Joe Brolly

[macdanger2]

you reduce the game to 13 a side it is not Gaelic Football anymore in my view.

So reducing the numbers on a team means it's not Gaelic Football?? Does that mean any All Ireland's played before 1913 (?) belong to a different sport??

But changing the rules so that every team has to "re-set" for a kickout is still Gaelic Football??

You must be on the wind but here's the amended roll of honour (as an aside, gaa.ie roll of honour hasn't been updated since 2011  ) anyway having removed All Irelands played in different sports - Limerick in particular will be raging:

Kerry (34) - 1913, 1914, 1924, 1926, 1929, 1930, 1931, 1932, 1937, 1939, 1940, 1941, 1946, 1953, 1955, 1959, 1962, 1969, 1970, 1975, 1978, 1979, 1980, 1981, 1984, 1985, 1986, 1997, 2000, 2004, 2006, 2007, 2009, 2014
Dublin (13) - 1921, 1922, 1923, 1942, 1958, 1963, 1974, 1976, 1977, 1983, 1995, 2011, 2013
Galway (9) - 1925, 1934, 1938, 1956, 1964, 1965, 1966, 1998, 2001.
Meath (7) - 1949, 1954, 1967, 1987, 1988, 1996, 1999.
Cork (5) - 1945, 1973, 1989, 1990, 2010.
Down (5) - 1960, 1961, 1968, 1991, 1994.
Cavan (5) - 1933, 1935, 1947, 1948, 1952.
Wexford (4) -  1915, 1916, 1917, 1918.
Tyrone (3) - 2003, 2005, 2008.
Offaly (3) - 1971, 1972, 1982.
Mayo (3) - 1936, 1950, 1951.
Kildare (3) - 1919, 1927, 1928.
Donegal (2) - 1992, 2012
Roscommon (2) - 1943, 1944.
Armagh (1) - 2002
Derry (1) - 1993
Louth (1) - 1957.
Tipperary (1) - 1920.
Limerick (0) -

[Fear ón Srath Bán]

While Brolly's suggestion may have flaws the only way to see how works is to trial it and it is certainly worth that. We often play 13 a side in Britain and whatever else it does it doesn't make the blanket defence, especially the extreme versions, redundant. I don't think the problems in the game would be much impacted by having 13 behind the ball as opposed to 15. An this would be harder to trial than Brolly's idea as you'd possibly be impacting on the number of people who can play, panel sizes, substitution regulations etc. I'd leave things for now but I'd certainly be open to all suggestions for trial periods to see how we go. The real thing we need to change though is attitudes - view the game more positively and all would be fine. View a football match as a grim choking match to the death and perhaps there is nothing we can do to free the game.

Brolly's barmy folly doesn't just have flaws, it's a total bag of shite, not to put it too mildly!

I'll gladly concede to your greater experience with the 13-a-side, but would it be fair to say that if a team has any realistic designs on scoring then it would render the blanket a less plausible and profitable approach, ie., would it reduce the likelihood of wholesale deployment?

[brokencrossbar1]

Why not make it 14 aside. Each team plays with 5 defenders and 6 forwards and no one is allowed to mark the free forward. That free forward us not allowed outside the 45 at any time during the game and if he gets the ball no one is allowed to tackle him. That would cure it all!!!

[Agent Orange]

Why not make it 14 aside. Each team plays with 5 defenders and 6 forwards and no one is allowed to mark the free forward. That free forward us not allowed outside the 45 at any time during the game and if he gets the ball no one is allowed to tackle him. That would cure it all!!!

You'd be better off making it eleven a side, thus making the pitch considerably smaller, should appeal to the residents around Casement Park. Only allowing the keeper to handle the ball, introducing some sort of rule to stop moochers, could also keep the Casement residents on side, maybe call it the off side rule. Do away with the anthem and repackage it and sell it to Sky. Everyones a winner.

[6th sam]

Why not make it 14 aside. Each team plays with 5 defenders and 6 forwards and no one is allowed to mark the free forward. That free forward us not allowed outside the 45 at any time during the game and if he gets the ball no one is allowed to tackle him. That would cure it all!!!

Fair play bc1!
As a Cross man, I can see why u want to keep it a 15-a-side, to accommodate all incoming transfers from surrounding clubs!
Sorry, couldn't resist it!
Joking aside, there is a real demographic problem for the GAA going forward: smaller families, rural depopulation etc. Clubs like Crossmaglen will always be strong given their tradition and recent phenomenal success, but there will be real problems in smaller less glamourous clubs over the next few years. Probably the GAA's single biggest strength is the fact that you couldn't drive 5 miles almost anywhere in Ireland without hitting a GAA club. There is no doubt that as well providing a sporting and cultural outlet on the doorstep of anyone who wishes to take part, it engenders local tribal rivalry unmatched in any other sport. If that strong local identity is diluted by the folding of clubs, we will lose our biggest asset.
Demographic, social, and recent rule changes are making it increasingly difficult for all but the strongest clubs to compete at 15-a-side at all levels. Within 5 years we will lose a number of small clubs, unless we get serious about protecting and revitalising them

[muppet]

Why not make it 14 aside. Each team plays with 5 defenders and 6 forwards and no one is allowed to mark the free forward. That free forward us not allowed outside the 45 at any time during the game and if he gets the ball no one is allowed to tackle him. That would cure it all!!!

.....or just have no goalies. 

No player from either team allowed inside the large rectangle until the ball is spinning at a minimum of 60 rpm.

