GAA Discussion Paper

[Rossfan]

How and who will police this?
We only had Johnny in for training 3 times this month - sure look at the record.

What do you mean police it ? If a player comes to you and has been training three days in a row - don't be like all those other gobshites and train him for a 4th day in a row

Self regulation......we're good at that alright
It'll be "I want 100% turn out - no excuses" then Co Board will sanitise the training records.

[Dinny Breen]

Self regulation......we're good at that alright

Jimmy Hyland, played on Rathangan school team that won All-Ireland 'C' this year. Also played county minor and club minor, u21 and senior (intermediate). Back in school and his school coach refuses to pick him till January. Some coaches will put player welfare first. Appreciate not norm but all we can do is educate.

[Zulu]

To be fair, I think coaches get too hard a time on this. Coaching isn't just about getting a guy fit and a player won't necessarily be playing in the same position or the team the same style of play so not having a player at training can be detrimental. Besides, a guy who is on 8 teams might only end up at less than 30% of some teams training sessions but still plays as he is a star player while another guy who might only have that team and is at every training session gets dropped when the star returns. One IC team in a year, no, ifs, buts or maybes. Two levels at club (U21 and senior for example) and one level at school. No dual players at IC level from minor up. Do that and we would go along way to solving the flogging of some players and we'd also go some way to keeping more lads involved for longer.

[Cunny Funt]

To be fair, I think coaches get too hard a time on this. Coaching isn't just about getting a guy fit and a player won't necessarily be playing in the same position or the team the same style of play so not having a player at training can be detrimental. Besides, a guy who is on 8 teams might only end up at less than 30% of some teams training sessions but still plays as he is a star player while another guy who might only have that team and is at every training session gets dropped when the star returns. One IC team in a year, no, ifs, buts or maybes. Two levels at club (U21 and senior for example) and one level at school. No dual players at IC level from minor up. Do that and we would go along way to solving the flogging of some players and we'd also go some way to keeping more lads involved for longer.

If a player is playing for his senior club & U-21,Senior county & U-21 and Sigerson cup team which includes championship and league how hard would it be for the five managers to sit down with each other and come up with a suitable training plan for that player?

[Zulu]

Not easy at all, near impossible in fact.

[Cunny Funt]

Not easy at all, near impossible in fact.

It might be in the pipeline but the current scheduling for underage players isn't going to change anytime soon and if player welfare is a priority then the near impossible will have to be made possible.

[Zulu]

You can't force multiple managers from all over the country to do that though. If we both manage the same player and you agree to managing him but I don't because I have.....a small panel, he's an important player, my team should be his main team (take your pick!) then there is nothing you or anyone else can do (and importantly follow through on) so it will remain impossible IMO.

[6th sam]

To be fair, I think coaches get too hard a time on this. Coaching isn't just about getting a guy fit and a player won't necessarily be playing in the same position or the team the same style of play so not having a player at training can be detrimental. Besides, a guy who is on 8 teams might only end up at less than 30% of some teams training sessions but still plays as he is a star player while another guy who might only have that team and is at every training session gets dropped when the star returns. One IC team in a year, no, ifs, buts or maybes. Two levels at club (U21 and senior for example) and one level at school. No dual players at IC level from minor up. Do that and we would go along way to solving the flogging of some players and we'd also go some way to keeping more lads involved for longer.

If a player is playing for his senior club & U-21,Senior county & U-21 and Sigerson cup team which includes championship and league how hard would it be for the five managers to sit down with each other and come up with a suitable training plan for that player?

