Official Cavan GAA Thread

[Mr. Pain]

Cavan didn't even get the moral victory all thought they would. Mr. Pain is not disappointed really as this was to be expected. It would have been a bigger disappointment if the minors had've lost. Mr. Pain is hungover now though and is starting to lose his typing skills. Rant ongoing!

[Hollow Man]

This was Hollow Man's prediction:

I think we will be beaten because of weaknesses at the back.

We conceded 1-19 to Longford in a challenge two weeks ago and I think 2-12 or 2-13 against Cork last Friday night.

I think we'll run up a decent score, maybe 1-12 or more likely 0-15 (seeing as we've only scored two goals all year) but Armagh will probably score more.

The thing is, this is the worst Armagh team for years. They're no great shakes at all but, while home advantage will count for something, we lack either a) the physicality, b) the ball winning ability at the back or c) brains on the sideline to win it.

The jury is out on McDonald at m/f, and while Dunne is a superb 19 year old, it'll be a year or two before he's fit for inter county full back. He'll be Cavan midfielder for years to come when he fills out though.

I wouldn't rule out a draw with Armagh destorying us the second day, but I'll plump for them to do the job first time out.

Prediction: Armagh 2-13 Cavan 0-15

Well, prediction was right (Armagh by four) with both teams scoring exactly two points less than I thought. The amazing thing was that I felt we were well able to compete with Armagh in every section bar midfield.

Johnston was outstanding in the second half, taking the game by the scruff of the neck after a difficult first half. McCabe did quite well too, and at the back, considering the quality ball he was getting, Clarke was curtailed reasonably well by Padraig Reilly.

I felt at half time that Keogan should have taken off Jason and brought Sean Brady on AS A MIDFIELDER to spoil McGrane, thus creating some space for Jelly and McCabe. However, I think Brady was instructed to play as a forward.

Another move I felt he could have made was bringing Martin Reilly back to wing back and taking off Watters, but he left the Drung man on when he wasn't playing well.

In Keogan's defence, we have f**k all options at m/f but surely we have better than Mulvey? And to bring a fella off after he was hopeless, then bring him back on because his replacement was even worse - that is plain embarrassing. I forgot about Gaffney; he must feel he was treated terribly, and rightly so.

Think of the players who have either quit the panel or not been called back - Lyng, Donohoe, Pierson, Chesty, Mickey Brennan (remember him?! At least he would have been fit and given his all, not run around with no boot!), Gaynor, Raymond Galligan, Ciaran Galligan... Some of these lads would have been decent options surely? And what about Cullivan? Is it true he quit because he was pissed off with the manager?

Instead, we were left with a makeshift, cobbled together panel (Eugene Keating listed as a sub? Where did they spring him from? Very promising player, but that just smacks of "make it up as we go along").

The sad thing is we ALMOST have the players. We saw that yesterday. Forde and McCabe played well I thought, and after that almost all of the young players did well enough. McKeever had a stormer on the ball, but he played too deep (as per instructions I'm sure) for a midfielder.

We need a couple of fit, strong and ignorant midfielders and a manager who can motivate and make the big calls.

[cavanmaniac]

Here's what I posted on the match thread, it'll do for here as well:

BUT....Cavan as a team are poor.  They have a number of excellent individual players who on their day will cause any opposition trouble.  They, however, have no discernable game plan or style of play.  It is all very individualistic and opportunistic.  The Cavan defence played reasonable well considering the pressure they were under.  They had no midfield.  the forwards are not a unit and did not seem to know what they were at.

Well observed, opportunistic is the word. The lack of cohesion and pattern on the field is entirely in keeping with the scatter gun, panic-button, try anything/try everything approach of the manager off it. It's basically a whole lot of different parts being slotted and moved hither and yon in the hope some of it sticks and something comes off. Never was this better exemplified than when McCabe was forced to stride 40 yards to bawl Martin Cahill out of it for going for a point instead of dropping the ball into the square, promptly ignored by Cahill who just turned his back and trotted off. We singularly failed to hit McCabe for most of the day, despite a number of other apeals from the big man himself. What was our manager doing on the sideline and in training that this hotch-potch, disparate collection of individuals couldn't be coached to play a team game and hit big Dermot with high ball? Three times in the second half a decent ball went into him, the first he blasted over for a point and on the other two occasions the ball broke to Johnston I think and scores came of it. But still we refused to hoist them in there despite the evidence it had Armagh in a degree of trouble. The result probably wouldn't have been any different but it was baffling all the same and I suppose just another bewilderment in the crazy chapter of Keogan's messy reign.

Overall the game went as expected. I'd have taken a four point loss before the game, I expected us to be carved up for goals and only for Miller we would have been dismantled entirely. Our 'midfield' was an embarrassment to our county. McDonald tried hard but was literally stuck to the ground all day, Mulvey's rank lack of fitness was so glaring he looked like a bizarre panto character or something instead of an intercounty footballer and only the industry of McKeever saved us from total and utter wipeout. His performance along with that of Miller, Flanagan, Jelly, Mackey sometimes and Sean Brady to an extent show that there is still something there to work with if we take the long view and are prepared to build from the bottom up for the next two seasons. We'll be a soft touch in the qualifiers now and hopefully that'll be the end of Keogan and we can close the book on this disastrous money-saving adventure.