[Keyser soze]

Gaelic must be the sport with the highest number of rule changes in the whole sporting world. FFS F1 doesnt have as many changes. There's always a committee or commission or body who are in the process of addressing the playing rules from as far back as I can remember. It's farcical at this stage.

And to cap it all there's a load of hot air balloons on here parrotting a gobshite like Joe Brolly with a barmy idea that he clearly shamelessly plagiarised off someone else, and treating it like the 2nd coming of christ. And all because some crowd of cheeky caaants had the temerity to bate them when they were sposed to win the AI for the next ten years at their leisure.

Would ye ffs just grow up, take your batin with a bit of grace and class and come back harder next year. Which is what Gaelic football is really all about.

[highorlow]

While Brolly's suggestion may have flaws the only way to see how works is to trial it and it is certainly worth that

Joe could do that himself handy enough or at least talk to a man to do it for him.

It could get messy towards the end of game when a team is say 3 or 4 ahead and trying to kill the clock, I can see lots of frees for back pushing been sacrificed by the team ahead and then the scamper back to the blanket. Also late in the game the goalie could just kick the ball over the sideline past the 45 on purpose and then re-set the blanket.

Imagine if this old rule was brought back in today's game.........."The match shall be decided by the greater number of goals. If no goal be kicked, the match shall be deemed a draw. A goal is scored when the ball is kicked through the goalposts under the cross-bar"

[muppet]

Gaelic must be the sport with the highest number of rule changes in the whole sporting world. FFS F1 doesnt have as many changes. There's always a committee or commission or body who are in the process of addressing the playing rules from as far back as I can remember. It's farcical at this stage.

And to cap it all there's a load of hot air balloons on here parrotting a gobshite like Joe Brolly with a barmy idea that he clearly shamelessly plagiarised off someone else, and treating it like the 2nd coming of christ. And all because some crowd of cheeky caaants had the temerity to bate them when they were sposed to win the AI for the next ten years at their leisure.

Would ye ffs just grow up, take your batin with a bit of grace and class and come back harder next year. Which is what Gaelic football is really all about.

While they have been quiet recently, the NBA has to be the leader in rule changes: http://www.nba.com/analysis/rules_history.html

Have to say the more rule changes, the more unintended consequences.

[armaghniac]

Armagh county board have announced a trial of the 13 a side idea, starting with one team and they've nominated Cross. Other teams will remain as 15 for now.

[BennyCake]

Why not make it 14 aside. Each team plays with 5 defenders and 6 forwards and no one is allowed to mark the free forward. That free forward us not allowed outside the 45 at any time during the game and if he gets the ball no one is allowed to tackle him. That would cure it all!!!

I'd go further. Make it 11 a side. 8 less players would make a hell of a difference

[thewobbler]

I've mentioned this on umpteen threads now, but there is a galling, myopic and even dangerous failure among people who have ideas to "improve" football, to recognise that every rule change brings unexpected outcomes.

----

The 13 a side discussion above is the the classic example. Yes communities are dwindling in rural Ireland, but the crux of the problem for clubs not fielding teams is not the number of available bodies, but the number of interested bodies.

Gaelic football is a direct opponent game, and as a result is simply not an enjoyable sport to play unless you're fit, and at most levels, unless you're very fit. Otherwise it's too easy to be exposed, even by limited natural talents.

It requires genuine dedication in terms of time an fitness, at almost every level.

Making the game 13-a-side would only put a greater emphasis again on fitness and speed, which I believe would further discourage mass participation. If you're a middling athlete with a busy life, then soccer or rugby will be much more attractive options to play.

----

Back to outcomes. Probably the single biggest rule change in football came in 1990 when frees could be kicked from hand.

The immediate and medium term result was a much better game - it was quicker and more free flowing.

But the current perceived malaise in our game (a thinking I don't subscribe to) can be traced back to this change.

Prior to 1990 the game was fundamentally one about territory. A general absence of short frees meant that this method of restart inevitably resulted in delivering the ball as far forward as possible.

From 1990 the newfound ability to deliver restarts quickly, sideways and back ways, saw the game slowly evolve into a possession based sport, and the last 4-5 years has seen that concept taken to a new level. There is no need to risk 50:50 possession from a restart; indeed in the majority of cases you'd be insane to do so.

By the way I'm not advocating a return to kicks from the ground. Just pointing out that if our legions of tinkermen want to get to the root of their perceived problem, this is where they should start looking.

For as long as the game encourages the sensible retention of possession, then coaches will encourage players to hold onto the ball and wait for the right opportunity to exploit - and conversely they will accept that there is nothing to be gained from sustained defensive techniques in their opponent's half, as their opponents present no actual danger until they cross the half way line.

[6th sam]

Agree entirely wobbler with most of your points re the unpredicted outcomes of rule changes. The black card , is the most recent example of a knee jerk change that hasn't worked in most people's view. However healthy and reasoned debate on occasional select changes can allow our games to evolve, as long as we don't get endless tinkering.

[Keyser soze]

Here Wobbler, there's absolutely no need to be coming on here making logical points and reasoned arguments. or indulging in a bit of thought before posting.

Im sure there are other forums for that type of thing.

Don't you know the whole game is in a state of chassis!

[SamFever]

Here Wobbler, there's absolutely no need to be coming on here making logical points and reasoned arguments. or indulging in a bit of thought before posting.

Im sure there are other forums for that type of thing.

Don't you know the whole game is in a state of chassis!

Us Down people chat like we play.