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Messages - APM

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1
GAA Discussion / Re: Rory Beggan
« on: August 02, 2021, 06:52:26 PM »
Beggan gives all to his county, and some keyboard know alls fee they can push a button and let him know that he was to blame for costing his county an Anglo Celt. Shocking case of cyber media at its worst!

Agreed! I watched the two games over the weekend.  I have already commented on the borefest that was Dublin v Kildare.

Monaghan Tyrone was an exciting game and the contribution Beggan made to it was immense.  He is a serious footballer and he plays like a sevens goalie. No-one mentions the ground he made up in catching Donnelly.  Beggan outran one of his own men to make that tackle. 
I think one of his points was on the '65. These are not scores that most teams can count on getting. 

His kickouts malfunctioned in the first half, but his outfielders have to take their share of the blame for that also.   

2
GAA Discussion / Re: Would you be in favour of a second tier?
« on: August 02, 2021, 05:29:14 PM »
Over the long run, there aren't as many tiers in football as there is in hurling. 

I would say you could get away with two. 

Consider over the last 20 years, there have been many times where typical division 3/4 teams have contested the latter stages of the championship or division 1 /2 in the league, or beaten typical mid- or top tier opposition.

It's becoming rarer, but off the top of my head:
Fermanagh 2004 AI Semi, Ulster Final 2018 - beat Armagh & Monaghan
Tipperary - All Ireland Semi - 2016
Wexford - All Ireland Semi - 2008, League Final - 2005, beat Galway in 2010
Wicklow - knocked Cavan, Down and Fermanagh out of the qualifiers in 2008
Carlow, beat Kildare 2018
Antrim, beat Donegal and Cavan to make an Ulster Final
Sligo have played in AIQFs and won Connacht
Limerick were respectable in the Munster Championship for much of the noughties

The point I'm making is that, for all of those teams, a Tier 2 competition could actually provide a spring board for success for a few years in the top tier. 

This will never happen in hurling, because while an Armagh, Tyrone or Mayo may win the Rackard Cup, they are unlikely to progress on and win a Ring Cup and get promoted to the Joe McDonagh or Liam McCarthy.  Even if they do, there isn't the interest or structures long term to sustain a long term progression, because the gap is so wide and the skills development from a young age is so critical. 

Football is different and some of these counties would have serious support (Sligo, Wexford etc).  If Dublin are to come back into the pack, it is possible to see a two tier competition work extremely well.

There are still plenty of instances of Division Three and four teams beating Division Two teams. There are zero instances of shock defeats for the established counties at the top of the pecking order - Kerry, Dublin, Tyrone, Mayo, Donegal. Monaghan seem to be the only team that are able to trouble those elite powers, but can also be vulnerable to sucker punches from weaker opposition themselves.

Take away 2020, when no team was prepared properly, and basically the only teams that beat that elite group are each other. There's your tier one, and everyone else is tier two. There's a greater chance of a bad Division four team like Sligo or Carlow beating a top ten side like Roscommon or Meath than there is of that top ten team turning over Kerry or Dublin.

Anything that happened prior to 2010 is irrelevant. Since we changed the leagues from 1a/1b/2a/2b to 1/2/3/4, the strong got stronger and the weaker fell away. Before that change (allowing a couple of years for the effects to bake in) is a different world.

I think that's spot on actually. 

Changing the leagues from 1a/1b etc, probably seemed like a logical thing to do at the time. 
Ironically, it was probably good for the league as a competition, but ultimately as you say, it was bad for overall competition

I would previously have explained the progress of Sligo, Wexford, Fermanagh etc in the 00s by the qualifier system.  I'd say there is a very strong case for it being the league structure. Because for a good 10 year period, you had the top 16 teams playing against each other. 

Am I right in saying that the big downside was that promotion was between 1b and 2b and between 1a and 2a it was a case of never the twain shall meet for teams that were in league division A and those in league division B.

