Our Wee country fans plan to Wreck Avivia stadium

[deiseach]

What do you think about the ruling itself Myles? Personally I find it absolutely astonishing that anyone would not understand that northern nationalists woulld rather play for the republic. If you have a history of abusing catholic players, surely its the least you'd expect??

The ruling is correct and I understand why the FAI have gone down the road of playing northerners. However, I think the Irish government should have stepped in long ago and warned them off. This issue goes beyond football. If Irish nationalists are serious about unity, then they have to start thinking about persuading northern unionists that their interests will be safe guarded in any all Ireland state. How are we going to do that by taking from them something they prize dearly, namely their football team? You only have to read a few threads on OWC to get a sense of how much bitterness this decision has caused. This was a golden opportunity for the Irish government to be statesman-like and to set aside short term sporting gain in order to gain the trust and respect of the unionist community up here. Unfortunately, it seems that the Dept of Foreign Affairs chose to throw its weight behind the FAI rather than reining it back. So 'we've' won and 'themmuns' have lost and in the process, reunification has been pushed back another couple of decades.

the irish gov dont have the right to 'warn off' the fai from picking people from the north. you cannot treat citizens differently and irish citizens in the north have to be treated the same as irish citizens in the south

Not only that, Fifa would not tolerate a national government interfering in the actions of their association. Whatever happened to sport and politics not mixing?

[muppet]

This decision would seriously worry me if I was an OWCer.

FIFA is an international organisation and hasn't defended Norn Iron's claim over its players. As it isn't a country it doesn't have the citizenship argument that real countries have. If FIFA doesn't defend any geographical claim they have on a player then I think they are on the slippery slope.

Spain's win exposed a lot of resentment of how 'Britain' can have 4 teams in the world cup and Basques (for example) are forced to play for Spain. Watch this space.

[haranguerer]

What do you think about the ruling itself Myles? Personally I find it absolutely astonishing that anyone would not understand that northern nationalists woulld rather play for the republic. If you have a history of abusing catholic players, surely its the least you'd expect??

The ruling is correct and I understand why the FAI have gone down the road of playing northerners. However, I think the Irish government should have stepped in long ago and warned them off. This issue goes beyond football. If Irish nationalists are serious about unity, then they have to start thinking about persuading northern unionists that their interests will be safe guarded in any all Ireland state. How are we going to do that by taking from them something they prize dearly, namely their football team? You only have to read a few threads on OWC to get a sense of how much bitterness this decision has caused. This was a golden opportunity for the Irish government to be statesman-like and to set aside short term sporting gain in order to gain the trust and respect of the unionist community up here. Unfortunately, it seems that the Dept of Foreign Affairs chose to throw its weight behind the FAI rather than reining it back. So 'we've' won and 'themmuns' have lost and in the process, reunification has been pushed back another couple of decades.

Wouldnt that be depriving said players of their human rights, given that they have dual nationality?

[stibhan]

reunification has been pushed back another couple of decades.

Deluded again. The idea that the owc crowd we be out in force to ensure that we don't vote for a United Ireland is laughable--there are many more reasons why it won't happen soon, and a lot of them more pertinent than us taking away their soccer team.

You'll have to reword that - I don't understand what you're saying.

Sorry, I should express myself in positive terms: I think that the OWC fans are mostly unionists who would against a United Ireland anyway, and don't think that they will have any undue influence on a future result. From what I've seen of the fans they mostly appear to be loyalist, so I'm not sure this particular scenario will have changed their minds. They have always used the term 'beggars', after all.

[Myles Na G.]

reunification has been pushed back another couple of decades.

Deluded again. The idea that the owc crowd we be out in force to ensure that we don't vote for a United Ireland is laughable--there are many more reasons why it won't happen soon, and a lot of them more pertinent than us taking away their soccer team.

You'll have to reword that - I don't understand what you're saying.

Sorry, I should express myself in positive terms: I think that the OWC fans are mostly unionists who would against a United Ireland anyway, and don't think that they will have any undue influence on a future result. From what I've seen of the fans they mostly appear to be loyalist, so I'm not sure this particular scenario will have changed their minds. They have always used the term 'beggars', after all.

You may have missed it, but even the Shinners have signed up to the consent principle these days. If you think that you're going to get a united Ireland without the consent of at least a significant minority of northern protestants, then you're the one being delusional.

[Myles Na G.]

What do you think about the ruling itself Myles? Personally I find it absolutely astonishing that anyone would not understand that northern nationalists woulld rather play for the republic. If you have a history of abusing catholic players, surely its the least you'd expect??

