Messages

The Gaa will reap what they sow with GAAGO, a clamour for money from the trough from the GPA. It will also do for the GAA what moving to Racing TV has done for horse racing in Ireland- absolutely f**k all.

I've bought 2 GAAGO matches so far and it really does bug me, especially as someone who went back to a Sky sub largely for the GAA.

Boxing was  the same. Loved the  big fights in the   late 80s/early 90s, Eubank Benn etc.  Some great bouts. Since  most matches went to sky , I have no idea  who  any fighters are (except maybe frampton),  and have  now no interest whatsoever in it.

Gaago will go the  same way. We need  kids looking up to gaa players and   Seeing  them as much as possible on tv.

I grew up in an era where I saw Tyrone games on TV maybe 2 or max 3 times a year, and only then if you got to the latter stages of the championship. Still knew every player,  their club etc. And this was before any Internet.

The greedy people are the ones demanding everything for free all of the time.

I agree, there's a level of entitlement to access everything for free these days - banking, online newspapers, sports events, people giving out about having to pay for them.
I remember when there were only 3 gaelic football games on TV back in 1990 and before - two semis and final.
If you wanted to watch a game you watched it in person, otherwise you listened to it on the radio and watched the Sunday Game. Now snowflakes young and old, expect to just be an armchair fan and see every game for free.

I should think the final games in each Group will have to start at the same time.

Going by Super 8s, yes.
Although different groups can be on different days so some teams may wish to finish 3rd rather than 2nd when they see the final positions in other groups.

to do it fair, all finalgames should really be played at the same time although not sure if that is logistically possible

I think 2 double headers in Croke Park and then 4 other games at various locations picked based on size and proximity.
E.g.
Round 3 (Neutral venues)

June 17 - 18

Group 1
Kerry v Louth (Croke Park)
Mayo v Cork  (Limerick)

Group 2
Galway v Ulster runner-up (Armagh/Derry)  (Breffni Park)
Tyrone v Westmeath  (Croke Park)

Group 3
Dublin v Sligo (Clones)
Roscommon v Kildare (Croke Park)

Group 4
Ulster winner (Armagh/Derry) v Clare (Pearse Stadium)
Monaghan v Donegal (Breffni Park)

Full fixture details will be confirmed by the CCCC on Friday, May 5th.

I should think the final games in each Group will have to start at the same time.

Going by Super 8s, yes.
Although different groups can be on different days so some teams may wish to finish 3rd rather than 2nd when they see the final positions in other groups.

I think Minor should change to u18 and keep u20 as is.
A lot of players are lost from gaelic football between u17 and u20 (as was the case between u18 and u21) and a lot of that was because of it being a 3 year age group, it's very hard to make the team, especially for the youngest age (18 year olds). At intercounty level there's only 2 or 3 18 year olds per u20 team.
Making it u18 and u20, means a 2 year age group, meaning 19 year olds are the youngest age, only 1 year younger than the older lads and a much greater chance of making the team/squad.

The GAA trying to convince people that the idea of 3 qualifying from groups was to avoid dead rubbers when in reality it's for financial reasons especially with the 4 preliminary 1/4s.
I don't see how dead rubbers will definitely be avoided.

In Kerry's group, if the winner of Kerry-Mayo beats the winner of Louth-Cork in the 2nd game, with the loser of Louth-Cork also losing their 2nd game, then won't the final game between the team with 2 wins v the team with 2 losses be a dead rubber?
And the other game will essentially be a dead rubber, 2nd and 3rd will be decided, just which order.

In your scenario, going into the last match the table could be:
Mayo -4
Kerry -2
Louth - 2
Cork -0
Last match is Kerry V louth and Mayo V cork

In that scenario, if cork and louth won their last matches, Louth could get top, Mayo second and Cork could get third with kerry finishing bottom.

That's unlikely, but they aren't dead rubbers.

Also, there is a benefit to fiishing 2nd over 3rd as you will (in theory) get an easier preliminary quarter final.

