions Control Committee proposed a four-week ban following his sending off in the Allianz NHL Division One clash with Waterford last Sunday.
The Irish Times' website is reporting that Waterford have yet to receive a referee's report on the incident which also saw Declan Prendergast sent off after he struck out at Brennan.
The report suggests, however, that the Déise defender could be facing an eight-week suspension after striking Brennan with his hurl at Walsh Park.
Brennan heard of the CCCC's recommendation today and his case is expected to be heard by the Central Hearings Committee (CHC) this week. The minimum ban for a red card is four weeks.
The Graigue-Ballycallan clubman will miss league encounters with Tipperary and Clare if his appeal is not successful.
Kilkenny are playing Galway in a back-match this sunday. They need to get it sorted by then as they're really thing on the ground panel-wise at the moment.
Prendergast should have gotten 6 months. Hopefully common sense prevails and Brennan will be exonerated.
That ref is some tool though. Hopefully he'll never be given another game again.
[/b]
They reckon he's the reald deal !! One of the up and coming lads. But it wasn't his fault - the umpire got Brennan sent off.
Quote from: orangeman on March 04, 2009, 10:32:11 AM
Quote from: bottlethrower7 on March 04, 2009, 10:06:53 AM
Quote from: orangeman on March 03, 2009, 06:07:57 PM
Kilkenny attacker Eddie Brennan has requested a personal hearing after the Central Competitions Control Committee proposed a four-week ban following his sending off in the Allianz NHL Division One clash with Waterford last Sunday.
The Irish Times' website is reporting that Waterford have yet to receive a referee's report on the incident which also saw Declan Prendergast sent off after he struck out at Brennan.
The report suggests, however, that the Déise defender could be facing an eight-week suspension after striking Brennan with his hurl at Walsh Park.
Brennan heard of the CCCC's recommendation today and his case is expected to be heard by the Central Hearings Committee (CHC) this week. The minimum ban for a red card is four weeks.
The Graigue-Ballycallan clubman will miss league encounters with Tipperary and Clare if his appeal is not successful.
Kilkenny are playing Galway in a back-match this sunday. They need to get it sorted by then as they're really thing on the ground panel-wise at the moment.
Prendergast should have gotten 6 months. Hopefully common sense prevails and Brennan will be exonerated.
That ref is some tool though. Hopefully he'll never be given another game again.
[/b]
They reckon he's the reald deal !! One of the up and coming lads. But it wasn't his fault - the umpire got Brennan sent off.
yep, I have a certain degree of sympathy. The ref wrote and submitted the report though.
The Waterford version on AFR is that Brennan lashed Prendergast across the chest with the hurley just before the shouldering and subsequent strike by Prendergast and it's reported that's what the umpires told the referee when consulted. If there's any truth in it it'd maybe explain why Eddie got a red from what looked just like a bit of shoulder jostling on his part.
Haven't seen it reported elsewhere or on here so maybe I'm totally wrong here but my view on the incident was that Prendergast didn't actually make contact with Brennan. Brennan's helmet is out of shot on the main camera and from the other camera the hurley makes a swing past his helmet without any sign of the momentum being impacted. Therefore I think Brennan made a meal of this and dived, the actions of another Waterford fella in telling him to get up would seem to back this up. I would love to think he got the red for diving but as I understand it the appropriate sanction is only a black card. Good to hear Prendergast isn't gonna appeal his suspension anyway as he deserves it for even attempting to strike... Took away from a decent game and you'd fear for Waterford if they come up against KK again this year, Cody will have them well motivated...
Quote from: johnneycool on March 04, 2009, 01:44:20 PM
The Waterford version on AFR is that Brennan lashed Prendergast across the chest with the hurley just before the shouldering and subsequent strike by Prendergast and it's reported that's what the umpires told the referee when consulted. If there's any truth in it it'd maybe explain why Eddie got a red from what looked just like a bit of shoulder jostling on his part.
no, that didn't happen. At no time did Brennan strike Prendergast. He hit him an awkward shoulder, meeting him more in his chest than not. Thats what provoked the reaction.
And Brennan would have been reported for the same offense as Prendergast if that was what the umpires told the ref they saw. That being the case he also would have received an 8-week ban. As it is, he received a 4-week ban for god-knows-what. I can't wait to see what the report says, but it can't have been striking an opponent, as that carries a minimum of 8 weeks.
Kilkenny have been at the forefront of tough hurling for the last ten years, If you watch their tackling it is verging on a foul nearly every time a player attempts to go past them.
Also if you watch the incident were the yellow cards were handed out, it was a bad Slap by tommy walsh that started the shemuzzle (not his first either) and I dont think think that kelly hot head and all that he is should have taken that from him either and he was right to chastise him for it. The ref should have black carded the two of them and played on.