The ruling is correct and I understand why the FAI have gone down the road of playing northerners. However, I think the Irish government should have stepped in long ago and warned them off. This issue goes beyond football. If Irish nationalists are serious about unity, then they have to start thinking about persuading northern unionists that their interests will be safe guarded in any all Ireland state. How are we going to do that by taking from them something they prize dearly, namely their football team? You only have to read a few threads on OWC to get a sense of how much bitterness this decision has caused. This was a golden opportunity for the Irish government to be statesman-like and to set aside short term sporting gain in order to gain the trust and respect of the unionist community up here. Unfortunately, it seems that the Dept of Foreign Affairs chose to throw its weight behind the FAI rather than reining it back. So 'we've' won and 'themmuns' have lost and in the process, reunification has been pushed back another couple of decades.

the irish gov dont have the right to 'warn off' the fai from picking people from the north. you cannot treat citizens differently and irish citizens in the north have to be treated the same as irish citizens in the south

Not only that, Fifa would not tolerate a national government interfering in the actions of their association. Whatever happened to sport and politics not mixing?

And yet John Delaney expressly thanked the Dept of Foreign Affairs for their assistance - is that not interference?

[muppet]

What do you think about the ruling itself Myles? Personally I find it absolutely astonishing that anyone would not understand that northern nationalists woulld rather play for the republic. If you have a history of abusing catholic players, surely its the least you'd expect??

The ruling is correct and I understand why the FAI have gone down the road of playing northerners. However, I think the Irish government should have stepped in long ago and warned them off. This issue goes beyond football. If Irish nationalists are serious about unity, then they have to start thinking about persuading northern unionists that their interests will be safe guarded in any all Ireland state. How are we going to do that by taking from them something they prize dearly, namely their football team? You only have to read a few threads on OWC to get a sense of how much bitterness this decision has caused. This was a golden opportunity for the Irish government to be statesman-like and to set aside short term sporting gain in order to gain the trust and respect of the unionist community up here. Unfortunately, it seems that the Dept of Foreign Affairs chose to throw its weight behind the FAI rather than reining it back. So 'we've' won and 'themmuns' have lost and in the process, reunification has been pushed back another couple of decades.

the irish gov dont have the right to 'warn off' the fai from picking people from the north. you cannot treat citizens differently and irish citizens in the north have to be treated the same as irish citizens in the south

Not only that, Fifa would not tolerate a national government interfering in the actions of their association. Whatever happened to sport and politics not mixing?

And yet John Delaney expressly thanked the Dept of Foreign Affairs for their assistance - is that not interference?

He thanked them for their 'assistants'. They made the tae.

[Myles Na G.]

'I can't remember it was years ago' POG

[stibhan]

reunification has been pushed back another couple of decades.

Deluded again. The idea that the owc crowd we be out in force to ensure that we don't vote for a United Ireland is laughable--there are many more reasons why it won't happen soon, and a lot of them more pertinent than us taking away their soccer team.

You'll have to reword that - I don't understand what you're saying.

Sorry, I should express myself in positive terms: I think that the OWC fans are mostly unionists who would against a United Ireland anyway, and don't think that they will have any undue influence on a future result. From what I've seen of the fans they mostly appear to be loyalist, so I'm not sure this particular scenario will have changed their minds. They have always used the term 'beggars', after all.

You may have missed it, but even the Shinners have signed up to the consent principle these days. If you think that you're going to get a united Ireland without the consent of at least a significant minority of northern protestants, then you're the one being delusional.

I'm not being delusional because I do not think the majority of any demographic in our population votes on the basis of how well their soccer team is doing. When Celtic refused to sign Steven Fletcher last year I wasn't going out of my way to vote unionist; when Steve Staunton was managing Ireland I didn't change my opinion on the constitution.

To be less churlish, the Northern football team is an obstacle to rather than a catalyst for partition. I, and they, think this at least spells danger for them unless they get their act together in terms of equality and responsibility. Football For All is commendable but means nothing when you make nationalists play for the Union Jack and GSTQ.

[pintsofguinness]

'I can't remember it was years ago' POG

No silly icon is going to distract from the fact that you're afraid to tell us who you are on owc or even that you condemned the stupid remarks made - in fact, I don't believe you even condemned them here.

[deiseach]

Not only that, Fifa would not tolerate a national government interfering in the actions of their association. Whatever happened to sport and politics not mixing?

And yet John Delaney expressly thanked the Dept of Foreign Affairs for their assistance - is that not interference?

No. By that logic, a goverment helping a World Cup bid would be the same thing as forbidding a national association from making the bid. And besides, it's always been an article of faith on OWC that sport and politics don't mix. Until it suits.

[Jim_Murphy_74]

And yet John Delaney expressly thanked the Dept of Foreign Affairs for their assistance - is that not interference?

Interference (at least in FIFA terms) is not aiding at national association.  If it was every major competition (World Cups etc..) would be cancelled due to the aid national governments give bids.

Inteference is seen by FIFA that governments coerce national associations. For example the fine on Togu for withdrawing from African Nations Cup on instructions from their government.

In essence, the fined party in interference cases is oft not the guilty one.

