Sinn Fein? They have gone away, you know.

Started by Trevor Hill, January 18, 2010, 12:28:52 AM

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SuperMac

Quote from: Trevor Hill on January 24, 2010, 06:44:38 PM
It is sadly the truth. Many of us may not like it, myself included, but the 6 counties remain British and will do so for the forseable future. Anyone who thinks anything different is living in cloud cuckcoo land.
So the nationalist population is not going to keep increasing but inexplicablly come to a halt ? Your living in cloud cuckoo land.

pintsofguinness

Quote from: Trevor Hill on January 24, 2010, 06:44:38 PM
It is sadly the truth. Many of us may not like it, myself included, but the 6 counties remain British and will do so for the forseable future. Anyone who thinks anything different is living in cloud cuckcoo land.
get that hard to believe
Which one of you bitches wants to dance?

Maguire01

Quote from: Nally Stand on January 23, 2010, 10:11:43 PM
You ask "What alternative path?" That is exactly my point. People who are most vocal in opposition to SF's current strategy for unity don't seem to be forthcoming with an alternative idea.
Where do we need the alternative ideas? We've all signed up to the GFA, SF included - we don't need to go thinking up ideas, we've decided we'll unite when the majority want to.

Quote from: Nally Stand on January 23, 2010, 10:16:58 PM
They are now in a process of building community relations and are the only party with a unionist outreach branch, which aims to build trust and persuade moderate unionists that a UI is in fact nothing to fear.
Maybe other parties don't need an explicit 'unionist outreach branch'. Maybe other parties don't have as far to reach.

Trevor Hill

I am Irish, and like most other northerners I aspire to a united Ireland, but I think a lot of northern nationalists need a severe dose of reality. We are further away from a united Ireland than ever before. The GFA has seen to that. This idea that there will be a handover in 2016 is absolute nonsense. It simply will not happen. While Britain may have no strategic interest in the north, it still has the best part of a million unionists to think about. You also have to realise that the unionist MPs are going to have a large bearing on the next parliament, the Conservatives have already realised that and are arranging pacts as we speak.
In my opinion we will not see a united Ireland in our lifetime.

orangeman

Quote from: Trevor Hill on January 24, 2010, 06:58:34 PM
I am Irish, and like most other northerners I aspire to a united Ireland, but I think a lot of northern nationalists need a severe dose of reality. We are further away from a united Ireland than ever before. The GFA has seen to that. This idea that there will be a handover in 2016 is absolute nonsense. It simply will not happen. While Britain may have no strategic interest in the north, it still has the best part of a million unionists to think about. You also have to realise that the unionist MPs are going to have a large bearing on the next parliament, the Conservatives have already realised that and are arranging pacts as we speak.
In my opinion we will not see a united Ireland in our lifetime.

Couldn't argue a lot with that other than to add as I've done before is that I could see a fair few nationalists not turning out to vote in a referendum about the border cos they're happy enough where they're at currently and can't see joining up with Dublin as having too many plus points.

Trevor Hill

Quote from: SuperMac on January 24, 2010, 06:48:06 PM
Quote from: Trevor Hill on January 24, 2010, 06:44:38 PM
It is sadly the truth. Many of us may not like it, myself included, but the 6 counties remain British and will do so for the foreseeable future. Anyone who thinks anything different is living in cloud cuckoo land.
So the nationalist population is not going to keep increasing but inexplicablly come to a halt ? Your living in cloud cuckoo land.

Thinking like that is part of the problem. We simply cannot out breed them. We ve had the best part of a century to do so, but haven't managed it yet. Even if we did mange to get a majority, what do we do with what is still going to be a sizeable minority. We cannot send the planters back.

Quote from: orangeman on January 24, 2010, 07:05:12 PM
Couldn't argue a lot with that other than to add as I've done before is that I could see a fair few nationalists not turning out to vote in a referendum about the border cos they're happy enough where they're at currently and can't see joining up with Dublin as having too many plus points.