In that scenario Mayo v Cork is a dead rubber. Mayo have secured top on head to head results v Kerry & Louth. Cork are bottom due to head to head results v Kerry & Louth.
Kerry and Louth are already thro' to the preliminary 1/4s, just deciding who's 2nd and who's 3rd, so essentially a dead rubber,in fact in some cases finishing 3rd may be preferred.

Apologies

You are correct in that scenario.

Well presuming tiebreakers are based on head-to-head, which I've assumed but haven't actual seen any where.
Head-to-head isn't fair imo for a group of mixed seeds where there's a mix of home, away and neutral games.
It's fine in the league as you've the 8 best teams so it balances out.
If Kerry beat Mayo but end up level on points, it seems unfair that Kerry would finish ahead based on head-to-head after having home advantage in that head-to-head. I think if two teams end up level on points, and one had home advantage (and won) head-to-head shouldn't count.

Depending on the group and your ambitions the way their home/away/neutral fixtures are fixed can give a big advantage.
For Kerry, they've the ideal situation, the one tough opponent at home and then the two easier opponents either at neutral venue or away.
Other teams who's ambition is to just win one game and finish 3rd, will want their easiest opponent at home and happy to write off 2 games against big guns and play them away or neutral.

The GAA trying to convince people that the idea of 3 qualifying from groups was to avoid dead rubbers when in reality it's for financial reasons especially with the 4 preliminary 1/4s.
I don't see how dead rubbers will definitely be avoided.

In Kerry's group, if the winner of Kerry-Mayo beats the winner of Louth-Cork in the 2nd game, with the loser of Louth-Cork also losing their 2nd game, then won't the final game between the team with 2 wins v the team with 2 losses be a dead rubber?
And the other game will essentially be a dead rubber, 2nd and 3rd will be decided, just which order.

Only the  GAA  could come up with preliminary quarter finals, complete nonsense, makes group stage less  appealing. One team knocked out ffs!  Same silly nonsense in Hurling as well.

I was thinking they should introduce a preliminary semifinal as well!

Seeing we're about to have preliminary 1/4 finals and we've already has preliminary finals (a.k.a. 'Home finals'), all that's missing is preliminary semifinals.

We shouldn't say things like this, even in jest, as someone surely will think its a great idea and it'll be before congress next season.

It might just occur naturally in conversation.
A: "Have you been to any Armagh game this year?"
B: "Yeah, I was at the quarter-final"
A: "Which 1/4 final? The preliminary one?"
B: "No, the other 1/4 final. The preliminary semi-final."

The GAA trying to convince people that the idea of 3 qualifying from groups was to avoid dead rubbers when in reality it's for financial reasons especially with the 4 preliminary 1/4s.
I don't see how dead rubbers will definitely be avoided.

In Kerry's group, if the winner of Kerry-Mayo beats the winner of Louth-Cork in the 2nd game, with the loser of Louth-Cork also losing their 2nd game, then won't the final game between the team with 2 wins v the team with 2 losses be a dead rubber?
And the other game will essentially be a dead rubber, 2nd and 3rd will be decided, just which order.

Only the  GAA  could come up with preliminary quarter finals, complete nonsense, makes group stage less  appealing. One team knocked out ffs!  Same silly nonsense in Hurling as well.

I was thinking they should introduce a preliminary semifinal as well!

Seeing we're about to have preliminary 1/4 finals and we've already had preliminary finals (a.k.a. 'Home finals'), all that's missing is preliminary semifinals.

The GAA trying to convince people that the idea of 3 qualifying from groups was to avoid dead rubbers when in reality it's for financial reasons especially with the 4 preliminary 1/4s.
I don't see how dead rubbers will definitely be avoided.

In Kerry's group, if the winner of Kerry-Mayo beats the winner of Louth-Cork in the 2nd game, with the loser of Louth-Cork also losing their 2nd game, then won't the final game between the team with 2 wins v the team with 2 losses be a dead rubber?
And the other game will essentially be a dead rubber, 2nd and 3rd will be decided, just which order.

In your scenario, going into the last match the table could be:
Mayo -4
Kerry -2
Louth - 2
Cork -0
Last match is Kerry V louth and Mayo V cork

In that scenario, if cork and louth won their last matches, Louth could get top, Mayo second and Cork could get third with kerry finishing bottom.