3
GAA Discussion / Re: Would you be in favour of a second tier?
« on: August 02, 2021, 02:26:30 PM »
Over the long run, there aren't as many tiers in football as there is in hurling. 

I would say you could get away with two. 

Consider over the last 20 years, there have been many times where typical division 3/4 teams have contested the latter stages of the championship or division 1 /2 in the league, or beaten typical mid- or top tier opposition.

It's becoming rarer, but off the top of my head:
Fermanagh 2004 AI Semi, Ulster Final 2018 - beat Armagh & Monaghan
Tipperary - All Ireland Semi - 2016
Wexford - All Ireland Semi - 2008, League Final - 2005, beat Galway in 2010
Wicklow - knocked Cavan, Down and Fermanagh out of the qualifiers in 2008
Carlow, beat Kildare 2018
Antrim, beat Donegal and Cavan to make an Ulster Final
Sligo have played in AIQFs and won Connacht
Limerick were respectable in the Munster Championship for much of the noughties

The point I'm making is that, for all of those teams, a Tier 2 competition could actually provide a spring board for success for a few years in the top tier. 

This will never happen in hurling, because while an Armagh, Tyrone or Mayo may win the Rackard Cup, they are unlikely to progress on and win a Ring Cup and get promoted to the Joe McDonagh or Liam McCarthy.  Even if they do, there isn't the interest or structures long term to sustain a long term progression, because the gap is so wide and the skills development from a young age is so critical. 

Football is different and some of these counties would have serious support (Sligo, Wexford etc).  If Dublin are to come back into the pack, it is possible to see a two tier competition work extremely well. 

4
GAA Discussion / Re: Leinster Senior Football Championship 2021
« on: August 01, 2021, 07:22:19 PM »
Boring and unwatchable.


I don't give a shite about the Dub's process.  That crap is unwatchable and frustrating for any viewer - surely even for the Dubs.  Passing the ball about between them, between midfield and the oppositions 21 is not worth watching.  They get away with it because of their fitness, but also because of the fear of the opposition who will rarely do what Flynn did and show bravery and conviction and tear into them.  Only Mayo and Kerry have done it in recent years at a team level.

People talk about Ciaran Kilkenny.  For the same reason people admire him, I find him to personify the entire Dublin approach.  Take no risks; solo on the spot and always give the 100% pass.  Boring, boring crap.

The media fawning over them for the last 10 years has been excruciating. They get too much respect from everyone; referees, other players, media, commenators, pundits!! These boring f**ckers have emasculated the rest of Leinster.  Mayo or Kerry urgently need to beat them.

You do realise the reason Dublin were boring and unwatchable today was because Kildare dropped 14 men back into their own half. They didnít press up on Dublin, even when Flynn got the goal after the water break to cut it back to a five point deficit.

Kildare didnít come into this one hoping for a win, just damage limitation and not wanting to put a sour note on a successful campaign. Completely understandable but you canít blame Dublin for playing keep ball and baiting Kildare to come out and tackle them.


I do - they have been emasculated. They stood off them and showed them too much respect. 
My problem is not just with Dublin, its that teams don't take the fight to them. 
It is the antithesis of competition.
They are boring and the opposition increasingly tends to be gutless.

I had thought about getting into a conversation about financial fair play as part of that, but that's for another day.

I should add,
I know my original post was somewhat irrational, but that surely is most long term GAA followers' gut reaction to watching the last 25 minutes of that game.  Anger, frustration, sickened that the game has come to this. 

5
GAA Discussion / Re: Leinster Senior Football Championship 2021
« on: August 01, 2021, 06:20:32 PM »
Boring and unwatchable.


I don't give a shite about the Dub's process.  That crap is unwatchable and frustrating for any viewer - surely even for the Dubs.  Passing the ball about between them, between midfield and the oppositions 21 is not worth watching.  They get away with it because of their fitness, but also because of the fear of the opposition who will rarely do what Flynn did and show bravery and conviction and tear into them.  Only Mayo and Kerry have done it in recent years at a team level.

