Sinn Fein? They have gone away, you know.

Started by Trevor Hill, January 18, 2010, 12:28:52 AM

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deiseach

Quote from: charlieTully on November 27, 2012, 02:57:38 PM
they could always try cutting the amount spent on unelected quangos.

AKA the peace dividend ;)

Maguire01

Quote from: charlieTully on November 27, 2012, 02:57:38 PM
Quote from: naka on November 27, 2012, 02:44:35 PM
interesting wee spack between shinners sdlp and dup over the cuts,
the guys try to play real politics every so often but the tribal tendencies always seem to get in the way.

reality is the cuts will be voted through because we need the block grant because of the bloated public sector and welfare state.

they could always try cutting the amount spent on unelected quangos.
Or the amount spent on 161 Press Officers at Stormont.

charlieTully

Quote from: Maguire01 on November 27, 2012, 04:45:33 PM
Quote from: charlieTully on November 27, 2012, 02:57:38 PM
Quote from: naka on November 27, 2012, 02:44:35 PM
interesting wee spack between shinners sdlp and dup over the cuts,
the guys try to play real politics every so often but the tribal tendencies always seem to get in the way.

reality is the cuts will be voted through because we need the block grant because of the bloated public sector and welfare state.

they could always try cutting the amount spent on unelected quangos.
Or the amount spent on 161 Press Officers at Stormont.

maybe save another few quid by halving the number of mla's

Applesisapples

Quote from: Evil Genius on November 27, 2012, 12:22:45 PM
Quote from: Applesisapples on November 26, 2012, 10:52:44 AMI don't believe for one minute that Conor Murphy is sectarian.
"Don't believe" or "don't want to believe"?

You see, the facts are that Murphy chose the sole RC applicant, over 4 other Protestant applicants, at least one of whom was obviously better qualified.

And when an independent, qualified and experienced Fair Employment Tribunal carefully examined the situation, they refuted eg Murphy's assertion that he was unaware of the overlooked Candidate's religious background, and pointed out that the successful applicant was personally well-known to Murphy and senior SF colleagues.

On the basis of this and other factors, they determined unequivocally that Murphy's actions were motived by by religious/ sectarian considerations. And I think it not coincidental that despite Murphy's protests that he is not sectarian etc, neither he nor his Party has done anything to get this verdict overturned, nor demonstrate why it was incorrect.

Yet even in the face of this clear and unambiguous evidence, you remain prepared to give Murphy a "bye-ball".

This contrasts starkly with your comments on the "Dissidents" thread, where you disgracefully linked by implication the family of the murdered Prison Officer and OO member, Mr. Black, to Loyalist terrorists etc, despite confessing that you "... have no specfic evidence that the Black family have had interaction with loyalist paramilitary elements etc"
[I note that you were careful to use the word "specific", when you might have excluded it completely  ::)]

So why the contrasting standards of proof?

Quote from: Applesisapples on November 26, 2012, 10:52:44 AMI do believe he and his Department messed up the selection process which gave the opportunity to others to portray him as such. I don't know about the possibility of grounds for appeal without seeing the evidence. However one thing is for sure Danny Kennedy wasn't going to miss an opportunity to make it look like Murphy is a bigot.
Ah, he "messed up", and his Department, too. Poor, misguided lambs.
Why, you could almost call Murphy "unfortunate", were it not for the inconvenient fact that the Tribunal unambiguously found that his was a case of bad faith (i.e. sectarianism), rather than simple incompetence...

Quote from: Applesisapples on November 26, 2012, 10:52:44 AMI don't know about the possibility of grounds for appeal without seeing the evidence.
If you need evidence, why don't you read the Tribunal's findings? They had all the evidence they needed to conclude that Murphy's actions were motivated by sectarianism.

Quote from: Applesisapples on November 26, 2012, 10:52:44 AMHowever one thing is for sure Danny Kennedy wasn't going to miss an opportunity to make it look like Murphy is a bigot.
Danny Kennedy didn't force Conor Murphy to act as he did. Nor is it his responsibility to absolve Murphy from such claims.

