The US policing crisis thread

Started by Eamonnca1, April 28, 2015, 07:10:37 AM

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whitey

The problem is that he seems to have lied on the juror questionnaire and has since come out and essentially said people should serve on juries in order to enact social change

Maybe he should just stfu

That being said I believe Chauvin should be serving 20+ years in jail

J70

Quote from: whitey on May 04, 2021, 01:37:44 PM
The problem is that he seems to have lied on the juror questionnaire and has since come out and essentially said people should serve on juries in order to enact social change

Maybe he should just stfu

That being said I believe Chauvin should be serving 20+ years in jail

Yep, I agree with all that.

And if he lied, then he should be appropriately penalized.

Jeopardizing a criminal prosecution is not something that should be taken lightly.

Gmac

Quote from: J70 on May 04, 2021, 02:30:38 PM
Quote from: whitey on May 04, 2021, 01:37:44 PM
The problem is that he seems to have lied on the juror questionnaire and has since come out and essentially said people should serve on juries in order to enact social change

Maybe he should just stfu

That being said I believe Chauvin should be serving 20+ years in jail

Yep, I agree with all that.

And if he lied, then he should be appropriately penalized.

Jeopardizing a criminal prosecution is not something that should be taken lightly.
the problem with the trial was it was held in Minneapolis with jurors from Minneapolis who knew that if the verdict wasn't guilty on all charges the city and lots of other cities would burn and be looted , that's not fair on a jury or chauvin no matter what you think of him . The alternate juror has stated this already.

J70

#1128
Quote from: Gmac on May 04, 2021, 02:41:54 PM
Quote from: J70 on May 04, 2021, 02:30:38 PM
Quote from: whitey on May 04, 2021, 01:37:44 PM
The problem is that he seems to have lied on the juror questionnaire and has since come out and essentially said people should serve on juries in order to enact social change

Maybe he should just stfu

That being said I believe Chauvin should be serving 20+ years in jail

Yep, I agree with all that.

And if he lied, then he should be appropriately penalized.

Jeopardizing a criminal prosecution is not something that should be taken lightly.
the problem with the trial was it was held in Minneapolis with jurors from Minneapolis who knew that if the verdict wasn't guilty on all charges the city and lots of other cities would burn and be looted , that's not fair on a jury or chauvin no matter what you think of him . The alternate juror has stated this already.

What was the alternative?

This case is known all over the world. There were protests everywhere. They're still kneeling before football games all over Europe almost a year later.

Where were they going to move the case to find a jury who came in without prior knowledge of the case or its importance and potential impact?

I don't really care if the jury thought there would be a major backlash to an aquittal. There was nothing anyone could do to change that. People react with fury to miscarriages of justice. And this case was so crystal clear that any acquittal would have merited people on the streets. That's just simply the way it was.

And the fact that trouble was a possible outcome of an acquittal does not mean that Chauvin didn't get justice. And besides, if he hadn't been caught red-handed, on camera, dishing out a slow, brutal death, there wouldn't even have been a trial to begin with. The blue wall of silence would have protected him and he'd be free to do it again.

Gmac

Quote from: J70 on May 04, 2021, 03:20:52 PM
Quote from: Gmac on May 04, 2021, 02:41:54 PM
Quote from: J70 on May 04, 2021, 02:30:38 PM
Quote from: whitey on May 04, 2021, 01:37:44 PM
The problem is that he seems to have lied on the juror questionnaire and has since come out and essentially said people should serve on juries in order to enact social change

Maybe he should just stfu

That being said I believe Chauvin should be serving 20+ years in jail

Yep, I agree with all that.

And if he lied, then he should be appropriately penalized.

Jeopardizing a criminal prosecution is not something that should be taken lightly.
the problem with the trial was it was held in Minneapolis with jurors from Minneapolis who knew that if the verdict wasn't guilty on all charges the city and lots of other cities would burn and be looted , that's not fair on a jury or chauvin no matter what you think of him . The alternate juror has stated this already.

What was the alternative?

This case is known all over the world. There were protests everywhere. They're still kneeling before football games all over Europe almost a year later.

Where were they going to move the case to find a jury who came in without prior knowledge of the case or its importance and potential impact?

I don't really care if the jury thought there would be a major backlash to an aquittal. There was nothing anyone could do to change that. People react with fury to miscarriages of justice. And this case was so crystal clear that any acquittal would have merited people on the streets. That's just simply the way it was.

And the fact that trouble was a possible outcome of an acquittal does not mean that Chauvin didn't get justice. And besides, if he hadn't been caught red-handed, on camera, dishing out a slow, brutal death, there wouldn't even have been a trial to begin with. The blue wall of silence would have protected him and he'd be free to do it again.
ok so you are in favor of mob justice .

