Messages

I would swop Clarke with Devlin and is Ruari C not fit?. If available l would play him at 12 (other side from the brother)? No word there? Prefer him to Seanie we need more scoring threat than runners there l believe. McCurry great career but l believe only 2nd half 20 min effectively in him at this level now Never strong/big enough ( Brian McGuigan exceptionnal in that regards but not for Dazzler?) or creative enough for CHF wonderful reliable scoring threat and passer inside but shied away from shots he would have scored from, in other days, in last two outings l felt.

Tyrone up next weekend

Morgan

Quinn
Teague
Devlin

Mckernan
Joey Clarke
Mcgeary

Conn
Kennedy

Seanie O'Donnell
Mcelholm
Ben McDonnell

Darragh Canavan
Mattie D
Ethan Jordan

Will they go with Cassidy, Mcelholm, r canavan at 11?

Will Ben McDonnell start again? Conor Oneill will be left for the under 20s surely?

Is there anyone who can come in defensively? No left sided free taker so will McCurry start? 

McElholm not good enough to play 11 in my opinion. needs kept out to wing. I'd rather have someone stronger on ball like McDonnell at 11 if that's our options.

agreed re McElholm great but wing fwd corner best for now. CHF big issue need a Seanie O'Shea but McDonnel told to go in tough but disciplined might be best for now?.
If reasonable (given u20 final) 20~30min of Ruari McCullagh may help there at end.

Armagh showed the strength and conditioning and mental toughness together needed in AI now even more so with 2pointer game coming to dominate [need at least 4pt goal to rebalamce the game l think] and if Tyrone can't match that Rossies will win l fear.

At least McCullagh got 5 min at rhe end. Messy but good win v Kildare 2-12 0-13 McDermott goal special in 1st half.

County board really need to get the internet info. right! It is shambolic, so hard to get team news and even scores

Seems Devlin thinking of giving McCullagh some time v Kildare (He would be a great man l think for 20-30 min v Rossies (but whatevers best for his career ..). Surely 2 Canavans and Kennedy are right by now?

This Roscommon team is going to have a field day running through the centre of our defence. They've serious running pace and we've been wide open all year.

I mean did anyone think we stood a chance even before this game? Unless they let in a few more 3rd or 4th division teams we aren't winning a game

Glad Rossies won today. May go on the piss and not recover from the physical battering as Tyrone wait in ambush.

Tyrone have all the talent required if not the organisation or strength and conditioning for AI it seems, so far, to me but mebbe they have sorted themselves out over last month with a bit more of muscle if not bone
(mental bone?). What is the S&C team now (back from travels to NZ etc.?
What is the injury list report now? does anyone know?

With regard to recently published set of fixtures - I though since Edendork are making use of AI to write letters - id do the same to analyse the proposed fixtures.

The starred rounds are basically split into 2 groups
County-heavy starred group

These teams mostly play each other in Rounds 1–7:

Club   County players missing
Errigal Ciaran   5
Edendork   4
Loughmacrory   4
Coalisland   3
Donaghmore   3
Trillick   3
Eglish           2
Killyclogher   1

That group has 25 county players affected.

Low/no county-player starred group

These teams mostly play each other in Rounds 1–7:

Club   County players missing
Omagh           1
Carrickmore   1
Dungannon   1
Dromore           1
Galbally   0
Ardboe           0
Clonoe           0
Moortown   0

That group has only 4 county players affected.

That means the redraw protects the county-heavy clubs from having to play teams like Galbally, Ardboe, Clonoe or Moortown while badly weakened.

Pure county-player disadvantage

On the basis of players missing, the most disadvantaged team is clearly:

1. Errigal Ciaran

They lose 5 county players for 7 starred games.

That is 35 player-games lost.

Team   Own player-games lost   Opponents missing against them   Net disadvantage
Errigal Ciaran   35   20   +15
Edendork   28   21   +7
Loughmacrory   28   21   +7
Omagh           7       3       +4
Dungannon   7   3   +4
Dromore           7   3   +4
Carrickmore   7   3   +4
Trillick   21   22   -1
Donaghmore   21   22   -1
Coalisland   21   22   -1
Galbally   0   4   -4
Ardboe           0   4   -4
Clonoe           0   4   -4
Moortown   0   4   -4
Eglish           14   23    -9
Killyclogher   7   24   -17

So if the argument is "who suffers most because they are missing county players?", the answer is:

Errigal Ciaran, then Edendork and Loughmacrory.

