The next 10 all Irelands

[Jayop]

Would any serious hurling person advocate abolishing the Munster Hurling final?

Why would any serious football person in Ulster, or anywhere for that matter, advocate abolishing the Ulster football final and the Ulster Championship?

The time of year of these proposals is the No1 problem I have with them. Play the provincials over April/May, Play the championship after them. A game a week, no ballsing about.

[Captain Obvious]

The 7 game league (no need for finals) is the best format the GAA have and a tiered system already in place. Instead of making that competition more important and of a bigger interest to players and supporters HQ are going to give us a dogs dinner of a format as Sid has outlined in that option B proposal.

Too much of a ask for the grey haired men in suits to come up with a plan of having two important competitions in one year?

[Armagh18]

Would any serious hurling person advocate abolishing the Munster Hurling final?

Why would any serious football person in Ulster, or anywhere for that matter, advocate abolishing the Ulster football final and the Ulster Championship?

Keep it for sure. But Tyrone deserve to be further on in the championship after winning Ulster than Kerry or Dublin do for sleepwalking through their provincials.

[Rossfan]

Who advocated abolishing the Provincial Championship or the Provincial Finals?
Isn't proposal B keeping them in watered down format with Finals??

[Jayop]

Who advocated abolishing the Provincial Championship or the Provincial Finals?
Isn't proposal B keeping them in watered down format with Finals??

Yes but played in Spring time according to Sid there.

[Solo_run]

Tyrone 3
Dublin 3
Kerry 3
Derry 1

[JoG2]

Tyrone 3
Dublin 3
Kerry 3
Derry 1

.. I gotta han it to you solo, good man

[sid waddell]

Who advocated abolishing the Provincial Championship or the Provincial Finals?
Isn't proposal B keeping them in watered down format with Finals??

Which is effectively abolishing them. An Ulster final played on March 13th and which does not tie into the Championship as a whole isn't the Ulster final. It's the McKenna Cup final.

[Rossfan]

Fogarty hinting neither  proposals A or B will get 60% of the vote.
He's usually on the ball with HQ's thinking....

https://www.irishexaminer.com/sport/gaa/arid-40704122.html

[Hound]

Would any serious hurling person advocate abolishing the Munster Hurling final?

Why would any serious football person in Ulster, or anywhere for that matter, advocate abolishing the Ulster football final and the Ulster Championship?

Is there any serious hurling person advocating the reinstatement of the Connacht hurling final? If it had been around for the last 10 years it wouldn't have been that much less competitive than the Leinster football championship.

Do the proposals seek to abolish the Ulster championship? To quote a wise poster, I hope you are not:
"You just substituted in a lowest common denominator absurdity in the absence of a real reply"

As far as I'm aware, the proposal is to run it separately so teams can still have a run at it, but while also leveling the playing field for Ulster counties when it comes to fighting for Sam.

There seems to be a consensus among those against the league system that provincial titles will mean nothing if not directly linked with progression to the All Ireland semi finals (or quarter-finals). I'm really not sure that's true. But if it is, it doesn't say a whole lot for retaining them. Tyrone v Armagh in a QF in the proposed system would still be a massive game to the players and fans involved.

[sid waddell]

Would any serious hurling person advocate abolishing the Munster Hurling final?

Why would any serious football person in Ulster, or anywhere for that matter, advocate abolishing the Ulster football final and the Ulster Championship?

Is there any serious hurling person advocating the reinstatement of the Connacht hurling final? If it had been around for the last 10 years it wouldn't have been that much less competitive than the Leinster football championship.

Do the proposals seek to abolish the Ulster championship? To quote a wise poster, I hope you are not:
"You just substituted in a lowest common denominator absurdity in the absence of a real reply"

As far as I'm aware, the proposal is to run it separately so teams can still have a run at it, but while also leveling the playing field for Ulster counties when it comes to fighting for Sam.

There seems to be a consensus among those against the league system that provincial titles will mean nothing if not directly linked with progression to the All Ireland semi finals (or quarter-finals). I'm really not sure that's true. But if it is, it doesn't say a whole lot for retaining them. Tyrone v Armagh in a QF in the proposed system would still be a massive game to the players and fans involved.

But sure you've just substituted in a lowest denominator absurdity in the absence of a real argument.