J70

Quote from: Gmac on May 04, 2021, 04:31:58 PM
Quote from: J70 on May 04, 2021, 03:20:52 PM
Quote from: Gmac on May 04, 2021, 02:41:54 PM
Quote from: J70 on May 04, 2021, 02:30:38 PM
Quote from: whitey on May 04, 2021, 01:37:44 PM
The problem is that he seems to have lied on the juror questionnaire and has since come out and essentially said people should serve on juries in order to enact social change

Maybe he should just stfu

That being said I believe Chauvin should be serving 20+ years in jail

Yep, I agree with all that.

And if he lied, then he should be appropriately penalized.

Jeopardizing a criminal prosecution is not something that should be taken lightly.
the problem with the trial was it was held in Minneapolis with jurors from Minneapolis who knew that if the verdict wasn't guilty on all charges the city and lots of other cities would burn and be looted , that's not fair on a jury or chauvin no matter what you think of him . The alternate juror has stated this already.

What was the alternative?

This case is known all over the world. There were protests everywhere. They're still kneeling before football games all over Europe almost a year later.

Where were they going to move the case to find a jury who came in without prior knowledge of the case or its importance and potential impact?

I don't really care if the jury thought there would be a major backlash to an aquittal. There was nothing anyone could do to change that. People react with fury to miscarriages of justice. And this case was so crystal clear that any acquittal would have merited people on the streets. That's just simply the way it was.

And the fact that trouble was a possible outcome of an acquittal does not mean that Chauvin didn't get justice. And besides, if he hadn't been caught red-handed, on camera, dishing out a slow, brutal death, there wouldn't even have been a trial to begin with. The blue wall of silence would have protected him and he'd be free to do it again.
ok so you are in favor of mob justice .

No, I'm not.

What I'm saying is that some cases are very high profile and very emotive. Throw in the historical context and there can lie the risk of a major public response to the outcome of such a case.

Any juror in such a situation is going to be aware of that.

That doesn't mean that the jury is going to be or was intimidated into one decision or another for that reason.

If there is evidence that the jury would have acquitted him but for the fear of provoking a public backlash, Chauvin is free to make that argument if he decides to appeal.

Given the evidence presented in the trial and that he wouldn't even testify himself in his own defense, he's going to have a tough job.

I ask once again though, what SHOULD have happened, in your opinion?

J70

Not US policing, but fuckin' hell!

https://www.bbc.com/news/uk-england-shropshire-56979521

Great player in his day. Such an undignified end, getting the shit kicked out of you by a couple of cops.

Gmac

Quote from: J70 on May 04, 2021, 05:30:49 PM
Quote from: Gmac on May 04, 2021, 04:31:58 PM
Quote from: J70 on May 04, 2021, 03:20:52 PM
Quote from: Gmac on May 04, 2021, 02:41:54 PM
Quote from: J70 on May 04, 2021, 02:30:38 PM
Quote from: whitey on May 04, 2021, 01:37:44 PM
The problem is that he seems to have lied on the juror questionnaire and has since come out and essentially said people should serve on juries in order to enact social change

Maybe he should just stfu

That being said I believe Chauvin should be serving 20+ years in jail

Yep, I agree with all that.

And if he lied, then he should be appropriately penalized.

Jeopardizing a criminal prosecution is not something that should be taken lightly.
the problem with the trial was it was held in Minneapolis with jurors from Minneapolis who knew that if the verdict wasn't guilty on all charges the city and lots of other cities would burn and be looted , that's not fair on a jury or chauvin no matter what you think of him . The alternate juror has stated this already.

What was the alternative?

This case is known all over the world. There were protests everywhere. They're still kneeling before football games all over Europe almost a year later.

Where were they going to move the case to find a jury who came in without prior knowledge of the case or its importance and potential impact?

I don't really care if the jury thought there would be a major backlash to an aquittal. There was nothing anyone could do to change that. People react with fury to miscarriages of justice. And this case was so crystal clear that any acquittal would have merited people on the streets. That's just simply the way it was.

And the fact that trouble was a possible outcome of an acquittal does not mean that Chauvin didn't get justice. And besides, if he hadn't been caught red-handed, on camera, dishing out a slow, brutal death, there wouldn't even have been a trial to begin with. The blue wall of silence would have protected him and he'd be free to do it again.
ok so you are in favor of mob justice .

No, I'm not.

What I'm saying is that some cases are very high profile and very emotive. Throw in the historical context and there can lie the risk of a major public response to the outcome of such a case.

Any juror in such a situation is going to be aware of that.

That doesn't mean that the jury is going to be or was intimidated into one decision or another for that reason.

If there is evidence that the jury would have acquitted him but for the fear of provoking a public backlash, Chauvin is free to make that argument if he decides to appeal.

Given the evidence presented in the trial and that he wouldn't even testify himself in his own defense, he's going to have a tough job.

