The Palestine thread

Started by give her dixie, October 17, 2012, 01:29:42 PM

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sid waddell

Russia currently occupies parts of three sovereign countries.

Russia is in no way a victim of any propaganda campaign, it is a dangerous, rotten, colonialist state, just like Israel is.


johnnycool

Quote from: sid waddell on May 18, 2021, 05:30:04 PM
Russia currently occupies parts of three sovereign countries.

Russia is in no way a victim of any propaganda campaign, it is a dangerous, rotten, colonialist state, just like Israel is.

Cuba, Afghanistan, Iraq off the top of my head.


Eamonnca1

Quote from: sid waddell on May 18, 2021, 12:30:10 PM
Quote from: seafoid on May 18, 2021, 12:04:32 PM
Antisemitism refers to  when Jews are weak and vulnerable. Eg beating up a rabbi in London on Sunday. That's antisemitic.
Criticising Israel's savagery has nothing to do with antisemitism.
Criticising Israel's savagery has nothing to do with anti-Semitism but there are too many people commenting online who are ignorant of the framework through which this must be done and veer into either dodgy linguistic territory, or outright anti-Semitism

There was a now deleted post on this forum last week which did that in the worst way possible, Israel loves opinions like that, it highlights them and tars the entire Palestinian cause as extremist, the video from London on Sunday was a disaster in that regard

Those who support the Palestinian cause for good reasons - and they are the overwhelming majority - have to be aware that there are genuine anti-Semites out there who like to hop on the bandwagon when it suits them

These anti-Semitic bandwagon hoppers do immense harm to the Palestinian cause

I was at a protest march in San Francisco during the last offensive against Gaza in 2014. The protestors were very careful to include Jews who oppose zionism on religious grounds. Still, the protest got negative coverage in the local press. There were thousands of people at it, but it was reported as "hundreds of protestors," and described as "blocking traffic." They said it was "mostly peaceful until" someone had a debate at the side of the street and voices got slightly raised. Getting good press for the Palestinian cause is almost impossible here. You never hear the term "occupied territories" like I used to hear all the time in UK and Irish media, and you certainly never hear about settlements or evictions. Coverage doesn't start until the Hamas rockets start flying.

Unquestioning support and almost declaring allegiance to Israel is still a requirement for anyone running for high office in the states, but it is shifting. Candidates like AOC who don't rely on big corporate donors, are immune to lobbyists, and can short-circuit the money-in-politics problem, are a bit more free to speak their minds. It's just a shame that there's so few of them for now.

Itchy

Some people think America is a democracy, what idiots.

sid waddell

Quote from: Itchy on May 18, 2021, 06:52:55 PM
Some people think America is a democracy, what idiots.
Much as the Republicans desperately desire otherwise, America is still a democracy

And to say otherwise makes you an idiot

seafoid

Quote from: sid waddell on May 18, 2021, 07:20:12 PM
Quote from: Itchy on May 18, 2021, 06:52:55 PM
Some people think America is a democracy, what idiots.
Much as the Republicans desperately desire otherwise, America is still a democracy

And to say otherwise makes you an idiot
A very weak democracy.
If Biden/Harris lose the next election all bets are off.

We are in Gatsby time again

"They were careless people, Tom and Daisy- they smashed up things and creatures and then retreated back into their money or their vast carelessness or whatever it was that kept them together, and let other people clean up the mess they had made." F Scott Fitzgerald
"f**k it, just score"- Donaghy   https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IbxG2WwVRjU

Itchy

Can someone remind me how to put a poster on ignore, I did it before but can't find the button now.

seafoid

Quote from: Itchy on May 18, 2021, 04:18:24 PM
Quote from: seafoid on May 18, 2021, 03:38:28 PM
The effects of the Famine lasted several generations in Ireland. Israel is a case of collective Holocaust trauma.
This drives the violence.  This paper is worth a read if you have the time.