Armagh still have work to do in my opinion. No other team they meet will offer carte blanche in midfield like we did which will curb the influence of Clarke and McDonnell inside, who are serious box office with the ball in hand and the type of players you're glad to say you saw playing in the flesh. Neither hit top gear today and were still head and shoulders above everyone. I'd also be worried about the full back line against a more mobile, team-work oriented unit who are winning more ball around the middle, but they're worries for another day. Well done to Armagh and best of luck for the rest of the year now.

My day was more or less done once the minors won anyway, fair play to them they made heavy weather of it but in hindsight it's best to come through with ample room to improve and without making too many headlines. It'd be massive for us to make an Ulster final now and get back on the national stage for the first time since the 70s, here's hoping.

[cavan4sam]

Think of the players who have either quit the panel or not been called back - Lyng, Donohoe, Pierson, Chesty, Mickey Brennan (remember him?! At least he would have been fit and given his all, not run around with no boot!), Gaynor, Raymond Galligan, Ciaran Galligan... Some of these lads would have been decent options surely? And what about Cullivan? Is it true he quit because he was pissed off with the manager?

Instead, we were left with a makeshift, cobbled together panel (Eugene Keating listed as a sub? Where did they spring him from? Very promising player, but that just smacks of "make it up as we go along").


Thats the thing, the turnover of players on the panel is far too high, how is a team ever going to progress when they have new men drafted in every couple of weeks? What did Michael McDonald or Lorcan Mulvey offer yesterday that Ciaran Galligan wouldn't have? Galligan started the replay last year and in my opinion done a very god job at what he was told to do which was to curtail Dan Gordan (we all seen how good he is over the last 2 weeks) yet he wasn't deemed good enough this year? Eamonn Reilly, captain of the County Champions, he would surely be good enough to be there, correct me if I am wrong but didn't he start both games against Down last year at CHB. I don't think he has disimproved that much?? Pierson would surely have been a better option to start ahead of Jason or at least be on the panel.

Where did Eugene Keating come from is right!! I know he is an excellent player and definitely a Cavan player for the future but he was asked into the county panel about 10 wks ago and wouldn't join up and now he is listed as a sub yesterday, it tells you all you need to know about the Cavan set up at present!!

[Hollow Man]

As I said on the other thread Maniac, brilliant post there. My sentiments exactly.

[Mr. Pain]

Eugene Keating is a smart man. He togged out yesterday and that earned him over a grand in grant money. Mr. Pain should have thought of that first.

[cavanmaniac]

Is it that easy though? I thought you had to provide evidence of being on the panel for a good spell of time, level of fitness and so on. I can't see the government handing over lolly if they think any kind of fella that can kick a ball is joining the panel two or three weeks before championship.

[anglocelt39]

Now if we couldn't compete with them, particularly at midfield could we not at least have tried to stop them playing. In other words, what was the story with Walsh? Not a great ball player (but we didn't see much of that from anybody eles around the middle either. Is he injured. Christ I even would have tried him at full back by way of giving Ronan something to think about.

If 10% of what I'm reading here is true about comings and goings I better agree it's time for change. Willl be a fairly messy situation for somebody to try to come in and change though, as regards options please don't anybody mention Paidi, he's the current man minus the brains, plus the All Ireland medals and on a par on the "other" stuff

[cavanmaniac]

It'd be a messy situatio to clear up, but it has to be tackled. That said, most of the 97 crew are all but gone now so if a new manager comes in and tries to build from the bottom up, he'll at least be dealing with lads that have won nothing and so should be hungry and willing to take instruction. That's the theory anyway.

I think we made suggestions a few pages back as to potential replacements, my shouts (and I hope to Jesus I'm not tempting fate here and that Keogan might actually decide to stay) would be Charlie Mulgrew or Dessie Dolan Snr as he'll likely finish up in Leitrim this year. Páidí I wouldn't have him around the place, a bit too impulsive and definitely not what's required.

Whether we like it or not, someone like Mickey Moran would inevitably be mentioned as well and some of the big corporate hitters might bankroll a move for Mickey Harte if he becomes available

[BallyhaiseMan]

dont think Paidi O Se would come this far North again,even if we did want him.

Couldnt see Joe Kernan taking it.

