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[It doesn't say that the players got the 100 guineas]

It doesn't say that the players got the 100 guineas. And Tipp were always likely to have won.

No doubt and no comment.

It will most likely have been staged for gambling purposes. It is similar to Steeplechasing, first recorded in Co. Cork in 1752, where (I think) two wealthy landowners each put a large stake on their best horse and jockey in a cross-country race between two landmarks (church steeples) on a winner-takes-all basis.

Abd it was very common in England around that time for wealthy landowners to raise a cricket team from the village they owned to challenge the village team of a neighbouring landlord on a similar basis.

Indeed, gambling on cricket was so prevalent that the Courts risked being overwhelmed with disputes, meaning the government was forced to make gambling a private contractual matter between participants, so that you couldn't sue someone for not paying out etc, a situation which afaik continued until an Act of Parliament in 2005 which gave legal recognition to regulated betting.

(I'm open to correction on the above by better informed posters than me, btw).

Don't ask me how I came across this, but an entry in The Dublin Gazette, No. 2854, covering Tuesday 27 September 1774 to Thursday 29 September 1774 notes the following:

"On Thursday last, there was a very great Hurling Match for an Hundred Guineas between the principal Hurlers in the County of Tipperary and the County of Galway, at Ballingarry, near this Town, which was won by the former."
https://virtualtreasury.ie/item/DGZ-1774-2854

Amateur sport, eh? 
 

My understanding of government funding is that if money is allocated to project X the recipent cannot choose to spend it on project Y. Soccer got less money for Windsor Park and the balance of the allocation went to regional stadium funding.
GAA and governments would need to go back to the drawing board to redistribute Casement money elsewhere. But as Duine says it is so long ago I could be talking ballix.

Not quite.

On realising that HMG owned a site at The Maze which was going spare, some rocket scientist* at Westminster came up with a whizzo scheme to build a sports stadium out there, which would be shared equally between GAA, Soccer and Rugby. This would kick start the redevelopment of the whole site with other uses etc, and need a budget of £140m.

Then when it was realised that it could never pay its way, but would instead be a financial drain, they eventually decided to reallocate the money to the three governing bodies, each to build their own "Regional" stadium. This was divided £62.5M to GAA and IFA each, plus £15m to Rugby. (Think those figures are correct, if not they're ballpark. Sorry  )

Rugby was happy enough with it's share to tart up Ravenhill, ditto GAA for Casement, to which they were going to add £15m of their own. When it came to Soccer however, the IFA argued that it didn't need the full whack for Windsor, so instead they got a dispensation to use £26.5m there, and dedicate the balance of £36.5m for "Sub-Regional Stadia".

This last might have been after the money was devolved from Westminster to Stormont (unsure?), either way it was effectively determined that the £36.5m could not be disbursed until after the 3 Regional stadia were completed. Which is why Soccer has been kept waiting all this time, until the latest DCAL Minister broke the logjam.

Now as it happens, I suspect that if Ulster GAA were to decide that their original plan for Casement simply isn't going to fly, then they could probably renegotiate a scheme whereby some could be diverted towards other County grounds, as with soccer, though only amongst the six NI counties. But if so, that raises a further problem, namely that Hilary Benn could decide to reduce, or even pull entirely, the additional £50m allocated from Westminster, since that was dedicated towards an all-singing, all-dancing super stadium at Casement which, if not built, then wouldn't justify any extra.

While the Dublin government might decide that their €50m, originally allocated to get Casement over the line, shouldn't really be diverted elsewhere. I suspect they could, at least if some of it went to the three counties in ROI, but it shouldn't be taken for granted, since Dublin money for a big new Ulster Stadium is one thing, but propping up a few county stadia elsewhere in NI might play out differently, from a political pov at least?


* - Or do I merely mean "rocket"?

Soccer is based on an sectarian entity, any of the above is mere mitigation.

The thing is, Soccer was always an all-Ireland sport, until the Partitionist 26 Counties seceded and formed their own, separatist entity.

The game was based in Belfast. Bohemians and Shelbourne won the Cup. 8 out of 10 teams were from Belfast.  Soccer is partitionist. Rugby and GAA aren't. 

Even if I took your and Armaghniac's fairly witless simplifications at face value - which I obviously don't - I still cannot see what any of it has to do with the demographic problems facing the GAA.

