Lots of talk on this forum about the Provos and about how they are supposedly not terrorists, but none about the INLA
Why is that? Why does nobody ever talk about the INLA?
It seems strange because they did the exact same sort of stuff the Provos did
Why are they less sexy and chic these days?
Were these guys heroes? Or terrorists?
Would it be unfair to class the INLA as terrorists based on this? Thoughts?
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Darkley_killings
Seriously?
What is your end game Sid?
Quote from: Milltown Row2 on May 15, 2021, 01:03:37 PM
Seriously?
What is your end game Sid?
Huh?
Can anybody seriously point out the difference between them and the Provos?
Do we have anybody to make the case that the INLA were engaged in a noble cause?
Quote from: dec on May 15, 2021, 01:17:47 PM
He is trolling
How so?
On the other threads we have people saying that the PIRA were not terrorists and were engaged in a noble cause?
So how it would be trolling to ask whether the INLA were terrorists or not, and engaged in a noble cause or not?
Is there anybody on the forum that wants to make the case
for the INLA?
And if not, why?
Anybody want to make the case against them?
Honestly lad, stay off the glue
Quote from: Milltown Row2 on May 15, 2021, 04:33:08 PM
Honestly lad, stay off the glue
Insulting somebody for making a thoughtful point isn't helpful
Quote from: sid waddell on May 15, 2021, 04:59:21 PM
Quote from: Milltown Row2 on May 15, 2021, 04:33:08 PM
Honestly lad, stay off the glue
Insulting somebody for making a thoughtful point isn't helpful
Nothing thoughtful about it. You're insulting yourself
Quote from: Milltown Row2 on May 15, 2021, 05:01:22 PM
Quote from: sid waddell on May 15, 2021, 04:59:21 PM
Quote from: Milltown Row2 on May 15, 2021, 04:33:08 PM
Honestly lad, stay off the glue
Insulting somebody for making a thoughtful point isn't helpful
Nothing thoughtful about it. You're insulting yourself
In your opinion, but that would be your opinion, wouldn't it
I think it's a very fair question to ask why so many people on this forum are prepared to defend the Provos, but not a different group who did the exact same things the Provos did
No need to be defensive about it, given you've always said you never supported the Provos
Quote from: sid waddell on May 15, 2021, 05:04:42 PM
Quote from: Milltown Row2 on May 15, 2021, 05:01:22 PM
Quote from: sid waddell on May 15, 2021, 04:59:21 PM
Quote from: Milltown Row2 on May 15, 2021, 04:33:08 PM
Honestly lad, stay off the glue
Insulting somebody for making a thoughtful point isn't helpful
Nothing thoughtful about it. You're insulting yourself
In your opinion, but that would be your opinion, wouldn't it
I think it's a very fair question to ask why so many people on this forum are prepared to defend the Provos, but not a different group who did the exact same things the Provos did
No need to be defensive about it, given you've always said you never supported the Provos
I don't and never supported any death/murder. None of its justified whether it was 100 years or last week
Quote from: Milltown Row2 on May 15, 2021, 05:12:06 PM
Quote from: sid waddell on May 15, 2021, 05:04:42 PM
Quote from: Milltown Row2 on May 15, 2021, 05:01:22 PM
Quote from: sid waddell on May 15, 2021, 04:59:21 PM
Quote from: Milltown Row2 on May 15, 2021, 04:33:08 PM
Honestly lad, stay off the glue
Insulting somebody for making a thoughtful point isn't helpful
Nothing thoughtful about it. You're insulting yourself
In your opinion, but that would be your opinion, wouldn't it
I think it's a very fair question to ask why so many people on this forum are prepared to defend the Provos, but not a different group who did the exact same things the Provos did
No need to be defensive about it, given you've always said you never supported the Provos
I don't and never supported any death/murder. None of its justified whether it was 100 years or last week
Good to have a Sheehy-Skeffingtonite on the forum for balance
It'd be class if some sort of internet-friendly mode of rehabilitation could be found for the INLA, in the same way that Simpsons memes are being used to rehabilitate the Provos
And of course in the way that the Provos have been rehabilitated through song
I suggest referring to the INLA as The La, or The La's - sounds much less threatening
"Up the La" would be a great rallying cry
And of course "Tiocfaidh Ár La" is perfect - the INLA need to reclaim this one
The La's "There She Goes" could be used as a rallying song - "she" could refer to the Droppin' Well bomb in Ballykelly in December 1982
Or it could be a mournful lament for Dominic McGlinchey's wife, a tribute
Maybe there could be a propaganda film, "To Live And Die In The LA"
You could have a book glorifying the struggle, LA Confidential
I very occasionally wondered why the INLA were not endearingly referred to as the "in-laws"
If the PIRA can be celebrated and rehabilitated through wordplay, song and culture, why not the INLA?
Surely, for too long they've been regarded as the unwanted child of the struggle for a united Ireland
Maybe it's time to bring the unwanted child in from the cold and class them as heroes in the same way the Provos are now widely considered to be such
Why the double standard, why the hypocrisy
Why do you care?
His full descent into Angelo is now complete. You are all hypocrites, hypocrites I tell you and I am going to show up every last one of you. It's the same as Angelo on the corona virus thread. Topic irrelevant tbh.
Quote from: JimStynes on May 16, 2021, 10:23:41 AM
Why do you care?
I think it's quite a fascinating double standard
The double standard doesn't really make sense to me
How can two groups do the exact same thing, and yet only one have a vocal cohort of defenders celebrating them
I think it's a great example of the power of marketing and propaganda
Quote from: imtommygunn on May 16, 2021, 10:27:40 AM
His full descent into Angelo is now complete. You are all hypocrites, hypocrites I tell you and I am going to show up every last one of you. It's the same as Angelo on the corona virus thread. Topic irrelevant tbh.
Well I don't think the people who have made discussion on this forum a never ending search for hypocrisy and perceived impurity can complain when they get a bit thrown back at them
Returning the serve, as it used to be called
If some posters are going to paint themselves as 100% clear in their thinking, with no hypocrisy whatsoever, I think it's no harm to pierce the bubble of their delusion
This topic is a handy way of doing that
Quote from: imtommygunn on May 16, 2021, 10:27:40 AM
His full descent into Angelo is now complete. You are all hypocrites, hypocrites I tell you and I am going to show up every last one of you. It's the same as Angelo on the corona virus thread. Topic irrelevant tbh.