People talk about Ciaran Kilkenny.  For the same reason people admire him, I find him to personify the entire Dublin approach.  Take no risks; solo on the spot and always give the 100% pass.  Boring, boring crap.

The media fawning over them for the last 10 years has been excruciating. They get too much respect from everyone; referees, other players, media, commenators, pundits!! These boring f**ckers have emasculated the rest of Leinster.  Mayo or Kerry urgently need to beat them.

You do realise the reason Dublin were boring and unwatchable today was because Kildare dropped 14 men back into their own half. They didnít press up on Dublin, even when Flynn got the goal after the water break to cut it back to a five point deficit.

Kildare didnít come into this one hoping for a win, just damage limitation and not wanting to put a sour note on a successful campaign. Completely understandable but you canít blame Dublin for playing keep ball and baiting Kildare to come out and tackle them.


I do - they have been emasculated. They stood off them and showed them too much respect. 
My problem is not just with Dublin, its that teams don't take the fight to them. 
It is the antithesis of competition.
They are boring and the opposition increasingly tends to be gutless.

I had thought about getting into a conversation about financial fair play as part of that, but that's for another day. 

6
GAA Discussion / Re: Leinster Senior Football Championship 2021
« on: August 01, 2021, 06:09:42 PM »
Boring and unwatchable.


I don't give a shite about the Dub's process.  That crap is unwatchable and frustrating for any viewer - surely even for the Dubs.  Passing the ball about between them, between midfield and the oppositions 21 is not worth watching.  They get away with it because of their fitness, but also because of the fear of the opposition who will rarely do what Flynn did and show bravery and conviction and tear into them.  Only Mayo and Kerry have done it in recent years at a team level.

People talk about Ciaran Kilkenny.  For the same reason people admire him, I find him to personify the entire Dublin approach.  Take no risks; solo on the spot and always give the 100% pass.  Boring, boring crap.

The media fawning over them for the last 10 years has been excruciating. They get too much respect from everyone; referees, other players, media, commenators, pundits!! These boring f**ckers have emasculated the rest of Leinster.  Mayo or Kerry urgently need to beat them.


7
GAA Discussion / Re: Ulster Championship 2021
« on: July 31, 2021, 03:39:03 PM »
Meyler in ..no sign there were covid cases going by starting line ip

All on the Ivermectin

No burns or canavan

Must be anti-iver

Heard that Dooher had the entire Tyrone team on his farm in Aughabrack a few weeks ago.  Apparently and he ran the entire panel of players up the crush and treated them himself with Ivomec pour-on. 

Supposedly Niall Morgan injured his neck in the crush gate and is doubtful for today. 

One of the players (they wouldn't say who, but my money is on Ronan McNamee) didn't get treated because they leapt over the side of the crush and they couldn't get him back in.  Also, Fergal Logan was in Craigavon hospital with a leg injury; he was capping the players into the yard and when he hit Hampsey a clip with a length of alkathene pipe, Hampsey drew back and kicked him on the shin, almost breaking his leg. 

8
GAA Discussion / Re: Ulster Championship 2021
« on: July 29, 2021, 12:53:06 PM »
Tyrone have beaten a 14-man Donegal and Division 4 Cavan.  Their last game before that was against Kerry who scored 6 goals past them.  Monaghan won't score 4 goals on Sunday but they might get two.  They didn't get any the last time they played Tyrone.

Monaghan were desperately open at the back against Armagh and the same against Donegal in the league, conceding 20 points in each. Tyrone won't be as open as Armagh were and therefore Monaghan cannot be allowing them the chances to waltz up the field and score points under zero pressure.  I think they can play more defensive football if the game demands it.

Tyrone are favourites and the pressure is off Monaghan.  There is something about them this year - a bit of the good, the bad, and the ugly! Some great forward play, scoring goals for fun; pulling games out of the fire; playing poorly and still winning and a bit of gamesmanship / cuteness where its needed.  I think they'll do it.

