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Messages - APM

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1
GAA Discussion / Re: NFL Division 2 - 2021
« on: June 16, 2021, 02:13:55 PM »
Oh to be in Ulster or Connacht and genuinely believe you have a chance at provincial honours. Finished with a very young team today. Kildare's attitude was good, Meath look like they need to freshen up management. Old heads pulled them back into it and remarkable considering Kildare's dominance for 60 mins almost pulled something out of it but not what you want to see when trying to develop and build a squad. So many teams lie between 3rd ranked and 14th ranked that it would be an exciting championship if Dublin and Kerry didn't exist. Well maybe just Dublin.

McEntee comes across very reactionary. You would imagine this year will be the end of the road for him. 
Hard to believe that Meath are where they are. Boylan was there for 23 years and in the 16 years since they have had 6 managers and done nothing.  With their populations, Meath and Kildare should be doing so much better.

https://mobile.twitter.com/TheSundayGame/status/1330254398535176204

I agree with that the financial doping of Dublin is a major problem.  But we have teams in Ulster (Donegal, Tyrone), Connacht (Mayo) and Munster (Kerry) that will at least give Dublin the semblance of a game.  Meath and Kildare haven't even been close to that standard, yet benefit from some of the same factors (population) that have helped Dublin and probably don't exist in some of the other Division 1 teams.  They should be in a more competitive position than what they are. It's like they have given up the ghost at all levels. 

2
GAA Discussion / Re: NFL Division 2 - 2021
« on: June 15, 2021, 07:13:02 PM »
Oh to be in Ulster or Connacht and genuinely believe you have a chance at provincial honours. Finished with a very young team today. Kildare's attitude was good, Meath look like they need to freshen up management. Old heads pulled them back into it and remarkable considering Kildare's dominance for 60 mins almost pulled something out of it but not what you want to see when trying to develop and build a squad. So many teams lie between 3rd ranked and 14th ranked that it would be an exciting championship if Dublin and Kerry didn't exist. Well maybe just Dublin.

McEntee comes across very reactionary. You would imagine this year will be the end of the road for him. 
Hard to believe that Meath are where they are. Boylan was there for 23 years and in the 16 years since they have had 6 managers and done nothing.  With their populations, Meath and Kildare should be doing so much better.

3
GAA Discussion / Re: Division one 2021
« on: June 14, 2021, 09:16:49 AM »
The split into 2◊4 was arseways. Galway aren't the second worst team in D1. Neither are Monaghan.

It was the same in the hurling. The standard in Galway's pool was far higher than in the other one.

If the footballers are any good they will be ar ais arŪs next year.
Who is worse than them? Because Armagh beat Monaghan in the league and beat them well in our last championship meeting and would probably be favourites vs Galway. Agree thought the split league is a disgrace.

Weirdly enough Armagh are the only team to have beat Monaghan this year

Agree with that.  Roscommon definitely deserved to go down on the basis of having lost every game.
If Galway aren't the second worst team in Division 1, and it's not Monaghan, who is?

Galway should have no excuses.  Should have beaten Monaghan yesterday in normal time.   

4
General discussion / Re: 💩 DUP C*ntwatch - Under New Management
« on: June 11, 2021, 11:26:04 AM »
I think Boris should have a referendum, just in the north, regarding the protocal. Just a simple should it stay, or go. Im convinced it would pass and the dup would be sidelined further with nowhere to turn.
There should be no referendum

The protocol would likely be thrown out

Referendums if at all possible should always be between two defined choices - if you held a referendum on this you're leaving open the choice of absolute chaos

It would be another Brexit - and the only logical place to go if the protocol is thrown out is a hard border

The UK negotiated this, they and Unionists now have to lie on the bed they made


Agree with this.  There cannot be a referendum on the protocol as there is no defined alternative.  As far as I can see the only sustainable alternative to a protocol is a United Ireland.  For reasons discussed exhaustively during the negotiations, a hard border on the island is not sustainable. 

Given those two choices in a referendum, I think the unionists politicians would be quite happy with the bed that they made for themselves.   

5
GAA Discussion / Re: Joe Brolly
« on: June 11, 2021, 10:52:12 AM »
Listened to the first 15mins and itís text book Brolly so far. Makes a couple of good points and then talks over everyone, talks about himself and throws in a few far fetched tales.

Two corkers so far:
- Dublin team Doctor, Dr Hickey, rang him after his comments on Tyrone and told him he was watching it in a pub in Listowel and there was a round of applause and standing ovation for Brolly after he spoke.
- pub in Tyrone had to turn off the TV when Brolly was speaking before a game as the punters where throwing their shoes at the telly.  ::)

Then at one stage Mark Sidebottom said that not all people like what Brolly was describing as his style. Brolly disagreed naturally, Sidebottom give example of he been at dinner the day before and 3 people where looking forward to the podcast and 3 said they wouldnít listen. Brolly dismissed this and said the 3 where lying.

