Drugs in UK sports....

[INDIANA]

Armstrong was a Narcissist. I accept cycling is structured differently, particularly from the team pov, but human nature is the same.

But if the suggestion is that Bolt failed a test, and that it was covered up, presumably in Jamaica (?), then those Jamaicans that were hung out to dry must be pretty pissed off watching Bolt the world's poster child, while they are Asafa Powell the drugs cheat etc .

If he failed in a major championship and it was covered up, then it is amazing to me that not a whisper has been said anywhere. There are lots of people who could make money, even just telling the story. There would be lots of athletes who have been banned, who would be happy to point the finger too. Gatlin is refusing to speak to the BBC because they call him 2 time drugs cheat all the time. Not to mention the whole Good versus Evil portrayal of his duel with Bolt.

I'd imagine if he had a sniff of evidence he would be singing from the rooftops.

I understand this.  But there are many ways to make it in a guy's own interests to stay quiet.  Lance nearly did it with many tens of people.  If he hadn't been such an arrogant and obnoxious bollix he might have managed it.  It was only after the lid came off that things started to really come out about him.  It may never come out in Bolt's case, but equally, I will never be convinced that he's clean.

The thing is, if there is a systematic cover up, it will come out in the end. It always does.

One thing to note about Jamacian sprinter's recent positive drug tests.

Some well sports scientists  have remarked to Richard Moore in his recent book on Jamacian sprinting that they don't believe there exists a  structured doping culture on the Island. For the following reasons:

- they get popped for using sports supplements in most cases. Usually with a banned substance not labelled on the product. In a systematic drug regime like the Americans or the US Postal team they rarely if ever got popped for using supplements - because their doctors would have picked it up. ie a sophisticated drug regime

- Sprinting is a culture on the Island. Kids at 5/6 are taught the mechanics and bio-mechanics of how to run properly from a technical point of view. Often at 5 years of age. Not even the U.S. do this.

- An extremely homophobic country whereby it is a culturally unacceptable to watch another man to pee into a cup.

They said they don't believe there is no doping in Jamacian athletics- but they claim it's nonsense to say there is a systematic regime of doping like other countries because the country hasn't the infrastructure and is too badly organised to have one.

[JimStynes]

http://tennishasasteroidproblem.blogspot.co.uk/2013/09/an-inconvenient-truth.html

An Inconvenient Truth
This is territory I've covered before, but it bears repeating.

In 2009, the New York Times reported that the International Tennis Federation (ITF) conducted EPO tests "only if blood screening indicates a player may be using the drug."

On February 20, 2012 I asked the ITF to confirm the reporting of the New York Times. On February 21, 2012 I received a response from the ITF. The person from the ITF communications department who responded to my e-mail stated that "I spoke with Dr. [Stuart] Miller about the article in the New York Times and, as he recalls, he was quoted correctly about the programme at the time."

Further, in August 2013, ITF anti-doping manager Stuart Miller told Barry Flatman of The Sunday Times the following: "What we used to do was what are called 'blood screenings', which were samples we collected and sent to a local laboratory or haematology lab that were screened for evidence, a non-sanctioned analysis which would give us an indication of whether players were likely to be using EPO or an oxygen enhancing agent."

These statements by the ITF mean that, at the time, EPO tests were only triggered by a blood screening indicating a player may be using the drug (i.e., they were targeted tests based on blood screening results and not random). I examined the ITF's anti-doping statistics for 2008 and 2009 for the players that received an EPO test (again, the EPO test was conducted because, as per ITF policy, a blood screening indicated the player may be using the drug).

The tables are below.

As you'll see, many players tested were (and currently are) highly ranked, including a number of Grand Slam winners.

The EPO data raises a number of questions:

(1) What were the blood parameter values from the blood screenings that indicated these players may be using EPO?
(2) Given the number of EPO test triggered, how is it that no tennis player has committed an anti-doping rule violation for using EPO?
(3) Will the ITF or the players in question release the blood screening results for independent analysis?
(4) Did the ITF retest any stored samples based on blood screening results?