But fixture fairness is a different issue

From a league fairness point of view, the low/no county-player teams can argue they are disadvantaged because they do not get to play the county-heavy teams while they are weakened.

For example, Galbally's starred fixtures are:

Round   Fixture   Opponent county players missing
1   Dungannon v Galbally   1
2   Clonoe v Galbally   0
3   Galbally v Omagh   1
4   Dromore v Galbally   1
5   Moortown v Galbally   0
6   Galbally v Carrickmore   1
7   Ardboe v Galbally   0

Galbally face opponents missing only 4 players total across all 7 starred games.

Then from Round 8 onwards, when games are worth 3 points, Galbally face:

Edendork
Errigal Ciaran
Loughmacrory
Trillick
Coalisland
Donaghmore
Eglish
Killyclogher

So Galbally play the county-heavy group in the 3-point non-starred games, not the 2-point starred games.

That is a strong fairness argument.

Home and away fairness

Galbally and Dromore also have the worst starred home/away split.

Team   Starred home games   Starred away games
Galbally   2                   5
Dromore           2                   5
Carrickmore   5                   2
Dungannon   5                   2

A fairer split would be 3 home / 4 away or 4 home / 3 away.

So from a venue point of view, Galbally and Dromore are the worst treated.

Final verdict
Most disadvantaged by missing county players

Errigal Ciaran — clearly.

Most disadvantaged by the structure of the redraw

Galbally and Dromore have the strongest case.

If I had to name one overall from a fixture-fairness argument

I'd say:

Dromore slightly worst overall

Because Dromore have:

Only 2 home starred games
5 away starred games
They lose 1 county player
Their starred opponents are barely weakened
They then face the county-heavy teams later in the 3-point games


Galbally have no county players, but the redraw gives them almost no benefit from starred fixtures and gives them 5 away games out of 7.

The fairest way is to spread the county-heavy teams across the full starred block, rather than putting the heavy county-player clubs mainly against each other and leaving Galbally, Ardboe, Clonoe, Moortown, Dromore, Omagh, Carrickmore and Dungannon mostly playing each other.

I would use these rules:

Rounds 1–7 remain starred.
Every team gets either 3 home / 4 away or 4 home / 3 away.
Each team should face opponents missing roughly the same total number of county players.
Avoid one group of "county-heavy" clubs and one group of "low/no-county-player" clubs.

Using your county-player numbers, this is a much fairer starred fixture list.

Proposed fairer starred fixtures
Round 1 ★
Home   Away
Killyclogher   Loughmacrory
Galbally   Trillick
Errigal Ciaran   Carrickmore
Ardboe           Clonoe
Dromore           Eglish
Coalisland   Donaghmore
Moortown   Dungannon
Omagh           Edendork
Round 2 ★
Home   Away
Loughmacrory   Moortown
Coalisland   Edendork
Omagh           Dromore
Dungannon   Ardboe
Errigal Ciaran   Donaghmore
Eglish           Galbally
Clonoe           Killyclogher
Carrickmore   Trillick
Round 3 ★
Home   Away
Omagh           Loughmacrory
Dungannon   Edendork
Moortown   Donaghmore
Eglish           Coalisland
Clonoe           Dromore
Ardboe   Carrickmore
Trillick   Errigal Ciaran
Galbally   Killyclogher
Round 4 ★
Home   Away
Loughmacrory   Edendork
Omagh   Moortown
Dungannon   Coalisland
Donaghmore   Dromore
Ardboe   Eglish
Clonoe   Errigal Ciaran
Carrickmore   Galbally
Trillick   Killyclogher
Round 5 ★
Home   Away
Loughmacrory   Ardboe
Dromore   Errigal Ciaran
Galbally   Coalisland
Moortown   Killyclogher
Edendork   Trillick
Carrickmore   Omagh
Dungannon   Clonoe
Donaghmore   Eglish
Round 6 ★
Home   Away
Loughmacrory   Carrickmore
Trillick   Clonoe
Killyclogher   Eglish
Donaghmore   Galbally
Errigal Ciaran   Dungannon
Ardboe   Omagh
Edendork   Dromore
Moortown   Coalisland
Round 7 ★
Home   Away
Coalisland   Loughmacrory
Dromore   Moortown
Edendork   Ardboe
Errigal Ciaran   Omagh
Galbally   Dungannon
Killyclogher   Donaghmore
Eglish   Trillick
Carrickmore   Clonoe
Why this is fairer

The current redraw has a huge imbalance. Some teams are playing opponents missing only 3 or 4 county players total across the seven starred games, while others are playing opponents missing 20+.

