Most Under Pressure Clubs In Ulster

[Fear Bun Na Sceilpe]

Would this not be a better thread than the alternative one currently running.

Where are the areas and clubs who are getting it tight, what are the reasons?, how can they be helped?

The criteria would need to include membership,facilities,finances and also which clubs cant operate freely because of intimiadtion etc.
I wouldnt be too worried about results if clubs are making an effort to field but id be worried if clubs were struggling to field

[armaghniac]

There are two issues here, intimidation, often in urban areas and small rural parishes where the population is declining, the latter mostly in the west where intimidation is less.

[Fear Bun Na Sceilpe]

In Derry some of the small clubs have amalgamated underage due to lack of numbers. In the city progress is being made against the incessant and overpowering tide of soccer. A lot of the non city clubs underestimate what the city clubs have to contend with by saying "sure we have a parish of few hundred against your thousands". Its not comparing apples with apples. I have played hurling in Derry City for a long time and it has to be a full time 24/7 passion to make it work. But there are places who have it worse.
There must be 30 soccer clubs in Derry City , the schools have their own leagues, most of the teachers come from a soccer background. People are like sheep, especially children and if you mix that in with the media you can see how hard it is to compete.

[general_lee]

Good thread; in light of that other "affront" of mine.

Amalgamations are sometimes hard to judge, some clubs just have a tradition of doing it regardless of numbers while others are just hellbent on silverware.

Taking Armagh at minor level as an example, there are 6 amalgamated teams, so that's at least 12 clubs unable to field a minor team solo; and some of them are even made up of three clubs. It's an odd scenario as a lot of the clubs who make up the amalgamated teams are Division 1/2 at senior level. It would seem Armagh has too many clubs for a small county, and too many small ones at that.

I would say if there was a general trend across Ulster in terms of needing attention it would be the urban clubs that need Looked at. Like you say numbers mean nothing if they're playing soccer and I'm sure the example you gave in Derry City apply equally in North and West Belfast and to a lesser extent towns like Lurgan, Downpatrick and Newry. You have to go back at least 20 years for the last time a championship was won in those towns.

[T Fearon]

Is there any town that can match Lurgan for number of GAA clubs?

Clan Na Gael
St Peters
St Paul's
Eire Og
Clann Eireann
Sarsfields
Wolfe Tones

[general_lee]

Is there any town that can match Lurgan for number of GAA clubs?

Clan Na Gael
St Peters
St Paul's
Eire Og
Clann Eireann
Sarsfields
Wolfe Tones

Eire Og people (Craigavon) will get all uppity being asked what part of Lurgan they're from, ditto Wolfe Tone's (Derrymacash). Sarsfields (Derrytrasna)... They will as well, but half their team genuinely is from Lurgan.

You forgot Sean Tracey's and could also include Magheralin and Aghagallon who are both closer than Trasna albeit different counties - again they will get uppity.

[T Fearon]

If all those Lurgan teams amalgamated into one super club,you'd never hear of Crossmaglen again

[brokencrossbar1]

If all those Lurgan teams amalgamated into one super club,you'd never hear of Crossmaglen again

I tell ye what tony, head down to Franci Street and suggest that, see what response you get?

[T Fearon]

Though that would get a bite!

[brokencrossbar1]

There are really 4 lurgan clubs, the 2 Sts, Clans and Clanns. The town has a population of around 17000 Catholics which if you divide it evenly then that's a bigger potential pick then most clubs have. Obviously there are different dynamics in towns but they really should be doing better than they are and shouldn't need amalgamation to beat Cross!

[general_lee]

There are really 4 lurgan clubs, the 2 Sts, Clans and Clanns. The town has a population of around 17000 Catholics which if you divide it evenly then that's a bigger potential pick then most clubs have. Obviously there are different dynamics in towns but they really should be doing better than they are and shouldn't need amalgamation to beat Cross!

I agree (to an extent) but I don't know where you get the 17k from.

The Lurgan clubs may have big catchment areas but the reality is apart from Clann Eireann (who have massive membership) the Lurgan clubs are quite small.

A lot of people in Lurgan will claim a vague connection to a club without actually playing or being an active member. That's probably why there are so many at Armagh games come championship time. GAA in Lurgan isn't dying but it needs one hell of a shot up the arse, no different to most provincial towns in the north.

