The US policing crisis thread

[foxcommander]

First day on the job as well. No comment from Al or Jesse as yet.

http://www.nydailynews.com/news/national/rookie-killed-day-job-virginia-shooting-article-1.2546227

Very tragic. Poor girl.

4 words from you on the subject. Is that it?
You'd have more to say if it was a drug dealer shot by a cop. We'd be hearing the #'s bleating away.

Of course, as usual, you have absolutely nothing to support that statement.

Yes I do - the likes of Michael Brown got massive coverage.

If the shooter was the one who got shot I'm sure there would have been a different narrative.
Certain movements would have been non-stop on all media outlets.
The hashtag crew would have been out in force as well as Al and Jesse. Go on - say it ain't so.

Awful news about this young woman, I hope Eamonnica has plenty to say on the subject.

Al was too busy f**king around leading a gaggle of idiots who were upset because no black millionaire was picked for best actor/actress, Jada Pickett Smith threw a hussy fit because her hubby willy did not get the nod to compete for the Oscar, these entitled liberal arsewipes are so arrogant it is staggsubject.Sharpton and Jackson are two haters, they cherry pick their causes, where were they when the child in Chicago got killed or when the coos got killed a month ago, they were nowhere, media whores both.

Of course they cherrypick their incidents. The media only really report on stories when there is a certain slant.
Poor Jada. If you're a shit actor just cause a stink and claim it's racism.
They did the same with the Rooney rule in the NFL. Make allowances for someone not being good enough.

I see that CNN have gone into overdrive calling Trump all sorts of names and basically saying he's clan supporter.
nice.

[foxcommander]

First day on the job as well. No comment from Al or Jesse as yet.

http://www.nydailynews.com/news/national/rookie-killed-day-job-virginia-shooting-article-1.2546227

Very tragic. Poor girl.

4 words from you on the subject. Is that it?
You'd have more to say if it was a drug dealer shot by a cop. We'd be hearing the #'s bleating away.

It was 4 more words of empathy and commiseration than you managed u arsewipe.

I was the one who posted it u dickweed. The likes of you only think it's "tragic" but get outraged when some drug dealer gets plugged and support the lootings and riotings that follow.

[J70]

First day on the job as well. No comment from Al or Jesse as yet.

http://www.nydailynews.com/news/national/rookie-killed-day-job-virginia-shooting-article-1.2546227

Very tragic. Poor girl.

4 words from you on the subject. Is that it?
You'd have more to say if it was a drug dealer shot by a cop. We'd be hearing the #'s bleating away.

It was 4 more words of empathy and commiseration than you managed u arsewipe.

I was the one who posted it u dickweed. The likes of you only think it's "tragic" but get outraged when some drug dealer gets plugged and support the lootings and riotings that follow.

I'm the first one who responded that it was "tragic", which you apparently find unsatisfactory.

So I ask, once again, for the second time, how should I have responded?

[Eamonnca1]

I'm the first one who responded that it was "tragic", which you apparently find unsatisfactory.

So I ask, once again, for the second time, how should I have responded?

Sack cloth and ashes.

[Keyser soze]

First day on the job as well. No comment from Al or Jesse as yet.

http://www.nydailynews.com/news/national/rookie-killed-day-job-virginia-shooting-article-1.2546227

Very tragic. Poor girl.

4 words from you on the subject. Is that it?
You'd have more to say if it was a drug dealer shot by a cop. We'd be hearing the #'s bleating away.

It was 4 more words of empathy and commiseration than you managed u arsewipe.

I was the one who posted it u dickweed. The likes of you only think it's "tragic" but get outraged when some drug dealer gets plugged and support the lootings and riotings that follow.

I know you posted it.. Without a single word of commiseration or sorrow. You are happy to use this young lady's death to score points on a discussion board when you quite obviously could not give a shit avbout the human tragedy that was her death. A disgusting thing to do, but clearly a defensible position for you.

[muppet]

http://www.bbc.com/news/world-us-canada-36041990

Chicago police plagued by racism, says official report

A task force, set up after a public outcry over police shootings, said some officers had "no regard for the sanctity of life when it comes to people of colour".
It said the department had alienated blacks and Hispanics by using excessive force and honouring a code of silence.
The report asks for more than 100 sweeping changes.
The panel found that 74% of the hundreds of people shot by officers in recent years were African-Americans even though blacks account for only 33% of the city's population.

[AZOffaly]

Stats like that, taken out of context, are misleading though. What is the percentage of crime committed by blacks? In other words what percentage of the criminal population are black. In areas like Chicago, the proportion is quite high, due to the ghettoisation of large American Cities.

I'm not defending racist police, they are a scourge and a cancer, hence the Black Lives Matter campaigns, but the likelihood of being shot by police goes up if you are involved in criminal behaviour, and if, in that city, a lot of criminal activity is perpetuated by minorities, then saying something like 74% of those shot by police are black, even though they only make up 33% of the population, is deliberately slanted.