In the case of the West Ham cast off there are two possibilities:

1) He "declared" for Ireland and the FAI were faced with saying yes please or not thanks
2) He was "tapped up" as a Northern Ireland Catholic

I won't comment here as the seems to be an unkown but if it was the former, hard to see how the FAI would act otherwise.  (Unless the infamous gentleman's agreement exist, although in fairness this is the FAI..........)

With regard to the CAS and preceeding FIFA ruling, the IFA forced the issue in both cases, not the FAI.  So bad and all as Delaney et al. are, they can hardly be accountable for the boardroom decisions north of the border.

The salient point here is that IFA have (shortsightedly) continued to push for implementation of FIFA rules when in fact said rules are the very problem they have. 

Not really the FAI fault at all.

/Jim.

[magickingdom]

from belfast newsletter

"Ulster Unionist MLA David McNarry last night called on the IFA to "fight tooth and nail" yesterday's judgment .

"The IFA should use the European Courts, appeal to Westminster, make these young players sign a document that they will stick by the IFA that is pouring money and resources into their development – maybe even renegotiate the Belfast Agreement that created this farce," said Mr McNarry."

Sinn Fein chairman of the DCAL committee Barry McElduff said: "It will come as no surprise that the CAS has thrown out this case.

"It was a blatant attempt to deny Irish citizens in the six counties their full rights as Irish passport holders and was doomed to failure from the start."

SDLP MLA Thomas Burns said: "We have consistently argued that footballers should have the right to choose which team to play for, whether that is Northern Ireland or the Republic. It is only right that any footballer is given the freedom to make up their own mind on which country they wish to represent."

But former Belfast lord mayor Jim Rodgers (UUP) – a member of the Glentoran board and of Sport NI – said: "If someone doesn't want to play for you, there isn't much you can do about it. But these young people accept the investment that's poured into their careers at an early stage and should stay with the sporting bodies who helped develop them with time and money.""


apeal to westminister!! does he still think they make the rules? what planet is mcnarry living on.

[deiseach]

from belfast newsletter

"Ulster Unionist MLA David McNarry last night called on the IFA to "fight tooth and nail" yesterday's judgment .

"The IFA should use the European Courts, appeal to Westminster, make these young players sign a document that they will stick by the IFA that is pouring money and resources into their development – maybe even renegotiate the Belfast Agreement that created this farce," said Mr McNarry."

Sinn Fein chairman of the DCAL committee Barry McElduff said: "It will come as no surprise that the CAS has thrown out this case.

"It was a blatant attempt to deny Irish citizens in the six counties their full rights as Irish passport holders and was doomed to failure from the start."

SDLP MLA Thomas Burns said: "We have consistently argued that footballers should have the right to choose which team to play for, whether that is Northern Ireland or the Republic. It is only right that any footballer is given the freedom to make up their own mind on which country they wish to represent."

But former Belfast lord mayor Jim Rodgers (UUP) – a member of the Glentoran board and of Sport NI – said: "If someone doesn't want to play for you, there isn't much you can do about it. But these young people accept the investment that's poured into their careers at an early stage and should stay with the sporting bodies who helped develop them with time and money.""


apeal to westminister!! does he still think they make the rules? what planet is mcnarry living on.

These are the same clowns who took umbrage when governments in Ireland and Britain objected to the rugby tours to apartheid South Africa. How dare politicians interfere! Charming to the last.

[TacadoirArdMhacha]

from belfast newsletter

"Ulster Unionist MLA David McNarry last night called on the IFA to "fight tooth and nail" yesterday's judgment .

"The IFA should use the European Courts, appeal to Westminster, make these young players sign a document that they will stick by the IFA that is pouring money and resources into their development – maybe even renegotiate the Belfast Agreement that created this farce," said Mr McNarry."

Sinn Fein chairman of the DCAL committee Barry McElduff said: "It will come as no surprise that the CAS has thrown out this case.

"It was a blatant attempt to deny Irish citizens in the six counties their full rights as Irish passport holders and was doomed to failure from the start."

SDLP MLA Thomas Burns said: "We have consistently argued that footballers should have the right to choose which team to play for, whether that is Northern Ireland or the Republic. It is only right that any footballer is given the freedom to make up their own mind on which country they wish to represent."

But former Belfast lord mayor Jim Rodgers (UUP) – a member of the Glentoran board and of Sport NI – said: "If someone doesn't want to play for you, there isn't much you can do about it. But these young people accept the investment that's poured into their careers at an early stage and should stay with the sporting bodies who helped develop them with time and money.""


apeal to westminister!! does he still think they make the rules? what planet is mcnarry living on.

These are the same clowns who took umbrage when governments in Ireland and Britain objected to the rugby tours to apartheid South Africa. How dare politicians interfere! Charming to the last.

Heard him on the radio on Friday saying that young footballers should have to make up their minds at 11 or 12 which side they want to play for.