To be fair I think they were a bit annoyed when Angelo of all posters showed them up on the old Ira v new ira threads. It's triggered a few of them.
Quote from: sid waddell on May 16, 2021, 10:29:06 AM
Quote from: JimStynes on May 16, 2021, 10:23:41 AM
Why do you care?
I think it's quite a fascinating double standard
The double standard doesn't really make sense to me
How can two groups do the exact same thing, and yet only one have a vocal cohort of defenders celebrating them
I think it's a great example of the power of marketing and propaganda
This coming from the king of double standards! I love the ra I hate the ra? Touch of madness
Quote from: trueblue1234 on May 16, 2021, 10:36:34 AM
Quote from: imtommygunn on May 16, 2021, 10:27:40 AM
His full descent into Angelo is now complete. You are all hypocrites, hypocrites I tell you and I am going to show up every last one of you. It's the same as Angelo on the corona virus thread. Topic irrelevant tbh.
To be fair I think they were a bit annoyed when Angelo of all posters showed them up on the old Ira v new ira threads. It's triggered a few of them.
He didn't though, and the proof of that is in how the pro-Provo posters have resorted to nothing except furious name calling lately
The pro-Provo posters have clearly lost their argument
That's not to say the old IRA were very nice people - they weren't - and I don't think they're particularly worthy of celebration - but they were not mindless, they did not carry on for 27 years in a futile, mindless campaign, they had a plan to win, did win, and had much more regard for the lives of the general public who had to live through their campaign, a general public which largely supported them
These are the key factors in determining whether a campaign of violence can be plausibly justified, or not
They introduce nuance - whereas the defences of the PIRA we have had on this forum have been all about doing away with nuance and bringing everything back to crude reductionism
Crude reductionism being the tool of the defeated debater
So I think it's clear that the old IRA and the PIRA are very much
not morally equivalent
Whereas the PIRA and the INLA
are morally equivalent
Quote from: sid waddell on May 16, 2021, 10:43:39 AM
Quote from: trueblue1234 on May 16, 2021, 10:36:34 AM
Quote from: imtommygunn on May 16, 2021, 10:27:40 AM
His full descent into Angelo is now complete. You are all hypocrites, hypocrites I tell you and I am going to show up every last one of you. It's the same as Angelo on the corona virus thread. Topic irrelevant tbh.
To be fair I think they were a bit annoyed when Angelo of all posters showed them up on the old Ira v new ira threads. It's triggered a few of them.
He didn't though, and the proof of that is in how the pro-Provo posters have resorted to nothing except furious name calling lately
The pro-Provo posters have clearly lost their argument
That's not to say the old IRA were very nice people - they weren't - and I don't think they're particularly worthy of celebration - but they were not mindless, they did not carry on for 27 years in a futile, mindless campaign, they had a plan to win, did win, and had much more regard for the lives of the general public who had to live through their campaign, a general public which largely supported them
So I think it's clear that the old IRA and the PIRA are very much not morally equivalent
Whereas the PIRA and the INLA are morally equivalent
I wonder who I was talking about when I said they were triggered. Maybe Angelo has his benefits.
Quote from: trueblue1234 on May 16, 2021, 10:45:40 AM
Quote from: sid waddell on May 16, 2021, 10:43:39 AM
Quote from: trueblue1234 on May 16, 2021, 10:36:34 AM
Quote from: imtommygunn on May 16, 2021, 10:27:40 AM
His full descent into Angelo is now complete. You are all hypocrites, hypocrites I tell you and I am going to show up every last one of you. It's the same as Angelo on the corona virus thread. Topic irrelevant tbh.
To be fair I think they were a bit annoyed when Angelo of all posters showed them up on the old Ira v new ira threads. It's triggered a few of them.
He didn't though, and the proof of that is in how the pro-Provo posters have resorted to nothing except furious name calling lately
The pro-Provo posters have clearly lost their argument
That's not to say the old IRA were very nice people - they weren't - and I don't think they're particularly worthy of celebration - but they were not mindless, they did not carry on for 27 years in a futile, mindless campaign, they had a plan to win, did win, and had much more regard for the lives of the general public who had to live through their campaign, a general public which largely supported them
So I think it's clear that the old IRA and the PIRA are very much not morally equivalent
Whereas the PIRA and the INLA are morally equivalent
I wonder who I was talking about when I said they were triggered. Maybe Angelo has his benefits.
Caliing somebody "triggered" is not an argument
It's an escape hatch used by somebody who has no argument
It's what right-wing internet trolls do
Quote from: sid waddell on May 16, 2021, 10:47:56 AM
Quote from: trueblue1234 on May 16, 2021, 10:45:40 AM
Quote from: sid waddell on May 16, 2021, 10:43:39 AM
Quote from: trueblue1234 on May 16, 2021, 10:36:34 AM
Quote from: imtommygunn on May 16, 2021, 10:27:40 AM
His full descent into Angelo is now complete. You are all hypocrites, hypocrites I tell you and I am going to show up every last one of you. It's the same as Angelo on the corona virus thread. Topic irrelevant tbh.
To be fair I think they were a bit annoyed when Angelo of all posters showed them up on the old Ira v new ira threads. It's triggered a few of them.
He didn't though, and the proof of that is in how the pro-Provo posters have resorted to nothing except furious name calling lately
The pro-Provo posters have clearly lost their argument
That's not to say the old IRA were very nice people - they weren't - and I don't think they're particularly worthy of celebration - but they were not mindless, they did not carry on for 27 years in a futile, mindless campaign, they had a plan to win, did win, and had much more regard for the lives of the general public who had to live through their campaign, a general public which largely supported them
So I think it's clear that the old IRA and the PIRA are very much not morally equivalent
Whereas the PIRA and the INLA are morally equivalent
I wonder who I was talking about when I said they were triggered. Maybe Angelo has his benefits.