Here are the EPO tests conducted by the ITF in 2009:


Competition   Last Name   First Name   Test date
Roland Garros   Verdasco   Fernando   28/05/2009
Roland Garros   Azarenka   Victoria   26/05/2009
Roland Garros   Vesnina   Elena   26/05/2009
Roland Garros   Kuznetsova   Svetlana   02/06/2009
Wimbledon   Djokovic   Novak   01/07/2009
Wimbledon   Hewitt   Lleyton   01/07/2009
Wimbledon   Karlovic   Ivo   01/07/2009
Wimbledon   Bryan   Bob   04/07/2009
Wimbledon   Bryan   Mike   04/07/2009
Wimbledon   Nestor   Daniel   04/07/2009
Wimbledon   Zimonjic   Nenad   04/07/2009
Wimbledon   Federer   Roger   05/07/2009
Wimbledon   Knowles   Mark   05/07/2009
Wimbledon   Roddick   Andy   05/07/2009
Wimbledon   Lisicki   Sabine   30/06/2009
Wimbledon   Radwanska   Agnieszka   30/06/2009
Wimbledon   Schiavone   Francesca   30/06/2009
Wimbledon   Stosur   Samantha   04/07/2009
Wimbledon   Groenefeld   Anna-Lena   05/07/2009
US Open   Makarova   Ekatarina   10/09/2009
US Open   Williams   Serena   14/09/2009

And here are the players who were tested for EPO in 2008:

Competition   Last Name   First Name   Test date
Australian Open   Mirza   Sania   27/01/2008
Roland Garros   Bondarenko   Alona   26/05/2008
Roland Garros   Chardy   Jeremy   01/06/2008
Roland Garros   Huber   Liezel   04/06/2008
Roland Garros   Black   Cara   04/06/2008
Roland Garros   Vemic   Dusan   05/06/2008
Roland Garros   Cuevas   Pablo   07/06/2008
US Open   Spears   Abigail   03/09/2008
US Open   Gonzalez   Maximo   03/09/2008
US Open   Sugiyama   Ai   04/09/2008
Paris Open   Del Potro   Juan Martin   30/10/2008
Paris Open   Simon   Gilles   30/10/2008
Paris Open   Nadal   Rafael   31/10/2008
Paris Open   Murray   Andy   31/10/2008
Paris Open   Federer   Roger   31/10/2008
Paris Open   Roddick   Andy   31/10/2008
Paris Open   Davydenko   Nicolay   01/11/2008
Paris Open   Blake   James   01/11/2008
Paris Open   Nalbandian   David   02/11/2008
Paris Open   Tsonga   Jo-Wilfried   02/11/2008
Out-of-Competition   Llagostera Vives   Nuria   24-Apr-08
Out-of-Competition   Martinez Sanchez   Maria-Jose   24-Apr-08
Out-of-Competition   Suarez-Navarro   Carla   24-Apr-08
Out-of-Competition   Zheng   Jie   24-Apr-08
Out-of-Competition   Cravero   Jorgelina   24-Apr-08
Out-of-Competition   Dulko   Gisela   25-Apr-08
Out-of-Competition   Jozami   Betina   25-Apr-08
Out-of-Competition   Salerni   Maria Emilia   25-Apr-08
Out-of-Competition   Peer   Shahar   20-Jul-08
Out-of-Competition   Pennetta   Flavia   20-Jul-08
Out-of-Competition   Safina   Dinara   20-Jul-08
Out-of-Competition   Vaidisova   Nicole   20-Jul-08
Out-of-Competition   Zvonareva   Vera   20-Jul-08
Out-of-Competition   Ivanovic   Ana   11-Oct-08
Out-of-Competition   Szavay   Agnes   11-Oct-08
Out-of-Competition   Kirilenko   Maria   11-Oct-08
Out-of-Competition   Bartoli   Marion   11-Oct-08
Out-of-Competition   Azarenka   Victoria   11-Oct-08
Out-of-competition   Coria   Guillermo   06-Jul-08
Out-of-competition   Del Potro   Juan Martin   06-Jul-08
Out-of-competition   Huss   Stephen   06-Jul-08
Out-of-competition   Hutchins   Ross   06-Jul-08
Out-of-competition   Djokovic   Novak   20-Jul-08
Out-of-competition   Federer   Roger   20-Jul-08
Out-of-competition   Mathieu   Paul-Henri   20-Jul-08
Out-of-competition   Robredo   Tommy   20-Jul-08
Out-of-competition   Federer   Roger   12-Oct-08
Out-of-competition   Nadal   Rafael   12-Oct-08
Out-of-competition   Ferrer   David   12-Oct-08
Out-of-competition   Youzhny   Mikhail   12-Oct-08
Out-of-competition   Andreev   Igor   12-Oct-08
Out-of-competition   Ancic   Mario   12-Dec-08
Out-of-competition   Davydenko   Nikolay   06-Dec-08
Out-of-competition   Djokovic   Novak   22-Dec-08
Out-of-competition   Kanepi   Kaia   28-Dec-08
Out-of-competition   Pennetta   Flavia   13-Dec-08
Out-of-competition   Radwanska   Agnieszka   16-Dec-08
Out-of-competition   Schiavone   Francesca   13-Dec-08
Out-of-competition   Tanasugarn   Tamarine   28-Dec-08

[JimStynes]

http://www.reuters.com/article/2015/08/25/us-dopping-athletics-kenya-idUSKCN0QU1MY20150825

Kenyan athletes warned of doping tests, says ARD

Some Kenyan athletes were warned ahead of unannounced doping tests and a banned runner accused athletics officials of demanding money to hide positive tests, German state broadcaster ARD reported on Tuesday.