https://dergipark.org.tr/tr/download/article-file/701010

I dont think Ireland spent those generations creating Ghettos, stealing lands and indiscriminately blowing civilians to pieces. There are evil forces in Israel that are using the holocaust to further their own goals. Its is disgusting that a people so wronged could turn around and do the same thing to another people, a people who were victims of vile propaganda and now using that propaganda style to demonise Palestinians, and to justify horrendous war crimes. Goebbels would be impressed if he was here to see it. It is also disgusting that the UN (especially the Americans) learn nothing from the history of WW2 and fail to act against such a heinous regime as Israel.
There was a lot of drinking. Plus shunting women into institutions.
Israel is obviously worse but trauma make people do awful things.
Israel will never be a normal country.
"f**k it, just score"- Donaghy   https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IbxG2WwVRjU

Itchy

Quote from: seafoid on May 18, 2021, 08:33:28 PM
Quote from: Itchy on May 18, 2021, 04:18:24 PM
Quote from: seafoid on May 18, 2021, 03:38:28 PM
The effects of the Famine lasted several generations in Ireland. Israel is a case of collective Holocaust trauma.
This drives the violence.  This paper is worth a read if you have the time.

https://dergipark.org.tr/tr/download/article-file/701010

I dont think Ireland spent those generations creating Ghettos, stealing lands and indiscriminately blowing civilians to pieces. There are evil forces in Israel that are using the holocaust to further their own goals. Its is disgusting that a people so wronged could turn around and do the same thing to another people, a people who were victims of vile propaganda and now using that propaganda style to demonise Palestinians, and to justify horrendous war crimes. Goebbels would be impressed if he was here to see it. It is also disgusting that the UN (especially the Americans) learn nothing from the history of WW2 and fail to act against such a heinous regime as Israel.
There was a lot of drinking. Plus shunting women into institutions.
Israel is obviously worse but trauma make people do awful things.
Israel will never be a normal country.

Ah ffs Seafood would you atop that rubbish. Famine (I prefer genocide) had nothing to do with shunting women into anything, that was the Catholic Church, not some "trauma"

seafoid

Re the US I like this quote

Benjamin Franklin, who reportedly said when asked what kind of government the founders had created: "A republic — if you can keep it."
"f**k it, just score"- Donaghy   https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IbxG2WwVRjU

sid waddell

Quote from: seafoid on May 18, 2021, 07:58:08 PM
Quote from: sid waddell on May 18, 2021, 07:20:12 PM
Quote from: Itchy on May 18, 2021, 06:52:55 PM
Some people think America is a democracy, what idiots.
Much as the Republicans desperately desire otherwise, America is still a democracy

And to say otherwise makes you an idiot
A very weak democracy.
If Biden/Harris lose the next election all bets are off.

We are in Gatsby time again

"They were careless people, Tom and Daisy- they smashed up things and creatures and then retreated back into their money or their vast carelessness or whatever it was that kept them together, and let other people clean up the mess they had made." F Scott Fitzgerald
Oh there's no doubt it's a weakening democracy because one party is nakedly anti-democracy

That's not in doubt

But as of the latest elections, the US was still able to vote out the despot

sid waddell

#3401
Quote from: Itchy on May 18, 2021, 08:41:15 PM
Quote from: seafoid on May 18, 2021, 08:33:28 PM
Quote from: Itchy on May 18, 2021, 04:18:24 PM
Quote from: seafoid on May 18, 2021, 03:38:28 PM
The effects of the Famine lasted several generations in Ireland. Israel is a case of collective Holocaust trauma.
This drives the violence.  This paper is worth a read if you have the time.

https://dergipark.org.tr/tr/download/article-file/701010

I dont think Ireland spent those generations creating Ghettos, stealing lands and indiscriminately blowing civilians to pieces. There are evil forces in Israel that are using the holocaust to further their own goals. Its is disgusting that a people so wronged could turn around and do the same thing to another people, a people who were victims of vile propaganda and now using that propaganda style to demonise Palestinians, and to justify horrendous war crimes. Goebbels would be impressed if he was here to see it. It is also disgusting that the UN (especially the Americans) learn nothing from the history of WW2 and fail to act against such a heinous regime as Israel.
There was a lot of drinking. Plus shunting women into institutions.
Israel is obviously worse but trauma make people do awful things.
Israel will never be a normal country.

