Now... This'll not be handy, especially with McManus out, I mean who will the oscar nominated Sean Cavanagh pull to the floor now?
All joking aside, really looking forward to this one. Should be a good game. Tyrone in my opinion are not as bad as last Sunday and not as good as yesterday..
It's definitely gonna be a battle and our lads will need to step it up a level from the league and cut out some of the silly mistakes. We were good in some of the games but only middlin in others. I don't think we were particularly good in the league final either and Donegal flattered us somewhat.
Bring it on..
Now... This'll not be handy, especially with McManus out, I mean who will the oscar nominated Sean Cavanagh pull to the floor now?
All joking aside, really looking forward to this one. Should be a good game. Tyrone in my opinion are not as bad as last Sunday and not as good as yesterday..
It's definitely gonna be a battle and our lads will need to step it up a level from the league and cut out some of the silly mistakes. We were good in some of the games but only middlin in others. I don't think we were particularly good in the league final either and Donegal flattered us somewhat.
Bring it on..
What are you on about handy lad! Jaysus you Monaghan boys are getting ahead of yourselves! lol
A lot of the outcome might depend on whether Monaghan want to play football or box! Or whether
they revert to type and fall apart when the see the white and red!
Joking aside... ahem...
Monaghan are going well at the moment; had a good league, will be buzzing as Ulster champions
and full of confidence! Tyrone will be more confident now after yesterday's result; but it was only
Down at the end of the day! Another draw could be on the cards for this battle; but the loss of
Mc Manus will be too much for Monaghan. Tyrone to scrape through in the replay.
Apparently Tyrone's B team beat the A team last week so I wouldn't be surprised if he names the B team again with McGinley scoring 3.03
I didn't see Tyrone in the replay, but winning that game in Newry does lend some (missing) gravitas to their USFC campaign.
It's just such an honour for Monaghan to have the opportunity to renew rivalries against this great Tyrone team, under the eternal tutelage of the majestic Mickey Harte. It just feels so good to think we will be playing our long standing friends, rivals and great sportsmen, in such a profile Ulster championship game.
Own own ambition, football ability and refreshing breath of fresh air O'Rourke has brought into the squad, should be more than enough to have the empty vessels rattling like mad one more time. Even with out thinning squad, impoverished funds and wailing violins, we are in a better place than last last year's 1/4 final encounter and should edge this game in Monaghan's favour.
Monaghan don't beat Tyrone.
Kiss our rings.
Quote from: ONeill on May 25, 2014, 10:39:12 PM
Monaghan don't beat Tyrone.
Kiss our rings.
We'll leave the ring kissing to you boys, thanks very much.
Wee buns, wee fecking buns!
Rumour has it McManus has flown out to Serbia for some horse placenta treatment in the hope we'll get 10 minutes out of him.
Monaghan have lost their element of surprise. There will be no shock in this game. Tyrone will beat Monaghan as they always do.
I don't see what Monaghan have done to be seen as some big threat all of a sudden. The only two teams that I have believed to be in the running for Ulster this year are Donegal and Tyrone.
Interesting to see how Monaghan deal with the black card issue. Always thought them very cynical. A lot of pull and dragging to stop any play developing.
Quote from: Bensars on May 26, 2014, 10:03:14 AM
Interesting to see how Monaghan deal with the black card issue. Always thought them very cynical. A lot of pull and dragging to stop any play developing.
We didn't get a black card in the league this year until the final. Have you seen much of Monaghan this year?
The pressure is all on Monaghan to win.
The leagues mickey mouse, they werent put under any pressure. when it comes to the heat of the championship, different story. I'd say theres a few of your boys will be bring cushions along with them ! :D
Quote from: Bensars on May 26, 2014, 10:30:23 AM
The leagues mickey mouse, they werent put under any pressure. when it comes to the heat of the championship, different story.
Aye but it's all we can go on so far with the black card, the defence has adapted well so far. None of this pulling and dragging that you lads are so fond of.
I think our defence will handle the Tyrone attack well enough, the question for me is if we'll score enough up front without McManus.
I look forward to the day this Tyrone attack get a good hard pitch on which they can really let loose. The recent weather has took the sting out of most teams attacking abilities.
Mc Manus will play. No more arseboxing.
Lads lettuce try to give our neighbours the respect their deserve as Ulster Champions.
In fairness they did what we couldn't do in the past 3 years and that is beat Donegal.
They were still celebrating when we met them in Croker and we were a lot more used to playing there than they were.
They're back in their home soil now and have the advantage of being able to watch us twice already and see our strengths and weaknesses.
Cute hoorism I hear ye thinking but I couldn't be ar$ed with that nonsense any more.
I think if Monaghan play like they did in the Ulster final last year we won't get close. We'll have to depend on frees. Whilst we've some talented forwards I don't think we have enough power or strength to beat a team like Donegal or Monaghan if they block up the defence and make it a war of attrition. Coney, RoN, McCurry, McAliskey all have great potential but like so many forwards can't hack the pressure cooker of having a swarm defence around them. Not many can.
Morgan could end up being our saviour though. I was very impressed with him on Sat night (well I only saw the highlights last night)
Will be looking forward to seeing Dessie Mone again. Wonder will he be marking Big Sean this time
As I asked on another thread. Did ye see how the Down boys were trying to tackle Sean very high up around his neck most of the game. He takes some abuse every game.
How did Emmet McKenna play on Sat night? Was interesting to hear Mugsy saying we should give the young lads a chance. I am all on for giving lads there chance but I am not all on for changing it every game.
Just out of interest, and this is a genuine question for the Monaghan lads, but what has improved about Monaghan this year that would make them a more difficult proposition than last year?
Quote from: BennyHarp on May 26, 2014, 11:03:43 AM
Just out of interest, and this is a genuine question for the Monaghan lads, but what has improved about Monaghan this year that would make them a more difficult proposition than last year?
More fellas competing for places, so the panel is better than I've ever seen it.
Two things about McManus:
1 Great player that he is, I don't think we're as reliant on him as some would believe. We have options upfront. He had the lion's share of our scoring in the league, but he took the majority of the scorable frees.
2 I'm not convinced he won't be playing!
Are yis playing wee mind games already.
I thought he was 6-8 weeks (http://www.independent.ie/sport/gaelic-football/big-blow-for-monaghan-as-conor-mcmanus-faces-eightweek-injury-layoff-30246299.html)
You'd hardly risk him playing against a durty cynical team like Tyrone
Quote from: Fuzzman on May 26, 2014, 10:54:28 AM
Lads lettuce try to give our neighbours the respect their deserve as Ulster Champions.
In fairness they did what we couldn't do in the past 3 years and that is beat Donegal.
They were still celebrating when we met them in Croker and we were a lot more used to playing there than they were.
They're back in their home soil now and have the advantage of being able to watch us twice already and see our strengths and weaknesses.
Cute hoorism I hear ye thinking but I couldn't be ar$ed with that nonsense any more.
I think if Monaghan play like they did in the Ulster final last year we won't get close. We'll have to depend on frees. Whilst we've some talented forwards I don't think we have enough power or strength to beat a team like Donegal or Monaghan if they block up the defence and make it a war of attrition. Coney, RoN, McCurry, McAliskey all have great potential but like so many forwards can't hack the pressure cooker of having a swarm defence around them. Not many can.
Morgan could end up being our saviour though. I was very impressed with him on Sat night (well I only saw the highlights last night)
Will be looking forward to seeing Dessie Mone again. Wonder will he be marking Big Sean this time
As I asked on another thread. Did ye see how the Down boys were trying to tackle Sean very high up around his neck most of the game. He takes some abuse every game.
How did Emmet McKenna play on Sat night? Was interesting to hear Mugsy saying we should give the young lads a chance. I am all on for giving lads there chance but I am not all on for changing it every game.
Well said Fuzzman. Monaghan have bean excellent Ulster champions and will be extremely hard to beet in their own cabbage patch. Some people think Tyrone just have to turnip to win. Tyrone will have a spring in their step for sure and no doubt Mickey will have a few little gems up his leave and hopefully our forwards will sprout up everywhere and pepper their defence. It's a big date for Tyrone and there's no raison why it shouldn't be a close pearing. :)
Quote from: never kickt a ball on May 26, 2014, 12:19:54 PM
Quote from: Fuzzman on May 26, 2014, 10:54:28 AM
Lads lettuce try to give our neighbours the respect their deserve as Ulster Champions.
In fairness they did what we couldn't do in the past 3 years and that is beat Donegal.
They were still celebrating when we met them in Croker and we were a lot more used to playing there than they were.
They're back in their home soil now and have the advantage of being able to watch us twice already and see our strengths and weaknesses.
Cute hoorism I hear ye thinking but I couldn't be ar$ed with that nonsense any more.
I think if Monaghan play like they did in the Ulster final last year we won't get close. We'll have to depend on frees. Whilst we've some talented forwards I don't think we have enough power or strength to beat a team like Donegal or Monaghan if they block up the defence and make it a war of attrition. Coney, RoN, McCurry, McAliskey all have great potential but like so many forwards can't hack the pressure cooker of having a swarm defence around them. Not many can.
Morgan could end up being our saviour though. I was very impressed with him on Sat night (well I only saw the highlights last night)
Will be looking forward to seeing Dessie Mone again. Wonder will he be marking Big Sean this time
As I asked on another thread. Did ye see how the Down boys were trying to tackle Sean very high up around his neck most of the game. He takes some abuse every game.
How did Emmet McKenna play on Sat night? Was interesting to hear Mugsy saying we should give the young lads a chance. I am all on for giving lads there chance but I am not all on for changing it every game.
Well said Fuzzman. Monaghan have bean excellent Ulster champions and will be extremely hard to beet in their own cabbage patch. Some people think Tyrone just have to turnip to win. Tyrone will have a spring in their step for sure and no doubt Mickey will have a few little gems up his leave and hopefully our forwards will sprout up everywhere and pepper their defence. It's a big date for Tyrone and there's no raison why it shouldn't be a close pearing. :)
Bravo! :D plus there is the carrot of a Final place.
Quote from: BennyHarp on May 26, 2014, 12:20:34 PM
Bravo! :D plus there is the carrot of a Final place.
Semi final place.
Quote from: babarino on May 26, 2014, 12:39:49 PM
Quote from: BennyHarp on May 26, 2014, 12:20:34 PM
Bravo! :D plus there is the carrot of a Final place.
Semi final place.
Well for whoever loses it will squash their dreams of a final place.
Quote from: BennyHarp on May 26, 2014, 11:03:43 AM
Just out of interest, and this is a genuine question for the Monaghan lads, but what has improved about Monaghan this year that would make them a more difficult proposition than last year?
Nothing to lose. Last year was massive expectation after beating Donegal and the pressure of a do or die clash with Tyrone. This year its the first rounds of Ulster, yes they are defending Ulster champs and will want to win badly but they have confidence to know they have a team that has been promoted to Div 1 so the qualifier route is well within their capabilities.
As a team they have improved greatly from last year with scores coming from different places than last year.
Quote from: never kickt a ball on May 26, 2014, 12:19:54 PM
Well said Fuzzman. Monaghan have bean excellent Ulster champions and will be extremely hard to beet in their own cabbage patch. Some people think Tyrone just have to turnip to win. Tyrone will have a spring in their step for sure and no doubt Mickey will have a few little gems up his leave and hopefully our forwards will sprout up everywhere and pepper their defence. It's a big date for Tyrone and there's no raison why it shouldn't be a close pearing. :)
This guy has to be a fruit and veg man. I don't think Monaghan will
leek like Down.
Lettuce see.
Don't see the whole hoo haa about McManus. A lot of posters seem to think Monaghan would win Ulster if he was available, but I'd be confident that Tyrone will beat Monaghan if he is playing or not, just as they have done in the last 3 occasions they have met in Championship with him involved.
Its a huge ask for this young Tyrone team. If they play like they did against down day 1 then it will be day tripping around Ireland for the rest of the summer to obscure places like Dr Cullen Park, Celtic Park and Navan.
if however we improve on our performance from the last day, we will compete against Monaghan and give ourselves a chance. I have Monaghan as strong favourites for this game. Tyrones light and young team will hopefully rise to the occasion.
I agree TM
We're well capable of beating a lot of sides but we're very lightweight with few definite leaders as yet. Gormley and Justy still our only dependable defenders. Mickey still very unsure of his best team or even style I think
Of course he's right to give young lads their chance but the chopping and changing affects young players confidence and belief. I can maybe name 6 players that should be starters but nobody knows where is their best position. Even big Sean we're still not sure
You are going to have to reign in this new sense of optimism Fuzzman. ;) I've sort of been saying this for a while now, Mickey is looking at being in Croker in the all Ireland quarter finals in August and whether we win against Monaghan or not is largely irrelevant. He has to manage a squad of young lads who need experience (the McKennas - Emmet, Ryan and even Niall, McNiece, Teirney, R O'Neill etc) who will be getting snippets of game time, and older heads (Gormley, Penrose, Joe, Justy and Stevie) who he knows he needs fit and in form come August. If that means them coming in and out of the team in May / June then I can handle that. We may have the look of an unsettled team at the minute but hopefully by All Ireland Quarter final weekend (however we get there) we will see a more settled team and the team Mickey actually wants on the pitch as his starting 15.
As I said last week I don't think a back door run is what this team needs. The team needs an ulster title and to be winning high profile games for the younger players to push on. They haven't won anything yet at senior level and an ulster title must be the first target. This is a huge test for them and a potential cracker of a game.
I also think Harte does know his best team but is working players back to fitness. His first 15 would be something like this
Morgan
Mcrory
Justy
Gormley
Mcnabb
Mattie
Harte
Colm
Clarke
Joe mc (possibly mark d for now)
Sean c
Mcginley
R oneill
Coney or Stevie depending on fitness
Mccurry
Quote from: Redhand Santa on May 26, 2014, 11:06:27 PM
As I said last week I don't think a back door run is what this team needs. The team needs an ulster title and to be winning high profile games for the younger players to push on. They haven't won anything yet at senior level and an ulster title must be the first target. This is a huge test for them and a potential cracker of a game.
I also think Harte does know his best team but is working players back to fitness. His first 15 would be something like this
Morgan
Mcrory
Justy
Gormley
Mcnabb
Mattie
Harte
Colm
Clarke
Joe mc (possibly mark d for now)
Sean c
Mcginley
R oneill
Coney or Stevie depending on fitness
Mccurry
I agree with a lot of what you are saying but if Tyrone get beaten by Monaghan they go into the qualifiers with 3 tough provincial games behind them, which will be more than any other team in the draw and equal to the amount of games Donegal or Monaghan are likely to get in Ulster. So, they will be no worse off but will have an extra few qualifier games to keep them ticking over. I have no doubt there is no plan to go that route and I would love to see them lift the Ulster title again, however, it won't be the end of the world if they lose here.
The McManus thing isn't of that much concern, though Eoin Lennon who's in fine form would be missed, I suspect we will be stroking the ball over the bar from a string of long range efforts. If the 15 who play, stay on the pitch, we will win and so far our discipline has been excellent with just one small indiscretion in the div 2 final. Any discipline anxiety would be around Big Dick, if he starts the game in Lennon's absence and gets up to his usual cynical antics.
But we won't be waiting on McManus to turn up, in fact he's forgotten already.
Quote from: BennyHarp on May 26, 2014, 11:32:45 PM
Quote from: Redhand Santa on May 26, 2014, 11:06:27 PM
As I said last week I don't think a back door run is what this team needs. The team needs an ulster title and to be winning high profile games for the younger players to push on. They haven't won anything yet at senior level and an ulster title must be the first target. This is a huge test for them and a potential cracker of a game.
I also think Harte does know his best team but is working players back to fitness. His first 15 would be something like this
Morgan
Mcrory
Justy
Gormley
Mcnabb
Mattie
Harte
Colm
Clarke
Joe mc (possibly mark d for now)
Sean c
Mcginley
R oneill
Coney or Stevie depending on fitness
Mccurry
I agree with a lot of what you are saying but if Tyrone get beaten by Monaghan they go into the qualifiers with 3 tough provincial games behind them, which will be more than any other team in the draw and equal to the amount of games Donegal or Monaghan are likely to get in Ulster. So, they will be no worse off but will have an extra few qualifier games to keep them ticking over. I have no doubt there is no plan to go that route and I would love to see them lift the Ulster title again, however, it won't be the end of the world if they lose here.
Tyrone won't get beaten by Monaghan.
Fightin talk boys, both main street & nrico bullish about their teams prospects. Great stuff
Mickey Harte has a much stronger pick to choose from when compared to Malachy O'Rourke. Id have Tyrone as Favourites anyhow. Be interesting to see who the bookies make favourites..
Still think we'll take this one. Those two games against Down will have brought us on leaps and bounds. We are getting closer to our strongest 15 and looked more confident on Saturday night. Monaghan will not be easy but I think we hold the edge on the scoring threat from all round the field. We couldn't handle McManus at all in Croker last year so think that could be key to our defence smothering the remaining Monaghan attack.
I think we'll see the same starting 15, barring any injuries.
I have a feeling Tyrone will handle the next two matches setting up an interesting Ulster final with the Anti Christs of football!!!
Quote from: Main Street on May 27, 2014, 12:55:36 PM
The McManus thing isn't of that much concern, though Eoin Lennon who's in fine form would be missed, I suspect we will be stroking the ball over the bar from a string of long range efforts. If the 15 who play, stay on the pitch, we will win and so far our discipline has been excellent with just one small indiscretion in the div 2 final. Any discipline anxiety would be around Big Dick, if he starts the game in Lennon's absence and gets up to his usual cynical antics.
But we won't be waiting on McManus to turn up, in fact he's forgotten already.
This is true, we need Lennon fit as midfield is the one area where we have few options at the moment, I'd dread to see Dick line up starting in a game like this. As far as McManus's injury goes, the only good thing about it is how long before the game it happened. So there's been plenty of time to plan without him.
Now that the dust has settled a bit after the last week or so I think it's no harm to look at what all the
fuzz fuss was about.
I think it's fair to say most people were VERY unhappy with the team Mickey named for the first game last Sunday. Many actually said it was disrespectful to Down that he named such a bad team but to me I thought that's what Mickey thought would be the team that would be best suited to beat Down. In most people's eyes within Tyrone
who knew the players we thought it was a very weak team and couldn't understand why so many new incoming players were named in strange positions where they hadn't played before.
As usual it was discussed a lot on here and some people got irate with others that how could we question Mickey. To me this is a discussion board and whilst it's much harder to pick the team and be the manager we are still entitled to question things on here within reason.
Then when Mickey saw that his team wasn't performing that well he made the changes last Sunday and then he made 5 major changes for the replay. I was glad he did that as I was worried that he was too stubborn to do that but I was WRONG. Thankfully.
The fact remains though that he made a very strange decision to pick those people in those positions and I think there are still a few players there who could be possibly replaced by better players on the sideline. I won't name them however we would probably all chose different teams as we do for every game. I can appreciate Mickey wants to bring in the new lads and give them a chance like BennyH said I think.
I suppose all I wanted to address was that there seemed to be a feeling amongst some posters that we were wrong or OTT to come out questioning Mickey and his choices but to me by making the 5 drastic changes he did show us that he admitted he got it wrong the first day but at least he listened to his backroom staff or maybe himself.
It will be interesting to see from here on in how the team changes or develops.
It's a wee bit worrying already that our FF line which we probably all rate quite highly haven't got many scores from play. You would imagine that v Monaghan, Cavan or Donegal there will be even less space for the forwards to operate in as these teams all use very tight defensive systems. We saw how Derry struggled on Sunday v Donegal.
Ahh how the back door route looks so much easier. What about games away to London, Offaly sorry AZ, Carlow and home to Kerry before meeting Dublin in the annual quarter final game
Relax lads I'm only messing. Yeah front door will get these young lads toughened up and ready for the Southern Softies in August (or next year ;) )
| Down(H) 2.11 to 3.08 | Down(A) 0.12 to 3.11 |
| Morgan 0.1 | Morgan 0.3 |
| McCrory | McCrory |
| McBride | Justy McMahon |
| Tierney | McNamee |
| T.McCann | McNabb |
| Matt Donnelly | Matt Donnelly 0.1 |
| P.Harte 1.0 peno | P.Harte 1.1 peno |
| Colm Cav | Colm Cav |
| C.Clarke | C.Clarke |
| McNeice/Mark Donnelly | E.McKenna |
| Sean Cav 0.5 (3f) | Sean Cav |
| McGinley | McGinley 2.1 |
| McCurry 1.2(2f) | McCurry 0.2(2f) |
| N.McKenna | Ronan O'Neill 0.1 |
| K.Coney 0.3 | K.Coney |
| R McKenna for McCann | S O'Neill for E.McKenna |
| M O'Neill for Morgan (black card) | Gormley for McNamee |
| S O'Neill for N McKenna | N McKenna (0-1) for Coney |
| Justin McMahon for McBride | Penrose for McCurry |
| C Gormley for Tierney | C McAliskey (0-1) for R O'Neill |
| M Penrose for McGinley | |
I hope yer right WT4E. I'd like to Ulster champs again.
Three of the changes for the second game where to bring in Justy, McNabb and McNamee into defence. Perhaps Mickey didn't feel they were fit enough to start the first day and didn't want to risk players not fully fit so early in the summer. Perhaps Mark Donnelly picked up an injury and wasn't fit for last week and hence the change there. It's hard to know when your not close enough to the camp. Niall McKenna did well coming on on Saturday night so perhaps it wasn't such a strange call to start him the previous week as maybe he's on a bit of form.
I wasn't happy with the team the first week and questioned it but also appreciate I don't know what exactly is going on in training or who has knocks. But for people to be questioning Harte's position as manager before and after the game was over the top nonsense.
Some pressure on Monaghan.
Quote from: ONeill on May 27, 2014, 10:51:38 PM
Some pressure on Monaghan.
Sure they've no hope. Playing their bogey team. No point turning up.
Quote from: imtommygunn on May 27, 2014, 10:59:28 PM
Quote from: ONeill on May 27, 2014, 10:51:38 PM
Some pressure on Monaghan.
Sure they've no hope. Playing their bogey team. No point turning up.
Turn up surely. A match is always better than training for Tyrone.
Any discipline anxiety would be around Big Dick, if he starts the game in Lennon's absence and gets up to his usual cynical antics.
Would hate to be close by if Big Dick goes off prematurely
Quote from: SuperHo on May 28, 2014, 12:26:28 AM
Any discipline anxiety would be around Big Dick, if he starts the game in Lennon's absence and gets up to his usual cynical antics.
Would hate to be close by if Big Dick goes off prematurely
That's disgusting!!!!!
ECU, where do you think McGinely's best position is?
Not his favourite position.
Wonder are the refs dreading getting this game. With Monaghan at home he'll want to be a homer but now after McEnaney's recent statement he will feel pressure to apply the black card rule a lot better.
As they said on TSG, nearly every tackle made now we find ourselves asking is that a deliberate trip or pull down. Refs jobs certainly have got much harder and like I said before I can't see why they can't get help from their linesmen, umpires and even at the bigger IC games some guy in front of a tv screen.
Quote from: WT4E on May 28, 2014, 09:09:17 AM
Quote from: SuperHo on May 28, 2014, 12:26:28 AM
Any discipline anxiety would be around Big Dick, if he starts the game in Lennon's absence and gets up to his usual cynical antics.
Would hate to be close by if Big Dick goes off prematurely
That's disgusting!!!!!
What a mind you have.
I thought of this http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2K8_jgiNqUc
Quote from: Fuzzman on May 28, 2014, 10:40:45 AM
ECU, where do you think McGinely's best position is?
Not his favourite position.
Wonder are the refs dreading getting this game. With Monaghan at home he'll want to be a homer but now after McEnaney's recent statement he will feel pressure to apply the black card rule a lot better.
As they said on TSG, nearly every tackle made now we find ourselves asking is that a deliberate trip or pull down. Refs jobs certainly have got much harder and like I said before I can't see why they can't get help from their linesmen, umpires and even at the bigger IC games some guy in front of a tv screen.
Attacking half back. He has the best engine on the Tyrone panel which allows him to run into attack and also get back into defence. The lad is a pure athlete, not the best footballer about nor does he have great feet but will run all day and showed on Sat that he can take scores when the opportunity presents itself. Would be a nightmare for the opposing half forward to have to mark him and track his runs.
Quote from: EC Unique on May 28, 2014, 12:50:57 PM
Quote from: Fuzzman on May 28, 2014, 10:40:45 AM
ECU, where do you think McGinely's best position is?
Not his favourite position.
Wonder are the refs dreading getting this game. With Monaghan at home he'll want to be a homer but now after McEnaney's recent statement he will feel pressure to apply the black card rule a lot better.
As they said on TSG, nearly every tackle made now we find ourselves asking is that a deliberate trip or pull down. Refs jobs certainly have got much harder and like I said before I can't see why they can't get help from their linesmen, umpires and even at the bigger IC games some guy in front of a tv screen.
Attacking half back. He has the best engine on the Tyrone panel which allows him to run into attack and also get back into defence. The lad is a pure athlete, not the best footballer about nor does he have great feet but will run all day and showed on Sat that he can take scores when the opportunity presents itself. Would be a nightmare for the opposing half forward to have to mark him and track his runs.
He won't get many scores playing up front, last week was a one off. But you are right regarding his engine and speed, would be very good to have him back at RHB as he covers alot of ground and never concedes many scores either.
I think he does deserve his place too and like you said has pace and can run all day.
However, like a good few of the younger defenders, I think he's not naturally defensive minded.
What I mean by that is that his natural instinct is to think about pushing forward and getting into good positions to receive a pass whereas other players instinctively think OK where's my man and what if this attack breaks down?
In the games I've watched Tyrone this year there are too many wing backs caught out of possession and as they highlighted on TSG you then see them running back towards their own goal trying to catch the man. The full back line is totally open then
It will be interesting to see how many scores he gets in the championship and I'd say he'll be better "marked" v Monaghan
Quote from: WT4E on May 28, 2014, 09:09:17 AM
Quote from: SuperHo on May 28, 2014, 12:26:28 AM
Any discipline anxiety would be around Big Dick, if he starts the game in Lennon's absence and gets up to his usual cynical antics.
Would hate to be close by if Big Dick goes off prematurely
That's disgusting!!!!!
Unlike our Tyrone brethren, at least we have a big dick.
But enough of that crude talk, otherwise some of the Tyrone posters will drag this thread down to the gutter.
The last time we met in the early stages of the championship, the game was played in Tyrone, Monaghan never got going, even if there was only a couple of points in it in the end, Clerkin got sent off early for little more than being Clerkin and Tyrone just managed the game without breaking serious sweat. Monaghan were division 4 material then.
I don't blame Tyronies for thinking that this this encounter is going to be more of the same for them. I do admire their faith in their few remaining class players, but just how many times can Seanie link arms, drag a player to the ground and pull Tyrone out of the fire for one more time?
I suppose Tyronies think that he will be able to do it this one more time, make the crucial difference and I wouldn't mock them for that belief, because it has been proven to work time and time again.
As we all know, this USC is really about not letting Donegal win and Tyrone have proven inadequate in that department, whereas Monaghan just have the ways, the means and the brains to beat Donegal.
Monaghan beat a Donegal side last year that had been fired up for the Tyrone game and were complacent with high expectations of just turning up and winning the Ulster final.
Quote from: SuperHo on May 28, 2014, 12:26:28 AM
Any discipline anxiety would be around Big Dick, if he starts the game in Lennon's absence and gets up to his usual cynical antics.
Would hate to be close by if Big Dick goes off prematurely
Bigis Dickis had a son called Brian, who was a very naughty boy. ;D
conor clarke picked up a serious looking knee injury tonight could be season ending for him
Fuzzman - 'I think he does deserve his place too and like you said has pace and can run all day.'
EC Unique - ' The lad is a pure athlete, not the best footballer about nor does he have great feet but will run all day.'
Is it a sad reflection of the game that this is the most important attribute deserving of a place on a county team? Remember when Gaelic Footballers used to be picked for their ability to play football.
(For the record, I'd have him in there too - needs work however - Horse Devlin coached him all the way through the replay - was guldering at him throughout!)
Quote from: Fuzzman on May 28, 2014, 04:11:17 PM
It will be interesting to see how many scores he gets in the championship and I'd say he'll be better "marked" v Monaghan
You're some laugh Fuzz commenting on the 'marking' by Monaghan.. It was Sean Cavanagh's antics which expedited the introduction of the black card system so you're not really in a position to be passing remarks on others 'marking'.
Quote from: CD on June 01, 2014, 04:59:47 PM
Fuzzman - 'I think he does deserve his place too and like you said has pace and can run all day.'
EC Unique - ' The lad is a pure athlete, not the best footballer about nor does he have great feet but will run all day.'
Is it a sad reflection of the game that this is the most important attribute deserving of a place on a county team? Remember when Gaelic Footballers used to be picked for their ability to play football.
(For the record, I'd have him in there too - needs work however - Horse Devlin coached him all the way through the replay - was guldering at him throughout!)
Ciaran's footballing ability is good enough to have him in the Tyrone squad. Ciaran's speed and engine is what makes the difference and gets him a starting place.
Quote from: EC Unique on June 02, 2014, 12:34:19 PM
Quote from: CD on June 01, 2014, 04:59:47 PM
Fuzzman - 'I think he does deserve his place too and like you said has pace and can run all day.'
EC Unique - ' The lad is a pure athlete, not the best footballer about nor does he have great feet but will run all day.'
Is it a sad reflection of the game that this is the most important attribute deserving of a place on a county team? Remember when Gaelic Footballers used to be picked for their ability to play football.
(For the record, I'd have him in there too - needs work however - Horse Devlin coached him all the way through the replay - was guldering at him throughout!)
Ciaran's footballing ability is good enough to have him in the Tyrone squad. Ciaran's speed and engine is what makes the difference and gets him a starting place.
Like I said - I'd definitely have him in there as well - I just find it interesting that you both commented on his other attributes before his football skills. A sign of the times. I'd say he's a player who'll get better every season - noticed Horse coaching him a lot from the sideline in Newry and having a go at him for not tracking and picking up his man and for adopting poor covering positions. It wouldn't do his confidence any good to have a coach constantly at him during play but the coaching staff were obviously concerned enough to be on his case. Dermy Carlin had a word with him as well. If he can get tuned in mentally we'll see a more confident player. Hope we see the best of him in the next few weeks.
Great post Granddadflash.
Firstly I'm glad I make you laugh as there seems to be a lot of tension on this thread already from ye Monaghan lads. I suppose yer not used to be defending champions and ye have a thorny path to regaining the title. Don't worry. The Donegal lads will talk ye through it.
Secondly, it Sounds like I touched a nerve there with the 'marking' comment. Are yis sensitive around that issue?
Sure with the new rules suiting Monaghan's clean open football yis will be grand. Chill. Sure we're wide open down the middle and our half back line are actually half forwards.
Harte has lost the run of himself and depends on Brollys tweets to tell him what changes to make at half time.
Cavanagh will be running scared of Big Dick and will be hoping to get pulled off at half time thanks to TSG.
Our best player is our keeper and so if ye can stop giving away soft frees within 70 metres ye'll be laughing.
I must tweet Sean now and explain how his antics last year has led to me not being allowed to comment any more on Marking. He will not be pleased as he has already been blamed for most things recently including Stevie Gerrard's dive v Chelsea.
Can you imagine if he dives now with Dick on top of him and getting him black carded. I dread to think of the headlines
Quote from: Fuzzman on June 02, 2014, 09:49:26 PM
Great post Granddadflash.
Firstly I'm glad I make you laugh as there seems to be a lot of tension on this thread already from ye Monaghan lads. I suppose yer not used to be defending champions and ye have a thorny path to regaining the title. Don't worry. The Donegal lads will talk ye through it.
Secondly, it Sounds like I touched a nerve there with the 'marking' comment. Are yis sensitive around that issue?
Sure with the new rules suiting Monaghan's clean open football yis will be grand. Chill. Sure we're wide open down the middle and our half back line are actually half forwards.
Harte has lost the run of himself and depends on Brollys tweets to tell him what changes to make at half time.
Cavanagh will be running scared of Big Dick and will be hoping to get pulled off at half time thanks to TSG.
Our best player is our keeper and so if ye can stop giving away soft frees within 70 metres ye'll be laughing.
I must tweet Sean now and explain how his antics last year has led to me not being allowed to comment any more on Marking. He will not be pleased as he has already been blamed for most things recently including Stevie Gerrard's dive v Chelsea.
Can you imagine if he dives now with Dick on top of him and getting him black carded. I dread to think of the headlines
It was intended to trigger you into a frenzy of keyboard manure, which clearly worked. Thanks for the retort Fuzz, you're lost at this craic, honestly. ::)
Quote from: CD on June 02, 2014, 03:51:19 PM
Quote from: EC Unique on June 02, 2014, 12:34:19 PM
Quote from: CD on June 01, 2014, 04:59:47 PM
Fuzzman - 'I think he does deserve his place too and like you said has pace and can run all day.'
EC Unique - ' The lad is a pure athlete, not the best footballer about nor does he have great feet but will run all day.'
Is it a sad reflection of the game that this is the most important attribute deserving of a place on a county team? Remember when Gaelic Footballers used to be picked for their ability to play football.
(For the record, I'd have him in there too - needs work however - Horse Devlin coached him all the way through the replay - was guldering at him throughout!)
Ciaran's footballing ability is good enough to have him in the Tyrone squad. Ciaran's speed and engine is what makes the difference and gets him a starting place.
Like I said - I'd definitely have him in there as well - I just find it interesting that you both commented on his other attributes before his football skills. A sign of the times. I'd say he's a player who'll get better every season - noticed Horse coaching him a lot from the sideline in Newry and having a go at him for not tracking and picking up his man and for adopting poor covering positions. It wouldn't do his confidence any good to have a coach constantly at him during play but the coaching staff were obviously concerned enough to be on his case. Dermy Carlin had a word with him as well. If he can get tuned in mentally we'll see a more confident player. Hope we see the best of him in the next few weeks.
How long til we have the players miked up and controlled by a series of defensive / offensive positioning coaches!
I find it worrying that we need a horse in there to be doing the job of some of our defenders
Have we no leaders any more to organise our defence.
Could we not get Dessie Mone to move across the border and we'd find him a good Tyrone lass.
I was up in Garvaghey over the weekend. Looks well alright though I expected one pitch to have a stand or some sort of raised seating.
When is the minor match refixed for now?
Cocky Monaghan bastards. Wee buns, wee fecking buns!
Minor match rescheduled for the 21st June in Armagh.
This time last year Monaghan kicked Donegal around the field in Clones in the Ulster final in a cynical game largely ignored because of the novelty team winning. Can they do it again?
Quote from: rrhf on June 03, 2014, 10:14:53 PM
This time last year Monaghan kicked Donegal around the field in Clones in the Ulster final in a cynical game largely ignored because of the novelty team winning. Can they do it again?
Obviously we had seen how not to play Donegal :D
Of course it's a tough task to out-cynic Tyrone, we would lose that type of game as Tyrone are the masters there. Probably we will be putting all our eggs into our football ability, tactics and the like.
Was '88 the last time Monaghan beat Tyrone in a game that mattered (even allowing for Cranney's refusal to award Tyrone a penalty late on)?
The Red Hand seems to wobble those boys.
Of course it's in the bag for Tyrone, just a figment of their destiny to beat Monaghan in the USFC.
No worries expected for Tyrone at all, but bring the empty vessels just in case.
tyrone were robbed in 88. kicked around the field in patsy kerlins last game for the county. When Cranny made the big call, and denied Noel Mc Ginn, we really should have appealed that result. Still...a good win in the minors...
Quote from: rrhf on June 03, 2014, 10:14:53 PM
This time last year Monaghan kicked Donegal around the field
Quote from: rrhf on June 03, 2014, 11:27:44 PM
tyrone were robbed in 88. kicked around the field
What's with all the kicking around the field rrhf? Could you please explain how you think Tryone won All Irelands in '03, '05 & '08? Tyrone are one of the most physical teams of the last 15 years (and in a good way I might add as most of them had the skill to go with it). Please also explain the difference between 'kicking around the field' and rugby tackling an inside forward to the ground, what's the difference and which is favourable in your opinion?
It's a lazy analysis and a misunderstanding to think that Monaghan are all about brawn/dirt/physicality, whatever you want to call it. On average, our team is probably one of the smaller teams in terms of player size. Yes they play hard and on the edge but Monaghan have a much wider skill set now than they've had for a long time, if ever (no disrespect to the teams that went before..)
Tyrone know how to mix it in the physicality stakes, probably a lot better than Monaghan to be honest, so, as I said on this thread before, it's a little bit rich for Tyrone men to be criticising Monaghan for 'kicking teams around the field'.
Cmon now. Monaghan are dirty. Be proud of your dirt. Yiz have been dirty for as long as I can remember. It's what makes Monaghan Monaghan.
Quote from: ONeill on June 04, 2014, 09:37:29 AM
Cmon now. Monaghan are dirty. Be proud of your dirt. Yiz have been dirty for as long as I can remember. It's what makes Monaghan Monaghan.
Watch this space.. ;)
Quote from: GrandMasterFlash on June 04, 2014, 09:35:35 AM
What's with all the kicking around the field rrhf? Could you please explain how you think Tryone won All Irelands in '03, '05 & '08? Tyrone are one of the most physical teams of the last 15 years (and in a good way I might add as most of them had the skill to go with it).
Please also explain the difference between 'kicking around the field' and rugby tackling an inside forward to the ground, what's the difference and which is favourable in your opinion?
I'll let rrhf explain how Monaghan for the last 20 years if not more kick teams around the field but do you really need us to explain the difference between doing that and how Sean Cav rugby tackled a man to save a certain goal. Can you really not see the difference?
Most people would say the Tyrone team in the 2000s worked very hard at tackling back and the odd time they bent/broke the rules like Ricey and Gormley but there would be very few UNBIASED NEUTRALS would say Tyrone were a dirty team back then. As you admit yourself we had too many quality talented players all over the pitch to need to be dirty or over physical. I think most people would have said Armagh and Monaghan are the two most physical teams in Ulster over the last 20 years.
You then admit that yourself by your line
Yes they play hard and on the edge but Monaghan have a much wider skill set now than they've had for a long time, if ever (no disrespect to the teams that went before..)Quote from: GrandMasterFlash on June 04, 2014, 09:35:35 AM
It's a lazy analysis and a misunderstanding to think that Monaghan are all about brawn/dirt/physicality, whatever you want to call it. On average, our team is probably one of the smaller teams in terms of player size. Yes they play hard and on the edge but Monaghan have a much wider skill set now than they've had for a long time, if ever (no disrespect to the teams that went before..)
Tyrone know how to mix it in the physicality stakes, probably a lot better than Monaghan to be honest, so, as I said on this thread before, it's a little bit rich for Tyrone men to be criticising Monaghan for 'kicking teams around the field'.
So you say Monaghan play hard and on the edge to defend your team but then say
Tyrone know how to mix it in the physicality stakes, probably a lot better than Monaghan. Is this a compliment to Tyrone or are you saying it's a bad thing?
You seem to be contradicting yourself a lot in that post GMF but to me the gist of what your saying is that this new Monaghan team are much smaller and more skillful than the teams that went before them who used to depend on kicking the sh*te out of teams in the hope of winning.
Would you say that most times Tyrone play Monaghan that it is Monaghan's interest to cut out the dirt and play open football? Do you think they now have the players to do that or will we see more of what we saw last year in Croker. It would be interesting to see.
This Tyrone team is very different to what ye played last summer.
Do you think we'll see Sean Cavanagh and probably Colm targeted again for some special "Dick" treatment. Will there be an element of revenge about this game for some of the players and fans after how we cheated you out of winning SAM last year?
Taking off my smart arse hat I think ye actually are a better team under your new manager and if I'm being totally honest I think ye could actually beat us or at least give us a hell of a game this time. However I think it could down to your discipline or lack of that could lose ye the game. If Morgan can stay on the field he will punish any fouls within 50-60 yards and he will frustrate the hell out of your fans and then players with his slow lazy kicking style. in Omagh the Down fans were on his back right from the start.
The other factor of course is has Mickey got our defence finally sorted. Will he stop playing players who are too attack minded and don't seem to follow their man when they pass and go?
I think having Justy in at FB will be a huge help and bringing on Conor in the 2nd half always tightens things up. Hopefully your'e not out of sight by then.
Will yis be wearing Blue this time or try to sneak the white jersey stunt again.
Will Tommy Freeman be back itching to get on and waving to the crowd Brolly style. It will be interesting to see what Joe has to say about this match. I loved the way Michael Lyster challenges him now every time when talking about Sean Cavanagh. Love it Mick
Monaghan will have to play as dirty as they possibly can to give Tyrone a real reason to lie down rather than dive and look to get their opponent sent off/black carded.
(Is this how we play this game?)
Quote from: Fuzzman on June 04, 2014, 11:15:23 AM
Quote from: GrandMasterFlash on June 04, 2014, 09:35:35 AM
What's with all the kicking around the field rrhf? Could you please explain how you think Tryone won All Irelands in '03, '05 & '08? Tyrone are one of the most physical teams of the last 15 years (and in a good way I might add as most of them had the skill to go with it).
Please also explain the difference between 'kicking around the field' and rugby tackling an inside forward to the ground, what's the difference and which is favourable in your opinion?
I'll let rrhf explain how Monaghan for the last 20 years if not more kick teams around the field but do you really need us to explain the difference between doing that and how Sean Cav rugby tackled a man to save a certain goal. Can you really not see the difference?
Most people would say the Tyrone team in the 2000s worked very hard at tackling back and the odd time they bent/broke the rules like Ricey and Gormley but there would be very few UNBIASED NEUTRALS would say Tyrone were a dirty team back then. As you admit yourself we had too many quality talented players all over the pitch to need to be dirty or over physical. I think most people would have said Armagh and Monaghan are the two most physical teams in Ulster over the last 20 years.
You then admit that yourself by your line
Yes they play hard and on the edge but Monaghan have a much wider skill set now than they've had for a long time, if ever (no disrespect to the teams that went before..)
Quote from: GrandMasterFlash on June 04, 2014, 09:35:35 AM
It's a lazy analysis and a misunderstanding to think that Monaghan are all about brawn/dirt/physicality, whatever you want to call it. On average, our team is probably one of the smaller teams in terms of player size. Yes they play hard and on the edge but Monaghan have a much wider skill set now than they've had for a long time, if ever (no disrespect to the teams that went before..)
Tyrone know how to mix it in the physicality stakes, probably a lot better than Monaghan to be honest, so, as I said on this thread before, it's a little bit rich for Tyrone men to be criticising Monaghan for 'kicking teams around the field'.
So you say Monaghan play hard and on the edge to defend your team but then say
Tyrone know how to mix it in the physicality stakes, probably a lot better than Monaghan. Is this a compliment to Tyrone or are you saying it's a bad thing?
You seem to be contradicting yourself a lot in that post GMF but to me the gist of what your saying is that this new Monaghan team are much smaller and more skillful than the teams that went before them who used to depend on kicking the sh*te out of teams in the hope of winning.
Would you say that most times Tyrone play Monaghan that it is Monaghan's interest to cut out the dirt and play open football? Do you think they now have the players to do that or will we see more of what we saw last year in Croker. It would be interesting to see.
This Tyrone team is very different to what ye played last summer.
Do you think we'll see Sean Cavanagh and probably Colm targeted again for some special "Dick" treatment. Will there be an element of revenge about this game for some of the players and fans after how we cheated you out of winning SAM last year?
Taking off my smart arse hat I think ye actually are a better team under your new manager and if I'm being totally honest I think ye could actually beat us or at least give us a hell of a game this time. However I think it could down to your discipline or lack of that could lose ye the game. If Morgan can stay on the field he will punish any fouls within 50-60 yards and he will frustrate the hell out of your fans and then players with his slow lazy kicking style. in Omagh the Down fans were on his back right from the start.
The other factor of course is has Mickey got our defence finally sorted. Will he stop playing players who are too attack minded and don't seem to follow their man when they pass and go?
I think having Justy in at FB will be a huge help and bringing on Conor in the 2nd half always tightens things up. Hopefully your'e not out of sight by then.
Will yis be wearing Blue this time or try to sneak the white jersey stunt again.
Will Tommy Freeman be back itching to get on and waving to the crowd Brolly style. It will be interesting to see what Joe has to say about this match. I loved the way Michael Lyster challenges him now every time when talking about Sean Cavanagh. Love it Mick
Firstly I was an UNBIASED NEUTRAL back then also. I attended 2 out of the 3 AI finals ('03 and '05) as most of my friends are from Tyrone. I would say that I didn't miss one of the Tyrone/Armagh titanic clashes in the 2000s and watched Tyrone in Croker throughout those fantastic years, and thoroughly enjoyed it..
I am not denying that Monaghan have been an 'over physical' team in the past and unfortunately have the ability to play like this. I must state though that this is not what your average Monaghan fan wants to see as we know they can play football when the put their minds to it. Banty had them fired up such that they would have went through a wall for him; this got them so far but not where they or any fan wanted them to be.. MOR is a different story and has them playing with the belief that they can win. Obviously winning an Ulster title has heightened this belief, as you would expect.
We are a different team now to the Monaghan teams of old. We have a wider range of skills, a greater depth in our panel, a bit of belief and an astute manager, which are all bonuses..
I just feel that it's a lazy and unfair analysis of Monaghan to say that they're dirty, they have no other offerings, and their main objective is 'kick the sh*te' out of teams or 'kick teams around the field' in 'the hope of winning'.
Regarding the jersey colour, I couldn't give a sh*te if they wore clown suits as long as they win.. :)
I think Malachy O'Rourke will have a surprise or two in his team line up for this game. Not many would have predicted that Pauric Donaghy would have started last years ulster final and that Paudie McKenna would have started the Div 2 League final (after not playing a single minute during the regular league fixtures).
We are less likely to be provoked into overly physical reactions these days by dastardly opponents, than in Banty's day.
But we just keep our powder dry, we haven't decommissioned.
That's a much better post GMF and much more open and honest and I'm not saying that sarcastically.
I haven't saw enough of ye to comment well enough but I agree Malachy is an astute manager and I think ye have progressed a lot from years gone by.
You've good players all over the team now and not just dependant on McManus. However, he will be a huge loss if he can't play as he would worry our defenders who are already brittle in confidence.
My main admiration for ye was that ye beat Donegal last year whereas we failed the previous 3 times.
Do you think ye will play the same way ye did v Donegal last year or are ye playing a lot more open. If it is an open game it could be the best game of the Ulster championship as I fear Cavan and Donegal will continue with their squeeze the life out of teams
(http://www.motifake.com/image/demotivational-poster/1206/life-pzy-mouse-snake-squeeze-life-demotivational-posters-1338777510.jpg)
I'm happy that you feel Monaghan have turned a corner and I think a bit like ourselves, playing in Ulster brings out the worst in you as it's dog eat dog. You can understand why Tyrone fans hate playing ye as it is always a dirty enough match with one team as bad as the other often.
As I said for the Down game, we have a tough road through the front door where we need to beat
Down, Monaghan(away), Cavan/Armagh and then probably Donegal AGAIN.
Compare it to Cork, Kerry or Dublin's path to the AI 1/4 finals and it just shows how unbalanced it is
As Darragh o'Se said in his Irish Times article (http://www.irishtimes.com/sport/gaelic-games/laverty-cut-from-same-cloth-as-canavan-the-small-man-with-attitude-surviving-in-ulster-1.1811463?page=2) Ulster football is amazing this time of the year and it gives the rest of us great entertainment when we're waiting for August.
No harm Fuzzman but I'd question how much you've actually seen or know about this Monaghan team, given that you've referenced a few times that Tyrone players will be in for special treatment from Dick, when the reality is that Dick most likely won't feature until the last 15-20 minutes. As long as Lennon stays fit that is, fingers crossed.
So I'd take your opinion on Monaghan being dirty with a pinch of salt. As the other fellas have said it's a different Monaghan team now than it was under Banty, yet it's still that period that defines Monaghan by the looks of it. We're playing a better style of football, more players are comfortable taking scores and from distance too, a far cry from when we sometimes used to almost exclusively rely on Tommy and Finlay from play and frees. And again the lack of discipline comment puzzles me, I wouldn't be too worried about that at all. Yes it was only the league, but we didn't get a black card until the final. The defence has been very solid recently, not as much needless fouling as there used to be and more clean turnovers. It's no secret that Morgan's frees are one of Tyrone's main weapons so I'm sure O'Rourke will have that drilled into the Monaghan defence.
Quote from: Main Street on June 03, 2014, 10:49:17 PM
Quote from: rrhf on June 03, 2014, 10:14:53 PM
This time last year Monaghan kicked Donegal around the field in Clones in the Ulster final in a cynical game largely ignored because of the novelty team winning. Can they do it again?
Obviously we had seen how not to play Donegal :D
Of course it's a tough task to out-cynic Tyrone, we would lose that type of game as Tyrone are the masters there. Probably we will be putting all our eggs into our football ability, tactics and the like.
Please do...
Your right I haven't seen them this year at all Schkite and I'm glad to hear they've cleaned up their act.
I will be delighted if they play positive open football as that suits our forwards big time. They would much prefer going man to man or at least not having a Donegal style of defence around them.
All I was saying was that I think Tyrone and Monaghan seem to take the worst out of each other.
Look at the Penrose v Mone battle last year. Penrose very rarely gets himself into that sort of a confrontation but he totally lost the run of himself last year and I was shocked Mickey didn't take him off at half time before he got the line before the start of the second half.