ARD and Britain's Sunday Times reported recently that the International Association of Athletics Federations (IAAF) had not followed up on hundreds of suspicious doping tests, throwing the sport into turmoil.

ARD has reported on allegations of doping in Kenyan athletics in the past.

In the latest report on Kenyan athletes, Frimin Kiplagat Kipchoge, a former runner who works with athletes, said some testers called up athletes ahead of their visits and were willing to reschedule them if they were not available.

According to doping rules, unannounced tests can take place at any time with the athlete having to register his or her daily whereabouts with a central system so as to be available for drug-testing, both in and out of competition.

Banned athlete Ronald Kipchumba, who tested positive for blood-boosting EPO in 2012, told ARD some athletics officials in the country were also demanding money from them to bury positive tests.

The governing body of athletics has been in crisis since the data from thousands of blood samples was leaked to the two media organizations this month.

Three weeks of further leaks and allegations that the IAAF has been soft on dopers overshadowed the run-up to its biennial showpiece, the world athletics championships, which opened in Beijing last week.

World Anti-Doping Agency (WADA) chief Craig Reedie told ARD Kenyan authorities were aware of what was needed to be done in the fight against doping, when he was asked if WADA would launch a separate investigation into the country's athletes.

WADA has launched two separate investigations into previous ARD allegations of doping.

(Reporting by Karolos Grohmann, editing by Ed Osmond)

[muppet]

That Tennis post is amazing Jim.

Why do you think we have not heard more about it? Why is it that tennis players, with suspicious results, could be getting a free ride?

[INDIANA]

That Tennis post is amazing Jim.

Why do you think we have not heard more about it? Why is it that tennis players, with suspicious results, could be getting a free ride?

Why do you think Lance got a free ride.

Rugby and soccer players get a free ride

Athletes get a free ride

Money

[muppet]

That Tennis post is amazing Jim.

Why do you think we have not heard more about it? Why is it that tennis players, with suspicious results, could be getting a free ride?

Why do you think Lance got a free ride.

Rugby and soccer players get a free ride

Athletes get a free ride

Money

I don't recall even Lance getting a free ride once data regarding suspicious blood tests were in the public domain.

If you can show similar suspicious data to the above for soccer & rugby or even athletics (other than the recent leak) I'll agree with you.

[INDIANA]

That Tennis post is amazing Jim.

Why do you think we have not heard more about it? Why is it that tennis players, with suspicious results, could be getting a free ride?

Why do you think Lance got a free ride.

Rugby and soccer players get a free ride

Athletes get a free ride

Money

I don't recall even Lance getting a free ride once data regarding suspicious blood tests were in the public domain.

If you can show similar suspicious data to the above for soccer & rugby or even athletics (other than the recent leak) I'll agree with you.

Conconi and Donati listed several Italian football teams in their files. Juventus being the biggest offenders. Closely followed by Milan.

Fuentes a convicted Spanish doping doctor had Nadal and the Spanish Football team as his clients. All of that is a fact- listed and documented when the office was raided.. Now if you want to believe they were simply swopping cola bottles then that's up to you. It is also said several other tennis players were on his books.

The same doctor looked after Tyler Hamilton, Contador , ullrich and Riis. But I'm sure he gave the tennis and football players legal supplements.

http://www.sportsonearth.com/article/67536920/soccer-doping-problem-shows-no-signs-of-stopping

[muppet]

There is a difference between rumours and a list of suspicious blood samples.

I happen to believe that Fuentes was doping his clients/patients. But without evidence it isn't much good.

"There allegedly exists a full list of every athlete every to be doped at Fuentes' clinic, but we may never get to read it.'

The Tennis link above shows a lost of tennis players who, if the criteria outlined but the Tennis authorities is correct, recorded suspicious blood samples regarding EPO. That would appear to be evidence. Why are the media not demanding answers from the people on that list?

Unfortunately, we don't have any such list for soccer or rugby.

But as I said before, if it is happening on a large scale, it will come out.