This part of the story is almost added as a footnote

"Figures released last month showed Chicago's murder rate had risen 84% in the first months of 2016 compared with last year.
The city saw 575 shootings and 125 murders up to 20 March compared to 290 shootings and 68 murders in the same period of 2015."

I wonder what the demographics on those shootings are?

[muppet]

Stats like that, taken out of context, are misleading though. What is the percentage of crime committed by blacks? In other words what percentage of the criminal population are black. In areas like Chicago, the proportion is quite high, due to the ghettoisation of large American Cities.

I'm not defending racist police, they are a scourge and a cancer, hence the Black Lives Matter campaigns, but the likelihood of being shot by police goes up if you are involved in criminal behaviour, and if, in that city, a lot of criminal activity is perpetuated by minorities, then saying something like 74% of those shot by police are black, even though they only make up 33% of the population, is deliberately slanted.

This part of the story is almost added as a footnote

"Figures released last month showed Chicago's murder rate had risen 84% in the first months of 2016 compared with last year.
The city saw 575 shootings and 125 murders up to 20 March compared to 290 shootings and 68 murders in the same period of 2015."

I wonder what the demographics on those shootings are?

That findings are more important than cold stats. The findings of 'excessive force' and 'code of silence' is particularly damning. If you are going to shoot criminals, fine by me, just make sure you don't only shoot the black ones.

[AZOffaly]

Absolutely, I'm glad this report was issued, and I'm glad they've found stuff that needs to change.

As regards don't only shoot the black ones, this is where the stats come in. Let's say 75% of violent crime is committed by black criminals. Would the shooting figures then be ok? I'm not saying I defend any p***k of a racist police officer, but I'm saying the stat is meaningless without context.

[muppet]

Absolutely, I'm glad this report was issued, and I'm glad they've found stuff that needs to change.

As regards don't only shoot the black ones, this is where the stats come in. Let's say 75% of violent crime is committed by black criminals. Would the shooting figures then be ok? I'm not saying I defend any p***k of a racist police officer, but I'm saying the stat is meaningless without context.

But that is simply more cold stats. If you find that officers are racist (this can apply to a black cop shooting a white man) in their decision making when it comes to pulling the trigger, then there is still a problem. I have no problem with a cop shooting a violent criminal, but that has to be the reason, not his skin colour.

[AZOffaly]

Jaysus, I'm agreeing with you. I'm saying the only issue I have with that report is that it throws out a stat like that without any context. As you said, the meat of the report is the same, but that stat makes it sound as if there's equal percentages of criminal behaviour, and the cops are only shooting the black ones. Without 'cold stats' to contextualise those percentages, the figures quoted are valueless.

I support the official report, I just don't like the media trying to gild the lily.

[muppet]

Jaysus, I'm agreeing with you. I'm saying the only issue I have with that report is that it throws out a stat like that without any context. As you said, the meat of the report is the same, but that stat makes it sound as if there's equal percentages of criminal behaviour, and the cops are only shooting the black ones. Without 'cold stats' to contextualise those percentages, the figures quoted are valueless.

I support the official report, I just don't like the media trying to gild the lily.

I agree that the media have a lot to answer for in these cases. The US media is even worse than our own.

I don't know if the full report itself is publicly available, but the Executive Summary makes for very interesting reading: https://assets.documentcloud.org/documents/2801130/Chicago-Police-Accountability-Task-Force-Report.pdf

It goes through the facts of the Laquan McDonald shooting and shows up the CPD in a very bad light. IMHO that is what the media should be focussing on.

[Eamonnca1]

More of that "protect and serve" stuff going around. Innocent kid gets pulled over and tazed into a coma because his license plate was mistakenly identified, ends up with permanent brain damage. The cowardly pig that did this wouldn't be so brave in a boxing ring, methinks:

https://www.facebook.com/NowThisNews/videos/1080103675413089/?pnref=story

[foxcommander]

Stats like that, taken out of context, are misleading though. What is the percentage of crime committed by blacks? In other words what percentage of the criminal population are black. In areas like Chicago, the proportion is quite high, due to the ghettoisation of large American Cities.

I'm not defending racist police, they are a scourge and a cancer, hence the Black Lives Matter campaigns, but the likelihood of being shot by police goes up if you are involved in criminal behaviour, and if, in that city, a lot of criminal activity is perpetuated by minorities, then saying something like 74% of those shot by police are black, even though they only make up 33% of the population, is deliberately slanted.

This part of the story is almost added as a footnote

"Figures released last month showed Chicago's murder rate had risen 84% in the first months of 2016 compared with last year.
The city saw 575 shootings and 125 murders up to 20 March compared to 290 shootings and 68 murders in the same period of 2015."

I wonder what the demographics on those shootings are?