On a totally different note. Did anyone come up with the final answer on whether the ref can move a sideline kick up the field if someone else is fouled when the ball is dead?
Quote from: Sleater on June 04, 2014, 12:02:28 PM
I think Malachy O'Rourke will have a surprise or two in his team line up for this game. Not many would have predicted that Pauric Donaghy would have started last years ulster final and that Paudie McKenna would have started the Div 2 League final (after not playing a single minute during the regular league fixtures).
On this note, I seen elsewhere that Conor McCarthy and Ryan McAnespie have been at training recently, anyone able to confirm or deny?
Quote from: Fuzzman on June 04, 2014, 02:07:16 PM
Your right I haven't seen them this year at all Schkite and I'm glad to hear they've cleaned up their act.
I will be delighted if they play positive open football as that suits our forwards big time. They would much prefer going man to man or at least not having a Donegal style of defence around them.
All I was saying was that I think Tyrone and Monaghan seem to take the worst out of each other.
Look at the Penrose v Mone battle last year. Penrose very rarely gets himself into that sort of a confrontation but he totally lost the run of himself last year and I was shocked Mickey didn't take him off at half time before he got the line before the start of the second half.
On a totally different note. Did anyone come up with the final answer on whether the ref can move a sideline kick up the field if someone else is fouled when the ball is dead?
Nothing Mickey could have done would have prevented Tyrone being reduced to 14.
Mickey is much smarter than you give him credit for.
Why do you Tyronies always think you know better than Mickey?
Of course there was nothing he could have done as the Ref wouldn't have accepted the substitution request but my point was that Penrose had totally lost the run of himself in the first half and was playing brutal stuff and Mickey could have had him off before half time arrived.
Everyone around me was saying they should take him off before he gets himself sent off and then he was.
Yes we all know better than Mickey. Mickey Mouse that is. We are still entitled to our opinions though.
How can you see the game going Main Street? Will it be an open and high scoring or will ye revert to playing sweepers? Do you think the two games we've had already will benefit us or will ye be fresher?
Any word on Joey McMahon and McNamee. Those two would certainly benefit the team I think.
Should we drop big Sean for this one? Save him for the Cavan game. ;D
We don't want Joe having another seizure on live TV.
(http://db2.stb.s-msn.com/i/8E/09B8242E4D97E9C5A24CBC15FB7_h416_w442_m2_q80_cTtGtCfhV.jpg)
Quote from: Fuzzman on June 04, 2014, 04:02:47 PM
How can you see the game going Main Street? Will it be an open and high scoring or will ye revert to playing sweepers? Do you think the two games we've had already will benefit us or will ye be fresher?
Any word on Joey McMahon and McNamee. Those two would certainly benefit the team I think.
Should we drop big Sean for this one? We don't want Joe having another seizure on live TV.
The force of Joe will be with us, but we won't need him, we're in good shape.
I don't know about freshness v 2 games under the belt. There's no science to say which of the benefits matters more, the benefit can swing stronger for either side on the day as they have done in the past, just depends.
Tyrone have "issues" lingering since last year but maybe have them sorted or still have enough to control this game after going a few points clear midway in the 2nd half. We have yet to beat Tyrone, that's a slight (elephant in the room) disadvantage right there.
I'm visualising Monaghan 2 points ahead with the ball, a minute of aded time to play and the crowd doing "ole's".
Quote from: Main Street on June 04, 2014, 05:01:36 PM
I'm visualising Monaghan 2 points ahead with the ball, a minute of aded (sic) time to play and the crowd doing "ole's".
They even misuse the apostrophe when they're chanting. Dirty fcukers.
Talking to one of the Monaghan lads today, they are hoping to introduce balls to training by end of the week. Basically its been wrestling and the dark arts to now. They have only burnt a dozen tyrone jerseys to date though and are looking more if anyone has any.
Quote from: Bingo on June 04, 2014, 05:30:56 PM
Talking to one of the Monaghan lads today, they are hoping to introduce balls to training by end of the week. Basically its been wrestling and the dark arts to now. They have only burnt a dozen tyrone jerseys to date though and are looking more if anyone has any.
I heard they're coming up with homophobic, "g'wan ye thieven'/dog fighten' bastards" type taunts. Needs must, to stop the exponents of all that is good in Ulster Gaelic football from strutting their stuff.
Old friends - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TTfMlSVpyp8
Dick coming in hard on Cavanagh around 1 min - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VqkWU5r9Xfs
Some Dick - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_z_2DsAL61M
Quote from: ONeill on June 04, 2014, 09:20:41 PM
Old friends - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TTfMlSVpyp8
Dick coming in hard on Cavanagh around 1 min - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VqkWU5r9Xfs
Some Dick - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_z_2DsAL61M
What exactly are your links above meant to prove? And as pointed out earlier, Clerkin isn't likely to feature much, if at all, so this Tyronie fixation with him is silly. It was Cavanagh's diving got him sent off last time in Omagh; Cavanagh who fooled the ref and got Hughes booked in Croke Park as well as hauling McManus down going for goal.
The sooner there's a TMO, or even post match citing and match bans, to cut out this sort of cynical shit, the better. One ref and a black card isn't enough to deal with them.
Tyrone need to be careful with this Monaghan tactic of raking at people when the half time whistle goes as you can see here around 2:30 - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tcodTHu4Vi8
In terms of Gerry Arth seating am I right in thinking DO row A would be right down the front and DC row A would be about halfway up?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sTQQa1djtF8
Cynical stuff by Monaghan around 7:35 here.
Just after watching penrose a sending off from last year again. How can Monaghan fans still be complaining about cavanagh diving when you see what dessie mone did last year. Down holding his face when barely more than pushed in his chest.
Quote from: ONeill on June 04, 2014, 10:11:22 PM
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sTQQa1djtF8
Cynical stuff by Monaghan around 7:35 here.
Thanks for shedding light on these offences O'Neill. We are all the wiser for it. Your forensic trawling through past matches going back to 1988 is the stuff of...a sado that seriously needs to get a life.
Quote from: Redhand Santa on June 04, 2014, 10:48:38 PM
Just after watching penrose a sending off from last year again. How can Monaghan fans still be complaining about cavanagh diving when you see what dessie mone did last year. Down holding his face when barely more than pushed in his chest.
Cuz Dessie got a Tyrone woman and she rubbed off on 'im.
Quote from: Redhand Santa on June 04, 2014, 10:48:38 PM
Just after watching penrose a sending off from last year again. How can Monaghan fans still be complaining about cavanagh diving when you see what dessie mone did last year. Down holding his face when barely more than pushed in his chest.
Ah jesus not this shite again...
Quote from: babarino on June 04, 2014, 10:53:49 PM
Quote from: ONeill on June 04, 2014, 10:11:22 PM
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sTQQa1djtF8
Cynical stuff by Monaghan around 7:35 here.
Thanks for shedding light on these offences O'Neill. We are all the wiser for it. Your forensic trawling through past matches going back to 1988 is the stuff of...a sado that seriously needs to get a life.
OK, but how do you defend the cynical laughter after this goal around 1:09? https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9Rxrsu9ot2Q
Quote from: Schkite on June 04, 2014, 11:10:26 PM
Quote from: Redhand Santa on June 04, 2014, 10:48:38 PM
Just after watching penrose a sending off from last year again. How can Monaghan fans still be complaining about cavanagh diving when you see what dessie mone did last year. Down holding his face when barely more than pushed in his chest.
Ah jesus not this shite again...
Like a dog with a bone, or a bone to pick, or in a dog fight. Hey, they're dogged.
O'Neill O'Neill O'Neill.
Leave them alone man. It's like Diarmuid Connolly. Misunderstood.
Monaghan are a changed animal. They've gone to anger management.
Yes they agree themselves they've spent years in the dark side and like ourselves they had to cross the line a few times to get over the line last year but trust them now
They're a totally different side now from the one in Croker last year.
They've got a top quality manager now who likes to play the game the way it should be played and so you will not see any more cynical stuff any more. So relax. Put away the old videos and enjoy the build up to the best game in Ulster this year. Red v Blue where I expect 3.11 to 2.15 scoreline.
I was just wondering did we ever meet Monaghan when we had Canavan playing? How did they manage to mark him?
As a matter of interest lads would you rather lose your title to Tyrone or Funegal?
Quote from: ONeill on June 04, 2014, 10:11:22 PM
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sTQQa1djtF8
Cynical stuff by Monaghan around 7:35 here.
If you look closely behind the goals a 5 year Sean Cavanagh is standing with his face pushed up against the wire with a tear rolling down his face, in despair at the cynical way in which Monaghan denied his beloved county an Ulster title.
Quote from: ONeill on June 04, 2014, 10:11:22 PM
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sTQQa1djtF8
Cynical stuff by Monaghan around 7:35 here.
Well done , had to laugh watching that clip
Stone Wall Penalty, referee hadnt the gahunas to give it , home town decision ::) ::)
Quote from: Fuzzman on June 04, 2014, 11:57:05 PM
O'Neill O'Neill O'Neill.
Leave them alone man. It's like Diarmuid Connolly. Misunderstood.
Monaghan are a changed animal. They've gone to anger management.
Yes they agree themselves they've spent years in the dark side and like ourselves they had to cross the line a few times to get over the line last year but trust them now
They're a totally different side now from the one in Croker last year.
They've got a top quality manager now who likes to play the game the way it should be played and so you will not see any more cynical stuff any more. So relax. Put away the old videos and enjoy the build up to the best game in Ulster this year. Red v Blue where I expect 3.11 to 2.15 scoreline.
I was just wondering did we ever meet Monaghan when we had Canavan playing? How did they manage to mark him?
As a matter of interest lads would you rather lose your title to Tyrone or Funegal?
D Connolly ???? you must be smoking weed
This is a battle between 2 cynical teams, however Tyrone are a different class to Monaghan and with all due respect, play football when given a chance, have won 3 AIs and are more skilled and equipped to progress
Monaghan will try and drag Tyrone down to a game which suits them, Physical, Ferocious Tackling, Intense Pressure and with this in mind could nullify Tyrone
Toss of a coin, Tyrone by 2 points but it wont be pretty, 2 Red Cards min, Monaghan don't do pretty and play on the edge all day long
So the referee could be crucial
Quote from: ONeill on June 04, 2014, 05:23:01 PM
Quote from: Main Street on June 04, 2014, 05:01:36 PM
I'm visualising Monaghan 2 points ahead with the ball, a minute of aded (sic) time to play and the crowd doing "ole's".
They even misuse the apostrophe when they're chanting. Dirty fcukers.
We even misspelled added.
A cry for help from the fckwit who goes by the username of oneill.
Maybe this is the time to acknowledge that an apostrophe free, self conscious fckwit with low self esteem, who calls himself ONeill, does exist.
He appears to need help. Is there anybody out there who can talk him down? You can promise him anything, but not an UC semi final place.
Quote from: Fuzzman on June 04, 2014, 11:57:05 PM
O'Neill O'Neill O'Neill.
Leave them alone man. It's like Diarmuid Connolly. Misunderstood.
Monaghan are a changed animal. They've gone to anger management.
Yes they agree themselves they've spent years in the dark side and like ourselves they had to cross the line a few times to get over the line last year but trust them now
They're a totally different side now from the one in Croker last year.
They've got a top quality manager now who likes to play the game the way it should be played and so you will not see any more cynical stuff any more. So relax. Put away the old videos and enjoy the build up to the best game in Ulster this year. Red v Blue where I expect 3.11 to 2.15 scoreline.
I was just wondering did we ever meet Monaghan when we had Canavan playing? How did they manage to mark him?
As a matter of interest lads would you rather lose your title to Tyrone or Funegal?
I actually enjoyed O'Neills winding with the clips, it was the resurfacing of the Penrose/Gormley/Mone debate from last summer that made me sigh.
I know you're being a sarky hoor again but there won't be that scoring in it. Just because it'll probably be low-scoring doesn't equal a dirty and cynical game. You'd swear we were the destroyers of gaelic football and you lads the saviours with the shite talk going on here.
On Canavan, I'm sure he was playing when we met in 2005, though I don't remember him doing much if he was. O'Neill was the man who ruined us that day.
Quote from: anfheardubh on June 05, 2014, 01:14:54 AM
This is a battle between 2 cynical teams, however Tyrone are a different class to Monaghan and with all due respect, play football when given a chance, have won 3 AIs and are more skilled and equipped to progress
Monaghan will try and drag Tyrone down to a game which suits them, Physical, Ferocious Tackling, Intense Pressure and with this in mind could nullify Tyrone
Toss of a coin, Tyrone by 2 points but it wont be pretty, 2 Red Cards min, Monaghan don't do pretty and play on the edge all day long
So the referee could be crucial
Different class, are they really? The Tyrone team now is full of young lads who've won nothing at senior level, the odd older head still knocking about and the likes of Cavanagh who is still playing great stuff. But there's far fewer of that calibre of player there now. It's no longer the days of Tyrone automatically being one of the main contenders for Sam, yet people still rate them like they are. Probably not much in it either way, but different class, no chance.
Quote from: anfheardubh on June 05, 2014, 01:03:18 AM
Quote from: ONeill on June 04, 2014, 10:11:22 PM
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sTQQa1djtF8
Cynical stuff by Monaghan around 7:35 here.
Well done , had to laugh watching that clip
Stone Wall Penalty, referee hadnt the gahunas to give it , home town decision ::) ::)
I remember it well, the Ref was shocking that day
Quote from: ONeill on June 04, 2014, 11:17:27 PM
Quote from: babarino on June 04, 2014, 10:53:49 PM
Quote from: ONeill on June 04, 2014, 10:11:22 PM
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sTQQa1djtF8
Cynical stuff by Monaghan around 7:35 here.
Thanks for shedding light on these offences O'Neill. We are all the wiser for it. Your forensic trawling through past matches going back to 1988 is the stuff of...a sado that seriously needs to get a life.
OK, but how do you defend the cynical laughter after this goal around 1:09? https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9Rxrsu9ot2Q
O'Neill I don't know where u got that from but I think that's the most serious offence you have unearthed!
Monaghan folk have some serious questions to answer
BTW O'Neill David Forde could have a job for you with the HET
Quote from: babarino on June 04, 2014, 09:50:10 PM
Quote from: ONeill on June 04, 2014, 09:20:41 PM
Old friends - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TTfMlSVpyp8
Dick coming in hard on Cavanagh around 1 min - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VqkWU5r9Xfs
Some Dick - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_z_2DsAL61M
What exactly are your links above meant to prove? And as pointed out earlier, Clerkin isn't likely to feature much, if at all, so this Tyronie fixation with him is silly. It was Cavanagh's diving got him sent off last time in Omagh; Cavanagh who fooled the ref and got Hughes booked in Croke Park as well as hauling McManus down going for goal.
The sooner there's a TMO, or even post match citing and match bans, to cut out this sort of cynical shit, the better. One ref and a black card isn't enough to deal with them.
I still laugh at Monaghan fans and their excuse for Darren Hughes being taught a lesson last year due to him getting a yellow card. That all stemmed from some RTE pundit spouting it and every Tom, Dick and Harry then decided to use that to defend how Hughes got the runaround. Cavanagh has gave better players than Hughes the runaround, and there has been thousands of players in the past who have received yellow cards and unless I'm mistaken, they were allowed to stay on the pitch and continue to play the game.
You Tyrone boys as always are fierce good craic. You are trying to build up Monaghan as a team full of hackers and draggers. I've seen the likes of Mayo, Donegal and Dublin up close and personal of late, as well as Monaghan, and Monaghan do not even come close to those three in the cynical / physical stakes. McManus is a huge loss. With him I would have tipped the Farney to win by a few, but now, its in the balance. If they click, the Tyrone forward unit will cause some heartache....however, can see this one ending in a draw
The championship has been very stop start so far this year.....ON WAY THE DIGGER!!!
Monaghan are at the mind games again. There is no doubt that McManus will be playing a part next week.
Can't wait for this game.
Quote from: Redhand Santa on June 05, 2014, 10:59:58 AM
Monaghan are at the mind games again. There is no doubt that McManus will be playing a part next week.
I'm certainly a bit more optimistic than I was a few weeks ago, and the word is he doesn't need the surgery which is a boost. But there's no sense in him rushing back and then getting a set-back. And this definitely isn't the game for it. Imagine all those Tyrone hallions dragging out of him and kicking his ankle, sure he'd be off on a stretcher.
Quote from: tyroneman on June 04, 2014, 10:08:34 PM
In terms of Gerry Arth seating am I right in thinking DO row A would be right down the front and DC row A would be about halfway up?
Correct. The O tells you it's open seating and C says it's "covered" seating. Row A of the covered sections would probably start just as you come up the steps.
Big Hughes can be a handful. Is Justin the man for the job?
Jeepers it's got fierce nasty in here and I think that's the first time I saw anfheardubh give us Tyronies any praise ;D
Yes I kinda half expect to see McManus at some stage.
I think it might not be as nasty as last years match. We just don't have that many spoilers any more as Mickey tends to have all good ball players in the squad.
When Gormley goes I don't know who we'll get to give a few slaps here and there.
I must say I'm really looking forward to this game and am kinda relieved it's not in Omagh as I've yet to see Tyrone play well there in a Ulster championship game but I suppose there hasn't been too many.
When is the 1st round of the qualifiers?
21st June
The curse of the six day turn around could leave Monaghan with a very long summer of nothing but cutting silage and saving hay!
Quote from: WT4E on June 05, 2014, 01:28:13 PM
The curse of the six day turn around could leave Monaghan with a very long summer of nothing but cutting silage and saving hay!
If they could get some of that silage done around Clones in time for the Tyrone and Monaghan match it will help the parking.
Monaghan these days remind me of... Monaghan. Wee buns, wee fecking buns!
Quote from: WT4E on June 05, 2014, 01:28:13 PM
The curse of the six day turn around could leave Monaghan with a very long summer of nothing but cutting silage and saving hay!
I have to apologise for that last post
I forgot to mention the bog - plenty of time to take home the turf too boys!
WT4E, were the Mods onto you?
Have Monaghan a good record in Clones?
I mean against other teams.
I wonder where Mickey will play big Sean for this game?
Maybe CHB and swap him with Mattie for his tackling back strengths
It will be interesting if we're leading by 2 points with time up and McCarron or Hughes is straight through on goal. What would you expect your players to do in that situation.
Brolly will be looking forward to this game I'd say. I hope him and Spillane are on.
Would this be considered Monaghan's strongest team which played in the league final. Have the won the Div 2 final before?
R Beggan (0-01 '45'); K Duffy, D Wylie, F Kelly (0-01); D Mone (0-01), V Corey, C Walshe; O Lennon, P Finlay (0-03, 1f); Kieran Hughes (1-01), S Gollogly, D Hughes (0-02); D Malone, P McKenna (0-02), C McManus (0-03).
Quote from: the_daddy on June 05, 2014, 03:12:19 PM
Regardless of result both teams will be out on 28th of June I think
A piece of realism, at last. Thanks Daddy.
http://digg.com/video/the-most-violent-sport-on-earth (http://digg.com/video/the-most-violent-sport-on-earth)
Secret recording of a Monaghan training session from the weekend just gone.
Quote from: the_daddy on June 05, 2014, 03:12:19 PM
Regardless of result both teams will be out on 28th of June I think
dont see it myself. Derry were very naive fornenst Donegal. Tyrone or Monaghan a bit too long in the tooth for the guff Donegal will serve up
Quote from: Fuzzman on June 05, 2014, 03:10:05 PM
WT4E, were the Mods onto you?
Have Monaghan a good record in Clones?
I mean against other teams.
I wonder where Mickey will play big Sean for this game?
Maybe CHB and swap him with Mattie for his tackling back strengths
It will be interesting if we're leading by 2 points with time up and McCarron or Hughes is straight through on goal. What would you expect your players to do in that situation.
Brolly will be looking forward to this game I'd say. I hope him and Spillane are on.
Would this be considered Monaghan's strongest team which played in the league final. Have the won the Div 2 final before?
R Beggan (0-01 '45'); K Duffy, D Wylie, F Kelly (0-01); D Mone (0-01), V Corey, C Walshe; O Lennon, P Finlay (0-03, 1f); Kieran Hughes (1-01), S Gollogly, D Hughes (0-02); D Malone, P McKenna (0-02), C McManus (0-03).
I know you are jesting about Sean but seriously will he now be moved to MF with Clarke out?
Quote from: EC Unique on June 05, 2014, 03:54:40 PM
Quote from: Fuzzman on June 05, 2014, 03:10:05 PM
WT4E, were the Mods onto you?
Have Monaghan a good record in Clones?
I mean against other teams.
I wonder where Mickey will play big Sean for this game?
Maybe CHB and swap him with Mattie for his tackling back strengths
It will be interesting if we're leading by 2 points with time up and McCarron or Hughes is straight through on goal. What would you expect your players to do in that situation.
Brolly will be looking forward to this game I'd say. I hope him and Spillane are on.
Would this be considered Monaghan's strongest team which played in the league final. Have the won the Div 2 final before?
R Beggan (0-01 '45'); K Duffy, D Wylie, F Kelly (0-01); D Mone (0-01), V Corey, C Walshe; O Lennon, P Finlay (0-03, 1f); Kieran Hughes (1-01), S Gollogly, D Hughes (0-02); D Malone, P McKenna (0-02), C McManus (0-03).
I know you are jesting about Sean but seriously will he now be moved to MF with Clarke out?
Id guess so. Not too many options with Joe McMahon ruled out & Aidan Cassidy no longer on the panel.
Conan Grugan & Plunkett Kane both returned from injury to play in the club championship, so they could come into the reckoning, but id imagine Sean will move to midfield.
Quote from: Bingo on June 05, 2014, 03:35:43 PM
http://digg.com/video/the-most-violent-sport-on-earth (http://digg.com/video/the-most-violent-sport-on-earth)
Secret recording of a Monaghan training session from the weekend just gone.
Just one bad call by the referee there - he missed a black card near the end.
Quote from: orangeman on June 05, 2014, 04:57:30 PM
Quote from: Bingo on June 05, 2014, 03:35:43 PM
http://digg.com/video/the-most-violent-sport-on-earth (http://digg.com/video/the-most-violent-sport-on-earth)
Secret recording of a Monaghan training session from the weekend just gone.
Just one bad call by the referee there - he missed a black card near the end.
Mickey Harte would be livid but Pat McEneaney will tell you he got it right.
Quote from: God14 on June 05, 2014, 04:02:22 PM
Quote from: EC Unique on June 05, 2014, 03:54:40 PM
Quote from: Fuzzman on June 05, 2014, 03:10:05 PM
WT4E, were the Mods onto you?
Have Monaghan a good record in Clones?
I mean against other teams.
I wonder where Mickey will play big Sean for this game?
Maybe CHB and swap him with Mattie for his tackling back strengths
It will be interesting if we're leading by 2 points with time up and McCarron or Hughes is straight through on goal. What would you expect your players to do in that situation.
Brolly will be looking forward to this game I'd say. I hope him and Spillane are on.
Would this be considered Monaghan's strongest team which played in the league final. Have the won the Div 2 final before?
R Beggan (0-01 '45'); K Duffy, D Wylie, F Kelly (0-01); D Mone (0-01), V Corey, C Walshe; O Lennon, P Finlay (0-03, 1f); Kieran Hughes (1-01), S Gollogly, D Hughes (0-02); D Malone, P McKenna (0-02), C McManus (0-03).
I know you are jesting about Sean but seriously will he now be moved to MF with Clarke out?
Id guess so. Not too many options with Joe McMahon ruled out & Aidan Cassidy no longer on the panel.
Conan Grugan & Plunkett Kane both returned from injury to play in the club championship, so they could come into the reckoning, but id imagine Sean will move to midfield.
Was at that game and out of those two I'd pick Plunkett Kane on what I saw and I don't even think he was operating at midfield for the full match. Thought Kane v good for Coalisland and I'm surprised he hasn't had more opportunities under Harte.
Quote from: Fuzzman on June 05, 2014, 12:33:03 PM
Jeepers it's got fierce nasty in here and I think that's the first time I saw anfheardubh give us Tyronies any praise ;D
Yes I kinda half expect to see McManus at some stage.
I think it might not be as nasty as last years match. We just don't have that many spoilers any more as Mickey tends to have all good ball players in the squad.
When Gormley goes I don't know who we'll get to give a few slaps here and there.
I must say I'm really looking forward to this game and am kinda relieved it's not in Omagh as I've yet to see Tyrone play well there in a Ulster championship game but I suppose there hasn't been too many.
When is the 1st round of the qualifiers?
Jaysus mate , i supported ya in 3 AI finals, went to many a game, was at the AI semi v Armagh in 2005 when Peter kicked the winner, Had tickets for the final but gave them to a Tyrone man i know.
Think only people from counties WHO REACH the final should be given tickets but that is for another day
So i am not anti Tyrone just cause i started a topic questioning Tyrone's future?????
Quote from: Fear ón Srath Bán on June 05, 2014, 02:18:53 PM
Monaghan these days remind me of... Monaghan. Wee buns, wee fecking buns!
Brian O'Nolan wouldn't have put it better himself. Tyronie prose and I dare say we'll be quoting that Belfast catch phrase very soon.
Quote from: babarino on June 05, 2014, 11:08:03 PM
Quote from: Fear ón Srath Bán on June 05, 2014, 02:18:53 PM
Monaghan these days remind me of... Monaghan. Wee buns, wee fecking buns!
Brian O'Nolan wouldn't have put it better himself. Tyronie prose and I dare say we'll be quoting that Belfast catch phrase very soon.
When scores are tight and hard to get
And your manager has no plan
When all you have is no bulging net
A pint of plain is your only man
;)
Wow good man AnFheardubh. I did the same myself for the last 2 years. Well actually I went last year to the final and was in the Hill with a few Dubs.
The two years before that I managed to buy two tickets on the day and sold them on to Donegal and Dub fans. I was on crutches in 2011 and watched in it Jurys hotel surrounded by 10 Armagh women who had had their tickets stolen the night before.
Would ye rather meet Tyrone in the final as we're easier bate or like another go at Monaghan. Sorry Cavan & Armagh of course we're not forgetting ye.
Quote from: Fear ón Srath Bán on June 06, 2014, 11:03:21 AM
Quote from: babarino on June 05, 2014, 11:08:03 PM
Quote from: Fear ón Srath Bán on June 05, 2014, 02:18:53 PM
Monaghan these days remind me of... Monaghan. Wee buns, wee fecking buns!
Brian O'Nolan wouldn't have put it better himself. Tyronie prose and I dare say we'll be quoting that Belfast catch phrase very soon.
When scores are tight and hard to get
And your manager has no plan
When all you have is no bulging net
A pint of plain is your only man
;)
"Moderation, we find, is an extremely difficult thing to get in this country."
Quote from: Fear ón Srath Bán on June 06, 2014, 11:03:21 AM
Quote from: babarino on June 05, 2014, 11:08:03 PM
Quote from: Fear ón Srath Bán on June 05, 2014, 02:18:53 PM
Monaghan these days remind me of... Monaghan. Wee buns, wee fecking buns!
Brian O'Nolan wouldn't have put it better himself. Tyronie prose and I dare say we'll be quoting that Belfast catch phrase very soon.
When scores are tight and hard to get
And your manager has no plan
When all you have is no bulging net
A pint of plain is your only man
;)
When the game's tight, a win hard to get,
it comes down what makes a man.
All-star McManus goes for the net,
haul 'im down, however ye can.
So is it Farney or Oriel?
Quote from: ONeill on June 06, 2014, 11:42:11 PM
So is it Farney or Oriel?
If you know to ask the question, you know the answer.
For us that don't know can you explain?
Enjoy this weekend Farney boys as yis will be awful panicky all next week.
The wife recommends Imodium.
Quote from: Fuzzman on June 07, 2014, 01:17:47 AM
For us that don't know can you explain?
Enjoy this weekend Farney boys as yis will be awful panicky all next week.
The wife recommends Imodium.
Ask O'Neill. He knows. I couldn't be bothered with WUMs.
Yes I'm enjoying the weekend, but really looking forward to next weekend. BTW what's Imodium? Is that a drug for Tyronie assholes?
Yeoooooo. The Farney Oriel lads are wobbling. It's the Red Hand syndrome.
Kyle Coney for midfield says McGuigan.
Quote from: ONeill on June 07, 2014, 09:17:42 AM
Yeoooooo. The Farney Oriel lads are wobbling. It's the Red Hand syndrome.
Don't jeopardise your high standing satirical perception with this sort of nonsense O'Neill. ::)
Yeeeooooo.
Quote from: Fuzzman on June 07, 2014, 01:17:47 AM
For us that don't know can you explain?
Farney, is comprised of about 6 parishes in the south east of the county (where they talk with a Louth/south Armagh type accent). Farney is a misnomer when used for the whole county. It would be a bit like Inishowen in Donegal, or Ards in Down. Not that The Irish News cares, as it makes for better bylines. Gaelic Life, get it right, more often than not. The whole of the county is in the Kingdom of Oriel, so it's more accurate.
So, it shouldn't be called Monaghan either as it was, like Farney, one of the regions.
Hmm, can we get the Farney Monaghan Oriel kicked out?
Quote from: ONeill on June 07, 2014, 06:06:27 PM
So, it shouldn't be called Monaghan either as it was, like Farney, one of the regions.
Hmm, can we get the Farney Monaghan Oriel kicked out?
Do you not learn history in Tyrone? Monaghan, like Tyrone and all other counties, came into existence as an administrative unit, post plantation. Farney is a barony, much like Dungannon and Clogher were; Oriel, Breffni were gaelic kingdoms and predate counties.
It's one of our national ironies that counties have been adopted with such gusto by the GAA, when they were created by the Sasanachs. Counties loosely follow older kingdoms.
http://www.billmacafee.com/admin/mapbaroniesulster.htm
History this week, next up it'll be a football lesson.
So, it shouldn't be called Monaghan either as it was, like Farney, one of the regions.
Anyhow......back to business.....
Is Joe available yet?
Will Sean revert to MF and we install a playmaker at 11?
Sean will start mf. Shea McGuigan at 11.
Quote from: ONeill on June 07, 2014, 08:24:53 PM
Sean will start mf. Shea McGuigan at 11.
Thumbs up from me anyway!
If we had 6 Seans I'd play them 3, 6, 8, 9, 11 and 14, and if another 2 showed up, I'd have them 10 and 12 too!
Lads dee ye not think there's more lads deserving of a starting role than Shea.
Yes he's from great stuck but I've not saw much yet to impress me.
For me RON is our best 11 with SON there for 2nd half.
I won't be surprised if Mickey shocks us with a few more odd choices on his first 15.
McCrory has certainly shut me up on how well he handled Poland both games.
I'd be glad to see McNamee and Justy to join him in a stabilised FB line but God knows
I've not saw much of Jack McCarron but he sounds good.
Despite what most of ye Oriel/Farney/Ulster Champs say I'll be shocked if this is an open clean game of football.
Do ye want Cavan or Our ma next?
Quote from: Fuzzman on June 07, 2014, 10:49:02 PM
Lads dee ye not think there's more lads deserving of a starting role than Shea.
Yes he's from great stuck but I've not saw much yet to impress me.
For me RON is our best 11 with SON there for 2nd half.
I won't be surprised if Mickey shocks us with a few more odd choices on his first 15.
McCrory has certainly shut me up on how well he handled Poland both games.
I'd be glad to see McNamee and Justy to join him in a stabilised FB line but God knows
I've not saw much of Jack McCarron but he sounds good.
Despite what most of ye Oriel/Farney/Ulster Champs say I'll be shocked if this is an open clean game of football.
Do ye want Cavan or Our ma next?
I agree about Ronan O'Neill, but I'd like to see how Shea performs in a championship game. Although not overly impressing during the league I do feel that if we are going to have lads like Shea on the squad then we have to give them the opportunity to play their way onto the team. He showed enough flashes of class to be given a chance. What's the alternative? Do we do what we did with loads of players in the past and keep him in the squad, give him no championship game time and drop them off a few years down the line. This is a perfect game to see if Shea can make it - I think he is good enough but if we don't play him in a championship game then we'll never know.
Quote from: ONeill on June 07, 2014, 07:50:57 PM
So, it shouldn't be called Monaghan either as it was, like Farney, one of the regions.
Well Donegal would be part of Tyrone, if that's your point. You'd have an even bigger pool to pick from.
Quote from: BennyHarp on June 07, 2014, 10:59:34 PM
I agree about Ronan O'Neill, but I'd like to see how Shea performs in a championship game. Although not overly impressing during the league I do feel that if we are going to have lads like Shea on the squad then we have to give them the opportunity to play their way onto the team. He showed enough flashes of class to be given a chance. What's the alternative? Do we do what we did with loads of players in the past and keep him in the squad, give him no championship game time and drop them off a few years down the line. This is a perfect game to see if Shea can make it - I think he is good enough but if we don't play him in a championship game then we'll never know.
Agreed BH, and what holds for young Mc Guigan would hold equally for young Grugan (IMO), whom I'd like to see get a run out in this one too.
RON at 11 with McAlskey/SON into the FF line. Sean to MF.
EC. No Errigal Ciaran men that could fill those roles??
Jaysus lads, we will need to watch our backs in the parade next week ;)
Quote from: cadhlancian on June 08, 2014, 07:41:19 PM
Jaysus lads, we will need to watch our backs in the parade next week ;)
Show the respect due to Ulster Champions with a guard of honour and I'm sure there'll be no trouble.
Quote from: cadhlancian on June 08, 2014, 05:26:56 PM
EC. No Errigal Ciaran men that could fill those roles??
No. We already have 3 starters on the side. Can't think of any others that would suit those positions.
Quote from: babarino on June 07, 2014, 03:29:48 PM
Quote from: Fuzzman on June 07, 2014, 01:17:47 AM
For us that don't know can you explain?
Farney, is comprised of about 6 parishes in the south east of the county (where they talk with a Louth/south Armagh type accent). Farney is a misnomer when used for the whole county. It would be a bit like Inishowen in Donegal, or Ards in Down. Not that The Irish News cares, as it makes for better bylines. Gaelic Life, get it right, more often than not. The whole of the county is in the Kingdom of Oriel, so it's more accurate.
So whats the deal with the Farney army then? Inniskeen lads only need apply
I see Monaghan are away to Louth in the qualifiers!
Quote from: WT4E on June 09, 2014, 10:51:07 AM
I see Monaghan are away to Louth in the qualifiers!
I advise returning your crystal ball, it's obviously broken.
Any word on team news?
Do Tyrone still go away for weekends before a big match?
I presume there will be a big crowd at this game?
Quote from: Fuzzman on June 09, 2014, 12:08:10 PM
Any word on team news?
Do Tyrone still go away for weekends before a big match?
I presume there will be a big crowd at this game?
Both teams were away this weekend and amazingly ended up in same hotel. At the breakfast buffet, Cavanagh went in for the breakfast but the monaghan lads were already there and was a big queue at the hot counter, so he jumped straight ahead to the get his drinks. At this stage, Dick Clerkin had his fry and was moving onto the drinks area. When he seen Cavanagh ahead and breaking the traditional breakfast protocol he flipped and shoulder charged him. It all kicked off from there and several sausages and eggs got thrown.
Of course it was the hotels fault for failing to have clear controls on place and the breakfast manager has lost his job.
So it kicks off next weekend, don't be surprised.
Dick threw a piece of cheese at Cavanagh. Sean turned around and shouted, "That's not very mature!"
Cheesy O'Neill. Very cheesy
Quote from: ONeill on June 09, 2014, 01:27:32 PM
Dick threw a piece of cheese at Cavanagh. Sean turned around and shouted, "That's not very mature!"
Lies, firstly if Dick threw it, it would have missed...comfortably. But Cavanagh would have threw himself to the floor anyway and rolled about a bit.
Who do ye Armagh boys want in the next round?
I see ye were getting ready for the marching season yesterday behind the Cavan flag
I hope there will be none of that in the next round.
Quote from: Fuzzman on June 09, 2014, 03:45:10 PM
Who do ye Armagh boys want in the next round?
I'm sure the men of Armagh would like to do unto Tyrone as the ladies of Armagh did yesterday. But I think we'll get Monaghan.
Quote from: ONeill on June 09, 2014, 01:27:32 PM
Dick threw a piece of cheese at Cavanagh. Sean turned around and shouted, "That's not very mature!"
How dairy
Quote from: armaghniac on June 09, 2014, 03:52:57 PM
Quote from: Fuzzman on June 09, 2014, 03:45:10 PM
Who do ye Armagh boys want in the next round?
I'm sure the men of Armagh would like to do unto Tyrone as the ladies of Armagh did yesterday. But I think we'll get Monaghan.
Please, please, please don't degrade this to a Tyrone/Armagh 'my Da's bigger than yours' thread, I beg you.. Ten years of that on here was more than ample for us... ???
Quote from: GrandMasterFlash on June 09, 2014, 11:02:21 PM
Quote from: armaghniac on June 09, 2014, 03:52:57 PM
Quote from: Fuzzman on June 09, 2014, 03:45:10 PM
Who do ye Armagh boys want in the next round?
I'm sure the men of Armagh would like to do unto Tyrone as the ladies of Armagh did yesterday. But I think we'll get Monaghan.
Please, please, please don't degrade this to a Tyrone/Armagh 'my Da's bigger than yours' thread, I beg you.. Ten years of that on here was more than ample for us... ???
Yes, but Diarmuid Marsden did deserve to get sent off!
Yes he struck but it's not right to call anyone a thug. No more of that...
I wonder have the Armagh fans ever been able to build up the courage to watch the match again and see the strike! I can only assume most of them didn't and hence in their own we world he never lifted a hand.
Quote from: Redhand Santa on June 10, 2014, 07:46:29 AM
I wonder have the Armagh fans ever been able to build up the courage to watch the match again and see the strike! I can only assume most of them didn't and hence in their own we world he never lifted a hand.
I wonder have you ever been able to build up the courage to let it go? You won 3, they won 1, you are brilliant, they are not, debate closed.
Take it elsewhere if you must, the schoolyard perhaps..
I wasn't being too serious - your easily annoyed! Seems to be a lot of tension among the Monaghan fans at the minute.
Anyone got anything about the match to say?
Any inside goss on how training etc is going?
Monaghan lost by a point to Cork in Kildare last week, 2-15 to 2-16. Third hand info to me said Cork had their championship line out or very close to it. Think a late goal for Cork clinched it. Gavin Doogan is back playing for Monaghan after breaking a bone in his foot before the Div 2 league final.
Quote from: Sleater on June 10, 2014, 10:41:45 AM
Monaghan lost by a point to Cork in Kildare last week, 2-15 to 2-16. Third hand info to me said Cork had their championship line out or very close to it. Think a late goal for Cork clinched it. Gavin Doogan is back playing for Monaghan after breaking a bone in his foot before the Div 2 league final.
McManus scored 2.08, from play.
Quote from: Bingo on June 10, 2014, 10:49:46 AM
Quote from: Sleater on June 10, 2014, 10:41:45 AM
Monaghan lost by a point to Cork in Kildare last week, 2-15 to 2-16. Third hand info to me said Cork had their championship line out or very close to it. Think a late goal for Cork clinched it. Gavin Doogan is back playing for Monaghan after breaking a bone in his foot before the Div 2 league final.
McManus scored 2.08, from play.
Tyrone are lining up Penrose to mark him on Sunday.
Quote from: Redhand Santa on June 10, 2014, 10:10:01 AM
I wasn't being too serious - your easily annoyed! Seems to be a lot of tension among the Monaghan fans at the minute.
You were being serious enough to kick-start an off topic conversation that most folk are fed up hearing about..
I'm not that easily annoyed..
Quote from: Bingo on June 10, 2014, 10:49:46 AM
Quote from: Sleater on June 10, 2014, 10:41:45 AM
Monaghan lost by a point to Cork in Kildare last week, 2-15 to 2-16. Third hand info to me said Cork had their championship line out or very close to it. Think a late goal for Cork clinched it. Gavin Doogan is back playing for Monaghan after breaking a bone in his foot before the Div 2 league final.
McManus scored 2.08, from play.
;D
Quote from: Maguire01 on June 10, 2014, 11:11:32 AM
Quote from: Bingo on June 10, 2014, 10:49:46 AM
Quote from: Sleater on June 10, 2014, 10:41:45 AM
Monaghan lost by a point to Cork in Kildare last week, 2-15 to 2-16. Third hand info to me said Cork had their championship line out or very close to it. Think a late goal for Cork clinched it. Gavin Doogan is back playing for Monaghan after breaking a bone in his foot before the Div 2 league final.
McManus scored 2.08, from play.
;D
That was with his ankle still in a cast
he's been on fire in training since it was was removed, ready to kick red ass.
We are the red arses no longer. Red hands yes
(http://www.livegaelic.com/wp-content/uploads/2014/01/tyrone-derry-mccurry.jpg)
Hopefully young McCurry will have a good game on Sunday as he's been quiet enough in the two games so far.
Of course none of have a clue what team Mickey will pick for Sunday but if you were the boss who would you go for and maybe why
I'm surprised we've not seen any of PJ Quinn so far
Here's my Tuesday's edition
Clucko
McCrory
Justy
McNamee
McNabb
Mat Donnelly
Harte
Sean C
Colm C
McGinley
RoN
Penrose - Breaking ball. Say Nobody
McCurry
Coney with SoN coming on 2nd half
Mark Donnelly - I think Mark used to play well in the FF line and is good at winning his own ball and
is accurate with points and often scores goals. He's wasted too far out the field.
I heard Sean, Dick and some lass Bernie Brogan on the Last Word yesterday evening.
Matt asked Sean would he do it again if it needed doing on Sunday and he paused for ages and said yes I think everyone would take one for the team if it needs to be done in the final 10 mins.
Dick was spoke very well I thought and wasn't at all in Sean's face like the last time.
(http://www.hoganstand.com/Common/NewGallery/inph0723367.jpg)
Watch out anybody who is going to the match or won't be in the house and has The Sunday Game on automatic tape every week as the channel changes to RTÉ1 this Sunday for the matches.
Cheers drici
Excellent I must check my Sky box
Quote from: drici on June 10, 2014, 02:13:54 PM
Watch out anybody who is going to the match or won't be in the house and has The Sunday Game on automatic tape every week as the channel changes to RTÉ1 this Sunday for the matches.
Cheers Drici.
Quote from: Sleater on June 10, 2014, 10:41:45 AM
Gavin Doogan is back playing for Monaghan after breaking a bone in his foot before the Div 2 league final.
That's great news. He has a fantastic engine and we could certainly do with as many midfield options as are available..
Quote from: Fuzzman on June 10, 2014, 01:53:07 PM
We are the red arses no longer. Red hands yes
(http://www.livegaelic.com/wp-content/uploads/2014/01/tyrone-derry-mccurry.jpg)
Hopefully young McCurry will have a good game on Sunday as he's been quiet enough in the two games so far.
Of course none of have a clue what team Mickey will pick for Sunday but if you were the boss who would you go for and maybe why
I'm surprised we've not seen any of PJ Quinn so far
Here's my Tuesday's edition
Clucko
McCrory
Justy
McNamee
McNabb
Mat Donnelly
Harte
Sean C
Colm C
McGinley
RoN
Penrose - Breaking ball. Say Nobody
McCurry
Coney with SoN coming on 2nd half
Mark Donnelly - I think Mark used to play well in the FF line and is good at winning his own ball and
is accurate with points and often scores goals. He's wasted too far out the field.
I heard Sean, Dick and some lass Bernie Brogan on the Last Word yesterday evening.
Matt asked Sean would he do it again if it needed doing on Sunday and he paused for ages and said yes I think everyone would take one for the team if it needs to be done in the final 10 mins.
Dick was spoke very well I thought and wasn't at all in Sean's face like the last time.
(http://www.hoganstand.com/Common/NewGallery/inph0723367.jpg)
I've been a big fan of Penrose over his career and I think his impact to Tyrone has been very underrated by a lot of people (Especially in 2008). But that said I think his race is run. Mark Donnelly can do this role better at this stage. I just don't see Penrose as being a starter for Tyrone anymore, which is a pity as he's been a great asset over the years.
have it on good authority from the Monaghan camp (player) that McManus will play on sunday
I would be shocked if McManus doesn't play at least some part on Sunday. They tried to make out he'd be saved as have back door if lose, when you here that you have to suspect there's mind games going on.
I was going to say this is probably monaghans best chance to beat tyrone in 25 years but thinking back that's been said ahead of numerous meetings.
It's important that tyrone get really stuck in on Sunday and play for the 70 minutes. There's no doubt this is the biggest game of the football championship to date and it would be a good confidence booster for the squad to get the win.
Can't see too many changes to the line up. Would be surprised if e McKenna stays at 10 and there's obviously going to be a change at midfield.
I suspect joe McMahon is the long term replacement there but won't be ready. I'm not sure if Harte will want to disrupt the team by bringing sean an attacking player out to replace Clarke who played a very defensive role. Gormley or Mcbride could do a similar job with Mcbride more likely to get the nod as Harte may be worried about gormley not having 70 minutes. You also can never rule out a fit Stephen oneill starting in the forwards. I guess he could go to 11 and Sean to the middle.
We don't need McManus for this game.
If O'Rourke sticks him on at some stage, it would just be some sort of preparation for the semi final.
Quote from: Main Street on June 10, 2014, 10:32:09 PM
We don't need McManus for this game.
If O'Rourke sticks him on at some stage, it would just be some sort of preparation for the semi final.
That's big talk there. After tyrone Monaghan would probably be the county I'd most like to see do well next. Hopefully will be keeping an eye on their back door games after Sunday.
I was a t the league final and was very impressed with Monaghan. They were excellent defensively, produced great counter attacking play and took great scores from distance. I've no donut that tyrone will play at a higher tempo than Donegal did that day and produce more quality so it will be interesting to see if Monaghan can cope with the step up.
Looking at the tyrone team from last year I think we could nearly be stronger if everyone is fit. Morgan gives us something extra in nets. And justy Mcnabb coney and ronan oneill should be in better shape and fit to start. Obviously joe McMahon (assuming not fit) mccarron and Clarke are big losses from then.
He is a very to play, been nothing wrong with him and trained the last cpl of weeks.
Played in challenge game last week
Quote from: Main Street on June 10, 2014, 10:32:09 PM
We don't need McManus for this game.
If O'Rourke sticks him on at some stage, it would just be some sort of preparation for the semi final.
I agree, keep the big guns for Armagh and not risk them against the Hallions.
Quote from: sam03/05 on June 10, 2014, 11:55:52 PM
He is a very to play, been nothing wrong with him and trained the last cpl of weeks.
Played in challenge game last week
I assume you mean 'available' by 'a very to play'?
Mickey Harte has it in today's Irish News that he'll play so nail him on for the No. 15 spot on Sunday..
Quote from: GrandMasterFlash on June 11, 2014, 09:14:56 AM
Mickey Harte has it in today's Irish News that he'll play so nail him on for the No. 15 spot on Sunday..
That's very nice of Mickey to help out with the Monaghan team selection.
Quote from: babarino on June 11, 2014, 09:56:55 AM
Quote from: GrandMasterFlash on June 11, 2014, 09:14:56 AM
Mickey Harte has it in today's Irish News that he'll play so nail him on for the No. 15 spot on Sunday..
That's very nice of Mickey to help out with the Monaghan team selection.
Harte will plan for McManus starting. If he doesn't he will most certainly appear at some stage. I think we all know McCrory will pick him up.
Like this
(https://encrypted-tbn1.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcST7fjtfFFymMJUDORhPBkrmjRR6T3mMXjtSLL0JLcrumcrJTLJ)
I think we should try something different this year lads and try to be nice and respectful to each other before this game.
We Tyronites need to show some respect to our neighbours who by their own admission have turned away from the dark side now they've finally broken through that barron spell.
Like wise ye Farneymen or whatever you want to be called "boys in blue" can ease off in the whole obsession with Sean Cavanagh and cheating etc. Don't let Brolly influence your own thoughts. You are well capable of pushing on from last year and getting to a AI semifinal this year if yer big players stay injury free.
I reckon we could see a great open game on Sunday (as long as we stay in the inside line in the parade). If Dessie Mone and Penrose can behave themselves then we could say the best game of the championship pre 1/4 final stage.
Now
Anyone got a spare ticket for the Gerry Arthurs stand as we always win when I'm there. Actually it's a long time since I've saw Tyrone beat in Clones. Anyone got that stat. When did we last lose there?
Sean will sort McManus out again if he appears,have no worries ;)
I would hope that the 2 games will stand to Tyrone but you can be sure that despite not having a game for 7 weeks Ryan Porter will have Monaghan in fantastic shape.Monaghan's defence will be a whole lot tighter than Down's and Tyrone will have to work harder for scores this time but I think we may just squeeze through by a point or two.
Donegal beat us in Clones in 2011 and 2012.
Of course. I'm not usually superstitious but I wasn't at those two games. Pesky kids!
I think I have to go away back years to remember when we last lost at Clones when I was there and YES I am going this Sunday.
I think it was before the golden years.
Did ye see the team they picked in the IN yesterday. They have Gormley and SON starting.
Most of the rest was like my own team with RON at 11 but Niall McKenna at 14. Wyle is a good full back.
Will Monaghan play with a sweeper do ye lads think? I don't think we will start with one but won't be surprised if we end up with one.
Monaghan by 4
Quote from: Fuzzman on June 11, 2014, 11:52:27 AM
Will Monaghan play with a sweeper do ye lads think? I don't think we will start with one but won't be surprised if we end up with one.