You know, the subject of this thread, on this GAA forum?

Unless you have nothing better by which to avoid addressing the Elephant in the Room?

Antrim poor here, even given its demographics.

Interesting one.

As it happens, it's just been announced that Oran Kearney has been appointed manager of Ballymena United FC. And while I know you cannot always go by names, it is nonetheless interesting to see some of those who make up the squad he inherits:
Declan Breen, Jack O'Reilly, Daire O'Connor, Kian Corbally, Patrick McEleney, Sean O'Neill, Donal Rocks, Stephen O'Connell, Danny Lafferty and Daithi McCallion. (This last, who has represented NI at under-age level, is the son of former Sinn Fein MP Elisha btw).
https://ballymenaunitedfc.com/the-playing-squad

Of course this should give no cause for comment - and indeed it doesn't - even in the "Buckle on Ulster's Bible Belt"!

But I list it here for the contrast it provides to eg the current Antrim Senior squad, where there isn't a Kyle or a Victor about the place:
https://antrim.gaa.ie/teams/senior-football

But heyho, so many on this Board insist that Soccer is the code with the problem of not being so inclusive as it might be, not the GAA, that it must be true. 

Enniskillen Santos, total facepalm every time i seen it in print

I suspect they chose that name since the town is fast running out of alternatives, such is the turnover of clubs there. And I believe that Santos themselves no longer exist.

Anyway, Enniskillen currently has four clubs participating in the Fermanagh & Western: Ekn Town United, Ekn Rangers, Ekn Rovers and Ekn Galaxy, though in previous times they've had five, or maybe even six? 

Curiously enough for a predominantly Nationalist town (just about), it only has one GAA club and one Rugby club, despite St.Michaels and Portora schools respectively both being strong in those two codes.

Maybe because Unionists are told by their immature twats of leaders that the GAA is the IRA at play and other such ridiculous shite which they believe!

When it comes to matters of recreation, leisure time and sporting activities, how many people in the Nationalist community take their cue directly from what SF or SDLP politicans tell them?

I'm guessing that it's virtually none and why do I suppose that? Because it's the exactly the same for their Unionist equivalents.

But I would also guess that you (specifically) may also take your cue on such matters, and much else besides, from your own immature twats of leaders. At least if the political slant of your posting is anything to go by.

Theres loads of clubs available to unionists. Bout the same as the amount of clubs available to people of a nationalist perspective.

Aye, but how proactive/successful are they in making that availability attractive to Unionists?

With the risk of engaging in whataboutary, I suppose the same could be said for how the NI support still only pulls from one side as well. Complete failure to properly engage with half the population of NI. A damning failure.

Soccer in NI is about a hell of a sight more than the NI national team. There are literally hundreds of clubs, at all levels, with many thousands of regular participants in all aspects of the game.
And these clubs are very representative of both main communities throughout the entirety of NI. Why only earlier today, the 5th Round draw for the Irish Cup (note the name  ) threw up eg Strabane Athletic vs Glentoran, Glenavon vs Newington, Dungannon vs Ards and Cliftonville vs Dundela.

So your "complete failure" is nonsense. 

P.S. Even when comnfined to the senior NI team, the current Manager is from a Nationalist/GAA Background, as is the Captain, as are several of the Board members, many of the staff both non-playing and playing (O'Neill's Assistant Manager is Dubliner Diarmuid O'Carroll). While the CEO is an Englishman whose family background hails from both parts of Ireland. I can confidently claim that there is no GAA equivalent, nor anything even close to it, anywhere in NI.

P.P.S. There's no "risk" about it, you are engaging in Whataboutery. Still, i suppose it's a lot easier than actually addressing the real point at issue, namely the demographic problems facing the present-day GAA. All of the problems, that is.

Evil Genius is being a tad disingenuous. Unionism has traditionally been hostile towards the GAA. Was it the boul Sammy that called us "The IRA at play?"

In the same way as Nationalism was traditionally hostile towards "Garrison games".

Was it the boul Sammy that called us "The IRA at play?"
Even renowned "moderate" Doug Beattie got his knickers in a twist a few years ago when *checks notes* St Paul's Lurgan had the audacity to put goal nets up in their club colours. Poor ol Doug thought that the local IRA training camp GAA club were trying to "mark territory". One can only imagine the privately held views if this is the nonsense an MLA is daft enough to come out with.