Caliing somebody "triggered" is not an argument
It's an escape hatch used by somebody who has no argument
It's what right-wing internet trolls do
Don't worry. You don't need to be annoyed. His views are more or less in line with your own previous views. Another week or two and you'll prob flip back in line with him. An Angelo/ Sid alliance would be something to behold.
Quote from: trueblue1234 on May 16, 2021, 10:51:38 AM
Quote from: sid waddell on May 16, 2021, 10:47:56 AM
Quote from: trueblue1234 on May 16, 2021, 10:45:40 AM
Quote from: sid waddell on May 16, 2021, 10:43:39 AM
Quote from: trueblue1234 on May 16, 2021, 10:36:34 AM
Quote from: imtommygunn on May 16, 2021, 10:27:40 AM
His full descent into Angelo is now complete. You are all hypocrites, hypocrites I tell you and I am going to show up every last one of you. It's the same as Angelo on the corona virus thread. Topic irrelevant tbh.
To be fair I think they were a bit annoyed when Angelo of all posters showed them up on the old Ira v new ira threads. It's triggered a few of them.
He didn't though, and the proof of that is in how the pro-Provo posters have resorted to nothing except furious name calling lately
The pro-Provo posters have clearly lost their argument
That's not to say the old IRA were very nice people - they weren't - and I don't think they're particularly worthy of celebration - but they were not mindless, they did not carry on for 27 years in a futile, mindless campaign, they had a plan to win, did win, and had much more regard for the lives of the general public who had to live through their campaign, a general public which largely supported them
So I think it's clear that the old IRA and the PIRA are very much not morally equivalent
Whereas the PIRA and the INLA are morally equivalent
I wonder who I was talking about when I said they were triggered. Maybe Angelo has his benefits.
Caliing somebody "triggered" is not an argument
It's an escape hatch used by somebody who has no argument
It's what right-wing internet trolls do
Don't worry. You don't need to be annoyed. His views are more or less in line with your own previous views. Another week or two and you'll prob flip back in line with him. An Angelo/ Sid alliance would be something to behold.
You're looking for an escape hatch again
Are you of the view that the PIRA were noble heroes and the INLA were scum?
Could you set out as you see it, why the PIRA were morally superior to the INLA?
Quote from: sid waddell on May 16, 2021, 10:53:50 AM
Quote from: trueblue1234 on May 16, 2021, 10:51:38 AM
Quote from: sid waddell on May 16, 2021, 10:47:56 AM
Quote from: trueblue1234 on May 16, 2021, 10:45:40 AM
Quote from: sid waddell on May 16, 2021, 10:43:39 AM
Quote from: trueblue1234 on May 16, 2021, 10:36:34 AM
Quote from: imtommygunn on May 16, 2021, 10:27:40 AM
His full descent into Angelo is now complete. You are all hypocrites, hypocrites I tell you and I am going to show up every last one of you. It's the same as Angelo on the corona virus thread. Topic irrelevant tbh.
To be fair I think they were a bit annoyed when Angelo of all posters showed them up on the old Ira v new ira threads. It's triggered a few of them.
He didn't though, and the proof of that is in how the pro-Provo posters have resorted to nothing except furious name calling lately
The pro-Provo posters have clearly lost their argument
That's not to say the old IRA were very nice people - they weren't - and I don't think they're particularly worthy of celebration - but they were not mindless, they did not carry on for 27 years in a futile, mindless campaign, they had a plan to win, did win, and had much more regard for the lives of the general public who had to live through their campaign, a general public which largely supported them
So I think it's clear that the old IRA and the PIRA are very much not morally equivalent
Whereas the PIRA and the INLA are morally equivalent
I wonder who I was talking about when I said they were triggered. Maybe Angelo has his benefits.
Caliing somebody "triggered" is not an argument
It's an escape hatch used by somebody who has no argument
It's what right-wing internet trolls do
Don't worry. You don't need to be annoyed. His views are more or less in line with your own previous views. Another week or two and you'll prob flip back in line with him. An Angelo/ Sid alliance would be something to behold.
You're looking for an escape hatch again
Are you of the view that the PIRA were noble heroes and the INLA were scum?
Could you set out as you see it, why the PIRA were morally superior to the INLA?
You were unable to do that for the old Ira over the provos and it's really knocked you. How many pages of posts and Angelo was still running rings around ya.
Quote from: trueblue1234 on May 16, 2021, 10:59:43 AM
Quote from: sid waddell on May 16, 2021, 10:53:50 AM
Quote from: trueblue1234 on May 16, 2021, 10:51:38 AM
Quote from: sid waddell on May 16, 2021, 10:47:56 AM
Quote from: trueblue1234 on May 16, 2021, 10:45:40 AM
Quote from: sid waddell on May 16, 2021, 10:43:39 AM
Quote from: trueblue1234 on May 16, 2021, 10:36:34 AM
Quote from: imtommygunn on May 16, 2021, 10:27:40 AM
His full descent into Angelo is now complete. You are all hypocrites, hypocrites I tell you and I am going to show up every last one of you. It's the same as Angelo on the corona virus thread. Topic irrelevant tbh.
To be fair I think they were a bit annoyed when Angelo of all posters showed them up on the old Ira v new ira threads. It's triggered a few of them.
He didn't though, and the proof of that is in how the pro-Provo posters have resorted to nothing except furious name calling lately
The pro-Provo posters have clearly lost their argument
That's not to say the old IRA were very nice people - they weren't - and I don't think they're particularly worthy of celebration - but they were not mindless, they did not carry on for 27 years in a futile, mindless campaign, they had a plan to win, did win, and had much more regard for the lives of the general public who had to live through their campaign, a general public which largely supported them
So I think it's clear that the old IRA and the PIRA are very much not morally equivalent
Whereas the PIRA and the INLA are morally equivalent
I wonder who I was talking about when I said they were triggered. Maybe Angelo has his benefits.
Caliing somebody "triggered" is not an argument
It's an escape hatch used by somebody who has no argument
It's what right-wing internet trolls do
Don't worry. You don't need to be annoyed. His views are more or less in line with your own previous views. Another week or two and you'll prob flip back in line with him. An Angelo/ Sid alliance would be something to behold.
You're looking for an escape hatch again
Are you of the view that the PIRA were noble heroes and the INLA were scum?