[INDIANA]

There is a difference between rumours and a list of suspicious blood samples.

I happen to believe that Fuentes was doping his clients/patients. But without evidence it isn't much good.

"There allegedly exists a full list of every athlete every to be doped at Fuentes' clinic, but we may never get to read it.'

The Tennis link above shows a lost of tennis players who, if the criteria outlined but the Tennis authorities is correct, recorded suspicious blood samples regarding EPO. That would appear to be evidence. Why are the media not demanding answers from the people on that list?

Unfortunately, we don't have any such list for soccer or rugby.

But as I said before, if it is happening on a large scale, it will come out.

There is a list for soccer. Fuentes has it. It contains some of the biggest names in World Football. It'll come out eventually

EPO is the absolute perfect drug for soccer and has been used in the sport since the mid 80's. And it's still used today

[Apparently so]

Fair play, tear on imo

[trileacman]

There is a difference between rumours and a list of suspicious blood samples.

I happen to believe that Fuentes was doping his clients/patients. But without evidence it isn't much good.

"There allegedly exists a full list of every athlete every to be doped at Fuentes' clinic, but we may never get to read it.'

The Tennis link above shows a lost of tennis players who, if the criteria outlined but the Tennis authorities is correct, recorded suspicious blood samples regarding EPO. That would appear to be evidence. Why are the media not demanding answers from the people on that list?

Unfortunately, we don't have any such list for soccer or rugby.

But as I said before, if it is happening on a large scale, it will come out.

There is a list for soccer. Fuentes has it. It contains some of the biggest names in World Football. It'll come out eventually

EPO is the absolute perfect drug for soccer and has been used in the sport since the mid 80's. And it's still used today

Is that a fact? Was it not for a similar assertion that Franko was pedantically pulled up on?

Not that I really give a fcuk and I'd probably say he does have it but it's just funny to see the double standards that exist.

[Declan]

http://www.bbc.com/sport/0/athletics/34060603

There's a surprise

[INDIANA]

There is a difference between rumours and a list of suspicious blood samples.

I happen to believe that Fuentes was doping his clients/patients. But without evidence it isn't much good.

"There allegedly exists a full list of every athlete every to be doped at Fuentes' clinic, but we may never get to read it.'

The Tennis link above shows a lost of tennis players who, if the criteria outlined but the Tennis authorities is correct, recorded suspicious blood samples regarding EPO. That would appear to be evidence. Why are the media not demanding answers from the people on that list?

Unfortunately, we don't have any such list for soccer or rugby.

But as I said before, if it is happening on a large scale, it will come out.

There is a list for soccer. Fuentes has it. It contains some of the biggest names in World Football. It'll come out eventually

EPO is the absolute perfect drug for soccer and has been used in the sport since the mid 80's. And it's still used today

Is that a fact? Was it not for a similar assertion that Franko was pedantically pulled up on?

Not that I really give a fcuk and I'd probably say he does have it but it's just funny to see the double standards that exist.

the list is proven to exist . It hasn't been released. There is no evidence anywhere that Bolt has doped. I'm not saying he hasn't I'm very suspicious about him .

[yellowcard]

There is a difference between rumours and a list of suspicious blood samples.

I happen to believe that Fuentes was doping his clients/patients. But without evidence it isn't much good.

"There allegedly exists a full list of every athlete every to be doped at Fuentes' clinic, but we may never get to read it.'

The Tennis link above shows a lost of tennis players who, if the criteria outlined but the Tennis authorities is correct, recorded suspicious blood samples regarding EPO. That would appear to be evidence. Why are the media not demanding answers from the people on that list?

Unfortunately, we don't have any such list for soccer or rugby.

But as I said before, if it is happening on a large scale, it will come out.

There is a list for soccer. Fuentes has it. It contains some of the biggest names in World Football. It'll come out eventually

EPO is the absolute perfect drug for soccer and has been used in the sport since the mid 80's. And it's still used today

Is that a fact? Was it not for a similar assertion that Franko was pedantically pulled up on?

Not that I really give a fcuk and I'd probably say he does have it but it's just funny to see the double standards that exist.

the list is proven to exist . It hasn't been released. There is no evidence anywhere that Bolt has doped. I'm not saying he hasn't I'm very suspicious about him .

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/sport/othersports/cycling/10027763/Operation-Puerto-judge-sparks-outrage-by-ordering-destruction-of-blood-bags.html

Major cover up job and evidence was ordered to be destroyed to protect athletes indentities.

[Pub Bore]

Orohougu doesn't quite get the mix right this year.