Oisin on talkback

[imtommygunn]

There is a sense of identity you get with the GAA which you don't get with soccer. It's part of parish, who you are etc. Flying tricolours / playing national anthems has nothing to do with this.

[johnnycool]

There is a sense of identity you get with the GAA which you don't get with soccer. It's part of parish, who you are etc. Flying tricolours / playing national anthems has nothing to do with this.

very much so and that's the biggest selling point for the GAA. The community aspect.

Speak to the average protestant in the north and their perception of the GAA is almost like an IRA training camp and the Shinners run every GAA club in the north.

It's what they've been fed for years by their political leadership unchallenged but once they do attend an event or go inside a GAA club they're apprehensive at first but once they see the walls aren't adorned with tricolours or posters of the proclamation at every cut and turn.
We run various weight loss initiatives and dementia workshops who pull in from all sections of the local community and you can almost see the surprise from the local protestants and ones moved into the area that the walls have pictures and of various teams on them and that the nationalist agenda isn't a big thing but irish culture like the sport, language, dance and music are more important.


For me a UI is more important than retaining a tricolour or Amhrán na bhFiann if it came to that.

[imtommygunn]

JC a kind of related but also unrelated question... What club do Kircubben represent? Driving through there at the weekend and saw a load of hurls. I didn't think it would be a hurling stronghold.

The GAA really stood up during this pandemic (at a local level) in terms of loads of GAA clubs delivering stuff to vulnerable people etc and like you say run plenty of community initiatives.

[johnnycool]

JC a kind of related but also unrelated question... What club do Kircubben represent? Driving through there at the weekend and saw a load of hurls. I didn't think it would be a hurling stronghold.

The GAA really stood up during this pandemic (at a local level) in terms of loads of GAA clubs delivering stuff to vulnerable people etc and like you say run plenty of community initiatives.

Kircubbin is 80+ % catholic and that's where Ballycran would garner most of their players from. The Orange hall along the shore and the names on some of the local businesses would suggest otherwise but there you go.

[imtommygunn]

Ah that was what threw me. I did wonder where Ballycran got their players from.

[ardtole]

Would Ballygalget be the Cloughey area between portaferry and portavogie? Doesnt seem too built uo of an area population wise. Would Ballygalget be a more rural club?

[johnnycool]

Would Ballygalget be the Cloughey area between portaferry and portavogie? Doesnt seem too built uo of an area population wise. Would Ballygalget be a more rural club?

We'd take from the Cloughey area which is now adorned in flegs and so would Ballycran to an extent as well. The demographics in that area has changed significantly since i was a teenager. A lot of new builds in that area have young catholic families in them considering the place had a "Cloughey True blues" pipe band..

We're almost exclusively rural although we take from areas like Cloughey and indeed Portaferry, neither of which are overly big places either.

[BennyCake]

You have to look at how unionists feel walking/driving past a GAA ground with a tri colour flying. Some might feel unwelcome,  intimidated or offended or might think, well I'll not be sending my kids there, even if they do play with local catholic kids.

Would we enter an orange hall or send our kids into one on some summer scheme/cross community thing, with the union flag flying above the door? Not trying to compare the GAA with the OO by the way. Just think a lot of Catholics would feel similar to unionists towards GAA

How many grounds have a tricolour ?
As a club that always had members from a unionist background , we didn't have to change anything, just be welcoming and keep politics out of it.

That said, if people think that Gaelic games can thrive on their own merits without patriotic trappings need to think again. Why does gaa volunteerism dwarf all other sports...patriotism is a big part of that.
The gaa does not have the professional and international attraction of most other competing sports eg soccer, rugby, but what's it has nailed is a sense of place: club, county , country .
If In our quest to draw in more unionists we dilute one of the things that makes us compete against the odds( ie patriotism)  , we need to be careful what we wish for . Unionists are unlikely to join in their droves, and yet patriotic motivation for members may be diluted .
GAA is unique as an Irish sporting and cultural organisation and it's one of its strengths . Welcome  everybody :yes, dilute patriotic principles: risky . Look at Dublin   Why did outstanding athlete con O'callaghan choose GAA? Being a patriotic gaeilgeoir probably influenced that decision.
Be careful what u wish for!

The patriotic principles you refer to are what? The flag and anthem?

Are we really going to see lots of nationalists turn away from the GAA, stop sending their kids to play, because the flag/anthem are removed/limited?