That 15 minute is Brolly in a nutshell. Itís funny at first but tiresome after half a hour. If you in a pub, youíd listen to it for first pint but youíd quickly look to move on.

Is it not good craic talking to people with opinions that they can articulate well and in an entertaining way, even if you disagree with them.  I laugh at people complaining about him telling lies.  Who's to say that story about Dr Hickey was untrue.  I can imagine it happening.  I don't know about the shoe story, but wouldn't rule it out in certain Tyrone bars  ;)

Even if it isn't true. What odds?

He's telling a story and giving a bit of colour.  He's passionate and clearly has a love of the games. You can see that he is concerned that as a cultural and sporting body, something is being lost in the drive for a more professional approach, whether its in the cautious football, the bland boring sports personalities, cynical football or some of the ambitions of the GPA. 

You mightn't like him, or his personality, but take away all of the bluster he is a really important voice for the GAA to listen to.

Itís about balance and you want some personality and colour for sure but with Brolly, and itís only my take on him, you donít get the balance. You just get him.

These stories of his, they donít stand up. The Dr Hickey story, there may have been approval and a few nodding heads but round of applause and standing ovation....have you ever been in an Irish pub FFS  ;D ;D In Joeís head it happened. Numerous times his stories are far fetched. Iíve no doubt he believes them though, many exaggerated and before fact over time.

What odds? If we let everyone on TV tell tales weíd be in a great place alright. Leave the lying to the politicians.

I donít think he is a great voice at all for the GAA. He goes to extremes and makes it personal all too often. He has these great causes and drops them like a hot potato. Pay TV was going to ruin GAA and now he involved in it, he was going to stop Covid and hasnít mentioned it in 12 months. He a mixed up man.

As I said, if you landed into a pub a bit under weather of a Sunday morning, youíd land in beside him and get a few pints onboard while he leads the way. Come a hour later, youíd have heard enough and be off up the street to another spot.

In my head they were already standing to be fair  :)

In terms of letting everyone tell tales; the point is that it isn't politics, its football and as far as spectators are concerned, it is entertainment. 

Think of the games that you played in and some of the stuff that happened on and off the pitch.  As the years go on the stories get a bit taller and a bit more embellished.  Is that not telling tales.

And to be fair to Brolly, a lot of his message is about ensuring that the adventure and joy remain in the game and all that goes with it, punditry included.

6
GAA Discussion / Re: Joe Brolly
« on: June 11, 2021, 10:01:55 AM »
Listened to the first 15mins and itís text book Brolly so far. Makes a couple of good points and then talks over everyone, talks about himself and throws in a few far fetched tales.

Two corkers so far:
- Dublin team Doctor, Dr Hickey, rang him after his comments on Tyrone and told him he was watching it in a pub in Listowel and there was a round of applause and standing ovation for Brolly after he spoke.
- pub in Tyrone had to turn off the TV when Brolly was speaking before a game as the punters where throwing their shoes at the telly.  ::)

Then at one stage Mark Sidebottom said that not all people like what Brolly was describing as his style. Brolly disagreed naturally, Sidebottom give example of he been at dinner the day before and 3 people where looking forward to the podcast and 3 said they wouldnít listen. Brolly dismissed this and said the 3 where lying.

That 15 minute is Brolly in a nutshell. Itís funny at first but tiresome after half a hour. If you in a pub, youíd listen to it for first pint but youíd quickly look to move on.

Is it not good craic talking to people with opinions that they can articulate well and in an entertaining way, even if you disagree with them.  I laugh at people complaining about him telling lies.  Who's to say that story about Dr Hickey was untrue.  I can imagine it happening.  I don't know about the shoe story, but wouldn't rule it out in certain Tyrone bars  ;)

Even if it isn't true. What odds?

He's telling a story and giving a bit of colour.  He's passionate and clearly has a love of the games. You can see that he is concerned that as a cultural and sporting body, something is being lost in the drive for a more professional approach, whether its in the cautious football, the bland boring sports personalities, cynical football or some of the ambitions of the GPA. 

You mightn't like him, or his personality, but take away all of the bluster he is a really important voice for the GAA to listen to.

7
GAA Discussion / Re: Joe Brolly
« on: June 10, 2021, 09:35:48 PM »
Yeah it's the personal attacks. Let's not forget that's why he is out of RTE and he was warned. He wasn't a victim from one incident here.

