Man Utd Thread:

Started by full back, November 10, 2006, 08:13:49 AM

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NAG1

Quote from: Boycey on October 26, 2021, 11:13:18 AM
Quote from: brokencrossbar1 on October 26, 2021, 10:13:17 AM
Agreed with Armaike. I think a misconception has been bandied about the United squad. Last season was an aberration and this year is maybe a bit more reflective of where they are. The reality is there's no cohesion. Certain players get more of a by-ball because of who they are (Maguire, Ronaldo). The biggest mistake was the vanity purchase of Ronaldo. They should have broken the bank for a dominant CM and played the counter attack game. In Sancho, Rashford, Greenwood they have serious pace. Ronaldo can't be dropped so at least one of those can't play. They are neither a pressing team or a counter attacking team. They're somewhere in the middle and that's destroying them. All that being said they're still gonna be battling for the 4th-8th place.

Why is last year an aberration bc1? Its there in black and white... Add Ronaldo, Varane and Sancho to the mix the group should e moving forwards not backwards

VVD's injury null and voided the whole season  ;)

Armamike

Quote from: sid waddell on October 26, 2021, 11:06:55 AM
Quote from: Armamike on October 26, 2021, 09:53:27 AM
Quote from: sid waddell on October 25, 2021, 09:46:49 PM
Imagine what Klopp would do with that United squad. The great thing is imagining is all we'll ever have.

I've heard this one bandied about in the run up to the game and since.  He'd get more of a tune out of them but he wouldn't get near a title or challenge for the CL. Simply because most of the players there wouldn't fit his template.  He'd end up shipping most of them out to bring in the players that would fit his plan.  A Klopp type manager who wants to put solid foundations in for the long term isn't going to be a short term hit.  Klopp was the butt of a good few Manu supporters' jokes during his first 3 years at Liverpool - Klopp the flop, Klippity Klopp etc.  It's one thing saying there's quality players there at the moment but they're a collection of individuals brought in by various managers. Any new manager coming in is inheriting a few pegs.
Same thing was said about Chelsea last year as what you say about Manchester United now.

Lamps hadn't a clue.

Tuchel takes over and bang, they win the Champions League.

Well maybe Tuchels the man and not Klopp! 
That's just, like your opinion man.

brokencrossbar1

LFC destroyed by injuries half way through the season, CFC managed by a rookie out of his depth in Lampard. All that being said MUFC were still 12 points off the top. No point in having Sancho with him scratching his hole on the bench ....added to the mix ;D.

You're right though they should be moving forward but that's not all on Oles door. Tactics may be wrong but lazy players are lazy players and there are a number of players in the United squad who won't work and no matter how talented they are that won't count.

tiempo

Quote from: JoG2 on October 26, 2021, 09:56:47 AM
Quote from: tiempo on October 26, 2021, 09:16:12 AM
One group of players is prepared to haul ass, the other isn't.

Yes, Klopp plays a system and players are targeted and brought in to fit into that system, a system which involves incredible work rate. For Klopp to have this Utd team 'cleaning' up, you'd be talking years and a (near enough) complete over haul, so not this Utd team.

Didn't they ask Roy Keane on Sky Sports what type of player he'd be these days - holding, attacking, ball winning, playmaker? He said all of them.

You cant just walk on a pitch and say OK today I'm gonna be sitting in this pocket doing feck all else, if I do my job that's good enough, Ozil type bullshit mentality

There's GK in the league having more impact on games in an outfield sense than Pogba ffs

Utd are well down the pecking order and a lot is the unwillingness to bust their hole, a minimum requirement in previous great teams

Boycey

Quote from: brokencrossbar1 on October 26, 2021, 11:41:21 AM
LFC destroyed by injuries half way through the season, CFC managed by a rookie out of his depth in Lampard. All that being said MUFC were still 12 points off the top. No point in having Sancho with him scratching his hole on the bench ....added to the mix ;D.

You're right though they should be moving forward but that's not all on Oles door. Tactics may be wrong but lazy players are lazy players and there are a number of players in the United squad who won't work and no matter how talented they are that won't count.

I think it's very lazy analysis to say United are lazy players. Tuchel at Chelsea recently and Klopp at Liverpool further back show that players challenged in the right way can/will perform better. Ole is as much out of his depth at Utd as Lampard was at Chelsea?