Could you set out as you see it, why the PIRA were morally superior to the INLA?
You were unable to do that for the old Ira over the provos and it's really knocked you. How many pages of posts and Angelo was still running rings around ya.
You're resorting to his lowest common denominator tactics now
It's quite sad to see that happen
You just left out "RAAAAAAAAAARRRRRR" from your post there
This is the sort of debating strategy children use!
Maybe it's in tribute to the children murdered by the PIRA?
Quote from: sid waddell on May 16, 2021, 11:04:08 AM
Quote from: trueblue1234 on May 16, 2021, 10:59:43 AM
Quote from: sid waddell on May 16, 2021, 10:53:50 AM
Quote from: trueblue1234 on May 16, 2021, 10:51:38 AM
Quote from: sid waddell on May 16, 2021, 10:47:56 AM
Quote from: trueblue1234 on May 16, 2021, 10:45:40 AM
Quote from: sid waddell on May 16, 2021, 10:43:39 AM
Quote from: trueblue1234 on May 16, 2021, 10:36:34 AM
Quote from: imtommygunn on May 16, 2021, 10:27:40 AM
His full descent into Angelo is now complete. You are all hypocrites, hypocrites I tell you and I am going to show up every last one of you. It's the same as Angelo on the corona virus thread. Topic irrelevant tbh.
To be fair I think they were a bit annoyed when Angelo of all posters showed them up on the old Ira v new ira threads. It's triggered a few of them.
He didn't though, and the proof of that is in how the pro-Provo posters have resorted to nothing except furious name calling lately
The pro-Provo posters have clearly lost their argument
That's not to say the old IRA were very nice people - they weren't - and I don't think they're particularly worthy of celebration - but they were not mindless, they did not carry on for 27 years in a futile, mindless campaign, they had a plan to win, did win, and had much more regard for the lives of the general public who had to live through their campaign, a general public which largely supported them
So I think it's clear that the old IRA and the PIRA are very much not morally equivalent
Whereas the PIRA and the INLA are morally equivalent
I wonder who I was talking about when I said they were triggered. Maybe Angelo has his benefits.
Caliing somebody "triggered" is not an argument
It's an escape hatch used by somebody who has no argument
It's what right-wing internet trolls do
Don't worry. You don't need to be annoyed. His views are more or less in line with your own previous views. Another week or two and you'll prob flip back in line with him. An Angelo/ Sid alliance would be something to behold.
You're looking for an escape hatch again
Are you of the view that the PIRA were noble heroes and the INLA were scum?
Could you set out as you see it, why the PIRA were morally superior to the INLA?
You were unable to do that for the old Ira over the provos and it's really knocked you. How many pages of posts and Angelo was still running rings around ya.
You're resorting to his lowest common denominator tactics now
It's quite sad to see that happen
You just left out "RAAAAAAAAAARRRRRR" from your post there
This is sort of debating strategy children use!
Maybe it's in tribute to the children murdered by the PIRA?
And the innocent victims of the old Ira. Don't forget them too.
Quote from: trueblue1234 on May 16, 2021, 11:07:04 AM
Quote from: sid waddell on May 16, 2021, 11:04:08 AM
Quote from: trueblue1234 on May 16, 2021, 10:59:43 AM
Quote from: sid waddell on May 16, 2021, 10:53:50 AM
Quote from: trueblue1234 on May 16, 2021, 10:51:38 AM
Quote from: sid waddell on May 16, 2021, 10:47:56 AM
Quote from: trueblue1234 on May 16, 2021, 10:45:40 AM
Quote from: sid waddell on May 16, 2021, 10:43:39 AM
Quote from: trueblue1234 on May 16, 2021, 10:36:34 AM
Quote from: imtommygunn on May 16, 2021, 10:27:40 AM
His full descent into Angelo is now complete. You are all hypocrites, hypocrites I tell you and I am going to show up every last one of you. It's the same as Angelo on the corona virus thread. Topic irrelevant tbh.
To be fair I think they were a bit annoyed when Angelo of all posters showed them up on the old Ira v new ira threads. It's triggered a few of them.
He didn't though, and the proof of that is in how the pro-Provo posters have resorted to nothing except furious name calling lately
The pro-Provo posters have clearly lost their argument
That's not to say the old IRA were very nice people - they weren't - and I don't think they're particularly worthy of celebration - but they were not mindless, they did not carry on for 27 years in a futile, mindless campaign, they had a plan to win, did win, and had much more regard for the lives of the general public who had to live through their campaign, a general public which largely supported them
So I think it's clear that the old IRA and the PIRA are very much not morally equivalent
Whereas the PIRA and the INLA are morally equivalent
I wonder who I was talking about when I said they were triggered. Maybe Angelo has his benefits.
Caliing somebody "triggered" is not an argument
It's an escape hatch used by somebody who has no argument
It's what right-wing internet trolls do
Don't worry. You don't need to be annoyed. His views are more or less in line with your own previous views. Another week or two and you'll prob flip back in line with him. An Angelo/ Sid alliance would be something to behold.
You're looking for an escape hatch again
Are you of the view that the PIRA were noble heroes and the INLA were scum?
Could you set out as you see it, why the PIRA were morally superior to the INLA?
You were unable to do that for the old Ira over the provos and it's really knocked you. How many pages of posts and Angelo was still running rings around ya.
You're resorting to his lowest common denominator tactics now
It's quite sad to see that happen
You just left out "RAAAAAAAAAARRRRRR" from your post there
This is sort of debating strategy children use!
Maybe it's in tribute to the children murdered by the PIRA?
And the innocent victims of the old Ira. Don't forget them too.
See again, you're resorting to crude reductionism
You're saying that all armed campaigns which killed any civilians, no matter the number, are exactly equivalent morally to each other
But that would be to say that the Khmer Rouge were equivalent to the ANC
Which would be a bit mental, wouldn't it
Your argument necessitates the absolute destruction of critical thinking - a bit like the Khmer Rouge actually!