The political stuff should have been separate and they didn't seem to seperate it mind you but I dunno what he wants to achieve here.

https://m.belfasttelegraph.co.uk/sport/gaa/no-regrets-from-rte-chief-mcbennett-over-axing-of-controversial-pundit-brolly-39487035.html

It was primarily down to a change in the head of RTE sport and his change away from personality based pundits to more game based analysis. Has the standard of pundit on RTE improved since the new head came in, I donít think so. I watched the Ireland match last night and didnít tune into the analysis yet this used to often be the best entertainment of the night. Wondering what Dunphy and Giles would say and how Bill knew how to press their buttons.

I do get the fact that some people want stats based analysis and information on KPIs but if I want that type of information Iíll sign up for a coaching seminar. It just doesnít interest me.

This looks like the real reason he was sacked

https://m.belfasttelegraph.co.uk/sport/gaa/no-regrets-from-rte-chief-mcbennett-over-axing-of-controversial-pundit-brolly-39487035.html

"I don't think you can just cover it the same way you've always done. People want to learn more. It's simply not good enough to come out with the same scenarioÖ the old days were good, this is awful. "

Dublin's  hegemony is a huge problem for anyone selling ads linked to.sports coverage. TV sport is about drama and the all Ireland endgame doesn't have any..

Using that metric, Pat Spillane and Colm O'Rourke should be gone too then!

Exactly what I was thinking.  Spillane in particular should be gone on that basis.  The interesting thing about Brolly that McConville seemed to uncover was that he is capable of giving far more incisive analysis, but he chose not to do so. He worked on the basis that people tuned into to hear a yarn at half time and for a good portion of the population he was probably right. 

My view of Brolly is that once you accept him for what he is, he is quite enjoyable to listen to.  His rant on Cavanagh was really good TV and for the most part he was dead right about the cynicism.  He articulated it very well; the notion that they were celebrating but that they had achieved something rotten.  There was hyperbole, but it was worth it as the point needed to be made.  Can you imagine any other pundit saying it. 

I could live without Spillane as there was no-one else who pedaled the myth as much as him that it was better in the 70s like him.  Pure crap analysis. 

It's grand to have the detailed analysis of tactics and formulations.  However, its great to have someone to spark a debate. There's no harm in the devil's advocate.

Paddy Heaney once had a very accurate article in the Irish News about GAA attendances depending heavily on the average drinking man.  They aren't there to examine tactics and they aren't that committed.  They are there to enjoy themselves, have a day out, a few pints and roar on their team.  He talked about them being priced out the gate by rising ticket costs.  The average drinking man is probably sitting at home or in the pub, and isn't a bit worried about which team made the most unforced errors.  It's the likes of Brolly, Spillane etc that keeps these guys engaged.

Oisin made that point, but Brolly refuted it in the interview and I have to say I agree with Brolly on that.
Once you cut through the bluster and the "entertainment", Brolly gave some very good insights into the games. I think a lot of people couldn't see past Brolly the entertainer far enough to actually listen to the analyst.
Of course that's a problem for a pundit too, but to be fair to brolly IMO he was rarely too far off the mark in terms of analysis.
I actually find McConnville (and Canavan for that matter) really difficult to listen to due to their tone of voice. The bore the arse of me to be honest.

Agree with all that. Brolly when he wanted to be was thee most informative pundit out there. He did get bored and did go off on rants but on form he was the best. Most importantly Joe was right in the podcast....IT IS ENTERTAINMENT ffs. Its our amateur sport that takes us away from our daily humdrum and we want a balance of insight and craic.

Canavan and McConville are good analysts but so drove...no life in them.

Eamon  Fitzmaurice seems like he's at a wake. Awful. Wieland constantly angry and dour.

There's bound to be some boys with a bit of craic and light in their eyes out there who can give a bit of both and are articulate enough to teach and keep us entertained

I'd be happy enough to listen to a McConville or a Canavan with a Brolly alongside them. Part of the problem in RTE is the increased level of political correctness. It's all so careful and once Joanne Cantwell replcaed Michael Lyster, it seemed to me that she didn't want to work with him.   

8
GAA Discussion / Re: Joe Brolly
« on: June 10, 2021, 11:16:19 AM »
Yeah it's the personal attacks. Let's not forget that's why he is out of RTE and he was warned. He wasn't a victim from one incident here.