Quite simply, if Murphy doesn't want to look like a bigot, he should stop behaving like one.  >:(
EG I don't believe it because I know the man. I am not saying his actions or decisions did not result in this man being discriminated against, but that is a different thing to someone being sectarian. Interview processes are by their nature discriminatory, that's how you arrive at a decision. But that process must be fair. In this case it would appear that the process was not fair. But that is a far cry from the man being a sectarian bigot. You could look a lot closer to your own roots for examples of that.

Applesisapples

Whilst NI is part of the UK we will never really have control over our own economy. Most Unionist turn a blind eye to the fact that the UK government enacts and will continue to act in the interests of the "mainland". Hence we have an approach in Europe to CAP reform which will adversely affect farmers here. Our enconomy and interests lie more closely with the ROI. We need to stop relying on handouts and start accepting responsibility for our own affairs. That does not equate to a United Ireland, it could be a federal arrangement with ties still to Britain akin to Jersey or the IoM. At the moment we are like the married child living in our own home but mum and dad still underwrite the bills. Unfortunately all parties including SF and the SDLP are happy to continue with this, to their shame. Time to grow up and earn our own living.

Rossfan

Quote from: Applesisapples on November 29, 2012, 11:10:05 AM
. At the moment we are like the married child living in our own home but mum and dad still underwrite the bills. Unfortunately all parties including SF and the SDLP are happy to continue with this, to their shame. Time to grow up and earn our own living.

That would mean they would have to make responsible and difficult decisions .....
and sure we couldn't be having that now could we?
They might end up like Labour and Fine Gael then  ::)
Davy's given us a dream to cling to
We're going to bring home the SAM

Nally Stand

Quote from: Nally Stand on November 26, 2012, 01:33:15 PM
Quote from: Applesisapples on November 26, 2012, 01:29:52 PM
It isn't internment, and these anti agreement dissidents must pay for their support for those Martin McGuinness referred to as traitors.
Please explain to me how Marion Price is not being interned.

Take your time...
"The island of saints & scholars...and gombeens & fuckin' arselickers" Christy Moore

glens abu

Ó Snodaigh demands release of republican prisonersNovember 29, 2012

Sinn Féin TD Aengus Ó Snodaigh has called on the Eamon Gilmore to demand of the British Government an end of the internment without trial of two Irish citizens in the Six Counties and to honour the spirit of the Good Friday Agreement and Weston Park Agreement and release two other Irish citizens being held in Maghaberry Prison in the North.

Deputy Ó Snodaigh was part of a cross party delegation which visited a number of republican prisoners in Maghaberry Prison and Marion Price who is currently being detained in the City Hospital. The delegation also met with the North's Minister for Justice David Ford.

Both Marion Price and Martin Corey are being held without charge, sentence or release dates.

Deputy Ó Snodaigh said;

"It is the judicial norms in a democratic society that those arrested would be charged or released but the British government has once again, in its dealings with Ireland, violated the basic rights of Irish citizens.

"I call on the British Government to act now and release both Marion Price and Martin Corey. Eamon Gilmore should contact the British Government directly to make this demand on behalf of the Irish Government."

In relation to two of the other prisoners whom the delegation met, Gerry McGeough and Gary Adams, Ó Snodaigh called for their immediate release and reminded the British and Irish government that both qualify for release under the terms of the Good Friday Agreement and Weston Park. One of the men is seriously ill having had a 7th stent inserted in his heart only this week.

Ó Snodaigh said;

"Failure to release Gerry McGeough and Gary Adams is a breach of commitment made during the peace process by both governments and they should be released without any further delay.

"That these men are in jail, away from their families and friends without any release date, is feeding anti-peace process sentiment in some quarters and is an insult to those who endorsed the Good Friday Agreement 14 years ago." ENDS

Applesisapples

Quote from: Nally Stand on November 29, 2012, 12:24:43 PM
Quote from: Nally Stand on November 26, 2012, 01:33:15 PM
Quote from: Applesisapples on November 26, 2012, 01:29:52 PM
It isn't internment, and these anti agreement dissidents must pay for their support for those Martin McGuinness referred to as traitors.
Please explain to me how Marion Price is not being interned.