I'd say about 13 of them, unlucky for some..
http://www.irishexaminer.com/sport/gaa/semi-finals-lsquorealisticrsquo-target-for-monaghan-271668.html
Quote from: GrandMasterFlash on June 11, 2014, 11:59:16 AM
http://www.irishexaminer.com/sport/gaa/semi-finals-lsquorealisticrsquo-target-for-monaghan-271668.html
Monaghan should reach the Ulster semi-final before being overrun by an Armagh team incensed by the sight of blue.
I like that article. Dicks understanding of his current position is interesting and quite accepting. He has been in the middle for a long time and now the legs are gone he knows he cant hold up for 70 mins.
Its great to see such a confident Monaghan outfit as well. I like Monaghan despite the burning hurt and pain of 85 national league semi final, and the robbery that was the 88 Ulster final, these lads are planning for a big year among the Corks, Dublins and Mayos of this world. The carrot here is to face an Armagh team more than likely decimated by multiple fighting suspensions and as automatic a path as you could expect to an Ulster final. We in Tyrone probably haven't a prayer this Sunday reading that. We might time our second meeting for the quarter final though and in Croke Park against Monaghan, anything can happen..
Team prediction as follows, assuming McManus and Gavin Doogan are non-starters and Lennon is:
1. Rory Beggan
2. Ryan Wylie
3. Drew Wylie
4. Colin Walshe
5. Fintan Kelly
6. Dessie Mone
7. Vinny Corey
8. Eoin Lennon
9. Darren Hughes
10. Paul Finlay
11. Stephen Gollogy
12. Chris McGuinness
13. Jack McCarron
14. Kieran Hughes
15. Dermot Malone
Quote from: GrandMasterFlash on June 11, 2014, 01:50:46 PM
Team prediction as follows, assuming McManus and Gavin Doogan are non-starters and Lennon is:
1. Rory Beggan
2. Ryan Wylie
3. Drew Wylie
4. Colin Walshe
5. Fintan Kelly
6. Dessie Mone
7. Vinny Corey
8. Eoin Lennon
9. Darren Hughes
10. Paul Finlay
11. Stephen Gollogy
12. Chris McGuinness
13. Jack McCarron
14. Kieran Hughes
15. Dermot Malone
Assuming the absentees, I'd probably agree with that selection if I was picking it. I think Ryan Wylie is a better option than Duffy and he could have a big impact this year, he was impressive when he came on in the league final. I'd also be in favour of starting both McCarron and McGuinness and having a right go at the Tyrone defence, but I think Malachy might prefer to start an extra "worker" like Donaghy rather than another "scorer". Still, who am I to doubt him!
Huge game for Hughes up front, we need him to have a big impact especially if Conor plays no part. He was disappointing in the quarter-final last year and got a silly red card, but I've seen him say how much that game annoys him so he'll be eager to put that right.
Monaghan having their sights set on an AI semi final shows the confidence Malachy O'Rourke has in this Monaghan team. Monaghan won the Ulster title and suffered due to the short turn around time till the quarter final. Monaghan had effectively no prep time last year. With silverware already in the bag, Monaghan go into this game in a different frame of mind to last year. Tyrone caught them last year.
I can't see Monaghan getting caught this year on their home pitch. Monaghan by 4.
Just got today's Irish News and there seems to be a lot of injuries in the Tyrone camp albeit to a lot of the possible subs. I wonder is Joey any nearer to playing some part
I'd like to see Stevie go back to Full forward but doubt he's fit enough yet for a full game and Wylie "held" him well last year.
Quote from: GrandMasterFlash on June 11, 2014, 01:50:46 PM
Team prediction as follows, assuming McManus and Gavin Doogan are non-starters and Lennon is:
1. Rory Beggan
2. Ryan Wylie
3. Drew Wylie
4. Colin Walshe
5. Fintan Kelly
6. Dessie Mone
7. Vinny Corey
8. Eoin Lennon
9. Darren Hughes
10. Paul Finlay
11. Stephen Gollogy
12. Chris McGuinness
13. Jack McCarron
14. Kieran Hughes
15. Dermot Malone
This looks like potentially a very strong team. With the confidence of being defending champions and with the likes of McManus to come in if the game is tight then I'd be surprised if Tyrone can compete at this level just yet. I've said before, we already have two games under the belt and as long as we don't ship any more injuries, then the back door may be our best route anyway. Maybe Mickey should play a few of the younger lads to give them experience of championship action against a top team?
Forecast Summary
Outlook for Friday to Sunday
Mostly cloudy with some spells of rain on Friday then becoming more settled over the weekend with some dry fine weather developing.
Weather looking good for the weekend lads and ladies.
Can you buy eastern stand tickets separately or are they only available as a family ticket? The woman and I are thinking of takin our three kids (3, 2 and 1) for their first championship experience and won't need tickets for them, being under 16. However,, something tells me the eastern stand is only available to family tickets.
It would be great to see a bit of decent weather for it. Why don't you just go to the pat McGrane? It says on gaa.ie that u16s can get in there free with no ticket.
I've found the ticketing updates very confusing for this game. In one place they're saying get your tickets early and only limited terrace tickets will be available on the day. In another they're saying u16s get in free and don't need tickets for pat McGrane which is unreserved seating. From what I can gather you can just pay in there on the day with tickets only needed for Gerry Arthur's? But you can buy tickets if you wish in advance.
I was thinking the Eastern stand as there tends to be more space there. Pat McGrane tends to be pretty packed on big match days. Will have to sacrifice the best view to accommodate my squad!
Good luck with that OG as its a long time to keep young kids entertained. Maybe they'll be grand but my advice would be either send them to a playground for an hour or bring loads of entertainment on yer phone etc.
I found large crowds and small kids don't mix well but you never know. Also don't expect the language to be sensored.
http://www.independent.ie/sport/gaelic-games/gaelic-football/determined-conor-mcmanus-goes-distance-to-take-on-tyrone-30344717.html
I honestly don't understand how Mickey Harte thinks Conor is gonna play...
Quote from: GrandMasterFlash on June 12, 2014, 12:57:48 AM
http://www.independent.ie/sport/gaelic-games/gaelic-football/determined-conor-mcmanus-goes-distance-to-take-on-tyrone-30344717.html
I honestly don't understand how Mickey Harte thinks Conor is gonna play...
I think MH is trying to keep his players on their toes, the recent champo wins against Monaghan may have lulled many of his players into thinking Monaghan will be a walk in the park and with McManus out all the more so.
Problem is all of those matches with Monaghan have been tough tight affairs with us usually squeezing just about thru. Many of those matches could easily have gone the other way and that was with a weaker Monaghan team than present playing a stronger Tyrone team.
Pretty disappointing that MH has to keep his players motivated coming into a match with the reigning Ulster champions.....
Quote from: GrandMasterFlash on June 12, 2014, 12:57:48 AM
http://www.independent.ie/sport/gaelic-games/gaelic-football/determined-conor-mcmanus-goes-distance-to-take-on-tyrone-30344717.html
I honestly don't understand how Mickey Harte thinks Conor is gonna play...
That indo article states
'Not since the Ulster final in 1988 have Monaghan beaten Tyrone at senior championship level and in the intervening 26 years they have lost all four matches to them.'I'm glad that 4th round qualifier at croke park doesn't rate as worthy to be included in the stats.
It's only 4-0 since 1988.
So much for saying Stevie at FF for Sunday.
Apparently he came off his bike last night and had a bad fall.
Where will the Louth match be? Will be nice to get to the quaterfinals with a few rounds of the L's again. Louth, London, Longford (sorry Derry I expect a shock!) :o
Quote from: Main Street on June 12, 2014, 11:17:36 AM
Quote from: GrandMasterFlash on June 12, 2014, 12:57:48 AM
http://www.independent.ie/sport/gaelic-games/gaelic-football/determined-conor-mcmanus-goes-distance-to-take-on-tyrone-30344717.html
I honestly don't understand how Mickey Harte thinks Conor is gonna play...
That indo article states
'Not since the Ulster final in 1988 have Monaghan beaten Tyrone at senior championship level and in the intervening 26 years they have lost all four matches to them.'
I'm glad that 4th round qualifier at croke park doesn't rate as worthy to be included in the stats.
It's only 4-0 since 1988.
Off the top of my head, Tyrone have played Monaghan in 2005, 2007, 2010, 2011 and 2013. How many Monaghan players have played in every game?
The round of club championship etc seems to have taken a fair toll on the availability of the Tyrone team and panel. There's a lot of big injuries and a lot of players carrying knocks that won't be healed before Sunday's big game.
Quote from: orangeman on June 12, 2014, 11:53:00 AM
The round of club championship etc seems to have taken a fair toll on the availability of the Tyrone team and panel. There's a lot of big injuries and a lot of players carrying knocks that won't be healed before Sunday's big game.
I'd say play the youngsters, give them a championship match against a top team and concentrate on rebuilding through the back door. When is the Louth game likely to be? Are we away again?
Quote from: nrico2006 on June 12, 2014, 11:45:46 AM
Quote from: Main Street on June 12, 2014, 11:17:36 AM
Quote from: GrandMasterFlash on June 12, 2014, 12:57:48 AM
http://www.independent.ie/sport/gaelic-games/gaelic-football/determined-conor-mcmanus-goes-distance-to-take-on-tyrone-30344717.html
I honestly don't understand how Mickey Harte thinks Conor is gonna play...
That indo article states
'Not since the Ulster final in 1988 have Monaghan beaten Tyrone at senior championship level and in the intervening 26 years they have lost all four matches to them.'
I'm glad that 4th round qualifier at croke park doesn't rate as worthy to be included in the stats.
It's only 4-0 since 1988.
Off the top of my head, Tyrone have played Monaghan in 2005, 2007, 2010, 2011 and 2013. How many Monaghan players have played in every game?
Also off the top of my head; Vinny, Lennon, Dick, Finlay and Gollogly would have been there all those years, can't remember if all played every game though. Dessie would've been there every game apart from 2005 because of a dispute with Banty as far as I can remember, he along with Vinny, Finlay and Gollogly had the misfortune to lose ulster finals to Tyrone at minor, u-21 and senior level. Them boys are seriously overdue a win.
Quote from: BennyHarp on June 12, 2014, 11:57:58 AM
Quote from: orangeman on June 12, 2014, 11:53:00 AM
The round of club championship etc seems to have taken a fair toll on the availability of the Tyrone team and panel. There's a lot of big injuries and a lot of players carrying knocks that won't be healed before Sunday's big game.
I'd say play the youngsters, give them a championship match against a top team and concentrate on rebuilding through the back door. When is the Louth game likely to be? Are we away again?
Louth are at home yes.
Tyrone might well have no option but to play a pile of young lads on Sunday.
When I was in Croker last Sunday I was really looking forward to this match this weekend but now I'm kinda dreading it tbh. We could get a hiding if they can walk through and score goals.
Coney can be very hit or miss and doesn't like the rough it up type of defenders as he far too often comes out looking in his wing mirrors at who's gonna clatter him. I could even see Mickey drop him.
Maybe he'll play big Joey in FF and shock us all. I'd be all on for that one.
From the Belfast Tele (http://www.belfasttelegraph.co.uk/sport/gaa/tyrone/ciaran-mcginley-relishing-new-attacking-role-30347192.html)
(http://cdn4.belfasttelegraph.co.uk/sport/gaa/tyrone/article30347191.ece/c0f2e/ALTERNATES/h342/SPT_2014-06-12_SPO_050_31969734_I1.JPG)
Ciaran McGinley never contemplated making the headlines as an ace marksman when he was initially drafted into the Tyrone defence by manager Mickey Harte.
But when the Errigal Ciaran clubman cracked home two goals and added a point for good measure in the recent Ulster Championship quarter-final replay against Down, manager Mickey Harte was presented with a welcome selection option.
McGinley had been feeling his way at half-back before he was suddenly switched into the half-forward line and it was from there that he tortured the Mourne defence at Pairc Esler, Newry.
Now with the scoring bit firmly between his teeth, McGinley is anxious to put more scores on the board against Monaghan in Sunday's semi-final at Clones.
A rangy work-horse, he atones for a lack of finesse by bringing boundless energy and a sharp eye for an opening to the Red Hands table.
Yet he concedes that he is still on a learning curve in terms of bedding down in inter-county football.
"I missed some chances against Down and I know myself I have lots to work on. The boys felt that they had a lot to answer for from the drawn game and I was delighted for the sake of our fans that we were able to win in Newry," reflects McGinley.
Tyrone unleashed a fresh level of intensity in that game which McGinley hopes they can replicate against a Monaghan side that will be making its debut in the Championship having had a seven-week break from competitive action following their Division Two final win over Donegal.
"I was lucky enough to get those two goals against Down but Monaghan will make things very hard because they will be keen to keep their title. They will be playing at home, they have lots of experience and also have the confidence that comes from a winning run," points out McGinley.
Even without cultured finisher Conor McManus, Monaghan are still expected to pose a huge threat with players like Jack McCarron, Paudie McKenna, Kieran Hughes and of course Paul Finlay carrying a big scoring threat.
McGinley, of course, is by no means the only Tyrone forward capable of reaping handsome scoring dividends.
Kyle Coney, Darren McCurry and the evergreen Sean Cavanagh are among those capable of hitting the target from distance not to mention the contribution that goalkeeper Niall Morgan can make from placed balls.
"There is no doubt that we have quality finishers. The last day out things ran for me but it could be someone else's turn on Sunday.
"The important thing is that we get a win that will take us into the semi-final against Armagh," adds McGinley.
Been told Monaghan will line out as follows:
1 Paddy Linden
2 Aoife Carragher (AA roadwatch)
3 Gerry McCarville
4 Paddy Cole
5 Barry McGuigan
6 The Banty
7 Nudie Hughes
8 Big Tom
9 Dick Clerkin
10 Charlenne McKenna
11 Oliver Callan
12 Ryan Sheridan
13 Kevin McBride
14 Conor McManus
15 Nudie Hughes
Ardlan O'Hanlon and Aiobhainn McGinnity very close but useful to come in off the bench.
How many injuries have Tyrone confirmed?
Obviously Conor Clarke out for the season. Joe McMahon still a long way off making a return (prob be 2015 in all likelihood)
Tiernan McCann is out, but cant recall hearing any others confirmed unavailable?
Quote from: Bingo on June 12, 2014, 12:09:01 PM
Been told Monaghan will line out as follows:
1 Paddy Linden
2 Aoife Carragher (AA roadwatch)
3 Gerry McCarville
4 Paddy Cole
5 Barry McGuigan
6 The Banty
7 Nudie Hughes
8 Big Tom
9 Dick Clerkin
10 Charlenne McKenna
11 Oliver Callan
12 Ryan Sheridan
13 Kevin McBride
14 Conor McManus
15 Nudie Hughes
Ardlan O'Hanlon and Aiobhainn McGinnity very close but useful to come in off the bench.
I'm surprised they didn't play Tommy Bowe, who'd be more use than some of those.
Talking to a Tyrone player this morning,can't believe how many players are unavailable for Sunday ???
I'll have to revise my prediction and say Monaghan by 8.
Just hope we get some of them back for the Louth game.
Quote from: Club Rossa on June 12, 2014, 12:37:45 PM
Talking to a Tyrone player this morning,can't believe how many players are unavailable for Sunday ???
I'll have to revise my prediction and say Monaghan by 8.
Just hope we get some of them back for the Louth game.
To be fair, even with a full squad we would have struggled in this one. We'll probably get Roscommon after Louth which would be a very difficult game too.
You Tyrone lads are some craic with all this talk of playing Louth. If yous were putting out the minors you'd be fully confident of winning against Monaghan.
Quote from: armaghniac on June 12, 2014, 12:33:54 PM
Quote from: Bingo on June 12, 2014, 12:09:01 PM
Been told Monaghan will line out as follows:
1 Paddy Linden
2 Aoife Carragher (AA roadwatch)
3 Gerry McCarville
4 Paddy Cole
5 Barry McGuigan
6 The Banty
7 Nudie Hughes
8 Big Tom
9 Dick Clerkin
10 Charlenne McKenna
11 Oliver Callan
12 Ryan Sheridan
13 Kevin McBride
14 Conor McManus
15 Nudie Hughes
Ardlan O'Hanlon and Aiobhainn McGinnity very close but useful to come in off the bench.
I'm surprised they didn't play Tommy Bowe, who'd be more use than some of those.
Too injury prone.
Quote from: GrandMasterFlash on June 11, 2014, 01:50:46 PM
Team prediction as follows, assuming McManus and Gavin Doogan are non-starters and Lennon is:
1. Rory Beggan
2. Ryan Wylie
3. Drew Wylie
4. Colin Walshe
5. Fintan Kelly
6. Dessie Mone
7. Vinny Corey
8. Eoin Lennon
9. Darren Hughes
10. Paul Finlay
11. Stephen Gollogy
12. Chris McGuinness
13. Jack McCarron
14. Kieran Hughes
15. Dermot Malone
I'd have Kieran Duffy, Paudie McKenna and Conor McManus starting instead of Ryan Wylie, McGuiness and McCarron.
Is Gavin Doogan likely to be back in the next month?
Quote from: donelli on June 12, 2014, 12:50:43 PM
Quote from: GrandMasterFlash on June 11, 2014, 01:50:46 PM
Team prediction as follows, assuming McManus and Gavin Doogan are non-starters and Lennon is:
1. Rory Beggan
2. Ryan Wylie
3. Drew Wylie
4. Colin Walshe
5. Fintan Kelly
6. Dessie Mone
7. Vinny Corey
8. Eoin Lennon
9. Darren Hughes
10. Paul Finlay
11. Stephen Gollogy
12. Chris McGuinness
13. Jack McCarron
14. Kieran Hughes
15. Dermot Malone
I'd have Kieran Duffy, Paudie McKenna and Conor McManus starting instead of Ryan Wylie, McGuiness and McCarron.
Is Gavin Doogan likely to be back in the next month?
I'd have Doogan back quicker than McManus, has he not played a games or two already?
printed my tickets last night for the match and when passing the pitch this morning i went in to see what my seats were like and true to form the ulster council have allocated extremely poor seats to season ticket holders. Has anybody on here had any luck getting their tickets changed ?
Looks like MH will have no option but to go with the younger players, in the main -- baptism of fire or what! :-\
Quote from: cluaineois on June 12, 2014, 01:04:39 PM
printed my tickets last night for the match and when passing the pitch this morning i went in to see what my seats were like and true to form the ulster council have allocated extremely poor seats to season ticket holders. Has anybody on here had any luck getting their tickets changed ?
Didn't get them changed but got them grouped (for the NFL final and left the group in place for this one). Allocated GA open stand, section GER DO, wherever that is? ::)
Quote from: Schkite on June 12, 2014, 11:59:04 AM
Quote from: nrico2006 on June 12, 2014, 11:45:46 AM
Quote from: Main Street on June 12, 2014, 11:17:36 AM
Quote from: GrandMasterFlash on June 12, 2014, 12:57:48 AM
http://www.independent.ie/sport/gaelic-games/gaelic-football/determined-conor-mcmanus-goes-distance-to-take-on-tyrone-30344717.html
I honestly don't understand how Mickey Harte thinks Conor is gonna play...
That indo article states
'Not since the Ulster final in 1988 have Monaghan beaten Tyrone at senior championship level and in the intervening 26 years they have lost all four matches to them.'
I'm glad that 4th round qualifier at croke park doesn't rate as worthy to be included in the stats.
It's only 4-0 since 1988.
Off the top of my head, Tyrone have played Monaghan in 2005, 2007, 2010, 2011 and 2013. How many Monaghan players have played in every game?
Also off the top of my head; Vinny, Lennon, Dick, Finlay and Gollogly would have been there all those years, can't remember if all played every game though. Dessie would've been there every game apart from 2005 because of a dispute with Banty as far as I can remember, he along with Vinny, Finlay and Gollogly had the misfortune to lose ulster finals to Tyrone at minor, u-21 and senior level. Them boys are seriously overdue a win.
HS has it that we didn't meet in 2011: http://www.hoganstand.com/Monaghan/ArticleForm.aspx?ID=218214 ???
Amazing there isn't a layout of the stand anywhere online
They're selling section K now online
Is that away down near the bottom goals? Does it run from A near the wheelchair area to what letter?
Quote from: GrandMasterFlash on June 12, 2014, 01:50:18 PM
Quote from: cluaineois on June 12, 2014, 01:04:39 PM
printed my tickets last night for the match and when passing the pitch this morning i went in to see what my seats were like and true to form the ulster council have allocated extremely poor seats to season ticket holders. Has anybody on here had any luck getting their tickets changed ?
Didn't get them changed but got them grouped (for the NFL final and left the group in place for this one). Allocated GA open stand, section GER DO, wherever that is? ::)
GER DO is the section at the front of the gerry arthurs around the 20 mtr line depending on seat number (lower numbers closest to 20, higher closer to 45) My seats are for row A which is below the level of the pitch. Would prefer Pat mc Grane or even Hill . I am going to ring Ulster council later as this isn't the first time season ticket holders have been fobbed off with inferior tickets
Quote from: cluaineois on June 12, 2014, 02:11:14 PM
Quote from: GrandMasterFlash on June 12, 2014, 01:50:18 PM
Quote from: cluaineois on June 12, 2014, 01:04:39 PM
printed my tickets last night for the match and when passing the pitch this morning i went in to see what my seats were like and true to form the ulster council have allocated extremely poor seats to season ticket holders. Has anybody on here had any luck getting their tickets changed ?
Didn't get them changed but got them grouped (for the NFL final and left the group in place for this one). Allocated GA open stand, section GER DO, wherever that is? ::)
GER DO is the section at the front of the gerry arthurs around the 20 mtr line depending on seat number (lower numbers closest to 20, higher closer to 45) My seats are for row A which is below the level of the pitch. Would prefer Pat mc Grane or even Hill . I am going to ring Ulster council later as this isn't the first time season ticket holders have been fobbed off with inferior tickets
Row A also, which is more like a trench. I highlighted this in the season ticket thread. Seems like the Monaghan tickets are all located there. Shocking vantage point.
Quote from: GrandMasterFlash on June 12, 2014, 01:50:18 PM
Quote from: cluaineois on June 12, 2014, 01:04:39 PM
printed my tickets last night for the match and when passing the pitch this morning i went in to see what my seats were like and true to form the ulster council have allocated extremely poor seats to season ticket holders. Has anybody on here had any luck getting their tickets changed ?
Didn't get them changed but got them grouped (for the NFL final and left the group in place for this one). Allocated GA open stand, section GER DO, wherever that is? ::)
I'm the same, but row G, so at least a few rows back. Gonna try and sell/swap for the hill.
Is the Tyrone team being named tonight or tomorrow?
I always look forward to the Thur night before a match when putting the kids to bed
Can we see any unexpected surprises? Ricey back in?
Quote from: Fuzzman on June 12, 2014, 03:47:06 PM
Is the Tyrone team being named tonight or tomorrow?
I always look forward to the Thur night before a match when putting the kids to bed
Can we see any unexpected surprises? Ricey back in?
I'm heading up Garvaghey direction tonight Fuzz, I'll let you know who's having extra spuds and who's in the treatment room.
Quote from: Fuzzman on June 12, 2014, 02:01:01 PM
Amazing there isn't a layout of the stand anywhere online
They're selling section K now online
Is that away down near the bottom goals? Does it run from A near the wheelchair area to what letter?
Yes starts from A beside wheelchair stand think it runs to N . Contacted season ticket office and they said allocation is made by Ulster council , rang ulster council and they said that i was just unlucky but that the seats are allocated by croke park. Was also informed that for armagh last week that the front row of seats were not allocated as it was felt that they were too low. Wont be renewing season ticket next year.
http://www.hoganstand.com/Monaghan/ArticleForm.aspx?ID=218196
Irony alert!
Dessie Mone holds no grudges against Tyrone; well thank f@*k for that! LOL
Last minute team guess:
Morgan
McCrory
Justy
McNamee
McNabb
Matty
Harte
Cavanagh
Cavanagh
McGinley
Ronan O'Neill
Mark Donnelly
Coney
SoN
McCurry
Yeah good team OG and most of us would pick the same although I can't see SON start myself.
I'd say Mickey though will have one or two surprises
I'm going for Block at FF ;D
Quote from: Fuzzman on June 12, 2014, 08:45:20 PM
Yeah good team OG and most of us would pick the same although I can't see SON start myself.
Cause he fell of his bike or for some other reason?
That's what I heard GFM but I didn't hear what his injuries are.
My point though is I wouldn't start him as he'd be better coming on I think
Monaghan team named:
1.Rory Beggan
2.Colin Walshe
3.Drew Wylie
4.Fintan Kelly
5.Dessie Mone
6.Vinny Corey
7.Kieran Duffy
8.Dick Clerkin
9.Darren Hughes
10.Paul Finlay
11.Pauric Donaghy
12.Paudie McKenna
13.Dermot Malone
14.Kieran Hughes
15.Jack McCarron
McManus and Lennon on the bench. You'd imagine there'll be one or two changes before it starts.
Tyrone Senior Football Team v Monaghan 15th June 2014
1 - Niall Morgan - Éadan na dTorc
2 - Aidan McCrory - Aireagal Chiaráin
3 - Justin McMahon - An Omaigh
4 - Ronan McNamee - Achadh Uí Aráin
5 - Ronan McNabb - An Droim Mhór
6 - Mattie Donnelly - Trí Leac
7 - Peter Harte - Aireagal Chiaráin
8 - Colm Cavanagh - An Mhaigh
9 - Conan Grugan - An Omaigh
10 - Martin Penrose - An Charraig Mhór
11 - Sean Cavanagh - An Mhaigh
12 - Ciaran McGinley - Aireagal Chiaráin
13 - Darren McCurry - Éadán na dTorc
14 - Stephen O'Neill - Clann na nGael
15 - Ronan O'Neill - An Omaigh
16 - Michael O'Neill - Cluain Eo
17 - Dermot Carlin - Coill an Chlochair
18 - Kyle Coney - Ard Bó
19 - Mark Donnelly - An Charraig Mhór
20 - Conor Gormley - An Charraig Mhór
21 - Peter Hughes - Eiscreach
22 - Plunkett Kane - Oileán a'Ghuail
23 - PJ Lavery - Cluain Eo
24 - Connor McAliskey - Cluain Eo
25 - Danny McBride - An Srath Ban
26 - Shea McGuigan - Ard Bó
Happy with that :)
Thankfully Stevie was wearing a cycling helmet and knee pads.
Very strong Tyrone team.. not sayin it makes the game any easier but all the pressure is on
Monaghan they have to beat Tyrone. A draw would have to be a disappointment for Monaghan
they just have to win.
Quote from: Schkite on June 12, 2014, 09:41:38 PM
Monaghan team named:
1.Rory Beggan
2.Colin Walshe
3.Drew Wylie
4.Fintan Kelly
5.Dessie Mone
6.Vinny Corey
7.Kieran Duffy
8.Dick Clerkin
9.Darren Hughes
10.Paul Finlay
11.Pauric Donaghy
12.Paudie McKenna
13.Dermot Malone
14.Kieran Hughes
15.Jack McCarron
McManus and Lennon on the bench. You'd imagine there'll be one or two changes before it starts.
Strong team, plenty of runners and dirty ball winners... What about the remainder of the bench: C McGuinness, R Wylie, Eoin Duffy, T Kerr, Gavin Doogan?
What's it like playing Monaghan, Stephen?
"it's just like riding a bike"
Would be surprised if that line up starts in those positions. If no changes are made to the 15 players named I could see Sean in MF. RoN at CHF. Penrose in corner. SoN at FF and Grugan at LHF.....
Quote from: GrandMasterFlash on June 12, 2014, 10:01:53 PM
Strong team, plenty of runners and dirty ball winners... What about the remainder of the bench: C McGuinness, R Wylie, Eoin Duffy, T Kerr, Gavin Doogan?
Strong enough bench: Gerard Mc Caffrey, Conor Boyle, Ryan Wylie, Karl O'Connell, Conor Galligan, Eoin Lennon, Eoin Duffy, Stephen Gollogly, Thomas Kerr, Christopher Mc Guinness, Conor McManus
Quote from: tyroneman on June 12, 2014, 10:16:53 PM
Would be surprised if that line up starts in those positions. If no changes are made to the 15 players named I could see Sean in MF. RoN at CHF. Penrose in corner. SoN at FF and Grugan at LHF.....
Any other changes you think or is that everything covered
Quote from: tyroneman on June 12, 2014, 10:16:53 PM
Would be surprised if that line up starts in those positions. If no changes are made to the 15 players named I could see Sean in MF. RoN at CHF. Penrose in corner. SoN at FF and Grugan at LHF.....
I would hope that young Grugan starts in the middle of the park, at the very least. We need to see if he's capable of the step-up, and no better opportunity than a Clones cauldron Championship clash. ;)
Quote from: BennyHarp on June 12, 2014, 09:52:47 PM
Thankfully Stevie was wearing a cycling helmet and knee pads.
Nope, 'twas a cotton-wool suit, as per the rest of them! ;)
Strong Tyrone team. Will be surprised if they don't win handy enough.
Well we know o Neill isn't fit with the bike and all that and there's a couple of strained calves there as well. Monaghan by 12.
Strong tyrone team. Mccurry probably lucky to keep his place ahead of coney. Took his goal well but has been quiet enough in last few games other than that and in the latter states of the league. Hopefully can hit form on Sunday. Surprised to see grugan in midfield, big chance for him to shine.
Should be a cracker on Sunday.
If there is a half each in clerkin and Lennon then midfield might do alright. Defence only had the one question mark and Duffy gets the nod over Ryan Wylie. Need a big game from hughes at ff if McManus really doesn't start
I know plenty of Monaghan men, unfortunately. They see us as superior, as men.
Seems like a logical team apart from Grugan. If he doesn't start I can see a change soon enough.
Quote from: timmyot501 on June 12, 2014, 11:41:50 PM
If there is a half each in clerkin and Lennon then midfield might do alright. Defence only had the one question mark and Duffy gets the nod over Ryan Wylie. Need a big game from hughes at ff if McManus really doesn't start
Hughes' normal game should be enough.
I'd only be worried if he was under par.
Who's the Ref.
Will his be booing Morgan from the start?
Interesting what Jordan wrote in the GL about 2010
Yep.
Monaghan have never been blessed with footballing ability or brains. That's why no AIs.
But they eat a lot and train. That can be dangerous.
Quote from: ONeill on June 12, 2014, 11:50:51 PM
Seems like a logical team apart from Grugan. If he doesn't start I can see a change soon enough.
Logical, if you base you logicality on your restricted purview only, that is!
MOTM from midfield, mark my words! ;)
Quote from: ONeill on June 13, 2014, 12:07:30 AM
Yep.
Monaghan have never been blessed with footballing ability or brains. That's why no AIs.
But they eat a lot and train. That can be dangerous.
Think you hit the nail on the head there O'Neill
Anyone have a Gerry Arthur's ticket for sale?
None left on webshite.
I hope we see Joey in the second half
I'd say Monaghan will be happy enough with that Tyrone MF
Quote from: ONeill on June 13, 2014, 12:07:30 AM
Yep.
Monaghan have never been blessed with footballing ability or brains. That's why no AIs.
But they eat a lot and train. That can be dangerous.
Monaghan would now be the best team never to win an AI, Tyrone used to be in 2003. I think that mantle is one that can spur the team on.
Club football is in a healthy state in Monaghan too with Truagh etc
Quote from: ONeill on June 13, 2014, 12:07:30 AM
Yep.
Monaghan have never been blessed with footballing ability or brains. That's why no AIs.
But they eat a lot and train. That can be dangerous.
Cheeky bastid.
Quote from: GrandMasterFlash on June 12, 2014, 10:01:53 PM
Quote from: Schkite on June 12, 2014, 09:41:38 PM
Monaghan team named:
1.Rory Beggan
2.Colin Walshe
3.Drew Wylie
4.Fintan Kelly
5.Dessie Mone
6.Vinny Corey
7.Kieran Duffy
8.Dick Clerkin
9.Darren Hughes
10.Paul Finlay
11.Pauric Donaghy
12.Paudie McKenna
13.Dermot Malone
14.Kieran Hughes
15.Jack McCarron
McManus and Lennon on the bench. You'd imagine there'll be one or two changes before it starts.
Strong team, plenty of runners and dirty ball winners... What about the remainder of the bench: C McGuinness, R Wylie, Eoin Duffy, T Kerr, Gavin Doogan?
I'd be genuinely surprised if Monaghan line out like that. O'Rourke is notorious for making 1 to 2 changes from the line -up provided to the media. Any idea what it will actually be?
I expect to see 2-3 changes to the Monaghan team.
As for Tyrone, I can see that team starting with the only question over Stephen O'Neill. We may see Coney coming in for him.
I had heard that Joe McMahon has an Achilles injury, from experience it can be a slow healer with rest the only real cure. Haven't heard anything to suggest he is back training again.
Will Vinny Corey be picking up our fly half Sean then?
Does Mone line up against Penrose again? I wonder did Mickey do this on purpose or is he playing mind games? "Moans" sets up a lot of forward moves so he'll need to be well "marked"
Ticket sorted for section B in Gerry Arthurs stand.
See the weather on Accuweather (http://www.accuweather.com/en/ie/clones/210613/weekend-weather/210613) says 21C but mainly cloudy & comfortable
Anyone meeting for a pint before hand?
Monaghan lads take note of the difference between the Tyrone crowd on your streets compared to the Armagh ones you meet next.
Quote from: The_Beard on June 13, 2014, 09:27:15 AM
I expect to see 2-3 changes to the Monaghan team.
As for Tyrone, I can see that team starting with the only question over Stephen O'Neill. We may see Coney coming in for him.
I had heard that Joe McMahon has an Achilles injury, from experience it can be a slow healer with rest the only real cure. Haven't heard anything to suggest he is back training again.
I was told maybe 2 months ago that Joe was unlikely to get back in time for the county this year. He has missed a hell of a lot of work being out of action for a long time. It was suprising that he was added to the match day squad the first day out against Down. I think the fact he didn't appear at all for Omagh in the club championship match with Coalisland recently speaks volumes.
Quote from: God14 on June 13, 2014, 10:30:16 AM
Quote from: The_Beard on June 13, 2014, 09:27:15 AM
I expect to see 2-3 changes to the Monaghan team.
As for Tyrone, I can see that team starting with the only question over Stephen O'Neill. We may see Coney coming in for him.
I had heard that Joe McMahon has an Achilles injury, from experience it can be a slow healer with rest the only real cure. Haven't heard anything to suggest he is back training again.
I was told maybe 2 months ago that Joe was unlikely to get back in time for the county this year. He has missed a hell of a lot of work being out of action for a long time. It was suprising that he was added to the match day squad the first day out against Down. I think the fact he didn't appear at all for Omagh in the club championship match with Coalisland recently speaks volumes.
Exactly what I thought when I saw him standing along the sideline not togged out, if he was anything close to it he would have had a jersey on him.
Quote from: omaghjoe on June 13, 2014, 04:24:20 AM
Quote from: ONeill on June 13, 2014, 12:07:30 AM
Yep.
Monaghan have never been blessed with footballing ability or brains. That's why no AIs.
But they eat a lot and train. That can be dangerous.
Think you hit the nail on the head there O'Neill
Yes, hit the nail into his own head, more like.
Probably being stuck in a dead end job, 20 years or so operating the cash till or some similar mundane job in education will do that to a man with no ambition, or as MH says, a man with a lot of empty space inside.
I was told the injury happened in the week between the Down games, he was togged out the first day and took part in the warm-up but wasn't togged out in Newry.
At this stage I would imagine a quarter final for Omagh v Eglish would be a more realistic target for him which is unfortunate from a county point of view.
Quote from: Sleater on June 13, 2014, 09:24:58 AM
Quote from: GrandMasterFlash on June 12, 2014, 10:01:53 PM
Quote from: Schkite on June 12, 2014, 09:41:38 PM
Monaghan team named:
1.Rory Beggan
2.Colin Walshe
3.Drew Wylie
4.Fintan Kelly
5.Dessie Mone
6.Vinny Corey
7.Kieran Duffy
8.Dick Clerkin
9.Darren Hughes
10.Paul Finlay
11.Pauric Donaghy
12.Paudie McKenna
13.Dermot Malone
14.Kieran Hughes
15.Jack McCarron
McManus and Lennon on the bench. You'd imagine there'll be one or two changes before it starts.
Strong team, plenty of runners and dirty ball winners... What about the remainder of the bench: C McGuinness, R Wylie, Eoin Duffy, T Kerr, Gavin Doogan?
I'd be genuinely surprised if Monaghan line out like that. O'Rourke is notorious for making 1 to 2 changes from the line -up provided to the media. Any idea what it will actually be?
I agree, but who knows who the changes may be. Even setting aside Eoin and Conor's recovery from injury, I wouldn't be surprised at all to see Ryan Wylie, Jinxy or McGuinness starting, even Eoin Duffy.
Quote from: Fuzzman on June 13, 2014, 09:54:40 AM
"Moans" sets up a lot of forward moves so he'll need to be well "marked"
Nice wordplay Fuzz, I like it..
Quote from: Fuzzman on June 13, 2014, 09:54:40 AM
Monaghan lads take note of the difference between the Tyrone crowd on your streets compared to the Armagh ones you meet next.
Difference being good or bad Fuzz? We're well aware of both crowds so you'll need to define 'difference'... :o
That is close but not quite the Tyrone starting team according to my source.
Grugan didnt impress me in the club championship at all against Coalisland and it took a late thirty something to come on to give Omagh a grip at midfield. I do think Grugan has talent but perhaps at wing forward (but not in place of our Marty:-)
Going by Gormley form in the club championship i for one would still have him on as the best defender in the county at club level but i dont be at county training to see what goes on so. When Tyrone won the All Ireland in 03 Stevie was a sub but everyone knew he was one of our better forwards and it takes everyone to know their role, which i would imagine the Tyrone lads do
Quote from: GrandMasterFlash on June 13, 2014, 12:44:32 PM
Quote from: Fuzzman on June 13, 2014, 09:54:40 AM
Monaghan lads take note of the difference between the Tyrone crowd on your streets compared to the Armagh ones you meet next.
Difference being good or bad Fuzz? We're well aware of both crowds so you'll need to define 'difference'... :o
They wear different colours and the ones this weekend have funny accents with lots of references to "wiles", "cutties", "cubs" and the like.
Quote from: Wee Roddy on June 13, 2014, 12:49:23 PM
That is close but not quite the Tyrone starting team according to my source.
Grugan didnt impress me in the club championship at all against Coalisland and it took a late thirty something to come on to give Omagh a grip at midfield. I do think Grugan has talent but perhaps at wing forward (but not in place of our Marty:-)
Going by Gormley form in the club championship i for one would still have him on as the best defender in the county at club level but i dont be at county training to see what goes on so. When Tyrone won the All Ireland in 03 Stevie was a sub but everyone knew he was one of our better forwards and it takes everyone to know their role, which i would imagine the Tyrone lads do
Big Starrs I think - He was seeing stars after the haymaker he got near the end!
I though P Kane was good that evening operating around the middle for the island but no sign of him at all theses days!!
Quote from: Main Street on June 13, 2014, 10:35:52 AM
Quote from: omaghjoe on June 13, 2014, 04:24:20 AM
Quote from: ONeill on June 13, 2014, 12:07:30 AM
Yep.
Monaghan have never been blessed with footballing ability or brains. That's why no AIs.
But they eat a lot and train. That can be dangerous.
Think you hit the nail on the head there O'Neill
Yes, hit the nail into his own head, more like.
Probably being stuck in a dead end job, 20 years or so operating the cash till or some similar mundane job in education will do that to a man with no ambition, or as MH says, a man with a lot of empty space inside.
Almost as dangerous as the complete absence of any discernible sense of humour.
I suppose I was digging to see who ye hate more.
The apple munching, Buckfast drinking, wrong flag following Our Ma fans Boy
(http://1.bp.blogspot.com/-4L3qoHcrqRQ/TWaJOmc24hI/AAAAAAAAGhI/vAfxzcyqZQs/s1600/Drumcree.jpg)
Or the quiet reserved humble Tyrone fans who will quietly respect your town this weekend, even if they are a bit cheeky
(http://www.squareball.com/wp-content/uploads/2008/09/true-tyrone-fans.jpg)
Predictions:
Monaghan to get first black card
2 reds in the game
Plenty of yellows
Changes to both teams before the start ;)
Monaghan by 2.
Tyrone 1-15
Monaghan 0-15
Monaghan to fly out of the blocks to make a mockery of the Tyrone game-fit perception. Lead 0-6 to 0-1 after 12 mins. Gradually Tyrone begin to wear the Fariel down and Gormley lords over his manor. A Peter Harte penalty after a Mone black card sees the red arses home and a romantic clench with the apple chompers. Fariel off to Louth where they are given a scare before bullying the wee ones.
Kyle Coney cameo late on sees him hit 0-3. McManus appears on 55 mins to a hero's reception only to be accidentally dumped on his arse by Colm Cavanagh who was soloing over his own head at the time.
Or maybe a dull 0-10 0-9. I don't know. Accordions tramped into shite beforehand.
2.22 to 1.25
About time we had a hurling scoreline like that. Great for Sky highlights.
Monaghan 3
Tyrone 1
Tyrone by 7 after 10 minutes. Monaghan to claw and claw but denied by a late last ditch heroic act by Sean cav. Colm cav. to cause mayhem.
Looking in good nick.
(https://pbs.twimg.com/media/BqCeDmJCUAAEwM1.jpg)
Armagh/Cavan row was tame enough, hope Tyrone and Monaghan beat the head off each other for 70+ minutes with about 12 men sent off including both county secretaries, the trainer, a waterboy and Biddy who makes the sandwiches.
Would really highlight the game on sky sports and spark some serious international interest in our games. Imagine the coverage our games would get after it. They'd probably give 20 minutes to it on newsnight.
Some good analysis In the GL this week, especially how Tyrone attack down the left week so much as any foul there leads to a better shooting chance for Morgan
So much for Jordan's compliment to O'Rourke about not stooping to Bantys level of mind games such as booking the same hotel as Tyrone etc.
Looking at that pic he's gone and moved the goalposts again. Unreal.
Will yis wear Meath colours as well.
Good luck to both teams and let's make it a classic
"Both Monaghan and Tyrone come into tomorrow's Ulster quarter-final at Hyde Park with a few points to prove."
http://www.irishexaminer.com/sport/gaa/expect-an-edge-as-farney-men-get-serious-272086.html
And here was me thinking it was St. Tiarnach's Parc Cluain Eois. Is there a Connaught title up for grabs too?
Good article by Dara and he seems to understand Ulster football as opposed to some of the southern media who provide lazy trite analysis. I hope he's right with his prediction also but as he says, it won't be this easy...
Quote from: Schkite on June 14, 2014, 12:05:58 AM
Looking in good nick.
(https://pbs.twimg.com/media/BqCeDmJCUAAEwM1.jpg)
Factor 50. "The clones glow" prepare to get very very hot. Happy fathers day...
Quote from: Bingo on June 13, 2014, 05:35:58 PM
Predictions:
Monaghan to get first black card
2 reds in the game
Plenty of yellows
Changes to both teams before the start ;)
Monaghan by 2.
Monaghan to take the Tyrone dressing room
Monaghan to wear a different shirt than agreed with Ulster Council
The fine weather to bring out the champagne football. Tyrone to pull through with a late surge...
Tyrone 2-13 Monaghan 1-15
Monaghan 1-11, Tryone 0-12.
Quote from: GrandMasterFlash on June 15, 2014, 10:05:30 AM
Monaghan 1-11, Tryone 0-12.
The arrogance displayed here is sickening.
Enjoy the game folks and may the best team win
I was up at 7 with the 2 yr old and WE watched Jimmy's winning matches documentary again. Great way to get ye psyched up for the game. The passion in that Kildare game was amazing. Just leaving the house now. Going with 3 aul lass. The craic will be 90 if not more
Is there a match on before the big one?
Quote from: on the sideline on June 15, 2014, 10:42:54 AM
Is there a match on before the big one?
Down v Donegal USHC
Is there somehow I can stream this game online? Anyone a link? I see this GAAGO thing? €10?
Quote from: DoireGael on June 15, 2014, 12:11:19 PM
Is there somehow I can stream this game online? Anyone a link? I see this GAAGO thing? €10?
Taken from earlier posting
Re: GAA doing a deal with Sky Sports
« Reply #2 on: March 27, 2014, 02:55:39 PM »
Sky Sports me arse.
http://webfirstrow.eu
http://tykestv.eu/
http://coolsport.tv
http://www.wiziwig.tv/index.php?part=sports
http://www.firstrowsports.eu/
http://www.vipbox.tv/s
http://www.nj43.com/
http://cricfree.tv/index.php
http://www.stopstream.com/
http://www.tsmplug.com
Cheers Antoinse.
Malachy Clerkin @MalachyClerkin 41s
Conor McManus starts for Monaghan
Monaghan's first point, they could have had 1-3 at this stage.
Can outfield players not take a free anymore?
Quote from: Go home ref on June 15, 2014, 02:23:20 PM
Can outfield players not take a free anymore?
They can't take penalties either
Tommy Carr is getting stupider by the day.
Monaghan looking the better team at the moment, they should be further ahead.
Even leaving the penalty aside, Monaghan should be a few points up. Looking the stronger team all over the field in the last fifteen minutes.
Good game and the ref is doing a very good job too. A pity about the RTE commentary.
Has a penalty ever been retaken for a keeper advancing off his line?
Quote from: Zulu on June 15, 2014, 02:40:21 PM
Monaghan looking the better team at the moment, they should be further ahead.
Aye - an awful lot of poor kicking by both teams though - Tyrone have hit a few dreadful wides and the keeper twice. Monaghan have played the wrong ball on a couple of occasions when a score was on.
Should Conor Clarke be allowed to sit where he is? I won't insult Hughes by saying it made a difference to his penalty but he shouldn't be standing there!
Pretty crap game. We are listless and have no punch up front at all. Ronan O'Neill has touched leather twice, I think. Big big improvement needed from our side, hopefully we can deliver.
I thought it was a pretty good game, nice pace and intensity with some great tackling. Some poor play by both sides alright but I wouldn't agree it was a poor game.
Tyrone were listless in first half. Good chance for Monaghan this.
Those Thomas Kane interviews are so annoying!!
Ref could easily have given a footblock there, though I think it would have been harsh
Thought so too. IMO it was a foot block as the defender didn't attempt to use his hands.
So monaghan never beat Tyrone. Is that it?
Quote from: Itchy on June 15, 2014, 02:43:11 PM
Good game and the ref is doing a very good job too. A pity about the RTE commentary.
Couldn t stick it. Went with the BBC coverage.
The WC commentary is unbearable as well. Brian Kerr and Jim Beglin ffs.
Neither black cards IMO, certainly the Tyrone black was nowhere near a black card.
Kavanagh went down extremely dramatically there.
The rules are a shambles. How is that tackle by Mone not cynical and deliberate? Yet McCurry is sat on the sideline?
Quote from: Zulu on June 15, 2014, 03:25:48 PM
Neither black cards IMO, certainly the Tyrone black was nowhere near a black card.
Tyrone one didn't seem intentional, and barely caught him with his elbow, hardly a trip.
<img src="http://smileys.emoticonsonly.com/emoticons/o/oscar_red_carpet-1148.gif" border="0" alt="Oscar Red Carpet" title = "Oscar Red Carpet emoticon" />
Acting award for Sean
Marty Duffy type ref i.e. We are talking about him
Quote from: Tubberman on June 15, 2014, 03:26:18 PM
Kavanagh went down extremely dramatically there.
no surprise there
Tyrone are poor.
Kavanagh at it again!! Grabbed Hughes arm and jumped to the ground. Stupid attempt at a tackle by Hughes though
Cavanagh cheating his way again, tricking ref to give Hughes a black card
2 years in a row Cavanagh has done Darren Hughes... What a horrible cheating bastard!
Wonder what Brolly will have to say this time!
Finlay + K.Hughes have been absolutely anonymous 2nd half!
Quote from: screenexile on June 15, 2014, 03:34:23 PM
2 years in a row Cavanagh has done Darren Hughes... What a horrible cheating b**tard!
Grow up!
Quote from: screenexile on June 15, 2014, 03:34:23 PM
2 years in a row Cavanagh has done Darren Hughes... What a horrible cheating b**tard!
Nonsense.
Normally I'd not be up for monaghan but I want to see cavanagh beaten.
That's a black card for Kavanagh. FFS ref, you're a joke!!
Important miss by Morgan! In this case any time taken worked against Tyrone.
Oisin called Monaghan by a point and so it is.
Quote from: our_fella on June 15, 2014, 03:35:34 PM
Finlay + K.Hughes have been absolutely anonymous 2nd half!
Finlay only came on as sub with 10 minutes to go
How was that not a black for Cavanagh??
Quote from: EC Unique on June 12, 2014, 11:00:30 PM
Strong Tyrone team. Will be surprised if they don't win handy enough.
Brilliant. I love the way you leave yourself so wide open
100% correct by Brolly.
Justice for Monaghan
Ireland rejoices. The right team prevailed.
Was Ciaran Mc Ginley playing today??
Quote from: Tubberman on June 15, 2014, 03:38:22 PM
100% correct by Brolly.
What did he say?
QuoteThat's a black card for Kavanagh. FFS ref, you're a joke!!
I disagree. I thought Cavanagh fouled but Clerkin dived to the ground so for me it wasn't a black.
I think Roy Hodgson should have brought Sean Cavanagh to the World Cup :P .He would win some amount of penalty/free kicks
Monaghan about six points the better team yet they almost allowed Tyrone to grab undeserved draw.