The modus operandis of the PIRA and the INLA were the exact same however
And yet you refuse to compare them morally
Smacks of a poster who wants to hide the truth
Quote from: sid waddell on May 16, 2021, 11:11:59 AM
Quote from: trueblue1234 on May 16, 2021, 11:07:04 AM
Quote from: sid waddell on May 16, 2021, 11:04:08 AM
Quote from: trueblue1234 on May 16, 2021, 10:59:43 AM
Quote from: sid waddell on May 16, 2021, 10:53:50 AM
Quote from: trueblue1234 on May 16, 2021, 10:51:38 AM
Quote from: sid waddell on May 16, 2021, 10:47:56 AM
Quote from: trueblue1234 on May 16, 2021, 10:45:40 AM
Quote from: sid waddell on May 16, 2021, 10:43:39 AM
Quote from: trueblue1234 on May 16, 2021, 10:36:34 AM
Quote from: imtommygunn on May 16, 2021, 10:27:40 AM
His full descent into Angelo is now complete. You are all hypocrites, hypocrites I tell you and I am going to show up every last one of you. It's the same as Angelo on the corona virus thread. Topic irrelevant tbh.
To be fair I think they were a bit annoyed when Angelo of all posters showed them up on the old Ira v new ira threads. It's triggered a few of them.
He didn't though, and the proof of that is in how the pro-Provo posters have resorted to nothing except furious name calling lately
The pro-Provo posters have clearly lost their argument
That's not to say the old IRA were very nice people - they weren't - and I don't think they're particularly worthy of celebration - but they were not mindless, they did not carry on for 27 years in a futile, mindless campaign, they had a plan to win, did win, and had much more regard for the lives of the general public who had to live through their campaign, a general public which largely supported them
So I think it's clear that the old IRA and the PIRA are very much not morally equivalent
Whereas the PIRA and the INLA are morally equivalent
I wonder who I was talking about when I said they were triggered. Maybe Angelo has his benefits.
Caliing somebody "triggered" is not an argument
It's an escape hatch used by somebody who has no argument
It's what right-wing internet trolls do
Don't worry. You don't need to be annoyed. His views are more or less in line with your own previous views. Another week or two and you'll prob flip back in line with him. An Angelo/ Sid alliance would be something to behold.
You're looking for an escape hatch again
Are you of the view that the PIRA were noble heroes and the INLA were scum?
Could you set out as you see it, why the PIRA were morally superior to the INLA?
You were unable to do that for the old Ira over the provos and it's really knocked you. How many pages of posts and Angelo was still running rings around ya.
You're resorting to his lowest common denominator tactics now
It's quite sad to see that happen
You just left out "RAAAAAAAAAARRRRRR" from your post there
This is sort of debating strategy children use!
Maybe it's in tribute to the children murdered by the PIRA?
And the innocent victims of the old Ira. Don't forget them too.
See again, you're resorting to crude reductionism
You're saying that all armed campaigns which killed any civilians, no matter the number, are exactly equivalent morally to each other
But that would be to say that the Khmer Rouge were equivalent to the ANC
Which would be a bit mental, wouldn't it
Your argument necessitates the absolute destruction of critical thinking - a bit like the Khmer Rouge actually!
The modus operandis of the PIRA and the INLA were the exact same however
And yet you refuse to compare them morally
Smacks of a poster who wants to hide the truth
No your right I agree there is innocent victims in all wars. Some targeted more innocents than others. And some disappeared many more than others as as well.
Quote from: trueblue1234 on May 16, 2021, 11:16:44 AM
Quote from: sid waddell on May 16, 2021, 11:11:59 AM
Quote from: trueblue1234 on May 16, 2021, 11:07:04 AM
Quote from: sid waddell on May 16, 2021, 11:04:08 AM
Quote from: trueblue1234 on May 16, 2021, 10:59:43 AM
Quote from: sid waddell on May 16, 2021, 10:53:50 AM
Quote from: trueblue1234 on May 16, 2021, 10:51:38 AM
Quote from: sid waddell on May 16, 2021, 10:47:56 AM
Quote from: trueblue1234 on May 16, 2021, 10:45:40 AM
Quote from: sid waddell on May 16, 2021, 10:43:39 AM
Quote from: trueblue1234 on May 16, 2021, 10:36:34 AM
Quote from: imtommygunn on May 16, 2021, 10:27:40 AM
His full descent into Angelo is now complete. You are all hypocrites, hypocrites I tell you and I am going to show up every last one of you. It's the same as Angelo on the corona virus thread. Topic irrelevant tbh.
To be fair I think they were a bit annoyed when Angelo of all posters showed them up on the old Ira v new ira threads. It's triggered a few of them.
He didn't though, and the proof of that is in how the pro-Provo posters have resorted to nothing except furious name calling lately
The pro-Provo posters have clearly lost their argument
That's not to say the old IRA were very nice people - they weren't - and I don't think they're particularly worthy of celebration - but they were not mindless, they did not carry on for 27 years in a futile, mindless campaign, they had a plan to win, did win, and had much more regard for the lives of the general public who had to live through their campaign, a general public which largely supported them
So I think it's clear that the old IRA and the PIRA are very much not morally equivalent
Whereas the PIRA and the INLA are morally equivalent
I wonder who I was talking about when I said they were triggered. Maybe Angelo has his benefits.
Caliing somebody "triggered" is not an argument
It's an escape hatch used by somebody who has no argument
It's what right-wing internet trolls do
Don't worry. You don't need to be annoyed. His views are more or less in line with your own previous views. Another week or two and you'll prob flip back in line with him. An Angelo/ Sid alliance would be something to behold.
You're looking for an escape hatch again
Are you of the view that the PIRA were noble heroes and the INLA were scum?
Could you set out as you see it, why the PIRA were morally superior to the INLA?
You were unable to do that for the old Ira over the provos and it's really knocked you. How many pages of posts and Angelo was still running rings around ya.
You're resorting to his lowest common denominator tactics now
It's quite sad to see that happen
You just left out "RAAAAAAAAAARRRRRR" from your post there
This is sort of debating strategy children use!
Maybe it's in tribute to the children murdered by the PIRA?
And the innocent victims of the old Ira. Don't forget them too.