The only site you need for Chicago crime

http://heyjackass.com/

[seafoid]

http://www.nybooks.com/daily/2016/07/08/after-dallas-police-shooting-violence-begets-violence/
After Dallas

David Cole   


The images that saturated social media over the last few days all should have borne warnings of their graphic content. The first depicted a police officer in Louisiana repeatedly shooting Alton Sterling, a thirty-seven-year-old black man, at point-blank range while he was pinned to the ground. That was Tuesday. The next day, an extraordinary ten-minute video showed Philandro Castile, a thirty-two-year-old black resident of Minnesota, bleeding to death in the front seat of his car after being shot by an officer in a Minneapolis suburb, again at point-blank range, during what should have been a routine stop for a burned-out taillight. In the video, Castile's girlfriend and her four-year-old daughter look on, helpless, as the police do nothing to aid Castile. The third video, from Thursday night, showed police officers and a crowd of peaceful protesters in Dallas running for cover from a sniper who shot twelve police officers and two civilians, killing five of the officers, in a mass shooting inspired by police abuse. 

"Violence begets violence," Dr. Martin Luther King, Jr., warned, echoing the Biblical injunction that those who live by the sword die by the sword. Rarely has the adage been more sadly apt. According to Dallas police chief David Brown, the Dallas gunman, Micah Xavier Johnson, said he was angered by the police shootings and wanted to kill "white people, especially white officers."

There was no link between those peacefully protesting the week's police shootings in Dallas and Mr. Johnson's hate crime, nor, of course, between the officers who shot Mr. Sterling and Mr. Castile and those who died serving as peace officers. But the connections between the three shootings nonetheless have deep roots in the American soil. As a culture we have too often chosen to address our problems with violence, even as we continue to make guns widely available so that citizens can do the same. We reflexively resort to force to address foreign policy challenges, whether in Iraq, Yemen, Somalia, Pakistan, Nicaragua, El Salvador, or Grenada. We spend more on our military budget than the next seven largest militaries in the world combined. And we declare endless "wars" on crime, drugs, terror, or the latest disease.

Our Constitution was predicated on socially sanctioned violence, in particular the force that was necessary to relegate about 500,000 of our fellow countrymen and women to slavery. It took a civil war to eradicate that sin. An entrenched system of state and private terror enforced Jim Crow segregation for decades thereafter.

The founding commitment to force is also reflected in the Second Amendment—whether it is viewed as preserving a prerogative of states to field militias or, as the Supreme Court has declared, an individual right to bear arms. As I wrote recently in The New York Review, Americans own about 300 million guns, or 88 for every 100 people, more guns per capita than any other nation. Each year, more than 30,000 Americans die by gunfire. Our gun murder rate is about thirty times that of the United Kingdom, which has strict gun laws, and where the vast majority of the police do not carry firearms. So far this year, according to The Washington Post, more than five hundred people have been killed in police shootings. Both of the men shot by police this week were carrying guns.

But in this instance, it is the "war" on crime itself that is most to blame. More than any other nation in the world, we turn to the state-sanctioned compulsion of the criminal justice system to "solve" social problems, including mental illness, drug addiction, poverty, homelessness, and lack of opportunity. Our "first responders" are too often the police, bearing handcuffs and guns rather than public assistance or life support. We arrest and incarcerate our fellow citizens at the highest per capita rate in the world. And those targeted are disproportionately black and Hispanic men living in poverty-stricken inner-city neighborhoods. We can't seem to find the resources to invest in those neighborhoods to support adequate schools, job training programs, after-care for children let out of school before their parents come home, or economic development. But we are more than willing to pay enormous sums for more police to patrol the neighborhoods and prisons to house inmates taken from these communities. Our prisons in turn are ruled by violence and the threat thereof, from both guards and fellow inmates.

This state violence breeds private violence. As black and Hispanic citizens lose their trust in the fairness of the criminal justice system, the system breaks down. Yale Law School professor Tom Tyler has shown that a healthy society relies heavily on the perceived legitimacy of its laws for compliance and enforcement. When citizens lose faith in the legitimacy of the system, they are less invested in adhering to its dictates and cooperating in its enforcement. That, in turn, too often leads the police, denied the soft power of legitimacy, to resort to violence. And as Jill Leovy powerfully demonstrated in Ghettoside, once the law loses legitimacy in a region, gangs also step in.

We have seen violence erupt in response to police abuse before. In the 1960s, police encounters sparked uprisings in cities across the country, laying waste to what few resources those living in the inner city had. After the 1992 acquittal of the police officers who beat Rodney King in Los Angeles, similar unrest broke out there. This time, though, the protests have been overwhelmingly peaceful, even as the acts they are protesting are anything but. And Mr. Johnson's sniper attack bears more resemblance to the Orlando and San Bernardino mass shootings than to the spontaneous community uprisings of the past.

There are important differences, to be sure, between military invasions, drone strikes, police shootings, gang executions, violent popular uprisings, terrorist acts, and sniper attacks. But what all of these incidents share is the precipitous, unjustified, and ultimately corrosive resort to violence. If we are to escape the cycle of retribution, we need to follow Dr. King's lead and pursue a path of nonviolence. This is true not only of the protesters, to whom King's remarks were addressed, but, even more critically, of the government—and of all of us. As Americans we have been far too complacent in the face of state-sanctioned violence. As long as the guns are pointed at others, we turn our heads and look away. But until we begin to demand alternatives to state violence, the killing will not cease.

July 8, 2016, 11:27 pm