I think that's the problem, players are busy ,managers are busy, fixture makers have a nightmare of a task fitting in games. The danger is when u leave it up to goodwill & organisation the player is still likely to suffer. Why should managers be expected to weaken their team while there is no obligation on other managers to do so. In this case the most bullish and selfish managers often succeed.
What we need to do is legislate to reduce the demands on the small percentage of elite players while providing weekly games for all. I think the suggestion of u17s not playing senior is a good one , even though it considerably disadvantages my own club this year. Similarly replacing minor Intercounty to u17 , and u21 to u20, while not allowing Intercounty players to play above their Intercounty age group , are two simple changes to aim for over the next few years.
Conditioning wise Gaelic footballers are getting heavier , much like rugby , and it's notable that it's almost unheard of an u20 player to play senior rugby. It makes sense to put a block on u20s playing senior Intercounty football. The u17 Intercounty season could provide more games eg over the summer which would aid elite player development, this would be much easier now that u17s can't play senior club . While these intercounty matches go ahead, club league matches go ahead, but all intercounty players will be available for an extended club championship campaign.

[giveballaghback]

Its not about the number of teams or matches a player has its what he is asked to do in between games,
players involved in multi teams must have a strict training schedule with regular assessment by a qualified trainer, until proper structures are put in place we will have players and coaches doing damage, it has to be regulated.
Professional structures must be put in place in all counties to protect the players and funded by the gaa of course.

[6th sam]

Its not about the number of teams or matches a player has its what he is asked to do in between games,
players involved in multi teams must have a strict training schedule with regular assessment by a qualified trainer, until proper structures are put in place we will have players and coaches doing damage, it has to be regulated.
Professional structures must be put in place in all counties to protect the players and funded by the gaa of course.

An intercounty player management scheme as per rugby union would be the way to go , this works in rugby because the ordinary club player has matches every week,  the international player joins his club colleagues for specific blocks whilst also adhering to an international fitness program. The key is the blocks of intercounty action, during this period county players should have matches every week, whilst their club colleagues also have games. I can not see any other system that would better protect intercounty players whilst allowing regular club football. Importantly during the intercounty championship season , we have to develop a system whereby all counties are having regular games. I often think that it's a nightmare for managers and players alike , when there are 3 to 4 weeks between intercounty matches, where intercounty players are either stood down from club matches, or no club matches are fixed, or worse still that fixture makers have to squeeze in as many club fixtures as possible before the ?10 day period prior to county games when county players aren't allowed to play for their clubs. Thus risking injury to not only county players but to club players not conditioned to survive an increased load of games.
The block of county fixtures allows county managers unrestricted access to their players, but then they return to the club's albeit still having a certain amount of permitted intercounty sessions.

[johnneycool]

Down clubs rejected the proposed trial period of 3 years changing the age groups to the odd.

TBH, Croke Park/ Down CB didn't really do a lot to convince the clubs of the merits of the trial other than some very generic nonsense about dropout without giving a whole pile of detail and how these new age groupings would prevent it.

Wexford, Longford and someone else will need to take the plunge it seems!

[Esmarelda]

Down clubs rejected the proposed trial period of 3 years changing the age groups to the odd.

TBH, Croke Park/ Down CB didn't really do a lot to convince the clubs of the merits of the trial other than some very generic nonsense about dropout without giving a whole pile of detail and how these new age groupings would prevent it.

Wexford, Longford and someone else will need to take the plunge it seems!

Any more feedback?

[johnneycool]

Down clubs rejected the proposed trial period of 3 years changing the age groups to the odd.

TBH, Croke Park/ Down CB didn't really do a lot to convince the clubs of the merits of the trial other than some very generic nonsense about dropout without giving a whole pile of detail and how these new age groupings would prevent it.

Wexford, Longford and someone else will need to take the plunge it seems!

Any more feedback?

From who, CP?

[Esmarelda]

Down clubs rejected the proposed trial period of 3 years changing the age groups to the odd.

TBH, Croke Park/ Down CB didn't really do a lot to convince the clubs of the merits of the trial other than some very generic nonsense about dropout without giving a whole pile of detail and how these new age groupings would prevent it.

Wexford, Longford and someone else will need to take the plunge it seems!

Any more feedback?

From who, CP?

Was the meeting about the various proposals not on at the weekend?