See again, you're resorting to crude reductionism
You're saying that all armed campaigns which killed any civilians, no matter the number, are exactly equivalent morally to each other
But that would be to say that the Khmer Rouge were equivalent to the ANC
Which would be a bit mental, wouldn't it
Your argument necessitates the absolute destruction of critical thinking - a bit like the Khmer Rouge actually!
The modus operandis of the PIRA and the INLA were the exact same however
And yet you refuse to compare them morally
Smacks of a poster who wants to hide the truth
No your right I agree there is innocent victims in all wars. Some targeted more innocents than others. And some disappeared many more than others as as well.
Yes and I think that's a crucial distinction as to why the PIRA could not be classed as a legitimate fighting force - because a key, primary modus operandi of theirs was the consistent targetting of totally unconnected civilians over the course of 27 years
They admit this themselves
As was the case with the INLA
I don't think this was the case at all in the War of Independence
So no innocent people died in the WOI? Righty O
Quote from: sid waddell on May 16, 2021, 11:24:09 AM
Quote from: trueblue1234 on May 16, 2021, 11:16:44 AM
Quote from: sid waddell on May 16, 2021, 11:11:59 AM
Quote from: trueblue1234 on May 16, 2021, 11:07:04 AM
Quote from: sid waddell on May 16, 2021, 11:04:08 AM
Quote from: trueblue1234 on May 16, 2021, 10:59:43 AM
Quote from: sid waddell on May 16, 2021, 10:53:50 AM
Quote from: trueblue1234 on May 16, 2021, 10:51:38 AM
Quote from: sid waddell on May 16, 2021, 10:47:56 AM
Quote from: trueblue1234 on May 16, 2021, 10:45:40 AM
Quote from: sid waddell on May 16, 2021, 10:43:39 AM
Quote from: trueblue1234 on May 16, 2021, 10:36:34 AM
Quote from: imtommygunn on May 16, 2021, 10:27:40 AM
His full descent into Angelo is now complete. You are all hypocrites, hypocrites I tell you and I am going to show up every last one of you. It's the same as Angelo on the corona virus thread. Topic irrelevant tbh.
To be fair I think they were a bit annoyed when Angelo of all posters showed them up on the old Ira v new ira threads. It's triggered a few of them.
He didn't though, and the proof of that is in how the pro-Provo posters have resorted to nothing except furious name calling lately
The pro-Provo posters have clearly lost their argument
That's not to say the old IRA were very nice people - they weren't - and I don't think they're particularly worthy of celebration - but they were not mindless, they did not carry on for 27 years in a futile, mindless campaign, they had a plan to win, did win, and had much more regard for the lives of the general public who had to live through their campaign, a general public which largely supported them
So I think it's clear that the old IRA and the PIRA are very much not morally equivalent
Whereas the PIRA and the INLA are morally equivalent
I wonder who I was talking about when I said they were triggered. Maybe Angelo has his benefits.
Caliing somebody "triggered" is not an argument
It's an escape hatch used by somebody who has no argument
It's what right-wing internet trolls do
Don't worry. You don't need to be annoyed. His views are more or less in line with your own previous views. Another week or two and you'll prob flip back in line with him. An Angelo/ Sid alliance would be something to behold.
You're looking for an escape hatch again
Are you of the view that the PIRA were noble heroes and the INLA were scum?
Could you set out as you see it, why the PIRA were morally superior to the INLA?
You were unable to do that for the old Ira over the provos and it's really knocked you. How many pages of posts and Angelo was still running rings around ya.
You're resorting to his lowest common denominator tactics now
It's quite sad to see that happen
You just left out "RAAAAAAAAAARRRRRR" from your post there
This is sort of debating strategy children use!
Maybe it's in tribute to the children murdered by the PIRA?
And the innocent victims of the old Ira. Don't forget them too.
See again, you're resorting to crude reductionism
You're saying that all armed campaigns which killed any civilians, no matter the number, are exactly equivalent morally to each other
But that would be to say that the Khmer Rouge were equivalent to the ANC
Which would be a bit mental, wouldn't it
Your argument necessitates the absolute destruction of critical thinking - a bit like the Khmer Rouge actually!
The modus operandis of the PIRA and the INLA were the exact same however
And yet you refuse to compare them morally
Smacks of a poster who wants to hide the truth
No your right I agree there is innocent victims in all wars. Some targeted more innocents than others. And some disappeared many more than others as as well.
Yes and I think that's a crucial distinction as to why the PIRA could not be classed as a legitimate fighting force - because a key, primary modus operandi of theirs was the consistent targetting of totally unconnected civilians over the course of 27 years
They admit this themselves
As was the case with the INLA
I don't think this was the case at all in the War of Independence
Thanks for your opinion.
Quote from: Milltown Row2 on May 16, 2021, 11:25:52 AM
So no innocent people died in the WOI? Righty O
That isn't the argument being made, only a fool would make that argument, and you know full well nobody argues that
The argument being made is that the PIRA consistently targetted civilians unconnected to the conflict as a key, primary modus operandi, as did the INLA
And the PIRA did it for a quarter of a century
The War of Independence IRA didn't do that
Therefore, whatever the moral failings of the old IRA, and only a fool would say the old IRA did not have moral failings, in the round the two campaigns are not morally comparable
There are a whole host of reasons, all of which involve critical thinking, to demonstrate why
But I suppose on this forum they will always be up against it when there is a considerable cohort of posters who are dogged and determined in their pursuit of crude reductionism at all costs
Don't feed the troll
Quote from: sid waddell on May 16, 2021, 11:11:59 AM
Quote from: trueblue1234 on May 16, 2021, 11:07:04 AM
Quote from: sid waddell on May 16, 2021, 11:04:08 AM
Quote from: trueblue1234 on May 16, 2021, 10:59:43 AM
Quote from: sid waddell on May 16, 2021, 10:53:50 AM
Quote from: trueblue1234 on May 16, 2021, 10:51:38 AM
Quote from: sid waddell on May 16, 2021, 10:47:56 AM
Quote from: trueblue1234 on May 16, 2021, 10:45:40 AM
Quote from: sid waddell on May 16, 2021, 10:43:39 AM
Quote from: trueblue1234 on May 16, 2021, 10:36:34 AM
Quote from: imtommygunn on May 16, 2021, 10:27:40 AM
His full descent into Angelo is now complete. You are all hypocrites, hypocrites I tell you and I am going to show up every last one of you. It's the same as Angelo on the corona virus thread. Topic irrelevant tbh.