9
General discussion / Re: China Coronavirus
« on: July 28, 2021, 05:52:55 PM »
you said "this highly infectious disease doesn't effect them" after I pointed out that there was a baby in intensive care FFS.

Your big, beefy, masculine balls must be taking all the blood that's meant to be going to your brain.
you do know a big percentage of people are picking up covid in hospitals.Even the bbc and rte propaganda machines could not deny this.Also Pissy,any mention whether the mother was vaccinated or not as you well know miscarriages are through the roof for vaccinated expectant mothers.

This should result in a permanent ban.
Totally agree. 

We have contributors here talking shite about football and hurling when they haven't the first clue about what they are on about.  But that's fine because its a GAAboard and it isn't life and death. 

However, the moderators SHOULD NOT be allowing this board to be used as a platform for spreading the kind of of crazy lies that are discouraging people from vaccinating themselves against a disease that continues to kill people. 

10
GAA Discussion / Re: Joe Brolly
« on: July 28, 2021, 05:32:42 PM »
Brolly v Oisin  McConville  https://t.co/K5Ra4pfnVZ?amp=1

Listened to that recently.

What an absolute slabber Brolly is. This interview reinforced to me that all Brolly cares about is Brolly. He doesnít want to talk about the game. He just wants to cause controversy so that heís the talking point.

He said Oisinís punditry wasnít memorable. A pundit says their bit, and you move on. Oisin is a very good, level headed pundit but you donít really remember it, because he very rarely causes controversy or doesnít behave like an child. Once the games over, you park it and move onto the next. Nobody remembers any of Brollys punditry, only the childish rants, ignorant behaviour and personal insults. Thatís not something to be remembered for.

An absolute narcissist, who is clearly missing the limelight.

Depends if you want to be entertained or educated.

Oisin will educate you on what is going on, Joe tries to entertain, that's his thing but he's ever more becoming a parody of himself.

The majority of sports TV pundits do neither. McConville is one of the better pundits on TV and one of the few whose opinion I would respect. Brolly is probably the most articulate and entertaining but he is also the most infuriating. He clearly has the capacity and intelligence but his personality trait means that he always has to try to be the star of the show. I would suggest that the only format that suits him at this stage is either a podcast of his own with no other guests or a newspaper column.   

I think that's well put.  He has become a parody of himself in many ways.  I think I heard somewhere that he said having the kidney transplant gave him more confidence.  If there was one man that didn't need more confidence........

He did manage to articulate a reasonably good league and championship format on that programme (https://www.bbc.co.uk/programmes/p09qlgtm), which he explained was only a slight amendment to previous Sean Kelly proposals.  McConville had ideas as well, but didn't articulate them as well.  However, it was well-chaired by Niblock and they brought something useful to the debate. 

I would say some of you won't bother listening to it because it's Brolly.  I'd say a good few more will listen to it, but won't hear anything he says, because you're too busy finding things to get annoyed about.  But it is worth a listen.

11
GAA Discussion / Re: Joe Brolly
« on: July 28, 2021, 11:44:42 AM »
https://www.bbc.co.uk/programmes/p09qlgtm

Listened to this last night.  Great programme.  Small number of speakers, one topic, is a great format. Let's them get under the skin of different themes.  Thomas Niblock a very good presenter and has done some good stuff. They might as well be in the bar.   

BBC's online stuff is very good, but on the flip side, the prominence of the GAA on the BBC is now much lower.  Never carried on FM Radio which is complete bollix if you are somewhere with no internet connection.  Yet they continue to dedicate Saturdays to the Irish League.  I also noticed that there is plenty of GAA on the BBC NI Sport website, but with the exception of the championship games, there was no reporting of it on the BBC NI homepage. 

End to End wasn't really that great was it.  I didn't really like Logan on it and he really didn't seem to like having Frank Mitchell McClory there. The format was pretty awkward. 