I do Agree that both need removing but not because it would help bring in more unionists (although if it helps, that's good too). I just don't think they are needed. Surely as passionate GAA people, we are mature enough and secure enough  in our identity that we don't need a flag/anthem? The GAA is a thriving sporting/cultural  organisation, and it will still thrive without them. If anyone turns away from the GAA if they are removed, maybe that would say a lot about them and their priorities

[general_lee]

If you were to believe some of the shite on social media you would think the Gaa was just another breakaway of the ira. There are certain people it will never appease. Like you say the uptake would be questionable. The problem for me would not be flags and anthems it would be the naming of grounds.

There would be a benefit in appeasing them because you are disarming them from having any sort of anti-GAA agenda. Once these issues they raise (mainly politicians) disappear you might see protestants think "They have done this to make us feel welcome in their organisation so let's give it a go".

Are you serious? These people would near oppose oxygen in the atmosphere if you reiterated to them enough times that Sinn Fein breathe it. Look at the absolute shítshow made of the Irish Language Act. The mere thought of it sends shivers down these reactionary bigots' spines. They're incapable of rational thought. If Republicans support something you can guarantee they will find some excuse to oppose it.

The GAA hasn't a chance, no matter what it does. Even the so-called liberal and great white hope of Unionism Doug Beattie can't bear the thought of an ILA. He even got his knickers in a twist when St Pauls in Lurgan had the audacity to have their goal nets in their club colours, or as Doug saw it a big "fück you" from the club to Unionists - because they can't view the Irish national flag as anything other than an IRA flag and by extension the colours of that flag (even though the colours of the nets were green, white and gold).

Strangely though not a peep from him when the local degenerates erected soldier F paraphernalia and all the other usual trappings in the town centre for the local Nationalists to enjoy. When some wags removed the Soldier F banner and burnt it that DUP wench Carla Lockhart described it as a hate crime!

I'm all for the GAA being progressive, improving relations and encouraging those from a traditional Unionist background to take part in our games but realistically (regardless of what changes are made)  this will be confined to some of the more middle-class clubs in Belfast.

[brokencrossbar1]

Was in Derry over the weekend.  First time in a while we drove home along the main road as we normally have to head to Tyrone first. Anyway,  it was on that road that we were listening to the interview. I never had paid much attention before. A nothing place in my life.  Never even heard of it hardly.  Coming into it I saw the Institute ground on the right hand side and as we drove the flags got bigger and more and more prevalent. 3 big f**k off flags per lamp post, NI flag, Butchers Apron and either a UVF or a Soldier F flag.  Hundreds of them. Everywhere.  Few miles up the road you have Dungiven.  Strong nationalist/republican area.  Thriving club and strong Irish ethos,  probably one of the areas that you'd expect some markings of the areas 'identity', particularly at this time of the year with the 40 anniversary of the Hunger Strikers.  Not a single Tricolour, not a single one.  A few Dungiven black and whites along the way at houses but that was about it.  I think I saw maybe 2 posters for Kevin Lynch and that was it. 

The difference in what you can actually see is frightening.  Driving round the Articlaves, and the Limavadies etc and all you see is flag after flag after flag.  It used to be intimidating but as a confident, open nationalist/republican who is steeped in the GAA it doesn't work any more.  Whilst what Oisín says is true that in the North there is not the same attraction for Protestants to join up,  there is less of a likelihood given what is happening within their own community and the fear mongering that comes from all sides of their 'leadership'.  Why compromise when compromising is a single pathway with no likely benefit?

Have your flags, have your marches, have your 'culture', the Irish language, the Irish music, the Irish sporting identity, and the revived Irish identity will continue to grow.  Join our journey forward, or stay stuck in 1690 forever.

[Milltown Row2]

Was in Derry over the weekend.  First time in a while we drove home along the main road as we normally have to head to Tyrone first. Anyway,  it was on that road that we were listening to the interview. I never had paid much attention before. A nothing place in my life.  Never even heard of it hardly.  Coming into it I saw the Institute ground on the right hand side and as we drove the flags got bigger and more and more prevalent. 3 big f**k off flags per lamp post, NI flag, Butchers Apron and either a UVF or a Soldier F flag.  Hundreds of them. Everywhere.  Few miles up the road you have Dungiven.  Strong nationalist/republican area.  Thriving club and strong Irish ethos,  probably one of the areas that you'd expect some markings of the areas 'identity', particularly at this time of the year with the 40 anniversary of the Hunger Strikers.  Not a single Tricolour, not a single one.  A few Dungiven black and whites along the way at houses but that was about it.  I think I saw maybe 2 posters for Kevin Lynch and that was it. 

The difference in what you can actually see is frightening.  Driving round the Articlaves, and the Limavadies etc and all you see is flag after flag after flag.  It used to be intimidating but as a confident, open nationalist/republican who is steeped in the GAA it doesn't work any more.  Whilst what Oisín says is true that in the North there is not the same attraction for Protestants to join up,  there is less of a likelihood given what is happening within their own community and the fear mongering that comes from all sides of their 'leadership'.  Why compromise when compromising is a single pathway with no likely benefit?