To be fair I think they were a bit annoyed when Angelo of all posters showed them up on the old Ira v new ira threads. It's triggered a few of them.
He didn't though, and the proof of that is in how the pro-Provo posters have resorted to nothing except furious name calling lately
The pro-Provo posters have clearly lost their argument
That's not to say the old IRA were very nice people - they weren't - and I don't think they're particularly worthy of celebration - but they were not mindless, they did not carry on for 27 years in a futile, mindless campaign, they had a plan to win, did win, and had much more regard for the lives of the general public who had to live through their campaign, a general public which largely supported them
So I think it's clear that the old IRA and the PIRA are very much not morally equivalent
Whereas the PIRA and the INLA are morally equivalent
I wonder who I was talking about when I said they were triggered. Maybe Angelo has his benefits.
Caliing somebody "triggered" is not an argument
It's an escape hatch used by somebody who has no argument
It's what right-wing internet trolls do
Don't worry. You don't need to be annoyed. His views are more or less in line with your own previous views. Another week or two and you'll prob flip back in line with him. An Angelo/ Sid alliance would be something to behold.
You're looking for an escape hatch again
Are you of the view that the PIRA were noble heroes and the INLA were scum?
Could you set out as you see it, why the PIRA were morally superior to the INLA?
You were unable to do that for the old Ira over the provos and it's really knocked you. How many pages of posts and Angelo was still running rings around ya.
You're resorting to his lowest common denominator tactics now
It's quite sad to see that happen
You just left out "RAAAAAAAAAARRRRRR" from your post there
This is sort of debating strategy children use!
Maybe it's in tribute to the children murdered by the PIRA?
And the innocent victims of the old Ira. Don't forget them too.
See again, you're resorting to crude reductionism
You're saying that all armed campaigns which killed any civilians, no matter the number, are exactly equivalent morally to each other
But that would be to say that the Khmer Rouge were equivalent to the ANC
Which would be a bit mental, wouldn't it
Your argument necessitates the absolute destruction of critical thinking - a bit like the Khmer Rouge actually!
The modus operandis of the PIRA and the INLA were the exact same however
And yet you refuse to compare them morally
Smacks of a poster who wants to hide the truth
The Old IRA didn't win. They didn't achieve their goal. A free Ireland.
Your point about saying the Khmer Rouge and the ANC is daft.
As for your question, I have no idea why. Could simply be down to the Wolfe Tones, i can't think of any INLA songs they have
what about the historic ira
Quote from: tonto1888 on May 16, 2021, 01:53:29 PM
Quote from: sid waddell on May 16, 2021, 11:11:59 AM
Quote from: trueblue1234 on May 16, 2021, 11:07:04 AM
Quote from: sid waddell on May 16, 2021, 11:04:08 AM
Quote from: trueblue1234 on May 16, 2021, 10:59:43 AM
Quote from: sid waddell on May 16, 2021, 10:53:50 AM
Quote from: trueblue1234 on May 16, 2021, 10:51:38 AM
Quote from: sid waddell on May 16, 2021, 10:47:56 AM
Quote from: trueblue1234 on May 16, 2021, 10:45:40 AM
Quote from: sid waddell on May 16, 2021, 10:43:39 AM
Quote from: trueblue1234 on May 16, 2021, 10:36:34 AM
Quote from: imtommygunn on May 16, 2021, 10:27:40 AM
His full descent into Angelo is now complete. You are all hypocrites, hypocrites I tell you and I am going to show up every last one of you. It's the same as Angelo on the corona virus thread. Topic irrelevant tbh.
To be fair I think they were a bit annoyed when Angelo of all posters showed them up on the old Ira v new ira threads. It's triggered a few of them.
He didn't though, and the proof of that is in how the pro-Provo posters have resorted to nothing except furious name calling lately
The pro-Provo posters have clearly lost their argument
That's not to say the old IRA were very nice people - they weren't - and I don't think they're particularly worthy of celebration - but they were not mindless, they did not carry on for 27 years in a futile, mindless campaign, they had a plan to win, did win, and had much more regard for the lives of the general public who had to live through their campaign, a general public which largely supported them
So I think it's clear that the old IRA and the PIRA are very much not morally equivalent
Whereas the PIRA and the INLA are morally equivalent
I wonder who I was talking about when I said they were triggered. Maybe Angelo has his benefits.
Caliing somebody "triggered" is not an argument
It's an escape hatch used by somebody who has no argument
It's what right-wing internet trolls do
Don't worry. You don't need to be annoyed. His views are more or less in line with your own previous views. Another week or two and you'll prob flip back in line with him. An Angelo/ Sid alliance would be something to behold.
You're looking for an escape hatch again
Are you of the view that the PIRA were noble heroes and the INLA were scum?
Could you set out as you see it, why the PIRA were morally superior to the INLA?
You were unable to do that for the old Ira over the provos and it's really knocked you. How many pages of posts and Angelo was still running rings around ya.
You're resorting to his lowest common denominator tactics now
It's quite sad to see that happen
You just left out "RAAAAAAAAAARRRRRR" from your post there
This is sort of debating strategy children use!
Maybe it's in tribute to the children murdered by the PIRA?
And the innocent victims of the old Ira. Don't forget them too.
See again, you're resorting to crude reductionism
You're saying that all armed campaigns which killed any civilians, no matter the number, are exactly equivalent morally to each other
But that would be to say that the Khmer Rouge were equivalent to the ANC
Which would be a bit mental, wouldn't it
Your argument necessitates the absolute destruction of critical thinking - a bit like the Khmer Rouge actually!
The modus operandis of the PIRA and the INLA were the exact same however
And yet you refuse to compare them morally
Smacks of a poster who wants to hide the truth
The Old IRA didn't win. They didn't achieve their goal. A free Ireland.
Your point about saying the Khmer Rouge and the ANC is daft.