Tramps nearly came back from the dead, they looked dead and buried. It will be the graveyard that is the back door for Hartes deadly divers. Doubt there will be a resurrection.
Fair play Monaghan they deserved it. I think K Hughes was doing serious hobbling about in the 2nd half and they still came through.
Tyrone are in for a serious drought after Cavanagh goes... Cue more crying from Mickey Harte in the morning!
Nrico must be in some shock, only thought Tyrone had to turn up, such arrogance.
Black card is a mess! As sign posted here on this board the black card encourages diving! Monaghan made hard work of what should have been an easy win. Stevie O'Neill looks gone. Harte although clearly frustrated after match.
Morgan can do all the poncing training videos he wants but its on match day that it matters ................................
Quote from: squire_in_navy_slacks on June 15, 2014, 03:53:01 PM
Morgan can do all the poncing training videos he wants but its on match day that it matters ................................
said it before will say it again morgan is a liability. ...
Quote from: squire_in_navy_slacks on June 15, 2014, 03:53:01 PM
Morgan can do all the poncing training videos he wants but its on match day that it matters ................................
couldnt happen to a nicer fella, delighted for him, micky harte is a moaning yap too. monaghan should have won by six or seven.
Quote from: Zulu on June 15, 2014, 03:44:39 PM
Quote from: Tubberman on June 15, 2014, 03:38:22 PM
100% correct by Brolly.
What did he say?
QuoteThat's a black card for Kavanagh. FFS ref, you're a joke!!
I disagree. I thought Cavanagh fouled but Clerkin dived to the ground so for me it wasn't a black.
Brolly said it was sad to see Cavanagh grabbing the man's arm and diving. Lyster got jumpy and started trying to talk over him, and brought in Spillane, but Pat agreed with Brolly on this one.
I thought the Cavanagh tackle was a nailed-on black card, but didn't see replay so could be wrong.
Agree on Cavanagh diving though I didn't see any reason for Clerkin to hit the ground when he was fouled by Cavanagh.
You'd have to say that was a very poor Tyrone performance and effort which meant that Monaghan didn't need to be at the top of the game.
I knew we had the game when Tyrone came out 'blazing' in the second half and that blaze petered out inside 3 minutes without scoring.
Even the crowd seemed quite relaxed, a bit of nerves at the end but sure beating Tyrone doesn't come easy, we just need more practice at doing it.
It feels good.
(http://www.hoganstand.com/Common/NewGallery/inph0713323.jpg)
Thought the 3 black cards were harsh but you can hardly blame the referee when the game is so quick and there is so much diving. I can understand Harte's frustration at the end as I remember the same frustration in the 2005 semi final when the referee didn't add time after Canavan and Mugsy had a party before their winning free kick. Thought Tony Donnelly spoke very well when interviewed.
Get the fook in! Scrappy and nervy end to the game, but it was always going to be against Tyrone after our recent record against them, huge monkey off our backs now. Alot to work on, some poor shooting and decision making at times. Tyrone were poor enough but we still made hard enough work of it in the end, should have been further ahead before their late comeback. McManus was well off the pace but still proved crucial with his flawless free-taking. Wylie and Kelly were exceptional in defence. Had a quick look at the odds on Paddy Power earlier for MOTM, I think Kelly was the longest odds player quoted at 40/1. I actually toyed with sticking a few euro on for the craic as he has such an impressive league but of course didn't bother. He won't be far off it.
Onwards to Armagh now, bit more time for McManus to get up to speed and hopefully Lennon too.
Monaghan should have won this by 10, hope they don`t take Armagh for granted the way Tyrone took them, I think they are well capable of beating Donegal, Stephen O`Neill at 33 only has something to offer off the bench, better with Donnelly in full forward. When the pressure is on Morgan is very flaky, he should be told not to be coming out the field soloing the ball full stop. Chris McGuinness shooting and option taking was terrible
In my opinion, Sean was fouled on each and every one of those occasions and they highlight how the difficult life has become for the referees. With a player running at pace he will go down on contact, it's a soccer thing to claim diving and it was Monaghan tactic to claim that on all occasions that Sean was fouled. How Mone had the face to claim a dive after his head high tackle, when in the first half he was diving like Klinnsmann when McGinley bumped into him after a free. Well done to Monaghan, they are a good team who makes life hard for the opposition. Tyrone played poorly and probably did well to push them to the wire but we have a lot of work to do through the back door.
It would be great if Monaghan could push on further from last year .
Quote from: Wildweasel74 on June 15, 2014, 04:34:10 PM
Monaghan should have won this by 10, hope they don`t take Armagh for granted the way Tyrone took them, I think they are well capable of beating Donegal, Stephen O`Neill at 33 only has something to offer off the bench, better with Donnelly in full forward. When the pressure is on Morgan is very flaky, he should be told not to be coming out the field soloing the ball full stop. Chris McGuinness shooting and option taking was terrible
I don't like to pick out players, especially after a win like that, but I'd have to agree. There were a good few who had poor shots, even Darren Hughes who is normally brilliant from long-range, but McGuinness had a few poor shots today and even one could have been the difference if Morgan slotted over that free. He's normally more accurate and decisive, so I'd just put it down as a bad day and he'll learn from it.
Dick also deserves a mention, didn't think he'd be able to last 70 minutes and I was sure Lennon would be on at some point, but Dick put in a solid shift and was a big part of the move that led to the goal.
deserved win for monaghan on a day when all tyrones frailties where shown up. only for sean cavanagh we would outside top 10 in ireland. brilliant today although i appreciate the frustration of other supporters because he does go down easy and buy the free, but we won't complain about that. its the ref's job to spot that. tyrone pretty poor up front.
stevie may retire for second time, doesn't have the legs but mickey has to accept some responsibility for putting in a man who has played almost zero competitive football for over a year. especially over the likes of mcaliskey who was sharp when he came on. stevie has been reduced to huff and puff arounds the middle for dirty ball because he hasn't the turn of pace to play inside.
mccurry is our best forward but he's too light to lead the line on his own, needs a ball winner in with him and play off him rather than hoofing a 60yard ball in and expecting him to do it all himself. again mickey has to take responsibility for this. why persist with mattie d ff in league and mckenna cup if you point blank refuse to play him there in championship. what was the point? why waste his time instead of maybe developing somebody like dan mcnulty into that role? very poor
how the nephew managed stay on the field i do not know. zero contribution again. good player, not doubting his quality but no matter who a player is, they need to know they aren't droppable.
much maligned defence and full back line actually did well today but overall monaghan too good. thats thrones season over anyway i doubt, had a shot at ulster but nowhere near good enough for all ireland.
Both mcginley and harte failed to show up today. Mickey should have changed one or both of them.
Quote from: Hereiam on June 15, 2014, 05:02:08 PM
Both mcginley and harte failed to show up today. Mickey should have changed one or both of them.
There were too many fires to put out for Tyrone, not even Mickey can perform miracles.
Quote from: BennyHarp on June 15, 2014, 04:35:47 PM
In my opinion, Sean was fouled on each and every one of those occasions and they highlight how the difficult life has become for the referees. With a player running at pace he will go down on contact, it's a soccer thing to claim diving and it was Monaghan tactic to claim that on all occasions that Sean was fouled. How Mone had the face to claim a dive after his head high tackle, when in the first half he was diving like Klinnsmann when McGinley bumped into him after a free. Well done to Monaghan, they are a good team who makes life hard for the opposition. Tyrone played poorly and probably did well to push them to the wire but we have a lot of work to do through the back door.
You are obviously from Tyrone so your comments cannot be taken seriously. Cavanagh's diving today was depressing to watch. What makes things worse this season is his diving is getting players black carded for doing nothing. Mickey Harte/Cavanagh/tyrone learned Karma is a bi*ch today. I can't understand how they can criticise a referee after he fell for all Cavanagh's dives
One other thing, I was a bit surprised to see Kieran Hughes taking the penalty, has he taken one for Monaghan before? I can't remember one. I do remember Darren scoring a good one a while ago so I thought he might have been taking it.
Always good to win well when not playing well.
Onwards now to our dear neighbours.
2 mins injury time???????????????????????????????
How?
Quote from: sam03/05 on June 15, 2014, 05:26:14 PM
2 mins injury time???????????????????????????????
How?
Niall Morgan wasted at least 2 minutes taking frees. Karma?
Poor Joe's been at the sour grapes
Joe McMahon @Bigjoemc 7m
Man of the match today for Monaghan #kinsella
There should have been at least 4 mins injury time.
Plus he blows time up when Tyrone on the attack.
Thought the ref had a shocking game
Quote from: sam03/05 on June 15, 2014, 05:26:14 PM
2 mins injury time???????????????????????????????
How?
Does it really matter? Monaghan were the superior team and should have won by 5 or 6. We can have no complaints. Don't forget the ref played a minute less in 05 AI final. We benefitted on that occasion so I don't think any Tyrone person should be complaining too much about time especially when we didn't deserve to win today. I think there are a bigger issues for Tyrone football.
The way the Tyrone management/setup are using the lack of stoppage time as a means of deflection is a classic Alex ferguson trick.
Well said Clarshack.
Although disappointed Joe McMahon would be better not commenting on the referee. They may meet again.
Monaghan could have won by more. Tyrone fans etc will blame Kinsella which is their entitlement / opinion.
But if tuth be told, this was a game Monaghan could and should have won by more. Tyrone lacked invention upfront. How good are Monaghan ?. Hard to say as Tyrone got to within a point of them and should have snatched a draw.
Well done to Monaghan. Donegal won't be ridiculously short priced favourites on 20.7.14. Monaghan are on the march !.
Too many mediocre players on the Tyrone team
Monaghan were marginally the better side, was not that impressed with them either. Tyrone kicked about 8 wides in 1st half alone and about 3/4 into keepers hands.
dont think they will really trouble Donegal that much.
Tyrone can have no complaints, if they'd nabbed a draw at the end, they certainly wouldn't have deserved it.
The one damning indictment of Tyrone so far this year is that they've now played 15 matches and we still don't know our best team- or anything close to it. I can't understand how some players lasted 70 minutes.
Quote from: squire_in_navy_slacks on June 15, 2014, 03:53:01 PM
Morgan can do all the poncing training videos he wants but its on match day that it matters ................................
My exact words coming out of Clones. No stones when it mattered. Same in Ballybofey last year.
Quote from: inroundthesquare on June 15, 2014, 06:06:35 PM
Quote from: squire_in_navy_slacks on June 15, 2014, 03:53:01 PM
Morgan can do all the poncing training videos he wants but its on match day that it matters ................................
My exact words coming out of Clones. No stones when it mattered. Same in Ballybofey last year.
Extremely harsh. It was a tight angle.
does anyone know the faith healer conor mc manus went to in donegal be some q at his door next week i would say
Quote from: Throw ball on June 15, 2014, 05:41:54 PM
Well said Clarshack.
Although disappointed Joe McMahon would be better not commenting on the referee. They may meet again.
Just seen his tweet - your right he would be better keeping shut instead of looking like a bad loser!
Maybe Harte should have a look at his team and tactics for a start . . .
Ach a very disappointing day in Clones..... my t'uppence worth on the match..
1. Well done Monaghan. Better team on the day. Could have won by more.
2. Tyrone for all the bad they were still should have drawn this game - based purely on the final free. They would not have deserved it though.
3. Why Sean didn't take the free I'm not sure - Morgan took around 4-5 goes at the same angle of kick on the 45 line in the warm up - and missed each one, wide right.
4. Two min injury time was a joke. At least 4 Mon players required treatment in the second half for over 2 minutes each time.
5. Amazingly they all got up and played on despite going down like they were felled by a bus (I will caveat that by saying Tyrone would, and have in the past, done exactly the same to take the sting out of games ).
6. Most of the black cards looked like black cards (I'm assuming McCurry gave lip to the ref?)
7. Tyrone had no game plan. At all.
8. High looping ball / high bouncing ball into the FF line works if you have Murphy, O'Gara or AN other big bruising full forward up there. It doesn't work for small forwards.
8. Only Colm and Mattie D played anywhwere near the required standard today. Sean and Justy were average enough, but got better in last 15.
9. The rest....... if you can't say anything nice....
Spot on tyroneman,would agree with that.
Best of luck to Monaghan,I hope they retain their title.They will have to play better to do so but I believe they will improve as they go on.
Quote from: skeog on June 15, 2014, 06:12:43 PM
does anyone know the faith healer conor mc manus went to in donegal be some q at his door next week i would say
Think he was at a few places, went to Sean Boylan in Dunboyne too
Heard Boylesports have offered to pay for Mickey Harte's Anger Management therapy
Quote from: orangeman on June 15, 2014, 06:10:29 PM
Quote from: inroundthesquare on June 15, 2014, 06:06:35 PM
Quote from: squire_in_navy_slacks on June 15, 2014, 03:53:01 PM
Morgan can do all the poncing training videos he wants but its on match day that it matters ................................
My exact words coming out of Clones. No stones when it mattered. Same in Ballybofey last year.
Extremely harsh. It was a tight angle.
Balls.. It wasn't a tight angle and if it was then he shouldn't have been let near it. McAliskey was the man for that free. Morgan should stick to nets or his career will implode
Quote from: Mikhailov on June 15, 2014, 07:17:27 PM
Quote from: orangeman on June 15, 2014, 06:10:29 PM
Quote from: inroundthesquare on June 15, 2014, 06:06:35 PM
Quote from: squire_in_navy_slacks on June 15, 2014, 03:53:01 PM
Morgan can do all the poncing training videos he wants but its on match day that it matters ................................
My exact words coming out of Clones. No stones when it mattered. Same in Ballybofey last year.
Extremely harsh. It was a tight angle.
Balls.. It wasn't a tight angle and if it was then he shouldn't have been let near it. McAliskey was the man for that free. Morgan should stick to nets or his career will implode
Did McAliskey not score a free from a very similar position just before? Makes it all the more bizarre.
Quote from: Schkite on June 15, 2014, 07:21:44 PM
Quote from: Mikhailov on June 15, 2014, 07:17:27 PM
Quote from: orangeman on June 15, 2014, 06:10:29 PM
Quote from: inroundthesquare on June 15, 2014, 06:06:35 PM
Quote from: squire_in_navy_slacks on June 15, 2014, 03:53:01 PM
Morgan can do all the poncing training videos he wants but its on match day that it matters ................................
My exact words coming out of Clones. No stones when it mattered. Same in Ballybofey last year.
Extremely harsh. It was a tight angle.
Balls.. It wasn't a tight angle and if it was then he shouldn't have been let near it. McAliskey was the man for that free. Morgan should stick to nets or his career will implode
Did McAliskey not score a free from a very similar position just before? Makes it all the more bizarre.
Schkite I wouldn't get involved, it's just the sound of the empty vessels rattling with their hindsight enhanced wisdom.
Quote from: Main Street on June 15, 2014, 05:05:14 PM
Quote from: Hereiam on June 15, 2014, 05:02:08 PM
Both mcginley and harte failed to show up today. Mickey should have changed one or both of them.
There were too many fires to put out for Tyrone, not even Mickey can perform miracles.
Fair play to monaghan they fully deserved the win. Hope they follow up and progress. For a supposedly marquee forward conor me manus has the heart of a lion. Absolute heroic stuff.
Quote from: sam03/05 on June 15, 2014, 05:26:14 PM
2 mins injury time???????????????????????????????
How?
It makes you wonder, does anyone actually calculate how much time is lost to stoppages?
Or is it all just arbitrary, i.e. we didn't need an ambulance/fire engine on the pitch therefore 2 mins injury time will do.
The Tyrone management showed a total lack of class at the end.I was watching on nordie tv(the commentator was some laugh) and it appears that a photographer was claiming that he was struck by a member of the Tyrone squad?He seemed to be pointing at the Tyrone Personnel/Team and I felt he was saying something like 'I will see you in court'
Quote from: rrhf on June 15, 2014, 07:30:10 PM
Quote from: Main Street on June 15, 2014, 05:05:14 PM
Quote from: Hereiam on June 15, 2014, 05:02:08 PM
Both mcginley and harte failed to show up today. Mickey should have changed one or both of them.
There were too many fires to put out for Tyrone, not even Mickey can perform miracles.
Fair play to monaghan they fully deserved the win. Hope they follow up and progress. For a supposedly marquee forward conor me manus has the heart of a lion. Absolute heroic stuff.
It's not football ability alone ,which gets a player like McManus through the Monaghan SFC :)
I was taken aback at how both teams were a good distance away from being at championship pace. Even the crowd were merely clapping the scores rather than roaring, ie until Monaghan scored the goal. But it was hard to escape the feeling that this was a game played a good bit away from the intensity and quality that most here expected would happen.
We had 6 from that 2007 Ulster final, Mone, Corey, Finlay, Clerkin, Gollogly and McManus, and a 7th, Lennon on the subs bench.
I guess they won't ponder too much on the dysfunctional aspects.
The 2 minutes of added time was clearly a ridiculous decision by the ref and in truth there should have been more added time based on the closing 15 minutes alone. Clerkin himself wasted 2 minutes rolling around ;D. The ref had a poor day really, he was conned by some theatrics on both sides and his black and yellow card decisions appeared to be totally random.
All that said, I don't think the had any great impact on the result as Monaghan were obviously the better team. Perhaps their poor record against Tyrone was to blame for their late collapse and but for that they would have won by 5 or 6, which would have been a fairer reflection of the game. I wish them all the best for the rest of the summer and hope they can reach and then do some damage in the AI series.
As for Tyrone, I wasn't surprised by the poor performance. Mickey is a legend in Tyrone and always will be but the fact is he and his coaching team have had a poor year. I said on this forum months ago that we should be looking to find something close to a settled team as quickly as possible and stick with it. Instead it's been more of what seems to have become Mickey's policy in recent years, constant changes from game to game. As such, we came into the championship with no clear idea of what the best team is and crucially pretty much nobody established in key positions down the spine of the team. The whole style from the league seems to have been discarded. As the pundits said today, Tyrone today were disorganised and it was the same against Down. Despite what posters from other counties are saying, there are talented players in the Tyrone setup but unfortunately we are the moment a rather rudderless ship, no direction and no plan. Should win some games in the qualifiers based on the talent in the side but will fall short against any half decent opposition.
Best team won. Don't think Morgan will worry too much about the missed free, all free takers have off days. I would be more concerned about his forays up the pitch! Nearly gifted a goal early on by taking to much out of it, albeit the corner back turned his back on play.
Aw well, scenic route beckons
Quote from: Main Street on June 15, 2014, 07:56:23 PM
Quote from: rrhf on June 15, 2014, 07:30:10 PM
Quote from: Main Street on June 15, 2014, 05:05:14 PM
Quote from: Hereiam on June 15, 2014, 05:02:08 PM
Both mcginley and harte failed to show up today. Mickey should have changed one or both of them.
There were too many fires to put out for Tyrone, not even Mickey can perform miracles.
Fair play to monaghan they fully deserved the win. Hope they follow up and progress. For a supposedly marquee forward conor me manus has the heart of a lion. Absolute heroic stuff.
It's not football ability alone ,which gets a player like McManus through the Monaghan SFC :)
I was taken aback at how both teams were a good distance away from being at championship pace. Even the crowd were merely clapping the scores rather than roaring, ie until Monaghan scored the goal. But it was hard to escape the feeling that this was a game played a good bit away from the intensity and quality that most here expected would happen.
We had 6 from that 2007 Ulster final, Mone, Corey, Finlay, Clerkin, Gollogly and McManus, and a 7th, Lennon on the subs bench.
I guess they won't ponder too much on the dysfunctional aspects.
Getting roughed up by Blayney and Magheracloone defenders is enough to toughen up any young forward! ;D
Darren Hughes was on the '07 panel aswell wasn't he?
Heard tony donnelly speak after and just thought to meself is this football management or failed takeover coup by a multinational. It really feels the whole set up cant see the wood for the trees. Son is a gent and a great tyrone gael but he shoulda been off early on. Jebus cripes its a game of football. All the smart scientific strategies cant kick a ball for ye. Hope louth win so some SERIOUS consideration can be given. Dunno the answer. God rest Paidi but he was often spot on bout the modern game.
as Brolly said after the game - Tyrone are a mess
Quote from: Captain Obvious on June 15, 2014, 03:45:14 PM
Monaghan about six points the better team yet they almost allowed Tyrone to grab undeserved draw.
[/quTote]
They scored 1.4 from open play!!!! Tyrone scored 0.9 so where are you getting the six points from?
Monaghan deserved to win with a point to spare.
Very little between these teams.
Quote from: kickingmule on June 15, 2014, 09:28:54 PM
Quote from: Captain Obvious on June 15, 2014, 03:45:14 PM
Monaghan about six points the better team yet they almost allowed Tyrone to grab undeserved draw.
They scored 1.4 from open play!!!! Tyrone scored 0.9 so where are you getting the six points from?
Monaghan deserved to win with a point to spare.
Very little between these teams.
Monaghan missed at least 2 clear goal chances - Tyrone didn't get a sniff at goal all day.
Quote from: Maguire01 on June 15, 2014, 09:46:36 PM
Quote from: kickingmule on June 15, 2014, 09:28:54 PM
Quote from: Captain Obvious on June 15, 2014, 03:45:14 PM
Monaghan about six points the better team yet they almost allowed Tyrone to grab undeserved draw.
They scored 1.4 from open play!!!! Tyrone scored 0.9 so where are you getting the six points from?
Monaghan deserved to win with a point to spare.
Very little between these teams.
Monaghan missed at least 2 clear goal chances - Tyrone didn't get a sniff at goal all day.
Not long back and about to settle down to Sunday Game, with a couple of 'cold ones' and some 'wee buns' the man from Strabane was going on about.
Defence bossed proceedings for Monaghan, Fintan Kelly was our man of the match. Midfield had really good periods and Clerkin stood out for us.
Our forward unit have had better days, but they stuck with their task and won enough possession to keep us on the front foot. We should have gone in at half time six points up. Jack McCarron should have been brought on.
For Tyrone Mattie Donnelly was very impressive. Colm Cavanagh put in a good shift too. Some of the Tyronies aren't happy with Harte today. I saw him in Newry against Down and thought he was immense. He was never going to get that much space against Monaghan though.
I agree with the Tyrone man post previous page re the black cards - what I saw they were deserved and I was close.
Onwards and Upwards - Muineachán abú!
Great result and great to get that monkey off our back - that's all Ulster teams beaten by this 'current' Monaghan squad, and whilst there is a lot of room for improvement, there's a real chance to defend the Ulster title. There were clearly a lot of nerves today - a lot of unforced errors that can be cut out, but given the layoff since the league final, that's maybe not a surprise. We should hopefully be a bit more polished for Armagh.
Whilst it was patchy enough, there were some great Monaghan performances - Drew Wylie, Kelly, Clerkin, Corey all had very good games and Malone put in a lot of work. McManus was rusty from play but his frees were perfect. Beggan scored two lovely points and was very good under the high ball - unlucky to concede the 45. I would have had Gollogly in a lot earlier (for McGuinness, who didn't have a great day), - didn't have much time to make an impact, but got an important hand in in defence. I would like to have seen Finlay in 15 minutes earlier too, to see if he might have been able to add a score in that barren period. Kieran Hughes missed some great chances, but then scored a few nice points - unlucky with the penalty.
The black card - or at least its application - is a shambles, and for anyone not from Tyrone, Cavanagh is infuriating. As with last year's quarter final, he fouled Darren Hughes, blatantly, yet again the ref totally missed this and again, Hughes is carded. How are refs not aware of this at this stage?! (Tyrone can argue about the added time, but they got score from the resulting free in, when it should have been a free out.) I also can't understand how Cavanagh avoided a black card for dragging Clerkin down at the end.
Monaghan deserved the victory. Tyrone are at a serious crossroads, well they have been at this crossroads for a few years now. A clean rebuild is needed and 100% faith put in the younger players coming through. Has been mentioned here on many many occasions, that MH has been with the older players for a long time and thinks maybe he owes them as much footy as possible. Sentimentality doesn't win matches (that said MH knows a lot more than I do)
2mins injury time...holy jeebus. GAA officials, please wake the fcuk up to the fact that timekeeping needs to be taken out of the refs hands. Players going down in the last 10 mins feigning injury and watching the clock tick tocking away grinds my gears. (Talking generally here, not necessarily about today's match)
Up Monaghan
Quote from: Jinxy on June 15, 2014, 07:32:07 PM
Quote from: sam03/05 on June 15, 2014, 05:26:14 PM
2 mins injury time???????????????????????????????
How?
It makes you wonder, does anyone actually calculate how much time is lost to stoppages?
Or is it all just arbitrary, i.e. we didn't need an ambulance/fire engine on the pitch therefore 2 mins injury time will do.
In my years of going to matches, it's 1 or 2 minutes, unless there has been one significant stoppage. Far from accurate i'd imagine, but that's the way in generally rolls. If Morgan hadn't taken so long with the free, they'd probably have had another chance within the 2 minutes.
And they failed to take them, Tyrone were poor today, yet could easily have stolen the draw.
But well done Monaghan, you deserved your win,
Quote from: Maguire01 on June 15, 2014, 10:04:18 PM
Quote from: Jinxy on June 15, 2014, 07:32:07 PM
Quote from: sam03/05 on June 15, 2014, 05:26:14 PM
2 mins injury time???????????????????????????????
How?
It makes you wonder, does anyone actually calculate how much time is lost to stoppages?
Or is it all just arbitrary, i.e. we didn't need an ambulance/fire engine on the pitch therefore 2 mins injury time will do.
In my years of going to matches, it's 1 or 2 minutes, unless there has been one significant stoppage. Far from accurate i'd imagine, but that's the way in generally rolls. If Morgan hadn't taken so long with the free, they'd probably have had another chance within the 2 minutes.
Some wear two watches and have a stopwatch for significant stoppages. (Benefit of having a father who assessed inter county refs). I admit I was surprised by only two minutes given the number of serious injuries to Monaghan players. I hope they're all ok. It made the second half rather boring.
It's crap getting beaten but no real lasting disappointment as we never at any stage deserved to win.
And this is probably a backhanded compliment, but my favourite parts of the game were the two occasions Clerkin tried the shoulder tackle he's usually an expert at and ended up on his ass (once against Cavanagh).
Also - the goal scorer was pretty unsportsmanlike when his goal celebration consisted of him running straight over to Peter Harte and roaring in his face (which the ref scolded him for).
(I never see the bad stuff Tyrone get up to but enough people on here do, so I just thought I'd point this one out for a bit of balance)
Monaghan look well organised and I have no doubts they'll be around for the business end.
Congrats Monaghan on a good win.
His deserved to win by far more and showed us all his poor we can be. Mattie Donnelly is the only decent player from today and for Mickey to leave SON on at FF for the whole game shows up again what I and many others are staying for some time.
We just don't have the players, hunger or know how any more but judging by a lot of posts on here that is delighting the majority of ye neutrals.
Well done Monaghan and I hope ye go on to win Ulster and yer never know why might might again. I'd say you have more scope for improvement than we have though
Quote from: Rois on June 15, 2014, 10:25:57 PM
Quote from: Maguire01 on June 15, 2014, 10:04:18 PM
Quote from: Jinxy on June 15, 2014, 07:32:07 PM
Quote from: sam03/05 on June 15, 2014, 05:26:14 PM
2 mins injury time???????????????????????????????
How?
It makes you wonder, does anyone actually calculate how much time is lost to stoppages?
Or is it all just arbitrary, i.e. we didn't need an ambulance/fire engine on the pitch therefore 2 mins injury time will do.
In my years of going to matches, it's 1 or 2 minutes, unless there has been one significant stoppage. Far from accurate i'd imagine, but that's the way in generally rolls. If Morgan hadn't taken so long with the free, they'd probably have had another chance within the 2 minutes.
Some wear two watches and have a stopwatch for significant stoppages. (Benefit of having a father who assessed inter county refs). I admit I was surprised by only two minutes given the number of serious injuries to Monaghan players. I hope they're all ok. It made the second half rather boring.
It's crap getting beaten but no real lasting disappointment as we never at any stage deserved to win.
And this is probably a backhanded compliment, but my favourite parts of the game were the two occasions Clerkin tried the shoulder tackle he's usually an expert at and ended up on his ass (once against Cavanagh).
Also - the goal scorer was pretty trampish when his goal celebration consisted of him running straight over to Peter Harte and roaring in his face (which the ref scolded him for).
(I never see the bad stuff Tyrone get up to but enough people on here do, so I just thought I'd point this one out for a bit of balance)
Monaghan look well organised and I have no doubts they'll be around for the business end.
That didn't look good but we are not aware of what Peter (trampishly) did to deserve that special attention.
Just seeing the Hughes cavanagh tackle on rte there now, how in the name of god did the ref not see cavanagh drag him down, its so blatant on the TV, Ref must been well out of position or unsighted
Quote from: Main Street on June 15, 2014, 10:58:37 PM
Quote from: Rois on June 15, 2014, 10:25:57 PM
Quote from: Maguire01 on June 15, 2014, 10:04:18 PM
Quote from: Jinxy on June 15, 2014, 07:32:07 PM
Quote from: sam03/05 on June 15, 2014, 05:26:14 PM
2 mins injury time???????????????????????????????
How?
It makes you wonder, does anyone actually calculate how much time is lost to stoppages?
Or is it all just arbitrary, i.e. we didn't need an ambulance/fire engine on the pitch therefore 2 mins injury time will do.
In my years of going to matches, it's 1 or 2 minutes, unless there has been one significant stoppage. Far from accurate i'd imagine, but that's the way in generally rolls. If Morgan hadn't taken so long with the free, they'd probably have had another chance within the 2 minutes.
Some wear two watches and have a stopwatch for significant stoppages. (Benefit of having a father who assessed inter county refs). I admit I was surprised by only two minutes given the number of serious injuries to Monaghan players. I hope they're all ok. It made the second half rather boring.
It's crap getting beaten but no real lasting disappointment as we never at any stage deserved to win.
And this is probably a backhanded compliment, but my favourite parts of the game were the two occasions Clerkin tried the shoulder tackle he's usually an expert at and ended up on his ass (once against Cavanagh).
Also - the goal scorer was pretty trampish when his goal celebration consisted of him running straight over to Peter Harte and roaring in his face (which the ref scolded him for).
(I never see the bad stuff Tyrone get up to but enough people on here do, so I just thought I'd point this one out for a bit of balance)
Monaghan look well organised and I have no doubts they'll be around for the business end.
That didn't look good but we are not aware of what Peter (trampishly) did to deserve that special attention.
Are you or are you just insinuating and throwing the T word in there?
I thought cavanagh's diving, dragging of arms etc etc was pretty bad in general today.
Funny game. Despite monaghan appearing better they couldn't shake tyrone off. Mcaliskey should have hit that free too.
I think tyrone could learn a lot from this game and come on from it. I think o'neill is a better sub to have these days. Also i've never understood why mcaliskey doesn't start- really worth his place.
Monaghan could do with stopping runners from half back quicker. Donnelly was destroying them. Mone was superb though as was the free taking of mcmanus.
Cavanagh was fouled @ 69.58 and Morgans kick was waved wide @ 70.52... They've only themselves to blame!!
Quote from: screenexile on June 15, 2014, 11:09:41 PM
Cavanagh was fouled @ 69.58 and Morgans kick was waved wide @ 70.52... They've only themselves to blame!!
It took a lackadaisical Tyrone one minute to miss that free. If Sean hadn't spent half that time rolling around the grass he could have got to his feet immediatley and looked for the quick free kick to somebody in a good position, but old habits die hard for Sean.
Cavanagh getting it big time on rte now, no brolly to blame there now lads, its time to open your eyes!
Quote from: LeoMc on June 15, 2014, 11:03:09 PM
Quote from: Main Street on June 15, 2014, 10:58:37 PM
Quote from: Rois on June 15, 2014, 10:25:57 PM
Quote from: Maguire01 on June 15, 2014, 10:04:18 PM
Quote from: Jinxy on June 15, 2014, 07:32:07 PM
Quote from: sam03/05 on June 15, 2014, 05:26:14 PM
2 mins injury time???????????????????????????????
How?
It makes you wonder, does anyone actually calculate how much time is lost to stoppages?
Or is it all just arbitrary, i.e. we didn't need an ambulance/fire engine on the pitch therefore 2 mins injury time will do.
In my years of going to matches, it's 1 or 2 minutes, unless there has been one significant stoppage. Far from accurate i'd imagine, but that's the way in generally rolls. If Morgan hadn't taken so long with the free, they'd probably have had another chance within the 2 minutes.
Some wear two watches and have a stopwatch for significant stoppages. (Benefit of having a father who assessed inter county refs). I admit I was surprised by only two minutes given the number of serious injuries to Monaghan players. I hope they're all ok. It made the second half rather boring.
It's crap getting beaten but no real lasting disappointment as we never at any stage deserved to win.
And this is probably a backhanded compliment, but my favourite parts of the game were the two occasions Clerkin tried the shoulder tackle he's usually an expert at and ended up on his ass (once against Cavanagh).
Also - the goal scorer was pretty trampish when his goal celebration consisted of him running straight over to Peter Harte and roaring in his face (which the ref scolded him for).
(I never see the bad stuff Tyrone get up to but enough people on here do, so I just thought I'd point this one out for a bit of balance)
Monaghan look well organised and I have no doubts they'll be around for the business end.
That didn't look good but we are not aware of what Peter (trampishly) did to deserve that special attention.
Are you or are you just insinuating and throwing the T word in there?
I am just repeating the trampish word used by Rois.
I didn't realise it was such an offensive word - sorry. I meant really unsportsmanlike so if it means anything other than that, I really am sorry and obviously too naive to be trying to use the description of behaviour.
I didn't notice what Peter Harte did to warrant it but Main Street must have seen something which might justify it. But he'll blame Peter Harte for his player's unsightly behaviour and me for him using the word that needs stars...hmmm...
As I said, I'm blind to Tyrone faults, but plenty on here aren't (nor from the Sunday Game are RTE, why in god's name they went to a Tyrone v Meath game to pick up a time wasting point when on both occasions Meath had the ball I just don't know!).
The meath thing was a bit odd. It was like a dig at tyrone. Don't get me wrong i think they're right however it was like they were trying to rub harte's nose in it. Maybe a bit of payback for no interviews.
Hopefully RTE take their key analyst Tommy Carr to task then. He thought the Hughes incident was a blatant black card. After multiple replays he decided that Hughes "took one for the team" yet later his colleagues decide that Sean dived. I didn't see the Sunday Game but did they highlight how easily the lad went over for the penalty?
Tyrone are on the ground, beaten, there are 3 million in the queue to stick the boot in.
I wonder why? :D
Quote from: BennyHarp on June 15, 2014, 11:28:16 PM
Hopefully RTE take their key analyst Tommy Carr to task then. He thought the Hughes incident was a blatant black card. After multiple replays he decided that Hughes "took one for the team" yet later his colleagues decide that Sean dived. I didn't see the Sunday Game but did they highlight how easily the lad went over for the penalty?
Clutching at straws.
Ah a bit rough digging up footage from last years game versus Meath. But the reality is that if you are going to throw stones..... Like us all we have a good laugh when we do a bitta cute hoarism to win a match be it time wasting or fouling to win a game but we are not too happy when we are on the other side of the coin.
Quote from: GrandMasterFlash on May 25, 2014, 12:23:31 PM
Now... This'll not be handy, especially with McManus out, I mean who will the oscar nominated Sean Cavanagh pull to the floor now?
That'll be Darren Hughes then.
Quote from: Rois on June 15, 2014, 11:20:34 PM
I didn't realise it was such an offensive word - sorry. I meant really unsportsmanlike so if it means anything other than that, I really am sorry and obviously too naive to be trying to use the description of behaviour.
I didn't notice what Peter Harte did to warrant it but Main Street must have seen something which might justify it. But he'll blame Peter Harte for his player's unsightly behaviour and me for him using the word that needs stars...hmmm...
As I said, I'm blind to Tyrone faults, but plenty on here aren't (nor from the Sunday Game are RTE, why in god's name they went to a Tyrone v Meath game to pick up a time wasting point when on both occasions Meath had the ball I just don't know!).
I didn't see what Harte did but I would ask the Q why was he singled out by Malone. I would presume something had happened previously between them.
On the surface, Malone was unsporting, but you were way out line calling his action trampish.
The Meath thing was Tyrone time wasting by fouling and stopping Meath from getting a goal. I'm sure there are umpteen clips you could get of that.
I'd personally like to see a Sean Cavanagh diving video... It'd be a long watch in fairness!
PS. The last free was a fair enough call but Cavanagh shouldn't have been omn the field to win it as the ref bailed out on giving him a black card which was nailed on!
Quote from: Maguire01 on June 15, 2014, 11:31:48 PM
Quote from: BennyHarp on June 15, 2014, 11:28:16 PM
Hopefully RTE take their key analyst Tommy Carr to task then. He thought the Hughes incident was a blatant black card. After multiple replays he decided that Hughes "took one for the team" yet later his colleagues decide that Sean dived. I didn't see the Sunday Game but did they highlight how easily the lad went over for the penalty?
Clutching at straws.
It really is. I don't see how you can compare a penalty being given after clear contact with a player pulling another down with him to win a free. If your main defence is quoting Tommy Carr then it's not a very strong one to be fair.
Quote from: Main Street on June 15, 2014, 11:35:56 PM
On the surface, Malone was unsporting, but you were way out line calling his action trampish.
I have changed it as never meant to cause that much offence- seriously, please someone PM me what this word really means!
Quote from: Schkite on June 15, 2014, 11:39:43 PM
Quote from: Maguire01 on June 15, 2014, 11:31:48 PM
Quote from: BennyHarp on June 15, 2014, 11:28:16 PM
Hopefully RTE take their key analyst Tommy Carr to task then. He thought the Hughes incident was a blatant black card. After multiple replays he decided that Hughes "took one for the team" yet later his colleagues decide that Sean dived. I didn't see the Sunday Game but did they highlight how easily the lad went over for the penalty?
Clutching at straws.
It really is. I don't see how you can compare a penalty being given after clear contact with a player pulling another down with him to win a free. If your main defence is quoting Tommy Carr then it's not a very strong one to be fair.
I think the lad went down very easily - is that not a dive to achieve an advantage? There was clear contact between Hughes and Cavanagh. Why was Hughes' arm over the top of Sean's shoulder? My quote of Tommy Carr is more a dig at the analysis on RTE. They have experts looking at the same incident and they arrive at completely polar apart conclusions.
Sad to see hartes reign coming to an end in this manner. At odds with rte, at odds with referees, officialdom... He's at odds with many of his own supporters as well.
Defenders arms will generally go over the top of cavanagh's shoulder as he lowers himself going into the tackle to draw fouls... Did it quite a few times today.
Quote from: BennyHarp on June 15, 2014, 11:50:36 PM
Quote from: Schkite on June 15, 2014, 11:39:43 PM
Quote from: Maguire01 on June 15, 2014, 11:31:48 PM
Quote from: BennyHarp on June 15, 2014, 11:28:16 PM
Hopefully RTE take their key analyst Tommy Carr to task then. He thought the Hughes incident was a blatant black card. After multiple replays he decided that Hughes "took one for the team" yet later his colleagues decide that Sean dived. I didn't see the Sunday Game but did they highlight how easily the lad went over for the penalty?
Clutching at straws.
It really is. I don't see how you can compare a penalty being given after clear contact with a player pulling another down with him to win a free. If your main defence is quoting Tommy Carr then it's not a very strong one to be fair.
I think the lad went down very easily - is that not a dive to achieve an advantage? There was clear contact between Hughes and Cavanagh. Why was Hughes' arm over the top of Sean's shoulder? My quote of Tommy Carr is more a dig at the analysis on RTE. They have experts looking at the same incident and they arrive at completely polar apart conclusions.
Crucially, the "experts" who had time to view the incident several times - and that's both Brolly and Spillane, and O'Se and Whelan - all reached the same conclusion.
And I haven't heard ANYONE else question the penalty decision.
Quote from: BennyHarp on June 15, 2014, 11:50:36 PM
Quote from: Schkite on June 15, 2014, 11:39:43 PM
Quote from: Maguire01 on June 15, 2014, 11:31:48 PM
Quote from: BennyHarp on June 15, 2014, 11:28:16 PM
Hopefully RTE take their key analyst Tommy Carr to task then. He thought the Hughes incident was a blatant black card. After multiple replays he decided that Hughes "took one for the team" yet later his colleagues decide that Sean dived. I didn't see the Sunday Game but did they highlight how easily the lad went over for the penalty?
Clutching at straws.
It really is. I don't see how you can compare a penalty being given after clear contact with a player pulling another down with him to win a free. If your main defence is quoting Tommy Carr then it's not a very strong one to be fair.
I think the lad went down very easily - is that not a dive to achieve an advantage? There was clear contact between Hughes and Cavanagh. Why was Hughes' arm over the top of Sean's shoulder? My quote of Tommy Carr is more a dig at the analysis on RTE. They have experts looking at the same incident and they arrive at completely polar apart conclusions.
There's definitely a difference between Cavanagh pulling Hughes's arm into him to look like he was dragged down when he wasn't, and Dessie coming into the penalty box at pace with a Tyrone defender running into him. If you think he went down easy then that's your opinion, but there's been no other complaints on that as far as I can see.
Regarding Tommy Carr, yeah they look at the same incident and came to different conclusions, but the lads in the studio have the benefit of time and replays to look over to decide exactly what happened. Mind you in this instance I thought the very first replay showed it clearly, maybe Carr didn't want to change his mind after initially saying it was a foul, or he could just be blind.
Quote from: God14 on June 15, 2014, 11:53:00 PM
Sad to see hartes reign coming to an end in this manner. At odds with rte, at odds with referees, officialdom... He's at odds with many of his own supporters as well.
Quote
In Irish News tmro: @TyroneGAALive manager Mickey Harte refused to speak to the media after the Red Hands' Ulster SFC semi-final defeat
Not good enough again by Tyrone when facing a side who are real contenders. Years now since Tyrone defeated a serious side and that's simply because the post-08 generation don't have that mentality.
Thought McCurry showed well despite the hospital passes. Sean dragged Tyrone back into contention but Tyrone seem to depend on that scenario a lot these last 2 years.
McManus wasn't fit but his free taking was first class. Good decision to play him.
Where do Tyrone go from here? Is Mickey getting the best out of a mediocre bunch? Possibly.
Monaghan won not playing well. They're easier on the eye than Donegal.
Harte's mask slipped today in some style!
Quote from: Rois on June 15, 2014, 11:47:57 PM
Quote from: Main Street on June 15, 2014, 11:35:56 PM
On the surface, Malone was unsporting, but you were way out line calling his action trampish.
I have changed it as never meant to cause that much offence- seriously, please someone PM me what this word really means!
It's hardly that offensive! Someone is being a bit too sensitive.
I wouldn't be worrying about it Rois.
Quote from: Maguire01 on June 15, 2014, 11:56:10 PM
Quote from: BennyHarp on June 15, 2014, 11:50:36 PM
Quote from: Schkite on June 15, 2014, 11:39:43 PM
Quote from: Maguire01 on June 15, 2014, 11:31:48 PM
Quote from: BennyHarp on June 15, 2014, 11:28:16 PM
Hopefully RTE take their key analyst Tommy Carr to task then. He thought the Hughes incident was a blatant black card. After multiple replays he decided that Hughes "took one for the team" yet later his colleagues decide that Sean dived. I didn't see the Sunday Game but did they highlight how easily the lad went over for the penalty?
Clutching at straws.
It really is. I don't see how you can compare a penalty being given after clear contact with a player pulling another down with him to win a free. If your main defence is quoting Tommy Carr then it's not a very strong one to be fair.
I think the lad went down very easily - is that not a dive to achieve an advantage? There was clear contact between Hughes and Cavanagh. Why was Hughes' arm over the top of Sean's shoulder? My quote of Tommy Carr is more a dig at the analysis on RTE. They have experts looking at the same incident and they arrive at completely polar apart conclusions.
Crucially, the "experts" who had time to view the incident several times - and that's both Brolly and Spillane, and O'Se and Whelan - all reached the same conclusion.
And I haven't heard ANYONE else question the penalty decision.
Maguire the penalty decision was a farce. A textbook dive. A fair and legal tackle went in and he dropped like a stone. The reason no fuss had been made about that is firstly, because it wasn't scored, and secondly because Joe Brolly never mentioned it and if the last few pages of this thread (and several other threads) shows, most lads desperately need Joe to tell them what to think and then they'll blindly repeat him ad nauseum.
Quote from: Maguire01 on June 15, 2014, 09:46:36 PM
Quote from: kickingmule on June 15, 2014, 09:28:54 PM
Quote from: Captain Obvious on June 15, 2014, 03:45:14 PM
Monaghan about six points the better team yet they almost allowed Tyrone to grab undeserved draw.
They scored 1.4 from open play!!!! Tyrone scored 0.9 so where are you getting the six points from?
Monaghan deserved to win with a point to spare.
Very little between these teams.
Monaghan missed at least 2 clear goal chances - Tyrone didn't get a sniff at goal all day.
exactly wasn't a one point game as the scoreboard suggests.
Quote from: Agent Orange on June 15, 2014, 03:46:03 PM
Tramps nearly came back from the dead, they looked dead and buried. It will be the graveyard that is the back door for Hartes deadly divers. Doubt there will be a resurrection.
I bet you're dead proud of that post.
Now away back with ye to the graveyard they dug you up from.
Quote from: Maguire01 on June 15, 2014, 11:58:52 PM
Quote from: God14 on June 15, 2014, 11:53:00 PM
Sad to see hartes reign coming to an end in this manner. At odds with rte, at odds with referees, officialdom... He's at odds with many of his own supporters as well.
Quote
In Irish News tmro: @TyroneGAALive manager Mickey Harte refused to speak to the media after the Red Hands' Ulster SFC semi-final defeat
Maybe that's because they didn't play in the semi-final. Your mistake or theirs?
Quote from: Schkite on June 15, 2014, 11:58:20 PM
Quote from: BennyHarp on June 15, 2014, 11:50:36 PM
Quote from: Schkite on June 15, 2014, 11:39:43 PM
Quote from: Maguire01 on June 15, 2014, 11:31:48 PM
Quote from: BennyHarp on June 15, 2014, 11:28:16 PM
Hopefully RTE take their key analyst Tommy Carr to task then. He thought the Hughes incident was a blatant black card. After multiple replays he decided that Hughes "took one for the team" yet later his colleagues decide that Sean dived. I didn't see the Sunday Game but did they highlight how easily the lad went over for the penalty?
Clutching at straws.
It really is. I don't see how you can compare a penalty being given after clear contact with a player pulling another down with him to win a free. If your main defence is quoting Tommy Carr then it's not a very strong one to be fair.
I think the lad went down very easily - is that not a dive to achieve an advantage? There was clear contact between Hughes and Cavanagh. Why was Hughes' arm over the top of Sean's shoulder? My quote of Tommy Carr is more a dig at the analysis on RTE. They have experts looking at the same incident and they arrive at completely polar apart conclusions.
There's definitely a difference between Cavanagh pulling Hughes's arm into him to look like he was dragged down when he wasn't, and Dessie coming into the penalty box at pace with a Tyrone defender running into him. If you think he went down easy then that's your opinion, but there's been no other complaints on that as far as I can see.
Regarding Tommy Carr, yeah they look at the same incident and came to different conclusions, but the lads in the studio have the benefit of time and replays to look over to decide exactly what happened. Mind you in this instance I thought the very first replay showed it clearly, maybe Carr didn't want to change his mind after initially saying it was a foul, or he could just be blind.
The penalty incident had no more contact than the Hughes one but that player doesn't have the profile to make it interesting.
Quote from: Nally Stand on June 16, 2014, 12:04:03 AM
Quote from: Maguire01 on June 15, 2014, 11:56:10 PM
Quote from: BennyHarp on June 15, 2014, 11:50:36 PM
Quote from: Schkite on June 15, 2014, 11:39:43 PM
Quote from: Maguire01 on June 15, 2014, 11:31:48 PM
Quote from: BennyHarp on June 15, 2014, 11:28:16 PM
Hopefully RTE take their key analyst Tommy Carr to task then. He thought the Hughes incident was a blatant black card. After multiple replays he decided that Hughes "took one for the team" yet later his colleagues decide that Sean dived. I didn't see the Sunday Game but did they highlight how easily the lad went over for the penalty?
Clutching at straws.
It really is. I don't see how you can compare a penalty being given after clear contact with a player pulling another down with him to win a free. If your main defence is quoting Tommy Carr then it's not a very strong one to be fair.
I think the lad went down very easily - is that not a dive to achieve an advantage? There was clear contact between Hughes and Cavanagh. Why was Hughes' arm over the top of Sean's shoulder? My quote of Tommy Carr is more a dig at the analysis on RTE. They have experts looking at the same incident and they arrive at completely polar apart conclusions.
Crucially, the "experts" who had time to view the incident several times - and that's both Brolly and Spillane, and O'Se and Whelan - all reached the same conclusion.
And I haven't heard ANYONE else question the penalty decision.
Maguire the penalty decision was a farce. A textbook dive. A fair and legal tackle went in and he dropped like a stone. The reason no fuss had been made about that is firstly, because it wasn't scored, and secondly because Joe Brolly never mentioned it and if the last few pages of this thread (and several other threads) shows, most lads desperately need Joe to tell them what to think and then they'll blindly repeat him ad nauseum.
If you think. I saw it as a clumsy tackle in the goal mouth. Was it a clean shoulder to shoulder charge?
Either way, it's academic.