I ask once again though, what SHOULD have happened, in your opinion?
the guy openly lied about the case to get on the jury if that's not grounds for a retrial I don't know what is .you can dislike it all you want but this guys admission means chauvin didn't get a fair trial

RadioGAAGAA

Quote from: Gmac on May 05, 2021, 12:24:54 AMybut this guys admission means chauvin didn't get a fair trial

(i) Do you think it affected the result?
(ii) Do you think the result was the wrong one?
i usse an speelchekor

whitey

Quote from: RadioGAAGAA on May 05, 2021, 07:06:40 AM
Quote from: Gmac on May 05, 2021, 12:24:54 AMybut this guys admission means chauvin didn't get a fair trial

(i) Do you think it affected the result?
(ii) Do you think the result was the wrong one?

No and no

But everyone, including Chauvin, is entitled to a fair trial

J70

Quote from: Gmac on May 05, 2021, 12:24:54 AM
Quote from: J70 on May 04, 2021, 05:30:49 PM
Quote from: Gmac on May 04, 2021, 04:31:58 PM
Quote from: J70 on May 04, 2021, 03:20:52 PM
Quote from: Gmac on May 04, 2021, 02:41:54 PM
Quote from: J70 on May 04, 2021, 02:30:38 PM
Quote from: whitey on May 04, 2021, 01:37:44 PM
The problem is that he seems to have lied on the juror questionnaire and has since come out and essentially said people should serve on juries in order to enact social change

Maybe he should just stfu

That being said I believe Chauvin should be serving 20+ years in jail

Yep, I agree with all that.

And if he lied, then he should be appropriately penalized.

Jeopardizing a criminal prosecution is not something that should be taken lightly.
the problem with the trial was it was held in Minneapolis with jurors from Minneapolis who knew that if the verdict wasn't guilty on all charges the city and lots of other cities would burn and be looted , that's not fair on a jury or chauvin no matter what you think of him . The alternate juror has stated this already.

What was the alternative?

This case is known all over the world. There were protests everywhere. They're still kneeling before football games all over Europe almost a year later.

Where were they going to move the case to find a jury who came in without prior knowledge of the case or its importance and potential impact?

I don't really care if the jury thought there would be a major backlash to an aquittal. There was nothing anyone could do to change that. People react with fury to miscarriages of justice. And this case was so crystal clear that any acquittal would have merited people on the streets. That's just simply the way it was.

And the fact that trouble was a possible outcome of an acquittal does not mean that Chauvin didn't get justice. And besides, if he hadn't been caught red-handed, on camera, dishing out a slow, brutal death, there wouldn't even have been a trial to begin with. The blue wall of silence would have protected him and he'd be free to do it again.
ok so you are in favor of mob justice .

No, I'm not.

What I'm saying is that some cases are very high profile and very emotive. Throw in the historical context and there can lie the risk of a major public response to the outcome of such a case.

Any juror in such a situation is going to be aware of that.

That doesn't mean that the jury is going to be or was intimidated into one decision or another for that reason.

If there is evidence that the jury would have acquitted him but for the fear of provoking a public backlash, Chauvin is free to make that argument if he decides to appeal.

Given the evidence presented in the trial and that he wouldn't even testify himself in his own defense, he's going to have a tough job.

I ask once again though, what SHOULD have happened, in your opinion?
the guy openly lied about the case to get on the jury if that's not grounds for a retrial I don't know what is .you can dislike it all you want but this guys admission means chauvin didn't get a fair trial

In a legal and technical sense that may be true. The courts will decide. And as I've already said, the juror should be subject to the full force of the law.

But Chauvin is going to prison for a long time. He might get a retrial, but he hasn't a leg to stand on and the result will be the same.

whitey

The guy is obviously a complete clown

He might finds his 15 minutes of fame comes from a different place than he imagined

Smerconish had an expert on yesterday and he didn't seem to think it would cause the verdict to be tossed.

Gmac

Quote from: RadioGAAGAA on May 05, 2021, 07:06:40 AM
Quote from: Gmac on May 05, 2021, 12:24:54 AMybut this guys admission means chauvin didn't get a fair trial

(i) Do you think it affected the result?
(ii) Do you think the result was the wrong one?
yes and that's irrelevant

J70

Quote from: Gmac on May 05, 2021, 06:08:41 PM
Quote from: RadioGAAGAA on May 05, 2021, 07:06:40 AM
Quote from: Gmac on May 05, 2021, 12:24:54 AMybut this guys admission means chauvin didn't get a fair trial

(i) Do you think it affected the result?
(ii) Do you think the result was the wrong one?
yes and that's irrelevant

Why do you think it affected the result in what was a very swift, unanimous decision?

Gmac

Quote from: J70 on May 05, 2021, 06:33:58 PM
Quote from: Gmac on May 05, 2021, 06:08:41 PM
Quote from: RadioGAAGAA on May 05, 2021, 07:06:40 AM
Quote from: Gmac on May 05, 2021, 12:24:54 AMybut this guys admission means chauvin didn't get a fair trial

(i) Do you think it affected the result?
(ii) Do you think the result was the wrong one?
yes and that's irrelevant

Why do you think it affected the result in what was a very swift, unanimous decision?
the jury was compromised by the juror who lied therefore the decision is compromised.