Ah ffs Seafood would you atop that rubbish. Famine (I prefer genocide) had nothing to do with shunting women into anything, that was the Catholic Church, not some "trauma"
The Irish Famine was not a genocide

Historical accuracy is important because if historical accuracy is deemed to not be important, that's the road to tyranny and genocide

I think I sense a pattern here with this poster

BennyCake

Quote from: sid waddell on May 18, 2021, 10:43:42 PM
Quote from: Itchy on May 18, 2021, 08:41:15 PM
Quote from: seafoid on May 18, 2021, 08:33:28 PM
Quote from: Itchy on May 18, 2021, 04:18:24 PM
Quote from: seafoid on May 18, 2021, 03:38:28 PM
The effects of the Famine lasted several generations in Ireland. Israel is a case of collective Holocaust trauma.
This drives the violence.  This paper is worth a read if you have the time.

https://dergipark.org.tr/tr/download/article-file/701010

I dont think Ireland spent those generations creating Ghettos, stealing lands and indiscriminately blowing civilians to pieces. There are evil forces in Israel that are using the holocaust to further their own goals. Its is disgusting that a people so wronged could turn around and do the same thing to another people, a people who were victims of vile propaganda and now using that propaganda style to demonise Palestinians, and to justify horrendous war crimes. Goebbels would be impressed if he was here to see it. It is also disgusting that the UN (especially the Americans) learn nothing from the history of WW2 and fail to act against such a heinous regime as Israel.
There was a lot of drinking. Plus shunting women into institutions.
Israel is obviously worse but trauma make people do awful things.
Israel will never be a normal country.

Ah ffs Seafood would you atop that rubbish. Famine (I prefer genocide) had nothing to do with shunting women into anything, that was the Catholic Church, not some "trauma"
The Irish Famine was not a genocide

Historical accuracy is important because if historical accuracy is deemed to not be important, that's the road to tyranny and genocide

I think I sense a pattern here with this poster

I believe the British reaction, or lack of, to the Irish famine, was most definitely genocide.

sid waddell

Quote from: BennyCake on May 18, 2021, 11:18:35 PM
Quote from: sid waddell on May 18, 2021, 10:43:42 PM
Quote from: Itchy on May 18, 2021, 08:41:15 PM
Quote from: seafoid on May 18, 2021, 08:33:28 PM
Quote from: Itchy on May 18, 2021, 04:18:24 PM
Quote from: seafoid on May 18, 2021, 03:38:28 PM
The effects of the Famine lasted several generations in Ireland. Israel is a case of collective Holocaust trauma.
This drives the violence.  This paper is worth a read if you have the time.

https://dergipark.org.tr/tr/download/article-file/701010

I dont think Ireland spent those generations creating Ghettos, stealing lands and indiscriminately blowing civilians to pieces. There are evil forces in Israel that are using the holocaust to further their own goals. Its is disgusting that a people so wronged could turn around and do the same thing to another people, a people who were victims of vile propaganda and now using that propaganda style to demonise Palestinians, and to justify horrendous war crimes. Goebbels would be impressed if he was here to see it. It is also disgusting that the UN (especially the Americans) learn nothing from the history of WW2 and fail to act against such a heinous regime as Israel.
There was a lot of drinking. Plus shunting women into institutions.
Israel is obviously worse but trauma make people do awful things.
Israel will never be a normal country.

Ah ffs Seafood would you atop that rubbish. Famine (I prefer genocide) had nothing to do with shunting women into anything, that was the Catholic Church, not some "trauma"
The Irish Famine was not a genocide

Historical accuracy is important because if historical accuracy is deemed to not be important, that's the road to tyranny and genocide

I think I sense a pattern here with this poster

I believe the British reaction, or lack of, to the Irish famine, was most definitely genocide.
You might believe it but serious historical scholars don't

Itchy

Do yourself a favour Benny, don't engage.