This proposed version tightens that gap massively.

Team   Opponent county players missing across R1–R7   Starred home/away
Dromore   15   3H / 4A
Omagh   15   4H / 3A
Coalisland   14   3H / 4A
Galbally   14   4H / 3A
Moortown   14   4H / 3A
Ardboe   13   4H / 3A
Carrickmore   13   4H / 3A
Edendork   13   3H / 4A
Trillick   13   3H / 4A
Clonoe   12   3H / 4A
Donaghmore   12   3H / 4A
Dungannon   12   4H / 3A
Killyclogher   12   3H / 4A
Eglish   11   3H / 4A
Errigal Ciaran   10   4H / 3A
Loughmacrory   10   4H / 3A

Under this model, the spread is only 10 to 15.

The current redraw has a spread of roughly 3 to 24, which is far too wide.

Main benefit

This removes the big problem where:

Galbally, Ardboe, Clonoe and Moortown get almost no benefit from starred fixtures.
Killyclogher and Eglish get a very favourable starred block.
The county-heavy clubs mostly cancel each other out.
Some teams get 5 away starred games.

In this version:

Nobody has worse than 3 home / 4 away.
Nobody gets a soft or brutal starred block.
The county-player effect is spread much more evenly.
The 2-point starred games are more representative of the whole division.

A lot of time and effort gone into that

Supercomputer

Any word on Tyrone injuries?
Canavans,Kennedy,McCullagh any others?

OK Rossies 1st?
Could be worse.
They are playing well but definitely can be beaten.

Any views?

Age old question of "golden crop" vs "genius manager".

I just hope enough lads get to the level to get Tyrone back to a consistent top team anyone is afraid to play.

Sam etc is a bonus

I would lean genius manager for this year's team.

Nobody would have fancied them to win Ulster. They're much more limited than previous teams, especially with the injuries.

Good lessons were clearly learnt after the group games and a system was put in place that played to the available players' strengths.

Response to reality and most important rwquired system/systems to match and exploit your resources to the maximum are the answer to all such siuations and isprecisely what current senior management do not seem to have floundering around with wierd selections and substitutions hoping the players commitment will compensate for managment ineptitude. The spirit is there and the skills if not all the strength. Tyrone need x a manager manage.ent team who can put in all together inspire with strength matching the needs of the new rules game. Floundering around with lame excuses won't cut it.

Surely Paul Devlin has to come in as manager at end of the year - a man with a proven track record of developing young talent. A man that wins big games.
Our senior management has won two big games in two years, Dublin (who are not the Dubs of old) and Donegal who had just won Ulster. They failed in every other big game and I see young talent such as O'Hare not even playing.  The man deserves the job.

Paul Dook has done an amazing job at underage level with the U20s and Minors before that. The one criticism that'll be thrown at him is that he's not managed a senior team, at either club or county level. I stand to be corrected on that but I think that's a fairly big question mark that he has against him. It's not one that cant be overcome but it's certainly not irrelevant

I'd say managing  AI winning minor and U20 teams is more important than managing a club team.

You rather have him, in my opinion, with that experience etc., than a lad who's managed a Top 5 club team in Tyrone. No debate about that.

Plus he knows a good cohort of these younger lads coming through the underage system in Tyrone. When U20s is over, I'm sure he watches a lot of senior club games in Tyrone.

He's omnipresent at Tyrone club games.

Im not sure he wants that Senior gig. If he did he would likely have taken a cherry picked senior club side by now. He looks very content where he is.

Devlin himself has had loads of questions around him prior to 2024 and some of his previous teams massively underachieving - The first round exits in 2021 & 2023 and the manner of the All Ireland Semi Final losses in 2019 & 2020. Lots of posters on here and myself included would have doubted his capabilities but the past three years have been outstanding at this level - excellent brand of football, tactically sound and great results.
One thing that is apparent about him is the amount of good coaches he surrounds himself with. He has an excellent track of record of having an excellent coaching team around him. Tyrone seniors over the past few years can be accused of lacking in this department.
But this title is a tremendous achievement - not the most fancied of teams, missing his marquee forward throughout and picked up another injury or two to key players but still delivered another Ulster title. Hopefully can go and deliver a third All Ireland Title in a row.
Conor Devlin surely an automatic call up to the seniors as soon as the U20s finish, a fantastic player serious leader.