As I said at the start of the thread, it is Davy Fitz's styl of managemnt to get it into the heads of his players that "gettng to know" your marker even before the game starts is what is required if "you want to battle your way into my team". It is a style that is outdated, stupid looking and innefective as it was in The All-Ireland and quite frankly, in that video on You Tube he looked a right tool for his famous oration. Having said that, I admire Fitzy for his contribution to the GAA and hurling in particular.
So, when this 50's style man marking and drawing across players is introduced don't expect the likes of Tommy Walsh to just stand there and take it. It is not part of Codys plan to be more physical but I think the Cats will give as god as they get any day.
I didnt see kelly drawing across Tommy Walsh as he ghosted passed him with the ball, I did see tommy walsh, slapping him with the hurl. Thats not replying to any sort of dirt that is jsut plain and simple dirt.
Maybe Tommy owed it to him for the treatment that was meeted out to him before a ball was thrown in, in last years All-Ireland which Liam Griffin referred to ?
Wheter the stroke on Eddie Brennan connected hard enough or he dived it was, to use a Laois term, a bit Castletownish or Clonadish. !!
Quote from: Bud Wiser on March 05, 2009, 06:35:07 PM
Maybe Tommy owed it to him for the treatment that was meeted out to him before a ball was thrown in, in last years All-Ireland which Liam Griffin referred to ?
So that makes it okay? And I'm not being one-eyed or partisan, I think Declan Prendergast will be fierce lucky to only get an eight-week ban. If you pulled across someone with a piece of wood in the streets you'd do well to avoid jail, even if the victim stayed standing. I just don't know why getting vengeance for an act that might have happened six months ago is somehow in a different league.
Quote from: deiseach on March 05, 2009, 08:21:59 PM
Quote from: Bud Wiser on March 05, 2009, 06:35:07 PM
Maybe Tommy owed it to him for the treatment that was meeted out to him before a ball was thrown in, in last years All-Ireland which Liam Griffin referred to ?
So that makes it okay? And I'm not being one-eyed or partisan, I think Declan Prendergast will be fierce lucky to only get an eight-week ban. If you pulled across someone with a piece of wood in the streets you'd do well to avoid jail, even if the victim stayed standing. I just don't know why getting vengeance for an act that might have happened six months ago is somehow in a different league.
no, its completely irrelevant. What makes it in a different league is that Walsh connected rather clumsily with Kelly's arm. Prendergast on the other hand struck Eddie Brennan across the head with his hurl.
if both those happened out on the street, as you put it, what would happen?
Can we lose the comparison to what would happen if you did it on a street - if you hit someone a fair shoulder on the street, you'd be arrested..
QuoteCan we lose the comparison to what would happen if you did it on a street - if you hit someone a fair shoulder on the street, you'd be arrested..
:)
Quote from: bottlethrower7 on March 06, 2009, 10:22:12 AM
no, its completely irrelevant. What makes it in a different league is that Walsh connected rather clumsily with Kelly's arm. Prendergast on the other hand struck Eddie Brennan across the head with his hurl.
if both those happened out on the street, as you put it, what would happen?
Inherent in Bud Wiser's comments is the notion that Walsh was getting revenge, so it would hardly be 'clumsy' then, would it? If you deliberately hit someone in the street, I doubt if the beak would be worried if it were the arm or the head as long as premeditation could be demonstrated
Quote from: bottlethrower7 on March 06, 2009, 10:22:12 AM
Quote from: deiseach on March 05, 2009, 08:21:59 PM
Quote from: Bud Wiser on March 05, 2009, 06:35:07 PM
Maybe Tommy owed it to him for the treatment that was meeted out to him before a ball was thrown in, in last years All-Ireland which Liam Griffin referred to ?
So that makes it okay? And I'm not being one-eyed or partisan, I think Declan Prendergast will be fierce lucky to only get an eight-week ban. If you pulled across someone with a piece of wood in the streets you'd do well to avoid jail, even if the victim stayed standing. I just don't know why getting vengeance for an act that might have happened six months ago is somehow in a different league.
no, its completely irrelevant. What makes it in a different league is that Walsh connected rather clumsily with Kelly's arm. Prendergast on the other hand struck Eddie Brennan across the head with his hurl.
if both those happened out on the street, as you put it, what would happen?
Id say your'e being a bit generous calling the slap across the arm whilst a good few inches from the ball as 'clumsy'.
I stil think there was intent but I'll also say slapping a lad on the arm or shoulder doesn't compare to slapping a lad on the head, helmet or no helmet.
Little Tommy Walsh can be a wee bit clumsy at times ;)
To be honest, no matter what way you dress it up or down, it was an absolutely disgraceful stroke. IMO there is NEVER a situation where this is acceptible, and im sure brennan isnt totaly innocent, but it is no excuse. Is brennans ban sticking?
Brennans ban has been overturned according to the irish news today