That's unlikely, but they aren't dead rubbers.

Also, there is a benefit to fiishing 2nd over 3rd as you will (in theory) get an easier preliminary quarter final.

In that scenario Mayo v Cork is a dead rubber. Mayo have secured top on head to head results v Kerry & Louth. Cork are bottom due to head to head results v Kerry & Louth.
Kerry and Louth are already thro' to the preliminary 1/4s, just deciding who's 2nd and who's 3rd, so essentially a dead rubber,in fact in some cases finishing 3rd may be preferred.

The GAA trying to convince people that the idea of 3 qualifying from groups was to avoid dead rubbers when in reality it's for financial reasons especially with the 4 preliminary 1/4s.
I don't see how dead rubbers will definitely be avoided.

In Kerry's group, if the winner of Kerry-Mayo beats the winner of Louth-Cork in the 2nd game, with the loser of Louth-Cork also losing their 2nd game, then won't the final game between the team with 2 wins v the team with 2 losses be a dead rubber?
And the other game will essentially be a dead rubber, 2nd and 3rd will be decided, just which order.

With the draw so early it leaves teams with options of throwing games. Not saying it would happen but it is potentially now in Kerry's interest to lose the Munster Final and finish up in a group with Monaghan and Donegal and leave Mayo for a rattle later in the year.

I don't get the rush with everything from draws to games on top of each other.

Not sure about that. As BcB pointed out above re a handy draw on paper for the Dubs not actually being a good thing.
I think Kerry will be happy to play Mayo in an important game in the round robin. Both teams will want to win to top the group, but it's a free hit and win, lose or draw, they will learn loads, and they'll be guaranteed to avoid each other in the quarter-finals.

Besides the preposterousity of Kerry throwing a Munster Final...

Kerry would much prefer an away game in Cork instead of in Donegal (especially since it'll give Kerry their opportunity of a first away win since last year's All-Ireland semi-final).
And would prefer their 1/4 final with Donegal or Monaghan as potential opponents than v Mayo.

On the negative side, Kerry have a serious threat to their unbeaten home record since 1995 by playing Mayo.

Dublin/Sligo is the likeliest fixture and should be played at a NEUTRAL venue in a NEUTRAL location.
Breffni Park the obvious choice.
If the GAA decide on Croke Park they should be boycotted!

Dublin will probably end up with 2 home games and 1 neutral in the round robin. Some joke.

Not hugely exciting for the neutral I doubt Clare Sligo or Westmeath win a match and Cork and Louth will play off for 3rd.

Group 4 in particular with the Ulster teams you know those games won't be hugely exciting.

I fancy Clare to beat Donegal

(1/2) Kerry 7/4 7/4
(1/2) Dublin 5/2 9/4
(1/2) Galway 11/2 13/2
(3) Mayo 7/1 7/1
(1/2) Derry 12/1 11/1
(3) Tyrone 16/1 18/1
(1/2) Armagh 20/1 22/1
(3) Roscommon 50/1 40/1
(3) Monaghan 66/1 50/1
(4) Cork 80/1 100/1
(4) Kildare 80/1 80/1
(4) Donegal 150/1 150/1
(1/2) Louth 200/1 200/1
(1/2) Clare 300/1 250/1
(4) Westmeath 500/1 500/1
(1/2) Sligo 1000/1 500/1

Odds to win pre and post draw.
Teams whose odds shortened got a good draw. Dublin/Derry/Roscommon/Monaghan/Clare/Sligo
Teams whose odds lengthened got a bad draw. Galway/Armagh/Tyrone/Cork

I wouldn't have seen the draw as good for Dublin.
Group might be easy, which they were always going to qualify from anyway, but it means the team they face in the quarters likely to be difficult as they can't face someone from their own group.
Most likely to get one from Mayo/Kerry, Tyrone/Galway, Armagh/Derry.

1/4 final predictions:

Kerry v Roscommon
Galway v Monaghan
Dublin  v Tyrone
Mayo v Derry

The Sligo and Kerry odds are almost totally based on history and reputation.
If the entire squads were swapped, the odds wouldn't differ.