All good for future but would Paul Devlin reallt want to manage senior team. If so great change b4 end of year and get strength and conditioning right mentally and physically as current managment are not good enough here or with wierd team selections not mixing age and experience to best effect. Must sadly recognise dazzler is not a starter for one example. Who is cuuently in charge of S&C. Is it still email in Kiwi-land? Blather won't cut it but Con Kilpatrick a great iterview after the Armagh match so as we know the spirit is there under the current bull dung Devlin's inspiration required badly.

Did you not say Gavin Devlin was your choice as next senior manager?
[/quote
Yes but non horse Devlin looks better with every title. The absolute dream team is Devlin and Devlin but could they get on gel? (l know there is any number of Devlins round there but are they related?? --- deliverance for Tyrone?)
Tough competition (and tough competitors is what we need) round the Loughshore!
 Devlin and Devlin Rule KO.
 Maybe the Lawns could arbitrate?

Surely Paul Devlin has to come in as manager at end of the year - a man with a proven track record of developing young talent. A man that wins big games.
Our senior management has won two big games in two years, Dublin (who are not the Dubs of old) and Donegal who had just won Ulster. They failed in every other big game and I see young talent such as O'Hare not even playing.  The man deserves the job.

Paul Dook has done an amazing job at underage level with the U20s and Minors before that. The one criticism that'll be thrown at him is that he's not managed a senior team, at either club or county level. I stand to be corrected on that but I think that's a fairly big question mark that he has against him. It's not one that cant be overcome but it's certainly not irrelevant

I'd say managing  AI winning minor and U20 teams is more important than managing a club team.

You rather have him, in my opinion, with that experience etc., than a lad who's managed a Top 5 club team in Tyrone. No debate about that.

Plus he knows a good cohort of these younger lads coming through the underage system in Tyrone. When U20s is over, I'm sure he watches a lot of senior club games in Tyrone.

He's omnipresent at Tyrone club games.

Im not sure he wants that Senior gig. If he did he would likely have taken a cherry picked senior club side by now. He looks very content where he is.

Devlin himself has had loads of questions around him prior to 2024 and some of his previous teams massively underachieving - The first round exits in 2021 & 2023 and the manner of the All Ireland Semi Final losses in 2019 & 2020. Lots of posters on here and myself included would have doubted his capabilities but the past three years have been outstanding at this level - excellent brand of football, tactically sound and great results.
One thing that is apparent about him is the amount of good coaches he surrounds himself with. He has an excellent track of record of having an excellent coaching team around him. Tyrone seniors over the past few years can be accused of lacking in this department.
But this title is a tremendous achievement - not the most fancied of teams, missing his marquee forward throughout and picked up another injury or two to key players but still delivered another Ulster title. Hopefully can go and deliver a third All Ireland Title in a row.
Conor Devlin surely an automatic call up to the seniors as soon as the U20s finish, a fantastic player serious leader.

All good for future but would Paul Devlin reallt want to manage senior team. If so great change b4 end of year and get strength and conditioning right mentally and physically as current managment are not good enough here or with wierd team selections not mixing age and experience to best effect. Must sadly recognise dazzler is not a starter for one example. Who is cuuently in charge of S&C. Is it still email in Kiwi-land? Blather won't cut it but Con Kilpatrick a great iterview after the Armagh match so as we know the spirit is there under the current bull dung Devlin's inspiration required badly.

Goals win games, incredible achievement. Phenomenal stuff. Drive it on 2 more to go

And so u20s prove 4-18 1-22 win Great stuff. All needdd now is senior mamager to take heed.

Are Tyrone on the road to the talentless cup

Said this a few weeks ago and was told the odds of Division 3 teams getting to a provincial were impossible. Down and westmeath beg to differ...
But I think there needs to be 3 Div3 teams in the finals which can't happen now?

Yeah it's Cavan who miss out if Down and Westmeath win next week, Tyrone are in the All Ireland Round 1

And if Tyrone are the 16th qualifer( which they may well be) at this stage it seems the best outcome  as it tends to mean more of the 'big' teams have missed out.

Well all good for Tyrone getting into AI after today's results with Rossies and Cork for prov finals

That's one hurdle cleared. Next step is to go and win it.

One small step for Tyrone one big step for Tyrone kind of....