As someone said yesterday put some of the Liverpool players into the Utd scenario and people would be saying exactly the same things about them. Trent is one that springs to my mind straight away, Liverpool fans are rightly proud of him and he's hugely important to how Liverpool play but at Utd his alleged limited defensive qualities would be pointed out at every hands turn

Saffrongael

If AWB was offering what TAA offered going forward you could forgive some of the defensive shortcomings, and if TAA was playing for United & producing that standard of play you could live with the defensive shortcomings. I don't think the United fans would be too hard on him
Let no-one say the best hurlers belong to the past. They are with us now, and better yet to come

brokencrossbar1

Quote from: Boycey on October 26, 2021, 12:18:22 PM
Quote from: brokencrossbar1 on October 26, 2021, 11:41:21 AM
LFC destroyed by injuries half way through the season, CFC managed by a rookie out of his depth in Lampard. All that being said MUFC were still 12 points off the top. No point in having Sancho with him scratching his hole on the bench ....added to the mix ;D.

You're right though they should be moving forward but that's not all on Oles door. Tactics may be wrong but lazy players are lazy players and there are a number of players in the United squad who won't work and no matter how talented they are that won't count.

I think it's very lazy analysis to say United are lazy players. Tuchel at Chelsea recently and Klopp at Liverpool further back show that players challenged in the right way can/will perform better. Ole is as much out of his depth at Utd as Lampard was at Chelsea?

As someone said yesterday put some of the Liverpool players into the Utd scenario and people would be saying exactly the same things about them. Trent is one that springs to my mind straight away, Liverpool fans are rightly proud of him and he's hugely important to how Liverpool play but at Utd his alleged limited defensive qualities would be pointed out at every hands turn

Ah come on man, Pogba, Ronaldo, Greenwood, Martial....these lads wouldn't run out of the way of themselves!  Fred not much better.

The thing is I think we are actually in  agreement, Ole is out of his depth, the same way Lampard was. That doesn't not though resolve the fact that there are players in the United squad who just ate it up to it. Keane commented that these players threw Mourinho under the bus and would do the same with Ole. That's panning out now and with Ronaldo there the ego is even bigger so that doesn't help.

A new manager should be able to get a better trick out of them but there's still 4-5 top players needed and that cannot be denied

seafoid

Quote from: brokencrossbar1 on October 26, 2021, 12:32:06 PM
Quote from: Boycey on October 26, 2021, 12:18:22 PM
Quote from: brokencrossbar1 on October 26, 2021, 11:41:21 AM
LFC destroyed by injuries half way through the season, CFC managed by a rookie out of his depth in Lampard. All that being said MUFC were still 12 points off the top. No point in having Sancho with him scratching his hole on the bench ....added to the mix ;D.

You're right though they should be moving forward but that's not all on Oles door. Tactics may be wrong but lazy players are lazy players and there are a number of players in the United squad who won't work and no matter how talented they are that won't count.

I think it's very lazy analysis to say United are lazy players. Tuchel at Chelsea recently and Klopp at Liverpool further back show that players challenged in the right way can/will perform better. Ole is as much out of his depth at Utd as Lampard was at Chelsea?

As someone said yesterday put some of the Liverpool players into the Utd scenario and people would be saying exactly the same things about them. Trent is one that springs to my mind straight away, Liverpool fans are rightly proud of him and he's hugely important to how Liverpool play but at Utd his alleged limited defensive qualities would be pointed out at every hands turn

Ah come on man, Pogba, Ronaldo, Greenwood, Martial....these lads wouldn't run out of the way of themselves!  Fred not much better.

The thing is I think we are actually in  agreement, Ole is out of his depth, the same way Lampard was. That doesn't not though resolve the fact that there are players in the United squad who just ate it up to it. Keane commented that these players threw Mourinho under the bus and would do the same with Ole. That's panning out now and with Ronaldo there the ego is even bigger so that doesn't help.

A new manager should be able to get a better trick out of them but there's still 4-5 top players needed and that cannot be denied
The Glazers make as much money as Liverpool do. They aren't going to buy 4 or 5 top players to win the PL. They are happy making the same money as Liverpool
"f**k it, just score"- Donaghy   https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IbxG2WwVRjU

Boycey

Quote from: brokencrossbar1 on October 26, 2021, 12:32:06 PM
Quote from: Boycey on October 26, 2021, 12:18:22 PM
Quote from: brokencrossbar1 on October 26, 2021, 11:41:21 AM
LFC destroyed by injuries half way through the season, CFC managed by a rookie out of his depth in Lampard. All that being said MUFC were still 12 points off the top. No point in having Sancho with him scratching his hole on the bench ....added to the mix ;D.