Only this week a gentleman from Braniel was found guilty of placing pipe bombs at the grounds used by arguably Ulster's most progressive GAA club. This is the backdrop with which GAA clubs have had to operate and continue to have to operate under.

It's all well and good criticising the GAA for not attracting enough Unionists, but it's easier said than done when you're up against such an archaic mentality.

Whatever the historical difficulties (both sides), or the gauldering of a few bucket-mouthed present-day politicians pandering to their vote etc, the fact is that nowadays Soccer on all levels receives widespread participation from the Nationalist population in all parts of NI, in direct converse to participation by Unionists in GAA, which remains at pitiful levels.

Yet the Report which is the subject of this thread completely ignores this.

Soccer is based on an sectarian entity, any of the above is mere mitigation.

The thing is, Soccer was always an all-Ireland sport, until the Partitionist 26 Counties seceded and formed their own, separatist entity.

Amazing how when they trampled Northern Nationalist into the ground, excluding them from basic civil liberties, unionists weren't asking for nationalist inclusion. The GAA is open to unionists many partake, many will never, the lad on here yapping, it's simple f**k him, why care what he thinks.

Quad Est Demonstratum.

(Or might that be "Prod Est Demonstratum"?  )

Why even bother replying to that twat.

Both erudite and charming! Congratulations - it's no wonder Themmuns are falling over themselves to join the GAA. Not.

No one was ever turned away from the GAA on the basis of creed, colour or sexuality

Has it never occurred to you that no-one has ever had to be turned away, from the Unionist population at least, seeing as the organisation does little or nothing substantive to encourage interest from amongst that population in joining etc?

No? Too difficult a concept?

[I can tell you that no one I know from a nationalist perspective supports NI. Literally no one.]

I can tell you that no one I know from a nationalist perspective supports NI. Literally no one.
I wasn't talking about the sport of soccer. I was talking about support for the national team for this wee country. They have zero support due to the unionist trappings that go along with that support. And nothing but token effort to change that. When Gaelic is played outside NI it has people from a wide range of backgrounds. Unfortunately people here tend to be a bit backwards on somethings.

As someone who has been following NI home and away for decades, I can tell you that such people definitely do exist, even if they are a small minority. Indeed, unable to attend the recent Luxembourg game at Windsor, I gave my ticket to a 40-something Catholic lassie from Belfast, a lifelong NI supporter, like her father before her.

And that is despite there being a "ready alternative" (ROI), which has been doing rather than NI of late, to support instead.

While the NT is only one aspect of the game, such that there can be no doubt that participation by Nationalists in NI soccer generally, at all levels, FAR exceeds that of Unionists in GAA.

My point being that for all your Whataboutery about soccer etc, the GAA is evidently worried by demographic trends, West to East, Rural to Urban, yet two of the most populous, urban, Eastern Counties in Ireland, also have the lowest participation levels on the entire island.

Those counties are, of course, Antrim and Down, who also have the highest proportion of Prods/Unionists on the island. Yet this clear disparity gets completely ignored in the report.

Funny that.

Since the removal of the 'Brit forces" ruke has any Club in the 6 Cos refused membership to someone on religious or political grounds?

Whatever other reasons there may have been, it was hardly the ban which was preventing a long waiting list of Unionists from joining their local GAA club, was it?

Which is why the (welcome) liftimng of the ban didn't make any noticeable difference either.

I think they have only mentioned the figures that would rise with 15 years inflation. The Dublin money wasn't on the table back then and therefore would not be expected to rise with inflation.
However, it must be included in the £170 million figure mentioned at the beginning because the other figures certainly don't get them there.

If the GAA consider that their original funding should be increased to account for inflation, then the £36.5m which Soccer is waiting for for its Sub-Regional funding (part of the original overall deal) should also be adjusted accordingly?

Especially since the delay stemmed from the incompetence etc of the GAA, not that of Soccer (or Rugby); indeed this £36.5m was effectively "held hostage" by successive SF and SDLP Sports Ministers while Casement was trying to be resolved.

Glad you mentioned that as we'd never heard that before

Aye, I'm sure you've all heard it, but how many of you heeded it?