Quote from: never kickt a ball on June 16, 2014, 12:07:43 AM
Quote from: Maguire01 on June 15, 2014, 11:58:52 PM
Quote from: God14 on June 15, 2014, 11:53:00 PM
Sad to see hartes reign coming to an end in this manner. At odds with rte, at odds with referees, officialdom... He's at odds with many of his own supporters as well.
Quote
In Irish News tmro: @TyroneGAALive manager Mickey Harte refused to speak to the media after the Red Hands' Ulster SFC semi-final defeat
Maybe that's because they didn't play in the semi-final. Your mistake or theirs?
It's a copy and paste.
Quote from: BennyHarp on June 16, 2014, 12:09:19 AM
Quote from: Schkite on June 15, 2014, 11:58:20 PM
Quote from: BennyHarp on June 15, 2014, 11:50:36 PM
Quote from: Schkite on June 15, 2014, 11:39:43 PM
Quote from: Maguire01 on June 15, 2014, 11:31:48 PM
Quote from: BennyHarp on June 15, 2014, 11:28:16 PM
Hopefully RTE take their key analyst Tommy Carr to task then. He thought the Hughes incident was a blatant black card. After multiple replays he decided that Hughes "took one for the team" yet later his colleagues decide that Sean dived. I didn't see the Sunday Game but did they highlight how easily the lad went over for the penalty?
Clutching at straws.
It really is. I don't see how you can compare a penalty being given after clear contact with a player pulling another down with him to win a free. If your main defence is quoting Tommy Carr then it's not a very strong one to be fair.
I think the lad went down very easily - is that not a dive to achieve an advantage? There was clear contact between Hughes and Cavanagh. Why was Hughes' arm over the top of Sean's shoulder? My quote of Tommy Carr is more a dig at the analysis on RTE. They have experts looking at the same incident and they arrive at completely polar apart conclusions.
There's definitely a difference between Cavanagh pulling Hughes's arm into him to look like he was dragged down when he wasn't, and Dessie coming into the penalty box at pace with a Tyrone defender running into him. If you think he went down easy then that's your opinion, but there's been no other complaints on that as far as I can see.
Regarding Tommy Carr, yeah they look at the same incident and came to different conclusions, but the lads in the studio have the benefit of time and replays to look over to decide exactly what happened. Mind you in this instance I thought the very first replay showed it clearly, maybe Carr didn't want to change his mind after initially saying it was a foul, or he could just be blind.
The penalty incident had no more contact than the Hughes one but that player doesn't have the profile to make it interesting.
Ah there's no point in arguing with some lads, using the penalty decision to deflect away from Cavanagh diving yet again is incredible. Good luck to ye.
Quote from: Maguire01 on June 16, 2014, 12:12:48 AM
Quote from: never kickt a ball on June 16, 2014, 12:07:43 AM
Quote from: Maguire01 on June 15, 2014, 11:58:52 PM
Quote from: God14 on June 15, 2014, 11:53:00 PM
Sad to see hartes reign coming to an end in this manner. At odds with rte, at odds with referees, officialdom... He's at odds with many of his own supporters as well.
Quote
In Irish News tmro: @TyroneGAALive manager Mickey Harte refused to speak to the media after the Red Hands' Ulster SFC semi-final defeat
Maybe that's because they didn't play in the semi-final. Your mistake or theirs?
It's a copy and paste.
Ah so you have to assume they have written that with so much glee they forgot to check the accuracy of the tweet.
Good luck to Monaghan in the semi final.
Monaghan have an excellent team on the pitch and an excellent management team off it. Well done to them. They work hard and have serious talent in a lot of positions. I can't see Armagh beating them and Donegal won't be looking forward to meeting them if Monaghan make the Ulster final.
Mc Manus will be better prepared the next day out.
Quote from: orangeman on June 16, 2014, 12:39:49 AM
Monaghan have an excellent team on the pitch and an excellent management team off it. Well done to them. They work hard and have serious talent in a lot of positions. I can't see Armagh beating them and Donegal won't be looking forward to meeting them if Monaghan make the Ulster final.
Mc Manus will be better prepared the next day out.
I agree. Congratulations to them, I hope they can take to the next level and become genuine All Ireland contenders this year.
I don't want to go over ground that probably has been covered earlier but why was Mickey Harte so particularly incensed today at the referee ? He normally doesn't have a go like the way he reacted today. RTE are rubbing it into Tyrone every chance they get. And Joe is making hay.
Quote from: orangeman on June 16, 2014, 12:52:45 AM
I don't want to go over ground that probably has been covered earlier but why was Mickey Harte so particularly incensed today at the referee ? He normally doesn't have a go like the way he reacted today. RTE are rubbing it into Tyrone every chance they get. And Joe is making hay.
Darren Hughes did 'run into' Gavin Devlin on his way onto the field at the end of the game. Might have got Harte's blood up prior to confronting the referee.
Mickey might be better concentrating on some of his own decision making on the sideline because it was far from faultless!
Quote from: orangeman on June 16, 2014, 12:39:49 AM
Monaghan have an excellent team on the pitch and an excellent management team off it. Well done to them. They work hard and have serious talent in a lot of positions. I can't see Armagh beating them and Donegal won't be looking forward to meeting them if Monaghan make the Ulster final.
Mc Manus will be better prepared the next day out.
I wouldn't write off the Orangemen yet Orangeman.
Most of the more reasonable Tyrone posters on here have been big enough to congratulate Monaghan and wish them well going forward. We have no complaints about being beaten by the better team ion the day.
We do have legitimate gripes about the timekeeping issue but are not using these this as an excuse.
It's a little disappointing therefore to see a lot of Monaghan posters be so ungracious in victory.
The fact we were only beaten by a point in the end and had our chance to draw says we have something about us. We are not contenders but we will make a difficult game for anyone.
Our key concerns are the uncertainty in team selection and lack of plan a never mind plan b. I would like to see Coney etc get 4-5 games starting to show what he can do rather than this constant chopping and changing.
Harte has been able to figure this out before I hope he does so again.
Fair play to Monaghan yesterday, definitely deserved winners. We were poor all over the field and never got going at all. It's really worrying that four years in a row we've faced a full on blanket defence (Donegal x 3 and yesterday) and still look completely clueless. How many times did we hoof it striaght up to the semi circle towards Mc Curry, RoN/SoN after ponderous build up then got swallowed up and turned over? We rarely attacked tge space down the channels or pulled men out to the wings and hit them with early direct ball.
Couple of other points:
Sad to see SoN being so ineffectual, he was beat in 80% of challenges and his foot passing was very poor. Am I correct in thinking he didn't have one shot at all today?
Somen Tyrone lads would need to take their heads out of the sand. Sean's arm grabbing has been going on for years and has has served him well. Was going to be a time when he would be hammered for it. Sean has a very prominent position in the GAA (a lot of which is self created) so we have to accept that he will be scrutinised much closer than tbe average Joe. However, to all those who are baying for his blood, could you please comment on the equal (if not worse) behaviour of Dessie Mone who usdd the exact same arm drag a number of times as well as hitting the dirt like a sack of sh*te when the draft of a Ciaran McGinley wind hit him in the back during the first half.
Quote from: ONeill on June 16, 2014, 12:01:48 AM
Sean dragged Tyrone back into contention but Tyrone seem to depend on that scenario a lot these last 2 years.
Not the only dragging he's done in the last two years in fairness..
Quote from: Nally Stand on June 16, 2014, 12:04:03 AM
Quote from: Maguire01 on June 15, 2014, 11:56:10 PM
Quote from: BennyHarp on June 15, 2014, 11:50:36 PM
Quote from: Schkite on June 15, 2014, 11:39:43 PM
Quote from: Maguire01 on June 15, 2014, 11:31:48 PM
Quote from: BennyHarp on June 15, 2014, 11:28:16 PM
Hopefully RTE take their key analyst Tommy Carr to task then. He thought the Hughes incident was a blatant black card. After multiple replays he decided that Hughes "took one for the team" yet later his colleagues decide that Sean dived. I didn't see the Sunday Game but did they highlight how easily the lad went over for the penalty?
Clutching at straws.
It really is. I don't see how you can compare a penalty being given after clear contact with a player pulling another down with him to win a free. If your main defence is quoting Tommy Carr then it's not a very strong one to be fair.
I think the lad went down very easily - is that not a dive to achieve an advantage? There was clear contact between Hughes and Cavanagh. Why was Hughes' arm over the top of Sean's shoulder? My quote of Tommy Carr is more a dig at the analysis on RTE. They have experts looking at the same incident and they arrive at completely polar apart conclusions.
Crucially, the "experts" who had time to view the incident several times - and that's both Brolly and Spillane, and O'Se and Whelan - all reached the same conclusion.
And I haven't heard ANYONE else question the penalty decision.
Maguire the penalty decision was a farce. A textbook dive. A fair and legal tackle went in and he dropped like a stone. The reason no fuss had been made about that is firstly, because it wasn't scored, and secondly because Joe Brolly never mentioned it and if the last few pages of this thread (and several other threads) shows, most lads desperately need Joe to tell them what to think and then they'll blindly repeat him ad nauseum.
You clearly don't know how Joe Brolly is perceived in Monaghan with a comment like that. :o
You are being completely biased, which is understandable, but it was a stonewall penalty. As to whether is was deliberate/intentional/clumsy/accidental (i.e. a black or yellow) is debatable within the confusion surrounding the application of cards, but it was definitely a penalty.
Quote from: omagh_gael on June 16, 2014, 07:33:25 AM
Fair play to Monaghan yesterday, definitely deserved winners. We were poor all over the field and never got going at all. It's really worrying that four years in a row we've faced a full on blanket defence (Donegal x 3 and yesterday) and still look completely clueless. How many times did we hoof it striaght up to the semi circle towards Mc Curry, RoN/SoN after ponderous build up then got swallowed up and turned over? We rarely attacked tge space down the channels or pulled men out to the wings and hit them with early direct ball.
Couple of other points:
Sad to see SoN being so ineffectual, he was beat in 80% of challenges and his foot passing was very poor. Am I correct in thinking he didn't have one shot at all today?
Somen Tyrone lads would need to take their heads out of the sand. Sean's arm grabbing has been going on for years and has has served him well. Was going to be a time when he would be hammered for it. Sean has a very prominent position in the GAA (a lot of which is self created) so we have to accept that he will be scrutinised much closer than tbe average Joe. However, to all those who are baying for his blood, could you please comment on the equal (if not worse) behaviour of Dessie Mone who usdd the exact same arm drag a number of times as well as hitting the dirt like a sack of sh*te when the draft of a Ciaran McGinley wind hit him in the back during the first half.
Dessie Mone out Cavanagh'd Cavanagh at one point by not going down from a foul in a non scoring position to going down from a non foul in a scoring position(both from Cavanagh). Cavanagh was livid.
Agree with most of my fellow Tyrone posters on here, and I've been saying it for a number of seasons, but I think it's time for change at the top. The football we are playing is far from pleasing on the eye, and would be acceptable, bar the fact it's also very ineffectual.
A few weeks ago, when the Tyrone Co Board announced Club Championship fixtures, there was 6 or 7 of the County panel who expressed their anger on social media. I feel that behind the scenes there appears to be a lack of unity between the players, the CB, Harte and the Clubs. In fact I don't fell it's that far behind the scenes.
At the minute you don't get this over arching feeling that we're all in this together and this is very reflective on the chemistry on the field.
The easy thing for me to say, is that we need a change of management, however I am aware that there are probably not too many alternates out there. One of the obvious candidates for me though was on the opposition bench yesterday.
Quote from: orangeman on June 16, 2014, 12:52:45 AM
I don't want to go over ground that probably has been covered earlier but why was Mickey Harte so particularly incensed today at the referee ? He normally doesn't have a go like the way he reacted today. RTE are rubbing it into Tyrone every chance they get. And Joe is making hay.
The lack of injury time seemed to be his main gripe and, to be honest, I've some sympathy there.
Quote from: Norf Tyrone on June 16, 2014, 09:23:16 AM
Agree with most of my fellow Tyrone posters on here, and I've been saying it for a number of seasons, but I think it's time for change at the top. The football we are playing is far from pleasing on the eye, and would be acceptable, bar the fact it's also very ineffectual.
A few weeks ago, when the Tyrone Co Board announced Club Championship fixtures, there was 6 or 7 of the County panel who expressed their anger on social media. I feel that behind the scenes there appears to be a lack of unity between the players, the CB, Harte and the Clubs. In fact I don't fell it's that far behind the scenes.
At the minute you don't get this over arching feeling that we're all in this together and this is very reflective on the chemistry on the field.
The easy thing for me to say, is that we need a change of management, however I am aware that there are probably not too many alternates out there. One of the obvious candidates for me though was on the opposition bench yesterday.
the problem is that there are no suitable candidates within tyrone and the county board will never go for an outside manager.
it's a very conservative attitude to have and will prove quite costly in the long run.
All week, I was wondering what selection surprise O'Rourke would have in store. I had hoped that Ryan Wylie would start in place of Kieran Duffy, but I never expected both to play, with Duffy as a sweeper. McManus starting wasn't really that much of a surprise. O'Rourke has, during his tenure as manager, got the vast majority of his tactical decisions right and he got this match ups and selections right for the most part. I wasn't sure if Dick would hold his discipline for the whole match, but credit to him, he did and the team benefited hugely from it. Holding Lennon in reserve was the right decision, though I think the Armagh game will be tailor made to start Lennon rather than Clerkin. Handing three lads (McKenna, R Wylie and Boyle) their championship debuts against Tyrone, of all teams, was risky but O'Rourke has shown he's not afraid to make the big calls.
A great result, if not a great performance It was good in some aspects, but lacking in others. Monaghan will need to improve on lots of areas of their play ahead of the Armagh game. I'm well sure O'Rourke will be aware of their failings and will be drilling the squad in addressing them
Quote from: Norf Tyrone on June 16, 2014, 09:23:16 AM
One of the obvious candidates for me though was on the opposition bench yesterday.
MOR? What about PTG?
Quote from: Sleater on June 16, 2014, 09:45:07 AM
All week, I was wondering what selection surprise O'Rourke would have in store. I had hoped that Ryan Wylie would start in place of Kieran Duffy, but I never expected both to play, with Duffy as a sweeper. McManus starting wasn't really that much of a surprise. O'Rourke has, during his tenure as manager, got the vast majority of his tactical decisions right and he got this match ups and selections right for the most part. I wasn't sure if Dick would hold his discipline for the whole match, but credit to him, he did and the team benefited hugely from it. Holding Lennon in reserve was the right decision, though I think the Armagh game will be tailor made to start Lennon rather than Clerkin. Handing three lads (McKenna, R Wylie and Boyle) their championship debuts against Tyrone, of all teams, was risky but O'Rourke has shown he's not afraid to make the big calls.
A great result, if not a great performance It was good in some aspects, but lacking in others. Monaghan will need to improve on lots of areas of their play ahead of the Armagh game. I'm well sure O'Rourke will be aware of their failings and will be drilling the squad in addressing them
That's a good summary.
Monaghan have plenty of room to improve and I don't doubt they will. I think it was important that Monaghan got their noses ahead during the later stages of the first half and could build on this. Tyrone a good team to hold a lead and make it hard for teams to get scores.
In the opening exchanges Monaghan seemed off the pace and their passing was slow and often misplaced. Once they got to grips with the pace of the game, they were the better team.
Whatever about Cavanagh pulling Hughes down or Dessie Mone doing the same, I thought Cavanagh had 3 very clear fouls in the first half alone that went un noted by the ref. I'm near certain that the ticking is still in place but ref never bothered with that. He was eventually booked late on but I was surprised he didn't bit a card up earlier.
Quote from: GrandMasterFlash on June 16, 2014, 09:54:24 AM
Quote from: Norf Tyrone on June 16, 2014, 09:23:16 AM
One of the obvious candidates for me though was on the opposition bench yesterday.
MOR? What about PTG?
Meh. Peter to me lacks a bit of charisma based on his punditry levels, and he hardly inspired at Fermanagh.
Congratulations to Monaghan - they fully deserved the win and should have won by more. It's a pity they didn't because the Tyrone management/players will still believe that all it needs is one more heave to get them over the line. There are 3 major problems with this Tyrone team.
1. Style of play
2. Unsettled team
3. Some players not putting in the required effort on the pitch
We have continued with the running game for the last 4 years and every time we have come up against a strong defence we have wilted. It's an indictment of our play that the only long direct ball that came into McCurry was from Morgan on one of his forays. Both McCurry and McAliskey are turn and shoot footballers so need fast ball coming in.
As somebody said earlier we've had 15 games this year and still don't know what the best team is. The selection for the opening Down match should be a wake up call for the County board. You spend 12 matches trying something new and then come the first big match you go back to what has failed for the last 4 years. Granted I think the defence put a great shift in yesterday and definitely have a more solid look about it but god knows how our forward line is going to line out in the next fortnight. I'd imagine the tinkering will be Mattie Donnelly to full forward with Gormley back to CHB.
As for effort there are some players just happy to wear the red hand and not give everything to the jersey. I don't get angry with a player not playing well but I can't stand it if the work rate is not their. Half way thru the second half when Monaghan were 5 points up the monaghan defence won a ball and started coming out. 2 tyrone players tracked their men until about 60 yards out and then just stopped. The monaghan players kept running forward with nobody with them. I honestly couldn't believe that I saw it.
All 3 issues are an indictment of the current management. I honestly believe that Mickey needs a rest and the players need a new face. We'll probably end up with a worse manager but I think a change is needed
Quote from: clarshack on June 16, 2014, 09:35:33 AM
Quote from: Norf Tyrone on June 16, 2014, 09:23:16 AM
Agree with most of my fellow Tyrone posters on here, and I've been saying it for a number of seasons, but I think it's time for change at the top. The football we are playing is far from pleasing on the eye, and would be acceptable, bar the fact it's also very ineffectual.
A few weeks ago, when the Tyrone Co Board announced Club Championship fixtures, there was 6 or 7 of the County panel who expressed their anger on social media. I feel that behind the scenes there appears to be a lack of unity between the players, the CB, Harte and the Clubs. In fact I don't fell it's that far behind the scenes.
At the minute you don't get this over arching feeling that we're all in this together and this is very reflective on the chemistry on the field.
The easy thing for me to say, is that we need a change of management, however I am aware that there are probably not too many alternates out there. One of the obvious candidates for me though was on the opposition bench yesterday.
the problem is that there are no suitable candidates within tyrone and the county board will never go for an outside manager.
it's a very conservative attitude to have and will prove quite costly in the long run.
John Donnelly from Fermanagh managed the county team. If the criteria is that the manager lives/works in the county the MOR would qualify ok
Great win yesterday for Monaghan. Nearly let it slip but luckily Tyrone missed the late free. Thought all the backs played well. Clerkin and Hughes did well in midfield and dispite some forwards not being up to scratch we just about got enough scores. Can't afford to miss as much in future games though.
Monaghan's 3 best players in order - Kelly, Wylie and Mone. Absolutely superb and willing to do the dirty work and all contributed going forward and linking defence to attack. Monaghan were maybe a 7/10 in that game overall and have vast room for improvement which can only be a good thing.
Tyrone battled well as they always do and have a fierce determination inbred in them but sadly for them quality was lacking. Their full forward line was so ineffective (bar McCurry) it's sad to see the decline of Stephen O'Neill who was once an absolutely superb player. Just doesn't have the legs therefore ball winning ability is lacking. Mickey got it wrong in a few areas I thought.
Donegal v Monaghan final I think.
Quote from: tc_manchester on June 16, 2014, 10:07:39 AM
Quote from: clarshack on June 16, 2014, 09:35:33 AM
Quote from: Norf Tyrone on June 16, 2014, 09:23:16 AM
Agree with most of my fellow Tyrone posters on here, and I've been saying it for a number of seasons, but I think it's time for change at the top. The football we are playing is far from pleasing on the eye, and would be acceptable, bar the fact it's also very ineffectual.
A few weeks ago, when the Tyrone Co Board announced Club Championship fixtures, there was 6 or 7 of the County panel who expressed their anger on social media. I feel that behind the scenes there appears to be a lack of unity between the players, the CB, Harte and the Clubs. In fact I don't fell it's that far behind the scenes.
At the minute you don't get this over arching feeling that we're all in this together and this is very reflective on the chemistry on the field.
The easy thing for me to say, is that we need a change of management, however I am aware that there are probably not too many alternates out there. One of the obvious candidates for me though was on the opposition bench yesterday.
the problem is that there are no suitable candidates within tyrone and the county board will never go for an outside manager.
it's a very conservative attitude to have and will prove quite costly in the long run.
John Donnelly from Fermanagh managed the county team. If the criteria is that the manager lives/works in the county the MOR would qualify ok
fair enough. MOR would be a good choice.
It's bad when we're getting sympathy from Jinxy. ;D
As I said last night congrats to Monaghan and ye should have won by far more.
Tyrone are definitely a second tier team now and will be unless we change a lot about ourselves which I can't see happening.
TBH, I thought Monaghan weren't great either but it was there first day out this year after weeks off. I think Hughes is a great forward and McManus will get a lot better now if he has no setbacks. besides them two though their forwards are nothing special and I would worry Donegal could beat ye if McFadden can get back to where he was.
I too was disappointed in their players and fans after the game but I suppose they have suffered a lot under us and so it was huge relief for them. Horse Devlin does annoy other teams players when he goes on sledging and shouldering lads and there is no need for it. Looks bad.
Where I was sitting Dessie Mone's whole family were in front of me including kids and lets just say they were far from gracious winners. They were booing our frees and clapping our wides whereas we were actually applauding when Monaghan kicked very good points the odd time.
I shook their hand at the end which I think they weren't too sure how to react but you could see the relief on their faces. They thought they'd blown it again so I can excuse their bad winning mentality
As I said earlier in the year I think Mickey has lost the run of himself and continues to make wrong calls. I am NOT calling for his head as we owe him a lot more than he owes us. To start my club mate Stevie and then to leave him in at FF for long periods just shows how he's lost his ruthlessness or lack of vision of how the game is going. Surely throwing big Sean, Mattie or even Joey in at 14 would have caused panic. Wylie played well and is a great player but he wasn't exactly challenged too often. The ball into the FF line was often poor and with Stephens now lack of pace it was food and drink for Wylie all day.
Mickey has become more and more frustrated I think the last few years. Not having the players he used to have. Not having enough leaders or players with the fight and balls to make it happen. Yes there should have been at least 5 mins injury time but Mickey 5-10 years ago would never have reacted like that and would have been taken defeat graciously. He said a few weeks ago that he wants to stay on for another few years and it's a great job he has so I am not expecting him to leave any time soon. I think for a lot of fans though we don't enjoy watching Tyrone play any more which is sad. Maybe the back door will allow the young lads develop and so he'll stop playing the older lads. Mattie Donnelly was immense yesterday and I would like to see McCurry getting better ball into him and I think McAliskey looked sharp.
I heard Coney was playing very well at MF for his club but I suppose it's very different to intercounty level
I enjoyed the day out yesterday and the craic in the car up and down. Yes I was disappointed but Monaghan deserved their win and God knows they've put up listening to us for long enough and being the bridesmaids. We met Banty in his pub after the game and the craic was great there.
I was however annoyed (AGAIN) with RTE TSG last night and this ever growing anti Tyrone feeling. I usually like Whelan but there was very much a biased attitude of "Devil rub it into them" and he even said what's good for the goose if good for the gander. That is not very balanced analysis imho and to be digging up video's from previous years to counter argue that the ref was justified to not add on more time was just childish.
Also I laughed at how many of ye on here said that the ref was right not to add on more time as Morgan was taking so long to take his frees. So does that mean then that if Tyrone were leading then you would change your tune and say he should add on 10 mins as Morgan was taking so long with his frees. I actually did laugh out loud when I read that.
Ahh well. I had a good father's day when I eventually got home.
(http://4.bp.blogspot.com/-dTNYQqo7Rl0/ULDs0Zg5nHI/AAAAAAAAAX4/lk_DW7m3PJE/s1600/goose.jpg)
Colm Keys' take on the game - http://www.independent.ie/sport/gaelic-games/gaelic-football/harte-fury-as-tyrone-edged-out-30356657.html
Did Tyrone foul that much in the first half in particular ?.
Harte's assistant Tony Donnelly suggested afterwards that his manager's ire was over the amount of time added on at the end and the fact that the end was signalled just after Tyrone had won a throw-in. Their belief was that play should have been allowed to continue.The free count against Tyrone was 26-17, 14-6 in the first half when they seemed to have a couple of 'stonewall' decisions from good positions go against them.
Quote from: GrandMasterFlash on June 16, 2014, 09:19:31 AM
Quote from: Nally Stand on June 16, 2014, 12:04:03 AM
Quote from: Maguire01 on June 15, 2014, 11:56:10 PM
Quote from: BennyHarp on June 15, 2014, 11:50:36 PM
Quote from: Schkite on June 15, 2014, 11:39:43 PM
Quote from: Maguire01 on June 15, 2014, 11:31:48 PM
Quote from: BennyHarp on June 15, 2014, 11:28:16 PM
Hopefully RTE take their key analyst Tommy Carr to task then. He thought the Hughes incident was a blatant black card. After multiple replays he decided that Hughes "took one for the team" yet later his colleagues decide that Sean dived. I didn't see the Sunday Game but did they highlight how easily the lad went over for the penalty?
Clutching at straws.
It really is. I don't see how you can compare a penalty being given after clear contact with a player pulling another down with him to win a free. If your main defence is quoting Tommy Carr then it's not a very strong one to be fair.
I think the lad went down very easily - is that not a dive to achieve an advantage? There was clear contact between Hughes and Cavanagh. Why was Hughes' arm over the top of Sean's shoulder? My quote of Tommy Carr is more a dig at the analysis on RTE. They have experts looking at the same incident and they arrive at completely polar apart conclusions.
Crucially, the "experts" who had time to view the incident several times - and that's both Brolly and Spillane, and O'Se and Whelan - all reached the same conclusion.
And I haven't heard ANYONE else question the penalty decision.
Maguire the penalty decision was a farce. A textbook dive. A fair and legal tackle went in and he dropped like a stone. The reason no fuss had been made about that is firstly, because it wasn't scored, and secondly because Joe Brolly never mentioned it and if the last few pages of this thread (and several other threads) shows, most lads desperately need Joe to tell them what to think and then they'll blindly repeat him ad nauseum.
You clearly don't know how Joe Brolly is perceived in Monaghan with a comment like that. :o
You are being completely biased, which is understandable, but it was a stonewall penalty. As to whether is was deliberate/intentional/clumsy/accidental (i.e. a black or yellow) is debatable within the confusion surrounding the application of cards, but it was definitely a penalty.
I'm not just talking about Monaghan folk. The threads from last two Tyrone games have been polluted by people endlessly rehashing whatever Joe Brolly told them to think. As for the penalty, it wasn't scored so not exactly vital, but I defy you to take another look at it and then still try to tell yourself it was a "stonewall penalty". The man dropped to the ground like a stone but that's as near as it got to "stonewall". But sure as I say, unless Joe Brolly says so too....
Quote from: Nally Stand on June 16, 2014, 11:25:28 AM
Quote from: GrandMasterFlash on June 16, 2014, 09:19:31 AM
Quote from: Nally Stand on June 16, 2014, 12:04:03 AM
Quote from: Maguire01 on June 15, 2014, 11:56:10 PM
Quote from: BennyHarp on June 15, 2014, 11:50:36 PM
Quote from: Schkite on June 15, 2014, 11:39:43 PM
Quote from: Maguire01 on June 15, 2014, 11:31:48 PM
Quote from: BennyHarp on June 15, 2014, 11:28:16 PM
Hopefully RTE take their key analyst Tommy Carr to task then. He thought the Hughes incident was a blatant black card. After multiple replays he decided that Hughes "took one for the team" yet later his colleagues decide that Sean dived. I didn't see the Sunday Game but did they highlight how easily the lad went over for the penalty?
Clutching at straws.
It really is. I don't see how you can compare a penalty being given after clear contact with a player pulling another down with him to win a free. If your main defence is quoting Tommy Carr then it's not a very strong one to be fair.
I think the lad went down very easily - is that not a dive to achieve an advantage? There was clear contact between Hughes and Cavanagh. Why was Hughes' arm over the top of Sean's shoulder? My quote of Tommy Carr is more a dig at the analysis on RTE. They have experts looking at the same incident and they arrive at completely polar apart conclusions.
Crucially, the "experts" who had time to view the incident several times - and that's both Brolly and Spillane, and O'Se and Whelan - all reached the same conclusion.
And I haven't heard ANYONE else question the penalty decision.
Maguire the penalty decision was a farce. A textbook dive. A fair and legal tackle went in and he dropped like a stone. The reason no fuss had been made about that is firstly, because it wasn't scored, and secondly because Joe Brolly never mentioned it and if the last few pages of this thread (and several other threads) shows, most lads desperately need Joe to tell them what to think and then they'll blindly repeat him ad nauseum.
You clearly don't know how Joe Brolly is perceived in Monaghan with a comment like that. :o
You are being completely biased, which is understandable, but it was a stonewall penalty. As to whether is was deliberate/intentional/clumsy/accidental (i.e. a black or yellow) is debatable within the confusion surrounding the application of cards, but it was definitely a penalty.
I'm not just talking about Monaghan folk. The threads from last two Tyrone games have been polluted by people endlessly rehashing whatever Joe Brolly told them to think. As for the penalty, it wasn't scored so not exactly vital, but I defy you to take another look at it and then still try to tell yourself it was a "stonewall penalty". The man dropped to the ground like a stone but that's as near as it got to "stonewall". But sure as I say, unless Joe Brolly says so too....
I'm one of the non-Monaghan folk and if you look at when I posted, it was before the end of the game, so I'm capable of forming an opinion without waiting for Brolly to do it for me.
The Cavanagh stuff doesn't have to come from Brolly. I don't listen to Brolly. Watched a bit of him last week and won't be watching again in a hurry. It's plain for everyone to see and it's getting worse by the year.
The Sunday game thing on time wasting was actually pathetic though. I do think there is an element of two fingers up to Tyrone for not engaging with RTE and it is weak. Whelan also let himself down with that.
Quote from: Fuzzman on June 16, 2014, 11:21:16 AM
It's bad when we're getting sympathy from Jinxy. ;D
As I said last night congrats to Monaghan and ye should have won by far more.
Tyrone are definitely a second tier team now and will be unless we change a lot about ourselves which I can't see happening.
TBH, I thought Monaghan weren't great either but it was there first day out this year after weeks off. I think Hughes is a great forward and McManus will get a lot better now if he has no setbacks. besides them two though their forwards are nothing special and I would worry Donegal could beat ye if McFadden can get back to where he was.
I too was disappointed in their players and fans after the game but I suppose they have suffered a lot under us and so it was huge relief for them. Horse Devlin does annoy other teams players when he goes on sledging and shouldering lads and there is no need for it. Looks bad.
Where I was sitting Dessie Mone's whole family were in front of me including kids and lets just say they were far from gracious winners. They were booing our frees and clapping our wides whereas we were actually applauding when Monaghan kicked very good points the odd time.
I shook their hand at the end which I think they weren't too sure how to react but you could see the relief on their faces. They thought they'd blown it again so I can excuse their bad winning mentality
As I said earlier in the year I think Mickey has lost the run of himself and continues to make wrong calls. I am NOT calling for his head as we owe him a lot more than he owes us. To start my club mate Stevie and then to leave him in at FF for long periods just shows how he's lost his ruthlessness or lack of vision of how the game is going. Surely throwing big Sean, Mattie or even Joey in at 14 would have caused panic. Wylie played well and is a great player but he wasn't exactly challenged too often. The ball into the FF line was often poor and with Stephens now lack of pace it was food and drink for Wylie all day.
Mickey has become more and more frustrated I think the last few years. Not having the players he used to have. Not having enough leaders or players with the fight and balls to make it happen. Yes there should have been at least 5 mins injury time but Mickey 5-10 years ago would never have reacted like that and would have been taken defeat graciously. He said a few weeks ago that he wants to stay on for another few years and it's a great job he has so I am not expecting him to leave any time soon. I think for a lot of fans though we don't enjoy watching Tyrone play any more which is sad. Maybe the back door will allow the young lads develop and so he'll stop playing the older lads. Mattie Donnelly was immense yesterday and I would like to see McCurry getting better ball into him and I think McAliskey looked sharp.
I heard Coney was playing very well at MF for his club but I suppose it's very different to intercounty level
I enjoyed the day out yesterday and the craic in the car up and down. Yes I was disappointed but Monaghan deserved their win and God knows they've put up listening to us for long enough and being the bridesmaids. We met Banty in his pub after the game and the craic was great there.
I was however annoyed (AGAIN) with RTE TSG last night and this ever growing anti Tyrone feeling. I usually like Whelan but there was very much a biased attitude of "Devil rub it into them" and he even said what's good for the goose if good for the gander. That is not very balanced analysis imho and to be digging up video's from previous years to counter argue that the ref was justified to not add on more time was just childish.
Also I laughed at how many of ye on here said that the ref was right not to add on more time as Morgan was taking so long to take his frees. So does that mean then that if Tyrone were leading then you would change your tune and say he should add on 10 mins as Morgan was taking so long with his frees. I actually did laugh out loud when I read that.
Ahh well. I had a good father's day when I eventually got home.
(http://4.bp.blogspot.com/-dTNYQqo7Rl0/ULDs0Zg5nHI/AAAAAAAAAX4/lk_DW7m3PJE/s1600/goose.jpg)
Thank you Fuzzman for your self-aggrandising account of your exemplary display of sportsmanship, in contrast to the heathens around you.
Just how you managed to stay above the pettiness of tribal rivalry (no doubt being on a high horse helped) and applaud the point scoring by the opposition was astonishing and by your own account just how you could look those heathens straight in the eye and congratulate them with an offered handshake after the game. Possibly they were a wee bit suspicious that they might be dragged to the ground. ;D
I don't know about the validity of just adding 2 minutes at the end, but rightly or wrongly this is how it is frustratingly done in most every game I have seen.
In context of most every other game in the GAA world, 2 minutes was appropriate.
Re the late free, Tyrone used up 1 minute missing that free knowing they only had 2 minutes. Tyrone gambled all on converting the free and leaving no time for Monaghan to get up the field and score a point.
Quote from: tc_manchester on June 16, 2014, 10:07:39 AM
Quote from: clarshack on June 16, 2014, 09:35:33 AM
Quote from: Norf Tyrone on June 16, 2014, 09:23:16 AM
Agree with most of my fellow Tyrone posters on here, and I've been saying it for a number of seasons, but I think it's time for change at the top. The football we are playing is far from pleasing on the eye, and would be acceptable, bar the fact it's also very ineffectual.
A few weeks ago, when the Tyrone Co Board announced Club Championship fixtures, there was 6 or 7 of the County panel who expressed their anger on social media. I feel that behind the scenes there appears to be a lack of unity between the players, the CB, Harte and the Clubs. In fact I don't fell it's that far behind the scenes.
At the minute you don't get this over arching feeling that we're all in this together and this is very reflective on the chemistry on the field.
The easy thing for me to say, is that we need a change of management, however I am aware that there are probably not too many alternates out there. One of the obvious candidates for me though was on the opposition bench yesterday.
the problem is that there are no suitable candidates within tyrone and the county board will never go for an outside manager.
it's a very conservative attitude to have and will prove quite costly in the long run.
John Donnelly from Fermanagh managed the county team. If the criteria is that the manager lives/works in the county the MOR would qualify ok
I suppose that was the similar position to John Donnelly, didn't he play for Trillick and managed the Clarkes at one point.
Quote from: Norf Tyrone on June 16, 2014, 10:04:25 AM
Quote from: GrandMasterFlash on June 16, 2014, 09:54:24 AM
Quote from: Norf Tyrone on June 16, 2014, 09:23:16 AM
One of the obvious candidates for me though was on the opposition bench yesterday.
MOR? What about PTG?
Meh. Peter to me lacks a bit of charisma based on his punditry levels, and he hardly inspired at Fermanagh.
Horse Devlin would be a good selection for next manager
There was a bit of agro at half time in Gerry Arthurs stand, not sure what sparked it but a Monaghan man seemed to lose the head badly with his Tyrone neighbours. He had a rant, made his way out of his seat then came back again. At this stage there was quite an audience.
Another Monaghan (MN2) got involved, started roaring the Tyrone man to 'mind his language, there are children sitting here'.
Another muttered comment from Tyrone man and MN2 shouts again, 'mind your language, there a f*cking children sitting here beside me'. Oh the irony!
Stewards kept an eye on them after half time but thankfully nothing happened after that.
(http://www.sportsfile.com/winshare/w540/Library/SF260/878052.jpg)
Conor Clarke in 'Christ the Redeemer' pose.
Quote from: sheamy on June 16, 2014, 12:05:54 PM
Conor Clarke in 'Christ the Redeemer' pose.
Hughes should have aimed for the redeemer's jewels.
i take it you are having a laugh about horse devlin?
Monaghan deserved winners yesterday even though a poor Tyrone performance could of snatched a late draw.
Cavanagh seems to be getting picked out a lot this last number of years possibly unfairly however bearing in mind I am a big fan of his footballing ability the fact he is being singled out doesn't really surprise me. IMO he's not one of the most likeable county players I have came across in my time. He would be awful whinger on the club scene and would have a trick or two up his sleeve in those games too. I just hope he tries to tone it down a bit from now to the end of his football career so he can be remembered for his sheer talent rather than anything negative.
Others have commented on put Matty D here and put him there to sort - I reckon his best position is 6 but the problem we really have is that we need about another 6/7 like him.
In fairness to Colm Cav - he took a lot of criticism in the early years but he is one of Tyrones most consistent performers.
Also I think Harte's time is up - heard from a good source that he's becoming more and more distant from the players - surely that's not a good sign!
Quote from: stalwart on June 16, 2014, 12:18:39 PM
i take it you are having a laugh about horse devlin?
No
I like watching the Monaghan full back line. Real hard, tight traditional defenders.
Hopefully with that red monkey off their back they'll throw off the shackles and become the Meath of 96/99 I think they resemble.
Quote from: sheamy on June 16, 2014, 12:05:54 PM
(http://www.sportsfile.com/winshare/w540/Library/SF260/878052.jpg)
Conor Clarke in 'Christ the Redeemer' pose.
Not much wrong - simply praying for intervention.
Stephen O'Neill was worse than ineffective. He failed to mark his man allowing him to score 2 points. Going forward he offered nothing. Either he should be dropped or moved to full-forward. To play him at full forward Tyrone would need to drop balls in on him and feed him with runners. Which would a total change of tactics.
But if Tyrone persist with the running game then they have to change their approach. When a Tyrone player has the ball inside the opponents half there is no one trying to run past him for a quick pass over the top. In stead they are running back behind him for an easy pass but one that just adds to the congestion and brings the ball into a worse location.
Mattie Donnelly would do it but he is a bit far back starting from CHB. Ideally Peter Harte should be bursting through to take the ball on the run. There are too many Tyrone players static or running parallel behind the man in possession when they are attacking.
This is a problem I've seen for a few years with Down and now can see Tyrone have the same problem. If you want to play the defensive style of football that is so prevalent in Ulster then you need to commit to fast direct football in the attack, with players flooding back after attack is over. But not players standing behind the attack waiting for it to end.
Quote from: PAULD123 on June 16, 2014, 01:39:35 PM
Stephen O'Neill was worse than ineffective. He failed to mark his man allowing him to score 2 points. Going forward he offered nothing. Either he should be dropped or moved to full-forward. To play him at full forward Tyrone would need to drop balls in on him and feed him with runners. Which would a total change of tactics.
But if Tyrone persist with the running game then they have to change their approach. When a Tyrone player has the ball inside the opponents half there is no one trying to run past him for a quick pass over the top. In stead they are running back behind him for an easy pass but one that just adds to the congestion and brings the ball into a worse location.
Mattie Donnelly would do it but he is a bit far back starting from CHB. Ideally Peter Harte should be bursting through to take the ball on the run. There are too many Tyrone players static or running parallel behind the man in possession when they are attacking.
This is a problem I've seen for a few years with Down and now can see Tyrone have the same problem. If you want to play the defensive style of football that is so prevalent in Ulster then you need to commit to fast direct football in the attack, with players flooding back after attack is over. But not players standing behind the attack waiting for it to end.
Exactly my thoughts on Tyrone's style of play.
Hard to watch. It will never create a goal chance against a decent side the way they are currently operating.
Quote from: Norf Tyrone on June 16, 2014, 10:04:25 AM
Quote from: GrandMasterFlash on June 16, 2014, 09:54:24 AM
Quote from: Norf Tyrone on June 16, 2014, 09:23:16 AM
One of the obvious candidates for me though was on the opposition bench yesterday.
MOR? What about PTG?
Meh. Peter to me lacks a bit of charisma based on his punditry levels, and he hardly inspired at Fermanagh.
Did you ever read Mickeys column. If we were picking managers based on the charisma of their public utterances.....
BTW PTG is yet to prove himself as a Manager. MOR & MH managed and had success with a number of teams at different levels and didn't just walk into their current jobs.
Quote from: LeoMc on June 16, 2014, 02:53:18 PM
Quote from: Norf Tyrone on June 16, 2014, 10:04:25 AM
Quote from: GrandMasterFlash on June 16, 2014, 09:54:24 AM
Quote from: Norf Tyrone on June 16, 2014, 09:23:16 AM
One of the obvious candidates for me though was on the opposition bench yesterday.
MOR? What about PTG?
Meh. Peter to me lacks a bit of charisma based on his punditry levels, and he hardly inspired at Fermanagh.
Did you ever read Mickeys column. If we were picking managers based on the charisma of their public utterances.....
BTW PTG is yet to prove himself as a Manager. MOR & MH managed and had success with a number of teams at different levels and didn't just walk into their current jobs.
MOR would be the stand out candidate. Would he leave Monaghan for the job though?
Very true Pauld but you need to be careful slagging of Mickey as you'll get blacklisted. :o
I am all on for bringing in the new young lads now and using some of the older lads in the second half if necessary but when you saw how well McAliskey played when he came on you'd have to wonder why Mickey was so slow with the changes. Playing RoN in the corner and then the crazy balls that was hit towards him, what did they expect would happen.
Listening to the lads here in Dublin today (not many of them actual Dubs) are saying that the media have Tyrone tarnished in very bad light now. Even on Newstalk the last two games Mickey had declined from doing an interview cos he fell out with Wooly Parkinson. Apparently it was in their contract the manager would talk to them so has he now broken that contract.
RTE and especially Brolly definitely have a HUGE influence on people's perceptions and thus on referees, linesmen, other fans and even our own fans. There definitely seems to be a very negative media vibe around Tyrone now and the quicker we go away the better seems to be the feeling.
Mickey used to be excellent with the media and would be very gracious in defeat, even in a tight ugly game.
Me myself, I was taking the defeat well yesterday and just saying we're not good enough any more and on the way home we were listening to the Cork hurling game and was in good mood. But after watching TSG last night, reading the papers today and hearing about Brolly's constant attacks on Sean Cavanagh certainly there seems to be a bit of a witch hunt out there.
I agree with you WT4 that Sean isn't helping the cause with his antics and is giving the media and others too much rope to hang him with. Whereas Colm has really settled down and puts the head down, takes the knocks and doesn't whinge the way he used to. I saw at least 2 incidents yesterday were he was taken down off the ball and he didn't even react once.
Glad to see you have finally relaxed a but Main Street and released a lot of the anger and hatred you seem to have. I know you've suffered at our red hands for years but it's all over now. I for one would like to see you win Ulster as long as you can take the battle to the Dubs the same way Donegal would. Oh yes sorry I forgot you've still to beat Armagh yet. Wee Buns.
Quote from: Fuzzman on June 16, 2014, 03:19:41 PM
Very true Pauld but you need to be careful slagging of Mickey as you'll get blacklisted. :o
I am all on for bringing in the new young lads now and using some of the older lads in the second half if necessary but when you saw how well McAliskey played when he came on you'd have to wonder why Mickey was so slow with the changes. Playing RoN in the corner and then the crazy balls that was hit towards him, what did they expect would happen.
Listening to the lads here in Dublin today (not many of them actual Dubs) are saying that the media have Tyrone tarnished in very bad light now. Even on Newstalk the last two games Mickey had declined from doing an interview cos he fell out with Wooly Parkinson. Apparently it was in their contract the manager would talk to them so has he now broken that contract.
RTE and especially Brolly definitely have a HUGE influence on people's perceptions and thus on referees, linesmen, other fans and even our own fans. There definitely seems to be a very negative media vibe around Tyrone now and the quicker we go away the better seems to be the feeling.
Mickey used to be excellent with the media and would be very gracious in defeat, even in a tight ugly game.
Me myself, I was taking the defeat well yesterday and just saying we're not good enough any more and on the way home we were listening to the Cork hurling game and was in good mood. But after watching TSG last night, reading the papers today and hearing about Brolly's constant attacks on Sean Cavanagh certainly there seems to be a bit of a witch hunt out there.
I agree with you WT4 that Sean isn't helping the cause with his antics and is giving the media and others too much rope to hang him with. Whereas Colm has really settled down and puts the head down, takes the knocks and doesn't whinge the way he used to. I saw at least 2 incidents yesterday were he was taken down off the ball and he didn't even react once.
Glad to see you have finally relaxed a but Main Street and released a lot of the anger and hatred you seem to have. I know you've suffered at our red hands for years but it's all over now. I for one would like to see you win Ulster as long as you can take the battle to the Dubs the same way Donegal would. Oh yes sorry I forgot you've still to beat Armagh yet. Wee Buns.
What happened to Mickey and RTE can't be defended and not a lot of people would be able to know how to handle the situation giving what he has been through. However I think Mickey thinks he can control the media which isn't a good thing - take for example the situation where he gave the character ref for the lad who got convicted of sex assault (btw I think he may have had his reasons to do it and could well have been right) but the thing which really bugged me was, given the outcome of the case I found it strange that no one asked the question or reported a response from MH afterwards. Where they too afraid? Did he decline?
This would link back to him falling out with Off the ball and Parkinson as they seem not to be afraid to ask different/difficult questions? (compare this attitude with Parkinson and McGuinness recent interview and how he handled the criticism that Parkinson had gave Donegal in the build up to the Derry game)
And as you say I think this attitude is DEFINITELY having an effect on Tyrone's football.
I blame Clonoe.
Best team in the county over the last 5 years yet they only have given us 2 subs yesterday.
Quote from: WT4E on June 16, 2014, 03:32:34 PM
Quote from: Fuzzman on June 16, 2014, 03:19:41 PM
Very true Pauld but you need to be careful slagging of Mickey as you'll get blacklisted. :o
I am all on for bringing in the new young lads now and using some of the older lads in the second half if necessary but when you saw how well McAliskey played when he came on you'd have to wonder why Mickey was so slow with the changes. Playing RoN in the corner and then the crazy balls that was hit towards him, what did they expect would happen.
Listening to the lads here in Dublin today (not many of them actual Dubs) are saying that the media have Tyrone tarnished in very bad light now. Even on Newstalk the last two games Mickey had declined from doing an interview cos he fell out with Wooly Parkinson. Apparently it was in their contract the manager would talk to them so has he now broken that contract.
RTE and especially Brolly definitely have a HUGE influence on people's perceptions and thus on referees, linesmen, other fans and even our own fans. There definitely seems to be a very negative media vibe around Tyrone now and the quicker we go away the better seems to be the feeling.
Mickey used to be excellent with the media and would be very gracious in defeat, even in a tight ugly game.
Me myself, I was taking the defeat well yesterday and just saying we're not good enough any more and on the way home we were listening to the Cork hurling game and was in good mood. But after watching TSG last night, reading the papers today and hearing about Brolly's constant attacks on Sean Cavanagh certainly there seems to be a bit of a witch hunt out there.
I agree with you WT4 that Sean isn't helping the cause with his antics and is giving the media and others too much rope to hang him with. Whereas Colm has really settled down and puts the head down, takes the knocks and doesn't whinge the way he used to. I saw at least 2 incidents yesterday were he was taken down off the ball and he didn't even react once.
Glad to see you have finally relaxed a but Main Street and released a lot of the anger and hatred you seem to have. I know you've suffered at our red hands for years but it's all over now. I for one would like to see you win Ulster as long as you can take the battle to the Dubs the same way Donegal would. Oh yes sorry I forgot you've still to beat Armagh yet. Wee Buns.
What happened to Mickey and RTE can't be defended and not a lot of people would be able to know how to handle the situation giving what he has been through. However I think Mickey thinks he can control the media which isn't a good thing - take for example the situation where he gave the character ref for the lad who got convicted of sex assault (btw I think he may have had his reasons to do it and could well have been right) but the thing which really bugged me was, given the outcome of the case I found it strange that no one asked the question or reported a response from MH afterwards. Where they too afraid? Did he decline?
This would link back to him falling out with Off the ball and Parkinson as they seem not to be afraid to ask different/difficult questions? (compare this attitude with Parkinson and McGuinness recent interview and how he handled the criticism that Parkinson had gave Donegal in the build up to the Derry game)
And as you say I think this attitude is DEFINITELY having an effect on Tyrone's football.
I thought Parkinson interviewed him before the game yesterday, did he not?
Anyone know what the official attendence was yesterday?
Not sure of the exact attendance but it was just over 20,000.
Just for the record
I will not be going on about Harte now any more nor am I trying to get him to leave but don't start giving any of us a hard time for asking questions. I heard a few guys saying yesterday hopefully we will lose to Louth and so there will be a dramatic change then. I do not hope we will lose and I want us to get as far as we can with the back sliding doors.