[T Fearon]

Those of us of a certain vintage remember the great Clan Na Gael team of the mid 70s, so unlucky in the All Ireland Club Final more than 20 years before Crossmaglen reached their first final,and with a team of lads from Francis Street.They didn't have to steal players from other clubs like Crossmaglen did.Great team,Smith,Mc Kinstry,Mc Kerr,O'Hagans,Crewe,Scullion.Arguably they sparked off the Renaissance of the County team as well,culminating in the All Ireland Final appearance in 1977

[rionach 4]

i have always contended that Lurgan town has a very strong tradition of GAA. In any one week in June when all games are at full flow as many as 800 to 1000 boys and girls men and women are involved directly in our games be it as a player, a coach or a club official. I have coached for many years in that area and  Lurgan has like many other areas some of the most dedicated GAA men I have met.

In the earlier days teams in Lurgan were centered and based in certain areas ie if you were from the Freecrow area you played for the Peters ,Kilwilkie Clann Eireann, Francis Street ,Clan NA gael and Taghnavan St Pauls.  While the grounds are still all located in those areas new housing developments and pop. movement has seen this change slightly . Tradition remains strong and family ties to a club dictate who you play for.

Like any other town or city the struggle really begins at 16 plus where lifestyle takes over more so than soccer. I could pick an excellent team of young lads of 18 plus that don't kick a ball anymore.
St Pauls have a superb set up facility wise as do the other clubs and they work tirelessly to keep the tradition going. Yes I agree that the teams are not as strong at underage level or senior as they once were but it's not through lack of effort.

[illdecide]

I'm a Clan na Gael man and am really disappointed they way we've fell down the pecking order recently and the benchmark is Crossmaglen (not just Armagh). We are an intermediate club at present and that's exactly our level at this time but I can tell you this for certain that Clan na Gael will start to progress over the next few years and within 4-5 years we will be back up to senior. I can see the progress at our club from 16's down and the numbers we have at present are excellent at underage. I know that doesn't guarantee you anything but it's def looking better that what we've had over the last few years...The great Clan na Gael teams of the 70's & 80's were special alright but I think it was a bit of a burden of the teams over the last 10-15 years, the pressure the senior teams were under from those supporters and players who played and supported them great teams demanded the same success but never delivered...(big pressure)

Clann Eireann look to be heading in the right direction and have the best 16's & 18's teams in the county, I expect them to be in senior league next year and If they can stay up for a year or two and them young lads come thru they'll be a serious outfit. (Clann Eireann have always had decent teams at underage but could never really get them thru into senior but this bunch look a different breed).

[brokencrossbar1]

I'm a Clan na Gael man and am really disappointed they way we've fell down the pecking order recently and the benchmark is Crossmaglen (not just Armagh). We are an intermediate club at present and that's exactly our level at this time but I can tell you this for certain that Clan na Gael will start to progress over the next few years and within 4-5 years we will be back up to senior. I can see the progress at our club from 16's down and the numbers we have at present are excellent at underage. I know that doesn't guarantee you anything but it's def looking better that what we've had over the last few years...The great Clan na Gael teams of the 70's & 80's were special alright but I think it was a bit of a burden of the teams over the last 10-15 years, the pressure the senior teams were under from those supporters and players who played and supported them great teams demanded the same success but never delivered...(big pressure)

Clann Eireann look to be heading in the right direction and have the best 16's & 18's teams in the county, I expect them to be in senior league next year and If they can stay up for a year or two and them young lads come thru they'll be a serious outfit. (Clann Eireann have always had decent teams at underage but could never really get them thru into senior but this bunch look a different breed).

I'd say your teams would feel the same sort of internal club pressure as we did at the start as we were always compared to the team of the 60's that won 7 out of 10. They would have won Ulster as well if it has been in existence as they won many invitational competitions which were the vogue at the time. The constant reminders from old boys at the club bar that you'll never be as good as the team of the 60's drove us on and I'm sure the same thing happens in Clans. CE are doing rightly but the have a big fall off from 16 to 19 and I would imagine that a lot of clubs are feeling that. Young lads that are good at that age but playing soccer or rugby or just have a car and a few quid say might say to themselves that why should we bother, Cross are winning senior anyway. It won't always be the case but it's easier for us to retain players than it is for other clubs.

General Lee, the 17k is from the census figures. It's only a potential figure. There are approximately 2k people round Cross but not all of them is involved in the club so that's the comparison I'm using it against.

Fearon piss aff