The political stuff should have been separate and they didn't seem to seperate it mind you but I dunno what he wants to achieve here.

https://m.belfasttelegraph.co.uk/sport/gaa/no-regrets-from-rte-chief-mcbennett-over-axing-of-controversial-pundit-brolly-39487035.html

It was primarily down to a change in the head of RTE sport and his change away from personality based pundits to more game based analysis. Has the standard of pundit on RTE improved since the new head came in, I donít think so. I watched the Ireland match last night and didnít tune into the analysis yet this used to often be the best entertainment of the night. Wondering what Dunphy and Giles would say and how Bill knew how to press their buttons.

I do get the fact that some people want stats based analysis and information on KPIs but if I want that type of information Iíll sign up for a coaching seminar. It just doesnít interest me.

This looks like the real reason he was sacked

https://m.belfasttelegraph.co.uk/sport/gaa/no-regrets-from-rte-chief-mcbennett-over-axing-of-controversial-pundit-brolly-39487035.html

"I don't think you can just cover it the same way you've always done. People want to learn more. It's simply not good enough to come out with the same scenarioÖ the old days were good, this is awful. "

Dublin's  hegemony is a huge problem for anyone selling ads linked to.sports coverage. TV sport is about drama and the all Ireland endgame doesn't have any..

Using that metric, Pat Spillane and Colm O'Rourke should be gone too then!

Exactly what I was thinking.  Spillane in particular should be gone on that basis.  The interesting thing about Brolly that McConville seemed to uncover was that he is capable of giving far more incisive analysis, but he chose not to do so. He worked on the basis that people tuned into to hear a yarn at half time and for a good portion of the population he was probably right. 

My view of Brolly is that once you accept him for what he is, he is quite enjoyable to listen to.  His rant on Cavanagh was really good TV and for the most part he was dead right about the cynicism.  He articulated it very well; the notion that they were celebrating but that they had achieved something rotten.  There was hyperbole, but it was worth it as the point needed to be made.  Can you imagine any other pundit saying it. 

I could live without Spillane as there was no-one else who pedaled the myth as much as him that it was better in the 70s like him.  Pure crap analysis. 

It's grand to have the detailed analysis of tactics and formulations.  However, its great to have someone to spark a debate. There's no harm in the devil's advocate.

Paddy Heaney once had a very accurate article in the Irish News about GAA attendances depending heavily on the average drinking man.  They aren't there to examine tactics and they aren't that committed.  They are there to enjoy themselves, have a day out, a few pints and roar on their team.  He talked about them being priced out the gate by rising ticket costs.  The average drinking man is probably sitting at home or in the pub, and isn't a bit worried about which team made the most unforced errors.  It's the likes of Brolly, Spillane etc that keeps these guys engaged. 


9
GAA Discussion / Re: Division one 2021
« on: June 04, 2021, 04:56:22 PM »
Armagh vs Ros is a huge game. Big for both teams but absolutely huge for us. Itís been a long road back to here.

We know that Dublin and Kerry are way ahead of us. Depressingly it is difficult to conceive of how those respective gaps could be closed.

We have to admit that Donegal, Tyrone and Mayo are ahead of us. Not by as much but definitively ahead. Bottom 3 in Division 1 looks like a ceiling for us in the near term. On that basis you will suffer relegation at some point. Roscommon are in that yo-yo territory already. Relegation is not a disaster but it makes everything this group of players is trying to achieve that bit more difficult

A case to be made that Division 1 should become a 10 team group.

As Mayo found out last year the trap door is too easy to fall through in the current format and the likes of Armagh, Roscommon, Meath need consecutive years in Div 1 to develop.

Wouldn't disagree with that as an Armagh man.  However, I think there would be a stronger argument to have smaller divisions with games played home and away.   I posted this a few weeks back and don't think anyone commented on it, so I'll add it again here.   
http://gaaboard.com/board/index.php?topic=29928.msg2053334#msg2053334

10
GAA Discussion / Re: Division one 2021
« on: June 04, 2021, 08:46:15 AM »
McGeeney is a big plus for Roscommon

What do you mean?

11
General discussion / Re: What is the point of this board anymore?
« on: May 25, 2021, 06:56:35 PM »
I don't think he's the one with the ego. 

The bar analogy is perfect and one I really relate too. 

To be fair there is a couple of these guys. 

You might see them at the bar and say to yourself, I'll sit down at a table or go into the lounge; and lo-and-behold, the feckers will be in there too, sitting arguing like hell and driving you mad.  Then you move to the bar and they are there as well.   

There's not much point posting anything sensible as it gets lost in all the crap and doesn't even generate any kind of a response.
 

12
This format is only appropriate for the pandemic.  Realistically it is crap as it pairs teams based on location and you have a mini-Ulster league going in Division 1 North.  These teams see plenty of each other.