I think our young team needs to develop and the back door suits that better than the cauldron of the more defensive negative style Ulster football. Monaghan are a lot further down the road in team development as are Donegal but I would still have hope for maybe 2020.
What did ye make of the ticket sales yesterday. It seemed very badly organised
I bought tickets online and was to collect them at the ground. I asked 3 stewards, one in a suit where do I go and nobody knew. I was then told to go to Gate 34 I think so I queued up with all the ones with printouts
Once I got to the top the guy says No No you need to meet the man outside with the envelopes and he has your tickets. So I go back out and wander around for another 10 mins and eventually find this guy. UNREAL. No signs no pickup point nothing.
Quote from: Fuzzman on June 16, 2014, 03:19:41 PM
Me myself, I was taking the defeat well yesterday and just saying we're not good enough any more and on the way home we were listening to the Cork hurling game and was in good mood. But after watching TSG last night, reading the papers today and hearing about Brolly's constant attacks on Sean Cavanagh certainly there seems to be a bit of a witch hunt out there.
I agree with you WT4 that Sean isn't helping the cause with his antics and is giving the media and others too much rope to hang him with. Whereas Colm has really settled down and puts the head down, takes the knocks and doesn't whinge the way he used to. I saw at least 2 incidents yesterday were he was taken down off the ball and he didn't even react once.
The bit in bold. Only he's giving them
all the rope. It's easy to have a go at Brolly, but all pundits have picked up on the way he plays - there seems to be universal agreement (outside Tyrone at least!) on those black card incidents.
Sean Cavanagh gave nobody a black card and was fouled on every occasion.
Just read rate the ref on page 67 of Irish News.
I don't know who wrote it but it certainly states that he was very harsh on Tyrone and give no protection to McCurry.
Cavanagh does get HUGE abuse every game he plays but his reputation as a diver now means he never plays with a clean sheet.
I think he is often targeted now for special attention because of who he is and so to me he needs to re address this now.
Move him to FF and let players drag him down in the box
Quote from: rrhf on June 16, 2014, 05:37:40 PM
Sean Cavanagh gave nobody a black card and was fouled on every occasion.
He should have received a black card in injury time for a tackle. He also should have received a black card instead of Darren Hughes for the incident in which Hughes was black carded. He was fouled on a few occasions alrite but he goes to ground so dramatically it is hard to be sympathetic to him. Monaghan were the better side overall in what was a fairly enjoyable and exciting match. Personally I thought the ref had a decent game. He should however have played at least another minute or two of injury time. Having said that in almost every game too little injury time is played.
Quote from: rrhf on June 16, 2014, 05:37:40 PM
Sean Cavanagh gave nobody a black card and was fouled on every occasion.
But he wasn't. Going to ground does not equal a foul!
Quote from: J OGorman on June 16, 2014, 06:08:36 PM
Quote from: rrhf on June 16, 2014, 05:37:40 PM
Sean Cavanagh gave nobody a black card and was fouled on every occasion.
But he wasn't. Going to ground does not equal a foul!
Maybe in your rule book OGorman but not in Kinsella's. Just ask Dessie Mone what foul was committed when he won his penalty. Better still watch the replay of the
foul incident yourself and let us all know. Dessie is too busy to talk as he is chasing down Fuzzman.
Dessie mone doing it doesn't make sean cavanagh doing it ok.
Quote from: imtommygunn on June 16, 2014, 06:54:02 PM
Dessie mone doing it doesn't make sean cavanagh doing it ok.
Sean Cavanagh doing it doesn't mean we can't mention Dessie Mone doing it ok.
Agreed. As long as that's not your defense.
Dessie Cavanagh
Some shocking reporting in The Irish News Today. A few quotes:
"Kinsella's adjudication of the black card rule was fine"
"Hughes was shown a black card when he dragged Cavanagh to the ground"
"Yesterday it was Darren Hughes doing the rugby-tackling"
"Set up Monaghan's goal and was black-carded for rugby-tackling Sean Cavanagh"
Now I can understand the ref making a wrong call in the heat of the moment - it's a difficult one to call - but surely journalists can do a better job than this?
Quote from: Nally Stand on June 16, 2014, 11:25:28 AM
Quote from: GrandMasterFlash on June 16, 2014, 09:19:31 AM
Quote from: Nally Stand on June 16, 2014, 12:04:03 AM
Quote from: Maguire01 on June 15, 2014, 11:56:10 PM
Quote from: BennyHarp on June 15, 2014, 11:50:36 PM
Quote from: Schkite on June 15, 2014, 11:39:43 PM
Quote from: Maguire01 on June 15, 2014, 11:31:48 PM
Quote from: BennyHarp on June 15, 2014, 11:28:16 PM
Hopefully RTE take their key analyst Tommy Carr to task then. He thought the Hughes incident was a blatant black card. After multiple replays he decided that Hughes "took one for the team" yet later his colleagues decide that Sean dived. I didn't see the Sunday Game but did they highlight how easily the lad went over for the penalty?
Clutching at straws.
It really is. I don't see how you can compare a penalty being given after clear contact with a player pulling another down with him to win a free. If your main defence is quoting Tommy Carr then it's not a very strong one to be fair.
I think the lad went down very easily - is that not a dive to achieve an advantage? There was clear contact between Hughes and Cavanagh. Why was Hughes' arm over the top of Sean's shoulder? My quote of Tommy Carr is more a dig at the analysis on RTE. They have experts looking at the same incident and they arrive at completely polar apart conclusions.
Crucially, the "experts" who had time to view the incident several times - and that's both Brolly and Spillane, and O'Se and Whelan - all reached the same conclusion.
And I haven't heard ANYONE else question the penalty decision.
Maguire the penalty decision was a farce. A textbook dive. A fair and legal tackle went in and he dropped like a stone. The reason no fuss had been made about that is firstly, because it wasn't scored, and secondly because Joe Brolly never mentioned it and if the last few pages of this thread (and several other threads) shows, most lads desperately need Joe to tell them what to think and then they'll blindly repeat him ad nauseum.
You clearly don't know how Joe Brolly is perceived in Monaghan with a comment like that. :o
You are being completely biased, which is understandable, but it was a stonewall penalty. As to whether is was deliberate/intentional/clumsy/accidental (i.e. a black or yellow) is debatable within the confusion surrounding the application of cards, but it was definitely a penalty.
I'm not just talking about Monaghan folk. The threads from last two Tyrone games have been polluted by people endlessly rehashing whatever Joe Brolly told them to think. As for the penalty, it wasn't scored so not exactly vital, but I defy you to take another look at it and then still try to tell yourself it was a "stonewall penalty". The man dropped to the ground like a stone but that's as near as it got to "stonewall". But sure as I say, unless Joe Brolly says so too....
I've just had a another look. Mone was shoved by the defender. He wasn't "pulled down" or "dragged down" as per the RTE commentators, but it wasn't a shoulder to shoulder tackle and there was absolutely no attempt to go for the ball. Therefore it was a foul. Inside the square. That makes it a penalty.
Quote from: Maguire01 on June 16, 2014, 07:36:18 PM
Some shocking reporting in The Irish News Today. A few quotes:
"Kinsella's adjudication of the black card rule was fine"
"Hughes was shown a black card when he dragged Cavanagh to the ground"
"Yesterday it was Darren Hughes doing the rugby-tackling"
"Set up Monaghan's goal and was black-carded for rugby-tackling Sean Cavanagh"
Now I can understand the ref making a wrong call in the heat of the moment - it's a difficult one to call - but surely journalists can do a better job than this?
Maybe they are right and you are wrong!
Quote from: BennyHarp on June 16, 2014, 07:51:45 PM
Quote from: Maguire01 on June 16, 2014, 07:36:18 PM
Some shocking reporting in The Irish News Today. A few quotes:
"Kinsella's adjudication of the black card rule was fine"
"Hughes was shown a black card when he dragged Cavanagh to the ground"
"Yesterday it was Darren Hughes doing the rugby-tackling"
"Set up Monaghan's goal and was black-carded for rugby-tackling Sean Cavanagh"
Now I can understand the ref making a wrong call in the heat of the moment - it's a difficult one to call - but surely journalists can do a better job than this?
Maybe they are right and you are wrong!
If i'm wrong, then so is Brolly, Spillane, O'Se and Whelan - all of whom had the opportunity to see several replays of the incident(s). Not to mention most people here who managed to catch the game or highlights on TV.
well there you go then because Spillane and Brolly are never wrong :-\
Quote from: tyronefan on June 16, 2014, 08:02:44 PM
well there you go then because Spillane and Brolly are never wrong :-\
Who said that?
Quote from: Maguire01 on June 16, 2014, 07:59:42 PM
Quote from: BennyHarp on June 16, 2014, 07:51:45 PM
Quote from: Maguire01 on June 16, 2014, 07:36:18 PM
Some shocking reporting in The Irish News Today. A few quotes:
"Kinsella's adjudication of the black card rule was fine"
"Hughes was shown a black card when he dragged Cavanagh to the ground"
"Yesterday it was Darren Hughes doing the rugby-tackling"
"Set up Monaghan's goal and was black-carded for rugby-tackling Sean Cavanagh"
Now I can understand the ref making a wrong call in the heat of the moment - it's a difficult one to call - but surely journalists can do a better job than this?
Maybe they are right and you are wrong!
If i'm wrong, then so is Brolly, Spillane, O'Se and Whelan - all of whom had the opportunity to see several replays of the incident(s). Not to mention most people here who managed to catch the game or highlights on TV.
Have to agree with the Monaghan man here.
Quote from: Maguire01 on June 16, 2014, 07:59:42 PM
Quote from: BennyHarp on June 16, 2014, 07:51:45 PM
Quote from: Maguire01 on June 16, 2014, 07:36:18 PM
Some shocking reporting in The Irish News Today. A few quotes:
"Kinsella's adjudication of the black card rule was fine"
"Hughes was shown a black card when he dragged Cavanagh to the ground"
"Yesterday it was Darren Hughes doing the rugby-tackling"
"Set up Monaghan's goal and was black-carded for rugby-tackling Sean Cavanagh"
Now I can understand the ref making a wrong call in the heat of the moment - it's a difficult one to call - but surely journalists can do a better job than this?
Maybe they are right and you are wrong!
If i'm wrong, then so is Brolly, Spillane, O'Se and Whelan - all of whom had the opportunity to see several replays of the incident(s). Not to mention most people here who managed to catch the game or highlights on TV.
I'll see your Brolly and Spillane and rise you a Tommy Carr. All three of which should not be taken seriously. I wouldn't consider most of the wind up merchants here as being evidence either. O'Se and Whelan are independent which is fair enough but then so are the journalists you so easily dismiss.
You won the game fair and square and best of luck in the semi final. But move on and stop this nonsense about everything Cavanagh does is cheating and Monaghan are whiter than white. You'll learn that the more successful you get the more criticism you will get - be prepared for your stars to come under the microscope, like Cavanagh, very soon, especially, if you become AI contenders. I suspect at which point you will be on here desperately trying to defend the actions of the likes of Dick Clerkin and Dessie Mone who currently nobody outside of Monaghan care about so their misdemeanours do not make national headlines or warrant full length discussions and rants on the Sunday Game.
Quote from: BennyHarp on June 16, 2014, 08:24:06 PM
Quote from: Maguire01 on June 16, 2014, 07:59:42 PM
Quote from: BennyHarp on June 16, 2014, 07:51:45 PM
Quote from: Maguire01 on June 16, 2014, 07:36:18 PM
Some shocking reporting in The Irish News Today. A few quotes:
"Kinsella's adjudication of the black card rule was fine"
"Hughes was shown a black card when he dragged Cavanagh to the ground"
"Yesterday it was Darren Hughes doing the rugby-tackling"
"Set up Monaghan's goal and was black-carded for rugby-tackling Sean Cavanagh"
Now I can understand the ref making a wrong call in the heat of the moment - it's a difficult one to call - but surely journalists can do a better job than this?
Maybe they are right and you are wrong!
If i'm wrong, then so is Brolly, Spillane, O'Se and Whelan - all of whom had the opportunity to see several replays of the incident(s). Not to mention most people here who managed to catch the game or highlights on TV.
I'll see your Brolly and Spillane and rise you a Tommy Carr. All three of which should not be taken seriously. I wouldn't consider most of the wind up merchants here as being evidence either. O'Se and Whelan are independent which is fair enough but then so are the journalists you so easily dismiss.
I'm thinking the journalists must have written their reports based on seeing the incident once, in real time, possibly from some distance. Most people would have called it a black card for Hughes looking at it once in real time. Just strange - and sloppy - that they later went to press with that version - several times.
Quote from: BennyHarp on June 16, 2014, 08:24:06 PM
You won the game fair and square and best of luck in the semi final. But move on and stop this nonsense about everything Cavanagh does is cheating and Monaghan are whiter than white. You'll learn that the more successful you get the more criticism you will get - be prepared for your stars to come under the microscope, like Cavanagh, very soon, especially, if you become AI contenders. I suspect at which point you will be on here desperately trying to defend the actions of the likes of Dick Clerkin and Dessie Mone who currently nobody outside of Monaghan care about so their misdemeanours do not make national headlines or warrant full length discussions and rants on the Sunday Game.
Firstly, I never said everything Cavanagh does is cheating. One of his points yesterday was immaculate, and he was pretty much the reason Tyrone were in contention at the death. He's a great player - the best on that Tyrone team by some distance. But he has form - indeed he has form in pulling down Hughes - a yellow card last year and a black one this year, in both cases where Cavanagh was the one doing the fouling.
I also don't think Monaghan are whiter than white - not for a minute. And to suggest that Clerkin or Mone haven't come in for criticism is laughable! They have played on the edge, and sometimes over it. Although i'd suggest both are a lot more disciplined that they were 4 or 5 years ago (in fact the whole team probably is).
I'd like to think i'll call things as they are and won't be so blinkered to say black is white when it relates to a Monaghan player. I take no issue, for example, with Malone's black card - a clear pulling-down offence.
Quote from: Maguire01 on June 16, 2014, 07:36:18 PM
Some shocking reporting in The Irish News Today. A few quotes:
"Kinsella's adjudication of the black card rule was fine"
"Hughes was shown a black card when he dragged Cavanagh to the ground"
"Yesterday it was Darren Hughes doing the rugby-tackling"
"Set up Monaghan's goal and was black-carded for rugby-tackling Sean Cavanagh"
Now I can understand the ref making a wrong call in the heat of the moment - it's a difficult one to call - but surely journalists can do a better job than this?
Not surprised at the Irish News; they are to Tyrone what Fox News is to the Republican Party in the USA.
(http://www.dmcaphotography.com/wp-content/uploads/2014/06/IMG_2248a.jpg)
Quote from: Maguire01 on June 16, 2014, 08:43:02 PM
Quote from: BennyHarp on June 16, 2014, 08:24:06 PM
You won the game fair and square and best of luck in the semi final. But move on and stop this nonsense about everything Cavanagh does is cheating and Monaghan are whiter than white. You'll learn that the more successful you get the more criticism you will get - be prepared for your stars to come under the microscope, like Cavanagh, very soon, especially, if you become AI contenders. I suspect at which point you will be on here desperately trying to defend the actions of the likes of Dick Clerkin and Dessie Mone who currently nobody outside of Monaghan care about so their misdemeanours do not make national headlines or warrant full length discussions and rants on the Sunday Game.
Firstly, I never said everything Cavanagh does is cheating. One of his points yesterday was immaculate, and he was pretty much the reason Tyrone were in contention at the death. He's a great player - the best on that Tyrone team by some distance. But he has form - indeed he has form in pulling down Hughes - a yellow card last year and a black one this year, in both cases where Cavanagh was the one doing the fouling.
I also don't think Monaghan are whiter than white - not for a minute. And to suggest that Clerkin or Mone haven't come in for criticism is laughable! They have played on the edge, and sometimes over it. Although i'd suggest both are a lot more disciplined that they were 4 or 5 years ago (in fact the whole team probably is).
I'd like to think i'll call things as they are and won't be so blinkered to say black is white when it relates to a Monaghan player. I take no issue, for example, with Malone's black card - a clear pulling-down offence.
Fair enough, maybe I'm responding more to the theme of how the thread is going than your individual posts but I'd say the level of criticism Cavanagh gets is disproportionate to his perceived crimes and is at a different level to anything faced by Clerkin or Mone, who I have singled out because I've watched them for many years and know they play on the edge. For the record. I'm not blinkered to Cavanaghs crimes either, his theatrics after he goes down is embarrassing but he is singled out by opposing teams and over the years has learned how to ensure the ref is aware of the fouls on him, in my opinion he doesn't deserve the vilification he gets on national TV or on these pages.
Clearly photoshopped. Sure Cavanagh dived the cheat!
Quote from: tyroneboi on June 16, 2014, 09:04:28 PM
(http://www.dmcaphotography.com/wp-content/uploads/2014/06/IMG_2248a.jpg)
We could have a game called "spot the bingo" in that picture. I look shocking well too.
Quote from: Bingo on June 16, 2014, 10:17:11 PM
Quote from: tyroneboi on June 16, 2014, 09:04:28 PM
(http://www.dmcaphotography.com/wp-content/uploads/2014/06/IMG_2248a.jpg)
We could have a game called "spot the bingo" in that picture. I look shocking well too.
Nice hat Bingo.
Colin Cooper comes under more abuse than Cavanagh ever has, whys he not reverted to this diving shite, as for not highlighting Monaghan we all know what Clerkin brings to the table and he rightly been pointed out as doing underhand stuff, point is he didn't do any yesterday, so kinda hard to bring him into the good and bad of yesterdays game. I rather supporters accept some actions of their players are indefensible, or we just end up with a bunch of Mueller's and Pepe's playing the game in a few years.
Is Cavanagh a diver - well yeah he is a bit. He does go down easy at times. Did he pull down Hughes? Well maybe a little, but without a doubt not before Hughes had fouled him.
But I think it is important to not lose sight of the amount of times the man is fouled/pulled back/blocked. Cavanagh gets fouled far more than he ever gets frees. And he does go down easy but is that diving? perhaps it is, but he rarely does it when he hasn't been fouled. maybe he could stay on his feet but if he has been fouled then again maybe he is entitled to go down????
Quote from: PAULD123 on June 16, 2014, 10:44:39 PM
Is Cavanagh a diver - well yeah he is a bit. He does go down easy at times. Did he pull down Hughes? Well maybe a little, but without a doubt not before Hughes had fouled him.
But I think it is important to not lose sight of the amount of times the man is fouled/pulled back/blocked. Cavanagh gets fouled far more than he ever gets frees. And he does go down easy but is that diving? perhaps it is, but he rarely does it when he hasn't been fouled. maybe he could stay on his feet but if he has been fouled then again maybe he is entitled to go down????
Hate to see players go down easy even if they are being fouled but in regards to Mone's rugby tackle on Cavanagh i felt at the time Mone had every intention to take sean down and was rightly carded. Cavanagh held on to ensure the ref made correct call. I think Cavanagh is getting special attention from the media.
theres no word of him going down under a hard hit from Clerkin,who ended up on the floor himself, so the question is if he can brush this off so easy why he going down under lesser tackles which happend to be in better scoring positions.
A Tohill used to get the jersey pulled of him in many a game, he got on with it, J McCartan a much smaller man was noted for doing the take down and getting an odd easy free on top of the hard ones. It used to annoy me Tohill never got frees where McCartan did for the same type of tackle, but i been less happy with him as a player to look up to, if he started going down to get frees just to show the ref he was been fouled.
At the end of the day its all down to what you expect from a team representing your county, some things which players from my own county done i didn't like, and there be no way i defend them with the attitude "but that team at it, that player does it", if your happy u team does it, then take the criticism other counties will give of a team/players actions on the football field.
You sometimes be remembered for your actions,antics etc, that why Billy Sheenan will always be so loved among his northern countrymen (or brits if u talking to Billy) Sorry Billy have to use some example.
Quote from: SkillfulBill on June 16, 2014, 10:54:07 PM
Quote from: PAULD123 on June 16, 2014, 10:44:39 PM
Is Cavanagh a diver - well yeah he is a bit. He does go down easy at times. Did he pull down Hughes? Well maybe a little, but without a doubt not before Hughes had fouled him.
But I think it is important to not lose sight of the amount of times the man is fouled/pulled back/blocked. Cavanagh gets fouled far more than he ever gets frees. And he does go down easy but is that diving? perhaps it is, but he rarely does it when he hasn't been fouled. maybe he could stay on his feet but if he has been fouled then again maybe he is entitled to go down????
Hate to see players go down easy even if they are being fouled but in regards to Mone's rugby tackle on Cavanagh i felt at the time Mone had every intention to take sean down and was rightly carded. Cavanagh held on to ensure the ref made correct call. I think Cavanagh is getting special attention from the media.
Mone?
That was the other cavanagh who hit clerkin.
Nothing to do with media. The amount of diving he was at on sunday was bad. He is not usually as bad as that.
I doubt a 6'3" man has ever had as many high tackles done on him as cavanagh sunday.
Great player. Needs to cut it out.
Quiet yer moaning boyz. We'll meet again this year I bet up in Omagh this time.
Good posts Benny H
Quote from: Wildweasel74 on June 16, 2014, 10:59:24 PM
theres no word of him going down under a hard hit from Clerkin,who ended up on the floor himself, so the question is if he can brush this off so easy why he going down under lesser tackles which happend to be in better scoring positions.
A Tohill used to get the jersey pulled of him in many a game, he got on with it, J McCartan a much smaller man was noted for doing the take down and getting an odd easy free on top of the hard ones. It used to annoy me Tohill never got frees where McCartan did for the same type of tackle, but i been less happy with him as a player to look up to, if he started going down to get frees just to show the ref he was been fouled.
At the end of the day its all down to what you expect from a team representing your county, some things which players from my own county done i didn't like, and there be no way i defend them with the attitude "but that team at it, that player does it", if your happy u team does it, then take the criticism other counties will give of a team/players actions on the football field.
You sometimes be remembered for your actions,antics etc, that why Billy Sheenan will always be so loved among his northern countrymen (or brits if u talking to Billy) Sorry Billy have to use some example.
Every forward worth their salt knows how to buy a free when in the scoring zone. Cavanagh knocked Clerkin flying on Sunday but there is some difference when going at full pelt and there is contact with an opposing player, the result usually being that you'll go flying and land in a heap. As for the Darren Hughes incident, Hughes was fouling last year and was at the same yesterday. The picture clearly backs it up. If he learnt to tackle legitimately he would maybe make more of a contribution than he has so far against the top teams.
Quote from: Wildweasel74 on June 16, 2014, 10:59:24 PM
theres no word of him going down under a hard hit from Clerkin,who ended up on the floor himself, so the question is if he can brush this off so easy why he going down under lesser tackles which happend to be in better scoring positions.
A Tohill used to get the jersey pulled of him in many a game, he got on with it, J McCartan a much smaller man was noted for doing the take down and getting an odd easy free on top of the hard ones. It used to annoy me Tohill never got frees where McCartan did for the same type of tackle, but i been less happy with him as a player to look up to, if he started going down to get frees just to show the ref he was been fouled.
At the end of the day its all down to what you expect from a team representing your county, some things which players from my own county done i didn't like, and there be no way i defend them with the attitude "but that team at it, that player does it", if your happy u team does it, then take the criticism other counties will give of a team/players actions on the football field.
You sometimes be remembered for your actions,antics etc, that why Billy Sheenan will always be so loved among his northern countrymen (or brits if u talking to Billy) Sorry Billy have to use some example.
That's because it was a fair shoulder to shoulder charge and he is quite happy to ship those tackles, as its part of the game. A completely nonsensical comparison to make, but in line with other nonsense on this thread.
Quote from: Fuzzman on June 17, 2014, 01:00:05 AM
Quiet yer moaning boyz.
..says the man who's done a fair bit of it himself. From the media, to the supporters, to the manager, the tactics, the players, want me to continue? ::)
You can argue on individual incidents all day, all teams will have players who will look to take advantage of the rules and this has always existed. Monaghans Nudie Hughes would buy 2/3 frees a game by pulling in defenders stray hand and that was in the 80's.
The black card was to address this but it is very hard to spot. Plus as it is a black card offence, you'd expect some cards to be shown for it but I've seen frees given against forwards for this and no further action has been taken. Its like its been ignored.
And the reason is very obvious - its so hard to call. As that picture shows, I'd a decent view of Hughes Black card. In real time, I said straight away that he was gone, the man beside me the same. Hughes was totally wrapped round him with both arms and appeared to be jockeying him. TV pictures might show differently but ref doesn't have them. I can't recall Hughes making much of it either.
I welcomed the black at the time but from the first rules briefing I attended, I said they were only going to add to the problems. As the championship hots up this is becoming more apparent.
I doubt any ref will want to ref the All-Ireland final this year as the calls to be made will be massive.
Quote from: Bingo on June 17, 2014, 09:35:13 AM
You can argue on individual incidents all day, all teams will have players who will look to take advantage of the rules and this has always existed. Monaghans Nudie Hughes would buy 2/3 frees a game by pulling in defenders stray hand and that was in the 80's.
The black card was to address this but it is very hard to spot. Plus as it is a black card offence, you'd expect some cards to be shown for it but I've seen frees given against forwards for this and no further action has been taken. Its like its been ignored.
And the reason is very obvious - its so hard to call. As that picture shows, I'd a decent view of Hughes Black card. In real time, I said straight away that he was gone, the man beside me the same. Hughes was totally wrapped round him with both arms and appeared to be jockeying him. TV pictures might show differently but ref doesn't have them. I can't recall Hughes making much of it either.
I welcomed the black at the time but from the first rules briefing I attended, I said they were only going to add to the problems. As the championship hots up this is becoming more apparent.
I doubt any ref will want to ref the All-Ireland final this year as the calls to be made will be massive.
I thought at the time it was a bit softer than the previous two, then I heard Brolly had been on a rant about Cavanagh and the pictures that RTE showed that night seemed to back him up.
This shows another angle. As the Tyrone PRO said on Twitter Maybe Sky cameras would have got more or better angles.
Quote from: Bingo on June 17, 2014, 09:35:13 AM
You can argue on individual incidents all day, all teams will have players who will look to take advantage of the rules and this has always existed. Monaghans Nudie Hughes would buy 2/3 frees a game by pulling in defenders stray hand and that was in the 80's.
The black card was to address this but it is very hard to spot. Plus as it is a black card offence, you'd expect some cards to be shown for it but I've seen frees given against forwards for this and no further action has been taken. Its like its been ignored.
And the reason is very obvious - its so hard to call. As that picture shows, I'd a decent view of Hughes Black card. In real time, I said straight away that he was gone, the man beside me the same. Hughes was totally wrapped round him with both arms and appeared to be jockeying him. TV pictures might show differently but ref doesn't have them. I can't recall Hughes making much of it either.
I welcomed the black at the time but from the first rules briefing I attended, I said they were only going to add to the problems. As the championship hots up this is becoming more apparent.
I doubt any ref will want to ref the All-Ireland final this year as the calls to be made will be massive.
Don't you worry Bingo, the referees will tear out each other's entrails if needs be to get to ref the AIF.
Have to say I think the black card has been a great move. At club level I believe the mouthing off at referees has fallen off a cliff because of it and if for no other reason that is good enough for me.
Quote from: tyroneboi on June 16, 2014, 09:04:28 PM
(http://www.dmcaphotography.com/wp-content/uploads/2014/06/IMG_2248a.jpg)
Is it just me or do his arms look a bit long?
Quote from: GrandMasterFlash on June 17, 2014, 08:51:58 AM
Quote from: Fuzzman on June 17, 2014, 01:00:05 AM
Quiet yer moaning boyz.
..says the man who's done a fair bit of it himself. From the media, to the supporters, to the manager, the tactics, the players, want me to continue? ::)
I typed that on my phone at 1am and predictive text changed it from Quet to Quiet
I meant
"It's 1am quet your mone-ing"
There were a lot more controversial decisions that this one but to me when you've got your two arms around a players waste like that then their is only really one intention on the tacklers mind and that is to stop him. The difference is now of course is that the tackler tries to stay on their feet despite the cynical nature of the foul
Quote from: Jinxy on June 17, 2014, 11:14:10 AM
Quote from: tyroneboi on June 16, 2014, 09:04:28 PM
(http://www.dmcaphotography.com/wp-content/uploads/2014/06/IMG_2248a.jpg)
Is it just me or do his arms look a bit long?
Does anyone know a physio in Mayo could verify it?
The infuriating thing is that Sean would, in all likelihood, have got his free if he had of tried to continue on. Hughes may have still got a black card as anyone moving at that speed would likely hit the dirt. Grabbing his arm on the fall leaves Sean open to ridicule and takes the focus away from how much fouling/abuse he receives himself.
Out of interest, would be curious to see the stats on which player has been responsible (as in the victim) for the most most black cards. Sean's bound to be near the top. Is it four so far in the championship? Two versus Down and two on Sunday?
Quote from: nrico2006 on June 17, 2014, 08:35:27 AM
Quote from: Wildweasel74 on June 16, 2014, 10:59:24 PM
theres no word of him going down under a hard hit from Clerkin,who ended up on the floor himself, so the question is if he can brush this off so easy why he going down under lesser tackles which happend to be in better scoring positions.
A Tohill used to get the jersey pulled of him in many a game, he got on with it, J McCartan a much smaller man was noted for doing the take down and getting an odd easy free on top of the hard ones. It used to annoy me Tohill never got frees where McCartan did for the same type of tackle, but i been less happy with him as a player to look up to, if he started going down to get frees just to show the ref he was been fouled.
At the end of the day its all down to what you expect from a team representing your county, some things which players from my own county done i didn't like, and there be no way i defend them with the attitude "but that team at it, that player does it", if your happy u team does it, then take the criticism other counties will give of a team/players actions on the football field.
You sometimes be remembered for your actions,antics etc, that why Billy Sheenan will always be so loved among his northern countrymen (or brits if u talking to Billy) Sorry Billy have to use some example.
Every forward worth their salt knows how to buy a free when in the scoring zone. Cavanagh knocked Clerkin flying on Sunday but there is some difference when going at full pelt and there is contact with an opposing player, the result usually being that you'll go flying and land in a heap. As for the Darren Hughes incident, Hughes was fouling last year and was at the same yesterday. The picture clearly backs it up. If he learnt to tackle legitimately he would maybe make more of a contribution than he has so far against the top teams.
Nice, take a dig at his performances to back up your point. He was excellent when we beat the AI champs last year to win Ulster or did they not count as a top team? ::)
As for Hughes "fouling last year and at it again", the key foul that he got booked for last year he clearly won the ball in. In this case a picture means little, you need to see video footage of it, you can't even see Cavanagh's right arm that seemed to hold onto Hughes's right arm. It was probably a foul alright but it's hard to say if Hughes would've got a black card if it wasn't for Cavanagh pulling his arm in.
Quote from: LeoMc on June 17, 2014, 12:37:02 PM
Quote from: Jinxy on June 17, 2014, 11:14:10 AM
Quote from: tyroneboi on June 16, 2014, 09:04:28 PM
(http://www.dmcaphotography.com/wp-content/uploads/2014/06/IMG_2248a.jpg)
Is it just me or do his arms look a bit long?
Does anyone know a physio in Mayo could verify it?
There's one in Ballina that says it has been photoshopped for sure.
Is a forward trying to obtain an advantage like Sean Cavanagh has done on Sunday any different from a defender who pulls/drags their opponent off the ball? Or who gives a sneaky tug of the shorts from behind as they race to a ball?
Why demonise one man for trying to gain an advantage but ignore other offences? Is there a hierarchy of offences?
Quote from: The_Beard on June 17, 2014, 01:53:33 PM
Is a forward trying to obtain an advantage like Sean Cavanagh has done on Sunday any different from a defender who pulls/drags their opponent off the ball? Or who gives a sneaky tug of the shorts from behind as they race to a ball?
Why demonise one man for trying to gain an advantage but ignore other offences? Is there a hierarchy of offences?
buts sure as long as we get high scoring matches sure what odds
How many pages will this run to I wonder ::)
Quote from: Rossfan on June 17, 2014, 02:06:15 PM
How many pages will this run to I wonder ::)
Only matter of time before someone hilariously make this comment.
Can anyone tell me why Cavanagh got a yellow and not a black for his "tackle" 30 seconds from the end?
For what its worth the penalty looked very soft, although technically probably a foul, he caught his leg with his own knee, similar but not as blatent as what happed to cillian o'connor in the ros match.
Correct call on the black card also, fair enough cavanagh did pull him down but he was fouled first so you deal with that, result = free in and black card
Quote from: Mayo4Sam on June 17, 2014, 02:30:15 PM
Can anyone tell me why Cavanagh got a yellow and not a black for his "tackle" 30 seconds from the end?
For what its worth the penalty looked very soft, although technically probably a foul, he caught his leg with his own knee, similar but not as blatent as what happed to cillian o'connor in the ros match.
Correct call on the black card also, fair enough cavanagh did pull him down but he was fouled first so you deal with that, result = free in and black card
i can certainly see your point, but this is one of the main problems with the black card, you would have as many people that would take the opposite view and say Cavanagh pulled him down and that HE should have gotten a black card, and this is with seeing it multiple time and from different angles on replays.
How is a referee supposed to get a call like that right and insure that the wrong man isnt standing on the sideline for the close of the game when the decision is so much down to interpretation?
Quote from: blewuporstuffed on June 17, 2014, 02:44:11 PM
Quote from: Mayo4Sam on June 17, 2014, 02:30:15 PM
Can anyone tell me why Cavanagh got a yellow and not a black for his "tackle" 30 seconds from the end?
For what its worth the penalty looked very soft, although technically probably a foul, he caught his leg with his own knee, similar but not as blatent as what happed to cillian o'connor in the ros match.
Correct call on the black card also, fair enough cavanagh did pull him down but he was fouled first so you deal with that, result = free in and black card
i can certainly see your point, but this is one of the main problems with the black card, you would have as many people that would take the opposite view and say Cavanagh pulled him down and that HE should have gotten a black card, and this is with seeing it multiple time and from different angles on replays.
How is a referee supposed to get a call like that right and insure that the wrong man isnt standing on the sideline for the close of the game when the decision is so much down to interpretation?
This is the thing, there is huge pressure on the referees to get the calls right and unfortunately they are proving that they are not up to it. The call becomes massive when it results in the player sitting out the rest of the game. There's a thin line between making a punishment severe enough to deter the fouls and making it so severe that the refs are nearly afraid to make the call - especially early in a big game and especially when it is not clear cut as in a few recent incidents. Is it time that we had a team of 15 - 20 or so professional referees (or if every county had a professional referee), who would officiate at all inter county championship games. During the week they could visit clubs and schools around the country training new referees and doing workshops for players. They could even do schools games and big club games when championship matches arent on. This would disseminate the message through the grades. We could set up development squads for the referees too.
Referees have huge pressure on them these days and to be honest I think the black card is the final straw and has put just that bit too much pressure on them as individuals. With that and the increased tv coverage and all out scrutiny they get they're on a hiding to nothing.
All things considered the ref did a great job sunday. Ulster championship games are the worst of any to ref.
The diving(from all teams) has increased significantly and is just another pressure on top of black cards and everything else they have to look at.
Personally I don't know why anyone would want to be a ref and it's made worse by ex refs scrutinising them too.
Quote from: imtommygunn on June 17, 2014, 03:25:10 PM
Referees have huge pressure on them these days and to be honest I think the black card is the final straw and has put just that bit too much pressure on them as individuals. With that and the increased tv coverage and all out scrutiny they get they're on a hiding to nothing.
All things considered the ref did a great job sunday. Ulster championship games are the worst of any to ref.
The diving(from all teams) has increased significantly and is just another pressure on top of black cards and everything else they have to look at.
Personally I don't know why anyone would want to be a ref and it's made worse by ex refs scrutinising them too.
Small men with a bit of power, they all love it.
Quote from: omagh_gael on June 17, 2014, 01:07:58 PM
The infuriating thing is that Sean would, in all likelihood, have got his free if he had of tried to continue on. Hughes may have still got a black card as anyone moving at that speed would likely hit the dirt. Grabbing his arm on the fall leaves Sean open to ridicule and takes the focus away from how much fouling/abuse he receives himself.
Well said OG and I really wish he would stop doing this as well. It seems to me he's been concentrating on the dragging DOWN part in his head and knowing that defenders now will try to stop him by staying on their feet and dragging him with two hands.
This conversation brings me back to 2003 and all the talk about Tyrone diving and how it was used to counteract Armagh's bending the rules on physicality to the edge.
I remember chats about quite often there would be a foul but the ref would let it go as it was a tough championship match and you wouldn't get frees for fouls in say the AI semi or final that you would get on round 1 or National league games.
We might not like to admit it but refs are more like to give the free if the man on the ball ends up on the ground due to a tackle. It certainly helps to make his mind up as the advantage is over.
I remember for years watching Stevie O'Neill with 2 men hanging out of him and managing to stay upright but the ref making exceptions cos Stevie was so strong and often not giving the foul. I think we saw that a few times on Sunday as well.
Whereas Sean certainly does get fouled a hell of a lot and understandably so cos he is such an influential player for Tyrone. Often if you stop Sean you stop Tyrone. Sean obviously has been dealing with that now for years and so his way of combating that is to think "F**K Yis, if you're gonna foul me then I'm gonna go to ground to help make the refs mind up for him. Is this wrong?
Some will say YES(mainly defenders or anti Tyrone groups) and some will say No (mainly talented forwards)
Someone said why does Gooch not go down more then and earn more frees.
It's not in his mindset I suppose but then again he doesn't play in Ulster football either where there are a lot more robust tackling and defensive tactics.
As someone said Nudie Hughes and many others used to grab the arm and go down years ago so this is not a new phenomenon. The main difference is you now have motor mouths like Brolly and others who go on a major RANT and with so much social media nowadays his followers are more than happy to join in.
In my biased eyes I said it back then in 2003 and I'll say it again now that PTG and Sean Cavanagh often go to ground when they're being fouled to ensure the free is given. I don't think I've seen either of them blatantly DIVE when there has been no contact.
Re the Ref on Sunday. What did ye neutrals think? Forget the black card tackles did you think he favoured one team over another?
Monaghan keeping things in perspective
Veteran midfielder says win over Tyrone merely another stepping stone on an arduous path as minds turn to Armagh's challenge
(http://www.irishtimes.com/polopoly_fs/1.1834503.1402947199!/image/image.jpg_gen/derivatives/box_620_330/image.jpg)
The football championship this past weekend offered starkly contrasting stories; Monaghan's controlled joy in Clones and Carlow's 28-point humiliation in their outdated Dr Cullen Park.
Tyrone's first defeat to their southern neighbours since 1988 appeared to anger Mickey Harte so much that he refused to comment to the media.
Thankfully veteran Monaghan midfielder Dick Clerkin was full of chatter. The mindset radically altered, beating Tyrone wasn't about life and death, it was just another game.
"That's the pressure we put on ourselves far too much, prior to Malachy [O'Rourke] coming. We 'had' to do this, we 'had' to win an Ulster title. That pressure maybe weighed on us too much.
"Malachy said to us during the week, you know, there's one and a half billion people in China that couldn't give a shite about that game today. That puts things in perspective. The worst thing that could happen today is that we lose here to Tyrone, and that's it, we push on.
"It was about going out, enjoying it, playing without expectation and just focusing on the job at hand. We were physically well-prepared, we knew we had the players, and we had a management team that would make the right choices."
Emotional side
Clerkin added: "Maybe we have stopped talking about 'having' to beat Tyrone, that we can't go back here as losers. None of that talk was thrown about, because what does that mean? It means nothing. You are focussing on something you have no control over.
"Players have a job to do, a system of play in terms of players knowing how to do their job. They focused on that, not the emotional side.
"Again, Malachy, the crew and the players put an end to that talk. You just go out, focus on your job and see how far it takes you."
One of those players is Conor McManus. Feared to be gone for the summer, having damaged ankle ligaments on the May Bank Holiday weekend, the current All Star planted 0-6 from frees in a 70-minute stretch.
"Malachy is very conscious of keeping people's expectations in check. Before the match when Conor was announced, if it had have been announced a couple days earlier it would have been a lot of talk, maybe unnecessary pressure. So much has gone into getting Conor back, he was captain this year, an All-Star last year and he was looking forward to a big season.
"To get struck down with an injury that can end people's seasons, I think to come back and the medical team to get him to play 70 minutes there today was phenomenal and I am just delighted for him because he deserves every bit of it."
Of course, Monaghan are only leaving base camp. Armagh next, possibly Donegal after, before the rest of the country gets interested.
"If we want to talk about us being a top-tier team, we have to take that pressure. Plenty of times over the years we haven't dealt with pressure like that, but this team with Malachy, we can manage expectation well.
"He will dampen down things...all we can do is worry about ourselves...Armagh are a county steeped in tradition, they are aware that tradition was being questioned over the last few years and they have turned a corner, no more than we did last year. So we will be looking at their team, they are very much in the same mould as we were last year."
Quote from: blewuporstuffed on June 17, 2014, 02:44:11 PM
Quote from: Mayo4Sam on June 17, 2014, 02:30:15 PM
Can anyone tell me why Cavanagh got a yellow and not a black for his "tackle" 30 seconds from the end?
For what its worth the penalty looked very soft, although technically probably a foul, he caught his leg with his own knee, similar but not as blatent as what happed to cillian o'connor in the ros match.
Correct call on the black card also, fair enough cavanagh did pull him down but he was fouled first so you deal with that, result = free in and black card
i can certainly see your point, but this is one of the main problems with the black card, you would have as many people that would take the opposite view and say Cavanagh pulled him down and that HE should have gotten a black card, and this is with seeing it multiple time and from different angles on replays.
How is a referee supposed to get a call like that right and insure that the wrong man isnt standing on the sideline for the close of the game when the decision is so much down to interpretation?
First foul (and black card offence) was by the Monaghan man
Quote from: Zip Code on June 17, 2014, 03:51:11 PM
Quote from: imtommygunn on June 17, 2014, 03:25:10 PM
Referees have huge pressure on them these days and to be honest I think the black card is the final straw and has put just that bit too much pressure on them as individuals. With that and the increased tv coverage and all out scrutiny they get they're on a hiding to nothing.
All things considered the ref did a great job sunday. Ulster championship games are the worst of any to ref.
The diving(from all teams) has increased significantly and is just another pressure on top of black cards and everything else they have to look at.
Personally I don't know why anyone would want to be a ref and it's made worse by ex refs scrutinising them too.
Small men with a bit of power, they all love it.
We'd be fairly fucked if they didn't do it.
Quote from: Mayo4Sam on June 17, 2014, 04:13:21 PM
Quote from: blewuporstuffed on June 17, 2014, 02:44:11 PM
Quote from: Mayo4Sam on June 17, 2014, 02:30:15 PM
Can anyone tell me why Cavanagh got a yellow and not a black for his "tackle" 30 seconds from the end?
For what its worth the penalty looked very soft, although technically probably a foul, he caught his leg with his own knee, similar but not as blatent as what happed to cillian o'connor in the ros match.
Correct call on the black card also, fair enough cavanagh did pull him down but he was fouled first so you deal with that, result = free in and black card
i can certainly see your point, but this is one of the main problems with the black card, you would have as many people that would take the opposite view and say Cavanagh pulled him down and that HE should have gotten a black card, and this is with seeing it multiple time and from different angles on replays.
How is a referee supposed to get a call like that right and insure that the wrong man isnt standing on the sideline for the close of the game when the decision is so much down to interpretation?
First foul (and black card offence) was by the Monaghan man
Well it all depends in who deliberately pulled down who. That's the only offence here that could be black card territory. Hughes' tackling may have been a foul, but it's only the foul of deliberately pulling down that's a black card. Its clear that Cavanagh was trying to pull Hughes down before he went down, so not sure how you can conclude that Hughes committed a black card offence first.
Quote from: Mayo4Sam on June 17, 2014, 02:30:15 PM
Can anyone tell me why Cavanagh got a yellow and not a black for his "tackle" 30 seconds from the end?
For what its worth the penalty looked very soft, although technically probably a foul, he caught his leg with his own knee, similar but not as blatent as what happed to cillian o'connor in the ros match.
Correct call on the black card also, fair enough cavanagh did pull him down but he was fouled first so you deal with that, result = free in and black card
He may have been fouled first, but that's not a black card offence. Its only a black card when the opponent is deliberately dragged down, if Cavanagh deliberately dragged Hughes down with him, Cavanagh should get the black card- if the ref hasn't given a free (or possibly yellow card) for the initial foul.
Quote from: Jinxy on June 17, 2014, 11:14:10 AM
Quote from: tyroneboi on June 16, 2014, 09:04:28 PM
(http://www.dmcaphotography.com/wp-content/uploads/2014/06/IMG_2248a.jpg)
Is it just me or do his arms look a bit long?
Cavanagh keeps stretching them!
On the photo - probably taken at 500/sec - would like to see if the photographer captured any more frames from this incident.
I hadnt thought of it that way. Hard one to call for the ref in fairness
Quote from: tyroneboi on June 16, 2014, 09:04:28 PM
(http://www.dmcaphotography.com/wp-content/uploads/2014/06/IMG_2248a.jpg)
That looks likes Hughes is trying to stop Cavanagh falling over or else he is performing the Heimlich manoeuvre, neither of which are black card offences.
Quote from: Mayo4Sam on June 17, 2014, 05:24:17 PM
I hadnt thought of it that way. Hard one to call for the ref in fairness
Yes, it is a hard one to call, so the vilification of Cavanagh by so many people and no more so than RTE is completely out of order. We don't know for definite what the intention of either man was so it's unfair for these people to matter of factly decide that Cavanagh is a cheat.
Quote from: BennyHarp on June 17, 2014, 06:45:24 PM
Quote from: Mayo4Sam on June 17, 2014, 05:24:17 PM
I hadnt thought of it that way. Hard one to call for the ref in fairness
Yes, it is a hard one to call, so the vilification of Cavanagh by so many people and no more so than RTE is completely out of order. We don't know for definite what the intention of either man was so it's unfair for these people to matter of factly decide that Cavanagh is a cheat.
Yes, it is a hard one to call, in real time at least, and it would be unfair to vilify the referee. But that's not happening.
I don't know how many ways you can interpret Cavanagh's intention in grabbing Hughes' arm.
Quote from: Maguire01 on June 17, 2014, 06:54:07 PM
Quote from: BennyHarp on June 17, 2014, 06:45:24 PM
Quote from: Mayo4Sam on June 17, 2014, 05:24:17 PM
I hadnt thought of it that way. Hard one to call for the ref in fairness
Yes, it is a hard one to call, so the vilification of Cavanagh by so many people and no more so than RTE is completely out of order. We don't know for definite what the intention of either man was so it's unfair for these people to matter of factly decide that Cavanagh is a cheat.
Yes, it is a hard one to call, in real time at least, and it would be unfair to vilify the referee. But that's not happening.
I don't know how many ways you can interpret Cavanagh's intention in grabbing Hughes' arm.
You can't deny that in that picture, at some point, Hughes had his left arm wrapped around Cavanagh. Just because you keep saying it was a dive doesn't mean that is what happened.
Quote from: BennyHarp on June 17, 2014, 07:49:42 PM
Quote from: Maguire01 on June 17, 2014, 06:54:07 PM
Quote from: BennyHarp on June 17, 2014, 06:45:24 PM
Quote from: Mayo4Sam on June 17, 2014, 05:24:17 PM
I hadnt thought of it that way. Hard one to call for the ref in fairness
Yes, it is a hard one to call, so the vilification of Cavanagh by so many people and no more so than RTE is completely out of order. We don't know for definite what the intention of either man was so it's unfair for these people to matter of factly decide that Cavanagh is a cheat.
Yes, it is a hard one to call, in real time at least, and it would be unfair to vilify the referee. But that's not happening.
I don't know how many ways you can interpret Cavanagh's intention in grabbing Hughes' arm.
You can't deny that in that picture, at some point, Hughes had his left arm wrapped around Cavanagh. Just because you keep saying it was a dive doesn't mean that is what happened.
Is it a possibility that Hughes' arm is in this position because he was being pulled down and is moving his arm to protect himself from the fall?
For what it is worth my reading is that the initial foul is by Hughes (possible yellow) and a free to Tyrone. Cavanagh pulls him to the ground resulting in a black card for him and a hop ball.
For all the talk of Cavanagh, and the odd mention of Mone, how does Penrose not get more of a mention for his pull down in the first half.
29 questionable decisions against Tyrone in that game. Includes fouls not given soft frees etc.
Quote from: rrhf on June 17, 2014, 09:15:12 PM
29 questionable decisions against Tyrone in that game. Includes fouls not given soft frees etc.
::) ::) ::) ::) ::) ::) ::) ::) ::) ::) ::) ::) ::) ::) ::) ::) ::) ::) ::) ::) ::) ::)
Quote from: Throw ball on June 17, 2014, 08:46:29 PM
Quote from: BennyHarp on June 17, 2014, 07:49:42 PM
Quote from: Maguire01 on June 17, 2014, 06:54:07 PM
Quote from: BennyHarp on June 17, 2014, 06:45:24 PM
Quote from: Mayo4Sam on June 17, 2014, 05:24:17 PM
I hadnt thought of it that way. Hard one to call for the ref in fairness
Yes, it is a hard one to call, so the vilification of Cavanagh by so many people and no more so than RTE is completely out of order. We don't know for definite what the intention of either man was so it's unfair for these people to matter of factly decide that Cavanagh is a cheat.
Yes, it is a hard one to call, in real time at least, and it would be unfair to vilify the referee. But that's not happening.
I don't know how many ways you can interpret Cavanagh's intention in grabbing Hughes' arm.
