Euro 20/21

Started by rodney trotter, May 19, 2021, 08:11:03 PM

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caprea

Quote from: Milltown Row2 on July 12, 2021, 11:51:16 PM
Quote from: caprea on July 12, 2021, 11:43:59 PM
For all the talk and all the attempts to blame Southgate, the defeat is on Rashford more than anyone else.

Eh? He played 1 minute in the game, help me out here on that one

He handed the initiative back to Italy. Missing his penalty after Donnarumma already committed to his right hand side was inexplicable.

That was the game.

Milltown Row2

Quote from: caprea on July 12, 2021, 11:55:27 PM
Quote from: Milltown Row2 on July 12, 2021, 11:51:16 PM
Quote from: caprea on July 12, 2021, 11:43:59 PM
For all the talk and all the attempts to blame Southgate, the defeat is on Rashford more than anyone else.

Eh? He played 1 minute in the game, help me out here on that one

He handed the initiative back to Italy. Missing his penalty after Donnarumma already committed to his right hand side was inexplicable.

That was the game.

He played one minute ffs . You taken penalties in a European final before?

England didn't press on after scoring and allowed the Italian team to dominate.

But yeah, it's think Rashford lost the game
None of us are getting out of here alive, so please stop treating yourself like an after thought. Ea

tiempo

Englands bid to host the 2030 World Cup on the ropes before it even got off the ground due to the scum behaviour of so called supporters at the weekend. Same type of Neanderthals that broke into Old Trafford in May. The groundball fraternity can't be trusted to behave themselves, pathetic.

Estimator

I think Southgates main problem is that he trusts some players too much and others he doesn't trust at all. They don't really fit into his back 7 system.

This even goes back to the World Cup 3yrs ago. His subs always came on v late in the game, with little chance to prove themselves. Don't think he made any changes in the World Cup knock-out games until at least the 75th minute. And it was always the same players being subbed on, the subbed off, almost like it was pre-ordained before the match regardless of how it was going.

The English fans seemed to accept it then and through the Euros as they were winning, but it was only painting over the cracks, as soon as they lost he was always going to be heavily blamed/criticized for his team selection/subs

Against Italy, with 15minutes to go, he should have been trying to change things up, run at the Italian defence/midfield, especially as they'd 3 or 4 booked at that stage. Had Foden been fit he may have been introduced for Mount, but the option for Grealish, Rashford, Sancho to make the Italians think a bit more, was still there.

He needs to find a way to protect the defence/Pickford as well as harnessing their attacking potential, but I don't think he is that guy.
Ulster League Champions 2009

north_antrim_hound

Quote from: Estimator on July 13, 2021, 10:42:58 AM
I think Southgates main problem is that he trusts some players too much and others he doesn't trust at all. They don't really fit into his back 7 system.

This even goes back to the World Cup 3yrs ago. His subs always came on v late in the game, with little chance to prove themselves. Don't think he made any changes in the World Cup knock-out games until at least the 75th minute. And it was always the same players being subbed on, the subbed off, almost like it was pre-ordained before the match regardless of how it was going.

The English fans seemed to accept it then and through the Euros as they were winning, but it was only painting over the cracks, as soon as they lost he was always going to be heavily blamed/criticized for his team selection/subs

Against Italy, with 15minutes to go, he should have been trying to change things up, run at the Italian defence/midfield, especially as they'd 3 or 4 booked at that stage. Had Foden been fit he may have been introduced for Mount, but the option for Grealish, Rashford, Sancho to make the Italians think a bit more, was still there.

He needs to find a way to protect the defence/Pickford as well as harnessing their attacking potential, but I don't think he is that guy.

Agreed, kane and Sterling looked a bit leggy second half as the played a lot in the last two weeks, not every one has options like England in terms of substitutes that can bomb forward from a defensive formation. I like Southgate and he has a thankless job but Mancini seem to have more bravery on taking off big names.
Management is a learning curve to and he might benefit from this competition for the World Cup.
There's a man with a mullet going mad with a mallet in Millets

johnnycool

Quote from: Milltown Row2 on July 12, 2021, 11:58:57 PM
Quote from: caprea on July 12, 2021, 11:55:27 PM
Quote from: Milltown Row2 on July 12, 2021, 11:51:16 PM
Quote from: caprea on July 12, 2021, 11:43:59 PM
For all the talk and all the attempts to blame Southgate, the defeat is on Rashford more than anyone else.

Eh? He played 1 minute in the game, help me out here on that one

He handed the initiative back to Italy. Missing his penalty after Donnarumma already committed to his right hand side was inexplicable.

That was the game.

He played one minute ffs . You taken penalties in a European final before?

England didn't press on after scoring and allowed the Italian team to dominate.

But yeah, it's think Rashford lost the game

Quite harsh that, no?

The actual game was 120 minutes of which Rashford played 3 or 4 minutes.

The deciding penalties are a lottery as we know. Can't remember the team, might have been Switzerland who took unbelievable penalties to put France out, yet the next game vrs Spain also went to penalties and you'd have thought it was the first time some of them had ever taken one.

Over the 120 minutes Italy were the better team and deserved to lift the trophy and that's not anti-English bias, that's based on Pickford being much the busier of the two keepers.

BennyCake

Quote from: tiempo on July 13, 2021, 10:34:39 AM
Englands bid to host the 2030 World Cup on the ropes before it even got off the ground due to the scum behaviour of so called supporters at the weekend. Same type of Neanderthals that broke into Old Trafford in May. The groundball fraternity can't be trusted to behave themselves, pathetic.

Wouldn't matter anyway. There's not enough oil money in Britain to swing a World Cup bid.

When you think about how Qatar got the next one, yet only had maybe one built stadium, it's madness.