However, I could see benefits of both larger and smaller divisions.  Here are a couple of options to discuss:
Personally I like option 1, although there will be complaints that it will make the strong stronger. 


Option 1

Top 2 divisions with 6 teams
Divisions 3 - 6 with 5 teams (Edit: alternatively the extra teams could go into the two bottom divisions as they will have less championship action)
One team promoted and one team relegated every year. 
Would be highly competitive in each division, with fewer teams and more alignment in ability. 
Edit: Could even play home and away. For a 5 team division it really is only one extra game than they play now - cut out the play offs and you really would have no extra playing slots required)


Division 1
Kerry
Dublin
Galway
Tyrone
Monaghan
Donegal

Division 2
Mayo
Meath
Armagh
Roscommon
Kildare
Westmeath

Division 3
Laois
Clare
Cavan
Fermanagh
Cork

Division 4
Down
Derry
Longford
Tipperary
Offaly

Division 5
Leitrim
Louth
Limerick
Wicklow
Antrim

Division 6
Wexford
Carlow
Sligo
Waterford
London

Option 2
Alternatively 2 Divisions of 10 and one with 12 (probably the bottom div as they will have a shorter involvement in the championship)
2 teams promoted each year
Gives more opportunity to play better teams and improve (but more mismatches)

Division 1
Kerry
Dublin
Galway
Tyrone
Monaghan
Donegal
Mayo
Meath
Armagh
Roscommon

Division 2
Kildare
Westmeath
Laois
Clare
Cavan
Fermanagh
Cork
Down
Derry
Longford

Division 3
(12 Teams)

Tipperary
Offaly
Leittrm
Louth
Limerick
Wicklow
Antrim
Wexford
Carlow
Sligo
Waterford
London

13
GAA Discussion / Re: Rule Changes
« on: May 18, 2021, 06:46:06 PM »
While Im typing this someone somewhere will be posting about rule changes to make the games better.

If they want to stop Rugby League type stuff
GET RID OF OR SEVERELY LIMIT THE  ****IN THROWBALL.
The new black/penalty inside 20/arc is a solution to Hurley cynical fouling problems being landed onto football.

I don't understand people giving out about too much handpassing. It's a fundamental part of Gaelic football. They tried putting a limit on handpassing in the fbd league a couple of years back and it was a farce.

Maybe soccer is a better sport for you.

Spot on! You make a post complaining about too many rule changes and someone responds immediately about the need for rule changes. 
The GAA are making changes and then not even allowing time for those to bed in before making new changes.  The entire media commentary is about rules needing changed and how the rule changes are making a bollix of the game. It's not just ex-players.  Martin Breheny would be an awful man for it too.  It's like they are bored commentating on the actual game and have got into a rut of suggesting changes.

Wobbler spot on too about the ex-players.  Basically these guys are given a platform by RTE to denigrate the game and make us feel like idiots for watching it.  Pat "it was far better in my day" Spillane being the poster boy for this crap. There was nothing golden about the golden years.  Middling skills, middling fitness, loads of handpassing (handpassed goals FFS) - but far fewer games televised, hence, people didn't have to sit through Carlow and Wicklow in the first round of Leinster. 

All the same, it's great to have it back.  There were a number of decent games on yesterday and instead of the Sunday Game and the radio giving a few minutes to look at Armagh v Monaghan (only one of two decently competitive Div 1 games this weekend), we had to listen to more and more shite about rules. 

Aaaarrrghh






14
GAA Discussion / Rule Changes
« on: May 18, 2021, 04:04:30 PM »
What is it about the GAA?  The hierarchy is absolutely obsessed with rule changes, most of which are stupid and have made the game worse - like the mark. But worse than that is the media.  If they are not suggesting that we need to ban the handpass, or go to 13 aside, it's that football is too physical and hurling is loosing its physicality.  There was more coverage to rule changes over the weekend than there was to the actual games. It would melt your head. 

 

 

15
General discussion / Re: INLA - Undefeated Army?
« on: May 17, 2021, 04:48:39 PM »
The amount of absolute shite polluting this board is ridiculous.    I see no need to be starting threads like this and I see no need for anyone to be replying to them to be keeping them going.  The mods should be deleting crap like this and removing the posters whose interest in GAA is clearly dwarved by their interest in politics and other such shite.   

This is a GAA Board.  Excluding the county sections, more than half of the posts are on the General Discussion rather than on the GAA Discussion. Perhaps understandable given lockdown.  But lockdown is now over and we can now enjoy our football and hurling again.

If you want to do politics go to Stormont, the Dail or feck off to Boards.ie.  If you want to do religion go to the chapel, church or go and read Richard Dawkins.  Do not bring it in here,



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