Most Likely as Maniac said
Charlie Mulgrew
Mickey Moran
Dessie Dolan

id add in
Brian McIvor(probably will be finished with Donegal this year although may get the Derry job)

[gortnaleck]

I did not see the game yet and I was listening to Northern Sound so I think we got beaten.We seemed to play up to our ability though and to be beaten by just four points is a bit flattering.I don't know much about Keegan's ability as a manager but you could give that panel (add Pierson,Gaynor whoever) to any manager you like and it still would not be better on paper or on the field than the Armagh team.Of course this is from someone who didn't even see the game andwas hearing about fundraisers up in Maghera.There are a lot of tough teams in the qualifiers also so it's going to be hard to progress.I just think we have to be realistic about what is available and keep adding to what is a young team that could have sat down and took a good beating on Sunday but kept playing tough to the end having pretty much being outplayed at midfield for the duration

[mylestheslasher]

Well it was a disapointing if not suprising result on Sunday. I said here before that we would need to win midfield to have a chance and we were a million miles from doing that. Armagh could have easily hammered us if they had taken their goal chances. It was impossible to rank our FB line as they were under immense pressure, at times Podge did ok on Clarke but Hannon had a really tough time. It is also interesting to watch how McDonnell and Clarke link up, looping around each other almost telepathically. Our forward line is still to individualistic for my liking. Half back line tried hard but struggled and midfield was a wipeout although McKeever worked very hard. half Forward line weren't really in it much and were crowded out. Our lack of size really showed up here. Johnstone had a good 2nd half but his childish behavior at the end of the match (bitching to ref and umpire for about 5 mins, then doing his best to get sent of by making reckless challenges) is why many people just don't take to him. He want to develop some dignity to go with his skills. We were outclassed by a much better team in the end and no one can argue that. However, the actions on the line were yet again bizarre. Taking off McDonald putting on Mulvey and then taking off Mulvey was a joke even by Keoghans standards. After the game he said Mulveys hamstring injury flared up which is pure dung as Mulvey was clearly not happy being taken off. Gaffney must be seriously pissed of he didn't get a run. Also we had McCabe FF and hardly a ball put into him, if the ball wasn't going to be put in then why not move him out to fix midfield. Instead we just ended up wasting one of our best players. I heard that Walsh is injured since the challenge match with Sligo a few weeks ago. Apparently, Keoghan held an all-day training camp on a Saturday 2 weeks before the Antrim game. They started training at 10am, had a break mid day and went back at it in the evening. I heard it was a very very tough day. Then Keoghan has a challenge match against Sligo the next day. Most of the players can hardly get up at half time to go back out on the pitch they are so wrecked. Walsh picked up an injury in that game. Why oh why would a manager do the like of that 2 wks before a championship match is beyond me when the likes of Tyrone hardly train at all leading into these games.

The minors were quiet good but were helped by an strange decision by the Armagh management to remove the sweeper they had with the wind in the 1st half. The tactic worked very well for them but when the sweeper was removed Cavan totally took over. I really hope  they can take Tyrone now and maybe we can get some joy this summer.

As for the seniors in the back door, there are a lot of big guns in there and I also wonder will we lose many more players to abroad. I can't really see us getting a decent run in it to be honest, which will hopefully result in the speedy departure of Keoghan. Who will take over is the question. I am hearing the name Stephen King everywhere I go and it fills me full of fear. Great player but just as bad as Keoghan on the line. His stock is rising due to the good run Killeshandra are having - but I assure you this is in spite of him. If you don't believe me ask anyone who has played under him. Joe Kernan would be the ideal man but he is getting into TV work and I'd imagine he'll advance that career instead. Mulgrew could be the man.

[cavanmaniac]

Most of that is true gortnaleck but you could also give it to almost any other manager and you'd at least be sure that the side was properly prepared and run in a professional fashion, and in that sense, gave themselves the best chance against the opposition even if it might have ended in failure.
I don't think anybody expects we'd be in an All-Ireland final with a different manager, what's nagging at us all is that we'd be alot better and more comeptitive with someone who instilled discipline, manged men better and has a better grounding in tactics and so on. I guess in a nutshell we'd be happy if we felt we gave ourselves the best conceivable chance every time we took the field.

[cavanmaniac]

Johnstone had a good 2nd half but his childish behavior at the end of the match (bitching to ref and umpire for about 5 mins, then doing his best to get sent of by making reckless challenges) is why many people just don't take to him. He want to develop some dignity to go with his skills.

Have to say I agree there, I was very much in fear he'd get the line and give the Armagh fans something to jeer about. He was clearly frustrated and all but that's little excuse.

I forgot to put it in my original run down of the game but it was also very noticeable the lack of team-ethic that nobody pulled Johnstone aside and told him to calm down. They all just stood back and watched him potentially walking into a suspension for the qualifiers.

[Lawrence of Knockbride]

Cavanmaniac & Myles summed up everything pretty well. As well as Gaffney we also had John Cunningham on the bench  who started the league at midfield. We also had McCabe & Forde who, despite their dedication to the cause, feel the need to attack the officials with the game going on around them. They're unlikely to learn at this stage.

I still think the minors aren't playing as a team with a lot of the lads putting the head down and running before having a look. Fortunately our wing forwards were very good at doing that but ultimately I think Graham needs to address this.