As for your question, I have no idea why. Could simply be down to the Wolfe Tones, i can't think of any INLA songs they have
I live in a free Ireland that came into being because of the old IRA
So you're wrong in a basic factual sense
Germany is much smaller now than it used to be yet it would obviously be ludicrous to say a free Germany does not exist
Similarly it's ludicrous to say a free Ireland does not exist
It's not enough to say a point is "daft" - you have to say
whyNorthern Ireland
is a free society by the way
I don't think it's a particularly successful society but it
is a free society
Typical free state response. I'm free, sod the rest.
Time for ignore
Quote from: tonto1888 on May 16, 2021, 03:17:23 PM
Typical free state response. I'm free, sod the rest.
Time for ignore
Just because you do not live in a free Ireland does not mean a free Ireland does not exist
What you are saying is that unless a state exists to the maximum possible boundary of what it could historically be considered to have any sort of claim over, that that state does not exist
That's why I brought up Germany, because Germany used to be much bigger than it is now - I don't think it would be a good idea for there to be a Greater Germany movement which seeks to get back East Prussia, now Kaliningrad, or parts of Poland, such as Wroclaw, formerly Breslau
Armenia would be another example, historic Armenia was much bigger than the current day state of Armenia
Serbia is another example
Salonika in Greece used to be Turkish, should Turkey say "there is no such thing as Turkey until Salonika is reconquered"?
I don't think that would be a good idea
Even historic Israel was bigger than current day Israel
The attitude that says modern day Israel must control everything from the Mediterranean Sea to the Jordan is the same attitude that says the state of Ireland has an inherent right to own the six counties
The reality is that there are many competing historical claims over pieces of land worldwide, and some will inevitably be disappointed
The important thing is that those of the ethnicity or nationality which does not own these disputed pieces of land are treated as any other citizens would be
That's what NI should focus on, building a good society for
all, and let the cards fall where they may in any putative border poll 15-20 years down the line
They took out Billy Wright so not all bad.
Quote from: charlieTully on May 16, 2021, 04:03:44 PM
They took out Billy Wright so not all bad.
They loved a bloody internal feud every so often
Quote from: imtommygunn on May 16, 2021, 10:27:40 AM
His full descent into Angelo is now complete. You are all hypocrites, hypocrites I tell you and I am going to show up every last one of you. It's the same as Angelo on the corona virus thread. Topic irrelevant tbh.
It's certainly the same MO.
bombardment of nonsense on anyone with a contradictory viewpoint to the stage where they give up in exasperation and then claim some sort of internet victory and feel good about yourself.
The INLA would be the hipsters' choice.
Quote from: Dag Dog on May 17, 2021, 01:14:30 PM
The INLA would be the hipsters' choice.
Rollie fags, unpronounceable bottles of vino coupled with strong moustachios
2 points
1. There is no doubt that Sid has created the thread to stir the pot.
2. Irrespective of who created the thread or what their motivation there are those who do apply a double standard between PIRA and INLA. That does deserve to be exposed.
Quote from: smelmoth on May 17, 2021, 03:38:36 PM
2 points
1. There is no doubt that Sid has created the thread to stir the pot.
2. Irrespective of who created the thread or what their motivation there are those who do apply a double standard between PIRA and INLA. That does deserve to be exposed.
I've never seen a post on here (maybe you can highlight it) that says PIRA good INLA bad.
As far as I'm aware they splintered into different bodies and their goals were the same.
How they went about their jobs is up for discussion but for me a campaign to kill someone in guerrilla warfare, be it 25 years ago or 100 years ago is no different.
The amount of absolute shite polluting this board is ridiculous. I see no need to be starting threads like this and I see no need for anyone to be replying to them to be keeping them going. The mods should be deleting crap like this and removing the posters whose interest in GAA is clearly dwarved by their interest in politics and other such shite.
This is a GAA Board. Excluding the county sections, more than half of the posts are on the General Discussion rather than on the GAA Discussion. Perhaps understandable given lockdown. But lockdown is now over and we can now enjoy our football and hurling again.
If you want to do politics go to Stormont, the Dail or feck off to Boards.ie. If you want to do religion go to the chapel, church or go and read Richard Dawkins. Do not bring it in here,
The OP has been put on "holiday" at least twice in the last few months.
You have to wonder what the 2 week bans achieve. Because it's evidently nothing.
Quote from: APM on May 17, 2021, 04:48:39 PM
The amount of absolute shite polluting this board is ridiculous. I see no need to be starting threads like this and I see no need for anyone to be replying to them to be keeping them going. The mods should be deleting crap like this and removing the posters whose interest in GAA is clearly dwarved by their interest in politics and other such shite.
A GAA club is named after an INLA man
We haven't really had anybody speak up for the INLA here
Given that nobody seems to want to do so, surely that proves it's a bit of a bad look for the GAA to have a club named after an INLA man?
Quote from: Milltown Row2 on May 17, 2021, 04:28:40 PM
Quote from: smelmoth on May 17, 2021, 03:38:36 PM
2 points
1. There is no doubt that Sid has created the thread to stir the pot.
2. Irrespective of who created the thread or what their motivation there are those who do apply a double standard between PIRA and INLA. That does deserve to be exposed.
I've never seen a post on here (maybe you can highlight it) that says PIRA good INLA bad.
As far as I'm aware they splintered into different bodies and their goals were the same.
How they went about their jobs is up for discussion but for me a campaign to kill someone in guerrilla warfare, be it 25 years ago or 100 years ago is no different.
"Guerilla warfare" like Darkley?
Quote from: APM on May 17, 2021, 04:48:39 PM
The amount of absolute shite polluting this board is ridiculous. I see no need to be starting threads like this and I see no need for anyone to be replying to them to be keeping them going. The mods should be deleting crap like this and removing the posters whose interest in GAA is clearly dwarved by their interest in politics and other such shite.
This is a GAA Board. Excluding the county sections, more than half of the posts are on the General Discussion rather than on the GAA Discussion. Perhaps understandable given lockdown. But lockdown is now over and we can now enjoy our football and hurling again.
If you want to do politics go to Stormont, the Dail or feck off to Boards.ie. If you want to do religion go to the chapel, church or go and read Richard Dawkins. Do not bring it in here,
You are probably correct...although no rules have been broken.
This thread has probably run its course, so I'll lock it before it descends into something we don't need.