12
GAA Discussion / Re: Ulster Championship 2021
« on: July 22, 2021, 03:08:09 PM »
Should tickets not go through the clubs? Club members should get the jump on tickets before the bandwagon support

Many club members don't go near a game all year until there's a final.

There's also plenty of balloons running up and down the country 'supporting' their county, who wouldn't lift a finger to help their local club.

You know the type - young fella always has the most up to date strip, been at every McKenna Cup match since the big snow of 47 but the only players he could name on the club team are the 2 boys playing for the county.

I know who I'd rather give a ticket to.

What about the club members who never go to a county game? Have they any more right to a county ticket than a predominantly county supporter?

I know of lots of people who donít really have much association with their local club, for a number of reasons. A lot of clubs are clannish, two or three families running the show, looking after themselves. Itís hard to feel involved if you werenít a top player or donít come from a local footballing dynasty. Or maybe your kids donít play, so youíre less likely to stay involved.

100%

There are lots of these people and they contribute in their own way to the association and games.  Moreover, not everyone continually contributes to a club.  Some might make a big effort for a few years and then fall back for a while.   

13
GAA Discussion / Re: Ulster Championship 2021
« on: July 18, 2021, 10:33:00 PM »
No thread for the Armagh Monaghan match, so posting here. 

Disappointed that Armagh lost the game, but felt that the supporters on both sides that were at the game were treated to a fantastic spectacle and superb atmosphere. It was literally thrilling.  The quality of the football (not the defending), some of the fielding (Rian O'Neill in particular) and the scoring.  The comeback and Monaghan's cool heads at the death. 

Reminded me of watching football in the 90's with the crowd heavily involved instead of sitting bored in the stands looking at their phones.  Had the kids with me and delighted that they were there to experience it - even though their team lost.  It's matches like this that makes youngsters fall in love with the games. 

Couldn't begrudge Monaghan the win under the tragic circumstances and hope they go on to beat Tyrone  ;D

14
GAA Discussion / Re: Ulster Championship 2021
« on: July 10, 2021, 06:09:13 PM »
Absolutely brainless by McNamee

There was nothing really in it. He was pushed beside the ref and pushed back albeit in the face. If that's a red the game is finished. Mcgough usually is a good ref but has let too many fouls against Tyrone go today.

Don't talk shite.  After Darren Hughes getting sent off for ruffling McCann's hair you would think you would know that you can push a man in the face

15
GAA Discussion / Re: Ulster Championship 2021
« on: July 08, 2021, 03:46:27 PM »
Tyrone will hammer Cavan.  There will be points to prove after the Kerry game. 

There's an aul bully in Tyrone.  They usually annihilate weaker opposition, never content with a 10 point win.  Doesn't matter how bad they are going, they rarely get caught in a dogfight with weaker opposition. 

Long term though, I don't think it will matter.  That Kerry game will have sowed serious seeds of doubt in players' minds and it might just be the case that Harte's system papered over the cracks of a weaker bunch of players. You couldn't envy what Logan and Dooher are attempting to achieve with this team. 

When Micko left Kerry in 1989 after 14 years, they didn't win another all-Ireland till '97.  And they only had one team to beat to make an AI Semi. 
Sean Boylan left Meath after 23 years and they have been in the doldrums ever since, apart from an AI Semi in 2009 I think.  They are consistently underachieving.

They'll beat Cavan handy, but if Logan and Dooher manage to steer Tyrone to a win in Ulster and make a decent tilt at the all-Ireland, they will be really exceeding expectations, particularly with no midfield.
Iíd expect Tyrone to hammer Cavan as well but I definitely wouldnít put any money at all on Cavan getting beat. We saw last year what theyíre capable of and theyíll be determined their summer wonít end with relegation to D4 and getting tanked in Ulster, theyíll have as big a point to prove as Tyrone.

Would love it if Cavan proved me wrong, it was pure joy watching that win last year. But they got beaten by Wicklow last time they played.

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