The lowest common denominator absurdity is to compare the Connacht Hurling Final, a match which has taken place on six occasions over the last century, all in the 1990s, with the Munster Hurling Final, one of the biggest occasions in the hurling year ever since the game started being played on an organised basis.

Do you not see how absurd and lowest common denominator this is?

It's also an absurd, lowest common denominator, gaslighting exercise to claim that a standalone "Ulster Football Championship", played in February and March, will retain its prestige.

There is a short answer to that. It will not.

I mean it's in the proposal itself. It calls them "pre-season competitions". They'll have all the prestige of the McKenna Cup, the O'Byrne Cup, the FBD League, the Makita International tournament and a pre-season friendly between Shamrock Rovers and Djurgarden.

Provincial finals in high summer have massive value as occasions, in terms of selling the game, in terms of prestige, in terms of history, in terms of being genuinely something for mid-ranking teams to aim at. To throw that away for a rationalised, deeply predictable league with masses of empty spaces in the crowd, where all those occasions are lost forever, is madness.

[Rossfan]

Would any serious hurling person advocate abolishing the Munster Hurling final?

Why would any serious football person in Ulster, or anywhere for that matter, advocate abolishing the Ulster football final and the Ulster Championship?

There seems to be a consensus among those against the league system that provincial titles will mean nothing if not directly linked with progression to the All Ireland semi finals (or quarter-finals). I'm really not sure that's true. But if it is, it doesn't say a whole lot for retaining them.

Indeed.
If they can't stand on their own 2 feet they can't be that vital.
Problem with them linking to AI Championship is the 11/9/7/6 participants; unfairness on Ulster Counties; the sleepwalk past hurling Counties to AI series for Kerry: the Dublin monopoly of Leinster and a Connacht County can get to the last 12 with 1 game against a D4 team.

A possible compromise on Proposal B would be to play the Provincials in traditional knock out format during the NFL- like soccer cup competitions, with certain  weekends (4 required) set aside for them.

[toby47]

Kerry 4
Dublin 4
Mayo 1 (when yer man dies)
Donegal 1

[Hound]

The lowest common denominator absurdity is to compare the Connacht Hurling Final, a match which has taken place on six occasions over the last century, all in the 1990s, with the Munster Hurling Final, one of the biggest occasions in the hurling year ever since the game started being played on an organised basis.

Yep good man, that's exactly what I did 

[sid waddell]

Would any serious hurling person advocate abolishing the Munster Hurling final?

Why would any serious football person in Ulster, or anywhere for that matter, advocate abolishing the Ulster football final and the Ulster Championship?

There seems to be a consensus among those against the league system that provincial titles will mean nothing if not directly linked with progression to the All Ireland semi finals (or quarter-finals). I'm really not sure that's true. But if it is, it doesn't say a whole lot for retaining them.

Indeed.
If they can't stand on their own 2 feet they can't be that vital.
Problem with them linking to AI Championship is the 11/9/7/6 participants; unfairness on Ulster Counties; the sleepwalk past hurling Counties to AI series for Kerry: the Dublin monopoly of Leinster and a Connacht County can get to the last 12 with 1 game against a D4 team.

A possible compromise on Proposal B would be to play the Provincials in traditional knock out format during the NFL- like soccer cup competitions, with certain  weekends (4 required) set aside for them.

Sure that's like saying if you separate World Cup qualifiers from the World Cup so that they're no longer World Cup qualifiers, and they can "no longer stand on their own two feet", they can't be that important.

I mean the NFL in America is a pointer as to how valuable the provincial championships are.

They have divisional titles - with the divisions always made up of the same teams, like the NFC East - it's always the New York Giants, the Philadelphia Eagles, the Washington whatever they're called nows, and the Dallas Cowboys. The NFL has eight of these divisional titles. Not every team can win the Superbowl, but every divisional title is an achievement in itself.

The point is that as well as being ends in and of themselves, divisional titles qualify you for the play-offs. They are all inextricably tied into the road to the Superbowl. 8 of the 12 play-off teams are divisional champions - there are four wild cards, the NFL's equivalent of back door qualifiers.

Then you have your Conference championships, which are the next step up from divisional championships.

If you removed the divisional and Conference championships from American football's NFL season and played them as pre-season competitions, do you think they'd matter anymore?