Have your flags, have your marches, have your 'culture', the Irish language, the Irish music, the Irish sporting identity, and the revived Irish identity will continue to grow.  Join our journey forward, or stay stuck in 1690 forever.

In mixed areas and decent residential areas the flags are not there, where I live there are no flags in any of the houses, anywhere, they don't come over the hill at Monkstown and stick up flegs! nor are they down in Whiteabbey village either. But those wee town that are solely protestant or 95% its decked out within an inch of its existence! BT9 in Belfast there will not be any either and I'd say its half and half, but the locals would not tolerate the area looking like a shithole.

Like you, a fleg doesn't intimidate me I don't even see them anymore. I see an eyesore

[imtommygunn]

The flag is an insecurity thing. It makes me laugh now tbh. When younger and I was brought up in a nationalist only area I'd not have seen them so for a wee bit they annoyed me but you grow out of it. Sure look at the crown roundabout in Larne. How could you do anything but laugh?

I would be in England / Scotland a good bit. You'd be lucky to see one flag on any visit never mind streets bedecked in them.

[johnnycool]

Was in Derry over the weekend.  First time in a while we drove home along the main road as we normally have to head to Tyrone first. Anyway,  it was on that road that we were listening to the interview. I never had paid much attention before. A nothing place in my life.  Never even heard of it hardly.  Coming into it I saw the Institute ground on the right hand side and as we drove the flags got bigger and more and more prevalent. 3 big f**k off flags per lamp post, NI flag, Butchers Apron and either a UVF or a Soldier F flag.  Hundreds of them. Everywhere.  Few miles up the road you have Dungiven.  Strong nationalist/republican area.  Thriving club and strong Irish ethos,  probably one of the areas that you'd expect some markings of the areas 'identity', particularly at this time of the year with the 40 anniversary of the Hunger Strikers.  Not a single Tricolour, not a single one.  A few Dungiven black and whites along the way at houses but that was about it.  I think I saw maybe 2 posters for Kevin Lynch and that was it. 

The difference in what you can actually see is frightening.  Driving round the Articlaves, and the Limavadies etc and all you see is flag after flag after flag.  It used to be intimidating but as a confident, open nationalist/republican who is steeped in the GAA it doesn't work any more.  Whilst what Oisín says is true that in the North there is not the same attraction for Protestants to join up,  there is less of a likelihood given what is happening within their own community and the fear mongering that comes from all sides of their 'leadership'.  Why compromise when compromising is a single pathway with no likely benefit?

Have your flags, have your marches, have your 'culture', the Irish language, the Irish music, the Irish sporting identity, and the revived Irish identity will continue to grow.  Join our journey forward, or stay stuck in 1690 forever.

In mixed areas and decent residential areas the flags are not there, where I live there are no flags in any of the houses, anywhere, they don't come over the hill at Monkstown and stick up flegs! nor are they down in Whiteabbey village either. But those wee town that are solely protestant or 95% its decked out within an inch of its existence! BT9 in Belfast there will not be any either and I'd say its half and half, but the locals would not tolerate the area looking like a shithole.

Like you, a fleg doesn't intimidate me I don't even see them anymore. I see an eyesore

Our local Alliance MLA, ex camog Kellie put up a facebook post about loyalist paramilitary flegs going up in Cloughey..

Strangely very few likes and comments below it considering when she mentions integrated education all the great and good row in behind her about how it's the way forward, yet very little about UVF flegs in what is now a mixed area.

They don't bother me in the slightest either, akin to a dog pissing against the post..

[Milltown Row2]

The flag is an insecurity thing. It makes me laugh now tbh. When younger and I was brought up in a nationalist only area I'd not have seen them so for a wee bit they annoyed me but you grow out of it. Sure look at the crown roundabout in Larne. How could you do anything but laugh?

I would be in England / Scotland a good bit. You'd be lucky to see one flag on any visit never mind streets bedecked in them.

Is it still there? I worked in the place that made it lol!! Would have been young catholic students working on it...

I think it was made for the queen celebrations of some sorts and they were meant to keep it on there for just that period but have left it there!

That's about 8/9 years or more

[brokencrossbar1]

Agreed about all of this but the thing is that is still a very strong mentality of a large core of people. Like cornered rats they are getting angrier and angrier, the whole move by the DUP to have an outreach program is not to assuage any of their fears but to bring the angry dog back inside the yard so it can do its angry barking for them and there is a few hard years ahead I fear