You can't deny that in that picture, at some point, Hughes had his left arm wrapped around Cavanagh. Just because you keep saying it was a dive doesn't mean that is what happened.
Is it a possibility that Hughes' arm is in this position because he was being pulled down and is moving his arm to protect himself from the fall?
For what it is worth my reading is that the initial foul is by Hughes (possible yellow) and a free to Tyrone. Cavanagh pulls him to the ground resulting in a black card for him and a hop ball.
For all the talk of Cavanagh, and the odd mention of Mone, how does Penrose not get more of a mention for his pull down in the first half.
So it was a foul then. Listening to the fellas on here you think that Cavanagh dived to the ground untouched. All I'm arguing is that a foul occurred. Then, if he committed a foul the defender is opening himself up to be exposed by the forward and in my opinion Cavanagh is within his rights to force the ref to make a decision. It's not the Florence Fight Club here, (regardless of what Brolly says about manliness) if someone is fouling you, you make bloody sure the ref sees it. To be labelled a cheat for going down after being fouled is unfair.
A few points on darren hughes black card (1) if hughes wasn't fouling sean , he wouldn't have been carded (2) have you ever carried someone on your back , wrapped around you who is 6 ft tall and weighs 14 stone, while your runing - you'd hardly stand up yourself (3) as kevin madden points out in irish news there is actually a more cynical tackle , in that they wrap the player up but release him before he hits the ground (4) the tackle issue needs resolved with clear guidelines (5) the black card has only made the whole situation worse (6) most supporters do not have a clue what is an actual black card offence. (7) as a tyrone supporter : the tyrone team beat themselves : extremely poor team , no clear system of play , I've said all year n a team in transition .
Shhh don't go thinking for yourself.. This board used to be a place where free thinkers were commonplace. now it's choked with brolly Spillane wannabees. The sheep now have the keys to the board.
Benny had a fair point, if Hughes hadn't his arm in their (fouling him as he's come across the shoulder) then Cavanagh wouldn't have been able to pull him down. Forwards have been at it for years and it's a hard thing to police. Realistically it's part of the game and literally every team does it. Some either they're all cheats or they're not but singling out Cavanagh isn't on especially on the back of last year when he did what any county fan would have wanted their player to do in that situation.
f**k it Mayo did it more we'd have a Connacht final from '01 and a minor all-Ireland from '08
Every time Monaghan got a free in the second half the player lay down injured completely disrupting the momentum of the game. Is that considered ok? There is a clear agenda against Tyrone on the Sunday game which is completely against the spirit of the gaa. They only focus on questionable decisions in the game which go Tyrone's way and totally ignore everything else. On Sunday night they actually went back to clips of Tyrone fouls from last year to try and prove their points.
On a separate note I'd like to see Monaghan go on and do well now. I enjoy watching their style of play and they always bring good passion to the game. They have built up a very good team under O'Rourke and could make a big impact this year if everyone stays fit. They're sound defensively and break well. I wouldn't be overly surprised if Tyrone can regroup if the teams met each other again in the quarter finals but its a long way off.
Quote from: delgany on June 17, 2014, 10:28:45 PM
A few points on darren hughes black card (1) if hughes wasn't fouling sean , he wouldn't have been carded (2) have you ever carried someone on your back , wrapped around you who is 6 ft tall and weighs 14 stone, while your runing - you'd hardly stand up yourself (3) as kevin madden points out in irish news there is actually a more cynical tackle , in that they wrap the player up but release him before he hits the ground (4) the tackle issue needs resolved with clear guidelines (5) the black card has only made the whole situation worse (6) most supporters do not have a clue what is an actual black card offence. (7) as a tyrone supporter : the tyrone team beat themselves : extremely poor team , no clear system of play , I've said all year n a team in transition .
Tyrone have been in transition from 2010 apparently. It's about time the excuses stopped for both players and management. They've had more than enough time (30+ games over the last 2 years) to get a settled team and a proper system of play and it hasn't happened. The most bemusing thing for me is that nobody seems prepared to ask the hard questions of either players or more pertinently management
Quote from: barelegs on June 17, 2014, 11:22:31 PM
Quote from: delgany on June 17, 2014, 10:28:45 PM
A few points on darren hughes black card (1) if hughes wasn't fouling sean , he wouldn't have been carded (2) have you ever carried someone on your back , wrapped around you who is 6 ft tall and weighs 14 stone, while your runing - you'd hardly stand up yourself (3) as kevin madden points out in irish news there is actually a more cynical tackle , in that they wrap the player up but release him before he hits the ground (4) the tackle issue needs resolved with clear guidelines (5) the black card has only made the whole situation worse (6) most supporters do not have a clue what is an actual black card offence. (7) as a tyrone supporter : the tyrone team beat themselves : extremely poor team , no clear system of play , I've said all year n a team in transition .
Poss
Tyrone have been in transition from 2010 apparently. It's about time the excuses stopped for both players and management. They've had more than enough time (30+ games over the last 2 years) to get a settled team and a proper system of play and it hasn't happened. The most bemusing thing for me is that nobody seems prepared to ask the hard questions of either players or more pertinently management
This is possibly due to the fact that we got to a National League final and AI Semi final last year which by any standards is a decent enough return. I fully agree that this year hasn't been good though.
I'm probably one of Mickeys biggest supporters on here and believe he has earned the right to be given time that may not be afforded to others. However, I'm getting a little bit concerned that the job may just be getting a bit too much for him at this stage and I just hope that it hasn't become some sort of obsession for him to win another AI, which may just be clouding his judgement slightly. His reaction at the final whistle on Sunday was something completely out of character for him and worries me slightly. I just hope it wasn't the sign of a man struggling to cope.
It wouldn't take a tactical genius to work out that what was good enough against Down's defense wouldn't happen against Monaghan. McGinley, P. Harte and McKenna were brilliant in Newry, yet didn't feature or didn't play in Clones. They don't go from hero to zero that quick.
I'd still say there's enough quality in Tyrone to make a quarter final this year and then who knows.You're right to be concerned about Mickey's poor PR, not to mention the cynical stuff. Try not to let the emotion take over. As we've learnt to our cost over the years, the tantrums don't help.
Quote from: BennyHarp on June 17, 2014, 11:34:34 PM
Quote from: barelegs on June 17, 2014, 11:22:31 PM
Quote from: delgany on June 17, 2014, 10:28:45 PM
A few points on darren hughes black card (1) if hughes wasn't fouling sean , he wouldn't have been carded (2) have you ever carried someone on your back , wrapped around you who is 6 ft tall and weighs 14 stone, while your runing - you'd hardly stand up yourself (3) as kevin madden points out in irish news there is actually a more cynical tackle , in that they wrap the player up but release him before he hits the ground (4) the tackle issue needs resolved with clear guidelines (5) the black card has only made the whole situation worse (6) most supporters do not have a clue what is an actual black card offence. (7) as a tyrone supporter : the tyrone team beat themselves : extremely poor team , no clear system of play , I've said all year n a team in transition .
Poss
Tyrone have been in transition from 2010 apparently. It's about time the excuses stopped for both players and management. They've had more than enough time (30+ games over the last 2 years) to get a settled team and a proper system of play and it hasn't happened. The most bemusing thing for me is that nobody seems prepared to ask the hard questions of either players or more pertinently management
This is possibly due to the fact that we got to a National League final and AI Semi final last year which by any standards is a decent enough return. I fully agree that this year hasn't been good though.
I'm probably one of Mickeys biggest supporters on here and believe he has earned the right to be given time that may not be afforded to others. However, I'm getting a little bit concerned that the job may just be getting a bit too much for him at this stage and I just hope that it hasn't become some sort of obsession for him to win another AI, which may just be clouding his judgement slightly. His reaction at the final whistle on Sunday was something completely out of character for him and worries me slightly. I just hope it wasn't the sign of a man struggling to cope.
I think the Mickey Harte supporters club is reducing after every game. How did SON and Penrose manage to stay on for the 70 mins. Harte has gone stale a few years ago and my biggest concern is the man will not go gracefully and will tear the county apart if he is ever forced out. I can see club delegations objecting to any extensions to his management.
Quote from: Mayo4Sam on June 17, 2014, 10:54:26 PM
Benny had a fair point, if Hughes hadn't his arm in their (fouling him as he's come across the shoulder) then Cavanagh wouldn't have been able to pull him down. Forwards have been at it for years and it's a hard thing to police. Realistically it's part of the game and literally every team does it. Some either they're all cheats or they're not but singling out Cavanagh isn't on especially on the back of last year when he did what any county fan would have wanted their player to do in that situation.
f**k it Mayo did it more we'd have a Connacht final from '01 and a minor all-Ireland from '08
I agree that nearly every team has players who are able to orchestrate frees just like Sean did on Sunday. And it is frustrating when it happens against your team. But before this year the consequence was a free against and maybe a point from the subsequent free. The problem now is a team can now lose a player for the rest of the game. Last year Sean probably would have been described as cute but now he is been called a cheat.
Parkinson is siding with Sean here.
http://www.independent.ie/opinion/columnists/off-the-ball/pundits-need-to-alter-focus-and-stop-pops-at-cavanagh-30363277.html
Quote from: orangeman on June 18, 2014, 09:30:59 AM
Parkinson is siding with Sean here.
http://www.independent.ie/opinion/columnists/off-the-ball/pundits-need-to-alter-focus-and-stop-pops-at-cavanagh-30363277.html
Points well made wooly -now put this thread to bed! :z
Quote from: timmyot501 on June 18, 2014, 12:51:26 AM
Quote from: Mayo4Sam on June 17, 2014, 10:54:26 PM
Benny had a fair point, if Hughes hadn't his arm in their (fouling him as he's come across the shoulder) then Cavanagh wouldn't have been able to pull him down. Forwards have been at it for years and it's a hard thing to police. Realistically it's part of the game and literally every team does it. Some either they're all cheats or they're not but singling out Cavanagh isn't on especially on the back of last year when he did what any county fan would have wanted their player to do in that situation.
f**k it Mayo did it more we'd have a Connacht final from '01 and a minor all-Ireland from '08
I agree that nearly every team has players who are able to orchestrate frees just like Sean did on Sunday. And it is frustrating when it happens against your team. But before this year the consequence was a free against and maybe a point from the subsequent free. The problem now is a team can now lose a player for the rest of the game. Last year Sean probably would have been described as cute but now he is been called a cheat.
Exactly.
It has always been an issue getting these calls right and now the penalties have been increased, but we are no closer to getting them correct.
Quote from: orangeman on June 18, 2014, 09:30:59 AM
Parkinson is siding with Sean here.
http://www.independent.ie/opinion/columnists/off-the-ball/pundits-need-to-alter-focus-and-stop-pops-at-cavanagh-30363277.html
"On occasions like this, and I've done it many times, you lock the defender's arm under yours and go to ground dragging him down with you. This is not conning anyone, it's simply drawing attention to the fact you're being fouled." ;D
This is called the tyrone defence.
Your honour, maybe I was clocked driving 80 in a 50 zone but I was only doing so to expose a weakness, that road signs are not a proper deterrent.
-
Quote from: Main Street on June 18, 2014, 11:03:21 AM
Quote from: orangeman on June 18, 2014, 09:30:59 AM
Parkinson is siding with Sean here.
http://www.independent.ie/opinion/columnists/off-the-ball/pundits-need-to-alter-focus-and-stop-pops-at-cavanagh-30363277.html
"On occasions like this, and I've done it many times, you lock the defender's arm under yours and go to ground dragging him down with you. This is not conning anyone, it's simply drawing attention to the fact you're being fouled."
;D
This is called the tyrone defence.
Your honour, maybe I was clocked driving 80 in a 50 zone but I was only doing so to expose a weakness, that road signs are not a proper deterrent.
-
You seriously need to dry up?
I never realised that McManus or any of the other Monaghan players never used this tactic. ::)
Quote from: Main Street on June 18, 2014, 11:03:21 AM
Quote from: orangeman on June 18, 2014, 09:30:59 AM
Parkinson is siding with Sean here.
http://www.independent.ie/opinion/columnists/off-the-ball/pundits-need-to-alter-focus-and-stop-pops-at-cavanagh-30363277.html
"On occasions like this, and I've done it many times, you lock the defender's arm under yours and go to ground dragging him down with you. This is not conning anyone, it's simply drawing attention to the fact you're being fouled."
;D
This is called the tyrone defence.
Your honour, maybe I was clocked driving 80 in a 50 zone but I was only doing so to expose a weakness, that road signs are not a proper deterrent.
-
Or more accurately Your honour, maybe I was clocked driving 80 in a 50 zone but I was only doing so because no-one pulled in the Monaghan car speeding in front of me.
As I said in the black card thread - there were a lot of big, phyisically strong men on both sides in Clones last Sunday doing Bambi impersonations. It was not confined to Tyrone. Monaghan lads are more than capable of hitting the deck. And it's spread to almost every county. Simulation was always in the game and the black card has just upped the ante.
Quote from: WT4E on June 18, 2014, 09:34:23 AM
Quote from: orangeman on June 18, 2014, 09:30:59 AM
Parkinson is siding with Sean here.
http://www.independent.ie/opinion/columnists/off-the-ball/pundits-need-to-alter-focus-and-stop-pops-at-cavanagh-30363277.html
Points well made wooly -now put this thread to bed! :z
http://tyronetribulations.com/2014/06/17/romance-expert-reckons-brolly-possibly-infatuated-with-sean-cavanagh/
Sean is cheating to compensate for the fact that he's surrounded by mediocrity.
It's still not enough though, such is the infestation of same.
It's good to see his antics out of the Ulster championship and lets hope this media tart is epelled from the all ireland series just as quickly.
Cheating is cheating afer all.
Some dosh bags talking here. Big Sean, who wouldn't jump at having him as a club or county player for themselves. I can remember the great Jacko bogging his boot into the late Dermot Earlys ass in the middle of Croke Park on All Ireland final day against Roscommon. Give my head peace lads.
Quote from: orangeman on June 18, 2014, 09:30:59 AM
Parkinson is siding with Sean here.
http://www.independent.ie/opinion/columnists/off-the-ball/pundits-need-to-alter-focus-and-stop-pops-at-cavanagh-30363277.html
If Parkinson agrees with you, you might need to re-examine your position. I must say I was amused at there being no reason for a defender to have his hand in near the attacker. You are still allowed try and dispossess the man by slapping the ball out of his hands I presume? Sounds like Wooly wants defenders to stand beside him with their arms behind their backs.
Call it what you like, justify it anyway you like, but the fact of the matter is grabbing a lad's arm and dragging him to the ground on top of you to make it look like he dragged you down is a) a foul itself and b) an attempt to con the ref
Quote from: Knock Yer Mucker In on June 18, 2014, 01:01:17 PM
Some dosh bags talking here. Big Sean, who wouldn't jump at having him as a club or county player for themselves. I can remember the great Jacko bogging his boot into the late Dermot Earlys ass in the middle of Croke Park on All Ireland final day against Roscommon. Give my head peace lads.
Is that a defense of him? I don't want to pick on Sean Cavanagh, but what has the fact that every county in Ireland would like to have him (they would) got to do with whether he is fond of the auld embellishment? It's like everything has to be 100% good or 100% bad with some lads. It is never that way, and Sean Cavanagh is an exceptional footballer, who happens to win frees occasionally when they are not merited. Is that such a controversial thing to say?
He's by no means the only lad to do it either.
all the other Tyrone lads do it too!!!! :D
Hughes was fouling Cavanagh, he got a black card and it was deserved. Monaghan won and thats that.
Quote from: AZOffaly on June 18, 2014, 01:06:20 PM
Quote from: Knock Yer Mucker In on June 18, 2014, 01:01:17 PM
Some dosh bags talking here. Big Sean, who wouldn't jump at having him as a club or county player for themselves. I can remember the great Jacko bogging his boot into the late Dermot Earlys ass in the middle of Croke Park on All Ireland final day against Roscommon. Give my head peace lads.
Is that a defense of him? I don't want to pick on Sean Cavanagh, but what has the fact that every county in Ireland would like to have him (they would) got to do with whether he is fond of the auld embellishment? It's like everything has to be 100% good or 100% bad with some lads. It is never that way, and Sean Cavanagh is an exceptional footballer, who happens to win frees occasionally when they are not merited. Is that such a controversial thing to say?
He's by no means the only lad to do it either.
all the other Tyrone lads do it too!!!! :D
That's right he is not, and I want him to continue getting us frees by exaggerating his fall, it is all part of the game. Any team would want a player who could get them frees by whatever way.
What seems to have been glossed over is the small incident which happen between big Sean and McManus last year, which I feel played a massive influence in Hughes et. al. wanting to hang out of big Sean on Sunday.. Monaghan remained reasonably composed about it (thankfully, only losing one man to a black card in relation) but to me they'd have formed an orderly cue to get a dig at him. Lets be honest lads, revenge is sweet..
Quote from: AZOffaly on June 18, 2014, 01:02:42 PM
Quote from: orangeman on June 18, 2014, 09:30:59 AM
Parkinson is siding with Sean here.
http://www.independent.ie/opinion/columnists/off-the-ball/pundits-need-to-alter-focus-and-stop-pops-at-cavanagh-30363277.html
If Parkinson agrees with you, you might need to re-examine your position. I must say I was amused at there being no reason for a defender to have his hand in near the attacker. You are still allowed try and dispossess the man by slapping the ball out of his hands I presume? Sounds like Wooly wants defenders to stand beside him with their arms behind their backs.
Call it what you like, justify it anyway you like, but the fact of the matter is grabbing a lad's arm and dragging him to the ground on top of you to make it look like he dragged you down is a) a foul itself and b) an attempt to con the ref
I think what he was saying was the manner of the tackle was always going to be a foul. Coaching indicates this.
If you listen to any coach the proper way to tackle in such a situation is whilst running along side the attacker use the near hand in and out to dispossess. Once you reach across with the other hand or over the back - especially when someone like Cavanagh is running 95% of time it will be a foul.
Hughes definitely fouled Cavanagh!
Quote from: GrandMasterFlash on June 18, 2014, 02:07:56 PM
What seems to have been glossed over is the small incident which happen between big Sean and McManus last year, which I feel played a massive influence in Hughes et. al. wanting to hang out of big Sean on Sunday.. Monaghan remained reasonably composed about it (thankfully, only losing one man to a black card in relation) but to me they'd have formed an orderly cue to get a dig at him. Lets be honest lads, revenge is sweet..
So you're justifying fouls?
Okkkkk.................
That's correct WT4E, but also when you are face on, you are entitled to try and play the ball. In fact you are entitled to try and play the ball at any time, you're just not very likely to get it if you're reaching in from behind, and you are more likely to foul that way. That's why we coach footwork and body position as well as the near hand tackle etc.
*However* just because you are out of position and reaching in, that does not necessarily mean you are fouling, and does not entitle a lad to grab you and pull you down on top of him. It's probably bad technique, but it's not illegal technique unless you are actually fouling the man. There's no rule that says you can't tackle the ball from behind, in front, the side or anywhere else.
Quote from: AZOffaly on June 18, 2014, 02:24:53 PM
That's correct WT4E, but also when you are face on, you are entitled to try and play the ball. In fact you are entitled to try and play the ball at any time, you're just not very likely to get it if you're reaching in from behind, and you are more likely to foul that way. That's why we coach footwork and body position as well as the near hand tackle etc.
*However* just because you are out of position and reaching in, that does not necessarily mean you are fouling, and does not entitle a lad to grab you and pull you down on top of him. It's probably bad technique, but it's not illegal technique unless you are actually fouling the man. There's no rule that says you can't tackle the ball from behind, in front, the side or anywhere else.
No it doesn't but when you are reaching in with your right arm then wrap your left around the torso of the player then the chances are you are going to commit a foul. Every single forward player i know worth their salt will take advantage of this sort of tackling which is commited to slow up the attacker in an unfair/illegal way. Why should Sean Cavanagh, in the dying minutes of a big championship game, let an opposing player foul him, stop him from making progress and cost his team a place in an Ulster Semi final? To prove his manliness? To stop internet trolls from critising him? Give me a break..... Cavanagh was fouled, he went to ground, he may have helped bring Hughes to ground to make sure he got the free. (Monaghan players where tactically fouling then claiming diving throughout the game - see Dessie Mone's ridiculous accusation that Sean dived after his throat high tackle on him.) Ultimately Cavanagh would have saved Tyrone had Morgan kicked a point he could normally kick in his sleep - i would have taken that with pleasure. If I was from Monaghan, i'd be more concerned with how they nearly let a dead and buried Tyrone team off the hook than worrying themselves with Cavanagh.
Quote from: AZOffaly on June 18, 2014, 02:24:53 PM
That's correct WT4E, but also when you are face on, you are entitled to try and play the ball. In fact you are entitled to try and play the ball at any time, you're just not very likely to get it if you're reaching in from behind, and you are more likely to foul that way. That's why we coach footwork and body position as well as the near hand tackle etc.
*However* just because you are out of position and reaching in, that does not necessarily mean you are fouling, and does not entitle a lad to grab you and pull you down on top of him. It's probably bad technique, but it's not illegal technique unless you are actually fouling the man. There's no rule that says you can't tackle the ball from behind, in front, the side or anywhere else.
That's all fine and well AZ and I agree with what your saying.
Problem is in this case its irrelevant considering the fact that Hughes grabbed him and pulled him down equating to a foul
Maybe so. I'm just having a go at Parkinson.
The bias against Tyrone from some is nauseating. The guy was fouled twice maybe 3 times in a manner that would warrant a black card EOS
Quote from: BennyHarp on June 18, 2014, 02:55:01 PM
Quote from: AZOffaly on June 18, 2014, 02:24:53 PM
That's correct WT4E, but also when you are face on, you are entitled to try and play the ball. In fact you are entitled to try and play the ball at any time, you're just not very likely to get it if you're reaching in from behind, and you are more likely to foul that way. That's why we coach footwork and body position as well as the near hand tackle etc.
*However* just because you are out of position and reaching in, that does not necessarily mean you are fouling, and does not entitle a lad to grab you and pull you down on top of him. It's probably bad technique, but it's not illegal technique unless you are actually fouling the man. There's no rule that says you can't tackle the ball from behind, in front, the side or anywhere else.
No it doesn't but when you are reaching in with your right arm then wrap your left around the torso of the player then the chances are you are going to commit a foul. Every single forward player i know worth their salt will take advantage of this sort of tackling which is commited to slow up the attacker in an unfair/illegal way. Why should Sean Cavanagh, in the dying minutes of a big championship game, let an opposing player foul him, stop him from making progress and cost his team a place in an Ulster Semi final? To prove his manliness? To stop internet trolls from critising him? Give me a break..... Cavanagh was fouled, he went to ground, he may have helped bring Hughes to ground to make sure he got the free. (Monaghan players where tactically fouling then claiming diving throughout the game - see Dessie Mone's ridiculous accusation that Sean dived after his throat high tackle on him.) Ultimately Cavanagh would have saved Tyrone had Morgan kicked a point he could normally kick in his sleep - i would have taken that with pleasure. If I was from Monaghan, i'd be more concerned with how they nearly let a dead and buried Tyrone team off the hook than worrying themselves with Cavanagh.
I'm not talking about the Cavanagh incident specifically. I'm refuting Parkinson's suggestion that a defender can't have his arm/hand anywhere near the attacker.
Cavanagh is a fine exponent of the tuck and roll (far from the only one as I've said) , but I have no idea if he was fouled or not in that incident. I haven't bothered to research it as I've never commented on that incident itself.
Quote from: omaghjoe on June 18, 2014, 03:04:19 PM
The bias against Tyrone from some is nauseating. The guy was fouled twice maybe 3 times in a manner that would warrant a black card EOS
I hope that's not aimed at me. I've spent quite a bit of time defending Tyrone when I thought it was necessary. Bias against Wooly on the other hand, guilty as charged.
Quote from: AZOffaly on June 18, 2014, 03:05:45 PM
Quote from: omaghjoe on June 18, 2014, 03:04:19 PM
The bias against Tyrone from some is nauseating. The guy was fouled twice maybe 3 times in a manner that would warrant a black card EOS
I hope that's not aimed at me. I've spent quite a bit of time defending Tyrone when I thought it was necessary. Bias against Wooly on the other hand, guilty as charged.
Why do you dislike Parkinson? I much prefer him and the OFTB team than the dull and repetitive clichés spun out on TSG!
What would Wooly know about tackling?
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dtO-uGhmeY0 (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dtO-uGhmeY0)
Quote from: omaghjoe on June 18, 2014, 03:04:19 PM
The bias against Tyrone from some is nauseating. The guy was fouled twice maybe 3 times in a manner that would warrant a black card EOS
I hope you see the irony in your post - your defense against antti tyrone bias is a pro tyrone bias?
Quote from: WT4E on June 18, 2014, 03:19:23 PM
Quote from: AZOffaly on June 18, 2014, 03:05:45 PM
Quote from: omaghjoe on June 18, 2014, 03:04:19 PM
The bias against Tyrone from some is nauseating. The guy was fouled twice maybe 3 times in a manner that would warrant a black card EOS
I hope that's not aimed at me. I've spent quite a bit of time defending Tyrone when I thought it was necessary. Bias against Wooly on the other hand, guilty as charged.
Why do you dislike Parkinson? I much prefer him and the OFTB team than the dull and repetitive clichés spun out on TSG!
A good few reasons to be honest, but as a pundit, mainly I think he's a spoofer. As a pundit do I prefer him to Joe Brolly and Co. Maybe, yes. Having said that, there's a jar of marmalade gone off in my fridge that I'd prefer as a pundit to them lads.
Quote from: WT4E on June 18, 2014, 03:19:23 PM
Quote from: AZOffaly on June 18, 2014, 03:05:45 PM
Quote from: omaghjoe on June 18, 2014, 03:04:19 PM
The bias against Tyrone from some is nauseating. The guy was fouled twice maybe 3 times in a manner that would warrant a black card EOS
I hope that's not aimed at me. I've spent quite a bit of time defending Tyrone when I thought it was necessary. Bias against Wooly on the other hand, guilty as charged.
Why do you dislike Parkinson? I much prefer him and the OFTB team than the dull and repetitive clichés spun out on TSG!
Agree with AZ, he is a spoofer. Brolly-lite , though, Joe has forgotten more about football than CP will ever know, and its mainly about the attention. I quite liked his hair though during his playing days
Points taken on Parkinson - Different folks I suppose.
I wonder would that be the majority view on Parkinson?
Quote from: WT4E on June 18, 2014, 04:01:54 PM
Points taken on Parkinson - Different folks I suppose.
I wonder would that be the majority view on Parkinson?
I'd say he's a polarising figure alright. I do find him entertaining on Newstalk when he's not talking about the GAA, and some of his insights into things that happened off the field with Laois are quite interesting. He's growing on me slightly, but he's still a bluffer I think. I'm sure other people love him.
Wooly to my mind was always a wannabe. He was never a great footballer but did enough to make people think he had something in him. Also he was a bit 'different' to the stereotypical footballer and as a result stood out a bit more. As an analyst he is poor enough. He tries to be controversial and different with no real substance. I would place himself and David Brady in the same category, high opinions based on FAS!
Is he not the Laois equivalent to Kevin McGourty? (Replace name with whoever from your county fits that category!)
He had talent, but probably not as much as he thought he did. He also seemed to be one of the original Laois lads that got inflated opinions of themselves at a young age, and didn't want to listen to anyone.
I'd rate him as good footballer, not a great one, but someone who seems to hate leaving an opinion unaired, regardless of his knowledge on the subject. As I said, entertaining when you don't really care about the subject matter. Mildly annoying when you do.
Quote from: AZOffaly on June 18, 2014, 03:25:07 PM
. As a pundit do I prefer him to Joe Brolly and Co. Maybe, yes. Having said that, there's a jar of marmalade gone off in my fridge that I'd prefer as a pundit to them lads.
;D ;D ;D
Quote from: omaghjoe on June 18, 2014, 03:01:18 PM
Quote from: AZOffaly on June 18, 2014, 02:24:53 PM
That's correct WT4E, but also when you are face on, you are entitled to try and play the ball. In fact you are entitled to try and play the ball at any time, you're just not very likely to get it if you're reaching in from behind, and you are more likely to foul that way. That's why we coach footwork and body position as well as the near hand tackle etc.
*However* just because you are out of position and reaching in, that does not necessarily mean you are fouling, and does not entitle a lad to grab you and pull you down on top of him. It's probably bad technique, but it's not illegal technique unless you are actually fouling the man. There's no rule that says you can't tackle the ball from behind, in front, the side or anywhere else.
That's all fine and well AZ and I agree with what your saying.
Problem is in this case its irrelevant considering the fact that Hughes grabbed him and pulled him down equating to a foul
The question is who pulled who own, because regardless of other fouls, that's the only black card offence relevant here.
Quote from: AZOffaly on June 18, 2014, 03:02:08 PM
Maybe so. I'm just having a go at Parkinson.
Wooly is a breath of fresh air.
Different strokes for different folks I suppose.
watched 1st half on sky+ HD.
5min37. .dessie mone dives after being nudged from behind by c. McGinley. mone warned by ref.
8min30. vinny corey deliberately hand-trips McGinley TWICE in full view of linesman mcquillan and ref.free given to mon for pickup off ground.strange he sees pickup but not 2 hand trips which are much more obvious and cynical than mccurrys elbow trip.
9th min. .penrose pulled back by Kelly,whistle blows well after foul,ref gives free out for ?overcarrying. very harsh!
14min31.. k hughes slips as he shoots for score, ref DIDNT have his arm raised for advantage so why did he give a free when the ball landed short? there was NO foul.
16min11... vinny corey dives/goes down easily for soft free,sean protests,there was minimal contact. ?ref conned again!
23min07.. dessie mone goes down easily in box,after hesitation ref gives penalty,then consults via radio again with linesman/standby referee mcquillan and gives mcnabb yellow.it was barely a foul,def not a yellow
28min14.. drew wylie pulls big sean down behind him with his left hand right in front of mcquillan and ref.mon get free.sean doesn't bother protesting(prob assumes both are blind/subconsciously influenced by joe 93 rants)
29min50.. penrose is "taken out" by colin walshe at corner flag, again in full view of ref and mcquillan.!no free,! unbelieveable!!
36min47.. penrose pulls down k duffy by arm.free to tyrone,ref duped again.
Quote from: weejim on June 18, 2014, 09:34:43 PM
watched 1st half on sky+ HD.
5min37. .dessie mone dives after being nudged from behind by c. McGinley. mone warned by ref.
8min30. vinny corey deliberately hand-trips McGinley TWICE in full view of linesman mcquillan and ref.free given to mon for pickup off ground.strange he sees pickup but not 2 hand trips which are much more obvious and cynical than mccurrys elbow trip.
9th min. .penrose pulled back by Kelly,whistle blows well after foul,ref gives free out for ?overcarrying. very harsh!
14min31.. k hughes slips as he shoots for score, ref DIDNT have his arm raised for advantage so why did he give a free when the ball landed short? there was NO foul.
16min11... vinny corey dives/goes down easily for soft free,sean protests,there was minimal contact. ?ref conned again!
23min07.. dessie mone goes down easily in box,after hesitation ref gives penalty,then consults via radio again with linesman/standby referee mcquillan and gives mcnabb yellow.it was barely a foul,def not a yellow
28min14.. drew wylie pulls big sean down behind him with his left hand right in front of mcquillan and ref.mon get free.sean doesn't bother protesting(prob assumes both are blind/subconsciously influenced by joe 93 rants)
29min50.. penrose is "taken out" by colin walshe at corner flag, again in full view of ref and mcquillan.!no free,! unbelieveable!!
36min47.. penrose pulls down k duffy by arm.free to tyrone,ref duped again.
If only the ref had HD.
Good objective analysis weejim ::)
Quote from: WT4E on June 18, 2014, 11:22:27 AM
Quote from: Main Street on June 18, 2014, 11:03:21 AM
Quote from: orangeman on June 18, 2014, 09:30:59 AM
Parkinson is siding with Sean here.
http://www.independent.ie/opinion/columnists/off-the-ball/pundits-need-to-alter-focus-and-stop-pops-at-cavanagh-30363277.html
"On occasions like this, and I've done it many times, you lock the defender's arm under yours and go to ground dragging him down with you. This is not conning anyone, it's simply drawing attention to the fact you're being fouled."
;D
This is called the tyrone defence.
Your honour, maybe I was clocked driving 80 in a 50 zone but I was only doing so to expose a weakness, that road signs are not a proper deterrent.
-
You seriously need to dry up?
I never realised that McManus or any of the other Monaghan players never used this tactic. ::)
Eh?? go dry up yourself with your whinging, deflection and looking for angles of justification.
The Parkinson defence has to be most ridiculous immature piece of spin ever to grace the gaa pages to justify dragging a player to ground.
Quote from: Main Street on June 18, 2014, 11:11:21 PM
Quote from: WT4E on June 18, 2014, 11:22:27 AM
Quote from: Main Street on June 18, 2014, 11:03:21 AM
Quote from: orangeman on June 18, 2014, 09:30:59 AM
Parkinson is siding with Sean here.
http://www.independent.ie/opinion/columnists/off-the-ball/pundits-need-to-alter-focus-and-stop-pops-at-cavanagh-30363277.html
"On occasions like this, and I've done it many times, you lock the defender's arm under yours and go to ground dragging him down with you. This is not conning anyone, it's simply drawing attention to the fact you're being fouled."
;D
This is called the tyrone defence.
Your honour, maybe I was clocked driving 80 in a 50 zone but I was only doing so to expose a weakness, that road signs are not a proper deterrent.
-
You seriously need to dry up?
I never realised that McManus or any of the other Monaghan players never used this tactic. ::)
Eh?? go dry up yourself with your whinging, deflection and looking for angles of justification.
The Parkinson defence has to be most ridiculous immature piece of spin ever to grace the gaa pages to justify dragging a player to ground.
No, using Spillane / Brolly as defence is worse.
Quote from: orangeman on June 18, 2014, 09:30:59 AM
Parkinson is siding with Sean here.
http://www.independent.ie/opinion/columnists/off-the-ball/pundits-need-to-alter-focus-and-stop-pops-at-cavanagh-30363277.html
So he says:
On occasions like this, and I've done it many times, you lock the defender's arm under yours and go to ground dragging him down with youThe point is, if you're the one doing the dragging down, you're the one committing the black card offence. That some pundits don't even seem to realise this...
Quote from: Main Street on June 18, 2014, 11:11:21 PM
Quote from: WT4E on June 18, 2014, 11:22:27 AM
Quote from: Main Street on June 18, 2014, 11:03:21 AM
Quote from: orangeman on June 18, 2014, 09:30:59 AM
Parkinson is siding with Sean here.
http://www.independent.ie/opinion/columnists/off-the-ball/pundits-need-to-alter-focus-and-stop-pops-at-cavanagh-30363277.html
"On occasions like this, and I've done it many times, you lock the defender's arm under yours and go to ground dragging him down with you. This is not conning anyone, it's simply drawing attention to the fact you're being fouled."
;D
This is called the tyrone defence.
Your honour, maybe I was clocked driving 80 in a 50 zone but I was only doing so to expose a weakness, that road signs are not a proper deterrent.
-
You seriously need to dry up?
I never realised that McManus or any of the other Monaghan players never used this tactic. ::)
Eh?? go dry up yourself with your whinging, deflection and looking for angles of justification.
The Parkinson defence has to be most ridiculous immature piece of spin ever to grace the gaa pages to justify dragging a player to ground.
I don't think I've done a lot of whinging!
You've been very prominent - enjoy ur win - Monaghan deserved it just get over it and move on!
Quote from: GrandMasterFlash on June 18, 2014, 02:07:56 PM
Lets be honest lads, revenge is sweet..
2014 hasn't run its course yet, not all games will be in Clones, and you might be wise to keep that counsel to yourself.
Quote from: Fear ón Srath Bán on June 19, 2014, 12:32:14 AM
Quote from: GrandMasterFlash on June 18, 2014, 02:07:56 PM
Lets be honest lads, revenge is sweet..
2014 hasn't run its course yet, not all games will be in Clones, and you might be wise to keep that counsel to yourself.
Wouldn't matter where it's played if we meet again...wee buns...wee buns.
You Monaghan boys are lucky that Stephen O'Neill was still suffering the effects of his bicycle fall lol
Quote from: babarino on June 19, 2014, 12:48:13 AM
Quote from: Fear ón Srath Bán on June 19, 2014, 12:32:14 AM
Quote from: GrandMasterFlash on June 18, 2014, 02:07:56 PM
Lets be honest lads, revenge is sweet..
2014 hasn't run its course yet, not all games will be in Clones, and you might be wise to keep that counsel to yourself.
Wouldn't matter where it's played if we meet again...wee buns...wee buns.
;)
Likely true alas, if it involves another hometown refereeing performance such as Mr Kinsella's of Sunday last :P
Good luck to your lot, though you'ĺl need to increase your returns from play (in the absence of such a sympathetic ref).
Quote from: babarino on June 19, 2014, 12:48:13 AM
Quote from: Fear ón Srath Bán on June 19, 2014, 12:32:14 AM
Quote from: GrandMasterFlash on June 18, 2014, 02:07:56 PM
Lets be honest lads, revenge is sweet..
2014 hasn't run its course yet, not all games will be in Clones, and you might be wise to keep that counsel to yourself.
Wouldn't matter where it's played if we meet again...wee buns...wee buns.
Absolutely - that one point victory when Tyrone played exceptionally poorly and missed a free to equalise must fill you with an abundance of confidence.
Quote from: BennyHarp on June 19, 2014, 11:36:20 AM
Quote from: babarino on June 19, 2014, 12:48:13 AM
Quote from: Fear ón Srath Bán on June 19, 2014, 12:32:14 AM
Quote from: GrandMasterFlash on June 18, 2014, 02:07:56 PM
Lets be honest lads, revenge is sweet..
2014 hasn't run its course yet, not all games will be in Clones, and you might be wise to keep that counsel to yourself.
Wouldn't matter where it's played if we meet again...wee buns...wee buns.
Absolutely - that one point victory when Tyrone played exceptionally poorly and missed a free to equalise must fill you with an abundance of confidence.
Think you're missing the point here Benny. The "wee buns" comment I'd imagine is in relation to very similar comments by your fellow county men before the game that ye would win this easily. Don't take everything to heart.
Quote from: rrhf on June 18, 2014, 08:45:12 PM
Quote from: AZOffaly on June 18, 2014, 03:02:08 PM
Maybe so. I'm just having a go at Parkinson.
Wooly is a breath of fresh air.
Parkinson's article has to be the most ridiculous thing I've ever read... why is this guy even near it? I think he won a Leinster once and called the greatest GAA manager of all time a bluffer but other than that?
Pulling a mans arm in under you and falling is conning the ref! It gets him thinking the man is pulling you or holding you back when he actually can't get his arm away.
Bottom line is I don't doubt Hughes committed a foul but Cavanagh should have received a black card for pulling him on top of himself. Cavanagh is asking "Why always me?" because he feels like Mario Ballotelli... the 2 lads will find the answer in the mirror.
Dozens of players do it at every level of the game. Doesn't make it any more palatable. It should be highlighted.
Cavanagh has possibly the highest media profile of any player in the GAA. He does every press function that it's possible to do.
It might go a bit of the way to explaining 'why me'.
Quote from: sheamy on June 19, 2014, 12:38:02 PM
Dozens of players do it at every level of the game. Doesn't make it any more palatable. It should be highlighted.
Cavanagh has possibly the highest media profile of any player in the GAA. He does every press function that it's possible to do.
It might go a bit of the way to explaining 'why me'.
It might also be because his style of play were he is one of the very few players who directly runs at defences and takes them on meaning that defenders tend to stop him by any means - often by fouling him. As such it is often him who finds himself in these situations. How many times in that last 10 mins alone did Cavanagh run at that Monaghan defence and create panic? His plight is highlighted because he is a superbly direct footballer who runs at defences and feck all to do with the fact that he attends functions.
Quote from: BennyHarp on June 19, 2014, 12:58:41 PM
Quote from: sheamy on June 19, 2014, 12:38:02 PM
Dozens of players do it at every level of the game. Doesn't make it any more palatable. It should be highlighted.
Cavanagh has possibly the highest media profile of any player in the GAA. He does every press function that it's possible to do.
It might go a bit of the way to explaining 'why me'.
It might also be because his style of play were he is one of the very few players who directly runs at defences and takes them on meaning that defenders tend to stop him by any means - often by fouling him. As such it is often him who finds himself in these situations. How many times in that last 10 mins alone did Cavanagh run at that Monaghan defence and create panic? His plight is highlighted because he is a superbly direct footballer who runs at defences and feck all to do with the fact that he attends functions.
A lot of truth in that. He finds himself in that situation more than most.
Quote from: screenexile on June 19, 2014, 12:31:56 PM
Quote from: rrhf on June 18, 2014, 08:45:12 PM
Quote from: AZOffaly on June 18, 2014, 03:02:08 PM
Maybe so. I'm just having a go at Parkinson.
Wooly is a breath of fresh air.
Parkinson's article has to be the most ridiculous thing I've ever read... why is this guy even near it? I think he won a Leinster once and called the greatest GAA manager of all time a bluffer but other than that?
Pulling a mans arm in under you and falling is conning the ref! It gets him thinking the man is pulling you or holding you back when he actually can't get his arm away.
Bottom line is I don't doubt Hughes committed a foul but Cavanagh should have received a black card for pulling him on top of himself. Cavanagh is asking "Why always me?" because he feels like Mario Ballotelli... the 2 lads will find the answer in the mirror.
Did the top burst off the Derry tin of self loathing... starting to spill over...
Quote from: BennyHarp on June 19, 2014, 12:58:41 PM
Quote from: sheamy on June 19, 2014, 12:38:02 PM
Dozens of players do it at every level of the game. Doesn't make it any more palatable. It should be highlighted.
Cavanagh has possibly the highest media profile of any player in the GAA. He does every press function that it's possible to do.
It might go a bit of the way to explaining 'why me'.
It might also be because his style of play were he is one of the very few players who directly runs at defences and takes them on meaning that defenders tend to stop him by any means - often by fouling him. As such it is often him who finds himself in these situations. How many times in that last 10 mins alone did Cavanagh run at that Monaghan defence and create panic? His plight is highlighted because he is a superbly direct footballer who runs at defences and feck all to do with the fact that he attends functions.
Why are all the tricks of the trade not being highlighted then? How often do we see jerseys being pulled or men being pushed yet nothing is done about it? Some hypocrites about too, I remember the crying about the number of steps Cavanagh took against Dublin in 2008 yet not too much talked about the pulling that was going on that prevented him from playing within the correct nuymber of allocated steps hence the referee allowing him an advantage.
Decent interview with him today. I think sometimes the likes of Brolly forget that these lads are amateur at the end of the day, and their families are very exposed. Him making personal attacks on a player is more than just Sunday afternoon 'entertainment'.
By Arthur Sullivan
Seán Cavanagh says he has no regrets about not taking the late free that could have rescued a draw for Tyrone in their defeat to Monaghan at the weekend.
Cavanagh, who kicked two crucial late frees to secure a draw for Tyrone in their preliminary round game against Down last month, opted not to take the kick, giving it instead to goalkeeper Niall Morgan, whose effort from the difficult set-piece trailed to the right and wide.
"Genuinely, it was a combination that I had been fouled a couple of times and I was struggling," said Cavanagh yesterday at an event to mark PwC's continued partnership with the GPA.
"Even if I wasn't, I still would have given it to Niall. Niall is unbelievable. Last night (Tuesday) at training he was kicking them from 65 metres and that's no exaggeration. He's unbelievable at them. I think if the situation arose again I would still give it to him.
"He can miss but Niall would put over nine out of 10 of those whereas I would put over five or six out of 10 of those. It's one of the ones that he missed on Sunday but hopefully he will learn from experience and it will make him a stronger and better player."
Cavanagh admitted that Tyrone were far from at their best in the 1-12 to 0-14 defeat to Monaghan, but he is confident they can re-group in the qualifiers, as they did in last year's championship having lost to Donegal at the same stage.
"We just didn't perform, simple as that," he said. "We knew at half-time we were playing in second, third gear and we just couldn't pull it back quick enough. Obviously they got the goal at the right time. It was hard after that trying to pull it back.
"We only really started trying to cut loose in the last 10 or 15 minutes but up to that it was...give credit to Monaghan, they know how to defend and they contained us, but at the same time, we are disappointed with how we attacked in particular. It probably made life a little bit easier for them than we would have liked to but on the day, we can't have any complaints. They were the better side and it will take a good team to beat them.
"We know we have got more in us and we have to find a way to try and get a few of our key men back in through the Qualifiers for a bit of game time. The likes of Joe McMahon and guys like that. We have to use the Qualifiers to our best advantage. A few guys haven't got enough game time so hopefully a bit of game time and hopefully get back where we know we should be at."
He praised Monaghan's defensive organisation, and said their ability to break quickly into attack from defence reminded him of Donegal two years ago.
"They are a good side and you would imagine that they would get through Armagh and they will meet Donegal in the Ulster final," he said. "That will be a mammoth game because both teams play similar systems and it will take a good team to beat both teams in this year's championship because they will always make life difficult for you."
Cavanagh also responded to criticism of him from RTÉ pundit Joe Brolly, who singled him out following the Monaghan game for what the Derry analyst deemed to be a deliberate attempt from Cavanagh to draw a foul from a challenge from Darren Hughes.
"Obviously I've been here before," said Cavanagh, referencing criticism from Brolly for a tackle he made on Monaghan's Conor McManus in the All-Ireland quarter-final last year, "and I'm beginning to feel a little bit like Mario Balotelli!
"You know what, I find it hard to understand and I would be completely honest with you guys, I remember saying to Darren right after that challenge...look from last year's match when we played them in Croke Park, I remember saying to Darren right after that challenge, 'Look that was hard on you, you should never have got booked for it.'
Cavanagh said he wasn't overly upset by the criticism, but he admitted that elements of him are "annoying" and that it affects those close to him as well.
"He's not someone that I would know very much," said Cavanagh of Brolly. "I would bump into most pundits somewhere along the line but I would never have really met Joe. I don't understand it. Yet again, it's my family, my friends, my wife.
"My wife is a local GP, she's coming home to me and saying, 'Oh, people from all cross sections of the community are complaining, are talking about you today again'. And you're just going, 'right...' It's disappointing from that point of view because it does affect you.
"Whether it affects you directly...it didn't worry me after Sunday because, like last year, I was more worried and disappointed by the fact we lost the game. But in the days after it, your family and friends start telling you stories about people who aren't that clued in on GAA and are telling them that, yet again, I'm some bad boy of GAA that is always up to these sort of cheating tactics, or something. To me, it couldn't be further from the truth and that's what's disappointing."
Quote from: BennyHarp on June 19, 2014, 12:58:41 PM
Quote from: sheamy on June 19, 2014, 12:38:02 PM
Dozens of players do it at every level of the game. Doesn't make it any more palatable. It should be highlighted.
Cavanagh has possibly the highest media profile of any player in the GAA. He does every press function that it's possible to do.
It might go a bit of the way to explaining 'why me'.
It might also be because his style of play were he is one of the very few players who directly runs at defences and takes them on meaning that defenders tend to stop him by any means - often by fouling him. As such it is often him who finds himself in these situations. How many times in that last 10 mins alone did Cavanagh run at that Monaghan defence and create panic? His plight is highlighted because he is a superbly direct footballer who runs at defences and feck all to do with the fact that he attends functions.
Don't disagree. I said 'a bit of the way'. We're still talking about this 4-5 days on. Why? Because he did press yesterday to promote the GPA and PWC with this Ballotelli line. He knows what he is at so can't complain about media coverage when he doesn't like it. That's my point.
He is an absolutely excellent footballer. No angel on the field mind but does get a lot of abuse on it as well.
Quote from: Maguire01 on June 18, 2014, 11:02:02 PM
Quote from: weejim on June 18, 2014, 09:34:43 PM
watched 1st half on sky+ HD.
5min37. .dessie mone dives after being nudged from behind by c. McGinley. mone warned by ref.
8min30. vinny corey deliberately hand-trips McGinley TWICE in full view of linesman mcquillan and ref.free given to mon for pickup off ground.strange he sees pickup but not 2 hand trips which are much more obvious and cynical than mccurrys elbow trip.
9th min. .penrose pulled back by Kelly,whistle blows well after foul,ref gives free out for ?overcarrying. very harsh!
14min31.. k hughes slips as he shoots for score, ref DIDNT have his arm raised for advantage so why did he give a free when the ball landed short? there was NO foul.
16min11... vinny corey dives/goes down easily for soft free,sean protests,there was minimal contact. ?ref conned again!
23min07.. dessie mone goes down easily in box,after hesitation ref gives penalty,then consults via radio again with linesman/standby referee mcquillan and gives mcnabb yellow.it was barely a foul,def not a yellow
28min14.. drew wylie pulls big sean down behind him with his left hand right in front of mcquillan and ref.mon get free.sean doesn't bother protesting(prob assumes both are blind/subconsciously influenced by joe 93 rants)
29min50.. penrose is "taken out" by colin walshe at corner flag, again in full view of ref and mcquillan.!no free,! unbelieveable!!
36min47.. penrose pulls down k duffy by arm.free to tyrone,ref duped again.
If only the ref had HD.
If only Joe Brolly had HD. Or a pair of eyes. Or if only people would talk about these things above that we all witnessed, instead of every mouthpiece in Ireland arguing blindly about whatever Joe has told them to think. Incidentally, the Vinny Corey hand trip occurred almost within touching distance of the linesman Joe McQuillan.