I actually think that we would turn out in droves if there was ever to be such a referendum. I haven't voted in years, but I would definitely vote for that.

longrunsthefox

Chatting to a fellow this week who votes SF. He reckons we are aren't in effect under British rule now and happy can express his Irishness. To me our expression of Irishness is a right we should have had all along. The rest re-British rule is an as good as it gets attitude... 'sure it'll do rightly' which a lot of nationalists have now. 

Zapatista

Quote from: longrunsthefox on January 23, 2010, 03:21:26 PM
Forrest Gump (1994) - Memorable quotes.... he ran and ran and ran and one day stopped and said, 'I'm pretty tired... I think I'll go home now. ...' 
ditto this debate

longrunsthefox

Quote from: Zapatista on January 24, 2010, 07:29:34 PM
Quote from: longrunsthefox on January 23, 2010, 03:21:26 PM
Forrest Gump (1994) - Memorable quotes.... he ran and ran and ran and one day stopped and said, 'I'm pretty tired... I think I'll go home now. ...' 
ditto this debate

Whatutryingtosayman?   


Nally Stand

#145
Maguire, once again you raise my exact point about alternative strategies. A lot of the crap being spouted on this board is people criticing SF's method of achieving unity and being somehow partitionist yet these same people offer no alternative ideas and in fact most admit voting for the agreement, and hence have endorsed the current SF strategy. And as for unionist outreach branch, obviously SF for many unionists have a long way to reach, but they are taking this outreach seriously. Why criticise that?
"The island of saints & scholars...and gombeens & fuckin' arselickers" Christy Moore

Nally Stand

Trevor all I can say is im delighted you were not a nationalist political leader. You probably would have had the same "ah sure what can ya do. We cant have the vote so thats just the way it is" attitude. Nationalists are not apathetic. In the '01 general election the Stoop Down Low Party referred to themselves as "post nationalist," (ie your political philosophy). It was generally accepted as their biggest electoral mistake ever and they took a huge backlash from the nationalist community in the election.
"The island of saints & scholars...and gombeens & fuckin' arselickers" Christy Moore

Trevor Hill

Where as your nationalist political leaders made sure we had 25 years of murder and mayhem. 25 years when there was little to no economic investment in the north and what little there was they tried to destroy or extort money from. And after all that they got us the GFA, almost exactly what was on the table in 1974, except that now Ireland has abondoned its constitutional claim to the north.
Keep Ulster Bristish, Vótáil Sinn Féin.  ::)

Nally Stand

And there we have the typical anti republican view that it was all the big bad republicans who  caused all the trouble. There were two sides. In 1974 the brit war machine was in full swing. As i already pointed out, there was no stability then, the IRA felt it was 1994 before it believed the british govn was prepared to talk and yet Canary wharf in 1996 was the result of the british govn not taking republican attempts to talk seriously. As for your last comment, who should we vote for to gain unity then?
"The island of saints & scholars...and gombeens & fuckin' arselickers" Christy Moore

bonaduche

Quote from: Nally Stand on January 25, 2010, 03:30:59 AM
And there we have the typical anti republican view that it was all the big bad republicans who  caused all the trouble. There were two sides. In 1974 the brit war machine was in full swing. As i already pointed out, there was no stability then, the IRA felt it was 1994 before it believed the british govn was prepared to talk and yet Canary wharf in 1996 was the result of the british govn not taking republican attempts to talk seriously. As for your last comment, who should we vote for to gain unity then?
its strange to read some of the comments of people whohighlight they  dont have crowns on their passports and express their irishness withprife by  condemingfellow  irish people as toadyies for inviting a queen to visit their country....    then if you go back on their posts you can discover their double life as english soccer supporters who referre to their teams as our boys       who is the wanna be huns here. the shinners have done fantastic to bring our country to the position it is in at present and will progress and make this the greatest country in the world.