You're right though they should be moving forward but that's not all on Oles door. Tactics may be wrong but lazy players are lazy players and there are a number of players in the United squad who won't work and no matter how talented they are that won't count.

I think it's very lazy analysis to say United are lazy players. Tuchel at Chelsea recently and Klopp at Liverpool further back show that players challenged in the right way can/will perform better. Ole is as much out of his depth at Utd as Lampard was at Chelsea?

As someone said yesterday put some of the Liverpool players into the Utd scenario and people would be saying exactly the same things about them. Trent is one that springs to my mind straight away, Liverpool fans are rightly proud of him and he's hugely important to how Liverpool play but at Utd his alleged limited defensive qualities would be pointed out at every hands turn

Ah come on man, Pogba, Ronaldo, Greenwood, Martial....these lads wouldn't run out of the way of themselves!  Fred not much better.

The thing is I think we are actually in  agreement, Ole is out of his depth, the same way Lampard was. That doesn't not though resolve the fact that there are players in the United squad who just ate it up to it. Keane commented that these players threw Mourinho under the bus and would do the same with Ole. That's panning out now and with Ronaldo there the ego is even bigger so that doesn't help.

A new manager should be able to get a better trick out of them but there's still 4-5 top players needed and that cannot be denied

I could make cases for all the Utd players but what would be the point but you're right overall we'd be in general agreement. My feeling though is that most of or all of the supposed lazy players would thrive under the correct management.

Did those players throw Jose under the bus or did he throw them under it, the jury might still be out on that

Louther

Quote from: Louther on September 23, 2021, 09:48:25 AM
No harm to United supporters and it been the League cup but that performance last night showed how stale and poor United are been managed at present. It's a squad with no plan and relying on individuals to win games.

On paper (games aren't played on paper thankfully) that United team should be beating that West Ham team. But they can't. Struggle to make clear chances and put the opposition under any real kind of pressure that would force a mistake or make an opening.

I'm sure Ronaldo will be trotted out at weekend and all be great again but it's mad how United have painted over the cracks by signing a 36 year old on a short term deal.

I stand by this. It was evident from start of season that it was a team without structure. Lots of individuals playing as such and such are the egos involved that they happy to lay blame elsewhere rather than address it themselves.

Liverpool under Souness suffered from an ego driven manager playing weak players as a manager who wouldn't listen to anyone and felt the need to move away from past glories.
United under Ole are suffering from an ego driven team who wouldn't play for a weak manager trying to hold onto past glories.

rodney trotter

United have signed Top players but were more vanity signings. Van Der Beek, Sancho, Varane, Ronaldo
Declan Rice was needed more then some of these. Sancho didn't even get on against Liverpool and look what he cost.  Doucoure at Everton is also a very good defensive player.

Kieran Trippier would be a upgrade on Wan Bissaka

seafoid

This has been going on since 2013.
Fergie kept things hidden while he was still winning.

There was an emergency meeting between the 2 Glazers, Woodward and Solskjaer. Only one of them knows anything about soccer.
"f**k it, just score"- Donaghy   https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IbxG2WwVRjU

Ed Ricketts

Quote from: rodney trotter on October 26, 2021, 04:05:58 PM
United have signed Top players but were more vanity signings. Van Der Beek, Sancho, Varane, Ronaldo
Declan Rice was needed more then some of these. Sancho didn't even get on against Liverpool and look what he cost.  Doucoure at Everton is also a very good defensive player.

Kieran Trippier would be a upgrade on Wan Bissaka

Tried very hard in the summer to get Trippier for a good price, but Atletico held out.

They realise that Wan-Bissaka was a mistake.
Doc would listen to any kind of nonsense and change it for you to a kind of wisdom.

JPGJOHNNYG

Quote from: seafoid on October 26, 2021, 05:45:02 PM
This has been going on since 2013.
Fergie kept things hidden while he was still winning.

There was an emergency meeting between the 2 Glazers, Woodward and Solskjaer. Only one of them knows anything about soccer.

Joel glazer? ;D

nrico2006

What's also mad is the fact that Solskjaer has made two big signings over the last 2 summers and doesn't know what to do with them. VDB and Sancho are brilliant players and should be contributing.
'To the extreme I rock a mic like a vandal, light up a stage and wax a chump like a candle.'