JPGJOHNNYG

Quote from: BennyCake on July 13, 2021, 11:19:21 AM
Quote from: tiempo on July 13, 2021, 10:34:39 AM
Englands bid to host the 2030 World Cup on the ropes before it even got off the ground due to the scum behaviour of so called supporters at the weekend. Same type of Neanderthals that broke into Old Trafford in May. The groundball fraternity can't be trusted to behave themselves, pathetic.

Wouldn't matter anyway. There's not enough oil money in Britain to swing a World Cup bid.

When you think about how Qatar got the next one, yet only had maybe one built stadium, it's madness.

wasnt Ireland going to be include in the bid? probably just the Aviva maybe Croke but looks like it wont be happening anyway after the Wembley fiasco. The reports of lack of stewards and very few police seem ridiculous for the Euro final like wtf

seafoid

Quote from: BennyCake on July 13, 2021, 11:19:21 AM
Quote from: tiempo on July 13, 2021, 10:34:39 AM
Englands bid to host the 2030 World Cup on the ropes before it even got off the ground due to the scum behaviour of so called supporters at the weekend. Same type of Neanderthals that broke into Old Trafford in May. The groundball fraternity can't be trusted to behave themselves, pathetic.

Wouldn't matter anyway. There's not enough oil money in Britain to swing a World Cup bid.

When you think about how Qatar got the next one, yet only had maybe one built stadium, it's madness.
It's pure corruption
"f**k it, just score"- Donaghy   https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IbxG2WwVRjU

Armamike

As many suspected Italy was a bridge too far for England. The better team won and Italy were the best team in this tournament. Hard to know how England will fare in the future. They had a massive advantage here playing at home. Southgate has done a very good job getting them to the final stages of the last 2 tournaments. In the context of England's poor history at tournaments that's significant. If England ever get themselves organised right they will eventually win a major tournament.  They are too large a football nation to keep underachieving.
That's just, like your opinion man.

tiempo

Quote from: Armamike on July 13, 2021, 12:12:08 PM
As many suspected Italy was a bridge too far for England. The better team won and Italy were the best team in this tournament. Hard to know how England will fare in the future. They had a massive advantage here playing at home. Southgate has done a very good job getting them to the final stages of the last 2 tournaments. In the context of England's poor history at tournaments that's significant. If England ever get themselves organised right they will eventually win a major tournament.  They are too large a football nation to keep underachieving.

Jez if they've any more organizing to do it cant be much more than a few fluffy cushions at HQ.

Some countries have a winning history and heritage that very much helps them on their way e.g. the current Italy team with their lack of a good striker and 2 warhorse centre halves got the job done.

While some countries are mentally weak, the weight of history being too much e.g. England a team with all the raw materials plus home advantage but couldn't get the job done.

The manner of defeat should be disconcerting for the English FA, they were schooled on their home patch, and had it been the likes of Spain or France it could have been a lot uglier. Garth will use the last 2 tournaments as the template for the next, and rightly so, he's the most successful Eng manager since Alf, but there will be no evolution, the cart horse that is Rice will still be plonked in front of the back 4 or 5 with 7 men back 3 up top and inability to control the game.

BennyCake

#1211
Quote from: Armamike on July 13, 2021, 12:12:08 PM
As many suspected Italy was a bridge too far for England. The better team won and Italy were the best team in this tournament. Hard to know how England will fare in the future. They had a massive advantage here playing at home. Southgate has done a very good job getting them to the final stages of the last 2 tournaments. In the context of England's poor history at tournaments that's significant. If England ever get themselves organised right they will eventually win a major tournament.  They are too large a football nation to keep underachieving.

Has he though?

Tunisia? Panama? Ffs! They barely got past half a Colombia team, and only on penalties. A bang average Sweden team that Ireland should have beaten well 2 years previous. Ireland could have got to that semi in 2018. There was absolutely no pressure on Southgate in Russia, and he was lauded as some sort of genius for getting to a semi.

You could say they did somewhat better this time. But Muller scores that goal, and it's a different game. They cheated their way past a very good Danish team, needing a penalty again to do so. Italy dominated for a big part of the final, and made them look very very average. Only Italy's lack of a goal scorer, and that game is wrapped up in 90 minutes. They avoided all the big guns, just like in 2018. Had they met Belgium, Spain or France, they'd have got nowhere near the final. England were only beat in the end by penalties but in reality, they should never have been that close to winning it.

nrico2006

England look to have the talent to really progress in the next tournament or two, with the like of Sancho, Foden, Greenwood, TAA, Grealish etc. to become more prominent. 
'To the extreme I rock a mic like a vandal, light up a stage and wax a chump like a candle.'

nrico2006

Quote from: Captain Obvious on July 12, 2021, 03:52:08 PM
UEFA team.



Italy goalkeeper Gianluigi Donnarumma Player of the Tournament. Young player of tournament Spains Pedri.

Thats not the team of the tournament.
'To the extreme I rock a mic like a vandal, light up a stage and wax a chump like a candle.'

armaghniac

Quote from: Armamike on July 13, 2021, 12:12:08 PM
As many suspected Italy was a bridge too far for England. The better team won and Italy were the best team in this tournament. Hard to know how England will fare in the future. They had a massive advantage here playing at home. Southgate has done a very good job getting them to the final stages of the last 2 tournaments. In the context of England's poor history at tournaments that's significant. If England ever get themselves organised right they will eventually win a major tournament.  They are too large a football nation to keep underachieving.

England have room for improvement, but the likes of Germany would see themselves as having only room for improvement too, in a subsequent tournament the Germany, France or Spain might also be somewhat improved. You have to take your chances.
If at first you don't succeed, then goto Plan B