Take your time...
I don't need to explain, it's a fact. But sure you will twist it to suit anyway. If it was so clear cut the courts would have let her out, you know those courts that Sinn Fein now support, with the crowns on the coat of arms.

Nally Stand

#279
Quote from: Applesisapples on November 29, 2012, 06:02:53 PM
Quote from: Nally Stand on November 29, 2012, 12:24:43 PM
Quote from: Nally Stand on November 26, 2012, 01:33:15 PM
Quote from: Applesisapples on November 26, 2012, 01:29:52 PM
It isn't internment, and these anti agreement dissidents must pay for their support for those Martin McGuinness referred to as traitors.
Please explain to me how Marion Price is not being interned.

Take your time...
I don't need to explain, it's a fact. But sure you will twist it to suit anyway. If it was so clear cut the courts would have let her out, you know those courts that Sinn Fein now support, with the crowns on the coat of arms.
If someone is held in prison without crime or trial, it is internment. Go on, just explain to me how Marian Price is not being interned. Less copping out and just explain the detail.
"The island of saints & scholars...and gombeens & fuckin' arselickers" Christy Moore

Applesisapples

Quote from: hardstation on November 29, 2012, 11:43:34 PM
Quote from: Applesisapples on November 29, 2012, 06:02:53 PM
Quote from: Nally Stand on November 29, 2012, 12:24:43 PM
Quote from: Nally Stand on November 26, 2012, 01:33:15 PM
Quote from: Applesisapples on November 26, 2012, 01:29:52 PM
It isn't internment, and these anti agreement dissidents must pay for their support for those Martin McGuinness referred to as traitors.
Please explain to me how Marion Price is not being interned.

Take your time...
I don't need to explain, it's a fact.
It is? Enlighten me please.
There is obviously not going to be agreement here on Price. The point I was making which has become lost in all of this is that SF cannot expect to attract middleclass and more moderate support if they continue to champion dissident causes. If Price is being interned then let her challenge it in the courts. As I said the self same Royal Courts of Justice SF now support.

Nally Stand

#281
Another cop out.

Quote from: Applesisapples on November 30, 2012, 09:18:26 AM
SF cannot expect to attract middleclass and more moderate support if they continue to champion dissident causes.

I'd be more concerned if SF didn't speak out about the internment without trial of an innocent woman..

You have repeatedly stated that Marian Price is not interned. I, and now hardstation, are simply asking you to explain how her situation cannot be termed as internment without trial. Have the courage of your convictions and back up your claim with some sort of rationale, instead of resorting to "we won't agree anyway" and "let her go to court", ffs.
"The island of saints & scholars...and gombeens & fuckin' arselickers" Christy Moore

naka

not a shinner but have to agree that Price and corey have been removed from the streets  which should be construed as internment by the back door.
we shouldnt lambast other regimes and allow this to happen in a supposedly mature democracy

glens abu

Quote from: naka on November 30, 2012, 10:58:05 AM
not a shinner but have to agree that Price and corey have been removed from the streets  which should be construed as internment by the back door.
we shouldnt lambast other regimes and allow this to happen in a supposedly mature democracy

100% right naka,I have no love for Marion Price and she has a deep hatred of Sinn Fein but we must always stand up and speak out against what is wrong,and this very ill woman is being interned and should be released immediately .

theticklemister

Quote from: glens abu on November 30, 2012, 11:42:57 AM
Quote from: naka on November 30, 2012, 10:58:05 AM
not a shinner but have to agree that Price and corey have been removed from the streets  which should be construed as internment by the back door.
we shouldnt lambast other regimes and allow this to happen in a supposedly mature democracy

100% right naka,I have no love for Marion Price and she has a deep hatred of Sinn Fein but we must always stand up and speak out against what is wrong,and this very ill woman is being interned and should be released immediately .

You say you have no love for Marion Price as she has a deep hatred of Sinn Fein. I guarantee ye, ye listen to and sing the song 'Bring Them Home.' Marion has never bent a knee through all these years, I wonder if she was caught with an arm would you still support her status as a POW. I doubt it..