So it's not possible for someone who watched the game on BBC and saw absolutely no RTE coverage of the game to draw the conclusion that they think Cavanagh dived a lot? Is that what you're saying? Every conclusion that Cavanagh dived a lot must have been influenced by Joe Brolly?
You're giving Joe Brolly a lot of credibilitiy there. As well as various other flaws in your argument...
Is there an 11th commandment with some of you Tyrone posters sometimes "Thou shalt not question Tyrone"?
Quote from: imtommygunn on June 19, 2014, 02:21:49 PM
Is there an 11th commandment with some of you Tyrone posters sometimes "Thou shalt not question Tyrone"?
It seems the Tyrone posters aren't on their own, the mods, neither of who are from Tyrone, don't allow topics that are in any way critical of Tyrone and especially their manager.
Quote from: imtommygunn on June 19, 2014, 02:21:49 PM
So it's not possible for someone who watched the game on BBC and saw absolutely no RTE coverage of the game to draw the conclusion that they think Cavanagh dived a lot? Is that what you're saying? Every conclusion that Cavanagh dived a lot must have been influenced by Joe Brolly?
You're giving Joe Brolly a lot of credibilitiy there. As well as various other flaws in your argument...
Is there an 11th commandment with some of you Tyrone posters sometimes "Thou shalt not question Tyrone"?
So it's just a coincidence that the widespread "Cavanagh's a diver" thing only started two Tyrone games ago, when Joe first went on a rant about it? Odd too that the general public aren't hounding Dessie Mone for his diving on Sunday too then, you know, saying as people aren't just being led by Brolly like?
Cavanagh is getting the thick end of this as he is now the main culprit in a team who are famous for diving. It started on a mass scale in the 2003 Ulster championship. Handy frees in and around the 14/21, easy scores. Its continued ever since. Do parts the media / certain pundits have it in for Tyrone? Maybe, but its been earned. Cut out the diving and the so called anti-Tyrone agenda ends.
Diving is a fierce blight on what is a physical / manly game
Quote from: J OGorman on June 19, 2014, 02:56:41 PM
Cavanagh is getting the thick end of this as he is now the main culprit in a team who are famous for diving. It started on a mass scale in the 2003 Ulster championship. Handy frees in and around the 14/21, easy scores. Its continued ever since. Do parts the media / certain pundits have it in for Tyrone? Maybe, but its been earned. Cut out the diving and the so called anti-Tyrone agenda ends.
Diving is a fierce blight on what is a physical / manly game
OMG
I have no words!
Quote from: J OGorman on June 19, 2014, 02:56:41 PM
Cavanagh is getting the thick end of this as he is now the main culprit in a team who are famous for diving. It started on a mass scale in the 2003 Ulster championship. Handy frees in and around the 14/21, easy scores. Its continued ever since. Do parts the media / certain pundits have it in for Tyrone? Maybe, but its been earned. Cut out the diving and the so called anti-Tyrone agenda ends.
Diving is a fierce blight on what is a physical / manly game
Utter drivel. To pick out Tyrone as being any worse than any other team is an opinion based on nothing more than buying the waffle being spouted in the RTE studio. Dessie Mone gave a couple of masterclasses in diving last day out. Does anyone care? No. Why? Sure Joe hasn't told us to worry about him. It's only "cheating" when Tyrone do it.
Quote from: Nally Stand on June 19, 2014, 03:04:57 PM
Quote from: J OGorman on June 19, 2014, 02:56:41 PM
Cavanagh is getting the thick end of this as he is now the main culprit in a team who are famous for diving. It started on a mass scale in the 2003 Ulster championship. Handy frees in and around the 14/21, easy scores. Its continued ever since. Do parts the media / certain pundits have it in for Tyrone? Maybe, but its been earned. Cut out the diving and the so called anti-Tyrone agenda ends.
Diving is a fierce blight on what is a physical / manly game
Utter drivel. To pick out Tyrone as being any worse than any other team is an opinion based on nothing more than buying the waffle being spouted in the RTE studio. Dessie Mone gave a couple of masterclasses in diving last day out. Does anyone care? No. Why? Sure Joe hasn't told us to worry about him. It's only "cheating" when Tyrone do it.
but its not drivel. Tyrone are, by some stretch the market leaders here. I dont anyone to tell me that. If it was Donegal, Kerry whoever, I'd call it the same. Its an anti-diving rant
Sean Cavanagh set to appear in the new Despicable Me Movie . . .
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CEqD19bidbc
When Derry finally produce a footballer capable of lacing Cavanaghs boots we will then start to put this down as something other than nasty begrudgery on behalf of you guys etc..
Quote from: J OGorman on June 19, 2014, 03:08:50 PM
Quote from: Nally Stand on June 19, 2014, 03:04:57 PM
Quote from: J OGorman on June 19, 2014, 02:56:41 PM
Cavanagh is getting the thick end of this as he is now the main culprit in a team who are famous for diving. It started on a mass scale in the 2003 Ulster championship. Handy frees in and around the 14/21, easy scores. Its continued ever since. Do parts the media / certain pundits have it in for Tyrone? Maybe, but its been earned. Cut out the diving and the so called anti-Tyrone agenda ends.
Diving is a fierce blight on what is a physical / manly game
Utter drivel. To pick out Tyrone as being any worse than any other team is an opinion based on nothing more than buying the waffle being spouted in the RTE studio. Dessie Mone gave a couple of masterclasses in diving last day out. Does anyone care? No. Why? Sure Joe hasn't told us to worry about him. It's only "cheating" when Tyrone do it.
but its not drivel. Tyrone are, by some stretch the market leaders here. I dont anyone to tell me that. If it was Donegal, Kerry whoever, I'd call it the same. Its an anti-diving rant
Seriously though - why do you think Dessie Mone's diving (see the ridiculous dive from McGinley's bump, never mind the penalty) wasnt highlighted to at least show balance on the RTE analysis? To only rant about Cavanagh (for a seecond time) does seem to me to be a little bit pre-mediatated and opens them up for suggstions of bias.
suggestion.....
Quote from: J OGorman on June 19, 2014, 03:08:50 PM
Quote from: Nally Stand on June 19, 2014, 03:04:57 PM
Quote from: J OGorman on June 19, 2014, 02:56:41 PM
Cavanagh is getting the thick end of this as he is now the main culprit in a team who are famous for diving. It started on a mass scale in the 2003 Ulster championship. Handy frees in and around the 14/21, easy scores. Its continued ever since. Do parts the media / certain pundits have it in for Tyrone? Maybe, but its been earned. Cut out the diving and the so called anti-Tyrone agenda ends.
Diving is a fierce blight on what is a physical / manly game
Utter drivel. To pick out Tyrone as being any worse than any other team is an opinion based on nothing more than buying the waffle being spouted in the RTE studio. Dessie Mone gave a couple of masterclasses in diving last day out. Does anyone care? No. Why? Sure Joe hasn't told us to worry about him. It's only "cheating" when Tyrone do it.
but its not drivel. Tyrone are, by some stretch the market leaders here. I dont anyone to tell me that. If it was Donegal, Kerry whoever, I'd call it the same. Its an anti-diving rant
It's drivel of the highest order, spouted by those who need good ol' Joe to tell them what to think. An anti-diving rant? Is that why you're giving Mone such a hard time? Oh wait....
Quote from: Nally Stand on June 19, 2014, 02:45:47 PM
Quote from: imtommygunn on June 19, 2014, 02:21:49 PM
So it's not possible for someone who watched the game on BBC and saw absolutely no RTE coverage of the game to draw the conclusion that they think Cavanagh dived a lot? Is that what you're saying? Every conclusion that Cavanagh dived a lot must have been influenced by Joe Brolly?
You're giving Joe Brolly a lot of credibilitiy there. As well as various other flaws in your argument...
Is there an 11th commandment with some of you Tyrone posters sometimes "Thou shalt not question Tyrone"?
So it's just a coincidence that the widespread "Cavanagh's a diver" thing only started two Tyrone games ago, when Joe first went on a rant about it? Odd too that the general public aren't hounding Dessie Mone for his diving on Sunday too then, you know, saying as people aren't just being led by Brolly like?
Dessie Mone "out Cavanaghed" Cavanagh at one point on sunday. Yes he dives - Dessie Mone always pushed the boundaries at corner back too. That doesn't excuse him.
Last 15 of Sunday any of the fouls that were "played for" by Cavanagh involved high tackles. HIgh tackles all on a 6'3''+ guy. All by people smaller than him. This dominated the game. All these kind of tackles are yellow or black cards when they're penalised which they mainly are. Not only are these getting scores - they're getting players put either off or in precarious positions. Also they make opposition scared to tackle him. Scared to tackle because they don't want to concede a foul even when they are disciplined in their tackling they are likely to concede a foul because referees are getting suckered in.
I don't know if Joe Brolly said any of that - mainly because I didn't listen to him but those are my personal views on it.
Irrespective of who's at it diving has to stop in the game as it is becomign a blight. Cavanagh is the most high profile guy at it - but he's also the most guilty of it. Being the most high profile doesn't help him but if he wasn't doing it no one would be picking on him?
If Cavanagh is not the most guilty of it and is being victimised then tell me who's worse? Dessie Mone dives but he's not worse than Cavanagh or do you think he is?
Quote from: rrhf on June 19, 2014, 03:24:04 PM
When Derry finally produce a footballer capable of lacing Cavanaghs boots we will then start to put this down as something other than nasty begrudgery on behalf of you guys etc..
Fantastic! Football wasn't invented in 2003 and we had plenty of lads fit to lace Cavanagh's boots throughout the 90s! I don't know what exactly I'm supposed to be begrudging as the current Tyrone team haven't achieved anything of real note in a long time.
For the record I've been on about Sean Cavanagh's diving since funnily enough 2003 when he shamefully got Padraig O'Kane sent off in Casement Park long before Brolly started sticking the boot in... he needs to own up to it and cut it the f**k out. Nobody is doubting that when he's not falling around the place he's one of the top footballers in Ireland but for God's sake would he just stop rolling around the place!!!!
IN THE NAME OF GOD PLEASE CLOSE THIS TOPIC!
Quote from: The_Beard on June 19, 2014, 04:09:23 PM
IN THE NAME OF GOD PLEASE CLOSE THIS TOPIC!
This mans right close the thread - take a vote - type:
CLOSE if you agree
CLOSE
CLOSE
Quote from: The_Beard on June 19, 2014, 04:09:23 PM
IN THE NAME OF GOD PLEASE CLOSE THIS TOPIC!
If only you had the option of not clicking on the thread!
Have to get my spake in if this does close!.
I always thought giving Tyrone a hammering in the championship would be one of the most satisfying days as a Monaghan supporter!.
But I think I'm wrong...... Beating them by a point and listening to the whinging since is probably even better!!!!
Yeoo!!! Well done lads, its been a great week! UPMONAGHANSAYSWE!! :D :D
Ffs, it's a discussion board. If people still want to discuss what's happened then it's still a viable thread. If Cavanagh comes out with that Balotelli statement in the press then of course people are going to discuss it. As someone said, don't open the thread if you aren't interested.
Did Brolly not say live on the Sunday game that he used buy free's but it was a different type of cynicism?
watched 2nd half on sky hd box;
41min.44; Malone celebrates scoring goal(7 steps) by rushing straight to p harte to goad him.thankfully peter doesn't re-act.
44.47; dick collision at M/f.tyrone have possession.dick rolling around on ground. ?head injury,ref stops play.
46.00; dicks up again,he's ok.
47.19; dick down again, holding head again and rolling around even more this time. stevie oneill is disgusted,slo mo shows no/minimal contact to head area.stevie yellow card .(wrong again ref)(mc quillan 4 ft away again)
48.16; dick up again, he's ok again!
50.00; tyrone get 45, ball-boy kicks ball away when tyrone go to retrieve it.(tyrone aren't allowed ball-boy).
55.29; dessie mone does well to draw free,runs between 2 tyrone defenders,goes down ,and stays down.
58.11; high tackle/chop down on sean by dick,tyrone free, No tick/card for dick???
58.26; mc curry bottled up,ball breaks for tyrone, but ref calls play back,free to mon,mc curry black card , v harsh .
59.55; bear hug and pull down on sean by Malone,deliberate and cynical,black card correct.
61.20; Sean targeted again,reckless high tackle by mone, ref consults again,yellow card.
63.13; line ball to monaghan given by mc quillan, ball clearly goes out off mon no.19 k oconnell who is now laughing at wrong call.
63.53; Drew wylie goes down, stays down, ??even more xtra time!
PS ; dick playing well,isnt showing any after-effects of 2 head injuries.(he's a tough nut).
66.15; dick tries to take sean out again, but he lands on his arse, sean progresses.
5secs later; sean pulled down again by Darren hughes,sean holds darrens arm' hughes black card.
69.50; gallogly bear hugs sean twice,sean goes down eventually when dick joins in,free in ,no card.
71.18; sean bear hugs Dick,dick goes down easily,( ? to get sean a black card).gets yellow as it was not a pull-DOWN.
72.17; Tyrone break on attach,final whistle.
2 MINS xtra time played, there were 3MINS xtra time played 1st half with far fewer injuries/stoppages, AMAZING!!!
SOMEONE NEEDS TO GET A SKY+ BOX INTO RTE STUDIO ASAP SO WE CAN HAVE SOME PROPER ANALYSIS OF GAMES
So - Tyrone won? Monaghan are cheats? Ref was up for Monaghan? Tyrone are pure as the driven snow? ::)
Quote from: Rossfan on June 19, 2014, 08:27:25 PM
So - Tyrone won? Monaghan are cheats? Ref was up for Monaghan? Tyrone are pure as the driven snow? ::)
Did you watch it again on Sky+ too?
The game is over
what a bunch of whingers on here, the best team won , get over it !!!!
some teams can give a beating but not take one!
Look on the day tyrone were second best , fintan kelly class act @ corner back, gave penrose a roasting
Quote from: BennyHarp on June 19, 2014, 05:54:58 PM
Ffs, it's a discussion board. If people still want to discuss what's happened then it's still a viable thread. If Cavanagh comes out with that Balotelli statement in the press then of course people are going to discuss it. As someone said, don't open the thread if you aren't interested.
Start a thread on Sean Cavanagh then.
Quote from: The_Beard on June 19, 2014, 09:40:16 PM
Quote from: BennyHarp on June 19, 2014, 05:54:58 PM
Ffs, it's a discussion board. If people still want to discuss what's happened then it's still a viable thread. If Cavanagh comes out with that Balotelli statement in the press then of course people are going to discuss it. As someone said, don't open the thread if you aren't interested.
Start a thread on Sean Cavanagh then.
The incident that's being discussed happened in this game. Seriously, it's easy just to not open the thread. It seems strange that someone comes onto a discussion board to tell people to stop discussing a topic.
Quote from: BennyHarp on June 19, 2014, 09:56:38 PM
Quote from: The_Beard on June 19, 2014, 09:40:16 PM
Quote from: BennyHarp on June 19, 2014, 05:54:58 PM
Ffs, it's a discussion board. If people still want to discuss what's happened then it's still a viable thread. If Cavanagh comes out with that Balotelli statement in the press then of course people are going to discuss it. As someone said, don't open the thread if you aren't interested.
Start a thread on Sean Cavanagh then.
The incident that's being discussed happened in this game. Seriously, it's easy just to not open the thread. It seems strange that someone comes onto a discussion board to tell people to stop discussing a topic.
My point is that it's getting a bit boring / repetitive. Nothing of note has been added to this thread in days. The same crap regurgitated by those arguing for/against Sean Cavanagh.
I do understand the concept of a discussion board and others who have spent much longer than me posting on here have also backed closing the thread. But I'll take your advice and refrain from clicking into it.
Quote from: Nally Stand on June 19, 2014, 02:45:47 PM
Quote from: imtommygunn on June 19, 2014, 02:21:49 PM
So it's not possible for someone who watched the game on BBC and saw absolutely no RTE coverage of the game to draw the conclusion that they think Cavanagh dived a lot? Is that what you're saying? Every conclusion that Cavanagh dived a lot must have been influenced by Joe Brolly?
You're giving Joe Brolly a lot of credibilitiy there. As well as various other flaws in your argument...
Is there an 11th commandment with some of you Tyrone posters sometimes "Thou shalt not question Tyrone"?
So it's just a coincidence that the widespread "Cavanagh's a diver" thing only started two Tyrone games ago, when Joe first went on a rant about it? Odd too that the general public aren't hounding Dessie Mone for his diving on Sunday too then, you know, saying as people aren't just being led by Brolly like?
Sean Cavanagh has been a diver since he first lined out for Tyrone. I seen it from 10 yards away when he feigned injury when he wasn't touched to get a man sent off and that's 10 years ago. That said there are plenty more than him at it.
Quote from: The_Beard on June 19, 2014, 10:03:12 PM
Quote from: BennyHarp on June 19, 2014, 09:56:38 PM
Quote from: The_Beard on June 19, 2014, 09:40:16 PM
Quote from: BennyHarp on June 19, 2014, 05:54:58 PM
Ffs, it's a discussion board. If people still want to discuss what's happened then it's still a viable thread. If Cavanagh comes out with that Balotelli statement in the press then of course people are going to discuss it. As someone said, don't open the thread if you aren't interested.
Start a thread on Sean Cavanagh then.
The incident that's being discussed happened in this game. Seriously, it's easy just to not open the thread. It seems strange that someone comes onto a discussion board to tell people to stop discussing a topic.
My point is that it's getting a bit boring / repetitive. Nothing of note has been added to this thread in days. The same crap regurgitated by those arguing for/against Sean Cavanagh.
I do understand the concept of a discussion board and others who have spent much longer than me posting on here have also backed closing the thread. But I'll take your advice and refrain from clicking into it.
Hear hear
CLOSE
Brolly suffers from Obsessive Compulsive Disorder where Tyrone are concerned, and there's no shortage of numpties to leap into full agreement with him when his usual tirade spews forth. He's a sensationalist megalomaniac, and there are no lengths to which he will not stretch himself to keep his, rather pathetic, persona in lights. There are no fools like willing fools, and none so twisted in their 'analysis' as Brolly, and great bedfellows they both make.
Edit And I just couldn't be arsed subjecting my earholes to Brolly (and his RTE ilk) anymore, regardless of who's actually playing.
Quote from: weejim on June 19, 2014, 08:13:31 PM
watched 2nd half on sky hd box;
41min.44; Malone celebrates scoring goal(7 steps) by rushing straight to p harte to goad him.thankfully peter doesn't re-act.
44.47; dick collision at M/f.tyrone have possession.dick rolling around on ground. ?head injury,ref stops play.
46.00; dicks up again,he's ok.
47.19; dick down again, holding head again and rolling around even more this time. stevie oneill is disgusted,slo mo shows no/minimal contact to head area.stevie yellow card .(wrong again ref)(mc quillan 4 ft away again)
48.16; dick up again, he's ok again!
50.00; tyrone get 45, ball-boy kicks ball away when tyrone go to retrieve it.(tyrone aren't allowed ball-boy).
55.29; dessie mone does well to draw free,runs between 2 tyrone defenders,goes down ,and stays down.
58.11; high tackle/chop down on sean by dick,tyrone free, No tick/card for dick???
58.26; mc curry bottled up,ball breaks for tyrone, but ref calls play back,free to mon,mc curry black card , v harsh .
59.55; bear hug and pull down on sean by Malone,deliberate and cynical,black card correct.
61.20; Sean targeted again,reckless high tackle by mone, ref consults again,yellow card.
63.13; line ball to monaghan given by mc quillan, ball clearly goes out off mon no.19 k oconnell who is now laughing at wrong call.
63.53; Drew wylie goes down, stays down, ??even more xtra time!
PS ; dick playing well,isnt showing any after-effects of 2 head injuries.(he's a tough nut).
66.15; dick tries to take sean out again, but he lands on his arse, sean progresses.
5secs later; sean pulled down again by Darren hughes,sean holds darrens arm' hughes black card.
69.50; gallogly bear hugs sean twice,sean goes down eventually when dick joins in,free in ,no card.
71.18; sean bear hugs Dick,dick goes down easily,( ? to get sean a black card).gets yellow as it was not a pull-DOWN.
72.17; Tyrone break on attach,final whistle.
2 MINS xtra time played, there were 3MINS xtra time played 1st half with far fewer injuries/stoppages, AMAZING!!!
SOMEONE NEEDS TO GET A SKY+ BOX INTO RTE STUDIO ASAP SO WE CAN HAVE SOME PROPER ANALYSIS OF GAMES
Wow! Every single call went against Tyrone! Here, we'll take Louth and you can take Armagh. ::)
Quote from: Maguire01 on June 19, 2014, 11:40:35 PM
Quote from: weejim on June 19, 2014, 08:13:31 PM
watched 2nd half on sky hd box;
41min.44; Malone celebrates scoring goal(7 steps) by rushing straight to p harte to goad him.thankfully peter doesn't re-act.
44.47; dick collision at M/f.tyrone have possession.dick rolling around on ground. ?head injury,ref stops play.
46.00; dicks up again,he's ok.
47.19; dick down again, holding head again and rolling around even more this time. stevie oneill is disgusted,slo mo shows no/minimal contact to head area.stevie yellow card .(wrong again ref)(mc quillan 4 ft away again)
48.16; dick up again, he's ok again!
50.00; tyrone get 45, ball-boy kicks ball away when tyrone go to retrieve it.(tyrone aren't allowed ball-boy).
55.29; dessie mone does well to draw free,runs between 2 tyrone defenders,goes down ,and stays down.
58.11; high tackle/chop down on sean by dick,tyrone free, No tick/card for dick???
58.26; mc curry bottled up,ball breaks for tyrone, but ref calls play back,free to mon,mc curry black card , v harsh .
59.55; bear hug and pull down on sean by Malone,deliberate and cynical,black card correct.
61.20; Sean targeted again,reckless high tackle by mone, ref consults again,yellow card.
63.13; line ball to monaghan given by mc quillan, ball clearly goes out off mon no.19 k oconnell who is now laughing at wrong call.
63.53; Drew wylie goes down, stays down, ??even more xtra time!
PS ; dick playing well,isnt showing any after-effects of 2 head injuries.(he's a tough nut).
66.15; dick tries to take sean out again, but he lands on his arse, sean progresses.
5secs later; sean pulled down again by Darren hughes,sean holds darrens arm' hughes black card.
69.50; gallogly bear hugs sean twice,sean goes down eventually when dick joins in,free in ,no card.
71.18; sean bear hugs Dick,dick goes down easily,( ? to get sean a black card).gets yellow as it was not a pull-DOWN.
72.17; Tyrone break on attach,final whistle.
2 MINS xtra time played, there were 3MINS xtra time played 1st half with far fewer injuries/stoppages, AMAZING!!!
SOMEONE NEEDS TO GET A SKY+ BOX INTO RTE STUDIO ASAP SO WE CAN HAVE SOME PROPER ANALYSIS OF GAMES
Wow! Every single call went against Tyrone! Here, we'll take Louth and you can take Armagh. ::)
There seems to be a lot of focus on dick here.
Quote from: muppet on June 19, 2014, 11:55:36 PM
There seems to be a lot of focus on dick here.
Give a Dick a Mone.
Tyrone talking about cheating - this has to be a wind up.
?did u see the game, ? u don't believe these incidents actually all happened. ?does the fact that nobody is disputing any of them tell u anything?
Wise up wee fool
I see O'Neill has got another login.
Before this thread gets closed, hopefully sooner rather than later, but before it does, one thing has been bothering me from early on.
What the feck is the references to "wee buns" about???? :-\
Quote from: weejim on June 20, 2014, 11:01:30 AM
?did u see the game, ? u don't believe these incidents actually all happened. ?does the fact that nobody is disputing any of them tell u anything?
Does it not tell you that a ludicrously one sided analysis of the game was done and no one took it particularly seriously...
Quote from: Bingo on June 20, 2014, 11:11:18 AM
I see O'Neill has got another login.
Before this thread gets closed, hopefully sooner rather than later, but before it does, one thing has been bothering me from early on.
What the feck is the references to "wee buns" about???? :-\
http://www.urbandictionary.com/define.php?term=wee%20buns
Quote from: Bingo on June 20, 2014, 11:11:18 AM
I see O'Neill has got another login.
Before this thread gets closed, hopefully sooner rather than later, but before it does, one thing has been bothering me from early on.
What the feck is the references to "wee buns" about???? :-\
In the run up to the game, FOSB twice posted this was going to be an easy win for Tyrone, using Belfast idiom 'wee buns'; they'd say 'piece of piss' or 'easy peasy' elsewhere. Perhaps he was in wind up mode, so we'll let it go.
Quote from: Nally Stand on June 19, 2014, 02:45:47 PM
Quote from: imtommygunn on June 19, 2014, 02:21:49 PM
So it's not possible for someone who watched the game on BBC and saw absolutely no RTE coverage of the game to draw the conclusion that they think Cavanagh dived a lot? Is that what you're saying? Every conclusion that Cavanagh dived a lot must have been influenced by Joe Brolly?
You're giving Joe Brolly a lot of credibilitiy there. As well as various other flaws in your argument...
Is there an 11th commandment with some of you Tyrone posters sometimes "Thou shalt not question Tyrone"?
So it's just a coincidence that the widespread "Cavanagh's a diver" thing only started two Tyrone games ago, when Joe first went on a rant about it? Odd too that the general public aren't hounding Dessie Mone for his diving on Sunday too then, you know, saying as people aren't just being led by Brolly like?
Cavanagh is a diver only started 2 Tyrone games ago? What?
Quote from: Fear ón Srath Bán on June 20, 2014, 12:12:22 AM
Quote from: muppet on June 19, 2014, 11:55:36 PM
There seems to be a lot of focus on dick here.
Give a Dick a Mone.
It's catching. Must be all the Mickey bashing on the Tyrone thread.
Quote from: sheamy on June 20, 2014, 12:19:49 PM
Quote from: Fear ón Srath Bán on June 20, 2014, 12:12:22 AM
Quote from: muppet on June 19, 2014, 11:55:36 PM
There seems to be a lot of focus on dick here.
Give a Dick a Mone.
It's catching. Must be all the Mickey bashing on the Tyrone thread.
Let's not start on 'Mickey bashing' in the context of Tyrone footballers, please.
Cheers lads. Wee buns indeed.
Quote from: screenexile on June 19, 2014, 12:31:56 PM
Quote from: rrhf on June 18, 2014, 08:45:12 PM
Quote from: AZOffaly on June 18, 2014, 03:02:08 PM
Maybe so. I'm just having a go at Parkinson.
Wooly is a breath of fresh air.
Parkinson's article has to be the most ridiculous thing I've ever read... why is this guy even near it? I think he won a Leinster once and called the greatest GAA manager of all time a bluffer but other than that?
Pulling a mans arm in under you and falling is conning the ref! It gets him thinking the man is pulling you or holding you back when he actually can't get his arm away.
Bottom line is I don't doubt Hughes committed a foul but Cavanagh should have received a black card for pulling him on top of himself. Cavanagh is asking "Why always me?" because he feels like Mario Ballotelli... the 2 lads will find the answer in the mirror.
Hi leave Ballotelli alone.......he has done nothing wrong here.........
Quote from: GrandMasterFlash on June 20, 2014, 12:33:27 PM
Quote from: sheamy on June 20, 2014, 12:19:49 PM
Quote from: Fear ón Srath Bán on June 20, 2014, 12:12:22 AM
Quote from: muppet on June 19, 2014, 11:55:36 PM
There seems to be a lot of focus on dick here.
Give a Dick a Mone.
It's catching. Must be all the Mickey bashing on the Tyrone thread.
Let's not start on 'Mickey bashing' in the context of Tyrone footballers, please.
;D ;D
Haven't been on here since Tue I think and can't believe we're at page 47 going back over a lot of the same stuff.
However, some good points are made and for me I am amazed at how many people see Sean as being more the villain in that Hughes Black card that Hughes.
Of course some of ye are beyond hope of persuading otherwise but for most it is obvious Hughes approached that tackle with the intent of stopping Sean by grabbing him around the waist but NOT going to ground. It looked like a tactic that has been discussed before the game. So much so that Sean knew it was coming so his pre-mediated reaction was to make sure the instigator of the FOUL would get punished by dragging him down with him.
So to me Hughes DEFINITELY meant to rugby tackle Sean but stay on his feet and Sean DEFINITELY looked like he intended to drag him down to highlight to the ref what was happening. To suggest this is a black card but Hughes rugby tackle was not is either very naive or tongue in cheek.
The rules need to be fine tuned I think to cater for this slight variation in the tackle. We even saw it in last years AI final where in the final 10 mins the purists of football Dublin were jumping on men's back but not dragging them to the ground, even though there was no black card. It looks less cynical but it's not really.
I'm glad to see the Monaghan boyz are enjoying their week "in the sun" and despite their lack of honesty and class I will still be supporting ye to win Ulster and hopefully get McManus back into good shape
As for Brolly and RTE I really have been put off for life now. They can say what they want and there's no consequences.
With the widespread use now of Twitter, FB, RTE coverage online etc more and more people tune in to hear what the "experts" have to say
After the game on Sunday a pal of mine asked a man in his late 70s what did he make of the game and he starts quoting what they said on the Radio. Too many of us don't think for ourselves any more during a game or afterwards. I do it myself.
Maybe now I can go to a few games in the back door and watch Tyrone without listening to the totally biased comments of this gobshite and how he tells others to HOWL ON HOWL ON and talk over his colleagues.
(http://cdn2.belfasttelegraph.co.uk/incoming/article29472774.ece/4cc7d/ALTERNATES/h342/Brolly+12.jpg)
Lyster is a nice man and like the others there can't control Brolly at all.
They laugh it off the odd time but he still gets his propaganda out there.
The lads in the soccer studio aren't much better.
Good man the FUZZ
PAGE 47 and some common sense
Joe Brolly is just a sarcastic witty and arrogant fella, his analysis is sometimes misinterpreted and should be taken as tongue in cheek
He is only generating interest and hoping to add more viewers to RTE as people love to hear his over the top Preaching
Take it as a pinch of salt and have a laugh at him and with him
I wouldn't be one for hanging on the word of Brolly, Spillane or O' Rourke but he at least recognises there's more to Gaelic football these days than hoof it long and hope for the best as the other two would have you believe.
Re Cavanagh, I second the opinion that Sean flaps around like a salmon going upstream in the scoring zone with great frequency. He's infuriating to watch. It's cheating. Simples.
Quote from: Fuzzman on June 20, 2014, 04:18:08 PM
Haven't been on here since Tue I think and can't believe we're at page 47 going back over a lot of the same stuff.
However, some good points are made and for me I am amazed at how many people see Sean as being more the villain in that Hughes Black card that Hughes.
Of course some of ye are beyond hope of persuading otherwise but for most it is obvious Hughes approached that tackle with the intent of stopping Sean by grabbing him around the waist but NOT going to ground. It looked like a tactic that has been discussed before the game. So much so that Sean knew it was coming so his pre-mediated reaction was to make sure the instigator of the FOUL would get punished by dragging him down with him.
So to me Hughes DEFINITELY meant to rugby tackle Sean but stay on his feet and Sean DEFINITELY looked like he intended to drag him down to highlight to the ref what was happening. To suggest this is a black card but Hughes rugby tackle was not is either very naive or tongue in cheek.
The rules need to be fine tuned I think to cater for this slight variation in the tackle. We even saw it in last years AI final where in the final 10 mins the purists of football Dublin were jumping on men's back but not dragging them to the ground, even though there was no black card. It looks less cynical but it's not really.
And therein lies your problem. You don't understand the black card rule - even by your own reading of the incident.
There are specific offences for the black card rule:
Cynical Behaviour Fouls
1. Deliberately pull down an opponent.
2. Deliberately trip an opponent with the hand(s), arm, leg or foot.
3. Deliberately body collide with an opponent after he has played the ball away or for the purpose of taking him out of a movement of play.
4. Threaten or to use abusive or provocative language or gestures to an opponent or a teammate.
5. Remonstrate in an aggressive manner with a Match Official.http://www.gaa.ie/about-the-gaa/rules-and-regulations/
You said that
"Sean DEFINITELY looked like he intended to drag him down". That's a black card offence - see 1 above.
You said that
"Hughes DEFINITELY meant to rugby tackle Sean but stay on his feet". That's not a black card under any of the fouls above. It's likely a free, and maybe a yellow. But not a black.
It is now time to draw a line under this.. Let me take this opportunity to refresh the forum with some early quotes from our Red Hand friends:
Quote from: ONeill on May 25, 2014, 10:39:12 PM
Monaghan don't beat Tyrone.
Kiss our rings.
Quote from: Fear ón Srath Bán on May 26, 2014, 07:57:57 AM
Wee buns, wee fecking buns!
Quote from: EC Unique on May 26, 2014, 09:37:09 AM
Monaghan have lost their element of surprise. There will be no shock in this game. Tyrone will beat Monaghan as they always do.
Quote from: nrico2006 on May 26, 2014, 09:44:32 AM
I don't see what Monaghan have done to be seen as some big threat all of a sudden. The only two teams that I have believed to be in the running for Ulster this year are Donegal and Tyrone.
Quote from: WT4E on May 27, 2014, 01:54:29 PM
I have a feeling Tyrone will handle the next two matches setting up an interesting Ulster final with the Anti Christs of football!!!
Quote from: ONeill on May 27, 2014, 10:51:38 PM
Some pressure on Monaghan.
Quote from: Fear ón Srath Bán on June 03, 2014, 05:08:21 PM
Cocky Monaghan b**tards. Wee buns, wee fecking buns!
Quote from: ONeill on June 03, 2014, 10:53:09 PM
The Red Hand seems to wobble those boys.
Quote from: Fear ón Srath Bán on June 05, 2014, 02:18:53 PM
Monaghan these days remind me of... Monaghan. Wee buns, wee fecking buns!
Sin é.
That's the point he was making - I think Fuzz is saying that Hughes was trying to cheat the new rules by fouling Cavanagh without taking him to ground, thus avoiding the black card. A bear hug if you like. Cavanagh made sure he wasn't getting away with it. So in terms of the new rules Cavanagh outfoxed Hughes by taking himself and Hughes to ground - so alls fair in love and war.
Quote from: BennyHarp on June 20, 2014, 05:11:37 PM
That's the point he was making - I think Fuzz is saying that Hughes was trying to cheat the new rules by fouling Cavanagh without taking him to ground, thus avoiding the black card. A bear hug if you like. Cavanagh made sure he wasn't getting away with it. So in terms of the new rules Cavanagh outfoxed Hughes by taking himself and Hughes to ground - so alls fair in love and war.
That's isn't
cheating the rule - it's
not breaking the rule in the first place. There's a significant difference. It's like saying a player "cheated" the black card rule by talking to the ref instead of remonstrating in an aggressive manner. It's nonsense.
It is cheating the spirit of the rule.
This thread gone way by embarrassing, G lads Monaghan won , accept it and move on, and someone close the thread, it getting as bad as the old Seanie Johnston one.
Quote from: GrandMasterFlash on June 20, 2014, 05:11:08 PM
It is now time to draw a line under this.. Let me take this opportunity to refresh the forum with some early quotes from our Red Hand friends:
Quote from: ONeill on May 25, 2014, 10:39:12 PM
Monaghan don't beat Tyrone.
Kiss our rings.
Quote from: Fear ón Srath Bán on May 26, 2014, 07:57:57 AM
Wee buns, wee fecking buns!
Quote from: EC Unique on May 26, 2014, 09:37:09 AM
Monaghan have lost their element of surprise. There will be no shock in this game. Tyrone will beat Monaghan as they always do.
Quote from: nrico2006 on May 26, 2014, 09:44:32 AM
I don't see what Monaghan have done to be seen as some big threat all of a sudden. The only two teams that I have believed to be in the running for Ulster this year are Donegal and Tyrone.
Quote from: WT4E on May 27, 2014, 01:54:29 PM
I have a feeling Tyrone will handle the next two matches setting up an interesting Ulster final with the Anti Christs of football!!!
Quote from: ONeill on May 27, 2014, 10:51:38 PM
Some pressure on Monaghan.
Quote from: Fear ón Srath Bán on June 03, 2014, 05:08:21 PM
Cocky Monaghan b**tards. Wee buns, wee fecking buns!
Quote from: ONeill on June 03, 2014, 10:53:09 PM
The Red Hand seems to wobble those boys.
Quote from: Fear ón Srath Bán on June 05, 2014, 02:18:53 PM
Monaghan these days remind me of... Monaghan. Wee buns, wee fecking buns!
Sin é.
I'd say the Moanies will make 100 pages out of it yet ;D
Quote from: Rossfan on June 20, 2014, 07:01:52 PM
I'd say the Moanies will make 100 pages out of it yet ;D
Monaghan have won feck all yet, bless 'em, and another bandwagonner from the Wesht jumps on! Pray, you numpties, that you don't meet us (again) in 2014! :D
Just watched the RTE coverage tonight.
Whelan was a bollocks ok. But, Tomas O Se - you were a lion on the field but in the studio you are lily livered. You knew Whelan was point-scoring and spouting nonsense and you sat back and said nothing. Absolutely nothing.
And yer waistcoat was a mess.
Quote from: GrandMasterFlash on June 20, 2014, 05:11:08 PM
It is now time to draw a line under this.. Let me take this opportunity to refresh the forum with some early quotes from our Red Hand friends:
Quote from: ONeill on May 25, 2014, 10:39:12 PM
Monaghan don't beat Tyrone.
Kiss our rings.
Quote from: Fear ón Srath Bán on May 26, 2014, 07:57:57 AM
Wee buns, wee fecking buns!
Quote from: EC Unique on May 26, 2014, 09:37:09 AM
Monaghan have lost their element of surprise. There will be no shock in this game. Tyrone will beat Monaghan as they always do.
Quote from: nrico2006 on May 26, 2014, 09:44:32 AM
I don't see what Monaghan have done to be seen as some big threat all of a sudden. The only two teams that I have believed to be in the running for Ulster this year are Donegal and Tyrone.
Quote from: WT4E on May 27, 2014, 01:54:29 PM
I have a feeling Tyrone will handle the next two matches setting up an interesting Ulster final with the Anti Christs of football!!!
Quote from: ONeill on May 27, 2014, 10:51:38 PM
Some pressure on Monaghan.
Quote from: Fear ón Srath Bán on June 03, 2014, 05:08:21 PM
Cocky Monaghan b**tards. Wee buns, wee fecking buns!
Quote from: ONeill on June 03, 2014, 10:53:09 PM
The Red Hand seems to wobble those boys.
Quote from: Fear ón Srath Bán on June 05, 2014, 02:18:53 PM
Monaghan these days remind me of... Monaghan. Wee buns, wee fecking buns!
Sin é.
Well played.. ;D
Quote from: GrandMasterFlash on June 20, 2014, 05:11:08 PM
It is now time to draw a line under this.. Let me take this opportunity to refresh the forum with some early quotes from our Red Hand friends:
Quote from: ONeill on May 25, 2014, 10:39:12 PM
Monaghan don't beat Tyrone.
Kiss our rings.
Quote from: Fear ón Srath Bán on May 26, 2014, 07:57:57 AM
Wee buns, wee fecking buns!
Quote from: EC Unique on May 26, 2014, 09:37:09 AM
Monaghan have lost their element of surprise. There will be no shock in this game. Tyrone will beat Monaghan as they always do.
Quote from: nrico2006 on May 26, 2014, 09:44:32 AM
I don't see what Monaghan have done to be seen as some big threat all of a sudden. The only two teams that I have believed to be in the running for Ulster this year are Donegal and Tyrone.
Quote from: WT4E on May 27, 2014, 01:54:29 PM
I have a feeling Tyrone will handle the next two matches setting up an interesting Ulster final with the Anti Christs of football!!!
Quote from: ONeill on May 27, 2014, 10:51:38 PM
Some pressure on Monaghan.
Quote from: Fear ón Srath Bán on June 03, 2014, 05:08:21 PM
Cocky Monaghan b**tards. Wee buns, wee fecking buns!
Quote from: ONeill on June 03, 2014, 10:53:09 PM
The Red Hand seems to wobble those boys.
Quote from: Fear ón Srath Bán on June 05, 2014, 02:18:53 PM
Monaghan these days remind me of... Monaghan. Wee buns, wee fecking buns!
Sin é.
Over your head, my friend. Us Tyronnies are well aware of our limitations....
Quote from: ONeill on June 20, 2014, 11:07:37 PM
Quote from: GrandMasterFlash on June 20, 2014, 05:11:08 PM
It is now time to draw a line under this.. Let me take this opportunity to refresh the forum with some early quotes from our Red Hand friends:
Quote from: ONeill on May 25, 2014, 10:39:12 PM
Monaghan don't beat Tyrone.
Kiss our rings.
Quote from: Fear ón Srath Bán on May 26, 2014, 07:57:57 AM
Wee buns, wee fecking buns!
Quote from: EC Unique on May 26, 2014, 09:37:09 AM
Monaghan have lost their element of surprise. There will be no shock in this game. Tyrone will beat Monaghan as they always do.
Quote from: nrico2006 on May 26, 2014, 09:44:32 AM
I don't see what Monaghan have done to be seen as some big threat all of a sudden. The only two teams that I have believed to be in the running for Ulster this year are Donegal and Tyrone.
Quote from: WT4E on May 27, 2014, 01:54:29 PM
I have a feeling Tyrone will handle the next two matches setting up an interesting Ulster final with the Anti Christs of football!!!
Quote from: ONeill on May 27, 2014, 10:51:38 PM
Some pressure on Monaghan.
Quote from: Fear ón Srath Bán on June 03, 2014, 05:08:21 PM
Cocky Monaghan b**tards. Wee buns, wee fecking buns!
Quote from: ONeill on June 03, 2014, 10:53:09 PM
The Red Hand seems to wobble those boys.
Quote from: Fear ón Srath Bán on June 05, 2014, 02:18:53 PM
Monaghan these days remind me of... Monaghan. Wee buns, wee fecking buns!
Sin é.
Over your head, my friend. Us Tyronnies are well aware of our limitations....
Clearly not.
Oh dear.
We had a fair idea Monaghan would win this game. In fact, you should have won last year only Sean carried us. He nearly did the same. You'll not see our faux-cockiness on the Louth thread etc.
I was actually pleased for Monaghan. They have a fine side with some class players. I'm a bit surprised at how ungracious Monaghan men have been on here, but I know that's not representative.
Quote from: Fear ón Srath Bán on June 20, 2014, 11:23:03 PM
Quote from: Maguire01 on June 20, 2014, 11:20:12 PM
Clearly not.
So, what have you actually won? ::)
Bragging rights over those that dismissed Monaghan's chances.
We don't believe the faux cockiness line. It's easy to say that after the event. Playing well within our potential we also won the match. We expected to win if we got the performance right. What is worrying for Monaghan is that we should have won by 4+, yet Tyrone's 'big game' experience got them back to within a missed free to draw level.
Any truth there's a bit of an East versus West tension in the Tyrone camp?
Quote from: Fear ón Srath Bán on June 20, 2014, 11:23:03 PM
Quote from: Maguire01 on June 20, 2014, 11:20:12 PM
Clearly not.
So, what have you actually won? ::)
I'm not talking about Monaghan. I'm making reference to the fact that the poster who claimed: "Monaghan don't beat Tyrone" now reckons that "Us Tyronnies are well aware of our limitations...."
Quote from: babarino on June 20, 2014, 11:36:38 PM
Quote from: Fear ón Srath Bán on June 20, 2014, 11:23:03 PM
Quote from: Maguire01 on June 20, 2014, 11:20:12 PM
Clearly not.
So, what have you actually won? ::)
Bragging rights over those that dismissed Monaghan's chances.
We don't believe the faux cockiness line. It's easy to say that after the event. Playing well within our potential we also won the match. We expected to win if we got the performance right. What is worrying for Monaghan is that we should have won by 4+, yet Tyrone's 'big game' experience got them back to within a missed free to draw level.
Any truth there's a bit of an East versus West tension in the Tyrone camp?
Buy it.
Monaghan were 6-8 points the better side. I believed that before and after the game.
Please be gracious. You're our favourites.
Quote from: Maguire01 on June 20, 2014, 11:39:01 PM
Quote from: Fear ón Srath Bán on June 20, 2014, 11:23:03 PM
Quote from: Maguire01 on June 20, 2014, 11:20:12 PM
Clearly not.
So, what have you actually won? ::)
I'm not talking about Monaghan. I'm making reference to the fact that the poster who claimed: "Monaghan don't beat Tyrone" now reckons that "Us Tyronnies are well aware of our limitations...."
Jesus. You boys are actually serious.
Quote from: Maguire01 on June 20, 2014, 11:39:01 PM
Quote from: Fear ón Srath Bán on June 20, 2014, 11:23:03 PM
Quote from: Maguire01 on June 20, 2014, 11:20:12 PM
Clearly not.
So, what have you actually won? ::)
I'm not talking about Monaghan. I'm making reference to the fact that the poster who claimed: "Monaghan don't beat Tyrone" now reckons that "Us Tyronnies are well aware of our limitations...."
Over your head is right then, really.
Shouldn't be so sensitive, that's what it's all about, and at the end of last Sunday, Monaghan were still in the Ulster and we weren't -- well done, and big deal.
You have another game coming up, which I would have expected your (collective) energies to have been more focused on. But no, you'd rather dwell on this 'momentous' victory. Get over it.
Quote from: ONeill on June 20, 2014, 11:45:58 PM
Quote from: Maguire01 on June 20, 2014, 11:39:01 PM
Quote from: Fear ón Srath Bán on June 20, 2014, 11:23:03 PM
Quote from: Maguire01 on June 20, 2014, 11:20:12 PM
Clearly not.
So, what have you actually won? ::)
I'm not talking about Monaghan. I'm making reference to the fact that the poster who claimed: "Monaghan don't beat Tyrone" now reckons that "Us Tyronnies are well aware of our limitations...."
Jesus. You boys are actually serious.
I don't doubt you were having a laugh Oneill but I'm pretty sure the rest of the comments quoted were serious!!! A couple of those lads have previous in terms of being deluded about their team ...
Quote from: screenexile on June 21, 2014, 12:02:34 AM
I don't doubt you were having a laugh Oneill but I'm pretty sure the rest of the comments quoted were serious!!! A couple of those lads have previous in terms of being deluded about their team ...
So only ONeill was in jest, and
all the rest weren't, even though only "
a couple" of them have previous -- all we need, an innumerate Derryman in the mix! :P
Funny the Tyrone lads going on about us being ungracious and having no class. I don't agree, but you're going to get a bit of slagging when you write us off easily in the build-up. I'm sure a few of those were on the wind up and that's all good craic, but equally I've no doubt others were serious and dismissed our chances.
So unfortunately you're going to get this reaction afterwards. Suck it up lads, we've had to take enough defeats to ye hoors in the last decade! ;) You'll regroup in the back door and there's every chance we'll meet again down the line. I've been more focused on the Armagh game for a few days now, but it's hard to forget about this, especially when this thread has been near the top of the page every time I look in here.
So, Darren Hughes has had his black card overturned. McCurry's overturned as well.
http://hoganstand.com/ArticleForm.aspx?ID=219727
Quote from: Maguire01 on July 04, 2014, 05:07:25 PM
So, Darren Hughes has had his black card overturned. McCurry's overturned as well.
http://hoganstand.com/ArticleForm.aspx?ID=219727
Maybe it's time they just overturned the decision to introduced the black card?
Quote from: BennyHarp on July 04, 2014, 08:22:43 PM
Quote from: Maguire01 on July 04, 2014, 05:07:25 PM
So, Darren Hughes has had his black card overturned. McCurry's overturned as well.
http://hoganstand.com/ArticleForm.aspx?ID=219727
Maybe it's time they just overturned the decision to introduced the black card?
"they" can't. Would have to be done at Congress ;)
Quote from: Rossfan on July 04, 2014, 09:12:54 PM
Quote from: BennyHarp on July 04, 2014, 08:22:43 PM
Quote from: Maguire01 on July 04, 2014, 05:07:25 PM
So, Darren Hughes has had his black card overturned. McCurry's overturned as well.
http://hoganstand.com/ArticleForm.aspx?ID=219727
Maybe it's time they just overturned the decision to introduced the black card?
"they" can't. Would have to be done at Congress ;)
Who would want to go back to the days when every Tom, Dick and Sean thought it was ok to drag down players any time they broke into anything approaching space? The cost-benefit of that decision has hugely changed now and players are far less willing to risk seeing the line unless they feel it is absolutely necessary.
You can argue the unevenness of the application but as a tool for scaring defenders into behaving better it has been a huge success.
Quote from: Syferus on July 04, 2014, 09:20:33 PM
Quote from: Rossfan on July 04, 2014, 09:12:54 PM
Quote from: BennyHarp on July 04, 2014, 08:22:43 PM
Quote from: Maguire01 on July 04, 2014, 05:07:25 PM
So, Darren Hughes has had his black card overturned. McCurry's overturned as well.
http://hoganstand.com/ArticleForm.aspx?ID=219727
Maybe it's time they just overturned the decision to introduced the black card?
"they" can't. Would have to be done at Congress ;)
Who would want to go back to the days when every Tom, Dick and Sean thought it was ok to drag down players any time they broke into anything approaching space? The cost-benefit of that decision has hugely changed now and players are far less willing to risk seeing the line unless they feel it is absolutely necessary.
You can argue the unevenness of the application but a tool for scaring defenders into behaving better it has been a huge success.
I agree, I think the evenness will come with time and perhaps tuning.. The principle is correct, the application arguably not.